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Lou Dobbs Tonight
Who Will Protect American Consumers From Dangerous Imports?; Middle-Class Americans Under Assault
Aired October 01, 2007 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KITTY PILGRIM, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight: The housing and mortgage crisis sends shockwaves through state and local governments. Middle- class families could face a crippling new burden.
Also, a shocking new example of Mexico's meddling in our affairs -- another attempt by the government of Mexico to force American citizens to give amnesty to illegal aliens.
A government panel promises to protect consumers from dangerous imports, but will the government give federal agencies the money and powers they need? We will have that and much more straight ahead tonight.
ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT: news, debate, and opinion for Monday, October 1.
Live from New York, sitting in for Lou Dobbs, Kitty Pilgrim.
PILGRIM: Good evening, everybody.
Startling new details tonight about the close ties between the State Department and the private security firm Blackwater USA. Sources tell CNN a Blackwater employee wrote the State Department's initial report on a controversy shooting incident involving Blackwater staff in Baghdad.
The Iraqi government says Blackwater guards killed as many as 20 civilians in that incident. Blackwater says its employees were simply responding to an attack on the U.S. diplomatic convoy.
Jamie McIntyre reports from the Pentagon -- Jamie.
JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SENIOR PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: And, Kitty, it's not just Blackwater that is under fire, but also the State Department, which is under congressional scrutiny, accused of being too anxious to spend money to make contractor misconduct go away.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MCINTYRE (voice-over): This silent Iraqi police video obtained by "Newsweek" magazine shows the carnage after the September 16 incident, a smoking wreck with charred human remains, another car with blood-soaked seats, on the ground, dozens of shell casings and an Iraqi police officer gun in hand surveying the aftermath.
The initial State Department account, called a spot report, said the Iraqi deaths were the arrest of defensive fire after a convoy was engaged with small arms. That's the security contractor Blackwater's version of events, and, in fact, CNN has learned that that spot report was written by a Blackwater employee. The State Department insists that doesn't make any difference.
TOM CASEY, SPOKESMAN, U.S. STATE DEPARTMENT: The spot report does not represent an investigation, a review or anything more than a first-blush account of the basic incident itself.
MCINTYRE: The Iraqi police argue the video evidence and eyewitness accounts suggest that innocent actions by Iraqis were met with indiscriminate shooting. But a Blackwater spokesperson tells CNN all the initial statements given by guards at the scene are consistent with self-defense.
The concern that Blackwater's hired guns may have itchy trigger fingers is echoed in a memorandum prepared for a House committee investigating Blackwater and obtained by CNN. Among the findings, Blackwater has been involved in 195 escalation of force incidents in Iraq since 2005 and 84 percent of the time fired first. The State Department counters and some outside experts concur that that's because Blackwater gets the most dangerous assignments.
ROBERT YOUNG PELTON, AUTHOR, "LICENSED TO KILL": Statistically they're not any more violent or less violent than other security companies.
MCINTYRE: The congressional memo cites what it says are previously unreported Iraqi deaths at the hands of Blackwater forces, including a civilian shot in the head, the alleged cover-up of a shooting that killed an innocent bystander and a traffic accident that left an Iraqi vehicle in a ball of flames.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MCINTYRE: And now the FBI has been called in to assist in the investigation. They say that, at the request of the State Department, they will take part, with the State Department still in the lead -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Jamie, does that mean that criminal charges may be involved?
MCINTYRE: Well, what it means is that the FBI has the ability to conduct these investigations at a much higher level than the State Department. Obviously, State Department still in the lead, but it reflects the seriousness. And, yes, if they uncover any criminal wrongdoing, there could be criminal charges.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much, Jamie McIntyre. Thanks, Jamie.
Tomorrow's congressional hearing will also focus on the huge sums of money the federal government has paid Blackwater. Blackwater is based in North Carolina. It's the biggest of three private security contractors working for the State Department. Blackwater has earned more than $1 billion from the federal government since 2001. The State Department alone paid Blackwater over $832 million between 2004 and 2006. Now, Blackwater only had government contracts worth less than $1 million in 2001.
Insurgents in Iraq killed five more of our troops over the weekend, four in Baghdad, one in Diyala Province north of the Iraqi capital. Two other troops died in non-combat incidents; 66 of our troops were killed in September. That is the lowest monthly total since August of last year; 3,808 of our troops have been killed since this war began; 28,009 of our troops have been wounded, 12,577 seriously.
The military says the decline in U.S. troop deaths in Iraq in recent months is a positive sign. The number of Iraqis being killed has also fallen sharply, but military officials acknowledge that the levels of violence in Iraq are still too high.
Jim Clancy reports from Baghdad -- Jim.
JIM CLANCY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, we could hear some sighs of relief, but, certainly, there were no celebrations. No single reason for the dramatic drop in casualties either.
