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Lou Dobbs Tonight
Reversal on Licenses For Illegal Immigrants?; Still Best Government Money Can Buy?
Aired October 29, 2007 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LOU DOBBS, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight, a startling reversal by New York's Governor Eliot Spitzer on the issue of giving away driver's licenses to illegal aliens. But the governor's new plan has a few people confused and more than a few angry and upset. We will have complete coverage on the governor's reversal.
Also tonight, socio-ethnocentric special interest groups stepping up their legal assaults against state governments and county and local governments, trying to combat illegal immigration. Why? We will have a special report.
And members of Congress ignoring their much-ballyhooed ethics reform promises? No. Democratic lawmakers circumventing rules? No way. Those rules designed of course to stop special interest groups from paying Congress' travel expenses.
We will all of that, all the day's news and much more straight ahead here tonight.
ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT: news, debate, and opinion for Monday, October 29.
Live from New York, Lou Dobbs.
DOBBS: Good evening, everybody.
Chaos and some fury tonight over Governor Eliot Spitzer's new plan to give driver's licenses to illegal aliens. Governor Spitzer abruptly retreated and reversed himself, his original proposal to give U.S., citizens, legal residents and illegal aliens the same driver's licenses. That's the revision plan.
The governor now wants to create a three-tiered license system in the state of New York in close cooperation, we're told, with Michael Chertoff, secretary of homeland security. However, many New Yorkers are thoroughly confused and more than a few outraged by the new proposal.
Border security advocates say the governor is still rewarding illegal aliens by giving them any kind of driver's license.
Christine Romans is here now and has a report for us -- Christine.
CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Lou, New York's governor is not backing down on his plan to give illegal aliens driver's licenses, but he has made a U-turn.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ROMANS (voice-over): In a compromise with the Department of Homeland Security, New York's governor is now creating three New York driver's licenses.
GOV. ELIOT SPITZER (D), NEW YORK: We're on our way to offering New Yorkers the option of three secure licenses to drive and travel in this state, in this country and throughout the Western Hemisphere.
ROMANS: A so-called enhanced driver's license for northern and western New York residents that allows them to cross the Canadian border without a passport, just for U.S. citizens, another license for U.S. citizens and legal residents that complies with the federal REAL I.D. Act, allowing the bearer to board airplanes and enter federal buildings, and yet another, the governor's office says, for both driving and identification purposes that would be stamped "not for U.S. government use" and invalid at the airport or federal building. That license is for lawful residents and illegal aliens.
Spitzer says it is a major step forward for national security.
SPITZER: This will be the most secure licensing system in the country.
ROMANS: Outside a New York DMV, confusion.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It sounds kind of complicated to me.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think when you're dealing with more bureaucracy and more paperwork, I just think it's going to make things more complicated, especially when you're trying to fight terrorism.
ROMANS: Open border advocates say the governor betrayed them. They deplore the REAL I.D. Act and call this new system:
CHUNG-WHA HONG, NEW YORK IMMIGRATION COALITION: A three-tiered, discriminatory scarlet letter.
S.J. JUNG, YOUNG KOREAN-AMERICAN CONSORTIUM: Governor Spitzer, we are outraged at your flip-flopping. We are so ashamed to have someone like you, to have a misleader as our governor.
ROMANS: And Spitzer's compromise did nothing to quiet those who have criticized him for rewarding illegal immigration.
FRANK MEROLA, RENSSELAER COUNTY, NEW YORK, CLERK: He confused everyone. And that's what his intention was, to confuse the public. But bottom line, he wants to give a driver's license that looks identical to the license that I would carry without any distinction that they are here illegally.
ROMANS: He says giving licenses to illegal aliens violates state law.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ROMANS: Now, according to the governor's office, applicants for all three of these licenses will be given a registration form to register to vote.
Of course, voting is a privilege of U.S. citizens only. A Spitzer spokeswoman says the state is complying with federal law in giving all driver's license applicants the opportunity to register when they get one of three different kinds of New York driver's licenses -- Lou.
DOBBS: So, what we have watched then is the governor of the state of New York reverse himself, meet with his good friend Michael Chertoff, secretary of homeland security, join together, come up with this three-tiered system, and still leave the state of New York open to massive voter fraud. Is that in some total based on the governor's statement -- or the governor's office statement?
ROMANS: The governor's office would not characterize this, Lou, as a reversal. They say they are still going ahead with the original goal.
DOBBS: Let's call it an improvement, because I really don't care what this governor, this arrogant abuser of his office, and the just absolute disdain with which he holds both the truth and the citizens of the state of New York. This man is sitting here putting together a three-tiered system in which he is going to give voter registration privileges to people he knows are illegal?
ROMANS: They say that that is federal law that everybody who gets a driver's license has to get a form to register to vote. And I guess people are just supposed to know that, if they're not American citizens, that they can't fill out that form and send it in, apparently.
DOBBS: So, we're back to basically where we started, which is giving illegal aliens documentation that would allow them to carry out voter fraud?
