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Lou Dobbs Tonight
Obama's Running Mate?; Best Government Money can buy; Student Credit Card Debt Rising; Electronic Voting System a Joke
Aired August 22, 2008 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LOU DOBBS, CNN ANCHOR: Wolf, thank you.
Tonight, is Senator Obama playing the national media? Is he on the brink of revealing his running mate? It could all happen within the hour. We'll have complete coverage.
And tonight the threat to our democracy from e-voting machines that don't leave a paper trail and often don't work. Those e-voting machines are so unreliable, they've become a punch line in a national television commercial.
And tonight the amnesty open borders lobby is furious with a hospital in Chicago that all -- all that hospital did was save the life of an illegal alien from Mexico at tremendous financial expense and what is the reaction? The national executive of LULAC, one of the most powerful pro amnesty groups will be here to tell us why he didn't say thank you; all of that, all the day's news, and much more from an independent perspective straight ahead here tonight.
ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT: news, debate, and opinion for Friday, August 22nd. Live from New York, Lou Dobbs.
DOBBS: Good evening, everybody. Senator Obama tonight is apparently preparing to announce his running mate. We've been expecting that announcement throughout the afternoon. It could come, we're told, at any time. And, of course, we'll bring it to you as soon as it happens.
Senator Obama is hoping his vice presidential choice and the Democratic National Convention next week will combine to give him a lift in the polls, which are deadlocked. Most polls show Obama in a statistical dead heat with Senator McCain, despite Senator Obama having massive support from the liberal national media.
We have extensive coverage from an independent point of view tonight. We begin with our Bill Schneider on Obama's potential running mates.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Hello, Chesapeake.
WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST (voice-over): Barack Obama could choose a running mate who re-enforces his message of change. OBAMA: We are going to fundamentally bring about change in America.
SCHNEIDER: How about a Washington outsider like Kansas Governor Kathleen Sebelius (ph), women are often seen as political outsiders.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The finest of the fine...
SCHNEIDER: Or Virginia Governor Tim Kaine (ph).
OBAMA: Tim Kaine (ph) got in this thing for the right reasons.
SCHNEIDER: On the other hand, Obama's limited experience seems to be a weakness.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What process would you use to pull in the experience that you would need?
SCHNEIDER: He could go for Senator Hillary Clinton who has been in Washington since 1992. Or Evan Bayh, two term governor of Indiana, two term senator.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Staff member...
SCHNEIDER: Joe Biden's been in the Senate for 36 years. How's that for experience?
OBAMA: I've joined with people like Joe Biden to increase $1 billion of investment.
SCHNEIDER: Is it possible for Obama to do both? Re-enforce his message of change and reassure voters he has people around him with experience?
OBAMA: The key to bringing about change in Washington is going to be to get some good people in there, get a good president, get a good senator, get good congressmen in there.
SCHNEIDER: Chet Edwards has been in Congress for 18 years. He's a moderate Democrat who sometimes supports President Bush and sometimes opposes him.
REP. CHET EDWARDS (D), TEXAS: We have had a lot of disagreements on how to end the Iraq war. And on the budget plan of the administration.
SCHNEIDER: After all, he's President Bush's congressman.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCHNEIDER: Obama talks a lot about bipartisanship and ending the partisan gridlock in Washington. Now, that would really be change -- Lou.
DOBBS: Well, what about Hillary? What happened to Senator Clinton? SCHNEIDER: She's in there. She was in there. She'd be a person with a lot of experience. She's been in Washington since 1992.
DOBBS: But they didn't vet her.
(CROSSTALK)
DOBBS: They didn't vet her, Bill, what's going on?
SCHNEIDER: Well, well the calculation is did she need to be vetted? She's probably one of the most vetted people in American politics going back for many years, so they might not have felt they needed to.
DOBBS: So, what do you think? Who is it going to be?
SCHNEIDER: I have no idea. I can predict how 100 million people are going to vote, I cannot predict how one person is going to make up his or her mind.
DOBBS: All right, how about 100 million people...
(CROSSTALK)
DOBBS: How are they going to vote? Bill, thanks a lot.
SCHNEIDER: Very tight.
DOBBS: Very tight. All right. Bill Schneider, thanks a lot.
