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CNN Live At Daybreak

Interview With Dr. Ivan Walks and Dr. Martin Blaser

Aired October 31, 2001 - 07:07   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
Now for a wider view. There are 16 total infections, three deaths from inhalation anthrax, seven cases of the inhalation form and six cases of skin anthrax. The National Institutes of Health thinks the latest anthrax cases raises some questions.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, NATIONAL INSTITUTES OF HEALTH: Up to yesterday, there was no evidence at all that there could be or is an individual in which there might be the reasonable question did they get infected from a mail, a piece of mail that went to their home? That is being intensively investigated right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ZAHN: And here to talk about how anthrax is spreading, Dr. Ivan Walks, chief health officer in Washington, D.C., and Dr. Martin Blaser of the New York University School of Medicine. Welcome to both of you.

DR. IVAN WALKS, D.C. CHIEF HEALTH OFFICER: Good morning.

DR. MARTIN BLASER, NYU SCHOOL OF MEDICINE: Thank you. Hello.

ZAHN: Dr. Blaser, what are your worst suspicions about this woman who's gotten sick in New York?

BLASER: I think it's most likely that it's still mail related and probably at her place of work. But the director of the CDC said that they can't make any assumptions and I think that's right. There needs to be a full investigation where this case came from.

ZAHN: Describe to us the level of concern of health care workers at that hospital. Jason Carroll reporting that some 40 different environmental samples were made at that hospital where she worked. Ten of them so far have come back negative.

BLASER: In any facility where there's a case, there is always going to be a level of concern, although the past record has shown up to this point that the cases are pretty scattered, that one case doesn't mean that everybody is going to get sick. It could mean, perhaps, that one or two other people would get sick, but that's why people are getting prophylaxis.

So I think by finding that case, the people in the immediate vicinity are going to be protected.

ZAHN: In the beginning, Dr. Blaser, there was great concern that perhaps doctors, because anthrax was so new, might not recognize the symptoms of anthrax, might confuse it with cases of flu. Give us your sense of what the level of preparedness is at New York hospitals.

BLASER: Well, I think at New York hospitals and hospitals all over the country doctors have been on an incredible learning curve and now when somebody comes in with a skin rash or flu like symptoms, anthrax is on everybody's list. That doesn't mean everybody's got anthrax. That means that doctors, nurses, health professionals as well as the public, they're all thinking could this be anthrax? And that level of preparedness is going to help us. It's going to move treatment to an earlier stage.

ZAHN: Dr. Walks, I think of any of the doctors who have made appearances on television, you have been most candid about this learning curve that Dr. Blaser just stated. What is your reaction to what Dr. Fauci said yesterday and the implications potentially of every American maybe having to worry about their mail being infected with anthrax?

WALKS: I think there are profound implications. I think that we need to watch very carefully where this investigation goes. But to the comment about hospitals being more prepared, we've investigated with the help of the CDC here in the D.C. area well over 100 suspected cases. I think that's good news. I think telling folks that it's not only flu like symptoms, but with the flu you tend to get the watery eyes, the runny nose. With the anthrax flu like symptoms it's more of the lower respiratory aches, pains and cough.

I think as we continue to learn more about not only the science, but the clinical presentation, we can address people's needs better. But I think that we shouldn't make assumptions. We shouldn't continue to say everything is fine. This is a different kind of case. People are, again, rethinking what we thought we knew and I think that we should pay careful attention to it.

ZAHN: You've just said, Dr. Walks, that it's too early to say basically, you know, that we shouldn't worry about this anymore at a time when the mayor of your city, Anthony Williams, came out yesterday and stated that he believes that the local -- the worst of the local crisis is over. Do you agree with him or do you maintain that it's too early to say that?

WALKS: Well, of course I agree with my boss. But let me say this...

ZAHN: Yes, I guess you have no choice, do you, Dr. Walks?

WALKS: Well, I do have a choice.

ZAHN: Don't want to get you in trouble with the big guy.

WALKS: No, I think what the mayor is saying is that what we have seen here in the District -- and the mayor has tracked this very carefully. He's looked at the reports we hand out to the press daily. The number of cases we've had, five. It's been five for the last week and the cases that are suspicious, that number has continued to dwindle. The cases we're investigating, luckily, has continued to grow. It means we're still paying attention but we're not finding new cases here.

So this episode locally here, absolutely. We're looking at the down side of it. But our mayor is a very careful mayor and he wants us to continue to be vigilant and we absolutely will.

ZAHN: Dr. Walks, even after the CDC conceded that it had made some mistakes, you have talked rather candidly about the learning curve. How concerned are you that the American public is left with the perception that these medical officials simply don't know what they're doing?

WALKS: Well, I think that the American public needs to understand that medical professionals need to look at something new and learn about it. But that really has little to do with whether we are going to live in fear. I grew up in California. Earthquakes are unpredictable. They can kill people. People still live in California. Midwest, tornadoes. Southeast, hurricanes.

There's something about us understanding that this is a different day. We're in a different world. Let's trust the medical folks to move as quickly as they can but we can't stop living and just cower in our homes.

ZAHN: And once again you say that what you know today is a lot more than what your community knew yesterday and certainly a lot more than you guys knew last week.

WALKS: Well, one thing we can say today is that, for example, here in Washington, D.C. our science is good enough so that the people who were in those post offices that we were worried about that have not been to the Brentwood site, which is clearly very much contaminated, we know today they can stop their medications. So we're learning enough to give people good advice real time.

And if they can trust us to tell them what we don't know and to tell them what we do know, then they can take the advice from us and let us do the worrying. And that's what we want.

ZAHN: Dr. Blaser, a quick final thought on the ongoing threat to Americans here presented by anthrax?

BLASER: Unfortunately, people are still getting ill. It's a small number of people. Until we catch the perpetrators, we're all at risk. But I agree with Dr. Walks, the risk so far has been relatively small and people are working fast to contain it and manage the problem.

ZAHN: Dr. Blaser, thanks so much for your time. Dr. Walks, I hope I didn't get you in trouble with your boss here this morning.

WALKS: I don't think so. Thank you. ZAHN: As always, good to see you. Thank you again, gentlemen.

BLASER: Thanks.

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