Return to Transcripts main page

Lou Dobbs Tonight

Kerry Chooses Edwards as Running Mate; More Americans Killed in Iraq

Aired July 06, 2004 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


LOU DOBBS, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight, the waiting is over. Senator John Kerry has chosen his running mate.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN F. KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I am pleased to announce that, with your help, the next vice president of the United States if America will be Senator John Edwards from North Carolina.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DOBBS: Tonight, Senator Kerry and Senator Edwards are meeting. We'll have a live report from Pittsburgh where the two men are discussing election strategy.

The man Senator Kerry put in charge of the search for his running mate, Jim Johnson, joins us to talk about the selection process.

Radical Islamist terrorists may be planning an attack during the summer's political conventions. Former New York City police commissioner Bernard Kerik is our guest.

And continuing violence and death in Iraq. Is Iraq's new government up to the challenge? Tonight, Larry Diamond, former senior adviser to the Coalition Provisional Authority, is our guest.

ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT for Tuesday, July 6. Here now for an hour of news, debate and opinion is Lou Dobbs.

DOBBS: Good evening.

Tonight, Senator John Kerry and Senator John Edwards are holding their first meeting as candidates for the presidency and vice presidency. The senators will be discussing election strategy at the Kerry family estate outside Pittsburgh. Senator Kerry today chose Senator Edwards as his running mate over much more seasoned Democrats, including Congressman Richard Gephardt and Senator Bob Graham.

We begin our coverage tonight with Joe Johns in Pittsburgh -- Joe.

JOE JOHNS, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good evening, Lou.

Kerry has just arrived back in Pennsylvania after a short trip out to Indianapolis for a speech today. He will, of course, as you said, be meeting with John Edwards. Edwards took the short flight up from Washington, D.C., and arrived here with his family just a little while ago.

The two men did talk on the telephone this morning before Kerry's speech. However, Senator Edwards was not present here in Pittsburgh when Kerry spoke.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHNS (voice-over): Kerry started the day making calls to John Edwards as well as the finalists who were not chosen and others, Then, he stepped out on the stage in Market Square in Pittsburgh in a sea of waving flags to make his announcement.

KERRY: I have chosen a man who understands and defends the values of America, a man who has shown courage and conviction as a champion for middle-class Americans and for those struggling to reach the middle class.

I am pleased to announce that, with your help, the next vice president of the United States will be Senator John Edwards from North Carolina.

JOHNS: Edwards, who was in Washington at the time, had already accepted the offer and planned to meet with Kerry later in the day. The two men clashed in the primaries, and Republicans immediately started using Kerry's own words to portray Edwards, a first-term senator from North Carolina, as inexperienced.

Kerry apparently tried to address some of that criticism preemptively in his speech.

KERRY: John Edwards is ready for this job. He is ready for this job, and there is something else about John Edwards that is important in this campaign and our country at this critical time. As you know, I am determined that we reach out across party lines, that we speak the heart of America, that we speak of hope and of optimism, and John Edwards will join me in doing that.

JOHNS: Aides suggested Edwards' appeal to middle-class voters was a big selling point.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JOHNS: Edwards and Kerry are expected to wrap up the week in Edwards' home state of North Carolina. This campaign, now with a full ticket, is trying to get off to a quick start in the area of advertising. They already have an ad out, and they've made a buy on cable TV.

Lou, back to you.

DOBBS: Joe, thank you.

Joe Johns reporting from Pittsburgh. President Bush said he looks forward to a spirited contest with Senator Kerry and Senator Edwards. Vice President Dick Cheney offered Senator Edwards his congratulations.

At the same time, the Republicans launched a new offensive against the Kerry campaign. The Republican National Committee calls Senator Edwards "a disingenuous, unaccomplished liberal."

White House Correspondent Dana Bash reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DANA BASH, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): From the Oval Office, a polite reception.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I welcome Senator Edwards on the ticket.

BASH: By design, a president above the fray, after the vice president called his new opponent offering congratulations, but the Bush campaign had already been engaged for hours in a coordinated effort to discredit the new Democratic ticket.

The opposition research was ready to go, hitting reporters' e- mails minutes after the news came from the other side. Some Republican attacks are familiar, calling Edwards a liberal, out of the mainstream.

Before politics, the North Carolina Senator made millions as a trial lawyer. Bush aides say expect a lot more of this.

BUSH: No one has ever been healed by a frivolous lawsuit.

BASH: Another GOP criticism, just six years in the Senate is a weak resume for a post-9/11 world. On this point, the Bush camp thinks Senator Kerry said it best back when Edwards was his opponent, not his teammate.

KERRY: When I came back from Vietnam in 1969, ladies and gentlemen, I'm not sure if John Edwards was out of diapers then yet or not. I'm really not sure. I don't know.

BASH: Kerry later clarified the comment, saying he was simply pointing to the differences in level of preparedness and experience.

The Kerry camp thinks Edwards has appeal with independent voters. That's also why the Democratic candidate flirted with the idea of asking Republican Senator John McCain to run with him.

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: He has not wavered. He has not flinched from the hard choices.

BASH: The Bush camp was ready on that front, too, with an instant ad noting McCain backs Bush.

(END VIDEOTAPE) BASH: All that despite the fact the Republicans continue to remind reporters that history shows that running mates don't make a difference in the end.

But, with negative public opinion of Cheney at an all-time high and the Bush campaign facing a neck-and-neck race with very few undecided voters, they're clearly not taking anything for granted -- Lou.

DOBBS: Thank you.

Dana Bash from the White House.

Well, on Capitol Hill, Democrats strongly support Senator Kerry's selection of Senator Edwards as his running mate. Republican lawmakers are expected to launch a strong attack against Senator Edwards' career as a highly paid trial lawyer.

Congressional Correspondent Ed Henry with the report -- Ed.

ED HENRY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Lou, you're right. In addition to the fact that Edwards is a trial lawyer, Republicans are also hitting him very hard over the fact that, as Dana mentioned, he has very little experience in politics, but, in particular, Republicans are zeroing in on his lack of national security experience, in their estimation.

And, in fact, it was all crystallized in a quote from Republican Senator Trent Lott who said today of Edwards, "He's a charming guy who was a suing lawyer -- that's S-U-I-N-G lawyer -- who dropped by the Senate for four years and thought he was ready to be president. Now he wants to be vice president. What credentials does he have? Zero." Obviously harsh words from Trent Lott, the former Republican leader here in the Senate.

The current Democratic leader in the Senate Tom Daschle said he actually thinks Edwards has a lot of experience, and, as Daschle pointed out, Edwards has been on the Senate Intelligence Committee for four years, and that's more intelligence and national security experience than George W. Bush had in 2000.

Here's what Daschle said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TOM DASCHLE (D-SD), MINORITY LEADER: I think John Edwards has a lot more Washington experience than George Bush had four years ago. But, secondly, it isn't the length of experience in any case. It's the quality of the experience. It's the quality of the life experience.

When you look at what John Edwards has done for working families, for people who have been fighting hard all their lives to make ends meet, I can't think of a more qualified candidate than John Edwards.

(END VIDEO CLIP) HENRY: And, Lou, you heard there from Senator Daschle the spin from Democrats about that trial lawyer question at the end there. What they're trying to say is that John Edwards was standing up for working families, not necessarily fighting corporate interest. They want to cast it in a little bit better light than Republicans are.

What you're hearing from Senator Majority Leader Bill Frist -- he off camera early this morning initially said that -- he was directly asked, "Do you think that five-and-a-half years in the Senate is enough experience for someone to be a heartbeat away from the presidency?" and I was there when Senator Frist said, yes, it is enough experience.

But then later in the day when he went on camera, Senator Frist was a little harsher in his criticism of Senator Edwards.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BILL FRIST (R), MAJORITY LEADER: From an experience level, there's going to be a lot of the on-the-job training potentially if he were to ever serve as vice president, and those are the words of John Kerry, in terms of an experience level.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HENRY: And, Lou, what you heard there is that Republicans are planning to throw the Democrats' own words back at them. Obviously, it was a very hard fought, tough Democratic primary contest for the presidency earlier this year. Senator Frist referenced a comment that John Kerry made about the lack of experience of Edwards. You're going to see those kind of words undoubtedly popping up in campaign ads.

And a final note as well on the trial lawyer question, it's very interesting that this week the Senate is actually starting a debate tomorrow on class-action reform, trying to push lawsuits out of state courts and push them into federal courts.

And, Lou, Senator Frist said today that's a coincidence, and he is right that there has been talk for weeks that they were going to bring up this bill, long before John Kerry decided to make the Edwards announcement this week. But what I can tell you is it's a happy coincidence for Republicans because they're planning to beat up on John Edwards during the Senate floor debate about trial lawyers -- Lou.

DOBBS: And, Ed, it's also a coincidence that the president's father once accused Ronald Reagan of practicing voodoo economics just before Ronald Reagan chose him as his vice president.

HENRY: Absolutely. And the last time you had a successful ticket of two senators was 1960, and, as you well remember, John Kennedy and Lyndon Johnson were not exactly pals, but they realized that if they worked together, they could win the White House, and that's what you're seeing here, an alliance, not exactly a marriage made in heaven, but an alliance that they think will work -- Lou.

DOBBS: Now, Ed, I'm a lot older than you, and I did read about it, but I don't necessarily remember it.

Ed, thanks a lot.

Ed Henry from Capitol Hill.

The war in Iraq is certain to be a big issue in the election campaign. Today, there was word that insurgents have killed more Americans. They killed seven U.S. Marines in Al Anbar province west of Baghdad in the past two days. The military giving no further details.

