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CNN Live At Daybreak
Interview With Bob Mankoff
Aired November 06, 2001 - 07:55 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: The mood of the country was so somber after September 11 that "The New Yorker" magazine dropped all cartoons -- its now famous black issue, but that was eight weeks ago today, and this is now.
Humor is back, and "The New Yorker" is making up lost ground with its cartoon issue. Cartoon editor Bob Mankoff is here, and he's brought us some samples -- good to have you with us, Bob.
BOB MANKOFF, "THE NEW YORKER": It's good to be here.
O'BRIEN: First of all, it's unprecedented that "The New Yorker" took the cartoons out, is that true?
MANKOFF: Well, once before in the John Hershey's Hiroshima issue in 1946, so there was a precedent of, you know, of an incredibly serious event. And September 11 was an event, which not only made cartoons about it impossible, but nothing was funny. It was sort of a black hole for that week.
O'BRIEN: Did you have the sense, after September 11, that it might be difficult to ever get back to laughing at all?
MANKOFF: Absolutely. It felt like sort of a lobotomy had been done on your humor center of your brain, and then you realized that you -- what eventually what was impossible became inevitable, as it, frankly, became the most irony-rich environment that I've ever seen.
O'BRIEN: All right. Well, let's take a look at some of the cartoons...
MANKOFF: Sure.
O'BRIEN: ... you brought, and maybe we can talk about...
MANKOFF: Sure, absolutely.
O'BRIEN: ... what's funny and what is not.
MANKOFF: Yes.
O'BRIEN: First of all, on the easel here, this depicts a restaurant and the caption here, in case you can't read it, the food is just so, so, but the security is fantastic. And he's being scant. MANKOFF: Yes, well I mean, just this whole thing was so preoccupied with security and just the irony of -- I mean, if you were away and didn't know, and you found out there was an office of Homeland Security, would you feel more secure? I mean, my thought about that as a cartoonist is what on the office, do they have a double lock on the door? And the other advice is, they shouldn't leave the key under the mat.
O'BRIEN: All right. Now let's go to our first graphic.
MANKOFF: Sure.
O'BRIEN: We had some of these that we've actually kept already. This is an interesting one on, you know, marry the doctor, the old theme. A little twist on that...
MANKOFF: Yes.
O'BRIEN: ... post-September 11, because we have some new heroes to venerate.
MANKOFF: Right, right.
O'BRIEN: And the caption down there is, I'll have to paraphrase it, because I can't read it.
MANKOFF: Why do you want to marry a doctor? Why can't you marry a fireman?
O'BRIEN: Right, marry a fireman, dear, yes.
MANKOFF: Right, well the firemen have become the new heroes, and you know, you just think that -- I don't know -- there may be guys impersonating firemen in New York bars trying to pick up women. I mean, it's become very attractive now.
O'BRIEN: Go into a Halloween costume store...
MANKOFF: Right, right.
O'BRIEN: ... get him a helmet and all.
MANKOFF: Right.
O'BRIEN: All right. Another one that is interesting. This is a classic bar scene, always a lot of bar scenes...
MANKOFF: Right, right, sure.
O'BRIEN: ... in these cartoons. And these are two businessmen sitting at the bar, and of course, the subject is martinis. And basically he's saying...
MANKOFF: He's saying, well, you know, I feel if I don't have that third martini, I feel the terrorists have won. And you know, it's just everyone is starting to use the phrases that they hear, you know, whether it's we don't want the terrorists to win, or everyone has to have an American flag, or that it becomes, you know, this competition about how big a flag you can have, and that type of stuff.
So I think it's, you know, part of the purpose of humor is irony sort of as a corrective, and sort of show the difference between the actual and the ideal, and there's a huge difference here.
O'BRIEN: All right. And finally, let's get one more graphic up.
MANKOFF: Sure.
O'BRIEN: And then we'll go to the easel.
MANKOFF: Sure.
O'BRIEN: The final graphic, the one about hating everyone, which is a good one.
MANKOFF: Yes. This has taken me a while, but finally, I'm getting back to hating everyone.
O'BRIEN: Yes.
MANKOFF: And, you know, I think this shows that, you know, the enduring things is not who we like, but who we hate. And that doesn't change. And that surprised me that people, strangely enough, who were jerks before September 11, you know, three or four weeks later, turn out to be jerks again, at least in our own eyes.
O'BRIEN: All right. What seems to be a common thread here, though, is it's more a look at ourselves, than it is the Taliban or al Qaeda -- nothing funny about them.
MANKOFF: Well, maybe there is something funny, but you want to do what you know, and you know yourself, and that's sort of deeper. I mean, we had cartoons submitted to "The New Yorker," very funny cartoons, but we thought they were a little crude. There was one, Taliban (UNINTELLIGIBLE) road show. It just shows the Taliban smashing Buddhas and that type of stuff. It was funny, but you know, and it was very funny, but we're trying to just get into using satire and irony, sort of as a corrective to our own behavior. I got a feeling that the Taliban is not going to be that effected by our irony.
O'BRIEN: It might some day. Is it possible that that could enter in the realm of funny and tasteful?
MANKOFF: Oh, no, absolutely. Maybe we'll, you know, drop, you know, big humor irony packages on them, along with the food.
O'BRIEN: All right. One more on the easel.
MANKOFF: Sure.
O'BRIEN: And this is apropos of the news of the morning. MANKOFF: Yes, absolutely. You know, it shows the security thing is that we need to declaw the cat. And you know, everyone there, they are focused on the tiniest little thing. I mean, you know, we're saying that it was a victory when the guy came through with knives and the stun guns and the tear gas, and I'm thinking one more victory like that, and we'll lose.
But it was a victory in a way, because they did find, even though they missed all of that, they found a pair of very sharp nail clippers. So --
(CROSSTALK)
O'BRIEN: Wow! That could be pretty serious. Now, can you tell us do you get some calls? Have you gotten calls yet, people a little upset that you've gone over the line? You're obviously walking a tight rope here.
MANKOFF: Actually, I got a call from someone speaking Arabic or Urdu or Pakistani, I don't know, who seemed very excited, and I couldn't understand what he said, and I just said, look, I can't understand what you're saying. Mail me a letter. I said, you know what, though.
O'BRIEN: All right. OK. Bob Mankoff, cartoon editor of "The New Yorker" -- we appreciate you joining us here this morning...
MANKOFF: My pleasure.
O'BRIEN: ... and giving us an opportunity to laugh.
MANKOFF: Absolutely. We need it.
O'BRIEN: We appreciate that.
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