Senator Obama tomorrow will introduce his running mate whomever he or she may be at a rally to be held in Springfield, Illinois, the same place Senator Obama launched his primary campaign a year and a half ago. Jessica Yellin tonight is in Springfield, Illinois, preparing for what is likely to be a theatrical moment tomorrow.
Jessica, why such a long way for Obama to reveal his choice of vice presidential candidate to join him on the ticket?
JESSICA YELLIN, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Lou, the timing of this does seem a bit odd, at least the protracted waiting game we've all been going through is a bit unusual. But it affords the campaign two main advantages.
One is it allows the campaign in theory at least to build some momentum when they announce the VP either later tonight or more likely tomorrow. And then right up straight into the convention. Had they announced earlier in the week, the sense is they could have lost some of the energy by the time we got to the convention and they wouldn't have had as big a bounce. That's one theory.
The other approach that I've heard about from the Obama campaign is that in a sense this really helps them control the media's coverage of this vice presidential pick. Let's say this is a person who has some pluses, but also some serious minuses. And this minimizes the amount of time the media has to let's say rerun gaffes this person has made on tape or instances when the candidate has disagreed with Barack Obama.
Instead, there'll be a big event here tomorrow and just a day to the convention so they can hopefully, in their view, control the coverage to some extent. But I have to say it is unusual, Lou, because the thinking in D.C. has traditionally been on Friday nights and Saturdays, that's when you release bad news hoping you can bury it and get it hidden.
DOBBS: Right.
YELLIN: I guess the Obama campaign would say that's the old politics -- Lou.
DOBBS: It's old politics, but it's old politics for a reason. And by the way, the same thinking applies on Wall Street and in corporate America, so perhaps Senator Obama will again give instruction to the nation.
YELLIN: Well, the thinking -- and yes, I've actually seen studies, Lou that say corporate America releases bad economic data on a Friday night hoping it won't hurt the company. And then in time it actually catches up with them, so I think this is a media obsession right now. We all want to know right now, but it doesn't really matter in the end. It will -- to the voters. What really matters is who he picks and how that plays out over time.
DOBBS: And I'll make you another bet, too, Jessica.
YELLIN: Yeah.
DOBBS: No matter the thinking about how long it takes us to find the critical comments that the vice presidential nominee has uttered about Senator Obama or the gaffes he or she has uttered over the course of time, this may -- this might buy maybe three hours extra time, in which there wouldn't be a media frenzy around the mistakes and the past controversy. But on the fourth hour, I guarantee we'll be all over it.
YELLIN: I think you're right. Although we'll get distracted with the convention on Monday.
DOBBS: Not all of us.
YELLIN: A little?
(LAUGHTER)
DOBBS: Not all of us.
YELLIN: OK, not you, Lou.
DOBBS: All right.
YELLIN: I believe it.
DOBBS: Jessica, thanks a lot. Jessica Yellin. There's rising speculation tonight about Senator McCain's possible choice of vice presidential candidate. McCain is expected to announce his running mate next Friday, one week from tonight. His advisors today told us at CNN that McCain has not made a final decision on who that person will be.
In fact, they said reports that McCain has already decided to select former Governor Mitt Romney are simply untrue. Well while Senators McCain and Obama stayed out of sight today, their campaigns continued to blast each other on the candidates' homes, the number of houses they have, how much the homes cost, how much the candidates make.
Both candidates using television attack ads, trying to portray one another as elitist, out of touch with working men and women and their families. Could it be that both of them are right? The presidential campaign is simply turning nastier, the candidates spending even less time talking about important issues and more time with attack ads.
Lobbyists, the special interest groups, unions, corporate America all sparing no expense to influence the Democratic and Republican National Conventions. These groups organizing hundreds of lavish parties for the delegates. Another example of a political system that is literally for sale to the highest bidder. Another indication that all that talk of change and reform by these two candidates may be nothing more than empty rhetoric. Louise Schiavone has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(MUSIC)
LOUISE SCHIAVONE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In politics as in real estate the key at convention time is location, location, location. And big interest with the money to buy it has secured prime convention real estate in Denver and St. Paul.