Now, the Iraqis are giving credit to General Petraeus and a new U.S. strategy, but they also say it's a new U.S. understanding of what is going on, on the ground in Iraq. For his part, General Petraeus and Ambassador Crocker both gave the credit to the Iraqi people, their increased cooperation.
A spokesman for the prime minister, meantime, telling CNN the key in all of this has been the cooperation of tribal leaders in Anbar Province with the U.S. military and with the Iraqi military against al Qaeda.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALI AL-DABBAGH, IRAQI GOVERNMENT SPOKESMAN: This really is the fruit of such corporation which. And, at the end, and the tribes themselves, the people themselves start are defeating al Qaeda, which they make al Qaeda away from Baghdad, which they reduce the level of threat and the level of the number of the terrorism and the number of terrorist act. Now, we are facing the al Qaeda in the north areas.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CLANCY: To that end, there was a car bomb in Mosul overnight. It killed a university professor and wounded five of his students.
But the numbers don't tell the whole story here, Kitty. And, when you talk with Iraqis themselves, they say they're still living in fear in their neighborhoods, the reason, they suspect, that militia have infiltrated their own security forces. We talked about that with Iraq's Sunni vice president, Tariq Hashemi.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) TARIQ HASHEMI, IRAQI VICE PRESIDENT: Security and the armed forces, we do have a problem. We do have a militia that is already penetrating the Iraqi national armed forces. These militias have to be perished, in fact. And the militias, as well as al Qaeda, still main troublemakers, in fact. And they are behind the destabilization of my country.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CLANCY: Weeding out the militias from these security forces is a huge task. The U.S. can help, but the Iraqis are largely going to have to do it on their own.
Tonight, what many people are asking themselves, both Iraqis and U.S. forces, is how can they capitalize on September's success -- back to you, Kitty.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much, Jim Clancy. Jim Clancy reporting from Baghdad. Thanks, Jim.
Police in Austria tonight are questioning a man who allegedly tried to attack the U.S. Embassy. Now, officers arrested the man in Vienna after he tried to enter the embassy with a backpack full of explosives and Islamic literature. Those explosives included hand grenades, screws and nails.
The man fled from the embassy after his bag triggered a metal detector and police say the man lived in Austria, but he originally came from Bosnia.
Russian President Vladimir Putin today hinted that he may become Russia's prime minister next year. The Russian constitution prevents Putin from running for a third consecutive term as president, but Putin has strongly indicated that he wants to continue playing a leading role in the Russian government.
Meanwhile, Russia's air force is stepping up long-range patrols near Alaska. The commander of the North American Aerospace Defense Command says the U.S. is closely watching the Russians.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEN. GENE RENUART, NORAD COMMANDER: We can't afford to have an unidentified aircraft replicate what we saw on 9/11. And so, in the issue of long-range aviation, these aircraft launch and flying out in regions that are not -- they're not on a flight plan. They're not following a traditional air traffic route. And so, until you visually identify who that aircraft is, there is a certain amount of uncertainty there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PILGRIM: Now, Russian aircraft are also probing the defenses of U.S. allies in Europe. British And Norwegian fighter aircraft have intercepted Russian bombers recently. The military government of Myanmar tonight appears to be in complete control of the country. Troops and police last week crushed pro-democracy protests across Myanmar. Opposition groups say up to 200 people were killed. The government's top leader, so far, has refused to meet with the U.N. envoy who's visiting Myanmar.
Still to come: new examples of Mexico meddling in this country.
Casey Wian will have the story -- Casey.
CASEY WIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Kitty, there was a political convention this weekend in Los Angeles, held by a party trying to keep its delicate grip on the presidency. But it wasn't George Bush's GOP. It was Mexico's National Action Party. We will explain why disciples of Felipe Calderon and Vicente Fox were here -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Thanks, Casey. That report is coming up.
Also, one state lawmaker is fed up with communities that declare themselves sanctuary cities for illegal aliens. We will have that report.
And the federal government promises action to protect Americans from dangerous imports, but is all that just talk?
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: The debate over sanctuary policies in many cities is heating up in the state of Wisconsin. Lawmakers there are moving to ban local ordinances that flout federal immigration law.
As Bill Tucker reports, one state senator wants to make sure localities in Wisconsin aren't offering sanctuary to illegal aliens.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BILL TUCKER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Madison, Wisconsin, the home of the University of Wisconsin, doesn't describe itself as a sanctuary for illegal aliens, but, in 2004, the county board passed a policy which bars social workers from asking the immigration status of people seeking welfare. That policy also says the police -- quote -- "shall not inquire about a person's immigration status unless investigating criminal activity other than mere status of an undocumented alien."
Republican State Senator Glen Grothman wants to put an end to policies like Dane County's.
GLEN GROTHMAN (R), WISCONSIN STATE ASSEMBLYMAN: I'm afraid that what is going on here in Wisconsin is, first of all, we're sending the message out that, in the United States, immigration laws shouldn't be taken seriously, and from the perspective of the state of Wisconsin, we're making Wisconsin a welfare magnet. TUCKER: What Grothman's bill will do is prohibit local ordinances and resolutions that bar government employees from either checking on the legal status of people seeking welfare or from notifying the federal government if that status is illegal.
