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Laura Coates Live

Laura Coates And Guests Discuss U.S. Economy Status; Trump Vows To Expand Immigration Crackdown In The Coming Days; Dr. Sanjay Gupta Talks About His New Documentary On Treating Pain. Aired 11p-12a ET

Aired September 05, 2025 - 23:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[23:00:00]

LAURA COATES, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight, is our economy booming or stalling? New warning signs under President Trump as the White House says, look far, far into the horizon. Plus, could he be the world's first billionaire? No, not Trump. Elon Musk.

Tesla proposed an eye-popping pay package for him, but the carrot comes with some serious strings attached. And Trump's immigration crackdown hits New York and also Georgia, ending in hundreds of arrests. The co-owner of one of the plans targeted joins me, tonight on "Laura Coates Live".

President Trump has used a lot of words to describe his economy, or at least the one he's promised to deliver. Words like booming and roaring and prosperous. But tonight, the numbers, well, they tell a very different story. Talk is cheap, and a crater in jobs market is costing all of us plenty.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LAUREN SIMONETTI, FOX BUSINESS HOST: Twenty-two thousand jobs added in the month of August. That was much less than the expectation of 75,000.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): Unemployment rate hits four-three. That's the highest since 2021. And June jobs actually revised to negative. That would be the first month of job loss since December of 2020.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: Yeah, you heard that right. Only 22,000 jobs added in August. Let me put that into perspective, because you might think, all right, that's an ad and growth is growth. Well, it's the amount of growth that's the issue. Twenty-two thousand is actually really low. Consider this. The U.S. needs to add 100,000 per month to keep up with population growth. And those revised numbers for June, now in the red.

No net jobs added, only losses. The first time that's happened since the dark days of COVID. And the abysmal numbers, they don't end there. Look at manufacturing jobs specifically. The Secretary of Trump is saying he's going to supercharge and lead to a new golden age. Well, that's down 78,000 jobs this year. So, what exactly is going on? Top Economist for one of Wall Street's biggest investment firms is blaming it on two major factors.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TORSTEN SLOK, PARTNER AND CHIEF ECONOMIST, APOLLO: Combined together these two forces of trade uncertainty, tariffs, and at the same time also restrictions on immigration and deportations, that's why the economy is gradually slowing down and that's why job growth has been weaker in the last few months.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: So, two of President Trump's trademark policies. Well, how is the administration stomaching this new data? After all, Trump fired the woman in charge of running the numbers after last month's jobs report, which was also, frankly, in the gutter. Well, with no easy scapegoat, this time around, they're giving themselves a big old dose of, let's call it, "hopium".

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STUART VARNEY, FOX BUSINESS HOST: Would you admit to being just a little disappointed by this weakening job market?

LORI CHAVEZ DEREMER, SECRETARY OF LABOR: Well, 22,000 jobs underperformed just a bit, but it's still in the positive. Almost a half a million jobs have been created since the President took office. It's going to take some time.

KEVIN HASSETT, DIRECTOR OF THE NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL: We're very, very excited about where things are going. It's a little bit of a disappointing job number, but I pretty much expect it's going to revise up.

HOWARD LUTNICK, SECRETARY OF COMMERCE: You look at the unemployment rate numbers today, wait till a year from today, wow, it will be amazing numbers.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: Well, if amazing numbers are still a year away, then, a long time to wait, especially if you're looking for a job right now. Are you feeling the pinch of Trump's tariffs? As for the President, well, he is blaming the bad report on one of his favorite targets, the Fed chair, Jerome Powell. Trump says that Powell has kept interest rates high for too long. But he's not buying that year-long timeline from Howard Lutnick. No, he says it may be 2027 when we start seeing the booming economy that he's promising.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Our big year won't be really next year. I think it'll be the year after because when these plants start opening up, takes a period of time to build them. We're going to have tremendous job growth.

(END VIDEO CLIP) COATES: Let's talk with Professor of Economics and Public Policy at the University of Michigan, Justin Wolfers.

[23:05:00

Welcome back, Professor. I mean, look, based on today's report, rate the economy for us.

JUSTIN WOLFERS, PROFESSOR OF ECONOMICS AND PUBLIC POLICY, UNIVERSITY OF MICHIGAN: Boy, I'm going to give it a B. Now, that's, you know, well, there's a lot of great inflation and it's pretty easy to get an A. Look, the economy slowed, it slowed very sharply. We're not all the way down to an F, that would be a recession, but we're in striking range of one. We're at that very uncomfortable point where if one thing goes wrong, we are looking at a recession.

