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Laura Coates Live

Palisade Fire Expands Prompting New Evacuation Orders; Total Of 11 Reported Dead In L.A. County Inferno; Local Palisade Resident Describing Saving Homes; Plane Fighting L.A. Fires Collides With Civilian Drone; Trump Sentenced On Hush Money Case. Aired 11p-12a ET

Aired January 10, 2025 - 23:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[23:00:00]

ROBERT RAY, FORMER COUNSEL TO PRESIDENT TRUMP DURING FIRST IMPEACHMENT: That Trump is entitled to but the problem here is that the trial has already happened. So there's really no way to go back.

MONTEL WILLIAMS, TALK SHOW HOST AND ACTIVIST: I mean, I think, again, it's time to let's move forward. He's appealing and he's going to make a little bit more noise, but it's going to settle down. And four years from now there'll be a decision made after he's out of office and they'll probably say, you know --

RAY: Yeah, you think you're going to expect this appeal process to take at least two years to (inaudible) (CROSSTALK)

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN HOST: Everyone, thank you very much for being here. Thank you very much for watching "NewsNight." "Laura Coates Live" starts right now.

LAURA COATES, CNN HOST: Good evening and welcome to "Laura Coates Live." Truly exhausted firefighters are in their now fourth day of battling out of control blazes in Los Angeles. Right now, six wildfires are still burning across the county. You're looking at one of the worst, the Palisades fire. Well tonight, a new evacuation order is in place extending to one of the city's busiest freeways and the iconic Getty Center. It's been an all-out effort to stop the rapid spread and to try, try to prevent more destruction. But as you can see, the damage already done is truly staggering.

At least 10,000 properties have been destroyed completely. Now, the question on everyone's mind, how could this have happened? Well, it's time someone began to answer it. California Governor Gavin Newsom is ordering an investigation into what caused some hydrants to run dry early on. And the L.A. Fire Chief is calling out the city for cutting her department's budget by $17 million.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KRISTIN CROWLEY, LOS ANGELES FIRE DEPARTMENT: The fire department needs help. We can no longer sustain where we are. We do not have enough firefighters. And I warned, I rang the bell that these additional cuts could be very, very devastating for our ability to provide public safety. (END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: Well, some fingers are pointing in several directions. We're learning tonight that L.A. Mayor Karen Bass had a meeting with the fire chief after those comments. Now we don't know what was said to be a fly on the wall in that room. The mayor's office is denying a report that she has fired that chief. Let's go to CNN's Nick Watt who's in to the Palisades. Nick, a new evacuation order we learned in effect in the Palisades fire. Can you tell us what you know tonight?

NICK WATT, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. So, Laura, I'm standing on Sunset Boulevard in Palisades Village. I can see the flames that are causing the problem right now. They are going up over the Santa Monica Mountains into the San Fernando Valley by the looks of things. But here's the good news. That plume, huge plume of smoke coming off that fire is going straight up in the air, which means that there's not a lot of wind. And that is great news.

Now, during the lull in the wind today, I can only imagine that the firefighters were using their bulldozers to dig lines, fire lines to try and contain the fire. And if there's not much wind, hopefully they can hold those lines because the wind won't be blowing embers over the lines. But I've got to say in the past 10 minutes or so, we have seen half a dozen, a dozen fire trucks just booking it past us. I'm assuming they're going to head down Sunset Boulevard onto the 405, which as you mentioned, is that huge freeway that runs north-south.

So the evacuation zones are now up to the side of the 405. So I imagine they are going round to try and contain that fire over there. You know, the winds are going to be gentle overnight, which is just the best news you can possibly have. Because remember, when the winds are low, you can also attack these flames from the air. That was the crucial thing in the early hours and days of this fire here in the Palisades. The wind was so strong, they couldn't get anything up in the air, fixed wing or helicopters to drop water and retardant on these flames. So, fingers crossed.

Listen, these are about the best conditions I've seen in the past few days for fighting a fire. So hopefully they can get a handle on that before it gets over into Encino, before it gets any further that way. But yeah, you're right in the past hour or so the evacuation orders have been extended. I mean, it's still not over, Laura.

