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Lou Dobbs Tonight
Official English?; Terrorists Target Navy Ships; Illegal Aliens in Maryland; Merck Loses Vioxx Case; Secretary Rice Changes China Rhetoric; Safety vs. Privacy in Airports
Aired August 19, 2005 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LOU DOBBS, HOST: Thank you, Wolf. Good evening, everybody. And tonight, a showdown over illegal aliens in one state that could well have national implications. How a demand that illegal aliens should be embraced and not deported is sparking outrage around the country.
Also tonight, more than half the states have passed laws to make English their official language. But Congress refuses to pass similar legislation for the entire nation. We'll have a vigorous debate on the issue tonight.
And the airport screening technology that some critics call an electronic strip search. The Transportation Security Administration says it's changing their technology, but privacy groups aren't satisfied.
We begin tonight with a bold attack by radical Islamic terrorists against two U.S. Navy ships carrying thousands of our sailors and marines. The terrorists fired three rockets at two U.S. amphibious warfare ships docked at the Jordanian port of Aqaba.
One of the rockets flew over the bow of one of those ships, but another rocket hit a military warehouse in Aqaba. A Jordanian soldier was killed. There was no damage to the U.S. ships, no American casualties. Matthew Chance reporting from the Red Sea on the rocket attack, and David Ensor reporting from the Pentagon on the U.S. Navy's surprising vulnerability to terrorist attack. Surprising because of the new policies introduced after the attack on the USS Cole five years ago.
We begin with Matthew Chance -- Matthew?
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Lou, thank you very much. It has been dramatic developments here. The U.S. ships you mentioned narrowly missing disaster when rockets were fired from this place right behind me, the lights you can see behind me, the Jordanian Red Sea port of Aqaba where three rockets were fired. One of them narrowly missing the USS Ashland, a marine amphibious vessel carrying hundreds of U.S. personnel. Marines and sailors there.
It actually hit the ship. No U.S. personnel were injured, instead striking a warehouse in which one Jordanian soldier was killed. Another one was seriously injured. Two other rockets fired from the same location inside Aqaba as well.
One striking the grounds of a hospital in Aqaba itself. No injuries as a result of that. The other one fired across to Israel from where I'm speaking to you now, just a short distance away, across the gulf of Aqaba. Striking near the airport here in Eilat. Actually, directly hitting a taxi, which was badly damaged. The rocket itself did not detonate. Miraculously, the driver of that taxi managed to walk away relatively unscathed.
And nevertheless, Israelis, of course -- the Israeli government working in close cooperation with the Jordanians. Both governments taking this incredibly seriously. Most of the action, most of the investigation taking place across the water, though. A big security operation tonight to try and seal off, and try and bring to justice and try to arrest those people who carried out these attacks -- Lou?
DOBBS: Matthew Chance, thank you.
The attacks in Aqaba are raising new concerns about the protection of U.S. Navy ships during port calls. The Navy introduced new measures to protect our ships after the deadly attack against the USS Cole in Yemen in 2000. But those measures clearly failed today. David Ensor reports now from the Pentagon.
DAVID ENSOR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Lou, actually officials here say they don't think those measures failed. They believe that those measures were designed to address a different threat, and they stress that Navy captains realize that perfect security in every port call just isn't possible.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(voice-over): Although modern ships are equipped with radar and heat signature sensors and high powered Gatling guns, when in a harbor, Navy officials say, there is a limit to what U.S. personnel can do against shore-based attacks.
CMDR. JEFF BRESLAU, U.S. NAVY: Obviously there is never a 100 percent guarantee and I think it's unrealistic to expect that. But in this case, everything that should have been done was, prior to the ship's pulling in and while they were there.
ENSOR: The attack is the most serious on a U.S. ship on a port call since the USS Cole was attacked by Al Qaeda in Yemen harbor five years ago. Since then, ships have been authorized to fire on approaching unknown boats that do not stop on demand. And security patrols have been beefed up. But experts say those measures do nothing to stop this kind of rocket attack from shore.
CAPT. ALEC FRASER, U.S. NAVY: You remember the Cole and the lessons learned from that were protecting a ship out to, say, several hundred yards with the dolphins or pier security and people with machine guns on the side of the ship. But something from a couple of miles away is a whole different thing.
ENSOR: Even if the Katyusha rocket had hit one of the ships, though, a roughly 60 pound World War II-era munition, it would likely not, officials say, have done too much damage.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(on-camera): These rockets, though they have a long range, several miles or more, officials say fortunately, they're not very accurate -- Lou?
DOBBS: There is, of course, great comfort in the fact that neither ship was hit, nor were any Americans injured, certainly. There is great concern that the U.S. troops and sailors and marines are vulnerable, as are our warships. It seems a little, if you will, disingenuous on the part of the Pentagon to suggest you can't have 100 percent security. That hardly sounds like a can-do answer from the general staff at the Pentagon.
ENSOR: You know, the feeling of the Navy is that these port calls, these exercises, are important. That going to some of the ports, like Aqaba which if you've been there, it's a big basin, and there are hills up high for a couple of miles, looking down over the town and over the port, that that's very important to do.