COATES: So, tell me about the diagnosis here because you heard obviously that tariffs, immigration policies might be to blame. Is that right or too simplistic here?

WOLFERS: Look, the timing fits almost perfectly. The jobs growth basically stopped in April. April was when the President moved on from DOGE and put tariffs firmly on the agenda. April 2 was the so-called Liberation Day where he said he was saving the U.S. economy and we've created very few jobs ever since.

It's not just that, it's also, yes, it's also the rise of the new approach to immigration. It's also an incredible increase in the amount of uncertainty that businesses are facing. Tariffs have changed from week to week, from day to day, to month to month. And finally, in August, the administration has decided on a tariff policy. Funnily enough, the Supreme Court is maybe about to rule that the whole thing's unconstitutional. So, we've finally got uncertainty and we're back full of uncertainty yet one more time.

COATES: And not just in all sectors but particularly in manufacturing. The President did promise a golden age of it but now, we know that for a fourth month in a row, that sector is losing jobs. What exactly is happening in that sector? Is there some way to slow if not reverse that trend?

WOLFERS: Yeah, so honestly, it will be very hard to slow. The U.S. is moving on. We're moving up the value chain. We are creating scientists and engineers more than we are factory workers. And I for one, am O.K. with that. There's a nostalgia for manufacturing among many people, often among white collar folks who've never worked in a plant.

Turns out when you interview folks who work in a plant, what do they want their kids to grow up and do? Turns out most of them want their kids to grow up into those cushy office jobs, those white collar folks have. They're little less nostalgic for manufacturing.

Look, what's going on here is actually, it's not left-wing policy versus right-wing policy and ideological debates. It's actually incompetent policy. For instance, who would possibly build a new manufacturing plant based on a set of tariffs that might be struck down on October 18? Or to give another example, page one of the tariff handbook, you can sit in on any introductory economics class and we'll tell you, do not put tariffs on inputs.

The President has put a tariff, for instance, on steel. Very, very few Americans work producing steel. Hundreds of thousands of them work using steel as an input. Those folks now have to pay a special tariff upcharge that their competitors around the world don't have to pay. That's a very quick and very easy way to make American workers less competitive.

COATES: Talk to me about the short-term versus the long-term on this. Is there short-term pain, long-term gain you're talking about the policies that you think are failing? Or is this the inevitable trajectory?

WOLFERS: Laura, I think you are marvelous for asking that question because too often what we do with TV economics is focus on the ups and downs of the business cycle, who won this week, who won last month, and so on. Let's take a step back. You're exactly right to focus on that.

And so, when economists do that, we ask deeper, harder, more important questions. Why is the United States rich? Why is Argentina poor even though 100 years ago it was nearly as rich as the United States was? Why is the country I was born in, Papua New Guinea, in grinding poverty? And we've studied this, we economists, for decades now. And the overall answer, there's a complex way of saying it, a simple way is, what matters is the quality of our democratic, political, and economic institutions.

And so, that's things like having an independent Federal Reserve Board. That's things like having the Bureau of Labor Statistics being independent and reporting genuine and true data to each of us. It's allowing people in markets to pursue their passions and pursue their great new ideas rather than have the President suddenly decide that he wants to tell Coca-Cola how much sweetener, which sweetener to put in its beverage.

That he wants to tell Intel that the government should own 10 percent of it. That he wants to tell Harvard who to hire and what to teach. And he wants to tell Cracker Barrel what its logo is. This is an encroachment of the government into economic life that we've seen many times before in many other countries.

[23:10:01]

This plays out very, very slowly, but has very, very large impacts. It's the reason some countries are rich and some are poor. It's not going to show up in tomorrow's economic numbers. It will show up by the time our kids get to the table and discover the pie is a bit smaller than they were hoping.

COATES: Equally fascinating and for voting. Justin Wolfers, thank you so much for joining.

WOLFERS: You're the best, Laura. COATES: With me now CNN political commentator and Republican

strategist, Brad Todd, also former senior advisor for political engagement to President Biden, John McCarthy. Welcome to you both. I mean, Brad, talk to me about this economy.

We know full well that how people feel about the economy can sometimes rule the day in politics, even aside from what the numbers tell you today or otherwise. Is the administration in -- under the risk of essentially alienating voters who are not seeing the boom, the prosperity that he is talking about?

BRAD TODD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, the administration certainly has its plan and they're executing it. And there are three things that economy needs to grow. First off, it needs low taxes and the President's work to take care of that. It needs fewer regulations. They've worked to take care of that. Next thing needs is low interest rates. Jerome Powell at the Fed has held the American economy hostage.