COATES: Really, it's hard to find the words, Nick, when you think about the major artery of the 405, for example, in that area, the idea of the scope and the spread of this and these fire lines, so important to try to avoid it from jumping yet again as the first couple hours it did. We're learning about Governor Gavin Newsom, and he apparently is ordering an independent investigation into the wildfire water supply.

[23:05:01]

Can you give us more of the backstory behind this call to do this investigation?

WATT: Yeah. So, at the peak of the fires, 3:00 a.m. that first night, the fire hydrants here in Pacific Palisades ran dry. You could hear it on the radio comms between the firefighters that there just wasn't any water. And the problem is, Palisades is at the end of the city water supply, so the pipes are narrower, the pressure is lower, so they have these huge storage tanks up in the hills, three million gallons, that are supposed to keep those hydrants pressurized and keep them flowing, but they just couldn't refill those tanks.

And you know, listen, it was bad for sure that they didn't have the water, but you've got to wonder if they had all the water in the world, could they have really fought these fires? Because the other issue, you were talking earlier just a couple of minutes ago about Fire Chief Crowley here in L.A. You know, she's saying that they just didn't have the manpower. They don't have the people, partly, she says, because of the budget cuts.

They don't have the people to fight the fires. She said they also didn't have the people because of budgets to go around and inspect sure that people were cutting back that brush, which is mandatory. They didn't have the people to do that. So Mayor Bass, the fire chief, as you say, I would have loved to have been in that room to hear their meeting.

COATES: Absolutely. And again, the letter from the Office of the Governor wanting to have the L.A. Department of Water, as well as the L.A. County officials to conduct this investigation. No timeline has been said, but a swift preparation of a comprehensive review, examining the local preparation. A lot of questions unanswered and fire is still blazing. Nick Watt, thank you so much.

WATT: No problem.

COATES: You know, when the evacuation orders went into effect on just Tuesday and again, I cannot believe this started on Tuesday and all that has happened since then. There were many people who heeded those calls to evacuate, but not my next guest, and perhaps thankfully, because instead of fleeing for safety, he gathered the courage to stay, along with dozens of his workers, together they jumped right into action. They worked tirelessly to try to save as many homes as possible.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNKNOWN: Dude (ph), did you go (inaudible).

UNKNOWN: I know, dude. I know. He was going to get a hose on (inaudible).

UNKNOWN: It's okay, it's okay, it's okay, it's okay. Just relax, relax.

UNKNOWN: Oh, yeah. This is no bullshit dude. This is no bullshit.

UNKNOWN: Could we get that one more hose over here, it'd be good. Especially on that other side!

UNKNOWN: Ryan, can we get a little bit of water over here real quick? Yep. And just on that corner. Walk through. I'll come behind you. That's just on fire right there. It's going to catch the house.

UNKNOWN: Little bit more hunk over here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: This is like David and Goliath in action watching you guys just try to do anything you can. I've got lifelong Pacific Palisades resident and contractor Chuck Hart who joins me now. Chuck, my God, watching you guys just try to fight what looks like a relentless fire against all costs, the fire is quickly closing in. I understand you were at your neighbor's house who you've known your entire life. What happened?

CHUCK HART, CONTRACTOR WHO HELPED PEOPLE IN OACIFIC PALISADES: I was in town actually a job site over west of canyon and I got a phone call from a buddy of mine Ryan Minyam (ph) and he said, hey, you know, what I think there's a fire burning up by your mom's house. Within two seconds of that phone call my mom was on call waiting. I clicked over, she's like, Chuck, I can smell fire and I'm really worried.

I said mama, I'll come right now. I ran over to my house and the contractors who happen to have a bunch of firehoses. Luckily, a wrench and a key for the hydrant and reducers, I grabbed all that stuff, threw everything in my truck, raced up the hill, and I was really blown away because this happened a few months back or maybe a year ago, my time's not so good.

We had another big scare with fires up there, but the wind was so crazy this time. It went from Villa Floreza (ph) to the -- this is basically you drive up the Infinita (ph), you go up Villa Floreza (ph), drop down on the Loughlin (ph) Lane and go up to Charmel (ph) where my mom lives.