They believe Jordanian security is pretty good most of the time. This time they slipped up. They have to rely on the local security in these ports. In the end, that's what will save them from rocket attacks.
DOBBS: As you say, the region creates extraordinary vulnerabilities, really unlike almost any other place in the world, where the Suez Canal and the narrow straits that accompany the Red Sea throughout. David Ensor, thank you very much, reporting from Washington.
There was new violence in Gaza today, as Israeli troops and police stepped up their efforts to remove the last Jewish settlers and protesters. Troops used bulldozers to breakthrough barricades in one settlement. Police say 85 percent of all of the settlements have now been removed of protesters and settlers.
All but four of the 21 Gaza settlements are empty. Military and Israeli police commanders say the last four should be emptied by next Tuesday. That would be weeks ahead of the Sharon government's schedule.
Turning to another international issue of critical importance to the United States, the rising military and economic power of China. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice sharpened and toughened the U.S. position on China's economic policies, its military buildup, and its record on human rights. Her criticism comes as China and Russia conduct unprecedented military exercises in northeast Asia and in the Pacific. Kitty Pilgrim reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KITTY PILGRIM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice has changed her tone about China. Just this past March, en route to Asia, rice said, "With China, I also think we've had the best. We've had the best relations we've had in some time, perhaps ever." This week in Washington, Rice said in remarks to the "New York Times," which we confirmed with the U.S. State Department, China's military buildup is a concern. So is its human rights, restrictions on religion, and China needs to make significant structural changes to its economy, lest it become a problem for the international community.
Congress has been demanding action about China. The Chinese government bid for U.S. oil company Unocal raised a firestorm of concern on Capitol Hill. Congress held hearings on the national security risks of the deal. This week, Senator Charles Schumer of New York released a 15-page list of complaints against China, ranging from stealing U.S. patents to restrictions on U.S. investment in the country.
China has become assertive in recent months on the military front. This week, Chinese and Russian generals launched joint war games in Asia, in the same region as South Korea, a clear message to U.S. power.
JASON KINDOPP, EURASIA GROUP: This is clearly a challenge to U.S.'s military presence in the region.
PILGRIM: Last spring, China raised alarm when it suddenly passed a law allowing use of force against Taiwan, another gesture analysts say was meant to convey China's regional power to the United States.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(on-camera): The change in tone is striking. Secretary of State Rice is now also talking about economic issues in advance of President Hu's visit to the United States next month. Rice admitted in remarks to reporters, she has recently told Chinese leaders, "Don't ignore what people are saying about problems with the Chinese economy" -- Lou?
DOBBS: And importantly, the secretary of state, who has been traveling and has been as energetic in this first few months of her term as secretary of state, she has brought back a linkage between economic policy and diplomacy which has been absent through two administrations. That is critically important if it is a change that is sustained.
PILGRIM: It certainly is. And the remarks are striking on the economy in this particular instance.
DOBBS: And the delinkage creating a great protest when that delinkage is between human rights, economic policy, and of course, U.S. diplomacy. Kitty, thank you very much. Kitty Pilgrim.
One issue that Condoleezza Rice did not discuss is China's recent arrest of a U.S. citizen on charges of spying. The American, Xie Chunren, is under house arrest on suspicion of spying for Taiwan. The state department says China has been holding him in custody, in fact, since May 31st.
The United States did not publicize the case before, believing quiet diplomacy would be a more effective way to secure the man's release, the man held now for almost three months while the American public knew nothing of it.
Moving now to the war in Afghanistan, a U.S. marine was killed by insurgents today. The marine near Asadabad in the eastern part of the country. He is the third American to be killed in Afghanistan in two days. The fighting has escalated, we're told, ahead of Afghan elections next month. Ten of our troops have been killed since the first of this month. 227 Americans have been killed in Afghanistan over the past four years.
Still ahead here, a Maryland county executive says we should embrace illegal aliens and not deport them. The state's governor has an immediate and strong message for that county executive. And it has created, altogether, a national reaction.
We'll have that special report and the rising momentum to make English the official language of the United States of America. Supporters say immigrants have a civic duty to learn English. Opponents say that's racism. We'll have a spirited, lively debate. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: In Maryland tonight, a local government calling upon its citizens to embrace illegal aliens, sparking a political debate that could well define next year's Maryland gubernatorial elections. Maryland is the latest in a rising number of states where the illegal alien crisis has created a seismic shift in the political landscape. Lisa Sylvester reports.
LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Illegal immigration in Maryland doubled between 2000 and last year. The numbers have grown so fast, it's now shaping into a campaign theme. Montgomery County, Maryland, Executive Douglas Duncan, after returning from a trip to El Salvador said, quote, "We have to find ways to show compassion. Not to split up families and not to send back half a million Salvadorans to a country is just trying to create jobs for their current population".
