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Laura Coates Live
Trump Softens Tone but Won't Say When Tariffs Will be Cut; Trump Puts Onus on Zelenskyy to Accept Peace Deal; Judge Grants DOJ Extension in Abrego Garcia Case; Democrats Face Shake-Up as Longtime Senator Retires; Laura Coates Interviews Eva Longoria. Aired 11p-12a ET
Aired April 23, 2025 - 23:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[23:00:00]
JOE BORELLI, FORMER REPUBLICAN LEADER OF NEW YORK CITY COUNCIL, MANAGING DIRECTOR OF CHARTWELL STRATEGY: -- unlimited coffee, he can get Diet Cokes, and we could all just get rid of the Navy (ph) mess and have all-star breakfast and grits every morning.
ABBY PHILLIP, CNN ANCHOR AND SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: You know --
HILARY ROSEN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: You know you know what? Cheap eggs.
BORELLI: And cheap eggs.
PHILLIP: Cheap eggs. Well, you know what?
BORELLI: Now you know. I told you.
PHILLIP: You know what? I think you should wear, you should wear the Waffle House where they have the bowling alley because --
BORELLI: Nobody bowls.
PHILLIP: People bowl. Breakfast all day and bowling sounds perfect to me.
BORELLI: Oh, bowling.
PHILLIP: Everyone, thank you very much for joining us. Thanks -- thanks for watching "NewsNight." You can catch me any time on your favorite social media, X, Instagram, and TikTok. "Laura Coates Live" starts right now.
LAURA COATES, CNN HOST AND SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Tonight, is President Trump's trade war heading for a U-turn? Off ramp with some dangerous game of high-speed chicken. Tonight on "Laura Coates Live."
It's the tariff roller coaster that just keeps ongoing because tonight, the president is again injecting the thing, the markets. And, well, your 401K don't like it all. Uncertainty. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNKNOWN (voice-over): How soon do you want to bring the tariffs on Chinese goods down?
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Well, that depends on them.
UNKNOWN: Were you worried about what the 145% tariffs were doing to small businesses here in the U.S.? Is that why you're bringing it down?
TRUMP: No, no, no. I -- haven't brought it down. I haven't brought it. Still 145. I haven't --
UNKNOWN: But you said in the next --
TRUMP: I said it's a high tariff. It is a high tariff. But I haven't brought it down.
I get along very well with President Xi, and I hope we can make a deal. Otherwise, we'll set a price. And hopefully, they'll come here and they'll contribute. And if they don't, that's okay.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COATES: So, are tariffs on China coming down or not? Good luck reading those tea leaves because it all seemed a lot more clear yesterday. Remember when the president said this?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: A 145% is very high. And it won't be that high. Not going to be that high.
It will come down substantially, but it won't be zero.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COATES: So, this is the messaging equivalent of two steps forward, one step back. Remember his so-called reciprocal tariffs that he paused earlier this month? Well, he's now setting the timeline for their return if countries don't play ball.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: If we don't have a deal with a company or a country, we're going to set the tariff. We just set the tariff. It's something that we think that will happen, I'd say, over the next couple of weeks, wouldn't you say? I think so. Over the next two, three weeks.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COATES: Oh. And there's this, too.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) TRUMP: I really don't want cars from Canada. So, when I put tariffs on Canada, they're paying 25%, but that could go up in terms of cars.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COATES: Now, it is true that Trump's overall tone on tariffs has softened, especially with China, even if he's not making it clear what the plan really is.
You know, someone did get through to him. Two words, big box or at least their CEOs. Seems the CEOs of Walmart and Target and Home Depot and Lowe's, well, Axios was first to report that they warned him store shelves could go empty if he keeps all this up. So, the question now is, will China blink and then come to the table? Well, Trump is glass half-full.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNKNOWN (voice-over): Has there been any direct contact between the U.S. and China about trade at all?
TRUMP: Yeah. Of course. Every day.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COATES: But if you ask Treasury Secretary Scott Bessant, you will get a different answer. He told reporters this today. I think both sides are waiting to speak to the other. He also tossed aside rumors that Trump will unilaterally lower tariffs on China.
And you know what? The markets, they got the message. They were up overall for the day, but they lost some of their big early gains by midmorning, around the time of Bessent's comments. Market futures right now are in the red. So, we'll see what the roller coaster ride brings us all tomorrow.
But one GOP megadonor says all the wild twists, turns, and loops are risking permanent whiplash damage.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KEN GRIFFIN, GOP MEGADONOR: The United States was more than just a nation. It's a brand. It's a universal brand, whether it's our culture, our financial strength, our military strength. America rose beyond just being a country. It was like an aspiration for most of the world. And we're eroding that brand right now.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COATES: Joining me now, two reporters who have been breaking the story after story after story on this trade war, Marc Caputo, senior politics reporter for Axios, and Jeff Stein, White House economics reporter for "The Washington Post."