[23:10:00]

The time it took for me to go from Villa Floreza (ph) to get to my mom's house, there was a huge fire in my mom's yard (ph). And then the other side of the canyon behind my neighbors, Joan (ph) and Matt (ph) and on Kaylin (ph). And again, I grew up in this house.

My mom and dad moved into this house in 1969. They lived down on La Paz (ph) before that, forever. And it just -- watching this thing take off, it was the second we get water somewhere, we get that put out, you look across, and then there was two other places that were already on fire. And it happened it just kept popping off one place after the next after the next. This little video you're looking at right here is on the canyon on the other side of Turquesa (ph), which I used to run through to go over to my buddy's house at Vista Grande (ph) the (inaudible) house.

We would drop down and close over at this -- the fire had literally engulfed this entire canyon right there and was coming up underneath Scott (ph), one of my neighbor's houses right up under the ease. We got over there and it hit a palm tree and a pine tree and when the heat comes off of this thing it's -- I don't have any -- I don't have any firefighting gear on. It's just blasting you in the eyes. It's crazy. And so the smoke, the ash, embers, the steam from the water everything, it's intense.

COATES: My heart is racing just even at the thought of, God forbid, my son -- calling my son to tell him I'm afraid and having him come to save the house. And you were actually able to save your mom's house, an apartment building across from your own home as well. But we're hearing you talk throughout this video. And I have to tell you, the stress that you must have been under to keep yourself grounded, to direct and guide all of you guys just coming together. What was that like to even try to stay focused enough, knowing how emotional this really must be?

HART: I didn't feel overly emotional at that time at all. And I certainly was not expecting what was happening in downtown later on or any of that stuff down by my house or everywhere else in the Palisades to occur. So, it wasn't really an emotional thing. I would say it's more like I work really well under pressure for my job or just the purpose is focusing in my own life. I do really well there.

COATES: Yeah.

HART: So, I didn't feel really emotional about that. I felt really connected and engaged. My confidence sure --

COATES: But what happened when the adrenaline stopped?

HART: It hasn't. And I guess it had maybe about a day and a half ago, and I just burst into tears, and it happened again this afternoon. I'm here with a buddy of mine, Elton (ph). And we just stopped to talk for a minute. And when you're -- oh. When you don't think about it as much and you're just busy, it doesn't bother me. I usually -- that's how I kind of move around through my life in general.

I just try to do the next indicated right action and stay out of stuff that makes me sad or maybe even feel depressed because I just -- I want to be of maximum service to the people around me. I want to be engaged and I want to be into action. I feel better doing that. And so, you know, a lot of guys that are around me, they're in my life, not just the work for me, but that I'm involved with.

You know, trust God, clean house, help other people. And when I'm on that mission, which I try to stay on all the time, everything's working out. I'm really happy. I feel really lucky to have the proper gear, prepared myself to know what to do and to just be with a crew big enough to be able to jump on and actually make a positive effect --

COATES: Yes.

HART: -- and handle it, you know, to the best of our ability.

COATES: I mean, just seeing the images from where we are, Pacific Palisades, it is more than like your lifelong residence. I mean, this has been your family's home for four generations, I understand. And I want viewers to see the moment that you saw this fire destroy the church that your great grandfather founded.

(VIDEO PLAYING)

COATES: Can you talk about -- oh, Chuck, I'm sorry. What are you feeling right now? What are you -- what's going through your mind?

[23:14]

HART: I really feel bad. I'll tell you what I feel like. I was there earlier and I understand there's a lot of stuff going on. If we add some water, I know for a fact, a hundred percent that would not have happened. And I drove around back. I'm not a professional firefighter. I was watching these winds whip flames up onto my mom's house and I sprayed some chemical on there and it didn't catch and it was so hot. So I figured there was enough distance between the back of the church and these apartment buildings and the place next door that it wasn't possibly going to catch. I had yelled to talk to some firefighters. They said they throw some water from the tank on it and everybody's so busy. Everything's so crazy.