His views are echoed by Democratic Baltimore Mayor Martin O'Malley, who said at a state conference this week, quote, "I believe diversity is an American value. Immigrants contribute to our country and way of life." Both men are expected to challenge Governor Robert Ehrlich for his seat.
Maryland's Republican governor says, quote, "U.S. citizenship should mean something. We are a country of immigrants, but we need to respect our laws, and we have a responsibility to enforce our laws." The federal government's unwillingness to take action has left it up to states.
TAMAR JACOBY, MANHATTAN INSTITUTE: The public is more and more frustrated by this illegality and they're clamoring for theirs governors and their congresspeople to get involved. And it's is very understandable frustration, but it is a federal problem. SYLVESTER: Steve Camarota, which the Center for Immigration Studies, says politicians who embrace illegal immigration are missing the point.
STEVE CAMAROTA, CENTER FOR IMMIGRATION STUDIES: They seem to feel all the compassion for people who aren't even supposed to be in the country. But the Americans who are hurt by the job competition, the Americans who have to send their kids to overcrowded schools and public hospitals because of illegal immigration, for some reason, those low-income Americans don't seem to get the same empathy from these very same politicians.
SYLVESTER: Maryland county executive Doug Duncan's four-day junket to El Salvador cost tax payers $8,000. That paid for his visit and for three of his aides. Another topic that was discussed, the growing problem with Latin American gangs -- Lou?
DOBBS: Indeed. And MS-13, the worst and most vicious of those gangs, they originated in what country?
SYLVESTER: In El Salvador, the country where Doug Duncan was just visiting. So this all is connected. You see the illegal immigration and you can also see the gang problem, and it's no coincidence, Lou.
DOBBS: Lisa Sylvester, thank you very much, reporting from Washington.
Some 3 million illegal aliens crossed our broken border with Mexico last year. The federal government says that it can cut down on this mass exodus of illegal aliens from Mexico, not with stronger border enforcement, but now with television ads.
The U.S. Border Patrol is spending $1.5 million to air these ads called "No More Border Crossings." They are aimed at the Hispanic community and Mexico and the southwest, presumably the illegal alien community. The ads warn the physical dangers, not the illegality, of trying to cross the border.
Yesterday, the Department of Homeland Security announced a second ad campaign, warning parents not to hide their children in car trunks, engines, and gasoline tanks while crossing our border with Mexico illegally.
We'd like to know what you think about this new advertising campaign costing over $1 million. Do you believe the U.S. border patrol's decision to launch TV ads is an effective way to counter illegal immigration and secure our nation's borders? Yes or no, cast your vote at loudobbs.com. We'll have the results for you later, here in the broadcast.
Newly released documents show Supreme Court nominee Judge John Roberts warned about our nation's immigration crisis more than two decades ago. He even wrote a memorandum during the Reagan White House calling for a national identification card. Judge Roberts said such a card would help combat what he called, quote, "a real threat to our social fabric posed by uncontrolled immigration," end quote.
Judge Roberts wrote the memo to White House counsel Fred Fielding on October of 1983. That memo part of thousands of documents released this week by the Reagan Presidential Library and the National Archives.
Political correctness is not only an affliction in this country, but also in certain countries abroad. The Australian parliament yesterday announced that its security guards must stop using the term "mate" when greeting Australian government officials. They were ordered to use "sir" or "madam" instead.
The Australian public, never a public to embrace political correctness, was absolutely incensed. A former Australian prime minister, in fact, called it pomposity gone mad. Others called it a return to the class system. Today, that politically correct directive was dropped altogether by the Australian government. "Mate" is now safe again at the gates of the Australian parliament.
Coming up next here, massive damages against drug maker Merck. Damages over its painkiller Vioxx. A Texas jury ordering Merck to pay hundreds of millions of dollars in a landmark wrongful death case. We'll have the story next.
And then, should the federal government follow the lead of 26 states and make English the official language of the United States? Two Americans with very different views on our country and its language join me here ahead to debate the issue. Please stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: A jury tonight in Texas finding Merck liable for the death of a man who took its blockbuster painkiller drug Vioxx. The jury awarded his widow more than a quarter of a billion dollars in damages after reviewing evidence that links the drug to an increased risk of heart attack and stroke. This is the first of thousands of Vioxx-related lawsuits slated for trial. Ali Velshi is here now.
Ali, this award is unbelievable.
ALI VELSHI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's phenomenal. It's also not like to stand up. The widow of the man who is in question here has actually -- her lawyer said he doesn't expect this award of $229 million in punitive damages to stay because under Texas law, they don't allow it. That 229 is probably going to come down to $2 million.
DOBBS: Do we know what inspired the jury to come up with such a massive number?
VELSHI: The issue is how the drug companies market these drugs. The information was out there that they have risks, but here's the issue. These are competitive drugs to Vioxx.
(CROSSTALK) VELSHI: ... extra pain killers. And this is the stuff that comes with it. The drug companies say, "we put this out there. This is the information that you need to read." But who reads it? Do we read it? Should we read it? The issue is that Merck marketed this drug with the benefits and focus and the risks.