Advocates for illegal aliens say it's wrong to deny social benefits to illegal immigrants. They say Grothman's bill only highlights the need for the federal government to tackle a broken immigration system, not the states.
CHRISTINE NEWMAN-ORTIZ, VOCES DE LA FRONTERA: I think the Grothman bill, as well as many other local and state bills that have surfaced, are really an attempt for local and state politicians to grapple with this issue, when it is only the federal government that can really fix our broken immigration system.
TUCKER: But the federal government isn't taking action and federal law is being largely ignored, resulting in 12 to 20 million illegal aliens being in the country.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TUCKER: There are more than 1,400 bills currently pending in state legislatures aimed at tackling the issue of illegal immigration on a state-by-state basis. Grothman plans to introduce his bill in the state assembly in Wisconsin, Kitty, later this week.
PILGRIM: Fourteen hundred bills, that's an unbelievable number.
TUCKER: Over 1,400 bills. And they all don't agree, as you might expect. So, what's happening out in the states is, we're seeing the states step forward and say, if the federal government won't do it, we are going to step into that vacuum and do something about it.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much, Bill Tucker. Thanks, Bill.
Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff today shot back at House Speaker Nancy Pelosi over the border fence. Now, Pelosi is objecting to the fence on our southern border with Mexico. She called it a terrible idea. And she said the fence harms the environment.
Chertoff told the Associated Press that the fence is actually better for the environment because it stops illegal aliens from littering when they cross the border. Chertoff also said that more than 150 miles of fence along the border with Mexico have been completed. But some lawmakers are blasting Chertoff for the slow pace of building the fence.
Chertoff is also under fire for the lack of double fencing. Right now there are just eight miles of new double fencing. Now, legislation signed by President Bush just before the midterm elections in 2006 calls for 700 miles of border fence. The total length of the U.S. border with Mexico is almost 2,000 miles.
Mexico is now pushing the amnesty agenda right here in this country. Mexico's ruling party held a convention in Los Angeles, telling Mexicans it will work towards granting full citizenship rights for illegal aliens.
Casey Wian reports on this brazen foray into U.S. politics.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WIAN (voice-over): Border security activists protested outside a Mexican political convention in Los Angeles. They're angry's Mexico's PAN, the party of President Felipe Calderon, is meeting on U.S. soil.
The PAN is trying to register Mexican citizens in the United States by claiming to be the party of immigrants. The former president of Mexico spoke at the convention and criticized the United States for failing to grant amnesty to illegal aliens.
VICENTE FOX, FORMER MEXICAN PRESIDENT (through translator): It's a lack of compassion and vision because they don't understand the value of each immigrant, of each woman and man who have come to this country.
WIAN: Besides California, the PAN is organized in Arizona, Texas, Illinois, and New York.
GEORGE GRAYSON, COLLEGE OF WILLIAM AND MARY: The fact that they have the audacity to organize throughout the United States one of their own political parties, not focusing on Mexican issues, but concentrating on a U.S. internal issue -- that is illegal immigration -- I think is a cause for concern and I think it is raising chutzpah from an art to an exact science.
WIAN: Imagine, Grayson says, if the GOP held a convention in Mexico City and leading the agenda was a demand to open up Mexico's state-controlled oil industry to private investment.
GRAYSON: You would have demonstrations in the street, cries of interference in Mexican affairs. The newspaper editors would go apoplectic, and I suspect that local authorities would not even permit such a meeting to take place.
WIAN: American political candidates do campaign and raise money overseas. Rudy Giuliani went to London last month, while the spouses of Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton have planned similar trips. The Democratic National Committee says it does not try to there influence domestic politics of foreign nations.
Calls to the Republican Party were not immediately returned.
The PAN's convention was hampered by infighting. Some attendees complained party leaders were handpicked in Mexico City. Protesters from Mexico's main opposition party also gathered outside with signs proclaiming the PAN represents Mexico's rich, not its immigrants.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WIAN: Mexicans living in the United States played a significant role in electing Calderon last year, the first time Mexican citizens could cast ballots outside the country. His margin of victory was 24 percent among Mexicans living abroad, but just one-half of 1 percent overall -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: That explains a lot. Thanks very much, Casey Wian.
Time now for some of your thoughts.
Gary wrote to us from Texas: "I have lived in New York for 12 years, can't believe the plan to give illegal aliens driver's licenses. What is it with our elected officials? Are they trying to see who can give away our country the fastest? It's time to get rid of them all before they destroy us."
G.A. in Massachusetts wrote -- "Yes, by all means, give the illegal alien driver's licenses, welfare, free health care, freedom from prosecution, and whatever else they want. Let the American taxpayer suffer the consequences and pay for it." And then he writes in parentheses, "I hope you know sarcasm when you read it."
