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Since September 11th, We've Come to Understand a Lot About Psychology of Fear That Terrorism Can Create

Aired October 30, 2001 - 08:06   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: One reason that officials never anticipated the horrendous acts of September 11th was because the Western mind had difficulty conceiving that so many people would choose to commit a suicide in a single act. But since September 11th we've all come to understand a lot about such acts and the psychology of fear that terrorism can create.

Let's go a little deeper on this subject now with two guests in Washington, criminologist Gregg McCrary, a former FBI behavioral scientist and here in New York, Robert Schacter, a psychologist who focuses on emergency trauma.

And Mr. McCrary, I'd like to begin with you. I don't know if you saw the announcement last night by the - excuse me the attorney general and the head of the FBI - excuse me for just a moment. But it was such a blanket announcement and immediately I got the sense that if I were a terrorist watching that, I would declare victory just by virtue of the announcement.

GREG MCCRARY, CRIMINOLOGIST AND FORMER FBI BEHAVIORAL SCIENTIST: Well possibly, certainly the idea of terrorism is to instill fear. Very little - few acts of violence to instill a lot of terror and fear and that's the idea. But that's the dilemma for the FBI, for law enforcement in general, is that - well the FBI gets criticized on two occasions - either when they warn the public or when they don't warn the public.

So it's a - it's a dilemma, but it's just a matter of being vigilant - not being paranoid; not being scared or terrorized by this. They win, not by the announcement, but by how we react to it. So as long as we're not becoming terrorized by this, becoming fearful, becoming hysterical, then they really haven't won.

O'BRIEN: Mr. Schacter, is it a victory as you see it? In other words, how are we and the public suppose to interpret all of this? How are we suppose to process this information and do you get the sense that people are equipped to process it?

ROBERT SCHACTER, PSYCHOLOGIST: Well people become afraid when they're terrorized and the way this has worked is we have gotten hit very badly on September 11th and everything that happens after that makes us shake; makes us quake; and that's become the problem.

O'BRIEN: OK. So what do we need to do?

SCHACTER: Well I think people need to use emotional self-defense - a reform of self-defense. The truth is that everyone needs to be cautious; needs to be wary. But the actual probability of a terrorist act affecting one's life is probably relatively small and one needs to keep that in mind before getting too upset; too crazy.

O'BRIEN: Mr. McCrary, if the chances are so small, is it responsible for our government officials to make such statements when there's really not much we can do.

MCCRARY: Well I think it is to the degree that it makes us vigilant. The key and I agree with the doctor - the key here is vigilance, not hyper vigilance and to put it in the proper perspective. We probably have - we do have a far greater chance of being killed or injured in an automobile accident than we do in a terrorist attack, yet we're not fearful to get in a car and drive because we drive reasonably and we use prudent measures. And that's the way we need to approach this problem as well. We need to approach it with reason; with prudence; and just common sense.

O'BRIEN: Perhaps that's easier said than done. Mr. Schacter, what about the chicken little syndrome here or the boy who cried wolf? As these announcements continue, are people going to begin tuning them out?

SCHACTER: Well I think that the more one hears about this the more afraid they get. Hopefully nothing will happen and hopefully that fear will dissipate. But again, once you've been hit hard, you're afraid you're going to get hit again and that's usually what happens with these things.

O'BRIEN: Mr. McCrary, your specialty is studying the criminal mind. As you sort of get inside the mind of a terrorist here for a moment, this is precisely what they want to have happen - correct?

MCCRARY: Well they want to terrorize the country. There's no doubt about that, and I say if we let them do that, then they win. We certainly need to be aware of the risks, but we need to put them in the - in a proper perspective and as long as we do that, then they - then they haven't won.

O'BRIEN: You make some reference to bin Laden as sort of a Hitler-like character. Give me a sense of what you mean by that.

MCCRARY: Yes, he's a charismatic psychopathic type of leader - very manipulative individual and like Hitler, has galvanized a mass movement and created an external enemy. For bin Laden, it's us - it's the Western culture of the United States. For Hitler, it was the Jews. They predict all blame on us - everything that's wrong in the world is our fault.

And so there are a lot of - a lot of parallels here. Keep in mind that these leaders, like bin Laden, are like many charismatic social paths who get - psychopath - who get people to act violently on their behalf. However, they won't do it. We don't have to worry about bin Laden committing an act of suicide. He'll just manipulate other people into committing acts of violence.

O'BRIEN: Mr. Schacter, are you concerned in general about the mental health of Americans? Are they more depressed and do you think in general they're seeking help when they need it?

SCHACTER: Well I think the effect of this whole tragedy has been to sensitize people to make people more emotional. People who, at one point, were anxious before, now are more anxious. People who were a little depressed before are more depressed. It's been a phenomenon of psychological effect here.

O'BRIEN: All right, I hate to leave it on that down note, but that's where we got to do it. Robert Schacter, psychologist, Greg McCrary, criminologist on a classic darn if you do, darn if you don't story. We appreciate your time this morning.

(INAUDIBLE) Paula.

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