DOBBS: And a point of fact, Bextra, Celebrex, and Vioxx, Vioxx taken off the market, these for a short period, the FDA ultimately being criticized roundly for permitting these COX-2 inhibitors to be on the market at all. Several scientists saying they're simply not safe. But the lack of safety justified because of the immense pain that apparently some of these drugs, apparently I say underlined, relieve. So it's a remarkable situation.
VELSHI: Vioxx with a $2.5 billion a year drug. Lipitor is a $10 billion a year drug. But these drugs all come with risks, and everybody has to weigh the good against the bad. And the issue is how much information do you need to make that decision.
DOBBS: And Merck's stock, as one might expect, plummeting today.
VELSHI: It took a big hit today. But it took a big hit when they pulled it off the first time. So Merck is a smaller company than it once was.
DOBBS: OK. With 4,000 lawsuits in the wings...
VELSHI: This is where people are worried. Might be up to $50 billion in liabilities some analysts say. We'll find out more as this unfolds.
DOBBS: Indeed we will. Ali Velshi, thank you.
In Wisconsin tonight, violent thunderstorms and tornadoes have left hundreds of people homeless. Weather forecasters say as many as 18 tornadoes hit the state. One man was killed, another 30 people were injured. The storms leveled 15 homes and damaged dozens more in the town of Stoughton in southern Wisconsin. Governor Jim Doyle has declared a state of emergency in three counties.
Coming up next here, should English be the official language of the United States or not? Opponents saying making English official would send the wrong message to non-English speakers, while proponents say speaking English is simply the first step toward the American dream. Both sides of this important debate are next here.
And later, is it a necessary step to ensure your security or is it an electronic strip search? New airport security measures exposing a whole new debate over privacy. That special report still ahead. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: This was a tough issue for many. There is growing momentum in our country to make English the official language of this country. It comes amid growing concern that our nation's newest immigrants, legal and illegal, aren't making the effort to learn the English language, in the views of some, and to assimilate into our society.
Tonight, we have two opposing viewpoints, Casey McAlpin, the executive director of English Language Advisory Group, pro-English. They're in favor of making English, of course, the official language of the United States. And Angelo Falcon, the president of the Institute for Puerto Rican Policy is obviously against it.
Twenty-six states have passed legislation making English their official language. Should Congress do the same for the nation or not? I would like to, if I may, go first to a quote from Theodore Roosevelt. President Roosevelt, in 1919, gentlemen, said this: "We should insist that the immigrant who comes here does, in good faith, become an American and assimilates to us. He shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, where it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed or birthplace or origin." I don't think there's an American in the world who would disagree with it.
But he says there can be no divided allegiance here and says all of this is predicated on the fact that we, quote, "We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language, for we intend to see that the crucible turns our people out as Americans, of American nationality, and not as dwellers in a polyglot boarding house. And we have room but for one soul loyalty. And that is loyalty to the American people."
Let me turn to you, first, Angelo. Could anything be clear, more compelling, than the words of Teddy Roosevelt?
ANGELO FALCON, PRESIDENT, INSTITUTE FOR PUERTO RICAN POLICY: Well, I mean, the fact is, I guess what I hear about this kind of official language business is, I wonder if I'm on another planet. Because to me, English is the official language of this country. I don't see Latinos and others challenging that.
It's the dominant language on the Internet. It's become the language of diplomacy in the world.
DOBBS: Then why resist?
FALCON: There's nothing to resist. Why do you need legislation when it's a fact already? We read -- many Latinos, for example, read a lot in between the lines in terms of this kind of legislation. We think it's the kind of thing that really is insulting to Latinos, because there's this implied notion that we're resisting.
And what people don't understand is that there's a tremendous amount of immigration, and it takes time for people to learn the language. And what you're seeing is a lot of people coming into this country, you see residential segregation where people are being ghettoized, not because of language, but because of their race. And then you're saying that it's language that's creating this segregation. DOBBS: I'll come back to what you just said, because I vehemently disagree, because you're suggesting that people are being discriminated against, and that's why they aggregate new people in this country.
FALCON: That's improving (ph), sure.
DOBBS: We'll come back to that in just a moment. K.C., your thoughts. Is that your intent, to insult new immigrants into this country, specifically as Angelo suggests, Latinos?
MCALPIN: No, of course not. It's not insulting. I mean, there is over 170 countries out of the 191 that the U.N. lists as member countries in the world have declared an official language. Some of them have declared more than one official language. Mexico has an official language. Canada has an official language -- two official languages.
So it's not insulting to anybody. And it's clearly necessary. And there was a town a few years ago in Texas, on the border, that declared Spanish its official language. And we need to take this step now to avoid the problems that they have, for instance, in the European Union, where they're trying to cope with 21 different official languages and having a real problem doing so.
DOBBS: Angelo, you said that -- you didn't really respond to what Teddy Roosevelt said. And I would like to go back to that. And if we could put that quote up one more time. "We intend to see that the crucible turns our people out as Americans, of American nationality, and not as dwellers in a polyglot boarding house. And we have room but for one language here, and that is the English language."