Also today, insurgents killed 14 Iraqis in a bomb attack in a town northeast of Baghdad. The target there, a wake for victims of a previous attack two days ago.

Meanwhile, the family of a U.S. Marine captured in Iraq says that he has been set free by insurgents, but the Pentagon says it cannot confirm that report.

Our Senior Pentagon Correspondent Jamie McIntyre has the story -- Jamie.

JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SENIOR PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Lou, for now, the many questions surrounding the fate of Marine Corporal Wassef Hassoun remain largely unanswered. The Pentagon can't say for sure if he's alive or dead, if he is in Iraq or Lebanon, or if he was, indeed, set free as his family hopes and believes.

According to a statement faxed to Al Jazeera and posted on the Arabic news network's Web site, the 24-year-old humvee driver of Lebanese descent has, "been sent to a safe place after he had announced his forgiveness and his determination not to go back to the U.S. forces." That statement purportedly from a group calling itself the Islamic Response.

The U.S. military cannot confirm whether Hassoun is still under the control of his captors. Over the weekend, a statement on another Islamist Web site claimed he'd been executed, beheaded. Now his brother, who lives in Lebanon, says he is alive.

The U.S. has no confirmation of that or that Hassoun made any promise not to return to the American military. If he did, it could violate the U.S. military's code of conduct, which, under Article V, says prisoners under questioning will make no oral or written statement disloyal to their country, its allies or harmful to their causes. Military experts point out that that code of conduct is a moral guide, not a legal guide, and that statements made under duress or torture are rarely punished or reprimanded.

Still, there are indications that Hassoun left his post in Fallujah on July 20 under his own volition. It's not clear why he left. But, before the military starts calling him a deserter or makes any determination whether he did anything wrong, they'd first like to get him back alive and hear his side of the story -- Lou.

DOBBS: Jamie, thank you. Jamie McIntyre at the Pentagon.

Still ahead, Senator Kerry hopes Senator Edwards will further invigorate his election campaign. I'll talk with the man who led the search for Senator Kerry's running mate.

Law-enforcement agencies are preparing for a possible terrorist attack during this summer's political conventions. Former New York City police commissioner, Bernard Kerik, is my guest.

And new violence in Iraq. The latest challenge to Iraq's government. Larry Diamond, former senior adviser to the Coalition Provisional Authority, joins us.

Please stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DOBBS: The Democratic primary introduced Senator John Edwards to the nation. In the primary, he promised a positive campaign and he used it to win strong support. But Senator Edwards won only one primary contest in South Carolina, where he was born.

Bill Schneider has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST (voice-over): What did we learn about John Edwards from the Democratic primaries? We learned that he's a happy warrior, something not often said about John Kerry.

SEN. JOHN EDWARDS (D-NC), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: My campaign is about something bigger and stronger. It's about an uplifting, positive vision for America.

SCHNEIDER: Edwards' positive campaign resonated with Democratic primary voters. Let's look at Wisconsin, the showdown state in the primaries and a crucial Midwestern swing state in November. Edwards was the runaway favorite among Wisconsin voters who said they wanted a positive message. John Kerry is a New England patrician, hardly a populist, while Edwards is often compared with Bill Clinton as a candidate with a common touch.

EDWARDS: I want to be a champion for the people I have fought for all my life, regular people.

SCHNEIDER: The top choice of Wisconsin primary voters looking for a candidate who cares about people? John Edwards. Edwards' message is one of economic populism.

EDWARDS: ... closing the great divides that exist between America, those who live lives of privilege and never have to worry about a thing and then most of America.

SCHNEIDER: Sure enough Wisconsin Democrats who said their main concern was the economy and jobs went for Edwards. Then how come Kerry won the Wisconsin primary? Same reason he won almost every other primary. Voters felt Kerry had the right experience.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCHNEIDER: What does the choice of Edwards say about Kerry? It says he feels secure enough that he could put -- he can put someone on the ticket who's young, attractive, ambitious, and who's strong where he's weak. You know, Lou, Edwards is 51 years old, but he looks about 10 years younger. I hate him.

DOBBS: Bill Schneider, thank you very much.

The man who led the four-month search for Senator Kerry's running mate is Jim Johnson. I talked with the long-time Democratic activist earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DOBBS: Senator Kerry said at one point, effectively questioning whether Senator Edwards, as a one-term senator, was qualified to be running for president. I suspect this means he's changed his mind significantly?

JIM JOHNSON, LED SEARCH FOR KERRY'S VICE PRESIDENT: Well, the first meeting we had, I said, you know, the primaries are the primaries, and is there anything that came out of that process that I need to keep in mind as we think about prospective choices? And the first thing out of John Kerry's mouth to me was that was then, this is now, I want to consider all my previous rivals, I want to consider them straight up on their merits.

And when he'd had a chance to review John Edwards' record and his performance, not only the domestic side, where he has an instinctive understanding of what Americans are going through in the economy and understands the challenges of health care and other things on the domestic side.

He also saw what he'd done on the Senate Intelligence Committee in working on fighting bioterrorism and working on the 9/11 review that the Senate did and saw a breadth of understanding and commitment that he found very attractive.

DOBBS: The Bush-Cheney campaign, as you know, is running a television commercial, which they just released today, called "First Choice," in which they paint Senator Edwards as Senator Kerry's second choice. What's your reaction to that?

JOHNSON: Well, I think it's obviously a campaign gimmick, that it has something to do to kind of get in the game the day we announced. There's no secret about the fact that John Kerry and John McCain have enormous respect for each other. They're friends. They're colleagues. They go back and forth together. They, of course, have the common experience of Vietnam. John Kerry has enormous respect for John McCain. The concept of going forward with a unity ticket that was bipartisan was always something that we had on the table. On the other hand, long before we got into any specific conversations about how this might work, it was clear that it was not going to come to fruition, and so that's behind us.

John Edwards is very much John Kerry's first choice, and I think, as we go through this campaign period now, I don't think the American public is going to have any trouble understanding why because John Edwards is somebody who truly does inspire and inform on the issues that people care most about.

DOBBS: As you suggest, inspire, to articulate the message, but many people, as you know, Jim, right now in this country are not hearing a clear articulation of a message from the Democrats. What is the central message that Senator Kerry and the Democratic Party want both Senator Kerry and now Senator Edwards to articulate between now and the presidential election?

JOHNSON: The central message is that we can do better as a country, that we can be stronger, that we can give more opportunity to average families, that we can deal with the overwhelming burden of child-care costs and health-care costs and job loss and lack of new opportunity with better-paying jobs, and, at the same time, we can address the challenges of international security and terrorism, that we can do that with our allies, not without our allies, with an approach that is credible, sustained and strong.

And I think the Democratic Party is going to have a message of meeting the challenges of the future for our country, which is going to be very persuasive.

DOBBS: Well, Jim Johnson, you're no longer chairman of the Kerry Search Committee. You're out of a job. What do you do next?

JOHNSON: Well, I'm not too worried about that. I think there will be some things to do.

DOBBS: Thank you very much.

Jim Johnson.

JOHNSON: Thank you, Lou.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DOBBS: And our poll tonight. The question: Just how important is John Kerry's choice for vice president? It will influence your vote, or it will have no effect on your vote? Cast your vote at cnn.com/lou. These are very important votes, we assure you. We'll have the results later in the broadcast.

A New York City newspaper editor tonight is red faced by Senator Kerry's choice of Senator Edwards as his running mate on the Democratic ticket. "The New York Post" this morning bannered Congressman Dick Gephardt as Kerry's vice presidential running mate. Editor in chief Col Allan today released an apology to "New York Post" readers for the mistake. Allan He said the "Post" received information it believed to be correct. The "Post" received a congratulatory case of champagne for that mistaken headline from its crosstown rival the "Daily News."

We'll have much more on the new Democratic ticket coming up here with three of the country's top political journalists. Also ahead, the countdown to the national party conventions is underway. Now less than three weeks away from the Democratic convention, and unprecedented security measures are in place in Boston and New York. Former New York City police commissioner Bernard Kerik joins us.

And a deadly insurgent attack in Iraq has killed more than a dozen people. Iraqi citizens are vowing to fight back. We'll be joined by former adviser to the Coalition Provisional Authority Larry Diamond, coming right up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: LOU DOBBS TONIGHT continues. Here now for more news, debate and opinion, Lou Dobbs.

DOBBS: Just days after a deadline for tighter security at this country's ports, the Coast Guard has already released a statement containing incorrect information about port security. The Coast Guard tonight withdrew a statement that reported 42 foreign ships were denied entry into American ports between July 1 and 5. The Coast Guard tells CNN 19 foreign ships were actually turned away.

The Democratic national convention in Boston is three weeks away, the Republican national convention eight weeks away, and unprecedented security measures are planned around Boston's Fleet Center and New York's Madison Square Garden. My guest tonight says he doesn't believe the national political conventions will be a target for terrorists.

Former New York City police commissioner Bernard Kerik says, however, he does believe al Qaeda will strike again before the presidential election in November. Commissioner Kerik joins us here in New York.

Good to have you with us.

BERNARD KERIK, FORMER NEW YORK CITY POLICE COMMISSIONER: Thank you, Lou.

DOBBS: The idea that the conventions would not be a target. As you know, many people are fearful, speculating that they will be. What -- give us your reasons for believing as you do?

KERIK: Well, it's -- naturally, at this point, it's premature to say, but -- however, this is a time you have the most security probably in the entire country focused in any one place.

New York City, naturally, is a target. We know that from the '93 bombing, and we know it from September 11, 2001. We also know that there have been plans over the last several years for al Qaeda to strike here. We've taken out those plans.