Jeff, let me begin with you because it's kind of like you want to do something, but will you or can you do something? It sounds like there's a desire to deescalate the trade war. No real action plan on how to do it. Is that a fair assessment?
JEFF STEIN, WHITE HOUSE ECONOMICS REPORTER, THE WASHINGTON POST: I think that's spot on. The thing that I hear over and over again from people in the administration, people outside the administration, the foreign countries they're talking to, is that, as your segment reflected, people do not know what Trump wants.
[23:05:09]
And I've had conversations with senior people who are asking me. You know, I'm coming to them and saying, what are you guys asking for? And they're saying, hey, what are you hearing?
And it sets (ph) this amazing game of telephone because the president's own intentions are moving so quickly because he has this art of the deal theory where if he keeps everyone guessing, if he keeps everyone on his toes, if he keeps his true intentions hidden, that that will somehow reverberate to the glory of the United States.
And, you know, all we can say is that the results so far have mostly led to pain. There is no deal to speak of to -- to crow about from the administration's perspective.
COATES: Hmm.
STEIN: As reporters, we just assess what we have in front of us. Maybe that will change at some point. But at this point, people are just asking us, what are you hearing? And I'm saying, well, what are you hearing? And the answer is nobody really knows.
COATES: I mean, there's close to the best and there's close to a mess, Marc. And you were first to report that CEOs warned Trump of empty shelves and sky- high prices if these tariffs stayed in effect. You have to wonder, this is not a new message, essentially. There is predictability in that very statement. But what was it about them conveying it that seemed to resonate with the president?
MARC CAPUTO, SENIOR POLITICS REPORTER, AXIOS: I think the president has tendency to fixate on certain sort of big-ticket items and big ideas. And the idea, the phrase empty shelf is different for the United States.
We're accustomed to abundance. We're accustomed to being able to order what we want, the food we want when we're lying in bed and someone will deliver it, or order stuff from Amazon or go to Home Depot and buy a drill. But when you have the head of Home Depot, Target, Walmart, saying, look, in two weeks, there's a possibility we're going to start having empty shelves, there is no one else to blame for that but the current administration, and Trump is the head of the administration that set them on that course.
And it did, we are told, make an impression. However, just because it makes an impression doesn't mean Trump is going to change course. We are talking right now about the specifics, and we don't know the specifics of what Donald Trump wants, and it's not clear that Donald Trump knows that.
COATES: Hmm.
CAPUTO: But what is clear is the direction he wants to go. He wants more tariffs, he wants more manufacturing, and he wants a different trade deficit and trade balance between us, the United States, China, and other nations. How we get there? What that looks like? Again, I don't think he knows, and we certainly don't.
COATES: Well, it's one thing if you and I and Marc don't know. But if Trump doesn't know the answer to that question, no wonder the markets are reacting so poorly. But you also -- one of the key voices that seems to be emerging from all this is secretary of the treasury, Scott Bessent, of course. And you reported that he influenced Trump to dial back those attacks on Jerome Powell. Tell me more.
STEIN: Well, the treasury secretary traditionally has been the role that's most responsible for making sure that the U.S. economy, you know, stays on the right track, that financial markets aren't in a total panic. And while Bessent has had, you know, less success, you might say, in restraining Trump than Trump's first treasury secretary, Steven Mnuchin, Bessent has clearly been looking for a lowering of the temperature here.
And the projections that we were getting, the treasury was getting about the bond market, about the potential effects on the U.S. economy, which would be blamed on Bessent, were really quite alarming.
And so, it's no surprise that between, you know, trying to get Trump to reign in the attacks on the Fed, between trying to get him to, you know, signal an off ramp on the China tariffs, that that is the -- the outcome that he wants.
COATES: He doesn't want to hold the bag.
STEIN: Yeah. Exactly. The problem from Bessent's perspective is, right, that Trump views his leverage as critical. And Trump has this idea that seems very clear at this point, that he wants people to think that they don't know what he's going to do next. He wants the Chinese saying, maybe he will just destroy both of our economy simultaneously if we don't give him what he wants.
And that is fun -- that impulse that Trump has to seek that leverage, to preserve that ability to make people afraid of what he's going to do next, is fundamentally in conflict with the assurances that Bessent
and other members of the administration want that will get the markets to calm down, that will get consumer confidence back up and that will --
COATES: Yeah.
STEIN: -- sort of put a gauze on the situation.
COATES: Speaking of conflict, Marc, you know I'm coming to you, because you're reporting on a shouting match between Bessent and Elon Musk in the West Wing, of all places, where apparently, both men had to be separated. Someone described it to you as WWE in the hall of the West Wing. So, what exactly happened?
CAPUTO: Conflict has been brewing for quite some time between Scott Bessent and Elon Musk.