Explain to all of us, in your judgment, how it is in some way -- you said specifically Latinos, but of course, this is the most diverse society on the face of the planet. How about those who come here from Poland or Czechoslovakia or China or Indonesia?
FALCON: Well, I mean, there is a hidden agenda here. You know...
DOBBS: Well, tell us what it is. This -- this broadcast is all about truth, justice and the American way. So let's reveal it.
FALCON: The thing is, I think there is a hidden agenda here, and certainly the target is the growing issue of the number of Latinos in this country and what that means. And this feeling that somehow the characterization of Latinos as being anti-American, don't want to assimilate, don't want to learn the language -- yet study after study show that immigrants want to learn the English language. What we find time after time is that there are, for example, resources for programs to do English literacy, we find groups like pro-English...
DOBBS: Why should there be an exception for Latinos?
FALCON: No, there shouldn't be for Latinos. I'm saying we target...
DOBBS: But you're talking about (INAUDIBLE).
FALCON: Whatever happens with Latinos in dealing with...
DOBBS: Well, let me ask you about that.
FALCON: ... the assimilation should apply to everybody.
DOBBS: Come on, we're straight-talking people here. Why should there be in this country any resistance to the idea that English is going to be the...
FALCON: There isn't. That's my point. There isn't.
DOBBS: There isn't?
FALCON: There really isn't. No...
DOBBS: Then why...
FALCON: (INAUDIBLE) Latino community...
DOBBS: Then why would you take on the issue?
FALCON: The reason is that there is no need for it, because it is the dominant language in this country.
DOBBS: What is the need for it, K.C.? You get the last word, K.C.
MCALPIN: Well, there is a need for it. It's no longer as dominant as it was. We have a huge influx of non-English speaking immigrants. We want to preserve the melting pot ideal of our society that has been the formula for success for generations of immigrants. It's really bigoted, you know, to suggest that current immigrants today, whether they come from Latin America or anywhere, are any less capable of learning English...
FALCON: I never said that.
MCALPIN: ... and assimilating than previous generations of immigrants.
FALCON: That's ridiculous. That's ridiculous. That's ridiculous. What are you talking about? Are you nuts or something? Who said that? where did you make that up in.
MCALPIN: I'm sorry, so I'm sorry, there is a...
FALCON: Where did you make that up?
MCALPIN: There is a tendency to think...
FALCON: It's ridiculous. Hey, I'm talking to you in English!
MCALPIN: I'm sorry, there is a tendency for some people to think that immigrants can stay apart, because without the English...
FALCON: Well, those are extreme people. There are people -- there are all sorts of extremists in every community.
MCALPIN: Excuse me, excuse me. Wait a minute.
FALCON: You're just saying that those extremists are the mainstream, and I'm saying they're not. I'm saying that you're characterizing Latinos in a very strange way, in a very suspect way...
MCALPIN: No...
FALCON: And it's hard for me to sit here and listen to you. You bring up some town, some town in Texas.
MCALPIN: I'm sorry, I'm sorry...
FALCON: That's not the majority of the Latino population. And you take that and you extrapolate? This is ridiculous.
MCALPIN: The overwhelming -- I agree with you, that we need to do more to help new immigrants learn English. The government should do a lot more in that area. And there is a big need for English as a second language classes around the country.
But, look, it helps immigrants and it helps the country to learn English.
FALCON: Who says we don't want to learn English? What are you talking about? I don't know what you're talking about.
DOBBS: Let me ask you this...
FALCON: I don't get it! Who (INAUDIBLE) don't want to learn English?
(CROSSTALK)
DOBBS: Let me interrupt because we're out of time. Let me ask you this, we're increasingly a society in which schools are putting out their documents in Spanish and English, bearing the burden of doing so, in which businesses are now working out in Spanish language and English. Not unlike the situation that Canada faces with Quebec.
We have a situation at which -- well, before you react...
FALCON: Why did you do that example? Why don't you use some other example, like France or something like that? Quebec is very inflammatory. Very interesting selection.
DOBBS: Quebec is inflammatory?
FALCON: Well, it is a very controversial -- see, the thing is that...
DOBBS: Well, you don't think this is controversial? FALCON: The dominant language in this country...
DOBBS: Well, why don't you select my comparison for me?
FALCON: The dominant language in this country is clearly English. In the Latino community, every Latino parent...
DOBBS: Then why are you resisting it?
FALCON: Nobody is -- I'm saying there is nothing to resist.
DOBBS: Then why don't you embrace it?
FALCON: We do embrace it. We're here.
DOBBS: Do you embrace it...
FALCON: I'm talking to you -- am I talking to you in Spanish? I'm not. I'm talking to you in English.
DOBBS: Do you want to speak to me in Spanish?
FALCON: We support -- we support, you know, -- English is an important language. If you want to survive in this society...
DOBBS: An important language?
FALCON: No, I'm saying, if you want to succeed -- you're reading more into it. I'm saying...
