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CNN Live At Daybreak

Target: Terrorism: Defense Secretary Rumsfeld Takes Trip to Middle East

Aired October 03, 2001 - 08:34   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Before he left Washington, Secretary Rumsfeld told reporters military action in Afghanistan is not, repeat, not inevitable.

Let's get some additional insight on the secretary's mission. General Wesley Clark, CNN military analyst and former NATO commander, is in our Washington bureau this morning.

Good morning, general.

GEN. WESLEY CLARK, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Good morning, Miles.

O'BRIEN: All right, first of all, Mr. Rumsfeld's itinerary I find interesting. Most interesting to me is the fact that Pakistan is not on his the list of stops. What does that tell about the efforts to stage any sort of U.S. forces in that country?

CLARK: Well, it may not tell us anything. It may be that either the discussions have hit a stone wall, in which he can't be helpful, or that the agreement has been reached, and there is no reason for him to visit, and perhaps I am thinking that a visit might be counterproductive in terms of stirring up popular feelings and so forth. There's a complex of reasons for this.

It also may be that he's simply said that was the lowest priority, given all the other work that's been done with Pakistan.

O'BRIEN: It seems to me, though, that this underscores the importance of the countries which are to the north of Afghanistan. In particular, we're talking about, at this juncture, Uzbekistan. How strategically important is it right now. What are the military planners thinking, given the infrastructure to Uzbekistan and its proximity to Afghanistan?

CLARK: Well, these countries do have a base structure left over from their days in the Soviet Union, and some of these bases were used to support the Soviet Union's campaigns in Afghanistan. They have proximity from the north in an area that's further away from the ocean, further away from the U.S. forces that could be based offshore, and so it completes the circle, and these countries have also expressed some willingness to deal with the United States. The Soviet Russian President Putin has been generally supportive of this. And so it seems that Secretary Rumsfeld's visit is a big part of completing the person-to-person contact that is needed in this case to forge the linkages.

O'BRIEN: Person-to-person contact important. Obviously, let's talk about Saudi Arabia for a moment, an important U.S. ally in the region obviously. There are U.S. forces on the ground there. Ironically, that is a lot of what apparently upsets Osama bin Laden and has caused him to engage in this apparent jihad. How crucial is Saudi Arabia, and basing arrangements there for any U.S.-led campaign against terrorism in Afghanistan or in the region generally?

CLARK: Saudi Arabia could be important. It has wonderful facilities that were put in for another purpose, but the United States is working hard, as we speak, to diversify the basing options, and so we are working with other countries, we are looking in other places; we do have offshore logistics. We have prepositioning equipment. We have ships that have equipment, and so there are other alternatives.

But of course it would be important to us to secure the full support of Saudi Arabia, including the use of those bases.

O'BRIEN: General Clark, before you get away, let me ask you this, what is publicly known about basing arrangements and use of bases on soil other than the U.S. and what is done in the real world may not always jibe. Will there be winks and nods, for example, on the part of the Saudis, which might allow the U.S. to project its forces from Saudi Arabia more than we may see in the public press?

CLARK: I think that's very possible, but I think that there will be a sort of fundamental honesty between the United States and some elements of the Saudi government. I don't think you would find our American officials doing something without the knowledge of the right people in these host governments. How much the host governments disclose to their publics and how much our government tells us, these are matters that depend on the situation. But trust between governments at the right levels is fundamental to this operation.

O'BRIEN: And one more thing, when Secretary Rumsfeld says military action in Afghanistan is not inevitable, how do you read that?

CLARK: Well, first of all, the administration has said consistently, this is going to be a long campaign, or could be a long campaign, and so we don't want the clock to start ticking that says action in the next day, or two days, and put pressure on action before the intelligence is ready.

It really takes three qualities, three factors to bring action to a head. First, you got to have the forces in place to do this. That's structures being put in place now. Secondly, the diplomacy has to line up the right way. We have to keep the moral and diplomatic high ground. They are the terrorists, not us. We want the support of the countries in the regions, and we want the support of the Islamic movement. And finally, we have to have the actionable intelligence. We have to know that what we're striking will be productive in our overall campaign and not counterproductive, and we don't know how the progress is in gaining actionable intelligence, but we do know that it is wise not to set a clock in motion on collecting such information. O'BRIEN: General Wesley Clark, our military analyst, former NATO commander, thanks as always for your help in letting us understand all of this. We appreciate it.

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