[23:10:02]
Musk didn't want Bessent, for instance, to be treasury secretary during the transition. Obviously, Bessent prevailed. As DOGE under Musk started to kick into high gear, they had a few conflicts over staffing at treasury.
And then most recently, Scott Bessent wanted his pick to be the IRS commissioner. Elon Musk had his pick installed. Bessent then raised the issue with President Trump and said that Elon Musk had gone behind his back.
And this all sort of boiled over on Thursday when Bessent confronted Musk about it. And a shouting match and the F-bombs ensued. They were apparently face-to-face, chest-to-chest, and it was a really intense conversation -- not a conversation, there were some yelling going on.
At the time, Giorgia Meloni, the prime minister from Italy, was meeting with Trump in the Oval Office. And from what we're told, the arguing and the yelling could be heard or was within earshot of the prime minister when she was meeting with Trump. And while Bessent was telling Musk, F-you, Musk was then taunting him, saying, say it louder, as in let them hear it as you're losing your cool.
That's a good indication of how temperatures are rising in the White House and the sort of pressure cooker that it is right now over there.
COATES: Hmm. Talk about palace intrigue. Marc Caputo, Jeff Stein, thank you both. We'll hear more.
I want to dig deeper into this apparent U-turn by President Trump on China. With me now, Kevin O'Leary, chairman of O'Leary Ventures and the judge, of course, on "Shark Tank." Also, Ross Gerber, co-founder, president and CEO of Gerber Kawasaki Wealth and Investment Management. Welcome to you both.
Kevin, let me begin with you because last time you and I spoke, you had been wanting 400% tariffs on China. But there is reporting out there that suggest that Trump may be considering not going that direction, but actually cutting back. Do you think that Trump would make a negotiating mistake by easing tariffs at this juncture?
KEVIN O'LEARY, CHAIRMAN OF O'LEARY VENTURES, "SHARK TANK" JUDGE: No, I don't. I don't think China is just about tariffs. I mean, you know, the rest of these negotiations with 60 plus countries seem to be moving ahead. But the story that India is going to actually do something, you know, at paper -- paper deal, the same with the EU, that may happen. But China is different because it's not just tariffs. China has issues around the World Trade Organization, has issues around IP theft, has issues -- so --
COATES: I think China might be calling you because they want to have -- want to answer a little bit more about -- let me go to you, Ross, on this point because, you know, on this issue, you had on social media, the platform Weibo, the #Trumpchickenedout, that 150 million views, actually more than that. The Chinese think that Trump is chickening out, that it's really not more than the issue of tariffs at this point, unlike what Kevin is saying. Is Trump chickening out?
ROSS GERBER, CEO AND PRESIDENT, GERBER KAWASAKI WEALTH AND INVESTMENT MANAGEMENT: Well, I don't think Trump knows what he's doing. He's backed himself into a corner through horrible negotiating tactics.
I think what Kevin is trying to say is that, you know, there's a lot of issues that need to be addressed with China, and I don't think anybody is debating that. What they're debating is this approach where you're just slapping tariffs on this country and then saying, let's come to the table and work out a deal. And the bullying doesn't work in China. And if you studied any level of Chinese history, you would see that through the last 5,000 years of their history.
So, I think that's really the issue. It has been a bad approach. And it has gotten a bad result, not only from negotiating with our partners and allies, but also our potential enemies like China.
So, this idea that we're coming to the table to anybody, unless Kevin has some special knowledge, this is actually not true either. We're not coming to the table with anybody yet, and this is extremely concerning to everybody in the investment community.
But I'm telling you, the small business owners in America are suffering horribly from this. Trump has put an arrow in the heart of literally thousands of small businesses and business owners in our country who rely on China to supply their goods and services, whether it's packaging or beauty products or -- it's like people -- does he even understand how the supply chain at Tesla works? Because they have 5,000 global suppliers just at Tesla.
COATES: Hmm.
GERBER: So, Elon knows perfectly well that this is garbage policy and a garbage application of the policy, and it's costing America greatly. We've lost trillions, and I don't see how we get it back unless we reverse it.
COATES: Kevin, do you agree? I mean, GOP megadonor and hedge fund manager Ken Griffin, Kevin, he warned that this economic uncertainty is eroding the American brand.
[23:15:04]
Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KENNETH GRIFFIN, FOUNDER AND CEO OF CITADEL LLC, GOP MEGADONOR, HEDGE FUND MANAGER: But in the financial markets, no brand compared to the brand of the U.S. treasuries, U.S. treasury market, the strength of the U.S. dollar, and the strength -- the credit worthiness of U.S. treasuries. No brand came close. We put that brand at risk. When you tarnish that brand, it can be a lifetime to repair the damage that has been done.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COATES: Is Trump's trade work, Kevin, tarnishing the American brand?