ROMANS: Secretary of Department of Homeland Security said that they're against giving driver's license to illegal aliens...
(CROSSTALK)
DOBBS: Michael Chertoff said directly he thinks it's ridiculous.
ROMANS: They're against it. But they said that licensing state residents to drive on the roads is not something that the DHS has any say over.
DOBBS: And these socio-ethnocentric interest groups have the temerity to talk about this as separate but not equal treatment?
ROMANS: A real reversal. Some of the folks who were cheering him just a month ago say they have been utterly betrayed. They want the same kind of license for everyone. They say it is simply a scarlet letter to have one marked...
DOBBS: How dare these groups representing the interests of illegal immigrants demand equal rights to U.S. citizens? Have we reached such a point in this country that there is such propaganda and such nonsense that there is a powerful political impulse to give the same rights to those who are in this country illegally, in some cases superior rights, than to American citizens?
ROMANS: It's one of the reasons they have been so opposed to REAL I.D. from the very beginning, and now they see Spitzer's endorsement they think of REAL I.D. as just the ultimate betrayal they say of all immigrants' rights. That's what they say.
DOBBS: Immigrants' rights? Excuse me. We're not talking about immigrants' rights.
ROMANS: Right.
DOBBS: We're talking about illegal aliens in this country. And if our politicians in both parties, whether it's the White House or whether it's Albany, can't deal straightforwardly with the truth and the reality, instead of this almost -- I swear, it's just like a propaganda ministry that has been built up around this issue both by the activist groups and those condoning this open borders and amnesty. It is amazing for people to behold.
ROMANS: At this point, I'm just still trying to figure out which one of these licenses I'm eligible for and which one I'm going to get, Lou.
(LAUGHTER)
DOBBS: Well, based on what they're suggesting here, I think you could probably be far-reaching and take that REAL I.D. super-duper one.
ROMANS: I think I will go for that one.
DOBBS: All right, Christine, thanks -- Christine Romans.
Well, later here, I will be joined by one of the strongest critics and opponents of the governor's original plan, New York State Senator Martin Golden. We have invited the governor's representatives, including the head of his Homeland Security Department, but they were unavailable today. Darn it.
Well, turning now to the war in Iraq, there's been a sharp reduction, we're pleased to announce, in the number of American troops being killed; 34 of our troops have been killed so far this month, but that is the lowest monthly total since March of last year. Many officials say the decline in American deaths indicates that the so- called surge strategy is working. Other top officials aren't so sure.
Jamie McIntyre has the report for us from the Pentagon.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SENIOR PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The numbers may be coming down, but many parts of Iraq remain a deadly combat zone. Just ask Army 1st Lieutenant Ryan Miller, who is recovering in Germany after his Stryker fighting vehicle took a direct hit from an armor-piercing EFP.
1ST LT. RYAN MILLER, U.S. ARMY: We were driving by and then all of a sudden, boom. And that was a EFP. And I could tell right away. And I was in the back of that truck, which was basically the closest thing you can get to hell on this earth.
MCINTYRE: These days Miller, has a lot of company at the Landstuhl Medical Center, where wounded American soldiers are first taken, including now the most senior U.S. officer injured in an IED attack, Brigadier General Jeffrey Dorko, whose Army Corps of Engineers convoy protected by private contractors was attacked Monday.
General Dorko's shrapnel wounds, like Lieutenant Miller's, are not life-threatening, but another soldier in Miller's vehicle was one of the almost three dozen U.S. deaths in Iraq this month, a dramatic drop since the peak month of the surge, when more than 125 Americans were killed.
What does it mean? Some analysts believe it has less to do with the success of the surge and more to do with de facto ethnic cleansing that has resulted from four years of sectarian killing.
KATHLEEN HICKS, INTERNATIONAL SECURITY PROGRAM SENIOR FELLOW, CENTER FOR STRATEGIC INTERNATIONAL STUDIES: So, what you're seeing is really areas that used to be ethnically divided, where the U.S. would take casualties, attempting to keep parties apart, are now completely unified in their sectarian makeup. And, so, the U.S. isn't any longer keeping parties apart. They're keeping themselves apart.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MCINTYRE: The surge was supposed to buy breathing time, Lou, as you well know, for political reconciliation, something we have not yet seen. And the real test will be in the coming months as the U.S. draws down its troops to see if the level of violence continues to be reduced -- Lou.
DOBBS: And, Jamie, a brigadier general wounded by an IED today, the highest ranking officer to be hit, to be wounded. Tell us about that.
MCINTYRE: Well, he was in a convoy that was protected by a private security firm, one indication of the overstretched U.S. troops. That security firm, however -- not Blackwater, by the way -- Erinys International, quickly evacuated both the general and a soldier from that Army Corps of Engineers convoy.
The soldier was treated and released. The general is in stable condition. He is expected to be OK as well, although at one point we were told that he briefly had a collapsed lung.
DOBBS: A brigadier general, U.S. military forces in a convoy protected by a private security contractor?