However, during the convention, there will be Secret Service, the FBI, the State Department, the Defense Department, the -- everybody under the sun, plus the 40,000 members, the uniform members, of the New York City Police Department on their highest state of alert. It's going to be pretty secure.

So I think, if somebody's trying to get in here, that would not be the right time.

DOBBS: And, in Boston, much the same scenario.

KERIK: Much the same.

DOBBS: Both cities will be hit with a crush of delegates and those attending the convention. The idea that the security will be so tight that they cannot attack or would choose not to still leaves you...

KERIK: Well, you never -- can never say they cannot. You know, you can't prevent every event.

DOBBS: Right.

KERIK: You can't prevent every attack. You just can't. Look at Israel. They eliminate hundreds of attacks, but they get through. You can't prevent every one. The chances of them getting through in a circumstance like this are extremely difficult.

DOBBS: Let me ask you this. You believe that there will be an attack between now and the presidential election. First, why? And what would be the purpose?

KERIK: Well, for one thing, if you look at al Qaeda and what they did in Spain, they honestly believe that they had a major impact on the Spanish elections of the prime minister. They would believe that that could happen again here, where they may have an impact on the presidential election.

Could they have an opportunity here in the country? Perhaps, if they get in. You have to remember in the last two-and-a-half years we've arrested probably over 700 people related to terroristic activity, suspected terrorists.

Because of the creation of Homeland Security, intelligence, we're a lot better off today than we were. However, could it happen abroad? Absolutely. You have to remember we have over 120,000 troops in Iraq. We have troops fighting terrorism all over the world today. Are they targets? They're targets, just like they are in Baghdad on a daily basis.

DOBBS: How secure are we now today, in your opinion, in this country against an attack by al Qaeda or its affiliates?

KERIK: Oh, I think we're a lot more secure than we were on September 10 of '01. We've created the Department of Homeland Security. We've merged the 22 agencies. We have the Patriot Act, which is a primary tool. We have the mandate for the CIA and the FBI and others to communicate. Is it perfect? No. But it's 10 times, it probably 50 times better than it was on September 10 of '01.

DOBBS: Turning to Iraq. You did early on some of the training, you were responsible for some of the training of the police forces. Security continues to be the principal issue in Iraq. Give us your best assessment as to what we can expect over the next several months.

KERIK: I think we've seen some of the violence diminish in the last few weeks or in the last week or so since the handover. We had a bad day today and yesterday. But I think those days are going to probably continue. I think it's really up to the Iraqi leadership and Iraqi intelligence. But we have good strong commitment from the new Iraqi government. The Prime Minister Allawi, who is out there, as you know yesterday he gave intelligence to the U.S. coalition that went in and took out a camp in Fallujah, a safe house. These things are going on and it's very, very important to know that it's coming from the Iraqis.

DOBBS: Bernard Kerik, good to have you with us.

KERIK: Lou, thank you.

Now let's take a look at some of your thoughts. Many of you writing in about Senator Kerry's choice for a running mate.

Joel Tafel (ph) in Winter Park, Florida. "In my opinion, we should applaud the selection Kerry made in Edwards. He brings to the table a new and clear vision that this country of ours is in dire need of."

J. Neil Thompson, Groveland, New York. "My hope now is that our president will listen to reason and ask Dick Cheney to step aside for the good of the party and ask Senator McCain to replace the current VP. This will then give Bush's ratings an instant pushup."

Send us your thoughts at loudobbs@CNN.com. And a reminder to vote in our poll. The question, "how important is John Kerry's choice for vice president? Will it influence your vote or will it have no impact whatsoever." Cast your vote at CNN.com/lou. We'll have the results coming right up.

Also ahead here tonight, new insurgent attacks in Iraq more than a week after the interim government took power. We'll be talking with the former senior adviser of the Coalition Provisional Authority Larry Diamond about what's needed next.

And Democrats hope Senator John Kerry will bring new energy to the race for the White House. Critics however say he's too inexperienced. We'll be talking with our panel of top political journalists about the Kerry/Edwards ticket.

And a California company. Its products protect our national security and American jobs. "Made in America," our special report coming up next. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DOBBS: As we reported, insurgents in Iraq have killed seven more American marines and 14 Iraqis were killed in separate attacks. My next guest says there are still not enough troops in Iraq to meet the most urgent need of security. Larry Diamond, former senior adviser to the Coalition Provisional Authority, professor of political science and sociology at Stanford University joining us tonight from Stanford. Good to have you with us.

LARRY DIAMOND, FMR. SR. ADVISER, COALITION PROVISIONAL AUTHORITY: Good evening, Lou.

DOBBS: The issue of security, the damage, the death, it's unrelenting. Are you hopeful that the U.S. and the Iraqis now can bring security to a level that people's lives will not be at least in the degree of danger that they are now?

DIAMOND: It's going to take a long time, but I'm more hopeful now because Iraqis have their own government. They're in charge. And I think they feel more of a sense of responsibility for their own fate.

DOBBS: Bernard Kerik pointed out just moments ago that the intelligence that led to the U.S. attack on the safe house of Al- Zarqawi was provided by the interim government and its intelligence operations. He sees that as a hopeful sign. Do you?

DIAMOND: I think that's a hopeful sign. I think much of what the Prime Minister Allawi and his government are doing to assert authority and make Iraqis understand that it's their future on the line, that it's not resisting an American occupation any longer is a signal of transformation in the psychology of the situation.

DOBBS: And U.S. troops, Larry, more troops are needed, in your judgment. How many more?

DIAMOND: Lou, I think tens of thousands more troops have been needed for a long time. But I really think we're past that now. They're not going to come. Iraqis want to see Iraqis assuming responsibility for the security of the country. So I think the practical imperative now is to expedite the training of Iraqi police, army, civil defense corps, border patrol to take more responsibility for their own security.

DOBBS: The Iraqis are about to form their national democratic election. You seek proportional representation, if you will. Give us your best judgment as to how that would work, the impact on the three principal groups, that is the Kurds, the Shia and the Sunni.

DIAMOND: Lou, it's a bit complicated. But to try and make it as simple as possible, you want each group to be fairly represented. If you have a type of system like we have in the United States, it could be very unstable because there won't be two parties in Iraq. There could be 300 or 500. And so you could have somebody in a single member district winning with three or 5 percent of the vote. Where's the fairness in that? With proportional representation each group in the country, including each ethnic group and religious group will get a share of the seats proportional to its support in the electorate so there will be more of a stake in the system, more security.

The one amendment I would make to what the U.N. has proposed is to have that proportional representation be in multimember districts of moderate size, say five to ten members per district so that people can have some connection to their representatives and independence can get elected.

DOBBS: Larry Diamond, thanks for being here.

DIAMOND: It's a pleasure.

DOBBS: In Oregon tonight, the Portland archdiocese says it will file for bankruptcy because it can't afford the legal cost of sex abuse lawsuits. It is the first Roman Catholic diocese in this country to make such a move. That filing will freeze a priest abuse trial involving the late Reverend Maurice Grammond. He was accused of sexually abusing more than 50 boys in the 1980s. Grammond died in 2002.

Still ahead here, we'll talk with our panel of top political journalists about the Kerry/Edwards ticket.

Also, "Made in America." A company in central California committed to keeping jobs in this country out of patriotism and profitability. We'll have the story for you when we continue in just one moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DOBBS: And now, "Made in America." Companies choosing to keep jobs in this country instead of outsourcing. Tonight's company, Pelco -- manufactures security cameras that monitor some of the world's most famous landmarks. Pelco's CEO says patriotism keeps the company's 1,500 manufacturing jobs right here in the United States.

Casey Wian reports from Clovis, California.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CASEY WIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Who's watching the Statue of Liberty? What about this summer's Republican National Convention or the Olympic games in Athens, Greece? Security cameras for all three are made by Pelco -- a home-grown manufacturing company in central California that's committed to keeping jobs in the United States.

DAVID MCDONALD, PRESIDENT & CEO, PELCO: First, we're, I think, unusually patriotic in our mindset. And we believe in the power of the American worker. We have very productive motivated people who are very efficient at producing our products.

WIAN: Pelco has customers all over the world: Buckingham Palace, the Panama Canal, New York's Central Park. But the company refuses to send its 1,500 U.S. manufacturing jobs overseas in search of cheaper labor.

MCDONALD: Many of those things look good on paper. When you consider the logistics costs, that -- the impact, potentially to quality, the scheduling difficulties and other challenges, the little savings that you could generate on paper often go up in smoke in the real world.

WIAN: In fact, by investing in state-of-the-art equipment and unique employee motivation programs, McDonald says it's actually cheaper to manufacture in the United States.

When the American flag's on its workers uniforms and throughout its factories to the September 11 memorials that dedicate Pelco's headquarters, here patriotism seems as least as important as profit. 9/11 hit home at Pelco, because many of the company's clients -- including the Empire State Building, Ellis Island, and the New York Police and Fire Departments -- were at or near Ground Zero.

MCDONALD: We've always had a very, I'd say, special relationship with New York City and many people there that we know. And that tragedy, I think, affected us, therefore, much differently than it might have other people.

WIAN: The realities of a global economy make it necessary for Pelco to buy some foreign-made components, and it does have an international sales and customer service staff. But the company says the security systems it sells here and abroad will always be made in the USA.

(on camera): While other companies expand overseas, Pelco will soon open its largest manufacturing plant here -- 144,000 square feet, room for 500 new employees.

Casey Wian, CNN, Clovis, California.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DOBBS: Updating a story we first brought you a month ago about the impact of cheap imports on the American shrimp industry. The Bush administration today proposed tariffs on shrimp imported from China and Vietnam.