O'LEARY: No, not at all. I mean, this narrative on China is different than the rest of the countries. So, you know, talking about China, being worried about them, being concerned, let's understand what they've been doing for the last 25 years. Remember, they joined the --
COATES: Before you answer that question that you're answering, I want you to answer the one I asked, though. Do you think it's actually tarnishing America's brand like the way that Ken Griffin said because, of course, more than $7 trillion in value has been erased in the S&P 500 in the last two months? Do you think there has been a tarnishing of the brand that could be reversed if at all?
O'LEARY: No, it's strengthening the American brand. That's the whole point.
COATES: How?
O'LEARY: We're the largest economy on Earth. We're 39% of all goods consumed worldwide. We're 26.1% of world GDP. And if we don't fight against China's theft of IP, of not abiding by the World Trade Organization laws, all of the disputes going on forever, the theft of every mold of an American product, that is what the American brand is about. It's about democracy, transparency, and rule of law.
And you want China to ride shotgun every small American company that hits $5 million in sales? I'm telling you, every administration for 26 years has never addressed this problem till now.
COATES: Wait. What about Kevin's point about -- about small companies?
O'LEARY: Kevin -- Kevin, you're Canadian. Okay? And Canadians --
COATES: I can't hear. I -- hold on. Both of you, stop. I want to hear both of your points.
GERBER: Kevin, you're an --
COATES: Excuse me. Excuse me. I want to hear your points.
GERBER: -- Canadian.
COATES: Ross, I want to hear your point, but because you spoke over him, I couldn't hear the initial point. I wanted to hear your response, Kevin. First, the idea of small businesses. What was your reaction to what Ross had to say about small businesses? And then Ross, continue. Go ahead, Kevin.
O'LEARY: Nobody invests in more small businesses in America than I do. Sixty-two percent of jobs created in America are by businesses 5 to 500 employees. I'm their advocate. I have hundreds of cases of how China has screwed them over by getting them to five million sales of domestic revenue, then stealing their products, dumping them back in the American market. And the molds that actually are in China, they run the American product during the day, and the Chinese knock off at night. I live this every day.
And I'm just telling you, if we don't address this at some point now, because there's no way to dispute it, you can't use the WTO, you can't litigate in China. They raise money in our markets without even complying by gap. I'm just saying, wait a second, let's just level the playing field.
So, I'm not worried about how Chinese feel about anything. I love the Chinese people. I want to do business there. The government cheats, steals, robs, and does not play by any rules. I don't think 125% is enough.
COATES: Ross, are you convinced by that point? Are you convinced? Because early --
GERBER: You know, once again --
COATES: I want to hear from Ross now. Ross, go ahead.
GERBER: I don't consider the debate over whether China does things that are bad to American businesses. We all agree with that. It's how we deal with it, which you don't want to answer the question, which is tarnishing the American brand globally.
This isn't just about China. You're Canadian, and the Canadians couldn't be more angry at us. Now, I live in California, and the Canadians are, like, oh, we're just not coming to California now. and I can't tell you how much money in California we make off Canadian tourism. Now, tourism has gone negative here in the United States from foreigners because it has tarnished our brand, the way we're handling it.
We're the richest country in the world. And the same small businesses you represent now are getting screwed with these tariffs because they have to pay them. Have you actually talked to all your business owners recently? Because I talk to them every day in my job. And I have over 8,000 clients and tons of them are business owners.
So, I can tell you, this is -- we're about to see dramatic increase in costs across America. Americans have never had things disappearing from the shelves since COVID. Okay? So, do you -- do you want to have a world where you can't find socks? You know, like, we're not going to start manufacturing socks in America. So, it's just we have to start growing up and accepting the world isn't like in 1920 anymore. And, like, the manufacturing that they want to bring back to America isn't the manufacturing we want.
[23:20:02]
COATES: I know we have to go. I -- Ross, I know we have to go, but I have to --
GERBER: -- application is a disaster.
COATES: I -- I hear you. I know we have to go. Kevin, I'm going to ask you to be succinct in your final point, so they don't yell at me. Go ahead.
O'LEARY: First of all, let's set -- set the record straight. I have multi-nationalities. My whole -- my whole family is American. I care about every business I invest in America. You're weak when you say we can't deal with this now. Be strong and get ready for the fight of your life to settle this issue with China. Cheating, stealing, ripping off American IP, enough is enough, it's time to deal with it now. Have some backbone, my friend. Show some strength. That is the American brand. That is the American entrepreneur. You're weak.
COATES: All right. Got to leave it there. I welcome you both. I know this competition is not over. Kevin O'Leary, Ross Gerber, thank you both.