DOBBS: I mentioned Quebec and you have a fit?
FALCON: Of course.
DOBBS: Come on. Now I'm being sensitive?
FALCON: The thing is -- the problem is that -- you see, what I object to is the fact that...
DOBBS: What you object to?
FALCON: ... Latinos support -- Latinos support the English language. There is no movement by Latinos to undermine the English language. What you're seeing is a tremendous change in the population. It takes time for people to learn the language. And there are communities that have -- with Spanish as the dominant language, and that's changing. And I think a lot of that has to do -- my opinion, not yours -- to a residential segregation in this country that I think there is a -- housing discrimination that reinforces the use of the language, Spanish language. I think what we are not addressing with this kind of legislation is how you deal with the source of the issue of segregation and...
DOBBS: Well, the source -- I mean, we can go to (INAUDIBLE) sources. We can go to economics and sociology...
FALCON: We have to. We have to. This is superficial, unnecessary legislation...
DOBBS: But there are also, of course, issues of border security...
FALCON: ... that polarizes.
DOBBS: ... and immigration policies to begin with.
FALCON: These are other issues that have to all be discussed together. I'm just saying that English-only legislation is really a waste of time. It's unnecessary. Groups like this, what they're doing is they're basically using that for another agenda, and that's an anti-Latino agenda. And I think that's the thing that I find offensive.
DOBBS: K.C., I apologize, we're out of time. I think that we have illuminated some parts of this, and I hope...
FALCON: And I did the whole thing in English.
DOBBS: And I'm very proud of you, Angelo Falcon.
MCALPIN: Yes, good thing we can converse in English.
DOBBS: Gentlemen, I apologize, we're out of time. We thank you both for being here. Come back, we'll continue the discussion.
Taking a look now at some of your thoughts on this issue. In fact, many of you wrote in about the proposal to make English the official language of this country. And our poll question last night, do you think it should be the official language? By the way, that poll question resulted in the first 100 percent result answer; 100 percent of you responded saying, yes, it should be. Just for the record.
Wendy in Carter Lake, Iowa wrote to say: "Lou, if it weren't for the imbeciles we have in our government, your poll question about our language wouldn't even be a topic. Keep on keeping on."
A viewer from Union, New Jersey, who identified himself only as "Fed Up," wrote: "When I came to this country from Italy, I had to learn English in order to advance. Funny, but I always thought that English was and is the language of the United States of America. Now, we need a vote? Well, then my vote is yes."
And Mike Cowan in -- and I hope I get this right -- Ronkonkoma, New York: "I think it is a sad commentary on life in the United States today that there is even a question about English having to be voted on as our official language."
And Shelly Jenkins in Gettysburg, Pennsylvania. "Lou, I do not understand how making English the official language can possibly be viewed as racist. All four of my grandparents legally immigrated to this country from Russia, Poland and France. Every one of them spoke English fluently. They didn't feel oppressed. Would France or Russia make it as easy for us?" And Ben Trimble in Austin, Texas: "The vote seems to be 100 percent for English as the official language. Could this be because those who might vote no cannot read the question?"
And David Whitmire of Watkinsville, Georgia: "Immigrants are guests in our country, nothing more. As guests, I expect them to speak our language and live according to our customs. If they don't like it, they should return to their native country."
Send us your thoughts at loudobbs.com. Each of you whose e-mail is read here receives a copy of my book, "Exporting America."
Coming up next, three of the country's leading political journalists join us to discuss the state of emergency along our nation's southern border, and a great deal more as well.
And later, the debate between security and privacy. Will Americans support X-ray vision security machines at our airports? Is that a strip search of the sort? That special report is next. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Joining me now three of the country's top journalists. In Washington, Karen Tumulty of "Time" magazine, Roger Simon of "U.S. News & World Report," and from Orange County, California tonight, Ron Brownstein of the "Los Angeles Times." Thanks for being here. Good to have you all with us.
And let's turn to first issue. English language as the official language of the United States. What do you think, Karen? Is that -- is there even a reason for a debate?
KAREN TUMULTY, TIME: Well, I have got to tell you, though, I don't know precisely that it would change in practice to have a declaration that English is the official language. It still seems like there would be a lot of parts of the country where people would still feel the necessity to have signs in more than one language. So, precisely what would it change, Lou?
DOBBS: Roger?
ROGER SIMON, "U.S. NEWS & WORLD REPORT": This is an extremely touchy subject, as the last two guys who were talking about it might have indicated. There have been wars and riots fought over official languages. The famous Sharpsville Massacre in South Africa took place because the Afrikaner government determined -- or said that only Afrikaans would be the language taught in schools and black people protested that.
This -- it is hard if you're an English speaker to appreciate perhaps how sensitive people are who are not native English speakers are to preserving their language. And I don't see anything wrong with a multiculturalism, with having other languages used in the United States. RON BROWNSTEIN, LOS ANGELES TIMES: Lou, listening to those -- to that debate, the very spirited debate, there was one point on which both men agreed, and it is one which I think has not got enough attention for the past 15 years, which is that both said we need more money and more effort to help people assimilate.