MCINTYRE: That's right. It just goes to show you how the U.S. depends on those private hired guns to provide security in order to free up U.S. troops to do other combat missions, offensive combat missions. And it is an indication of how stretched the U.S. military is.
DOBBS: An indication of how stretched. It is also an indication of how just ignorant the Pentagon leadership, the general staff is, this president, this commander in chief and the civilian leadership, that we have U.S. military being protected by private security forces, Jamie.
Well, is there any sense of shame and embarrassment in that Pentagon?
MCINTYRE: Well, don't forget that a lot of these private security contractors are former U.S. military. And by all...
DOBBS: I don't care if they're -- what they're former. They are private security forces being employed to protect men and women in uniform, who are making a heck of a lot less money than they are, to put their lives on the line in combat. This is obscene, Jamie. Is there any embarrassment in that Pentagon?
MCINTYRE: Well, there's a lot of consternation over the fact that U.S. troops are to the point where they need to use these private contractors. But, no, they don't make any apologies for it.
DOBBS: Well, then, we have a president who needs to do so and to reverse course on this policy. This is utter, complete, shameless disrespect for every tradition and value of this country.
And, frankly, in my opinion, it is an absolute disregard for the values of the men and women who have served in that very building you're reporting from. I mean, I just -- this general staff is beyond me, frankly. In my opinion, they should be absolutely embarrassed out of their minds.
(CROSSTALK)
MCINTYRE: I would just add that, by all accounts, this security firm performed exactly as they were supposed to today in evacuating the...
(CROSSTALK)
DOBBS: Please, Jamie, let me be clear. I am not in any way criticizing the private security firm. It is a British private security firm, is it not?
MCINTYRE: I believe so.
DOBBS: So, that would -- some might argue that you could even identify that as a mercenary group, since they are foreign troops, former troops that are being employed to protect U.S. troops. But I'm not going to make that argument.
All I am saying is that the United States military, its leadership, should be mortified and embarrassed and -- by such conduct. It is outrageous. And I really don't care about the quality of the British security force at all.
Jamie, thank you very much.
MCINTYRE: All right.
DOBBS: That's just absurd.
Thank you.
Coming up next here, new evidence that special interests and corporate America continue -- you're not going to believe this -- to strongly influence our lawmakers on Capitol Hill of both political parties, despite something that you may recall they wanted to refer to as ethics reform.
Lisa Sylvester will have that report for us -- Lisa.
LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Lou, lawmakers are still taking advantage of travel perks paid for by special interest groups. We will tell you how lawmakers are getting around the new rules -- Lou.
DOBBS: Lisa, don't tell us lawmakers are getting around rules. That sounds, well, just un-lawmaker-like in Washington.
(LAUGHTER)
DOBBS: We will look forward to your report, Lisa. Thank you.
Also up next, socio-ethnocentric special intensifying their campaigns to thwart the will of the people, the will of the majority, and impose amnesty for illegal aliens, and, of course, maintain open borders, never mind that little global war on terror. We will have that special report.
Rising concerns across this entire country about drug-resistant staph infections, infections now linked now to almost 20,000 deaths every year.
Stay with us. We're coming right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Many American towns, counties, states frustrated by the lack of action in Washington, D.C., are passing laws and ordinances trying to deal with a wave of illegal immigration that is creating immense problems for their communities and jurisdictions.
But the efforts are often thwarted by open border and pro-amnesty groups and socio-ethnocentric groups activist groups. As Casey Wian now reports, they are filing more and more lawsuits that are making it increasingly difficult or financially even impossible for some communities to pass effective, effective ordinances and legislation.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CASEY WIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Oklahoma's Taxpayer and Citizen Protection Act becomes law this week. Among other things, it gives state and local police broader powers to enforce immigration law, prevents illegal aliens from obtaining driver's licenses or other state benefits, and requires employers doing business with the state to verify their workers are legal residents.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The federal government's failure to enforce our nation's borders functionally imposes a tax on each and every citizen. Here in Oklahoma, that's something to the tune of more than $200 million per year in direct costs, about two to three times that amount in indirect costs. It's an enormous burden.
WIAN: But the National Coalition of Latino Clergy is suing to block the law, calling it a political cancer of racial intolerance.
Not true, says Dan Howard, a former Oklahoma patrol officer and co-founder of outragedpatriot.com.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is not about racism. It's about nationalism. It's about patriotism.
WIAN: Lawsuits by advocates of benefits for illegal aliens have succeeded in places like Hazleton, Pennsylvania, and Escondido, California. Supporters of Oklahoma's crackdown say their law was crafted to withstand court challenges. The next is scheduled Wednesday in federal court.
Meanwhile, in Florida, activist Nora Sandigo says she has become the legal guardian for 600 U.S. citizen children with parents who are illegal aliens facing deportation. She says children are suffering. And she has filed a motion with the U.S. Supreme Court seeking an immediate halt to their parents' deportation.