Still ahead tonight, as Trump nears day 100 -- no, we're not there yet -- his day one goal of ending the war in Ukraine, it remains elusive. And now the administration is suggesting Zelenskyy need to take the deal or else the United States will walk away. So, what is it about the offer that has Trump's critics calling it a sellout to Russia? Adam Kinzinger will join me to explain next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[23:25:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I think we have a deal with Russia. We have to get a deal with Zelenskyy. And I hope that Zelenskyy -- I thought it might be easier to deal with Zelenskyy. So far, it has been harder. But that's okay.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COATES: President Trump puts the onus on President Zelenskyy to end Russia's war on Ukraine, rebuking Zelenskyy for undermining the U.S. peace plan. He posted on a social media, we are very close to a deal, but the man with no cards to play should now finally get it done.
With me now, CNN senior political commentator and former Republican congressman from Illinois, Adam Kinzinger. Adam, welcome back. The administration is pushing hard to get the deal done in his first 100 days. That's what? A week from today, by the way. This proposal seems to favor Russia, including recognition of -- of Russian control in Crimea. You called the plan insane. Why?
ADAM KINZINGER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, FORMER ILLINOIS REPRESENTATIVE: I mean, it is insane, first off, what Donald Trump is displaying. My main man, Ronald Reagan, said in one of his speeches in 60 something -- he said, we can have peace, and we can have it this next second. Surrender. I mean, anybody can have peace. You can have peace tomorrow, any time if you surrender.
And this is what Donald Trump is doing. He has basically said -- now what -- also, let's set the record here for a second. Russia is losing 1,100 men a day. A day. They are, in one week, losing -- having the same casualties that we had in Afghanistan over 20 years. This belief that Russia somehow can keep going when they're assaulting the Ukrainian lines right now with donkeys and scooters and using human meat waves, Russia is out of offensive combat power. But what they've done is convince Donald Trump that somehow, they'll stay in this war forever.
You know, both sides are like boxers. They're kind of tired. They're just kind of barely hitting each other now. And Donald Trump, particularly with Crimea, in essence, giving them de jure recognition, which means by law recognition instead of de facto, which is just like recognizing the reality of the ground that violates everything that Ukraine has in their Constitution.
And lastly, I'll say on top of all of this, there's no security guarantees. I mean, one of the things we were very critical of the Obama administration on is not giving weapons to Ukraine and not having a security guarantee. I mean, Donald Trump attacks Obama on this. And now, he's not giving Ukraine any security guarantees. There's literally nothing that -- that the Ukrainians gain in this, and every -- every concession has been given to the Russians.
COATES: Well, the vice president, J.D. Vance, says the administration aims to -- quote -- "freeze the territorial lines" -- unquote -- close to where they stand at this moment. Is -- is there a realistic path forward if that is what happens?
KINZINGER: Well, J.D. Vance also said, frankly, I don't care what happens in Ukraine. Let's remember that. And so, I don't consider him any kind of a, you know, an economic -- academic on this issue.
So, yeah, I mean, look, it's one thing to say, you know, hey, look, we want an end of this war, and we recognize that Ukraine is not going to basically get back all of the territory. That's de facto recognition. It's kind of like saying we recognize that.
De jure says it is now U.S. policy and law, which -- by the way, the Baltics during the entire time that they were occupied by the Soviet -- by Russia, Soviet Union, we never de jure recognized that, and we always said that they were independent. And then when they actually threw off the Soviet Union, they were immensely, you know, happy with the United States for doing that.
We can't do this with -- with Ukraine in terms of allowing them or forcing them to give up Crimea and gain nothing, and particularly the security guarantees. So, you can freeze the lines all you want, that's great, until Russia regroups, which they fully intend to do, and reattack without a security guarantee. COATES: Well, the White House insists that Trump did not give Zelenskyy an ultimatum of some kind. But the secretary of state, Marco Rubio, skipped today's peace talk summit in London. And Vance says it is time for Ukraine and Russia to get on board or the U.S. will walk away. Is that a serious threat?
KINZINGER: I think so. And I think that's their plan. I mean, look, Marco Rubio, the biggest disappointment of a person I've ever known in my life because he knows better and yet he's continuing to do this.
[23:30:01]
By the way, the people that are fighting in the trenches in Ukraine are heroes. Our administration is cowardice. It's -- it's unbelievable, cowardice. But what I think is going to happen, what I -- what I worry about, actually, and it may be better for Ukraine ultimately, is that Donald Trump disengages. He says, boy, I tried, I don't care anymore.
The concern then is he'll turn around and relieve sanctions on Russia because you know he's desperate to do that. He's basically said he's desperate to do that. But it's probably better for Ukraine if Trump quits taking an interest in it.
And if Europe steps up to back Ukraine, Europe can crush Russia in and of itself. It doesn't mean the United States -- nice if the United States was there to back up Ukraine with them.
COATES: Well, if that were true, one must wonder why it hasn't happened yet. Adam Kinzinger, thank you so much.