You know, you go around the country, yes there is debate about whether people want to learn English. There are not a lot of spaces in English as a second language class. Certainly not here in Southern California, New York City, other major ports of immigration.
That's one point on which I think both sides can agree. If you want greater assimilation, you have to make greater effort help people assimilate. And I think that is something that has been lacking under presidents of both parties.
DOBBS: Vice President Dick Cheney telling a veteran's group that the United States will not relent in Iraq. That sounds like an upping of the ante, if you will, against rather different statements from the administration over the past several weeks. What do you think, Karen?
TUMULTY: Well, that certainly is -- it is certainly putting the vice president on record. It is interesting, however, that almost all of his appearances lately are in fact in front of either military groups or at Republican fund-raisers. I think this was a situation of sort of trying to shore up the base.
But the problem, as we discussed last week, is that we're getting other signals from the Pentagon. And in fact from -- from high ranking officials at the Pentagon that in fact the plans are being made to sort of scale back the troop commitment. And the question is whether, say come next spring, we're going to be in a position where the United States can say in fact we do have the security situation under control.
DOBBS: Roger, it is curious because Donald Rumsfeld seemed to be pushing away from war on terror and describing our conflict with radical Islamists as a struggle, not a war, a struggle against violent extremism. And at the same time, starting to talk about draw downs, and suddenly the vice president is out here -- he's knocked down on that. It is war on terror again, the president made that clear. And now we see the situation where the vice president is saying we will not relent. Is there a divide here in the administration?
SIMON: Cheney seems oddly disconnected from what others as you indicate have been saying. Perhaps there is not sufficient leadership from the very top on that. We do know that on Memorial Day it was Cheney who said the insurgency was in its last throes, which I don't think anyone else in the administration actually believes.
And in his recent speech Cheney also said that one of the reasons we're fighting is to show that we have not lost our resolve. I think that's an unfortunate statement. This is not a some kind of macho game of chicken to show we have our resolve. The war in Iraq is about whether we have just, realizable goals and how many Americans we have willing to die for those goals, rather than have Iraqis stand up and fight for them.
DOBBS: Ron, two governors, Governor Richardson of New Mexico, Governor Napolitano of Arizona declared states of emergency in their states because of illegal immigration and border security issues. What's your reaction?
BROWNSTEIN: Well, no one -- I don't think there is anyone out there who thinks that the situation along the border is under control. Almost everyone I think agrees...
DOBBS: I've heard you make understatements but that's about as understated as I can imagine. They just declared states of emergency and Ron Brownstein says they don't believe that the border is under control.
BROWNSTEIN: No one -- I'll put it this way, no one believes the situation is tolerable. The question is what is it going to take to get it under control. And perhaps this will begin to spur the debate.
I have said before on this show, Lou, I think the fundamental divide in the immigration debate is between those who believe that the solution is solely or primarily enforcement based. That if is, that if we put more money into border patrol, we put more money in technology,
(CROSSTALK)
DOBBS: The country has come this far. Ron, excuse me, the country has come this far. The country understands, I believe on all sides of this, it doesn't matter what you do with immigration reform, it doesn't matter what you do with the war on drugs, it doesn't matter what you do on terms of the war on terror, if you can't secure the border, you can't prevail.
BROWNSTEIN: I agree. You turn it upside down. The argument is whether you can control the border solely through enforcement, or whether you have to have laws that are fundamentally more enforceable than what we have now. No one on Congress is out there saying we don't need more effort on the border. The question is whether we also need to have some kind of guestworker program that would allow the border patrol to focus on smuggling for other reasons.
DOBBS: Thank you very much, Ron, Roger, Karen.
At the top of the hour -- at the top of the hour here on CNN, "ANDERSON COOPER 360," who speaks far more clearly than I do -- Anderson.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: It is a tongue twister, Lou. Thanks.
A girl in Kansas, a high school senior mauled to death by a tiger, she was standing next to the beast for a yearbook picture of all things when it lashed out, took her life. Tonight on 360, why was this young woman allowed to stand so close to the tiger? And why should anyone be allowed to keep these animals as pets? A lot more questions and answers. We'll try to get to the bottom of it.
We also speak to a friend of Dennis Rader, the BTK Killer, a friend who still stands by him, goes so far as to say he did a lot of good things for the community, an interview you won't hear anywhere else. Top of the hour, Lou.
DOBBS: Thanks, Anderson.
Coming up next here, should airport screeners be granted the same X-ray powers as superman? We'll have a special report on privacy concerns.
Also the remarkable story of a marine sergeant in this week's edition of "Heroes."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Does new technology giving airport screeners X-ray vision go too far? When the technology first came out, Civil Libertarians and others complained saying graphic images of passengers' bodies violates personal privacy. Now the Transportation Security Administration asserts the technology is ready for use. Jeanne Meserve has the report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CHRISTOPHER REEVE, ACTOR: All right, Luthor, where is it? Where's the detonator?
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): X-ray vision isn't just for Superman anymore.