CRAIG HOLMAN, PUBLIC CITIZEN: We're now seeing about 173 corporations buying access to the convention for prices ranging from as low as $50,000 to as high as $5 million.
SCHIAVONE: The non partisan Public Citizen reports exclusive convention entree is paved by lavish donations to the host committees, a term of art that specifies donations are made to the civic pride of the cities of Denver and St. Paul not to the political parties per se.
For example, the Democratic National Committee corporate sponsorship plan establishes several sponsorship levels. At the top, presidential sponsors who haven't donated at least $1 million secure VIP convention access. Xcel Energy (ph) is contributing a million in cash. Public Citizen reports other well-heeled (ph) donors include Qwest, Level 3 Communications, Molson-Coors, and Union Pacific. Gold sponsors who have given $250,000 to the Denver host committee include Comcast, Conoco-Phillips, Eli-Lilly and Staples.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And most of these corporations, especially the corporations will be funding both conventions. They're not -- they try not to be obviously partisan. I think mostly because they're not sure who is going to win yet.
SCHIAVONE: When the GOP anoints John McCain as its standard bearer, Xcel Energy, Comcast, Eli Lily, and Qwest will be there too with major donations. This McCain delegate who as a lawyer represents several convention donors insists that corporate donations have little or no impact.
CRAIG ENGLE, PARTNER, ARENT FOX: They're called political party conventions for a reason. They really are giant parties where not a whole lot of business gets done.
SCHIAVONE: Ethics rules about entertaining members of Congress will keep the food and drink service in corporate suites to a minimum.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCHIAVONE: Public Citizen says government watchdog groups will be scouting the nearly 400 parties scheduled for the two conventions to see who is actually walking into them. But these watchdog groups don't expect to get into a lot of those parties -- Lou.
DOBBS: Well, maybe there should be a shareholder lawsuit then for the companies funding these conventions and contributing to them if as the gentleman says there's no business being taken care of. What in the world is corporate America doing?
SCHIAVONE: It's a great...
DOBBS: Or maybe that guy is just a little wrong, what do you think?
SCHIAVONE: It's a great investment for these companies to be there. Qwest, for instance, is contributing $6 million to each convention in communications and data services. It's a huge presence, 170 of the corporations who are funding these conventions have business before Congress.
DOBBS: Qwest, of course, out there in Denver, part of the landscape for the home team, if you will there...
SCHIAVONE: That's right.
DOBBS: ... in Denver, Colorado. Louise, thank you very much, appreciate it.
Well the influence obviously, well is being peddled everywhere. An astounding number of lobbyists, in fact, worked to influence the decisions made by federal agencies, officials, lawmakers, our elected officials. In fact, there are more than 41,000 registered lobbyists that work in Washington, D.C.
That works out as we've reported to you on a number of occasions to 77 lobbyists for each member of Congress. And business special interest in this country spent almost $3 billion last year to influence the decision makers of lawmakers. The biggest spender when it comes to buying influence from Washington is, of course, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce.
It's very difficult, of course, as a result for the middle class to find representation when so much money is being spent by so many special interests to crowd out true representation of the American people.
Up next, e-voting machines have become a national joke. Even the Maytag man is now poking fun. We'll have that special report.
And a new challenge to San Francisco's outrageous sanctuary policy for illegal aliens. A policy that has been blamed for the cold-blooded murder of a father and two sons. That story is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: The city of San Francisco could soon have to pay for the consequences of its sanctuary policy. A policy that tragically cost a father and his two sons their lives. The victim's family today filing a wrongful death suit against the city. The killings in June sparked national outrage.
Anthony Bologna (ph) and his son Michael and Matthew were allegedly shot and killed by an illegal alien who had been twice shielded from federal authorities and released under San Francisco's juvenile illegal alien sanctuary policy. The family's attorney says the city is clearly to blame. Saying the crimes would not have been committed had the suspect been turned over to Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KRIS KOBACH, BOLOGNA FAMILY ATTY.: The city's negligence in this case is extraordinary. You can't prevent your police officers from talking to ICE. The city was also committing over federal law violations. It's a crime to harbor an illegal alien. It's a crime to transport an illegal alien, and it's a crime to encourage that illegal alien to remain in the United States. The city of San Francisco was guilty of all three of those crimes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DOBBS: Well the family wants the city of San Francisco to take responsibility. And it wants the city to compensate them for the tragic loss of their loved ones. San Francisco has 45 days to respond. Attorney Kobach says if the city does not, a lawsuit is the next step.