KINZINGER: Any time. You bet.
COATES: Up next, the escalating standoff in the Abrego Garcia case. The DOJ now looking for more time before answering a judge's demand to give information about his mistaken deportation. This wasn't named for his case. One of Abrego Garcia's attorneys standing by with an update for us tonight.
And later, the retirement of longtime Democratic Senator Dick Durbin and the uncomfortable conversation it's now reigniting for his party.
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[23:35:00]
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COATES: New tonight, the judge overseeing the case of Kilmar Abrego Garcia, the mistakenly deported Maryland man, pausing for a week the long-awaited expedited fact-finding process that would help the judge determine what the Trump administration has or has not done to facilitate Abrego Garcia's return to the United States. All on the heels of Judge Paula Xinis's admonishment of the administration for not acting in good faith, at least so far, during the discovery process. I want to bring in one of the attorneys representing Kilmar Abrego Garcia, Alexandra Ribe. Alexandra, thank you for joining us. I mean, the -- the judge is postponing the so-called discovery process when documents are exchanged information for a week. The order suggests that you agree to that request, for a week. Why?
ALEXANDRA RIBE, ATTORNEY FOR KILMAR ABREGO GARCIA: So, there has been a ceiling order by the court, so I can't speak about what's happening in discovery. What I can speak about is the order from yesterday, from the judge. And I think that that order, which was about the -- just the discovery process and the objections to the discovery that the government is making.
She used words such as that they were stubbornly refusing to comply, there was a willful refusal, and I think that her tone makes it clear that she understands and we understand that this case is -- is more than about Mr. Abrego Garcia. This case is about whether the government -- whether there's accountability, whether the government has accountability, whether the government is above the law.
COATES: The administration has highlighted a domestic dispute with his wife from 2021, an incident that she has, in fact, acknowledged. They also continue to allege that he is a member of the MS-13 gang and that he was involved in human trafficking. I know that the family has disputed all of those allegations to the extent related to the gang violence or anything else.
Is there any truth to these accusations? And if so or if not, why do you think the government is asserting these now?
RIBE: I mean, I -- I think the government is asserting them now because they're -- they're engaged in political messaging just so that they can figure out a way to -- to -- to justify their admitted mistake. I mean, again, they admitted to the court under oath that this was an administrative error, that our client was not supposed to be deported. And so -- not supposed to be deported to El Salvador. Let me be clear. They admitted that. And the reason for that is because he has a humanitarian final order restricting his deportation to El Salvador. So, they've admitted that.
And then afterwards, when they were called -- called on it very publicly -- and look, I mean, I -- I think that the breadth of this case has -- has really taken hold of the nation. It's something that we didn't expect. When my -- when my small law firm took on this case, certainly, we did not expect all of the media interest that we've gotten and --
COATES: His family did not either. Right? I mean, she was stunned to think about the breadth and scope of the -- of the coverage of this and, of course, what it could pretend for so many others. I mean, she's caught up in this political frenzy and, frankly, this justice issue as well.
And now, she fears for her own safety. I mean, she and her kids were forced to move to a safe house, I understand, after officials perhaps have -- have posted a court document that included the address of the family. Is that correct?
RIBE: Yes. I mean, the -- I -- I think exactly what you said. I -- as much as we had no idea that this would take on a life of its own. I just want to be clear that I'm so happy it has because I think that people are realizing that it is more than just this man. Exactly like you said.
This is about, okay, well, if this country can disappear somebody to a foreign prison and then say there's nothing we can do about it, there's no recourse afterwards, then they can do that to anybody. And that is really the -- the chilling effect of this case. And I think we had no idea, and I think she had no idea.
[23:40:00]
And -- and I can see her being very worried because it's a polarizing subject. You know, you have -- you have us screaming at the top of our lungs that our client should not have been deported. And the government has even said that themselves, that they did an error. And then you have the government saying, okay, well, he's an MS-13 member. And whether or not there's -- there's good evidence on that, the fact that the government is saying that, that is enough for people to believe it.
And then on top of that, you have what you just mentioned, which is that the government posted a protective order. That protective order had her -- Mr. Abrego Garcia's wife's address on it. So, I mean, I would be petrified if I were her. I mean, this case is -- has so many -- caught so many people's attention. And so, for your address to be publicly out there in this type of environment when we're talking about this case that's so polarizing, I would be terrified.
COATES: Alexandra Ribe, we await more information that you can provide and, of course, the courts as well. Thank you.
RIBE: Thank you so much for having me.
