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CNN Live At Daybreak
Helicopter Crashes West of Baghdad
Aired January 13, 2004 - 05:29 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: We want to get right live to Baghdad. A helicopter has crashed west of Baghdad.
Karl Penhaul live there now -- Karl, do we know if it's a Black Hawk or some other kind of helicopter?
KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So far, Carol, the type of helicopter hasn't been confirmed. All that coalition authorities here in Baghdad are saying so far is that, yes, a helicopter of some kind has gone done. They're talking around the town of Habaniyah. That's about 30 kilometers, 40 kilometers, or 40 miles, should I say, rather, west of Baghdad, between the towns of Falluja and Ramadi.
Now, you will remember that late last week, a Black Hawk MediVac helicopter was shot down near the town of Falluja. But as I say, so far coalition authorities this morning not saying what type of helicopter it was or what type of incident may have brought down that helicopter and obviously not so far the number of people who were aboard that helicopter.
COSTELLO: Tell us more about the area where this helicopter went down. Many guerrillas are known to be there in that area, right?
PENHAUL: That's correct, Carol. This really is the heart of the so-called Sunni Triangle. This is where most of the resistance against the coalition has been based and it's here where it's been mostly led by former supporters of Saddam Hussein's regime. The town of Falluja, for example, sees action just about every day in the form of roadside bombs and attacks on coalition troops.
On the other side of where the helicopter went down today, the city of Ramadi, and, again, almost daily attacks on coalition forces there.
So a very volatile area, perhaps the most volatile area at this moment in Iraq.
COSTELLO: Have coalition forces put in any practices that might prevent the crash of helicopters?
PENHAUL: Yes and no. Obviously, there are great security precautions when they're flying these helicopters. But, again, one of the tactics is to fly low and fast over the countryside. Sometimes they try and fly so high that they're out of range of both ground fire and potential missile attacks. So they do vary altitudes and such like. But obviously in an area where there is a heavy, heavy, resistance, then they're always going to be exposed to some measure and to some degree of attack.
But as I say, not yet confirmed whether today's accident was an attack or whether it was just a crash.
COSTELLO: All right, we'll let you go so you can gather more information.
Karl Penhaul live from Baghdad.
We have our senior international editor, David Clinch, with us now.
And it's difficult to get information right away when something like this happens.
DAVID CLINCH, CNN INTERNATIONAL EDITOR: It is. It is. We always want to bring you as much information as we possibly can as quickly as we can. But, clearly, there's a lot more to be found out about this helicopter going down west of Baghdad. There have been a number of helicopters in that region that have gone down. It takes, also, quite some time even for the military itself to understand what has happened, whether or not helicopters have been shot down or have come down accidentally.
So it'll be some time before we have the full details on that.
Another story just to sort of broaden the picture a little bit on Iraq, we talked about this yesterday, this Shiite ayatollah in Iraq, Sistani, voicing very strong opposition over last weekend to the U.S. hand over plan to create a new government in Iraq.
Now, the "New York Times" is reporting today that the Bush administration, which up until this point has said that it's not particularly worried about his opposition, is, in fact, taking steps to revise that plan. Now, the article doesn't tell us exactly what revisions they're going to put in place, but clearly his opposition has created some concern.
We'll be talking to Ambassador...
COSTELLO: So might the United States be negotiating with Sistani, trying to come up with a new way to hold elections?
CLINCH: Well, it's an interesting dynamic. We'll be talking to the U.S. administrator, Paul Bremer, during the day today. We'll have that interview on air tonight. He has actually voiced what is an interesting point, that, in fact, the negotiation is within the Governing Council itself. Sistani or the Shiite members of Iraq have representation there.
And, clearly, I think the point here is really that while Sistani is calling for an open election in which Shiites, who are the majority, would clearly have an advantage, the U.S. plan talks about caucuses, something which we're obviously familiar with here in the United States, not something that is very readily understood in Iraq. But I think what Paul Bremer says repeatedly is that while you can talk about elections and majorities, the essence, the spirit of democracy is that that maintains the rights of the minority. And that is clearly what he and the Governing Council are all about. The minorities are all represented on that Council.
So we'll be watching that during the day today.
We're also obviously keeping an eye on that story that's just developed from Britain, "Dr. Death," the doctor who killed dozens, perhaps hundreds of his patients in Britain over the years, has apparently hung himself, committed suicide. The first question there is why was he not on suicide watch? He had been previously. Apparently, according to the prison service at this time, was not on suicide watch in the prison where he was found dead this morning.
COSTELLO: Well, it's interesting that he could find something to hang himself with, as in bed sheets in this case.
CLINCH: Right, I mean suicide watch, by definition, means you're watched all the time anyway. But, also, things like belts and sheets are removed or restricted so you can't use those. That will be a question. We'll be going up to the town where he killed those hundreds of people today to get reaction from there, as well.
COSTELLO: All right, David Clinch, many thanks.