It states: "Twelve to 20 million people did not fall from the sky in parachutes last week or last month. It took decades for this enormous number of illegal people to enter our country. Congress and our executive administrations were aware of their presence, but they tolerated it because it was convenient."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WIAN: The motion also coins an apparently new euphemism for amnesty, to go along with comprehensive immigration reform, guest workers and a path to citizenship. Lou, it is called a deferred enforced departure program -- Lou.
DOBBS: Good lord. The tortured language, the tortured reasoning, the outright propaganda in this national debate. At least now it is a national debate.
Casey, think back to three years ago, when we really began focusing almost nightly on this issue. There was so little public understanding of this issue. We have come a long ways over the course of the past three or four years.
WIAN: We certainly have. And people were talking about paths to citizenship, so-called comprehensive immigration reform as if it was a done deal. In fact, this motion with the Supreme Court that this one group has filed still concedes or makes the argument that comprehensive immigration reform, some form of amnesty, is going to pass.
That's one reason that they cite for the Supreme Court stepping in and taking action in favor of these illegal alien parents. Some people, I guess...
DOBBS: And at what point you do you suppose, Casey, in this country -- and I'm asking this, I think -- well, I will throw it out there and you can either decide it's rhetorical or respond.
There seems something bizarre when we have something called the Latino Clergy, we have all of these socio-ethnocentric groups who are focusing on issues and interests that are in, in their judgment, racial. If we were to see that kind of conduct across the broad white population of this country, there would be utter disgust.
This is a country in which we have come together. You know, every statistic I have seen, every survey shows just about half, half of the ethnic and racial groups who are involved on this issue oppose illegal immigration and they support border security.
And, yet, these groups, because they have the pandering of these political parties, act as if they're speaking for entire racial groups, entire ethnic groups in this country. It is, to me, just so, it's anathema to everything this country stands for.
WIAN: Hopefully, the voices of those who favor enforcement of our immigration laws who are Latinos and other ethnicities will make their voices heard as loud as the open borders crowd has.
DOBBS: Yes. And, well, let's make sure that -- you know, it's all ethnicities and races, including -- it's across the board.
I would just like to see a day in which we are as jealous of one another's rights in this country as we are simply of our own, and hopefully we can get to that ideal rather soon in this country.
Thank you very much, Casey Wian.
WIAN: OK.
DOBBS: Time now for some of your thoughts.
Terry in Tennessee wrote in to say: "Since illegal immigrant rights advocates and the ACLU are so opposed to the revised New York driver's license plan, Governor Spitzer has obviously and finally made a good decision. Way to go, Lou Dobbs."
Well, I don't want to take credit for anything that has transpired to this point. Let's see how it all works out. If it makes sense in the end, then I will, of course, be glad to jump on the bandwagon and take some credit.
But I think what's really important is that for everyone to understand, New Yorkers are making their voices heard here. They're talking to their state senators and state assembly men and women, and letting this governor know that their prerogatives, their rights as citizens are not something that one arrogant governor is just going to give away with an imperious edict.
And that is heartwarming to see. Now, if we could see it nationwide, and particularly in Washington, D.C.
Denis in California: "You're right. Spitzer is an idiot. You got it right the first time. God bless and hang in there now."
Well, now, I appreciate that, but I did apologize for calling him an idiot. He is the other things that I have called him, but he's not an idiot. And I was idiotic to call him an idiot.
Jim in New York: "Your criticism of Governor Eliot Spitzer on the granting of driver's licenses to illegal aliens is 1000 percent correct. Keep giving him hell."
We will guarantee you that we will continue to try to put the reality and the truth before our audience here every night.
We will have more of your thoughts coming up here later. Each of you whose e-mail is read here will receive a copy of Jack Cafferty's new book, "It's Getting Ugly Out There."
Now tonight's poll: Do you believe states giving away driver's licenses to illegal aliens is simply an attempt to expedite massive voter fraud in this country nationwide? Yes, no? Cast your vote at loudobbs.com. We will have the results here later in the broadcast.
Up next, the Democratically-controlled Congress promised they would give up travel paid for by those lobbyists. You know, they only spend $2 billion a year in our nation's capital trying to influence the outcome of legislation and legislators. It's another promise not quite kept. We will be telling you about that.
Hospitals and schools around this country right now are on the alert for the drug-resistant killer superbug. We will have the latest for you.
Stay with us. We're coming right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Well, ethics reform, the Democrats took control of the House and the Senate last year making that a centerpiece of their efforts, Democrats promising to stop special interest groups, lobbyists from offering lawmakers those expensive trips and gifts.
But some lawmakers have found new and innovative ways to work around their own rules, as Lisa Sylvester now reports on the best government money can still buy.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SYLVESTER (voice-over): In March, 10 GOP lawmakers escaped from Washington and spent a long weekend in sunny Palm Beach, Florida, at the Ritz-Carlton, many with their spouses. They didn't pay for their nearly $500-a-night rooms or their meals. The tab was picked up by the Club For Growth, a think tank that supports tax cuts.
After the Jack Abramoff lobbying scandal, Congress passed ethics legislation to make it harder for lobbyists to schmooze lawmakers on expensive junkets. But records show the perks still keep on coming from other sources.