And Nancy in Massachusetts: "Dear Lou, may you have a very speedy recovery. I miss you and your take on this dysfunctional government."
Lou is continuing to recover from his tonsillectomy, is feeling much better, and we expect him to return to the broadcast very soon.
We will have more of your e-mail a little bit later.
And also still to come tonight, the mortgage crisis, it's not only causing foreclosures around the country. It's also threatening America's middle class in other ways. We will have a special report.
And buyer beware. Consumer groups demand action to protect the American consumer from a rash of dangerous and poisonous imports.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: It is the largest meat recall in U.S. history, and that's prompting legislation to make food safer for consumers.
Senator Sherrod Brown today announced a measure that gives the Department of Agriculture mandatory recall authority. That is something it does not have now. And that would help speed up the removal of poisonous food from supermarket shelves.
Now, this move comes after the Topps Meat Company voluntarily recalled 21.7 million pounds of ground beef that may be contaminated with E. coli bacteria. More than a dozen people in eight states fell sick from eating the contaminated meat; 22 other cases of food poisoning are still being investigated.
Well, anger over dangerous imports is finally leading to some government response. Today, President Bush's Import Safety Panel met in Washington.
And, as Lisa Sylvester reports, panelists heard from consumer and industry groups on ways to protect Americans from toxic imports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Whether it's food, toys, or cribs, it's getting tougher for consumers to have confidence in the products they buy, headlines of hundreds of thousands of unsafe products being recalled, the latest, an expanded recall of frozen hamburger meat processed in New Jersey that has been linked to E. coli. Consumer groups say federal watchdog agencies have done a lousy job keeping up with the flood of imported products.
DONALD MAYS, CONSUMER UNION: They need to do a lot more to make sure that unsafe imports are not coming into our countries and crossing our borders.
SYLVESTER: This government panel appointed by President Bush has been tasked with coming up with ways of sure of safety of imported products.
CHUCK CONNER, ACTING AGRICULTURE SECRETARY: When an import of a certain product is contaminated, even if only a tiny percentage of the product is affected, of course everyone suffers.
SYLVESTER: In its first public meeting, the panel heard recommendations from consumer and industry groups. The Consumer Federation of America urges more resources for the Consumer Product Safety Commission.
The federal watchdog agency in 1980 had 978 full-time staffers, today, only 401.
RACHEL WEINTRAUB, CONSUMER FEDERATION OF AMERICA: The agency's budget has not kept up with inflation, has not kept up with its deteriorating infrastructure, has not kept up with increasing data needs, and has not kept up with the fast-pace changes occurring in consumer product development.
SYLVESTER: Other recommendations, banning all lead from children's products, increasing penalties against companies who violate federal standards, requiring companies certify their products are safe, and giving mandatory recall authority to the Food and Drug Administration and USDA, something they don't have now.
Industry group support giving the FDA more oversight authority, but are resisting mandatory regulations. They also oppose proposals floating on Capitol Hill that would impose user fees on importers to improve safety.
BOB BAUER, ASSOCIATION OF FOOD INDUSTRIES: (r)MD-BO¯They're already paying the import duties. They're paying taxes and that sort of thing. So, it's not a precedent that we would like to see started. That's one of our main concerns.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SYLVESTER: Today, the import panel was primarily in listening mode, hearing what the various groups had to say. Then they will weigh the different views. And, next month, they're scheduled to release their findings to the president and the public -- Kitty. PILGRIM: It is a very late start, Lisa, a start, but a very, very late one. Thanks very much, Lisa Sylvester.
Well, that brings us to the subject of tonight's poll. Do you believe the federal government will put the interests of U.S. consumers ahead of the interests of corporate elites on the dangerous issue of dangerous imports? Cast your vote, yes or no, at loudobbs.com. We will bring you the results a later in the broadcast.
Coming up, middle-class Americans, already reeling from the mortgage crisis, they're facing a major new threat. We will have a special report.
Also, the religious right issues a blunt warning to the Republican Party. We will have that report.
And the Supreme Court faces controversy on the first day of its new term. One of the country's leading authorities on the Supreme Court will join us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: America's middle class is facing yet another assault as a result of the escalating mortgage crisis. Mounting defaults on subprime mortgages continue to crush the housing market and also squeeze the finances of state and local governments.
As Christine Romans reports, Americans already hit by the mortgage crisis are likely to be hit again -- by higher local taxes or service cuts.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Falling home prices and a housing slowdown are biting into real estate revenue for counties and states. Every state except Vermont must balance its budget by law.
That could mean higher taxes ahead or cuts in services, like education, from primary school through the state college system.
RAYMOND SCHEPPACH, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, NATIONAL GOVERNOR'S ASSOCIATION: And that means higher tuition for students and/or for parents. Similarly, in the elementary and secondary, that's normally a problem of not having enough teachers. That, combined with some tax increases, are going to clearly squeeze middle income Americans.