It's just, you know, bottom line is there was no water. And I just -- I thought that it was going to be okay. And I really, really wish I would have grabbed this book out of the sanctuary, the big -- the big Bible up on the pulpit and then the founder's book. It's in a glass case. Well, it was in a glass case in this nice little bit thing that -- I didn't want to break the church's front door. My key card wasn't working on the other side and I just -- it didn't happen, I didn't get it and it doesn't matter, you know, it's just whatever it is. It is what it is.

COATES: You are safe. The work that has been done and the generations that have been impacted by your great grandfather's decision to found that will never change, ever.

HART: Yeah, yeah. We're gonna -- we're gonna make a new church. There'll be the old church with the same quirky people I love so much, they go there. And it's gonna be great. It's gonna -- it's just gonna take a minute.

COATES: Yeah.

HART: Yeah. I love the people I go to church with. Sometimes I walk in and I just I look at them I've known him my entire life and you know, it reminds me I'm involved in another program is, we're just people that normally wouldn't mix, but in the house of God, we all come together and we're all part of the community. And I just love these folks so much. And we're all so different and we're all going to come back together. And it's going to -- it's going to be good. It's going to be good. It's just going to take a minute to get there.

And, you know, God's whole gift to service with purpose is work. So, hey, guess what? We just got a lot of work to do. And that's what we're gonna do. We're gonna work. I mean, it's all work. We're just gonna get busy.

COATES: Well, let me tell you something. I know there has been a GoFundMe page. It's been set up to help sustain labor costs as well. And I got to tell you, it's so moving to hear the optimism and the resilience that you are showing. It gives so many people hope, Chuck. Thank you.

HART: And just so you guys know, that money's not for me at all. I've already burned through all my cash, keeping my guys going and all the equipment and materials and everything else, I just -- it just would help me continue doing what we're doing. You know, normally I'm not like a GoFundMe fan, although I will throw some money at it for certain things. If you guys want to, great. If you don't, hey, I get it. But, you know, thank you and thanks for the opportunity.

COATES: Chuck Hart, thank you so much. I'm sorry we met this way. Thank you. So far, we know at least 11 people have died from these fires. Now we're learning who they are. Victor Shaw was 66 years old. He died defending his Altadena home and was found with a fire hose in his hand. Neighbors say the house had huge significance for him and it had been in the family for nearly 55 years.

Rodney Nickerson lived just a short walk from Victor's home. Rodney lived in his house for more than 50 years. He raised his two children there. The last comment to his daughter, I'll be here tomorrow. He was 82 years old.

Erliene Kelley, she was 83. She didn't evacuate from her home in Altadena with the rest of her family. She told them, it's in God's hands. She had lived in her house for more than 40 years. People nearby called her the perfect neighbor.

[23:20:00]

Annette Racili (ph), she was 85. She was encouraged to evacuate her Pacific Palisades home, but stayed behind with her pets, her dog, Greetly (ph), her canary, Pepper (ph), her two parrots, and a turtle.

Anthony Mitchell was 67, and his son, Justin, was in his 20s. Anthony was an amputee who used a wheelchair, and his son, Justin, suffered from cerebral palsy. On Wednesday morning, Anthony was speaking with his daughter in Arkansas when he told her he had to go because the fire was in the yard of their Altadena home. He was later found by Justin's bed. Their families believe that Anthony was trying to save his son, saying he would not have left Justin behind, no matter what.

Still ahead tonight, a live update from the L.A. Fire Department on that new Palisades Fire hotspot forcing new evacuations.

Plus it's a difference maker in the aerial fight to contain the fires, the so-called super scooper. We have one live for you tonight with an expert standing by to explain just how important it is.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[23:25:00]

COATES: At this hour, there's a new evacuation order issued in the Palisades Fire and it's near one of the busiest freeways in Los Angeles. If you look at the screen here on your left, you see this little icon that shows you the map where it says Palisades Fire. Right there above the indication for the Getty Villa, just west of Beverly Hills, this particular fire you're seeing on the right is right there.

There's a line that you see between the Palisades Fire to the indicators where Beverly Hills and beyond. That's the 405, that major freeway in Los Angeles where Nick Watt was explaining to us the fire. They're hoping not to jump and extend even further. I want to go right to the L.A. Fire Department Public Information Officer, Captain Adam Van Gerpen. Adam, thank you for being here. Can you give us an update on this evacuation order and the areas that are at risk?