According to "CQ MoneyLine," which tracks congressional travel, privately funded trips by lawmakers in the first eight months of this year topped $1.9 million. That's up from last year, where the total for all of last year was $1.7 million.
MARY BOYLE, COMMON CAUSE: We have certainly seen a new sport in Washington this fall, which seems to have been find your way around the new ethics and lobby reform laws. And we have seen lobbyists doing it. We see members of Congress doing it.
SYLVESTER: The new rules ban lobbyists and their firms from paying for a lawmaker's trip, but it does not prohibit nonprofits or 501(c)s from covering the costs. And the Ethics Committee must pre- approve trips, but public watchdog groups want to make sure the committee itself is following ethical guidelines.
MEREDITH MCGEHEE, CAMPAIGN LEGAL CENTER: Right now, we have a dysfunctional ethics process. So, one of the issues that's still in play in Congress is whether or not the Ethics Committee, that is in charge of approving these trips, is, in fact, applying these standards in a way that both is a commonsense standard, but also takes into account the appearance of conflicts or the appearance that these trips are really just luxury vacations.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SYLVESTER: Now, the Club For Growth tells CNN that the congressmen invited to their winter conference spent most of their time in the hotel conference rooms, talking about issues like cutting taxes and reducing government spending, the think tank adding -- quote -- "Most Americans would agree that we need to have more of these kinds of discussions, instead of the political blather that normally comes out of Washington" -- end quote.
But considering these the serious that took place in sunny Florida, including on a nice four-hour long cruise on a 17-foot yacht, it was, all in all, not a bad free weekend trip -- Lou. DOBBS: Well, I mean -- so the Club for Economic Growth, which is a Republican conservative group, and the Democrats who promised all of this reform, they -- I suppose that if you're sitting on a fancy yacht for four hours, you can do some really deep thinking. My gosh, the fact that they even have the temerity to continue to rationalize this. This has become -- I mean it's almost Orwellian what is passing for communication in this country. They won't talk straight. They won't even admit a passing resemblance to the reality of the situation.
SYLVESTER: And, Lou, you...
DOBBS: Unbelievable.
SYLVESTER: ...know what they're doing, is they are just finding workarounds. And the new workaround is find a non-profit, find a 501C3 and essentially get them to pay for the trip, but the game still continues -- Lou.
DOBBS: You know, and, unfortunately, you're right, it is a game. But the impact -- the consequences are anything but a game. We have all of these special interests, corporate America dominating the legislative and electoral process, as I've said. And it's a game that the voters in this country need to shut down, for both Democrats and Republicans.
A good way, as you know, Lisa, if I may, recommend it, is go out and register Independent as quickly as you can. You'll miss the fun of the primaries in some states, but believe me, the impact on those two wings of the same bird that we call political parties in this country would be worth it.
Thank you very much, Lisa Sylvester.
Democrats also promising those short work weeks, you remember, when they took control of the Congress?
Well, now, the House leadership says the 110th Congress won't be in session on Fridays when it begins its second year. Congress will only work Fridays next year in June, when it takes up appropriation bills.
House majority leader, Congressman Steny Hoyer, says that he wants House members now to spend more time in their districts and more time with their family. Oh, my gosh. I think a lot of voters would like them to spend more time with their families, as well, if not with their districts.
Coming up next, more on the confusion and outrage over Governor Eliot Spitzer's new, revised, even better plan to give away illegal alien driver's licenses. A leading opponent of the governor's original plan is New York State Senator Martin Golden. He is among our guests here tonight.
Also, health officials now concerned and warning schools across the country about the dangers of drug-resistant staph infections. We'll have the latest for you. And rising concerns about Iran's efforts to kill American troops in Iraq and about Iran's nuclear weapons program. One of the world's leading authorities on the Mideast, Professor Fouad Ajami, joins us here.
Stay with us.
We're coming right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: New calls tonight for a national database -- a national registry to keep track of the cases of the drug-resistant staph bacteria. The CDC says more than 90,000 people could be infected this year with the so-called super bug. Health care experts say it may be time for hospitals, and particularly public schools, to start taking drug-resistant staph infections far more seriously.
And as Jim Acosta now reports, concern is rising after the recent death of a 12-year-old boy in New York City.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
JIM ACOSTA, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Two days before Omar Rivera apparently died from the super bug MRSA, the 12- year-old was rushed to the emergency room at this city hospital in New York. But according to the family's lawyer, the hospital mistakenly diagnosed Omar as having an allergic reaction and sent him home with Benadryl. The hospital confirms it treated Omar for non-MRSA related symptoms and is investigating what more could have been done to detect the infection.
PAUL WEITZ, RIVERA ATTORNEY: They should have admitted Omar. And I think had they admitted him, there is a very real possibility that he'd be alive today.
DR. FRANK LOWY, COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY: And you can see that in the lab.