ROMANS: It doesn't end at higher tuition and fewer teachers. Expect higher fees to use public parks. Many states already have hiring freezes and are cutting back on administrative costs.
DOMINIC CALABRO, FLORIDA TAXWATCH: The state is going to feel it because with fewer transactions, fewer sale of homes -- even old, existing homes -- when people come in, they bring in new carpeting, they buy new refrigerators, washers, driers. They do a lot of major, substantial repairs that costs tens of thousands, sometimes even low hundreds of thousands of dollars. And all those items are subject to the sales and use tax.
ROMANS: Consider Florida, whose real estate market exploded during the last decade. Now, lawmakers there are calling a special session, facing the prospect of more than $1 billion in spending cuts.
And Arizona, with a $600 million budget shortfall in its 2008 budget. The governor predicts the housing slowdown will result in slower retail sales in the state.
In New York, the governor warns of a shortfall of at least $3.6 billion for next year due to slowdowns in financial services and real estate.
And in Baltimore County, revenue from real estate taxes tumbled 15 percent during the past year, with an even sharper drop expected this year.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
ROMANS: Unlike many states and municipalities, that county's budget office says it will not face a budget gap, in part because officials there never believed the housing boom could possibly continue. And they were right.
But in many other places, middle class Americans face double jeopardy now -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: And it may be just the start of this.
ROMANS: Um-hmm.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much.
Christine Romans.
Well, on his first day of the new term, the U.S. Supreme Court today refused to hear a number of polarizing cases. Nine justices declined to hear two church/state disputes. And they also rejected a request by tobacco companies to make it harder for smokers to prove that they were lied to by the tobacco industry.
But, as Kelli Arena reports, the nine justices are expected to court controversy with a number of other divisive cases.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
KELLI ARENA, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): They are cases that are expected to sharply divide the court. The issues already divide the nation.
THOMAS GOLDSTEIN, SCOTUSBLOG.COM: The term could get even more interesting here at the very beginning. And it will chart a course for whether the court is ideologically purely conservative or more balanced.
ARENA: Is lethal injection constitutional? Can accused terrorists challenge their detention in federal court?
Can the president order a state to retry a non-citizen convicted of murder?
The court's nine justices will tackle these contentious questions and one thing is certain -- decisions will likely go to the way of Justice Anthony Kennedy, the one swing vote on the court.
DOUGLAS KMIEC, PEPPERDINE UNIVERSITY LAW SCHOOL: It's hard to understate the significance of Justice Kennedy. The problem for both the more liberal side of the court and the more conservative side of the court is that neither side fully understands Justice Kennedy.
ARENA: The justices will also take on cases with decidedly racial overtones and look at whether states can require voters to show photo I.D. at the polls and at the constitutionality of a law requiring harsher federal sentences for dealing crack cocaine versus powder -- both issues, civil rights groups say, unfairly affect minorities.
GOLDSTEIN: And Congress, in a sort of be tough on crime approach to things, really set crack sentences very, very high. But the justices have been asserting the independent authority of judges to decide how sentences should be determined.
ARENA: And that's not an expensive enough docket, the Supreme Court is expected to add two more cases in coming months -- a blockbuster appeal on whether individuals have a constitutional right to possess handguns and whether child rapists should be executed.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
ARENA: Now, all of this coming in the midst of an election year, when the court and its ideology will be front and center in voters' minds -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much, Kelli.
A very busy docket, indeed.
Thank you, Kelli.
ARENA: Sure.
Let's take a closer look at the controversial cases facing the highest court in the land.
And with me now is Jonathan Turley, law professor at George Washington University in Washington, D.C.
Thanks for being with us, sir.
JONATHAN TURLEY, LAW PROFESSOR, GEORGE WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY: Thank you. PILGRIM: You know, in the last term, a court -- a third of the cases were decided by a 5-4 vote. Justice Kennedy cast the deciding vote in a number of these cases.
How do you expect -- I guess they were abortion, race, campaign finance -- given the new slate, how do you expect him -- he is the swing vote, is he not?
TURLEY: Oh, this the year of Justice Kennedy. He may be a court of one on many of these cases. The past cases from last year really played to his more conservative background. These cases, however, fall into areas where he has historically played that moderating role and I expect -- and many of us expect that he will continue to do so, and that he will vote, at least with the left side of the court, on some of these cases -- from first amendment cases to some, perhaps, national security cases.
PILGRIM: Six of the nine justices attended the red mass at the Cathedral of St. Matthew today. This is a tradition. The Catholic bishop, Timothy Dolan, in his sermon talked about an alliance between religion, morality and democracy.
Given that the justices decide on the division between search and state, is this an appropriate sermon, do you believe?
TURLEY: I have to tell you, Kitty, I have never liked this tradition. It goes back to 1245. But it involved, in this case, six justices who sat and listened to a member of the clergy talk about this alliance of the faithful and those who carry out our laws. There are many Americans in this country -- a growing number -- who are agnostic and atheist. And they feel left out. They feel that this an institution that reaffirms this alliance at the very start of every term.