ADAM VAN GERPEN, LOS ANGELES CITY FIRE DEPARTMENT: Yes, so right now we did issue new evacuation orders and it's -- the fire is in the Mandible Canyon area. So it's moving closer to the 405 freeway. This is on the east end of our fire here. So, we just finished getting over our red flag conditions around 6:00, but that just goes to show people that even though we're not in these red flag extreme wind conditions, the fire can still change direction quickly and right now it is moving fast towards the east direction of this fire.

COATES: So how are you determining where to give the evacuation orders? I mean, what are the factors that are involved in trying to decide that the people have understanding of where they might be in these zones?

VAN GERPEN: Well, we have a very large footprint here. We're talking to the boots who are on the ground. We're talking to our incident (ph). They're relaying that back to our incident commanders. So as we see the fire progressing and moving in towards the east, what we have to do is we reallocate our resources and we start moving them over into that direction. So we have 10 aircraft in the air right now that have all been diverted to that eastern part of this fire, as well as additional strike teams. So we have -- we're sending at least two additional strike teams out there. So, 10 more agents in addition to what's already out there.

COATES: Is that all hands back (ph) approach to the eastern part of that fire? Is that an indication of just how significant it is to be so close to 405?

VAN GERPEN: Well, one of the fortunate things is that there's not very much wind up there. So the early stages of this fire, it was a very fast, very erratic, historic 100 mile an hour winds. So we're not having the winds up there. I've talked to some of the members who are up there and there's not -- this is not a wind driven fire. This is more topography and there is a light winter wind that's up there, but we're not having the extreme conditions. So we're trying to get as resources as we can there right now so that we can stop this from progressing any further.

COATES: Could you imagine when this began on Tuesday that they could have the potential to extend this far?

VAN GERPEN: No. I was working that day. I was there right when it started and we were actually at another fire in Hollywood. We saw the large loom up of smoke, and we started heading over there. We knew there was going to be high winds. We're used to having Santa Ana wind conditions. What we're not used to is having 99 mile an hour gusts and severely erratic wind conditions, extreme fire behavior. You put out one fire, and then you turn around, and there's a mile -- two mile ember cast and you have new starts. So yeah, this -- we know that there was a potential for a large fire, but nothing like this.

COATES: A mile to two mile ember cast. That is unbelievable to think about the range of what's happening. I know you have the aerial coverage, hopefully in this wind reprieve. Adam Van Gerpen, thank you so much. I know you're very busy at work. Thank you so much.

VAN GERPEN: Thank you.

COATES: You heard the fire officials say that they're now using aircraft to try to battle these flames when they couldn't do early on with the wind speed and beyond. And that includes what you're seeing on your screen right now; 47,000 pound plane that's known as the super scooper. And it literally, it scoops up almost 1,500 gallons of water to then drop on these fires.

[23:30:05]

But one of those planes has now been grounded. Why? A drone hit it and damaged the wing. Joining me now, Sam Davis, CEO of Bridger Aerospace, which provides aerial support to fight wildfires. Sam, thank you for being here. I know you are mobilizing a plane to send to California. I see you have a plane behind you. Can you walk us through this unique plane? What is it capable of doing and just how important it could be in fighting a fire?

SAM DAVIS, CEO, BRIDGER AEROSPACE: Absolutely. Thank you for taking the time. And yeah, you see one of our super scoopers behind me here in the aircraft in the hangar in Bozeman, Montana. We have six of these. There's 10 in the U.S. total. We have the largest fleet in the U.S. These are the only purpose built aerial firefighting aircraft out there. These are giant boats on wings, as you saw from the video. They can scoop and drop water continuously on one tank of gas one fuel cycle.

With 1,400-gallon tanks, they can drop continuously for about four to five hours, and one aircraft can drop hundreds of thousands of gallons of water a day. They're big machines, but they're very adept at getting into tight places. They're short takeoff and landing, so they're very used to working in high mountainous terrains, some of the hills there around Palisades. And they need, you know, water sources like rivers, lakes, and even the ocean, obviously where there's an unending supply of water to go fight fires. So these are pretty special machines and one that we're happy to get down to L.A. to help support the efforts there.