Today marks the final day of Immigration and Customs Enforcement Self-Deportation program. The so-called schedule departure voluntary program allowed illegal aliens to turn themselves in to immigration authorities for voluntary deportation. The final official count of people who turned themselves in -- now this is the final number -- it's eight. Tonight being the last -- the last -- the end of the program. A spokesman for ICE today said they would scrap the program. Jim Hayes (ph), the acting director of ICE's Detention and Removal Operation said the failure of this scheduled departure program quote "proves the only method that works is enforcement". And Jim Hayes (ph), we can hear more good sense and straightforward talk from more agency officials like him.
In our poll tonight, do you believe ethnocentric special interest groups such as LULAC and La Raza are responsible for a delusional sense of entitlement among illegal aliens in this country? Cast your vote at loudobbs.com. We'll have the results here later.
On a programming note, I'll be talking with Brent Wilkes (ph), the executive director of LULAC later here in the broadcast.
American consumers struggling through the financial turmoil tonight face another threat from credit card companies. The companies going after our college students now often with the help of the schools and universities. As Lisa Sylvester reports, many of those institutions are selling private student information for profit.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Andrew Kunka is a student at Rutgers Law School in Newark. His credit card debt tops $5,000, books, tuition, other expenses. He's now maxed out his credit card. And the credit card offers still keep coming.
ANDREW KUNKA, STUDENT: I think it's very easy. In fact, I think it's too easy. Because I think what happens is so many students they take these credit cards and they expect only to be using them, you know, for minimal things that they have to get, but what happens is tuition payments come up, living expenses come up.
SYLVESTER: Credit card companies market aggressively to students trying to reel in new customers, offering freebies, lunches, t-shirts and other goodies.
ED MIERZWINSKI, U.S. PUBLIC INT. RESEARCH GRP.: There's a difference between college students and other adults. College students often don't have a job, often don't have any items on their credit report to give them a credit score. Yet they're given credit cards anyway.
SYLVESTER: And the colleges are cashing in as student credit card debt is piling up. The New York attorney general's office is investigating how universities and alumni associations profit by selling students' sensitive information to the credit card companies.
BENJAMIN LAWSKY, SPECIAL ASSISTANT TO U.S. ATTY. GEN.: The universities get paid millions and millions of dollars by the credit card companies to basically give exclusive access to that company to the students. And they -- what the universities will often do is they'll actually sell the students' personal information to the credit card companies in exchange for these millions of dollars. SYLVESTER: University of Iowa officials confirmed it receives $200,000 every year from the Bank of America for a credit card that's marketed to alumni and undergrad students. No suggestion of illegality, but the Alumni Association stopped sharing its student roster with marketers last November after negative publicity. But the credit card company can still get personal student information through the university's public records.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SYLVESTER: Now a spokesperson from the University of Iowa responded saying, quote, "we are trying to reduce our dependency on credit card revenue" and notes that students can opt out to have their personal information not shared with outside marketers. But we should mention, Lou that a lot of these credit card offers appear to be deals. In the case of the University of Iowa credit card, the introductory rate is 4.9 percent, later the rate jumps to more than 18 percent and with late payments the rate jumps to 29.99 percent -- Lou.
DOBBS: Someone should grab a hold of the president of the University of Iowa and explain to -- I don't know whether it's a man or a woman -- and explain to them the facts of life. What they're doing is absolutely unconscionable. If that's the kind of lesson the University of Iowa wants to teach its students, then God help them. I mean they owe the citizens of Iowa an apology and those young people going to the university an apology. That's unconscionable.
SYLVESTER: And Lou, the fact is that there are many universities, not just the public colleges, but also private colleges that are doing the exact same thing, selling students' personal information to these credit card companies and these credit card companies do not have the students' best interests.
DOBBS: And those universities at the same time working out in some cases, many of those universities working out deals with student loan organizations, in which they benefit in the quid pro quo, those arrangements. There needs to be a broad examination of what universities are doing with their private information and loans.