The administration said foreign countries have been dumping shrimp at deeply discounted prices. American shrimpers already knew that. They say the value of their harvest has fallen by more than 50% because of those cheap imports and, without tariffs, the shrimpers say they will simply be out of business within a year.

The Commerce Department says the proposed tariffs range from eight to 113% and would hit about $2.3 billion worth of shrimp imports. 90% of the shrimp consumed in this country now comes from overseas.

Tonight, a look at what happens when unexpected guests drop in. Some wild pictures: this of a car that crashed through a roof in Marlborough, Massachusetts. Police say the 70-year-old driver apparently hit the gas instead of the brake when trying to park in an elevated lot next to the house, which explains the ease with which that car managed to stay horizontal in the roof. Fortunately and incredibly, no one was injured.

Still ahead here tonight: Senator John Kerry chooses a running mate with widespread Democratic support, but little national political experience.

We'll talk with our panel of leading political journalists -- that's next. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DOBBS: The Kerry-Edwards ticket could inspire a major policy change at the U.S. Chamber of Commerce. Senator Edwards is a former trial lawyer and, earlier this year, Chamber President Tom Donohue said if Edwards is chosen, quote, "I think, in that circumstance, the Chamber would have to recognize that it's a new day," end quote.

The Chamber has never endorsed a presidential candidate. Senator Kerry's campaign, meanwhile, launched an offensive against Donahue last week. The campaign blasted Donohue for his support of offshore outsourcing and accused him of having close ties to the White House.

Joining me now for more on the campaign, three of the country's top political journalists: E.J. Dionne, Columnist for the "Washington Post"; Karen Tumulty, National Political Correspondent, "TIME" magazine; Roger Simon, Political Editor, "U.S. News & World Report" -- all from Washington, D.C., appropriately enough -- I suppose, appropriately enough.

What was your reaction to the selection? E.J., did you think this was the -- sort of the shoe-in candidate?

E.J. DIONNE, COLUMNIST, "WASHINGTON POST": Yes. I think it was the only logical choice in the end. To judge the Edwards pick, you have to think of what we would be sitting here saying if he had picked Dick Gephardt.

Dick Gephardt's a very decent man, but if Kerry had picked him, people would have said he was afraid of Edwards because he's too charismatic and would outshine him. He did the safe thing. Gephardt's been around the track a while.

Secondly, the Edwards choice is the only choice, I think, that has any chance of putting, you know, a number of southern states in play. And simply making them competitive is very important to Kerry.

And third, Edwards really did excite a lot of energy in the Democratic grass-roots. A friend of mine said today he knew Kerry was going to pick Edwards when he said he was going to announce it on e- mail to all of his supporters, because the only name that was going to incite some supporters to send some money in was John Edwards. So, I think it was the logical choice.

DOBBS: Karen -- Edwards, will he be able to, as E.J. suggests, drive the ticket in the south?

KAREN TUMULTY, NATIONAL POL. CORRESPONDENT, "TIME" MAGAZINE: Well, I am not so sure how much of the south it really puts into play. Because don't forget, Edwards -- it wasn't a sure thing he would even win re-election in his own home state of North Carolina.

I do think it helps, and helps possibly a lot in Florida, but I'm not sure how many other southern states it brings into play. His real appeal is going to be in the Midwest, where his -- get ready to hear this phrase about two million more times between now and the election -- the son of a mill worker can really, I think, relate to a lot of working-class people and important swing voters in the Midwest.

DOBBS: Are you suggesting, Karen, that working people in this country will actually have some sort of voice in this campaign?

TUMULTY: Well, you know, it's interesting. I saw poll results last week that suggested that two-thirds of truly undecided swing voters are people who do not have a college education.

DOBBS: Outstanding. The fact is that, Roger, that with two- thirds of those without a college education, the issue is how many have jobs, how important is that going to be in this and how much an appeal does Senator Edwards have in that regard?

ROGER SIMON, "U.S. NEWS AND WORLD REPORT": Well, I don't know if Senator Edwards has any great credentials for a man -- in the area of job creation. We have to, once again, two multimillionaires on the ticket who live in multimillion dollar houses a few blocks from each other in Georgetown. Yes, he grew up in humble surroundings and he was smart enough to get out of those humble surroundings to become a very wealthy personal injury attorney. I think John Kerry went with the safest choice he could possibly make.

DOBBS: Was that an endorsement, Roger?

I wasn't to clear on that.

SIMON: An endorsement of what, Lou?

DOBBS: Of Senator Edwards.

SIMON: No. It was an endorsement of getting out of humble beginnings. I think John Kerry took the safest route he could take, it was the most popular route the party leaders, with some members of Congress. Heck, even Ralph Nader wrote an open letter, saying pick John Kerry, we love him suing these corporations. So, I'm not sure it was any great profile in courage. I think he made the popular choice.

DIONNE: (OFF-MIKE) Edwards is a millionaire. What he is, is an upwardly mobile populist. And that's a really good combination for Americans. He can give the dad and the mill speech because it's true, and he did come from humble beginnings. But Americans also like strivers, so that Edwards has the potential, if he plays this right, and he did pretty well in the primaries, even though he didn't win the nomination, of sort of bridging this gap and he can win a lot of blue collar voters. But he also, especially in the Wisconsin primary, got a lot of upper income voters. That's a pretty good trick for the Democrats. And just to go back to your early question, I think, blue collar voters really are an important swing group in this election, as Karen underlined. They are white working class voters are very much in play.

SIMON: John Edwards won one state, a state he will not win in November which was his native state of South Carolina. I'm not sure he did so well in the primaries.

DOBBS: Well, one of the things I'm excited about, Karen, nonetheless, irrespective of what E.J. and Roger say, I'm excited...

SIMON: ...reasonable one.

DOBBS: I'm excited that at least Senator Edwards will be the only one of the four names on the ticket come November who did not go to Yale.

Is there any significance to that?

TUMULTY: In fact -- in fact, it's very funny, because he -- in North Carolina, of course, the big rivalry is the university of North Carolina vs. Duke. And he even finds people from Duke too elitist for his blood. So he is very much a product of public school system and as E.J. said, a striver.

DIONNE: The N.C. State and University of Carolina isn't bad, it's a pretty good bridge in North Carolina.

DOBBS: And with Coach Krzyzewski remaining all seems to be well tonight in the -- in North Carolina.

We thank you very much, E.J. Dionne, Karen Tumulty, Roger Simon.

DIONNE: Thank you.

TUMULTY: Thank you.

SIMON: Thank you, Lou.

"Tonight's Thought" is on politics. "A politician thinks of the next election. A statesman, of the next generation." Let's hope we have four people thinking about the next generation in November. Those are the words of American Clergyman, James Freeman Clarke.

Turning now to Wall Street, it was a down day. The Dow down more than 60 points. The Nasdaq down about 43. The S&P down more than 9.

Christine Romans is here to give us the upward perspective.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the upward perspective would be oil price. Oil prices were up 4 percent. $40 a barrel an oil, Lou, is again within reach. And the economic picture though mixed. Services sector is slowing. Another report showed firings are falling, but so are hirings. Now speaking of jobs, a lexicon is growing up around outsourcing American jobs to cheap overseas labor markets. Boston Consulting Group has reported on profits and pitfalls of shipping to LCC's.

DOBBS: LCC's.

ROMANS: That's low cost country.

DOBBS: Oh, for crying out loud.

ROMANS: LCC options, LCC operations, it's all euphemisms for shipping American jobs. Remember this is the same...

DOBBS: Euphemism productivity, competitiveness, efficiency when they really mean cheap overseas labor.

ROMANS: And this is the same company that turned offshore into a verb, don't forget.

DOBBS: You've got to give them some credit for that at least. Any other acronyms that we could...

ROMANS: Well, we resurrected involuntary redundancies.

DOBBS: involuntary -- not really.

ROMANS: No. Back to those bad old days of euphemisms for bad news for the American worker.

DOBBS: Appreciate it, Christine, thank you. Looks like that's going to be one of the central issues in this campaign. Christine Romans.

Now let's look at some of "Your Thoughts" on "Broken Borders."

Nathan Muller, in Sterling, Virginia, "Open border advocates defend illegal aliens, it's mere undocumented workers' who shouldn't eve be questioned by law enforcement. What's next shoplifters asserting their right to undocumented purchases? Drug dealers craving status as undocumented pharmacist? Bank robbers making undocumented withdraws?"

"Dianne Petro, of Phoenix, Arizona, "Years ago, our family used to go camping along the Mexican border at Organ Pipe National Monument. Now the ground is full of illegals, the sky full of helicopters. We're losing our country bit by bit. Our government must find the resolve to take it back."

We love hearing from you. Send us "Your Thoughts" at loudobbs@cnn.com and please include your name and address.

Three major wild fires are burning tonight in Arizona. Firefighters are focusing on Mount Brand today. Two of the wild fires have burned more than 16,000 acres. Flames continue to threaten dozens of cabins and a mountaintop observatory. The Mount Brand International Observatory houses a $120 million large binocular telescope. It is still under construction. The observatory's director says when the telescope is operational it will be the most powerful optical telescope on Earth.

Still ahead the results of "Tonight's Poll" and a reminder to check our Web site for the complete list of companies we've confirmed to be exporting America, cnn.com/lou. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DOBBS: The results of "Tonight's Poll," 65 percent of you say John Kerry's choice for vice president will influence your vote, 35 percent of you say it will not.

Please join us here tomorrow evening. Our "Face-Off," does the national guard need to be restructured, we'll have a debate. And more on the new Democratic ticket. We'll be joined by three of countries top political journalist.