COATES: What are the hurdles when you're trying to utilize an aircraft with these erratic winds have been problematic early on?

DAVIS: Right, the winds do present a problem. Obviously, we have standard operating procedures where we operate only when conditions are safe and that includes winds that don't exceed where we would operate. Also, once winds get to the level of 99 miles an hour, the either retardant or water drop from the sky is as you can imagine, much less effective. However, when these planes operate, they can find the windows to drop water and retardant, as you can see in the video, even at nighttime. In helicopters, we can't do nighttime operations yet in scoopers, but we'll find those windows to operate and suppress that fire.

It's really important, as you know, with ground crews to get in and control those hotspots. If embers are traveling, you know, two miles -- up to two miles, it's pretty important that we get in front of that fire progression.

COATES: Sam, I understand that a super scooper was grounded though, because a drone had damaged the wing. I mean, how dangerous looking at the size of this machine and of course, how critical it is, how dangerous are these drones that could potentially hit it?

DAVIS: Oh, extremely dangerous. I mean, we see that here in Montana, we all cringed because that could have cost lives in the air, on the ground. It is extremely important that folks that are around abide by the laws. This is an extremely high penalty and offense for folks to be operating drones in any flight-restricted area or the TFR over fire. So we encourage folks every time we come in contact with them that it is not of interest to get in the way or to see the damage done when these highly trained professionals are putting their lives on the line and we would, you know, hate to see the worst happen.

COATES: And that aircraft was one out of Quebec. You know, we're hoping that it gets operational again soon, but nobody wants to see that. We even see it in our water operations where folks will be in air, you know, boats or jet skis to get close to us and get some footage. And we cannot, you know, stress the importance of folks staying out of the way of all of these operators.

COATES: Sam Davis, thank you so much.

DAVIS: Appreciate it. Thank you.

COATES: I mean, if you think only celebrities have been hurt by these fires, you're absolutely wrong. Next, we take you to Altadena for one family's heartbreaking loss.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[23:35:00]

COATES: Welcome back to our live breaking coverage of the wildfires that are torching L.A. County. You know, one of the hardest hit areas is Altadena, a suburb just 15 miles from downtown L.A. It's known for hiking trails and more affordable homes in some of the communities that are surrounding it. But those homes and those neighborhoods, they are now the thing of the past, thanks to the Eaton Canyon Fire. The chair of the L.A. County Board of Supervisors today comparing the devastation of the town to a war zone. Case in point, my next guests lost everything.

This is a picture of Nyangu Chipembere kneeling behind her family in front of the striking blue door of their family's home. Here's that family home today, gone. The only parts that are left are some burnt through walls just barely still standing. Well, Nyangu Chipembere and her daughter, Chinyarai Hamilton, join me now.

[23:39:55]

Ladies, I -- just seeing that image, I am so sorry that you are in the midst of all that is happening. It is unbelievable to even speak about, and I wonder from you, if I can start with you, Nyangu, did you have any time to try to save anything from your home?

NYANGU CHIPEMBERE, LOST HOME IN LOS ANGELES WILDFIRES: No, I actually slept right through the alert. I believe it was somewhere around 3:00. At 5:00 a.m. I got a phone call from my brother's friends and said, you guys have to evacuate. And I heard that fire probably ran through my house about an hour and a half later.

COATES: You were there when the fire got there?

CHIPEMBERE: I was -- the fire was behind my house, the next block. I tore through that block and then came -- jumped over to ours.

COATES: What was it like when you saw that coming and knew you had to leave?

CHIPEMBERE: You know, it was so gray. There was a blackout, there was smoke everywhere. I couldn't find a mask and I was just shaking. Grabbed my purse, threw clothes over my pajamas and ran out the door.

COATES: I can only imagine how disorienting that would be. It's early in the morning -- you're sweeping through it, unbelievable. And your daughter, Chinyarai, this is the place where you grew up. You're hearing what your mother experienced. What is this meant to you to what can only be a surreal experience?