We have higher interest rates than Australia, than Britain, than the E.U. They've been cutting rates while Jay Powell has been holding him hostage in a fit of peak because he doesn't like Donald Trump's terror policy and he's trying to strangle it out of him. It's a mistake. Now, he's going to have to cut it a half a point in September. Hope it's not too late.

COATES: Do you see that it's a hostage situation? I mean, obviously it's not just Powell who decides the interest rates. There is a group of people who are doing so. I know that he has targeted Powell in that respect. But Powell has been insistent that he's been very prudent about the reasons not to do so. How do you see it?

JOHN MCCARTHY, FORMER SENIOR ADVISER FOR POLITICAL ENGAGEMENT TO PRESIDENT BIDEN: I mean, we shouldn't be that surprised by this. I mean, after all this time, we know Donald Trump and we know how he behaves. When things are going well, he loves to take credit. And when things are going poorly, he loves to look around and find the nearest person and blame them.

So, you know, I don't know why this would be any different. He can fire all the people that he wants at the Department of Labor, or at the Bureau of Labor Statistics. But at the end of the day, this is his economy and he is going to be the one that's ultimately held accountable for it.

COATES: President Biden was, about the idea, I call it the "feelonomics" period of time when people had that disconnect between what he was saying and the administration was saying and what people felt about it. Democrats are obviously not in the power or the majority. How should they be handling this?

MCCARTHY: Well, the interesting thing for Democrats, I mean, you know, I'm semi-critical in this space. Democrats have a great heritage of grabbing defeat from the claws of victory. And you know, part of the reason that Democrats are in this mess right now is because we haven't been a credible economic messenger. Voters have told us time and time again that the issues that we're prioritizing are not ones that they care about.

But for Democrats the good news is actually what's happening in our governor's races. In about 60 days, people are going to be able to go to the polls in Virginia and New Jersey and our candidates they are doing something that Democrats haven't been doing historically. They're refocusing their message entirely on cost of living, entirely on the economy. So, I actually think that the Democratic brand will come around on this and Donald Trump has certainly given us an opening here.

COATES: How about timing though? I mean on this point, when you finish your point, but on timing. It sounds like everyone wants voters to be patient. Either it's coming soon or it's an election or it's next year. Are voters that patient?

TODD: Well, there's a big change in philosophy. Under Joe Biden, the government was pumping money into the economy fast and hiring people and growing as fast as it possibly could. Donald Trump's removed about 88,000 people from the federal government workforce. We're now getting closer back to that pre-pandemic number, which is where we need to be. Government needs to be smaller.

But low taxes, low regulations, less government employees, that's a sea change from Joe Biden and it's not going to happen overnight. But we already start seeing gas prices down. We still see unemployment in the low fours. That's where it needs to be. So, inflation seems to be under control. What we need is to kick start this economy with cheaper credit and let's catch up with the rest of the world, lower interest rates.

COATES: I want to turn to the idea of who you said about the governor's races and state politics in particular, because obviously, a lot of eyes are on the mayoral races in particular, because all politics truly is local, right? And there has been reporting that -- does Trump want to maybe see the New York mayoral race end in a way that does not have Mayor Mamdani?

Well, of course, there are reports he's putting his thumb on the scale and trying to maybe help Adams out of that race, and maybe give him an ambassadorship of some way. They're both denying it. Listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Cuomo might have a chance of winning if it was a one-on-one. If it's not one-on-one, it's going to be a hard race. And we'll get used to a communist, and he's going to have to go through the White House and get approvals for everything. And we're going to make sure that New York is not hurt.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: So, Adams is insisting that he is still running, that this is not what he's doing, that he is going to see it. I think he called Cuomo a snake and otherwise that he's going through this.

[23:15:00]

So, what's the end game here? I mean, there's a lot of gamesmanship happening. Is there a chance that Adams would leave the race and that Cuomo and Mamdani would be the ultimate competitors?

MCCARTHY: Well, first off, there's a lot happening here.

COATES: Yeah.

MCACARTHY: I mean, you have to kind of even laugh at the notion. I mean, New York is a Democratic city. And, you know, it would be political suicide for Andrew Cuomo to basically run on the premise that he had a deal set up for him by Donald Trump. I mean, that would kill him with voters. So, the very notion of this is just kind of almost comical. It certainly feeds into the same behaviors that we've seen from Donald Trump of wanting to put his finger on the scale and control the universe.