ACOSTA: Columbia University researcher Dr. Frank Lowy cautions it's time for East Coast hospitals to be on the look out for the penicillin-resistant staph infection. Lowy says cases of the bacteria started showing up in larger numbers out West and then slowly moved to the Northeast.
LOWY: Health care personnel may not have been as familiar as people in other areas of the country that these strains were now becoming more prevalent.
ACOSTA: With the super bug spreading, there are calls on the government to start doing a better job of tracking MRSA's movement on a national level.
SEN. CHARLES SCHUMER (D), NEW YORK: As long as our hospitals, labs don't have to report the incidents of the illness, we'll never know where the next case could pop up and whether we have it fully under control.
ACOSTA: And there are no national standards for schools to notify parents when the bacteria shows up in students. Parents at Omar Rivera's school in New York didn't know about the seventh grader's case until 11 days after he died.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Parents need to be informed right away and let them use their own judgments.
ACOSTA: Contrast that with Pikeville, Kentucky, where officials shut down the entire district of 23 schools after a non-fatal case of MRSA surfaced there.
Dr. Lowy says notifying parents is a good first step.
LOWY: I do think it probably is worthwhile, if there are cases within a school system or a day care facility, that some sort of advisory be sent out to parents and other people so that precautions can be appropriately instituted.
ACOSTA: Precautions as simple as hand washing and bandages can stop the super bug.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
ACOSTA: As for Omar Rivera, his mother's attorney says it's pretty clear to him he's got a good case of medical negligence to try in court. And the mother of this young boy will be in his lawyer's -- or in her lawyer's office tomorrow to talk about that case that could be coming down the pike -- Lou.
DOBBS: Yes. You know, and this is a tragedy, without question. The hospital, for its part, in responding to those, has it responded at all to the criticism from the attorney?
ACOSTA: Only that they did treat him for non-MRSA related symptoms, even though the lawyer says he showed up at the hospital with visible skin lesions.
DOBBS: Yes. This is so tough, because we've got a public health system so challenged in nearly every quarter. The CDC -- we have not seen the public health system and the leadership of that public health system take action on MRSA. It started to discuss this. But we have to talk about Congress talking about a database instead of our public health officials is a shame. And hopefully that is going to change quickly.
The idea that staph is worsening, it's pretty clear that that's what's happening here.
ACOSTA: That is what's happening. And it's pretty clear to experts who have looked at this that it is -- it is evolving into a larger problem. It used to only be in hospitals and health care settings. Now we're seeing it in schools, locker rooms, that sort of thing. And unless they get on top of it, they're just going to continue to see this popping up in new places. DOBBS: And as you reported, I mean it's so critically important to let parents know what is happening, which is, I know, in the mind of some educational bureaucrats, that they have superior powers to those of parents. But the fact is that parents are the caregivers and should be informed immediately.
ACOSTA: Yes.
If they don't know how can they do something about it?
DOBBS: It's incredible...
ACOSTA: Yes.
DOBBS: ...that there should even be a question about it. But this, of course, the 21st century in America. Jim, thank you very much. Jim Acosta.
Well, up next, New York's governor has a new proposal to give away driver's licenses to illegal aliens. It's being met with some pretty heavy criticism. One of the first opponents of the original plan joins me here next. We'll hear what he thinks.
And all talk, no action -- will U.S. sanctions on Iran really stop that country's officials from pursuing nuclear weapon ambitions?
I'll be talking with one of the world's leading authorities on the Middle East here next.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Over the weekend, New York's governor, Eliot Spitzer, dumped his original proposal to give away driver's license to illegal aliens and replaced it with a somewhat more sophisticated new plan -- one that still gives away driver's licenses to illegal aliens, however. One of the first opponents of the governor's proposal, Republican New York State Senator Marty Golden, who joins us here tonight.
Thanks for being here.
MARTIN GOLDEN (R), NEW YORK STATE SENATE: Thank you, Lou.
DOBBS: Your reaction to the governor's new proposal.
GOLDEN: Well, I'm a little shocked that the -- Michael Chertoff, the head of the Department of Homeland Security, went along with this charade. But I guess it meets the Real I.D. Act. And it makes the parameters of the Real I.D. Act, especially on the first two licenses, license one and license two, the enhanced license and the second license, which you and I would have. But the third tier license, which gives it to illegal immigrants, doesn't pass the smell test.
DOBBS: Well, let's put up what Michael Chertoff did say over the weekend, just to be clear, Michael Chertoff, the homeland security secretary said: "I don't endorse giving licenses to people who are not here legally, but federal law does allow states to make that choice. What we can do is insist that licenses that do not meet federal requirements be clearly so labeled."
Now, the governor's office today actually told us that federal law mandates that they give illegal aliens a driver's license.
Your position, your view?
GOLDEN: I think the -- I have to read that. I don't believe that that's true. I believe what happens
DOBBS: Well, if it is true, that means that 40 some odd states are going to have to give illegal aliens driver's licenses. And I don't think there's an appetite in the country for that.
GOLDEN: Well, a lot of states did this. They went that direction and they changed. And they came back and said you know what, what happened on 9/11...