It's just absurd that this is being tolerated. This is not a nation nor a society in which everything should be for sale and certainly not private information of our young people in universities and colleges. Thank you very much, Lisa. Lisa Sylvester reporting from Washington.
Up next, Senator Obama, well, a lot of people were expecting an announcement of his running mate at any time. But will the choice make any difference for the outcome? I'll be joined by three of the best political analysts here next.
And our democracy at risk. Electronic voting system so riddled with problem, they're becoming a pop culture joke. We'll share the joke with you. This one is not necessarily on you and me. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) DOBBS: It's 7:25 p.m. on the East Coast and we still haven't heard from the Obama campaign about who Senator's Obama's running mate might be. But we -- I assure you -- remain on pins and needles here waiting to give you that information as soon as we receive it.
We have reported for more than two years now on the serious threat that electronic voting poses to this democracy. E-voting systems are prone to computer hacking, glitches, incorrectly reported votes, and a lot of other mistakes. Many of the machines that will be used in our presidential election still have no paper trail.
Making a recount problematic at best. In fact, our election system in this country is now so flawed it's being spoofed in a national TV commercial. Kitty Pilgrim has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KITTY PILGRIM, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Our election system is so flawed it's a joke.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is ridiculous.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Folks, it'll be fixed in no time. Someone's working on it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We don't have all day.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Seriously.
(SOUNDS)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The lever was jammed.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Maytag repairman?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Not again.
PILGRIM: In recent elections, problems with electronic voting machines have stressed out poll workers, voters and have undermined confidence in accuracy. This week one of the top electronic voting machine companies in the country, Premiere Election Solutions, formally known as Diebold (ph), sent a nationwide product advisory to all 1,750 districts they service in 34 states, warning of the potential for dropped votes and miscounts.
In Oregon, officials look at the voting mess and shrug. For the last 10 years Oregonians have been voting with a pen and paper at home and then mailing in their ballots, which are cross-checked for a signature match. No long lines, no dropped votes, no flawed electronic machines with the bonus of a paper trail if a recount is needed.
DON HAMILTON, OREGON SECY. OF STATE'S OFFICE: It became a system we found out pretty quickly to save costs, it reduced fraud, it was easier, it found wild acceptance among the voters of the state.
PILGRIM: And the technology decisions are simple.
HAMILTON: Either a black pen or a blue pen or a pencil works very well.
PILGRIM: Marge Easley is the president of the Oregon League of Women Voters, which supports the mail-in voting system.
MARGE EASLEY, OREGON LEAGUE OF WOMEN VOTERS: You have two weeks to vote. You can think about things. You can gather all the materials together on your kitchen table, and just think about how you best want to vote.
PILGRIM: Oregon has no plans to change.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PILGRIM: Now, the stress-free system in Oregon seems to work just fine. Voter turnout in Oregon in 2004 was 86 percent. That's well above the national average. And the rest of the country, as a third of the voters in this election will be using touch-screen voting machines without a paper trail, there are no guarantees those machines will work on election day and that all the votes will be counted correctly -- Lou.
DOBBS: Well, certainly an interesting idea. You know, motor voter registration, motor voter. I mean via the post office. All right, thank you very much, Kitty. Kitty Pilgrim.
New developments tonight to report to you in the battle to stop the outsourcing of our defense and our national security. Boeing today saying that it may decide to pull out of a competition with Europe to build a fleet of new tanker aircraft for the Air Force. Boeing said it may withdraw if the Pentagon does not permit it another four months to submit a new bid.
Boeing says it needs more time because the Pentagon is looking for a larger aircraft than was first proposed. The European company that makes Airbus won the initial contract back in February, in what was considered an extremely flawed bidding process. The Pentagon reopened that bidding after the Government Accountability Office said there were significant errors in the process.
Up next, the very latest on the fight over an illegal alien who has received life-saving treatment at a Chicago hospital. The family, however, isn't saying thank you. They're crying racial discrimination. And the national executive director of the open borders amnesty group LULAC will be here to explain why his group isn't saying thank you either.