But you know, there are actually a lot of similarities in the messages between Donald Trump and Mamdani. They're both talking about lowering costs. They're both talking about all of these things and cost of living issues. But the difference is, you know, Mamdani is putting these plans out and he has this, you know, platform to do so now as a candidate.

Donald Trump's the sitting president. And Donald Trump, you know, was elected because he had this mandate. And instead, we've heard him talk about building a ballroom, changing the Rose Garden, taking over Greenland, renaming bodies of water. And none of those things have lowered costs for American families. So, to sit and say that the President has some kind of credible message on this is kind comical.

COATES: What's your reaction?

TODD: Well, we've seen Mamdani. I'm going to yield to John a lot of the internal Democrat politics in the city of New York.

MCCARTHY: And there are lot of them.

TODD: But -- all right. But, you know, we've seen Mamdani talk about seizing the means of production. We've seen him talk about condoning anti-Semitism. We've seen him say that, you know, he's going to run the grocery stores in New York. I mean, he is truly the most radical politician we've seen on the stage this large in American history.

Donald Trump is a New Yorker at heart, and I think he wants what's best for the city. That's why he's afraid Mamdani is going to win. Even though it might actually be good for him politically to post up against him every day, I think he thinks it'd be bad for New York.

COATES: We know, I've nationally -- the -- the mayoral candidate would deny the statements you've made about anti-Semitism and beyond. But here's what he did tell my colleague, Abby Philip tonight about these reports about those thumbs on the scale.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) ZOHRAN MAMDANI (D) NEW YORK CITY MAYORAL CANDIDATE: I think it's showcasing what's at stake, which is the fact that we have a vision to actually help New Yorkers afford their city. And Donald Trump has a vision to try and rip apart the very fabric of this city. He has passed legislation that will throw millions of New Yorkers off of their health care, ran a campaign on cheaper groceries, and has announced cutting snap for hungry New Yorkers across the five boroughs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: Will that resonate with voters?

MCCARTHY: New York is a special place, right? You know, it's a heavily Democratic city. We often want to read too much into one election and I would suggest that the path forward for Democrats is probably not what works in a New York City primary.

Again, we have these really telling elections coming up in places like Virginia, kind of you know, well-known swing state. And New Jersey, a state that has kind of been getting away from Democrats, and the Democrats are going to need to do real work to come across the finish line.

COATES: Yeah.

MCCARTHY: And places like that are going to be much more indicative about the direction the party needs to take more so than New York.

COATES: I wonder if that's part of reason there aren't people clamoring to make this the national standard for what Democrats would do later on, for good or for bad. Thank you both, nice seeing you.

Up next, he's already the world's richest man. But will Elon Musk become a trillionaire? Didn't even know there was a thing. Kara Swisher's here. And ahead, hundreds of undocumented workers detained by immigration agents. We'll talk with one of the owners of a plant that was raided.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[23:22:45]

COATES: He's already the world's richest man by a mile, and he could soon become a whole lot richer. Because tonight, Tesla's board is proposing a pay package for Elon Musk that includes a huge sum of Tesla shares, potentially worth, get this, $900 billion. Now, you combine that with his net worth of over, what, 300 billion? And that would make Musk the world's first ever trillionaire.

But there's a catch. Musk would have to hit a number of targets in order to get those actual shares, and calling them ambitious is putting it mildly. For starters, Tesla's valuation would need to grow to $8.5 trillion, that is currently eight times more than its current value. Tesla would also need to sell 20 million cars, deliver one million

autonomous robotaxis, and one million Optimus robots. Tesla's board says the proposed pay package is meant to incentivize Musk, obviously, so devote far more attention to hitting each of those targets.

Joining me now, CNN contributor and host of the "On" and "Pivot" podcast, Kara Swisher, also the author of "Burn Book, A Tech Love Story". Well, we love that you're here, Kara, so, let's get into it, please because this is a hell of a package.

KARA SWISHER, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Please.

COATES: I mean, really, they're talking about --

SWISHER: I guess.

COATES: -- all of these things that he could do. I mean, that's a huge incentive. Is it practical? Is it possible?

SWISHER: No. No. I mean, maybe, I guess, I suppose. I was thinking of quoting Shakespeare to you, if all, you know. If wishes were horses, all beggars would ride. You know, sure, why not? Like, you know, it's just, fine, it's a press release. It's a hope and a dream. I mean, they have to, as you said, but these are -- he had original pay patches of $29 billion in Delaware where a court shut, it went to 56. This one is 18 times that, and it's actually close to the valuation of the actual company itself. So, that's interesting.