Please be with us. For all of here, good night from New York. "ANDERSON COOPER 360" is next.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com


Aired July 6, 2004 - 18:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LOU DOBBS, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight, the waiting is over. Senator John Kerry has chosen his running mate.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN F. KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I am pleased to announce that, with your help, the next vice president of the United States if America will be Senator John Edwards from North Carolina.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DOBBS: Tonight, Senator Kerry and Senator Edwards are meeting. We'll have a live report from Pittsburgh where the two men are discussing election strategy.

The man Senator Kerry put in charge of the search for his running mate, Jim Johnson, joins us to talk about the selection process.

Radical Islamist terrorists may be planning an attack during the summer's political conventions. Former New York City police commissioner Bernard Kerik is our guest.

And continuing violence and death in Iraq. Is Iraq's new government up to the challenge? Tonight, Larry Diamond, former senior adviser to the Coalition Provisional Authority, is our guest.

ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT for Tuesday, July 6. Here now for an hour of news, debate and opinion is Lou Dobbs.

DOBBS: Good evening.

Tonight, Senator John Kerry and Senator John Edwards are holding their first meeting as candidates for the presidency and vice presidency. The senators will be discussing election strategy at the Kerry family estate outside Pittsburgh. Senator Kerry today chose Senator Edwards as his running mate over much more seasoned Democrats, including Congressman Richard Gephardt and Senator Bob Graham.

We begin our coverage tonight with Joe Johns in Pittsburgh -- Joe.

JOE JOHNS, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good evening, Lou.

Kerry has just arrived back in Pennsylvania after a short trip out to Indianapolis for a speech today. He will, of course, as you said, be meeting with John Edwards. Edwards took the short flight up from Washington, D.C., and arrived here with his family just a little while ago.

The two men did talk on the telephone this morning before Kerry's speech. However, Senator Edwards was not present here in Pittsburgh when Kerry spoke.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHNS (voice-over): Kerry started the day making calls to John Edwards as well as the finalists who were not chosen and others, Then, he stepped out on the stage in Market Square in Pittsburgh in a sea of waving flags to make his announcement.

KERRY: I have chosen a man who understands and defends the values of America, a man who has shown courage and conviction as a champion for middle-class Americans and for those struggling to reach the middle class.

I am pleased to announce that, with your help, the next vice president of the United States will be Senator John Edwards from North Carolina.

JOHNS: Edwards, who was in Washington at the time, had already accepted the offer and planned to meet with Kerry later in the day. The two men clashed in the primaries, and Republicans immediately started using Kerry's own words to portray Edwards, a first-term senator from North Carolina, as inexperienced.

Kerry apparently tried to address some of that criticism preemptively in his speech.

KERRY: John Edwards is ready for this job. He is ready for this job, and there is something else about John Edwards that is important in this campaign and our country at this critical time. As you know, I am determined that we reach out across party lines, that we speak the heart of America, that we speak of hope and of optimism, and John Edwards will join me in doing that.

JOHNS: Aides suggested Edwards' appeal to middle-class voters was a big selling point.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JOHNS: Edwards and Kerry are expected to wrap up the week in Edwards' home state of North Carolina. This campaign, now with a full ticket, is trying to get off to a quick start in the area of advertising. They already have an ad out, and they've made a buy on cable TV.

Lou, back to you.

DOBBS: Joe, thank you.

Joe Johns reporting from Pittsburgh. President Bush said he looks forward to a spirited contest with Senator Kerry and Senator Edwards. Vice President Dick Cheney offered Senator Edwards his congratulations.

At the same time, the Republicans launched a new offensive against the Kerry campaign. The Republican National Committee calls Senator Edwards "a disingenuous, unaccomplished liberal."

White House Correspondent Dana Bash reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DANA BASH, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): From the Oval Office, a polite reception.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I welcome Senator Edwards on the ticket.

BASH: By design, a president above the fray, after the vice president called his new opponent offering congratulations, but the Bush campaign had already been engaged for hours in a coordinated effort to discredit the new Democratic ticket.

The opposition research was ready to go, hitting reporters' e- mails minutes after the news came from the other side. Some Republican attacks are familiar, calling Edwards a liberal, out of the mainstream.

Before politics, the North Carolina Senator made millions as a trial lawyer. Bush aides say expect a lot more of this.

BUSH: No one has ever been healed by a frivolous lawsuit.

BASH: Another GOP criticism, just six years in the Senate is a weak resume for a post-9/11 world. On this point, the Bush camp thinks Senator Kerry said it best back when Edwards was his opponent, not his teammate.

KERRY: When I came back from Vietnam in 1969, ladies and gentlemen, I'm not sure if John Edwards was out of diapers then yet or not. I'm really not sure. I don't know.

BASH: Kerry later clarified the comment, saying he was simply pointing to the differences in level of preparedness and experience.

The Kerry camp thinks Edwards has appeal with independent voters. That's also why the Democratic candidate flirted with the idea of asking Republican Senator John McCain to run with him.

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: He has not wavered. He has not flinched from the hard choices.

BASH: The Bush camp was ready on that front, too, with an instant ad noting McCain backs Bush.

(END VIDEOTAPE) BASH: All that despite the fact the Republicans continue to remind reporters that history shows that running mates don't make a difference in the end.

But, with negative public opinion of Cheney at an all-time high and the Bush campaign facing a neck-and-neck race with very few undecided voters, they're clearly not taking anything for granted -- Lou.

DOBBS: Thank you.

Dana Bash from the White House.

Well, on Capitol Hill, Democrats strongly support Senator Kerry's selection of Senator Edwards as his running mate. Republican lawmakers are expected to launch a strong attack against Senator Edwards' career as a highly paid trial lawyer.

Congressional Correspondent Ed Henry with the report -- Ed.

ED HENRY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Lou, you're right. In addition to the fact that Edwards is a trial lawyer, Republicans are also hitting him very hard over the fact that, as Dana mentioned, he has very little experience in politics, but, in particular, Republicans are zeroing in on his lack of national security experience, in their estimation.

And, in fact, it was all crystallized in a quote from Republican Senator Trent Lott who said today of Edwards, "He's a charming guy who was a suing lawyer -- that's S-U-I-N-G lawyer -- who dropped by the Senate for four years and thought he was ready to be president. Now he wants to be vice president. What credentials does he have? Zero." Obviously harsh words from Trent Lott, the former Republican leader here in the Senate.

The current Democratic leader in the Senate Tom Daschle said he actually thinks Edwards has a lot of experience, and, as Daschle pointed out, Edwards has been on the Senate Intelligence Committee for four years, and that's more intelligence and national security experience than George W. Bush had in 2000.

Here's what Daschle said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TOM DASCHLE (D-SD), MINORITY LEADER: I think John Edwards has a lot more Washington experience than George Bush had four years ago. But, secondly, it isn't the length of experience in any case. It's the quality of the experience. It's the quality of the life experience.

When you look at what John Edwards has done for working families, for people who have been fighting hard all their lives to make ends meet, I can't think of a more qualified candidate than John Edwards.

(END VIDEO CLIP) HENRY: And, Lou, you heard there from Senator Daschle the spin from Democrats about that trial lawyer question at the end there. What they're trying to say is that John Edwards was standing up for working families, not necessarily fighting corporate interest. They want to cast it in a little bit better light than Republicans are.

What you're hearing from Senator Majority Leader Bill Frist -- he off camera early this morning initially said that -- he was directly asked, "Do you think that five-and-a-half years in the Senate is enough experience for someone to be a heartbeat away from the presidency?" and I was there when Senator Frist said, yes, it is enough experience.

But then later in the day when he went on camera, Senator Frist was a little harsher in his criticism of Senator Edwards.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BILL FRIST (R), MAJORITY LEADER: From an experience level, there's going to be a lot of the on-the-job training potentially if he were to ever serve as vice president, and those are the words of John Kerry, in terms of an experience level.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HENRY: And, Lou, what you heard there is that Republicans are planning to throw the Democrats' own words back at them. Obviously, it was a very hard fought, tough Democratic primary contest for the presidency earlier this year. Senator Frist referenced a comment that John Kerry made about the lack of experience of Edwards. You're going to see those kind of words undoubtedly popping up in campaign ads.

And a final note as well on the trial lawyer question, it's very interesting that this week the Senate is actually starting a debate tomorrow on class-action reform, trying to push lawsuits out of state courts and push them into federal courts.

And, Lou, Senator Frist said today that's a coincidence, and he is right that there has been talk for weeks that they were going to bring up this bill, long before John Kerry decided to make the Edwards announcement this week. But what I can tell you is it's a happy coincidence for Republicans because they're planning to beat up on John Edwards during the Senate floor debate about trial lawyers -- Lou.

DOBBS: And, Ed, it's also a coincidence that the president's father once accused Ronald Reagan of practicing voodoo economics just before Ronald Reagan chose him as his vice president.

HENRY: Absolutely. And the last time you had a successful ticket of two senators was 1960, and, as you well remember, John Kennedy and Lyndon Johnson were not exactly pals, but they realized that if they worked together, they could win the White House, and that's what you're seeing here, an alliance, not exactly a marriage made in heaven, but an alliance that they think will work -- Lou.

DOBBS: Now, Ed, I'm a lot older than you, and I did read about it, but I don't necessarily remember it.

Ed, thanks a lot.

Ed Henry from Capitol Hill.

The war in Iraq is certain to be a big issue in the election campaign. Today, there was word that insurgents have killed more Americans. They killed seven U.S. Marines in Al Anbar province west of Baghdad in the past two days. The military giving no further details.

Also today, insurgents killed 14 Iraqis in a bomb attack in a town northeast of Baghdad. The target there, a wake for victims of a previous attack two days ago.