CHINYARAI HAMILTON, MOTHER LOST HOME IN LOS ANGELES WILDFIRES: It's devastating. My mom has worked so hard to build this home and make it a place of gathering and peace and refuge for everyone in our family and to come back to this after everything she's done and everything she's already been through, it was horrible. There's no words that can describe how we felt looking at what used to be our house.

COATES: Just hearing that, I mean, so many people can relate to thinking about what it means to have a home, let alone to have a refuge and a sacred space for your family and to know what has happened. I mean, everyone has been following this coverage and thinking, you know, people can just rebuild and move on simply, but I wonder if you can share, Nyangu, the Altadena that you know that meant so much and means so much to your family.

CHIPEMBERE: Here we have a tight sense of community. Everybody knows each other by face. We all went to high school together. We don't know Nick. We know the family name. We talk to our neighbors. I feel safe for one thing and that's really important. My kids are grown. I have children, but I feel safe here. I came in my driveway actually --

COATES: And now? CHIPEMBERE: Now -- yeah, I was going to say I came in my driveway and the lights were still out and I just -- I was terrified. I didn't even want to be here -- be there, excuse me. But just uncomfortable. I don't even know if I want to be in that space again.

COATES: Chinyarai, that must be difficult to hear your mother say that.

HAMILTON: Absolutely. Everyone has been banding together to just work through this. It's hard, but we're coming together. I mean, we've got friends who are, you know, going and helping, friends that aren't able to get to their house, taking pictures for them to just let them know what the status is because that's such a horrible feeling, not knowing what the status is of your home, right?

So after we left our house, we went to a friend's house and another friend's house because we had to take pictures for them because they didn't have the ability to get to their home and see the status and then to have to show someone the picture of their home after what's happened. It's such a horrible feeling to have to do that. And you know, we're just mourning together.

COATES: Yeah.

HAMILTON: That's all we can do, is band together and try to rebuild and recover from this. And my hope is that when we work together to do that, that we will successfully. That is my hope for our community. We're such a beautiful, lovely community. We call it beautiful Altadena. And it really is beautiful. And it will be beautiful again.

COATES: If the love that's so apparent between your mother and you is any indication, Altadena is still very beautiful. Ladies, thank you. I'm so sorry.

HAMILTON: Thank you.

CHIPEMBERE: Thank you.

[23:45:01]

COATES: Next, he is the first president to be sentenced as felon. But Donald Trump, well, he remains defiant. Trump's former attorney and a former New York judge join me next.

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COATES: All right, well, 10 days, 10 days now separate us from historic moment in America when Donald Trump takes office once again on January 20th. But this time he'll be the first convicted criminal to become president. That conviction had officially became formal today when he was sentenced in the hush money case out of New York. Judge Juan Merchan ordering no prison time, no fine, no probationary period, essentially no punishment.

[23:49:56] But Judge Mershon did deliver a stern warning and message explaining the only thing stopping him from punishing Trump are the legal protections from the presidency.

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JUAN MERCHAN, JUDGE: Ordinary citizens do not receive those legal protections. It is the office of the president that bestows those far reaching protections to the office holder. And it was the citizenry of this nation that recently decided that you should once again receive the benefits of those protections which include, among other things, the supremacy clause and presidential immunity.

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COATES: The judge may have had the last word in the courtroom, but Trump did get his chance to say his piece too, and he leaned into his grievances.

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DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: It's been a political witch hunt. It was done to damage my reputation so that I'd lose the election, and obviously that didn't work.

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COATES: With me now, retired New York judge George Grasso, who was in court today, and former Trump attorney Tim Parlatore. Glad to have both of you here. I'll begin with you, Your Honor. Judge Merchan made a point to emphasize the impact of the office of the presidency on his decision. But for that election, knowing that he is a first-time offender, so to speak, would he have faced a very different kind of punishment?

GEORGE GRASSO, RETIRED JUDGH: One hundred percent. I think he could have easily been looking at what we would call a split sentence, something like 30 days jail and three years' probation, at a minimum probation. He was convicted of 34 separate felony counts, and I was in the courtroom every day. I think there was abundant evidence. Having said that, I think Judge Merchan did the right thing here. He threaded the needle. Unconditional discharge was the only possible sentence that would survive the type of challenge that went to the Supreme Court.