The stock price is a vibe stock price. It just is. It's so not in tune with its actual sales situation right now, which is troubling, I would say. I think most people realize that.

[23:25:00]

And so, it's a vibe stock. It's a, you know, meme stock kind of thing at this point. Because it doesn't seem like Cybertruck was a disaster. There's no Optimus robots for sale. And if you see Marc Benioff, who runs Salesforce, up a video, and it couldn't even go get a Coke. He had one, apparently. You know, it's short. He says Optimus is going to be a $25 trillion business like in a few years. But in 2017 he could drive a Tesla from New York to Los Angeles without touching the wheel. But okay, sure.

COATES: Well, after all that though--

SWISHER: I mean, he --

COATES: -- I mean, that's why I wonder, is it warranted, Kara? Because the last couple months alone of coverage on Elon Musk has been about how investors and beyond have been angry about the --everything going to the pot.

SWISHER: Yeah.

COATES: So, is it warranted or is it sort of a, hey, here's what we're going to ask you to do for us. We're never going to hit the goals. And then what?

SWISHER: Well, if he hits the goals, fantastic.

COATES: If.

SWISHER: I just don't know with the products he has, he can do that. Like robots is where he's saying it's going to happen, but he makes these promises all the time. Running it to Mars next week, running it to Mars in 20 -- whatever. You know, it happens all the time. And that's not a bad thing. I mean, I like someone who has hopes and dreams and everything else. It's just that, you know, there's no strictures on how much time he has to spend there.

Another thing, you know, because he has other companies. By the way, Starlink is doing a lot better. They just had a successful launch after 10 -- I mean, a half a dozen failures. But, you know, there's other better things he could be focused on, and I suspect he's more interested in. Twitter is about to get lapped by threads, which is owned by Meta. He's got a lot of challenges, but sure, you know, I'm going to pay you a billion dollars if you can get ratings to 30 zillion people, okay?

COATES: Quadrillion people please and then we'll take your bet. Okay, there you go. It's a whole thing. High hopes, apple pie in the sky kind of hopes I would think about that. But they have to reach that massive $8.5 trillion valuation.

COATES: But can you put that into perspective for us, what that would actually look like to accomplish something like that?

SWISHER: I mean, they have to-- eight-fold. What in the world can they sell for that much? Like, can they get people to buy those cars? Nobody seems to want to those cars. And BYD, speaking of getting lapped, they're getting lapped by BYD across the globe. Any other country, this is a Chinese company, they're providing cars that are $8000 that are very nifty, you know.

And they're taking over market share, somewhere Tesla should have done -- should have done a lesser expensive car instead of wasting all that time on that ridiculous cyber truck, which sold very few things. And is it is terribly ugly at the same time. It feels like it fell down the ugly tree and hit every branch. But you know, I think it's, you know, he's got to make a product and Optimus robots -- I have -- I'm not optimistic about robots right now. I'd eventually, absolutely. But right now, they're not in a state that you're going to sell a million of them by then.

So, you know, it's sort of like, I don't know. It's like saying, Kara, you know, you'll be playing the NBA next season. That'll be great. I just, it's never going to happen. And if he does it, kudos. That's all I -- if he figures out something to sell, that would be great. But there's other, I don't know, do we have an eight billion -- a trillion dollar company right now? Is Nvidia eight trillion? I don't think so. I haven't looked lately.

But you know, they have major products. Apple, the big companies that are in the multi-trillion dollar range are Apple, Nvidia, who else? Which also, if this A.I. things rise up, that'll be a problem for that stock. But really serious companies, I don't think Meta is even in that big -- I'm not -- I don't -- I haven't looked lately and the market's on a tear especially around tech companies.

But the companies that are eight -- there aren't any eight trillion dollar companies, I believe. And the ones that are in the range of doing that are companies like Apple and I just don't see -- they have hundreds of many, many products including something you might have heard of -- the iPhone, which seems to be very popular.

COATES: I'm trying to picture you playing in the NBA while so time is honestly gleaning all of your knowledge. And I got to tell you, it's quite the split screen that I am here for. I'm making season tickets. I don't know.

SWISHER: I would throw hands, my friend. Throw hands.

COATES: You know what? I'm definitely going to watch that now. Let's talk about the hot mic moment, though. I'm sure you heard about this.

SWISHER: Yeah.

COATES: Vladimir Putin attending that military parade in China earlier this week.

SWISHER: Yeah.