Meanwhile, the family of a U.S. Marine captured in Iraq says that he has been set free by insurgents, but the Pentagon says it cannot confirm that report.

Our Senior Pentagon Correspondent Jamie McIntyre has the story -- Jamie.

JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SENIOR PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Lou, for now, the many questions surrounding the fate of Marine Corporal Wassef Hassoun remain largely unanswered. The Pentagon can't say for sure if he's alive or dead, if he is in Iraq or Lebanon, or if he was, indeed, set free as his family hopes and believes.

According to a statement faxed to Al Jazeera and posted on the Arabic news network's Web site, the 24-year-old humvee driver of Lebanese descent has, "been sent to a safe place after he had announced his forgiveness and his determination not to go back to the U.S. forces." That statement purportedly from a group calling itself the Islamic Response.

The U.S. military cannot confirm whether Hassoun is still under the control of his captors. Over the weekend, a statement on another Islamist Web site claimed he'd been executed, beheaded. Now his brother, who lives in Lebanon, says he is alive.

The U.S. has no confirmation of that or that Hassoun made any promise not to return to the American military. If he did, it could violate the U.S. military's code of conduct, which, under Article V, says prisoners under questioning will make no oral or written statement disloyal to their country, its allies or harmful to their causes. Military experts point out that that code of conduct is a moral guide, not a legal guide, and that statements made under duress or torture are rarely punished or reprimanded.

Still, there are indications that Hassoun left his post in Fallujah on July 20 under his own volition. It's not clear why he left. But, before the military starts calling him a deserter or makes any determination whether he did anything wrong, they'd first like to get him back alive and hear his side of the story -- Lou.

DOBBS: Jamie, thank you. Jamie McIntyre at the Pentagon.

Still ahead, Senator Kerry hopes Senator Edwards will further invigorate his election campaign. I'll talk with the man who led the search for Senator Kerry's running mate.

Law-enforcement agencies are preparing for a possible terrorist attack during this summer's political conventions. Former New York City police commissioner, Bernard Kerik, is my guest.

And new violence in Iraq. The latest challenge to Iraq's government. Larry Diamond, former senior adviser to the Coalition Provisional Authority, joins us.

Please stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DOBBS: The Democratic primary introduced Senator John Edwards to the nation. In the primary, he promised a positive campaign and he used it to win strong support. But Senator Edwards won only one primary contest in South Carolina, where he was born.

Bill Schneider has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST (voice-over): What did we learn about John Edwards from the Democratic primaries? We learned that he's a happy warrior, something not often said about John Kerry.

SEN. JOHN EDWARDS (D-NC), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: My campaign is about something bigger and stronger. It's about an uplifting, positive vision for America.

SCHNEIDER: Edwards' positive campaign resonated with Democratic primary voters. Let's look at Wisconsin, the showdown state in the primaries and a crucial Midwestern swing state in November. Edwards was the runaway favorite among Wisconsin voters who said they wanted a positive message. John Kerry is a New England patrician, hardly a populist, while Edwards is often compared with Bill Clinton as a candidate with a common touch.

EDWARDS: I want to be a champion for the people I have fought for all my life, regular people.

SCHNEIDER: The top choice of Wisconsin primary voters looking for a candidate who cares about people? John Edwards. Edwards' message is one of economic populism.

EDWARDS: ... closing the great divides that exist between America, those who live lives of privilege and never have to worry about a thing and then most of America.

SCHNEIDER: Sure enough Wisconsin Democrats who said their main concern was the economy and jobs went for Edwards. Then how come Kerry won the Wisconsin primary? Same reason he won almost every other primary. Voters felt Kerry had the right experience.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCHNEIDER: What does the choice of Edwards say about Kerry? It says he feels secure enough that he could put -- he can put someone on the ticket who's young, attractive, ambitious, and who's strong where he's weak. You know, Lou, Edwards is 51 years old, but he looks about 10 years younger. I hate him.

DOBBS: Bill Schneider, thank you very much.

The man who led the four-month search for Senator Kerry's running mate is Jim Johnson. I talked with the long-time Democratic activist earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DOBBS: Senator Kerry said at one point, effectively questioning whether Senator Edwards, as a one-term senator, was qualified to be running for president. I suspect this means he's changed his mind significantly?

JIM JOHNSON, LED SEARCH FOR KERRY'S VICE PRESIDENT: Well, the first meeting we had, I said, you know, the primaries are the primaries, and is there anything that came out of that process that I need to keep in mind as we think about prospective choices? And the first thing out of John Kerry's mouth to me was that was then, this is now, I want to consider all my previous rivals, I want to consider them straight up on their merits.

And when he'd had a chance to review John Edwards' record and his performance, not only the domestic side, where he has an instinctive understanding of what Americans are going through in the economy and understands the challenges of health care and other things on the domestic side.

He also saw what he'd done on the Senate Intelligence Committee in working on fighting bioterrorism and working on the 9/11 review that the Senate did and saw a breadth of understanding and commitment that he found very attractive.

DOBBS: The Bush-Cheney campaign, as you know, is running a television commercial, which they just released today, called "First Choice," in which they paint Senator Edwards as Senator Kerry's second choice. What's your reaction to that?

JOHNSON: Well, I think it's obviously a campaign gimmick, that it has something to do to kind of get in the game the day we announced. There's no secret about the fact that John Kerry and John McCain have enormous respect for each other. They're friends. They're colleagues. They go back and forth together. They, of course, have the common experience of Vietnam. John Kerry has enormous respect for John McCain. The concept of going forward with a unity ticket that was bipartisan was always something that we had on the table. On the other hand, long before we got into any specific conversations about how this might work, it was clear that it was not going to come to fruition, and so that's behind us.

John Edwards is very much John Kerry's first choice, and I think, as we go through this campaign period now, I don't think the American public is going to have any trouble understanding why because John Edwards is somebody who truly does inspire and inform on the issues that people care most about.

DOBBS: As you suggest, inspire, to articulate the message, but many people, as you know, Jim, right now in this country are not hearing a clear articulation of a message from the Democrats. What is the central message that Senator Kerry and the Democratic Party want both Senator Kerry and now Senator Edwards to articulate between now and the presidential election?

JOHNSON: The central message is that we can do better as a country, that we can be stronger, that we can give more opportunity to average families, that we can deal with the overwhelming burden of child-care costs and health-care costs and job loss and lack of new opportunity with better-paying jobs, and, at the same time, we can address the challenges of international security and terrorism, that we can do that with our allies, not without our allies, with an approach that is credible, sustained and strong.

And I think the Democratic Party is going to have a message of meeting the challenges of the future for our country, which is going to be very persuasive.

DOBBS: Well, Jim Johnson, you're no longer chairman of the Kerry Search Committee. You're out of a job. What do you do next?

JOHNSON: Well, I'm not too worried about that. I think there will be some things to do.

DOBBS: Thank you very much.

Jim Johnson.

JOHNSON: Thank you, Lou.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DOBBS: And our poll tonight. The question: Just how important is John Kerry's choice for vice president? It will influence your vote, or it will have no effect on your vote? Cast your vote at cnn.com/lou. These are very important votes, we assure you. We'll have the results later in the broadcast.

A New York City newspaper editor tonight is red faced by Senator Kerry's choice of Senator Edwards as his running mate on the Democratic ticket. "The New York Post" this morning bannered Congressman Dick Gephardt as Kerry's vice presidential running mate. Editor in chief Col Allan today released an apology to "New York Post" readers for the mistake. Allan He said the "Post" received information it believed to be correct. The "Post" received a congratulatory case of champagne for that mistaken headline from its crosstown rival the "Daily News."

We'll have much more on the new Democratic ticket coming up here with three of the country's top political journalists. Also ahead, the countdown to the national party conventions is underway. Now less than three weeks away from the Democratic convention, and unprecedented security measures are in place in Boston and New York. Former New York City police commissioner Bernard Kerik joins us.

And a deadly insurgent attack in Iraq has killed more than a dozen people. Iraqi citizens are vowing to fight back. We'll be joined by former adviser to the Coalition Provisional Authority Larry Diamond, coming right up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: LOU DOBBS TONIGHT continues. Here now for more news, debate and opinion, Lou Dobbs.

DOBBS: Just days after a deadline for tighter security at this country's ports, the Coast Guard has already released a statement containing incorrect information about port security. The Coast Guard tonight withdrew a statement that reported 42 foreign ships were denied entry into American ports between July 1 and 5. The Coast Guard tells CNN 19 foreign ships were actually turned away.

The Democratic national convention in Boston is three weeks away, the Republican national convention eight weeks away, and unprecedented security measures are planned around Boston's Fleet Center and New York's Madison Square Garden. My guest tonight says he doesn't believe the national political conventions will be a target for terrorists.

Former New York City police commissioner Bernard Kerik says, however, he does believe al Qaeda will strike again before the presidential election in November. Commissioner Kerik joins us here in New York.

Good to have you with us.

BERNARD KERIK, FORMER NEW YORK CITY POLICE COMMISSIONER: Thank you, Lou.

DOBBS: The idea that the conventions would not be a target. As you know, many people are fearful, speculating that they will be. What -- give us your reasons for believing as you do?

KERIK: Well, it's -- naturally, at this point, it's premature to say, but -- however, this is a time you have the most security probably in the entire country focused in any one place.

New York City, naturally, is a target. We know that from the '93 bombing, and we know it from September 11, 2001. We also know that there have been plans over the last several years for al Qaeda to strike here. We've taken out those plans.