DOBBS: Right.
GOLDEN: ...we've seen. We don't want to see that terrorism again. And they came back and did what's right.
Now look at the State of Tennessee, the state of North Carolina. They had the same program.
You know what they did?
They rescinded it. Four hundred to five hundred thousand people showed up in North Carolina for licenses.
How many do you think will show up in the State of New York?
DOBBS: Joe Bruno, the state senate majority leader, had this to say. He's still opposed to the plan, saying: "Governor Spitzer is still not listening to the millions of New Yorkers and their elected representatives from both sides of the aisle, who wanted to pull the plug on his ill-advised plan, not just make some changes."
You were the first to announce that you had introduced legislation against the Spitzer plan.
What do you think?
GOLDEN: Well, we passed that legislation in the state senate this past Monday. And Frank Padavan was the sponsor. And the rest of us -- all 32 of us were on that legislation. The assembly failed -- I think with a vote of 57 to 85 -- failed to pass this bill. They went into a motion that did denied allowing the bill to the floor.
DOBBS: But a sizeable number of Democrats joined with the Republicans in that vote.
GOLDEN: We had eight in the Senate.
DOBBS: And the fact of the matter is, the senator is going to -- the senator. This governor is proceeding apace.
I -- is it your understanding that if this deal were -- if this proposal were to go through, that illegal aliens would be able to have a driver's license that would permit -- that would identify them so that they could -- and this is, frankly, one of my greatest concerns -- permit them to go into county clerk and go into the Board of Elections and get a -- register to vote?
GOLDEN: This is correct.
And you know what?
We, as a state, we check the Social Security number to see if you voted twice.
DOBBS: Right.
GOLDEN: We do not check to see if you are a citizen of this nation. We do not check to see if -- the Department of Homeland Security to see if that license is...
DOBBS: So why is it that...
GOLDEN: ...(INAUDIBLE).
DOBBS: ...the New York State legislature is setting new -- is setting standards for registration and verifying residency and citizenship to vote?
Because this isn't, as the saying goes, a1905. I mean we have serious issues.
GOLDEN: Well, we wouldn't get it past any assembly. And the governor would make sure that it didn't get past any assembly. But other than that, it's the rule of law today. It was passed in a VTL (ph) in 1995. So he cannot do this by fiat.
DOBBS: Right.
GOLDEN: He has to come back to the legislative body to get its approval. And if he moves down that path, we're going to take him to court. We're going to take him to court and to say he has to uphold the rule of law for the people of the State of New York. He's not going to get away with this.
DOBBS: The people are...
GOLDEN: Yes.
DOBBS: That would be including the citizens of the State of New York?
GOLDEN: That's exactly right. DOBBS: Thank you very much, Senator.
Good to have you with us.
GOLDEN: Thank you, sir.
DOBBS: A reminder now to vote in our poll -- do you believe giving away driver's licenses to illegal aliens is simply an attempt to expedite massive voter fraud on what is now a national scale -- yes or no?
Cast your vote at loudobbs.com.
We'll have the results here in just a few moments.
Up next, one of the world's leading and Middle East experts, Professor Fouad Ajami, joins us.
And we'll be right back.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Record high crude oil prices today, rising above $93 a barrel, creating turmoil in the markets and great anxiety across most of the world's Western industrialized nations. And those high prices also may be helping Iran withstand new U.S. economic sanctions.
Also helping Iran at this moment -- its rising trade relationship with Communist China.
Joining me now, one of the world's leading authorities on the Middle East, professor of Middle East Studies at Johns Hopkins University, author of the very important book, "The Foreigner's Gift."
Good to have you with us.
FOUAD AJAMI, AUTHOR, "THE FOREIGNER'S GIFT": Thank you very much, Lou.
DOBBS: Let's start with the sanctions.
AJAMI: Sure.
DOBBS: We've had some sanctions in place for a very long time against Iran.
Are you hopeful these will have impact?
AJAMI: We've had sanctions against Iran, like you said, for 20 years now. These sanctions have been in place. And the behavior of the Iranian regime has not changed. And you said it at the top. When you have $93 a barrel of oil, here is the second most important producer, Iran, in the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries. They have lots of money. They have lots of running room. They have lots of customers for their oil. And I don't think these sanctions will bite.
One thing about these sanctions, Lou -- and that's the fundamental question -- are they a prelude to war or are they a substitute for war?
That's really the question of the hour.
DOBBS: You are...
AJAMI: And...
DOBBS: ...you are possessed of the greatest insight I know in the Middle East.
AJAMI: Thank you.
DOBBS: Which is it?
AJAMI: I think they are a substitute for war. This is the way that the Bush administration...
DOBBS: May you be right.
AJAMI: May I be right. And I think we'll see. You know, you've -- I've been a repeated visitor to your show. I have come back and...
DOBBS: I hope you always will.
AJAMI: ...well, I think -- I think they are a substitute for war. I think the Bush administration doesn't have the political cover. It doesn't have the time. It doesn't have the consensus at home and the consensus abroad for a war against Iran.