COATES: He and Xi were caught on a hot mic discussing immortality. They discussed organ transplants and living to 150. And we are frankly seeing a lot of growing number of people in the tech world becoming obsessed with this concept of de-aging. What do you know about this?

SWISHER: I know a lot actually, Laura. I've been working on a lot of stuff about it. I can't say everything, but my next book is about this, about the sort of obsession with longevity and especially, it came from the tech industry because they're so narcissistic. But actually, there's some amazing things going on around longevity, around cancer research, around obesity, around sleep.

[23:30:00]

All kinds of stuff that is really promising, including A.I. that looks at your face and tells you whether you should get more -- a better, different cancer treatment. There's all kinds of cool stuff happening. And a lot of it is nonsense, too.

And I don't know about organ. I haven't examined organ transplants but you know, people are interested in this and the idea of a health span over a lifespan, you have a biological -- you have a chronological age and a biological age and they're different. And if you could extend your health span, that would be great.

COATES: Wow. Fascinating. I can't wait to read about that. Kara Swisher, always great to see you my friend.

SWISHER: Thanks.

COATES: Next, massive immigration raids across the country with agents rounding up hundreds of undocumented workers. I'll talk with the co- owner of one of the plants that immigration agents forced their way into this week.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[23:35:26]

COATES: President Trump is vowing to expand his immigration crackdown in the coming days. And we're getting a glimpse of what that might look like. In the last 24 hours, we've seen two of the biggest raids yet in Trump's second term. One in upstate New York, another one in rural Georgia.

The raid in Ellabel, Georgia targeted a production plant for Hyundai. Four hundred and seventy-five people detained, most Korean nationals according to Homeland Security officials. Some workers tried to flee by running through a sewage pond, but all were taken into custody, accused of living or working illegally in the country.

In a statement, Hyundai says most of the employees were contractors or subcontractors and not directly employed by Hyundai. But it vows to investigate the plan, adding, quote, "We prioritize the safety and well-being of everyone working at the site and comply with all laws and regulations wherever we operate."

And these types of massive immigration sweeps at workplaces have happened under past presidents, but they've escalated since Trump returned to the White House, targeting industries like agriculture and construction, healthcare and hospitality, industries powered by undocumented and documented workers.

The owners of Nutrition Bar Confectioners in Cato, New York say they did everything right. They say their workers were authorized to be in the United States. But an immigration raid still happened there yesterday and dozens of workers were detained.

And Lenny Schmidt, the vice president and co-owner of Nutrition Bar Confectioners, joins me now. Lenny, welcome. What a week this has been for your company. I understand that some of the agents actually forced their way inside the plant. Can you tell us more about what happened and how this was all carried out?

LENNY SCHMIDT, VICE PRESIDENT AND CO-OWNER, NUTRITION BAR: Yeah, absolutely. You know, when I arrived on the scene, the agents were swarming the plant. There were probably over a hundred of these agents on four wheelers, on foot. They had dogs, even a doom buggy it seemed like -- but they had surrounded the facility oh and forced their way through into the plant from everywhere, from all entrances, all exits that were there surrounding the facility.

They forced themselves through those doorways, got into the facility using, I think, crowbars, you know, kind of materials that you would open, you know, lock cars. Luckily nothing was broke, but anyways, they forced themselves through and barged into the facility to where they cornered all of our workers, targeted -- seemingly targeted just the Hispanic employees, separated everybody and then started doing their investigation to where later on they ended up escorting them into vans.

COATES: I mean, do you have any idea why your business was targeted in this way?

SCHMIDT: No, I don't. I mean, we have, you know, a good amount of Hispanics that work for us and I think that, you know, at some point we probably have gotten out that we had -- these workers here and you know, they, at some point probably formed a -- some sort of a, you know, a plan to come and conduct that raid.

COATES: You know, Lenny, I used to -- told CNN affiliate WSTM that it carried out a, quote, "court authorized enforcement action". We've reached out for more details. We have not heard anything back yet. Oftentimes, these workplace raids target people who are here illegally. But let me ask you about your employees. Did they have legal permits to work in the U.S. as far as you know?

SCHMIDT: Oh, absolutely. I mean, we, you know, take the laws very seriously. We are very successful. We've been in operation for a long time. And you know, to be able to do that, you got to go in accordance to the law. You've got to be able to run that company in accordance to the law. So, you know, we follow the rules. We vet each person um as best as we can in accordance with those laws and get the correct documentation to support this and then, you know, hire those people, and then move forward with production.

COATES: Well, how is this raid impacting your company's ability to operate?