As a matter of fact, it was cited in the brief Supreme Court decision not to stay the sentencing. The fact that the judge telegraphed there would be an unconditional discharge. So on the one hand, and I also disagree with the narrative that there's no consequence here. I think it's a severe consequence to be a convicted felon for anyone, including a president-elect and soon a president-to-be.

But the actual sentence was designed not to interfere with the duties of the president. So the judge had a tough job, and I think he threaded the needle. COATES: Well, Tim, as you know, yes, there is still a social stigma

around being a convicted felon, but he's not the average person who now is going to be precluded from getting a certain job of choice. He will be the president of the United States, and yet he is angry, frankly, about the -- being sentenced, being prosecuted in general. He will appeal. What is the likelihood of his ability to succeed on that appeal when he is suggesting that they should not have been able to pursue a state prosecution based on a federal violation of law in terms of that catch-and-kill election interference?

TIM PARLATORE, FORMER TRUMP ATTORNEY: Yeah, that is an interesting argument and really kind of goes to whether the judge properly instructed the jury on the federal election law. You know, can they do that type of prosecution? Yes, they can. But if you're going to say that it's in furtherance of that federal crime, you have to instruct the jury more fully on that crime. And also you have to present more evidence.

You remember, there was an expert witness who was disallowed, who would have been able to explain the aspects of the federal election law to the jury and what the procedures were and the fact that, you know, in this case, that type of, you know, that payment, the timing of it wouldn't have been reported to the FEC until after the election happened. All that is important, I think, but that is something that the appellate division is going to look at pretty hard.

COATES: I think they will continue to, and Trump has made no qualms about actually pursuing who will actually do it. We don't know. Todd Blanche, the attorney here, is likely to be a part of the DOJ, the number two position. But Judge Grasso, I mean, you have been in court, as you've said, throughout the trial. He showed no remorse today during that hearing, which was a Zoom hearing. He did speak about the political witch hunt. A lot of it was his greatest hits.

Judge Merchan did not respond. And there had been -- obviously, Merchan had been the target of a lot of the ire of Trump. What did you make of the decorum that was on display by the judge in this instance?

GRASSO: As you said, I was in every day of the trial. I think Judge Merchan, Juan Merchan, has been the utmost professional. And by the way, I've never met him previously. The only time I saw him in action was in this particular trial.

[23:54:55]

And in terms of bending over backwards to be fair to President-elect Trump, he could have -- Judge Machan very well could have proceeded with sentencing on July 11th. Yes, there was the Supreme Court immunity decision, and yes, it was expected that the defense would vehemently request an opportunity to be heard on that.

But Judge Merchan could have went to sentencing, and it wouldn't have really been even a Supreme Court issue at that time --

COATES: Sure. GRASSO: -- because he wasn't president-elect. And he could have hit him -- sentenced him with that split sentence. But with Judge Merchan did every step of the way, starting with adjourning it into September, and then in the heat of the election, saying, you know what, I'm not going to do this until after the election. All of that was bending over backwards in deference to the defendant.

Obviously, Defendant Trump gives Judge Merchan credit for nothing, and you know, dirty judge, crooked judge, but from what I've seen, and with the specific reasons I gave you, I think Judge Merchan couldn't have been fairer and some might say he was fair to a fault. Not me. I think he did the right thing.

COATES: Well, Tim, let me ask you and give you the quick final word here in terms of what happens next. Who's going to oversee this appeal and do you think that the principle behind trump's decision to keep protesting this is sound.

PARLATORE: I do think that there's a good ground for an appeal and who's going to do it. Susan Necheles, you know, she's a phenomenal attorney, great appellate attorney. She's been on this case throughout. And even though the other two attorneys are going to go work in DOJ, he already has somebody in place that's fully familiar and ready to go.

COATES: We'll see how it all unfolds. This is far from over on the appellate side. Good to have you here, Tim Parlatore, George Grasso. Thank you all so much for watching as well. "Anderson Cooper 360" is next.

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