CLINCH: All right.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired January 13, 2004 - 05:29 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: We want to get right live to Baghdad. A helicopter has crashed west of Baghdad.
Karl Penhaul live there now -- Karl, do we know if it's a Black Hawk or some other kind of helicopter?
KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So far, Carol, the type of helicopter hasn't been confirmed. All that coalition authorities here in Baghdad are saying so far is that, yes, a helicopter of some kind has gone done. They're talking around the town of Habaniyah. That's about 30 kilometers, 40 kilometers, or 40 miles, should I say, rather, west of Baghdad, between the towns of Falluja and Ramadi.
Now, you will remember that late last week, a Black Hawk MediVac helicopter was shot down near the town of Falluja. But as I say, so far coalition authorities this morning not saying what type of helicopter it was or what type of incident may have brought down that helicopter and obviously not so far the number of people who were aboard that helicopter.
COSTELLO: Tell us more about the area where this helicopter went down. Many guerrillas are known to be there in that area, right?
PENHAUL: That's correct, Carol. This really is the heart of the so-called Sunni Triangle. This is where most of the resistance against the coalition has been based and it's here where it's been mostly led by former supporters of Saddam Hussein's regime. The town of Falluja, for example, sees action just about every day in the form of roadside bombs and attacks on coalition troops.
On the other side of where the helicopter went down today, the city of Ramadi, and, again, almost daily attacks on coalition forces there.
So a very volatile area, perhaps the most volatile area at this moment in Iraq.
COSTELLO: Have coalition forces put in any practices that might prevent the crash of helicopters?
PENHAUL: Yes and no. Obviously, there are great security precautions when they're flying these helicopters. But, again, one of the tactics is to fly low and fast over the countryside. Sometimes they try and fly so high that they're out of range of both ground fire and potential missile attacks. So they do vary altitudes and such like. But obviously in an area where there is a heavy, heavy, resistance, then they're always going to be exposed to some measure and to some degree of attack.
But as I say, not yet confirmed whether today's accident was an attack or whether it was just a crash.
COSTELLO: All right, we'll let you go so you can gather more information.
Karl Penhaul live from Baghdad.
We have our senior international editor, David Clinch, with us now.
And it's difficult to get information right away when something like this happens.
DAVID CLINCH, CNN INTERNATIONAL EDITOR: It is. It is. We always want to bring you as much information as we possibly can as quickly as we can. But, clearly, there's a lot more to be found out about this helicopter going down west of Baghdad. There have been a number of helicopters in that region that have gone down. It takes, also, quite some time even for the military itself to understand what has happened, whether or not helicopters have been shot down or have come down accidentally.
So it'll be some time before we have the full details on that.
Another story just to sort of broaden the picture a little bit on Iraq, we talked about this yesterday, this Shiite ayatollah in Iraq, Sistani, voicing very strong opposition over last weekend to the U.S. hand over plan to create a new government in Iraq.
Now, the "New York Times" is reporting today that the Bush administration, which up until this point has said that it's not particularly worried about his opposition, is, in fact, taking steps to revise that plan. Now, the article doesn't tell us exactly what revisions they're going to put in place, but clearly his opposition has created some concern.
We'll be talking to Ambassador...
COSTELLO: So might the United States be negotiating with Sistani, trying to come up with a new way to hold elections?
CLINCH: Well, it's an interesting dynamic. We'll be talking to the U.S. administrator, Paul Bremer, during the day today. We'll have that interview on air tonight. He has actually voiced what is an interesting point, that, in fact, the negotiation is within the Governing Council itself. Sistani or the Shiite members of Iraq have representation there.
And, clearly, I think the point here is really that while Sistani is calling for an open election in which Shiites, who are the majority, would clearly have an advantage, the U.S. plan talks about caucuses, something which we're obviously familiar with here in the United States, not something that is very readily understood in Iraq. But I think what Paul Bremer says repeatedly is that while you can talk about elections and majorities, the essence, the spirit of democracy is that that maintains the rights of the minority. And that is clearly what he and the Governing Council are all about. The minorities are all represented on that Council.
So we'll be watching that during the day today.
We're also obviously keeping an eye on that story that's just developed from Britain, "Dr. Death," the doctor who killed dozens, perhaps hundreds of his patients in Britain over the years, has apparently hung himself, committed suicide. The first question there is why was he not on suicide watch? He had been previously. Apparently, according to the prison service at this time, was not on suicide watch in the prison where he was found dead this morning.
COSTELLO: Well, it's interesting that he could find something to hang himself with, as in bed sheets in this case.
CLINCH: Right, I mean suicide watch, by definition, means you're watched all the time anyway. But, also, things like belts and sheets are removed or restricted so you can't use those. That will be a question. We'll be going up to the town where he killed those hundreds of people today to get reaction from there, as well.
COSTELLO: All right, David Clinch, many thanks.
CLINCH: All right.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