REEVE: You diseased maniac.
MESERVE: An X-ray technology called Back Scatter, already used to see inside vehicles, may soon be used to look underneath the clothes of travelers to reveal weapons, contraband and a whole lot more.
TIM SPARAPANI, AMERICAN CIVIL LIBERTIES UNION: Superman with his X-ray vision, never had it so good. This technology -- actually this image is actually rather, sort of, cloudy and coarse compared to the others I've seen. You literally read the wrinkles on a person's body.
MESERVE: And the machines can store images, raising fears that very private secrets could become very public.
A. MICHAEL FROOMKIN, UNIVERSITY OF MIAMI LAW SCHOOL: How secure are they going to be? Are they going to be encrypted? Who is going to have access to the tapes? Are they going to be passing them around for office parties?
MESERVE (on camera): To allay privacy concerns and clear the way for preliminary testing at the nation's airports, the Transportation Security Administration has been working with manufacturers to reduce the detail visible to machine operators. (voice-over): Bob Postal is with one manufacturer.
What you'll see is very much an outline of the person's image with no detail of anatomy whatsoever, with the threat images superimposed on that outline.
SPARAPANI: I do think this is an improvement.
MESERVE: But the ACLU's Sparapani would like to see an even less-detailed figure.
SPARAPANI: Again, this is still a rather detailed silhouette of someone's body. Anyone who's had an amputation may be trying to obscure that. I think we still see details that are, you know, are intimate.
MESERVE: No pilot testing of Back Scatter on airline passengers is scheduled. The TSA says when it is, the machine with the less- detailed image will be used. Travelers will have the option of being patted down instead of being scanned. No images will be stored.
Screeners will be separated from passengers and will see only the machine image and screeners may only be allowed to scan passengers of the same sex. The TSA will be trying to determine if Back Scatter can screen passengers fast enough and whether it can deliver genuine security without compromising privacy.
For CNN's America Bureau, Jeanne Meserve, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
DOBBS: Still ahead, the story of a Marine sergeant who after nearly losing his leg in Iraq, now marvels at what the modern medicine has done for him. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Now our weekly tribute to our men and women in uniform. Tonight, the story of Marine Sergeant Doug Hayenga. After Sgt. Hayenga nearly lost his leg in Fallujah, doctors worked long and hard to save his leg, but his remarkable recovery, also due to his extraordinary bravery and determination. Casey Wian has his story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CASEY WIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Crossing the finish line: Personal victory for this Marine Sergeant Doug Hayenga.
SGT. DOUG HAYENGA, U.S. MARINE CORPS: It felt good. I thought it'd be a little easier, but I've got to do some more practice.
WIAN: It's been a year and four months since an explosion in Fallujah nearly cost Hayenga his life.
HAYENGA: I'm actually pretty lucky I still have my leg. It was within medical guidelines to amputate and then they decided to try to save it.
WIAN: After 22 surgeries, he's almost ready to walk again.
HAYENGA: Within a month, I should be walking without the crutches. So, it's getting there. It's another one of those little steps in the recovery process.
WIAN: Hayenga marvels at what doctors did to save his shattered leg.
HAYENGA: This is actually my stomach muscle. They cut me from my ribs to the bottom of my stomach, took out the right side of my six pack, opened up the leg and under a microscope, sewed two arteries and a couple of veins together and put a skin graft over it.
WIAN: But it wasn't just his leg. The blast nearly cost Hayenga his arm as well.
HAYENGA: The shrapnel came in -- shrapnel in the concussion cut the radial nerve and my arm was limp. I had a wrist palsy. This -- I had no feeling in my arm, for the most part.
WIAN: With grit and determination, he's fought through a year of therapy at the Balboa Navy Medical Hospital in San Diego.
DINORA HAYENGA, WIFE: He never saw it as an option not to be able to walk. He's a really strong person and I believe that because of that, he's been able to cope with this whole situation.
WIAN: Hayenga once dreamed of being an officer in the Marine Corps, but has now learned he we have to be medically retired. He believes the same positive attitude that helped him recover will now lead to success in the civilian world.
Casey Wian, CNN, reporting.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
DOBBS: Sgt. Hayenga also plans to continue his athletic career. The sergeant is now training to participate in the New York City Marathon.
The results now of our poll tonight: 90 percent of you do not believe the U.S. Border Patrol's decision to launch TV ads is an effective way to counter illegal immigration and secure our nation's borders.
And finally tonight, Judith Miller, the Pulitzer Prize-winning "New York Times" reporter has now been in prison for 44 days, for protecting her confidential source in the White House-CIA leak case.
Thanks for being with us tonight. Please join us next week. Our guests include former Constitutional Adviser to Iraq, Noah Feldman. He'll be here Monday, as the deadline for a new constitution in Iraq arrives. And Congressman Steve King of Iowa, hosing a critical summit on immigration reform. Please join us. For all of us here, have a very pleasant weekend. Good night from New York. "ANDERSON COOPER 360" starts right now -- Anderson?
END
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