However, during the convention, there will be Secret Service, the FBI, the State Department, the Defense Department, the -- everybody under the sun, plus the 40,000 members, the uniform members, of the New York City Police Department on their highest state of alert. It's going to be pretty secure.

So I think, if somebody's trying to get in here, that would not be the right time.

DOBBS: And, in Boston, much the same scenario.

KERIK: Much the same.

DOBBS: Both cities will be hit with a crush of delegates and those attending the convention. The idea that the security will be so tight that they cannot attack or would choose not to still leaves you...

KERIK: Well, you never -- can never say they cannot. You know, you can't prevent every event.

DOBBS: Right.

KERIK: You can't prevent every attack. You just can't. Look at Israel. They eliminate hundreds of attacks, but they get through. You can't prevent every one. The chances of them getting through in a circumstance like this are extremely difficult.

DOBBS: Let me ask you this. You believe that there will be an attack between now and the presidential election. First, why? And what would be the purpose?

KERIK: Well, for one thing, if you look at al Qaeda and what they did in Spain, they honestly believe that they had a major impact on the Spanish elections of the prime minister. They would believe that that could happen again here, where they may have an impact on the presidential election.

Could they have an opportunity here in the country? Perhaps, if they get in. You have to remember in the last two-and-a-half years we've arrested probably over 700 people related to terroristic activity, suspected terrorists.

Because of the creation of Homeland Security, intelligence, we're a lot better off today than we were. However, could it happen abroad? Absolutely. You have to remember we have over 120,000 troops in Iraq. We have troops fighting terrorism all over the world today. Are they targets? They're targets, just like they are in Baghdad on a daily basis.

DOBBS: How secure are we now today, in your opinion, in this country against an attack by al Qaeda or its affiliates?

KERIK: Oh, I think we're a lot more secure than we were on September 10 of '01. We've created the Department of Homeland Security. We've merged the 22 agencies. We have the Patriot Act, which is a primary tool. We have the mandate for the CIA and the FBI and others to communicate. Is it perfect? No. But it's 10 times, it probably 50 times better than it was on September 10 of '01.

DOBBS: Turning to Iraq. You did early on some of the training, you were responsible for some of the training of the police forces. Security continues to be the principal issue in Iraq. Give us your best assessment as to what we can expect over the next several months.

KERIK: I think we've seen some of the violence diminish in the last few weeks or in the last week or so since the handover. We had a bad day today and yesterday. But I think those days are going to probably continue. I think it's really up to the Iraqi leadership and Iraqi intelligence. But we have good strong commitment from the new Iraqi government. The Prime Minister Allawi, who is out there, as you know yesterday he gave intelligence to the U.S. coalition that went in and took out a camp in Fallujah, a safe house. These things are going on and it's very, very important to know that it's coming from the Iraqis.

DOBBS: Bernard Kerik, good to have you with us.

KERIK: Lou, thank you.

Now let's take a look at some of your thoughts. Many of you writing in about Senator Kerry's choice for a running mate.

Joel Tafel (ph) in Winter Park, Florida. "In my opinion, we should applaud the selection Kerry made in Edwards. He brings to the table a new and clear vision that this country of ours is in dire need of."

J. Neil Thompson, Groveland, New York. "My hope now is that our president will listen to reason and ask Dick Cheney to step aside for the good of the party and ask Senator McCain to replace the current VP. This will then give Bush's ratings an instant pushup."

Send us your thoughts at loudobbs@CNN.com. And a reminder to vote in our poll. The question, "how important is John Kerry's choice for vice president? Will it influence your vote or will it have no impact whatsoever." Cast your vote at CNN.com/lou. We'll have the results coming right up.

Also ahead here tonight, new insurgent attacks in Iraq more than a week after the interim government took power. We'll be talking with the former senior adviser of the Coalition Provisional Authority Larry Diamond about what's needed next.

And Democrats hope Senator John Kerry will bring new energy to the race for the White House. Critics however say he's too inexperienced. We'll be talking with our panel of top political journalists about the Kerry/Edwards ticket.

And a California company. Its products protect our national security and American jobs. "Made in America," our special report coming up next. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DOBBS: As we reported, insurgents in Iraq have killed seven more American marines and 14 Iraqis were killed in separate attacks. My next guest says there are still not enough troops in Iraq to meet the most urgent need of security. Larry Diamond, former senior adviser to the Coalition Provisional Authority, professor of political science and sociology at Stanford University joining us tonight from Stanford. Good to have you with us.

LARRY DIAMOND, FMR. SR. ADVISER, COALITION PROVISIONAL AUTHORITY: Good evening, Lou.

DOBBS: The issue of security, the damage, the death, it's unrelenting. Are you hopeful that the U.S. and the Iraqis now can bring security to a level that people's lives will not be at least in the degree of danger that they are now?

DIAMOND: It's going to take a long time, but I'm more hopeful now because Iraqis have their own government. They're in charge. And I think they feel more of a sense of responsibility for their own fate.

DOBBS: Bernard Kerik pointed out just moments ago that the intelligence that led to the U.S. attack on the safe house of Al- Zarqawi was provided by the interim government and its intelligence operations. He sees that as a hopeful sign. Do you?

DIAMOND: I think that's a hopeful sign. I think much of what the Prime Minister Allawi and his government are doing to assert authority and make Iraqis understand that it's their future on the line, that it's not resisting an American occupation any longer is a signal of transformation in the psychology of the situation.

DOBBS: And U.S. troops, Larry, more troops are needed, in your judgment. How many more?

DIAMOND: Lou, I think tens of thousands more troops have been needed for a long time. But I really think we're past that now. They're not going to come. Iraqis want to see Iraqis assuming responsibility for the security of the country. So I think the practical imperative now is to expedite the training of Iraqi police, army, civil defense corps, border patrol to take more responsibility for their own security.

DOBBS: The Iraqis are about to form their national democratic election. You seek proportional representation, if you will. Give us your best judgment as to how that would work, the impact on the three principal groups, that is the Kurds, the Shia and the Sunni.

DIAMOND: Lou, it's a bit complicated. But to try and make it as simple as possible, you want each group to be fairly represented. If you have a type of system like we have in the United States, it could be very unstable because there won't be two parties in Iraq. There could be 300 or 500. And so you could have somebody in a single member district winning with three or 5 percent of the vote. Where's the fairness in that? With proportional representation each group in the country, including each ethnic group and religious group will get a share of the seats proportional to its support in the electorate so there will be more of a stake in the system, more security.

The one amendment I would make to what the U.N. has proposed is to have that proportional representation be in multimember districts of moderate size, say five to ten members per district so that people can have some connection to their representatives and independence can get elected.

DOBBS: Larry Diamond, thanks for being here.

DIAMOND: It's a pleasure.

DOBBS: In Oregon tonight, the Portland archdiocese says it will file for bankruptcy because it can't afford the legal cost of sex abuse lawsuits. It is the first Roman Catholic diocese in this country to make such a move. That filing will freeze a priest abuse trial involving the late Reverend Maurice Grammond. He was accused of sexually abusing more than 50 boys in the 1980s. Grammond died in 2002.

Still ahead here, we'll talk with our panel of top political journalists about the Kerry/Edwards ticket.

Also, "Made in America." A company in central California committed to keeping jobs in this country out of patriotism and profitability. We'll have the story for you when we continue in just one moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DOBBS: And now, "Made in America." Companies choosing to keep jobs in this country instead of outsourcing. Tonight's company, Pelco -- manufactures security cameras that monitor some of the world's most famous landmarks. Pelco's CEO says patriotism keeps the company's 1,500 manufacturing jobs right here in the United States.

Casey Wian reports from Clovis, California.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CASEY WIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Who's watching the Statue of Liberty? What about this summer's Republican National Convention or the Olympic games in Athens, Greece? Security cameras for all three are made by Pelco -- a home-grown manufacturing company in central California that's committed to keeping jobs in the United States.

DAVID MCDONALD, PRESIDENT & CEO, PELCO: First, we're, I think, unusually patriotic in our mindset. And we believe in the power of the American worker. We have very productive motivated people who are very efficient at producing our products.

WIAN: Pelco has customers all over the world: Buckingham Palace, the Panama Canal, New York's Central Park. But the company refuses to send its 1,500 U.S. manufacturing jobs overseas in search of cheaper labor.

MCDONALD: Many of those things look good on paper. When you consider the logistics costs, that -- the impact, potentially to quality, the scheduling difficulties and other challenges, the little savings that you could generate on paper often go up in smoke in the real world.

WIAN: In fact, by investing in state-of-the-art equipment and unique employee motivation programs, McDonald says it's actually cheaper to manufacture in the United States.

When the American flag's on its workers uniforms and throughout its factories to the September 11 memorials that dedicate Pelco's headquarters, here patriotism seems as least as important as profit. 9/11 hit home at Pelco, because many of the company's clients -- including the Empire State Building, Ellis Island, and the New York Police and Fire Departments -- were at or near Ground Zero.

MCDONALD: We've always had a very, I'd say, special relationship with New York City and many people there that we know. And that tragedy, I think, affected us, therefore, much differently than it might have other people.

WIAN: The realities of a global economy make it necessary for Pelco to buy some foreign-made components, and it does have an international sales and customer service staff. But the company says the security systems it sells here and abroad will always be made in the USA.

(on camera): While other companies expand overseas, Pelco will soon open its largest manufacturing plant here -- 144,000 square feet, room for 500 new employees.

Casey Wian, CNN, Clovis, California.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DOBBS: Updating a story we first brought you a month ago about the impact of cheap imports on the American shrimp industry. The Bush administration today proposed tariffs on shrimp imported from China and Vietnam.