COATES: Well, still ahead, the age issue back to the forefront for Democrats as senator Dick Durbin announces that he is stepping aside. Will others follow his lead in passing the torch? But what does it mean for the party? We will talk about it next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[23:45:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. DICK DURBIN (D-IL): The decision on whether to run for reelection has not been easy. I truly love the job of being United States senator. But in my heart, I know it is time to pass the torch. So, I'm announcing today that I will not be seeking reelection at the end of my term.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COATES: A four decade plus career in Congress is coming to an end. Illinois Senator Dick Durbin announcing today that he won't seek reelection for another term, saying there are good people in the wings ready to serve, a sentiment a lot of people share, with many in the party saying it is time to pave the way for a new generation of leaders.
Durbin is the number two Democrat in the Senate, of course, after Chuck Schumer. He's also the top Democrat on the all-important Senate Judiciary Committee. His retirement likely setting up a contentious battle for party leadership after 2026 midterms.
Joining me now to discuss is former Democratic Congressman Joe Crowley. Congressman, he's 80. Perhaps not the biggest surprise, that he wants to leave at this point in time. But there have been calls for a long time for the passing of the torch, including generationally. Is this happening now? Will this be the new standard for others, perhaps?
JOE CROWLEY, FORMER NEW YORK REPRESENTATIVE: Well, let me first say about Dick Durbin, what a what a gracious fellow.
COATES: Hmm.
CROWLEY: I mean, that was so gracious, just that video, and how he handled it in passing the torch. And what a legacy of legislation. You know, from criminal justice reform to health care to immigration. I mean, he was just -- he was involved in every aspect of legislation in the past 40 years.
You know, I -- I do think you're seeing this happening maybe more biologically in some respects.
COATES: Strategically, you're saying?
CROWLEY: Yeah. I think that's the sonogram (ph). I think that you've had some titans. You know, we've had titans. And you think of Nancy Pelosi. She's a titan. You think of Dick Durbin. He's a titan. And so, these are people who have had energy, continue to have energy, and continue to want to serve. So, look, you know, he's passing the torch, he's not dropping it --
COATES: Hmm.
CROWLEY: -- which is interesting. It's important to say this is happening voluntarily. I think it speaks volumes to him again in terms of his class and his motivation.
COATES: Well, a new poll, a Pew poll, actually, shows 60% of Americans have an unfavorable view of the Democratic Party. That's, frankly, worse than the 56% unfavorable rating for the GOP. And some people notice the DNC vice chair, David Hogg. They're suggesting that some incumbent Democrats should be primaried. Leader Hakim Jeffries is dismissing that. What -- what is your reaction?
CROWLEY: My sense is that these primaries happen organically. I think the people at the DNC need to focus on how we win back the House of Representatives, how we win back the Senate.
COATES: Well, that could be one mechanism to do so.
CROWLEY: Well, it shouldn't be the role of a vice chair of the DNC to be picking and choosing who'll get primary and who will not. Apparently, in all due respect to David, I don't know him personally, but, you know, he has been through a lot in his whole life in terms of Parkland and the shootings out of -- out of Florida. He seems to be determined to make a life in politics. God bless him. He'll do well.
But at the end of the day, it seems as though certain people are exempt from this list. You know, apparently, Jan Schakowsky, is going to announce her retirement. They work on a primary because she's effective. Someone is determining who is and who isn't effective and deserves a primary. That should be left up to the people of that district.
If they -- look, there's no shortage of people who want to be in Congress. People would -- would do just about anything to get there if they think they could win the seat. So, let that happen organically, I think.
COATES: You know, one person who, as you know, won a seat is AOC, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.
CROWLEY: No.
COATES: I know. It's a -- your own district. I realize that shortly. But she came in at a time when people were also talking about a changing of the guard, so to speak, and she has become quite influential in the party and her presence quite felt. In fact, here was Bill Maher just this past weekend talking about the crowds she was drawing. Listen.
[23:50:00]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BILL MAHER, HBO POLITICAL TALK SHOW HOST: Big crowds. Again, the shiny object that the Democrats chase. It's not about the big crowds that come out to you when you're talking in a festival or wherever they are. I think -- because I think Bernie showed up at Coachella. That must have been fun for the fans.
(LAUGHTER)
It's who shows up on Election Day. And I just don't see that's the ticket. This is just not what's going to get the job done.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COATES: What do you think about that?
CROWLEY: Well, first off, I think that Alexandria Ocasio Cortez is a great talent. There's no doubt about that. I think that what she's doing is speaking in no small part as Bernie Sanders's to the base of our party. And we need to maintain that base. We need to turn them out in the general election as well.
But in order to win many of these seats in the House of Representatives, we need to go beyond our base. We have to appeal to moderates. We have to -- we have to actually appeal to some Republicans to vote -- to cross over and vote for a Democrat.
And so, I -- I do think that these are important things to happen, that they can -- should continue to do this. But at the same time, we need to keep in mind, in order to win back the House of Representatives, we have to take seats that are presently held by Republicans. And to do that, you have to go to the moderate or you have to appeal to Republicans.
COATES: Joe Crowley, always a pleasure to have you here.