[23:40:00]

SCHMIDT: It's definitely going to slow us down. We -- we're able to operate today and we will continue operating. And unfortunately, it's going to slow us down probably half speed or just less until we get, you know, some of hopefully these workers back. We are going to be starting a -- the hiring process again, conducting over the weekend to get more workers in. We expect to get some new workers next week, and in doing so, we'll be able to slowly creep up our productivity to the amounts that are needed for our customers.

COATES: Gosh.

SCMIDT: But we hope and pray for our workers to be safe and to return home to their families and hopefully, you know, of course, you know, back to -- back to work.

COATES: You know, I can't imagine that productivity dipping to the half point, as you say, and what impact that has. But I'm really glad you mentioned the human element of it, as well, because I understand that some of the detained employees, returned back to work as soon as they got out. How did that make you feel to see them return despite, I mean, being detained? And what a nerve-racking experience that must have been for so long.

SCHMIDT: It was -- it takes you back. It's heartbreaking. When we -- when some of those workers were let go from their detention centers, wherever they might have been, some of them came back to work. I remember seeing somebody punching the clock and I walked up to them and I couldn't believe my eyes. So, I gave -- I shook his hand and gave him a hug. And he just looked at me with a smile and said, thank you. And just quietly went back to work. I couldn't believe it.

You know, we had a nice meeting today with everybody saying that if you guys feel like you'd to take the day off, feel to do so and, you know, take as much time as you need and when you're ready, come back. And if you want to work, there's work for you. We'll get you to work. And they -- who, you know, came back so far, they want to get back to work. They like their job, you know. We treat them right. We pay them well.

And it's nice to come to work with these smiling faces and these people and have them there as a joy. And what makes us successful is having these wonderful workers. So, we hope that they're -- that everybody's okay and they return soon.

COATES: Lenny Schmidt, thank you so much.

SCHMIDT: Sure. Thank you.

COATES: Up next, the doctor is in, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, that is, with a scoop on new innovation that means you don't have to be in pain. He'll explain after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[23:46:13]

COATES: So, if you've ever had a migraine, you know how debilitating the pain can be. I mean, it can impact every aspect of your life. And migraine headaches affect tens of millions of people in this country alone. CNN chief medical doctor Sanjay Gupta, and author of the brand new book, "It Doesn't Have To Hurt", got to know a successful attorney and mother who said severe migraines robbed decades of her life. And it wasn't until she met a pain detective that she began to have hope. Here's a clip in Sanjay's new documentary that looks at innovative and unexpected ways to treat the pain.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNKNOWN: I remember being in the E.R., just holding my head as hard as I can, tears coming down my face. I kept saying it feels like I've had a cement block sitting on top of my head.

SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Blake (ph) suffered with chronic pain from migraines for more than 20 years.

GUPTA: How long would they last?

UNKNOWN: At the beginning, one to two days. GUPTA: And that time period, you were basically not able to function?

UNKNOWN: Yeah. I was trying to get in the darkest room, no light.

GUPTA (voice-over): Her first migraine hit in law school decades ago, and then she only got them occasionally. But after she had her children, Blake suffered from debilitating migraines every single day.

UNKNOWN: As a mother, when I would have these migraines, I felt so guilty. You know, I've got twins, two years old, running up and down hardwood floors, screaming, giggling, and it was killing me. Like I didn't want to hear it. And I thought, how bad as, you know, as a mother not to want to hear the laughter and, you know, pit pattering of feet.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: Dr. Sanjay Gupta joins me now. I mean, it's just so heart- wrenching to think about what she personally went through. But then, almost everyone can relate to having pain from headaches or migraines, but not being able to find the root cause of the pain, that may be the most debilitating of all.

GUPTA: Yeah, I think that that's what really is very toxic for people. I think in some ways it exacerbates the pain, as well. For Blake, you know, it was 20 years, and you know, she said, I would have been a different mother, I would have been a different wife, I would have been a different colleague were it not for the migraines.

You know, I interviewed a lot of headache doctors for this documentary. The doctor that ended up taking care of Blake sort of made this point, I think, when it came to migraines is that some people are born with a propensity for migraines. And that's kind of like putting a boulder near the edge of the cliff. But where you really focus your attention then is figuring out what is pushing the boulder over the cliff.

And that's what these pain detectives do. In her case, she had had a neck injury when she was in high school, Laura. And it was that old neck injury that seemed to be really driving the migraines, neck physical therapy, things like that, ended up focusing on the neck, ended up helping her head, which was kind of remarkable for her.