The administration said foreign countries have been dumping shrimp at deeply discounted prices. American shrimpers already knew that. They say the value of their harvest has fallen by more than 50% because of those cheap imports and, without tariffs, the shrimpers say they will simply be out of business within a year.

The Commerce Department says the proposed tariffs range from eight to 113% and would hit about $2.3 billion worth of shrimp imports. 90% of the shrimp consumed in this country now comes from overseas.

Tonight, a look at what happens when unexpected guests drop in. Some wild pictures: this of a car that crashed through a roof in Marlborough, Massachusetts. Police say the 70-year-old driver apparently hit the gas instead of the brake when trying to park in an elevated lot next to the house, which explains the ease with which that car managed to stay horizontal in the roof. Fortunately and incredibly, no one was injured.

Still ahead here tonight: Senator John Kerry chooses a running mate with widespread Democratic support, but little national political experience.

We'll talk with our panel of leading political journalists -- that's next. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DOBBS: The Kerry-Edwards ticket could inspire a major policy change at the U.S. Chamber of Commerce. Senator Edwards is a former trial lawyer and, earlier this year, Chamber President Tom Donohue said if Edwards is chosen, quote, "I think, in that circumstance, the Chamber would have to recognize that it's a new day," end quote.

The Chamber has never endorsed a presidential candidate. Senator Kerry's campaign, meanwhile, launched an offensive against Donahue last week. The campaign blasted Donohue for his support of offshore outsourcing and accused him of having close ties to the White House.

Joining me now for more on the campaign, three of the country's top political journalists: E.J. Dionne, Columnist for the "Washington Post"; Karen Tumulty, National Political Correspondent, "TIME" magazine; Roger Simon, Political Editor, "U.S. News & World Report" -- all from Washington, D.C., appropriately enough -- I suppose, appropriately enough.

What was your reaction to the selection? E.J., did you think this was the -- sort of the shoe-in candidate?

E.J. DIONNE, COLUMNIST, "WASHINGTON POST": Yes. I think it was the only logical choice in the end. To judge the Edwards pick, you have to think of what we would be sitting here saying if he had picked Dick Gephardt.

Dick Gephardt's a very decent man, but if Kerry had picked him, people would have said he was afraid of Edwards because he's too charismatic and would outshine him. He did the safe thing. Gephardt's been around the track a while.

Secondly, the Edwards choice is the only choice, I think, that has any chance of putting, you know, a number of southern states in play. And simply making them competitive is very important to Kerry.

And third, Edwards really did excite a lot of energy in the Democratic grass-roots. A friend of mine said today he knew Kerry was going to pick Edwards when he said he was going to announce it on e- mail to all of his supporters, because the only name that was going to incite some supporters to send some money in was John Edwards. So, I think it was the logical choice.

DOBBS: Karen -- Edwards, will he be able to, as E.J. suggests, drive the ticket in the south?

KAREN TUMULTY, NATIONAL POL. CORRESPONDENT, "TIME" MAGAZINE: Well, I am not so sure how much of the south it really puts into play. Because don't forget, Edwards -- it wasn't a sure thing he would even win re-election in his own home state of North Carolina.

I do think it helps, and helps possibly a lot in Florida, but I'm not sure how many other southern states it brings into play. His real appeal is going to be in the Midwest, where his -- get ready to hear this phrase about two million more times between now and the election -- the son of a mill worker can really, I think, relate to a lot of working-class people and important swing voters in the Midwest.

DOBBS: Are you suggesting, Karen, that working people in this country will actually have some sort of voice in this campaign?

TUMULTY: Well, you know, it's interesting. I saw poll results last week that suggested that two-thirds of truly undecided swing voters are people who do not have a college education.

DOBBS: Outstanding. The fact is that, Roger, that with two- thirds of those without a college education, the issue is how many have jobs, how important is that going to be in this and how much an appeal does Senator Edwards have in that regard?

ROGER SIMON, "U.S. NEWS AND WORLD REPORT": Well, I don't know if Senator Edwards has any great credentials for a man -- in the area of job creation. We have to, once again, two multimillionaires on the ticket who live in multimillion dollar houses a few blocks from each other in Georgetown. Yes, he grew up in humble surroundings and he was smart enough to get out of those humble surroundings to become a very wealthy personal injury attorney. I think John Kerry went with the safest choice he could possibly make.

DOBBS: Was that an endorsement, Roger?

I wasn't to clear on that.

SIMON: An endorsement of what, Lou?

DOBBS: Of Senator Edwards.

SIMON: No. It was an endorsement of getting out of humble beginnings. I think John Kerry took the safest route he could take, it was the most popular route the party leaders, with some members of Congress. Heck, even Ralph Nader wrote an open letter, saying pick John Kerry, we love him suing these corporations. So, I'm not sure it was any great profile in courage. I think he made the popular choice.

DIONNE: (OFF-MIKE) Edwards is a millionaire. What he is, is an upwardly mobile populist. And that's a really good combination for Americans. He can give the dad and the mill speech because it's true, and he did come from humble beginnings. But Americans also like strivers, so that Edwards has the potential, if he plays this right, and he did pretty well in the primaries, even though he didn't win the nomination, of sort of bridging this gap and he can win a lot of blue collar voters. But he also, especially in the Wisconsin primary, got a lot of upper income voters. That's a pretty good trick for the Democrats. And just to go back to your early question, I think, blue collar voters really are an important swing group in this election, as Karen underlined. They are white working class voters are very much in play.

SIMON: John Edwards won one state, a state he will not win in November which was his native state of South Carolina. I'm not sure he did so well in the primaries.

DOBBS: Well, one of the things I'm excited about, Karen, nonetheless, irrespective of what E.J. and Roger say, I'm excited...

SIMON: ...reasonable one.

DOBBS: I'm excited that at least Senator Edwards will be the only one of the four names on the ticket come November who did not go to Yale.

Is there any significance to that?

TUMULTY: In fact -- in fact, it's very funny, because he -- in North Carolina, of course, the big rivalry is the university of North Carolina vs. Duke. And he even finds people from Duke too elitist for his blood. So he is very much a product of public school system and as E.J. said, a striver.

DIONNE: The N.C. State and University of Carolina isn't bad, it's a pretty good bridge in North Carolina.

DOBBS: And with Coach Krzyzewski remaining all seems to be well tonight in the -- in North Carolina.

We thank you very much, E.J. Dionne, Karen Tumulty, Roger Simon.

DIONNE: Thank you.

TUMULTY: Thank you.

SIMON: Thank you, Lou.

"Tonight's Thought" is on politics. "A politician thinks of the next election. A statesman, of the next generation." Let's hope we have four people thinking about the next generation in November. Those are the words of American Clergyman, James Freeman Clarke.

Turning now to Wall Street, it was a down day. The Dow down more than 60 points. The Nasdaq down about 43. The S&P down more than 9.

Christine Romans is here to give us the upward perspective.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the upward perspective would be oil price. Oil prices were up 4 percent. $40 a barrel an oil, Lou, is again within reach. And the economic picture though mixed. Services sector is slowing. Another report showed firings are falling, but so are hirings. Now speaking of jobs, a lexicon is growing up around outsourcing American jobs to cheap overseas labor markets. Boston Consulting Group has reported on profits and pitfalls of shipping to LCC's.

DOBBS: LCC's.

ROMANS: That's low cost country.

DOBBS: Oh, for crying out loud.

ROMANS: LCC options, LCC operations, it's all euphemisms for shipping American jobs. Remember this is the same...

DOBBS: Euphemism productivity, competitiveness, efficiency when they really mean cheap overseas labor.

ROMANS: And this is the same company that turned offshore into a verb, don't forget.

DOBBS: You've got to give them some credit for that at least. Any other acronyms that we could...

ROMANS: Well, we resurrected involuntary redundancies.

DOBBS: involuntary -- not really.

ROMANS: No. Back to those bad old days of euphemisms for bad news for the American worker.

DOBBS: Appreciate it, Christine, thank you. Looks like that's going to be one of the central issues in this campaign. Christine Romans.

Now let's look at some of "Your Thoughts" on "Broken Borders."

Nathan Muller, in Sterling, Virginia, "Open border advocates defend illegal aliens, it's mere undocumented workers' who shouldn't eve be questioned by law enforcement. What's next shoplifters asserting their right to undocumented purchases? Drug dealers craving status as undocumented pharmacist? Bank robbers making undocumented withdraws?"

"Dianne Petro, of Phoenix, Arizona, "Years ago, our family used to go camping along the Mexican border at Organ Pipe National Monument. Now the ground is full of illegals, the sky full of helicopters. We're losing our country bit by bit. Our government must find the resolve to take it back."

We love hearing from you. Send us "Your Thoughts" at loudobbs@cnn.com and please include your name and address.

Three major wild fires are burning tonight in Arizona. Firefighters are focusing on Mount Brand today. Two of the wild fires have burned more than 16,000 acres. Flames continue to threaten dozens of cabins and a mountaintop observatory. The Mount Brand International Observatory houses a $120 million large binocular telescope. It is still under construction. The observatory's director says when the telescope is operational it will be the most powerful optical telescope on Earth.

Still ahead the results of "Tonight's Poll" and a reminder to check our Web site for the complete list of companies we've confirmed to be exporting America, cnn.com/lou. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DOBBS: The results of "Tonight's Poll," 65 percent of you say John Kerry's choice for vice president will influence your vote, 35 percent of you say it will not.

Please join us here tomorrow evening. Our "Face-Off," does the national guard need to be restructured, we'll have a debate. And more on the new Democratic ticket. We'll be joined by three of countries top political journalist.

Please be with us. For all of here, good night from New York. "ANDERSON COOPER 360" is next.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com