And I think we have to look at whether this appropriate for justices to do.
PILGRIM: One of the cases that's very interesting is "Crawford v. Marion County Board of Elections," which will determine if Indiana's law requiring voters to show photo I.D. can stand.
In an election year, how important is this?
TURLEY: Well, it's going to be very important. There's 20 states that use these types of ramped up requirements. But they're requirements that hit very hard minority groups and people with low income and elderly groups. And the court below, the 7th Circuit, had a decision from George Posner. And he agreed that these are mainly Democratic voters and that it affects the Democratic Party more. But he still upheld the law.
So if this goes through, if the court affirms that decision, you can expect that these laws will be ramped up in other states.
PILGRIM: All right, well, we look forward to the whole series. And it's very interesting stuff for an election year. Jonathan Turley, thank you very much for being with us.
TURLEY: Thanks, Kitty.
PILGRIM: Coming up, we'll hear from both sides in the dispute over the arrest of illegal aliens in one city at our Center of Illegal Immigration Crisis.
And, also, the presidential race -- Senator Hillary Clinton may have a lead in the polls, but Senator Obama is raising the cash. And we're going to find out how that will affect the campaign.
Will there be a third party candidate in '08?
Well, we'll tell you which group might field a surprise candidate.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: The third quarter fundraising period for the presidential campaigns is now closed. It was a good one for Democratic Senator Barack Obama.
But as Bill Schneider now reports, overall, the money flow to the campaigns slowed over the summer.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST (voice over): After the first and second quarters, campaigns were quick to come out with their fundraising totals.
Why?
Because the numbers were huge.
So what are we hearing about third quarter totals?
Not so much.
Summer is a tough time to raise money. Many early donors are tapped out.
Barack Obama reports raising $20 million this quarter -- impressive, if not quite the more than $30 million he raised last quarter.
Can Hillary Clinton match him?
MARK PRESTON, CNN POLITICAL EDITOR: It is going to be neck and neck, from what we're hearing, early on.
SCHNEIDER: John Edwards now says he will accept public financing and spending limits for the primaries. He raised $7 million this quarter, part of which the government will match.
PRESTON: He will receive matching funds, up to $250 of every donation he receives from people.
SCHNEIDER: Mitt Romney topped first quarter Republican fundraising and Rudy Giuliani won the second quarter. The race is on, with each estimating a third quarter take of about $10 million.
RUDY GIULIANI (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think it will end up that we have a very good quarter, probably one of the best of the Republicans.
SCHNEIDER: John McCain needs to show his campaign is turning around.
Will an expected haul of about $5 million do that?
He has long said money is not his biggest priority.
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R-AZ), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I never was going to rely on money to win this campaign. I'm not a very good fundraiser.
SCHNEIDER: Big things were expected of Fred Thompson. Some may see his expected haul as disappointing.
PRESTON: Eight million dollars, while respectable, probably will be viewed with some skepticism.
SCHNEIDER: Though maybe not by him.
FRED THOMPSON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I don't feel compelled to raise $100 million this year, which they said was openers to run for president.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCHNEIDER: Then there are candidates who hope their numbers will show they can run with the big dogs, like Republican Mike Huckabee and Democrat Bill Richardson. Now, Richardson raised $5.2 million this quarter.
And guess what?
He was one of the first candidates to report his total -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: Bill, you know, McCain says he's not that good at fundraising.
Isn't that a necessary skill in this campaign?
SCHNEIDER: Well, he actually was pretty good at fundraising. He raised some good money in the first couple of quarters. But he had a big problem -- he spent it. He spent so much money, he very nearly went broke. So fundraising has got to be one of his skills.
PILGRIM: Expensive stuff, isn't it?
SCHNEIDER: Yes, it is.
PILGRIM: Thanks very much, Bill Schneider.
SCHNEIDER: OK.
PILGRIM: A warning today from the Republican Party from the religious right. A group of Christian conservatives is threatening to back a third party presidential candidate if Rudy Giuliani wins the GOP nomination.
Well, as John King reports, it's not only Rudy Giuliani who is making conservative Christians angry.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN KING, CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Conservative icon Richard Viguerie calls it a warning shot not only to Rudy Giuliani, but the entire Republican Party.
RICHARD VIGUERIE, CONSERVATIVE STRATEGIST: If they go third party, this will, I guarantee you, not be a one-time effort. It will be that we have determined that the Republican Party is beyond salvation, that they have lied and betrayed the conservative voters one time too many, and that this will be a major effort that will go far beyond the '08 election.
KING: The tough talk follows a weekend meeting that included Focus on the Family's James Dobson, Tony Perkins of the Family Research Council, Viguerie and others. Social conservatives for months have complained about what they call lip service from the Bush White House, congressional Republicans and the leading GOP presidential hopefuls.