And is Senator Obama playing the media as we await here on pins and needles, as I said, for him to announce his running mate. I'll be joined by three of the country's very best political analysts here next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT -- news, debate and opinion. Here again, Mr. Independent, Lou Dobbs.
LOU DOBBS, CNN NEWS ANCHOR: Joining me now three of the best political analysts anywhere, CNN contributors and good guys, all: Republican strategist Ed Rollins. Ed served as White House political director, recently chairing Mike Huckabee's presidential campaign. "New York Daily News" Columnist, Errol Louis. Errol, also the host of "The Morning Radio Show" on WWRL, here in New York. Democratic strategist, Robert Zimmerman. Robert is just an enthusiastic Barack Obama supporter, member of the Democratic National committee.
What's going on, because we're really getting a little upset here, we in the national media, of course, we're starting to feel like, Robert, we're being played a little by the Obama campaign as we await the naming of his running mate. Tell me it isn't so.
ROBERT ZIMMERMAN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: You're getting played a lot. But then, I don't think you're on pins and needles over it.
DOBBS: Not really.
ZIMMERMAN: In I think, look, they've handled it very skillfully. They're building up mailing lists, realistically, by having everyone text in their e-mail addresses, send in their e-mail addresses. It's a smart tactic and they're building up to big announcement and I think it's going to -- a great deal of momentum going into the convention.
DOBBS: A great deal of momentum. So, does everybody agree it's a good strategy?
ED ROLLINS, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: No. I don't think it's a good strategy. I think the bottom line is like raising expectations that you're going to get Alex Rodriguez and you end up with a some 200 hitter in a major league trade. You know, there's nobody going to exceed the expectations, if they don't go with Hillary, which obviously they're not going, who else is going to create such excitement to make this thing -- you know, it's just -- it's an idiotic process. It also basically reflects on this is a guy who's supposed to be different and he's playing a game.
ERROL LOUIS, NEW YORK DAILY NEWS: Yeah, I mean, they could have done it far differently. As it is, we're going to have to sort of crank up all over again. We'll probably know sometime between tonight and tomorrow. It falls into the middle of a pretty blank news hole on the weekends, and so the Sunday talk shows will have it and so forth, but, you know, we're all going to arrive in Denver with kind of a blah feeling, I think. They really did loose an opportunity, I think.
ZIMMERMAN: What was the opportunity they lost? If anything you had a debate about -- a discussion about the different prospects, all of them getting very good marks and good reviews. I think there's a good deal of excitement about this. You have a different situation in the Republican Party where Rush Limbaugh's doing the vetting of the Republican possible vice presidential pick.
(CROSSTALK)
DOBBS: (INAUDIBLE)
ZIMMERMAN: I knew you'd say that.
DOBBS: No, I didn't. And by the way, what's wrong with that? (INAUDIBLE) some very good talk points...
ZIMMERMAN: Just goes to show you're listening to Rush everyday instead of listening to Lou.
(LAUGHTER)
DOBBS: So is John McCain, I fear.
ROLLINS: You know, the vice presidential choice is the first big judgment and this is a campaign that has stuttered the last several weeks, and is going backwards, losing momentum, and you need a momentum. And it's not like -- I go back to the point, unless there's some superstar out there other than the ones that have all been vetted, you know, maybe, I don't know a lot about Chet Edwards, other than the fact that he's a congressman from Texas, but maybe he's the magic answer, Nancy Pelosi wants him.
ZIMMERMAN: That should say it all.
DOBBS: Exactly.
ROLLINS: There's nobody out there that basically the country's sitting there, wow, just give me that guy. You know, maybe Phelps, the swimmer.
ZIMMERMAN: Well, I think you're making an interesting point, though, because ultimately both conventions are going to be critical in terms of uniting the base of the party. And right now we have both parties that truly are not fully united and that's what the role of both these conventions will feel the...
DOBBS: How do you know what's going on with the Republican Party? You're a Democrat, come on.
ZIMMERMAN: Polls and...
(CROSSTALK)
DOBBS: You can only deal with one disunity at a time.
ZIMMERMAN: And 88 percent of the people who voted for the candidates in the primary are now supporting McCain. You have a bigger number of Democrats and obviously you're not doing as well. And it's your old supporters, the Hillary supporters that haven't come home yet.