CROWLEY: Thanks, Laura.
COATES: Thank you so much.
CROWLEY: Good to be with you.
COATES: Still ahead, we have a very special guest tonight on this Wednesday evening. The one, the only Eva Longoria is standing by with a sneak peek at her latest adventure in her new show," Searching for Spain," next.
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[23:55:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COATES: Well, Eva Longoria is back in the new CNN Original Series, "Searching for Spain." She's taking viewers on a gastronomic journey all across Spain to see how the country is redefining its cuisine and dominating the world's culinary scene. In the first episode, Eva goes to Barcelona to learn about the importance of the hour of vermouth.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNKNOWN: We're on Carrer Parlament. If you ask anyone here in Barcelona what is parlament all about, they'll tell you vermouth.
EVA LONGORIA, ACTRESS, PRODUCER: Oh, yeah.
UNKNOWN: But more than just the drink, it's the culture around it. Right? La hora del vermut is kind of early afternoon, before lunch, family, friends, salty snacks, couple of beverages.
LONGORIA: Oh.
UNKNOWN: And the whole thing starts coming together. So --
LONGORIA: This is like my kind of living.
I always thought vermouth went in a drink. I didn't think you drink it by itself.
UNKNOWN: In Italy, it largely works that way. But here, it was taken and adapted, and it became a little less bitter, a little bit more herbaceous. They kind of found the sweet spot that makes it imminently drinkable.
LONGORIA (voice-over): With around 50 vermouth producers in this region alone, Catalans have clearly adopted this Italian import as their own.
I'm in heaven. I'm in heaven. Okay. Well, let we should try this first. Right?
UNKNOWN: Salud.
LONGORIA: Salud. Oh, it has an olive inside.
UNKNOWN: So, you'll get, like, those Mediterranean herbs, like --
LONGORIA: Yeah.
UNKNOWN: -- thyme or rosemary. They use sagebrush in this one, which is kind of --
LONGORIA: Oh.
UNKNOWN: -- part of one of their little secret ingredients that make it --
LONGORIA: You're right. It's not as sweet as some I've tried. Oh.
UNKNOWN: It's not. And the thing is you could happily drink a few of these or you can --
LONGORIA: Happily.
(LAUGHTER)
(Voice-over): And rule number one here, if you drink, you eat.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COATES: My kind of place. Eva Longoria joins me now. This all looks incredible. I forget my other questions. Tell me about this vermouth hour. What is going on? I love it.
LONGORIA: Yeah. Oh, my gosh. What a country to have an hour dedicated to drinking vermouth. I -- this is the first time I was introduced to vermouth. I -- I always thought of vermouth as something that just went in martinis. I didn't think it was a standalone thing.
But in Spain, each bar has their own recipe of vermouth. And it's -- it's not as bitter, as he said, as some. It's not as dry as others. It's a sweet vermouth. It's not as sweet as -- I mean, it they have just really perfected vermouth in Catalonia. And it was my drink of the summer last year. It still is, actually. COATES: This is why I love this series, because watching you react to it, and we all relate to you having these experiences. So, tell me about why you were so drawn --
LONGORIA: Yeah.
COATES: -- to being able to have this incredible journey. Why Spain and why this way?
LONGORIA: Yeah. Well, you know, I did search for Mexico because my whole life, I've been raised as a Mexican-American, very proud of my Mexican roots, and my dad would always tell me, you know what? You know, the Longorias are from Spain, the Longorias are from Spain.
And so, I, you know, after searching for Mexico, I told CNN, I was, like, I'd really love to, you know, go back to my roots, to Spain and my -- you know, search my Spanish heritage. And they were, like, let's do it. And so, being able to go back and -- and really, like you said, my reactions are so authentic. I knew Mexico so well and still discovered things in Mexico that I didn't know.
But Spain was really a mystery to me. I live now in the south of Spain, in Marbella, part time. So, I know a little bit. But, like, that reaction of, like, wait, this is made here? What? Like, it's so authentic.
COATES: Okay, fine, I'll come live with you. Eva, okay, just stop. It's fine. I can move in. It's fine. We'll do that. Of course, everyone is really excited.
LONGORIA: You know what? That is another thing. That's another thing, like, Spaniards have a great way of living.
COATES: Hmm.
LONGORIA: And if somebody asks you to, hey, let's go have a drink, they mean, like, right now. So, you're not going to go, like, yeah, how about Wednesday at five? Like, you're not scheduling it. They mean right now, and you go, and you have a drink, and you sit.
COATES: Eva, as always, thank you so much. You've got us tuning in.
[23:59:56]
Everyone, the all new CNN Original Series, Eva Longoria, "Searching for Spain." It premieres Sunday at 9 p.m. Eastern and Pacific, only on CNN.
Thanks for watching. "Anderson Cooper 360" is next.