COATES: This idea of a pain detective is so fascinating to me and I think so perhaps comforting to many people who may not even have heard of that. And yet you have spent the last three plus years working on this amazing book, now a documentary about pain. What are the key takeaways that you want people to learn from these projects?

GUPTA: There's so many things that I learned and you know, I'm a trauma neurosurgeon. I take care of patients in pain all the time. My mom broke her back while I was writing the book. I saw how pain can hijack one's entire identity making someone near -- you know, she wanted to end her life at one point because of this.

But I think one of the big things is that we have sort of been sort of a sledgehammer society with pain. We've taken high-powered meds, high, you know big invasive operations really more so than any other country in the world to the point where we haven't even talked about all the other amazing options there are to treat people's pain without surgery, without these types of medications.

[23:50:11]

And that's something that I did a deep dive into. There are emergency rooms around the country, including here in New York, where they hardly use opioids. Come in for a broken hip. You come in for whatever it might be, and you don't necessarily get opioids at that time. So, we're starting to evolve in terms of the things that we can offer people.

And finally, this idea that chronic pain -- acute pain serves a purpose. We know it teaches you a lesson. Chronic pain, pain that persists, is almost an entirely different entity. And that is where I really feel like it doesn't have to hurt. There's so much that could be done about it.

COATES: This is why everyone loves you, Sanjay, because you're never dismissive about what really is ailing people, and you search for a reason to help people live comfortably. I'm so thankful to you. Thank you so much.

GUPTA: You got it. Thank you, Laura. Thank you for having me.

COATES: Don't miss "Dr. Sanjay Gupta Reports, It Doesn't Have To Hurt", this Sunday, 9 P.M., only on CNN. Next, and we all need this, some positivity on this Friday night. Don't go anywhere.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[23:56:30]

COATES: In a hectic world, it can be easy to miss the positive stories happening around us. So, next week, we're bringing you those stories. We highlight men and women who have found innovative ways to help other people, and we call them Champions for Change. Their work runs the gamut, from a Cuban coffee shop that's building community to a company that's fighting a global crisis. But they're all making a difference, like my champion, Melissa Walker, who uses jazz to help spark joy and unlock unlimited potential in kids and got me swinging to the beat. Here's a preview of what's to come.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(MUSIC PLAYING)

UNKNOWN: I would equate the Cuban culture to the coffee, which has elements of joy, the strength and perseverance and resilience, just like the coffee is very strong. And they're very passionate people about what they care about.

UNKNOWN: One of the things I noticed about being a doula in the Bronx was that people didn't have access to the kind of care that they wanted. Our clinic offers all of the services just short of being able to catch babies and have people stay for a period after they've given birth.

UNKNOWN: My Champion for Change is a mom slash engineer who set out to reinvent the school bus. It's a company called Zum.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): Kara Hartigan-Whelan leads the Westchester Land Trust.

KARA HARTIGAN-WHELAN, LEADER OF WESTCHESTER LAND TRUST: Westchester Land Trust is one of 1300 land trusts in the country. Together we protect more than 60 million acres of land.

UNKNOWN: Sixty million.

WHELAN: Yeah.

UNKNOWN: Wow.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): She's turning conservation into a fight for healthy food and stronger kids.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): Mark Moore's company, Mana Nutrition, makes what's called ready to use therapeutic food. It can bring severely malnourished kids back from the brink of death.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: How many kids have you saved, do you think?

MARK MOORE, FOUNDER OF MANA NUTRITION: At least 10 million.

UNKNOWN: The doctors told my family I wasn't going to make it. A priest came into my room and read me my last rites.

GUPTA: So David Fajgenbaum decided to look at his own blood samples, his own lymph nodes, as sort of a Hail Mary, trying to find a clue and hopefully find a treatment that everyone else had missed.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): A mental illness can be very isolating. Woodley House provides housing and support services to people with mental health disorders.

UNKNOWN: I'll hug you anytime.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): There's just too many people who really need the kind of loving environment that we can provide.

COATES: Melissa Walker founded Jazz House Kids back in 2002 to try to bridge the gap in music education.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): Part of our mission is to make sure that those doors are swinging wide open. We allow far too many young people to not have access to the very things that would unlock their greatness.

(END VIDEO CLIP) COATES: You can catch all of these inspiring stories in an hour-long special hosted by Dr. Sanjay Gupta next Saturday, that's September 13th, 10 P.M. Eastern. You won't want to miss it. Hey, thank you all for watching. "Anderson Cooper 360" is next.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight on 360, month after firing the bearer of bad employment numbers, the White House gets another disappointment badge.