One thing that Admiral Michael Mullen, our chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said is that we are already at war in two Muslim countries, meaning Iraq and Afghanistan.
DOBBS: Yes.
AJAMI: We can't add a third.
DOBBS: A remarkable word of caution coming from the chairman of the Joint Chiefs. Some people thinking going, perhaps, too, far, but, nonetheless, offering an assessment that most people, at least, believe to be candid and honest.
President Bush said the world needs to stop Iran.
AJAMI: Yes.
DOBBS: Let's listen to what the head of the I -- the International Atomic Energy Agency, Dr. Mohamed ElBaradei, had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FROM "LATE EDITION"/SUNDAY)
MOHAMED ELBARADEI, IAEA DIRECTOR GENERAL: There's clearly a question of distrust between Iran and most of the international community -- at least the West, the U.S. in particular. And to build confidence -- you will not be able to do that through just exchanging rhetoric. You need to go and create the conditions to go to the negotiating table.
My fear, that if we continue to escalate from both sides, that we will end up into oppressiveness. We will end up into an abyss.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DOBBS: You were talking about a substitute for war. And, obviously, ElBaradei is thinking back to 2003...
AJAMI: Yes.
DOBBS: ...in which there was an overstatement on the part of this government.
AJAMI: Yes.
DOBBS: Your thoughts.
AJAMI: If you liked Boutros Boutros-Ghali of the United Nations before and Kofi Annan, you'll love Mohamed ElBaradei. This is a congenital anti-American man. And he was -- he still has his job because, at the end, at the crucial moment, the Bush administration blinked. They want him out of there.
This man has not been terribly reliable. This man hasn't really read Iran very well. So I wouldn't want to use him as a witness.
DOBBS: But he read Iraq very well and he declared there were no weapons of mass destruction. Indeed, for whatever reason you may argue, he was proved -- or not proved -- wrong, but, others would argue proved right.
AJAMI: Yes. I grant you this -- because, in fact, you're right. I mean that's why the ghost of Iraq stalks this encounter with Iran and the Iranians. I mean let's look at the basics. This Iranian revolution is now three decades old, practically. And it's always managed to go to the brink and then step back. We're not ready to take them on. We're not ready to fight them. And I think this is the question -- the -- Iran's nuclear ambitions and Iran's power are a question for the next president and the next administration.
DOBBS: You think we have that long, at least?
AJAMI: We have that long. I think -- I think that...
DOBBS: What is not clear how long we have on the issue of Turkey and the Kurds. And with 60,000 troops massed on that border, with bombing already taking place in Northern Iraq, so the Turkish aircraft -- what is the prospect?
AJAMI: I'm not a big fan of the Turkish position. And I was with you a while ago and we went into that. I think the problem of Turkey with the Kurds is not in Iraqi Kurdistan. It's not in Northern Iraq. The problem is in Turkey itself. The problem is for Turkish nationalism to accept Kurdish nationalism and to accept a kind of multi-ethnic society within Turkey.
DOBBS: Just a little (INAUDIBLE) to do for a nation...
AJAMI: And it -- that's right.
DOBBS: ...that is no longer easily described as led by a secular government.
AJAMI: Very -- it's very difficult. The Turks have -- both under secular governments and under this new Islam government -- they have a problem accepting the multiplicity of Turkey. And they have a problem understanding that it's not about Iraqi Kurdistan, it's about Turkey itself.
DOBBS: Professor Fouad Ajami, thank you for being here.
AJAMI: Thank you very much, Lou.
DOBBS: Up next, in just a few minutes "THE SITUATION ROOM" with Wolf Blitzer -- Wolf.
WOLF BLITZER, HOST, "THE SITUATION ROOM": Thanks, Lou.
Secret conversations with former President Gerald Ford. Now a reporter is telling all. He shares what the former president said about Bill Clinton's sex life and why Gerald Ford thought Dick Cheney should have been dumped as a vice presidential candidate.
An Al Qaeda mastermind behind that bombing that killed 17 American sailors might be free right now. Tonight, an exclusive interview with an agent who interrogated him and why the U.S. government and so many other people are furious.
The price of oil breaks another record and we haven't felt the worst worse of it at the gas pumps yet. Experts say it's coming and it could really be bad news for the economy.
All that and a lot more, Lou, coming up in "THE SITUATION ROOM."
DOBBS: Wolf, thank you.
Still ahead here, we'll have the results of tonight's poll and more.
Stay with us.
We're coming right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: The results of our poll tonight -- 96 percent of you say states giving away driver's license to illegal aliens is simply an effort to expedite massive voter fraud across the nation. We thank you for being with us tonight.
Please join us here tomorrow.
And on November 5th, one week from tonight, this broadcast will begin at a new time, 7:00 p.m. Eastern.
We hope you will join us.
For all of us here, thanks for watching.
Good night from New York.
"THE SITUATION ROOM" begins now with Wolf Blitzer -- Wolf.
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