TONY PERKINS, FAMILY RESEARCH COUNCIL: To the degree that the party moves away from those principal issues, social conservatives, Evangelicals will move away from the party.
KING: Giuliani is of most urgent concern. He supports abortion rights, including taxpayer-funded abortions as New York mayor. Giuliani also marched in gay rights parades and called the city's domestic partners benefits a model for the nation.
PERKINS: These are fundamental issues. These are black and white issues. These are issues that there's just no room for negotiation.
KING: Should he win the GOP nomination, social conservative leaders vow to oppose him. And more and more view a third party effort as preferable to just urging conservatives to stay home.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The gift of god...
KING: The Giuliani camp plays down the threat, noting polls showing strong support among churchgoing Evangelicals and Catholics. Asked Monday about the conservative opposition, the mayor played what he views as a trump card with conservatives who might disagree with him on abortion or any other issue.
GIULIANI: I run the most competitive against Hillary Clinton by a big, big margin. And I take some Democratic states from her. Nobody else does that.
KING: Perhaps. But while there are huge hurdles to third party candidacies, one born of social conservative frustration would be a huge threat to Giuliani.
VIGUERIE: Somewhere between a big problem and a nightmare. Christian conservatives, both white Evangelicals and Catholics, represent 40 percent, 50 percent of the Republican base. Now, they're not all going to defect to a third party, but if a significant number of them do, it just adds to the troubles that the GOP can look forward to in November.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
KING: Now these social conservative leaders hope now to derail the Giuliani candidacy, but they do acknowledge that if he wins the nomination and they go forward with the third party route, it would likely help the Democrats next year.
But, Kitty, they say that's a price they are willing to pay if the alternative is to sit quietly and allow a social moderate like Giuliani to take control of the party these conservatives have dominated since the rise of Ronald Reagan -- Kitty.
PILGRIM: That's tough talk.
Thanks very much.
John King.
A reminder now to vote in tonight's poll -- do you believe the federal government will put the interests of U.S. consumers ahead of the interests of corporate elites on the issue of dangerous imports, yes or no?
Cast your vote at loudobbs.com.
We'll bring you the results in just a few minutes.
Also, coming up, a city is sued over the arrests of a group of illegal aliens.
Now was race a factor?
We'll hear from both sides.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) PILGRIM: Coming up at the top of the hour, "THE SITUATION ROOM WITH WOLF BLITZER" -- Wolf.
WOLF BLITZER, HOST, "THE SITUATION ROOM": Thanks very much, Kitty.
Tonight we have some exclusive video of a dramatic showdown in the air -- U.S. fighter jets intercepting Russian bombers only miles from the U.S. coast -- not once, but over and over again.
Also, double agents inside the FBI -- you're going to find out why a new report says the agency is very vulnerable to moles in its midst.
Plus, a controversial custody death -- a troubled woman shackled and handcuffed and dying after being detained by police at a major U.S. airport.
All that, Kitty, coming up right here in "THE SITUATION ROOM".
PILGRIM: Thanks, Wolf.
Danbury, Connecticut is under fire over its efforts to deal with a crisis in the community caused by illegal immigration.
Now, according to Danbury police, 11 illegal aliens were arrested last month as part of a sting operation by federal agents and Danbury officers. Now nine of those arrested are suing the city and they claim their constitutional rights were violated. A tenth individual from another case has joined the suit.
They're being represented by a group of attorneys and law students from Yale Law School.
And Simon Moshenberg is part of the legal team representing the men.
And he joins us now from Hartford, Connecticut.
Now, because of the litigation, the two sides in this dispute cannot appear together on the program.
The mayor of Danbury will join us in a moment.
But for now, Simon, thanks for taking the time to discuss this with us.
You're one of the Yale law students representing the group of 10 people who claim that the City of Danbury illegally arrested them and violated their civil rights.
Why?
SIMON MOSHENBERG, YALE LAW STUDENT: Well, the City of Danbury, like many of us, is frustrated with the state of federal immigration law. But the city decided to take matters into its own hands and get into the business of enforcing federal immigration law. And whether or not you think that's a good idea as a policy matter, the fact is it's illegal under federal law.
PILGRIM: The mayor of Danbury, Mark Boughton, who's going to join us shortly, made the statement in response to the lawsuit. I'd like to read it: "The lawsuit is not just against the mayor and chief of police, it's against the citizens of Danbury, who clearly want our laws enforced fairly and firmly."
These individuals were illegal aliens and they were at a job site, an area where illegal aliens congregate to be picked up to do jobs. And so they were clearly looking for work, breaking the law.
Why couldn't they be arrested?
MOSHENBERG: Well, first of all, the immigration court has yet to decide whether our clients are or are not legal or illegal.
PILGRIM: Well, one was deported, correct?
MOSHENBERG: Those are different individuals from the ones who are currently filing suit.
The fact is that the federal law states that the federal government enforces federal immigration law. Now, there's a program where if a city wants to get involved in enforcing federal immigration law, the city can join this program. And, in fact, the City of Danbury attempted to join this program a few years ago and was denied permission from the state.
So the city has -- and, my understanding is that the mayor has recently proposed attempting, again to join this program.
PILGRIM: That is correct. And -- but the Danbury Police Department say that the ICE -- the immigration officers -- arrested the men, that they were assisting with vehicles and in a not -- they did not do the arresting. So that they didn't...
MOSHENBERG: Well, we...
PILGRIM: ...if the police department from the city did not involve themselves in the arrest, what's the problem?
MOSHENBERG: We've got evidence to the contrary. For example, we have already presented, in a different legal proceeding, Danbury booking reports that list the name of a Danbury police officer, James Lolly (ph), as the arresting officer. Moreover, aside from the fact that Danbury police are federally prohibited from making these arrests, the way in which the arrests were made also violates the Fourth Amendment of the constitution.
PILGRIM: Danbury police say they often assist federal agencies in their operations and that this normal procedure.
MOSHENBERG: Well, there's a difference between assisting a federal agency and making the arrest yourself and then turning someone over to the federal agency. We're arguing -- and we think the court will find -- that what they did in this instance crossed the line.
PILGRIM: All right, Simon Moshenberg, thank you very much for explaining your side of the case.
MOSHENBERG: Thanks for having us.
PILGRIM: Joining me from the other side of the case is Mark Boughton, the mayor of Danbury, Connecticut.
And thank you very much for joining us, sir.
MAYOR MARK BOUGHTON, DANBURY, CONNECTICUT: Thanks for having me.
It's great to be here.
PILGRIM: I know you could just hear that interview and let me just say that the plaintiffs in this case are saying that your city does racial profiling.
What do you have to say to that charge?
BOUGHTON: Well, you know, it's just nonsensical. Look, we have a neutral and fair application of our laws to all residents regardless of ethnicity, of status, of religion, of any of those common things. And so, at the end of the day, this is really about Yale sort of being the big bully in the state with their large endowment, trying to control political speech and trying to have a chilling effect on the debate about illegal immigration.
This is more about illegal immigration politics than it is about a point of law. We're correct in the law, so we look forward to defending our position vigorously in court.
PILGRIM: Let me just -- let me read from the lawsuit. And they say that your department engaged in illegal law enforcement activities. "In their frustration with the arrival of new immigrants in Danbury, Mayor Boughton and the police department have taken the law into their own hands."
This a very broad charge. It seems to go way beyond the actual particulars of this case.
What do you say to that?
BOUGHTON: Well, that's precisely my point. This lawsuit is not about the arrests, it's about having a chilling effect on my First Amendment right toward political speech. I've been actively involved in this debate about illegal immigration for several years now. Yale doesn't like it. So they feel that this a way in which they can silence myself and the administration and millions of other people that are upset about this problem.
So, at the end of the...
PILGRIM: So, in effect, a test case, basically? BOUGHTON: Oh, no question about it. And let me just tell you, because of that, we are going to vigorously defend our position. And, again, in terms of point of law, we believe we're correct.
PILGRIM: You know, the Danbury police, as I pointed out to Mr. Moshenberg, do assist federal agents on occasion.
And how often do they assist ICE in such instances?
BOUGHTON: ICE is routinely in town every couple of weeks, executing search warrants, looking for various individuals. It is our responsibility -- no, let me just say it's our duty to assist ICE or the FBI or DEA or ATF or any other federal agency. The strategic partnerships between local law enforcement agents, state agents and federal agencies are the only way that our laws can be enforced and the only way we can protect national security.
PILGRIM: Thank you very much.
Mayor Mark Boughton.
Thank you, sir.
BOUGHTON: Thank you.
And joining me -- we'll be right back in a moment.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PILGRIM: Now the results of tonight's poll -- 96 percent of you believe the federal government will not put the interests of U.S. consumers ahead of the interests of corporate elites on the issue of dangerous imports.
We do have some time for some more of your e-mails.
And Mary in New Jersey wrote to us: "I took my 1-year-old child for a lead test at the Board of Health. And as a reward, they gave her a cereal bowl and a sippy cup. And when we got home I noticed that there was a sticker on the bottom -- "made in China."
Bill in Tennessee: "Why are we showing outrage over sanctuary cities when we've been a sanctuary country for 20 plus years?"
And here are some more of the thousands of e-mails telling Lou to feel better soon. He is recovering well from his tonsillectomy.
Lois in New Jersey wrote: "Lou, we miss you. CNN is not the same without you and we wish you a speedy recovery."
And Peg in Florida wrote: "Lou, get that voice of yours back on television. You speak for us all."
We love hearing from you. Send us your thought at loudobbs.com.
Thanks for being with us tonight.
Please join us tomorrow.
For all of us here, thanks for watching.
Good night from New York.
"THE SITUATION ROOM" starts right now with Wolf Blitzer -- Wolf.
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