DOBBS: Errol, do you feel like you and I are in the Senate and just watching a tennis match here?
LOUIS: Well, you know, I think actually they're both right. The Republican base is getting consolidated; the Democratic base is not consolidated. And the theme of the convention -- everybody's going to be watching to see, you know, are the Clintons really onboard? Are they enthusiastic enough? Are their debts being retired? What's going on?
DOBBS: Let's get to the serious stuff, OK? I mean, enough of this high elevated discussion. Let's get to what's happening on, you know, on the ground. This is -- well, Obama took -- well, he wasted absolutely no time jumping on John McCain's answer Thursday to Politico.com on the number of houses he had. Here we go with the Obama's, the Obama campaign's first, what would you call it? Volley?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Somebody asked John McCain: how many houses do you have? And he said: "I'm not sure, I'll have to check with my staff." True quote.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DOBBS: Wow. Well, I tell you, the McCain campaign, not to be outdone fired back with its own attack ad. So, I'll tell you what, we're going to read that to you, because...
(BEGIN AUDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: How many houses do you and Mrs. McCain have?
JOHN MCCAIN (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think, I'll let my staff get to you. I can't tell you about that. It's condominiums where -- I'll have them get to you."
(END AUDIO CLIP)
DOBBS: That's the sound of McCain talking, there. That's very helpful. Now, here's the response from the McCain campaign. Which I think, by the way, is a pretty smart response. "Does a guy who made more than $4 million last year, just got back from vacation on a private beach in Hawaii and bought his own million dollar mansion with the help of a convicted felon really want to get into a debate about houses?"
ROLLINS: In fairness to him, he wasn't on a private beach, it was a private house that had a private beach, but it was not...
DOBBS: Do you want to expand that?
ROLLINS: I don't want to expand it. I just think that -- I don't think it's anymore fair to attack John McCain on the properties that his wife has for investment purposes than it was to attack Mrs. Kerry -- Mrs. Heinz Kerry, who had multiple houses last time. That's not what's relevant. What's relevant is what about people that are losing their houses across this country and when are they going to start talking about those kinds of things? Those are the things that matter.
ZIMMERMAN: I think the difference is Mrs. Kerry knew how many homes she had.
DOBBS: How many? How many?
ZIMMERMAN: I don't really know.
DOBBS: OK, well, that's the problem.
ZIMMERMAN: If I owned them...
DOBBS: The idea is that -- that is an effort by Obama to invalidate the candidacy of someone because he or she is wealthy. Is Senator Clinton worth $100 million? Yes. How much is Ted Kennedy worth? He's worked for working people all throughout his career. The suggestion that that somehow invalidates his status as a legitimate...
ZIMMERMAN: No, what it is...
LOUIS: No, you know, I heard more of it as a matter of, is this guy on top of the basics? Frankly, I thought it was a side jab at his age. You know, they said that he forgot how many homes he has, which is really a bit of an exaggeration.
DOBBS: Oh, you did? So, in other words, the defense is, in that case, that they were just being ageist, that they're that ignorant. That is stupid. That's ignorant and they ought to be -- I mean, that ought to be...
LOUIS: I'll tell you, Lou, just in the clip that you played, I don't think Barack Obama does sarcasm very well. I don't think he does personal...
DOBBS: I don't think he does a lot of things very well, to be honest with you and especially campaigning for the highest office in the land.
LOUIS: Exactly. He ought to leave that to somebody else.
ZIMMERMAN: And the point is, what this...
DOBBS: Is that your way of saying it's early?
ZIMMERMAN: I'm saying it's...
DOBBS: Or is that your way of saying it's time for the Democrats to suffer their curse?
ZIMMERMAN: No, what I'm saying is what invalidates John McCain is not the fact he doesn't remember how many homes he has, what invalidates him is the fact that he's trying to put down Barack Obama as an elitist and trying to dismiss him in that context and he's trying to portray himself as one of the working people...
DOBBS: What is -- what is your candidate doing?
ZIMMERMAN: My candidate's out there, articulating programs...
DOBBS: Oh, I see.
ZIMMERMAN: That's right, a tax cuts for middle income people...
DOBBS: The program is by talking about how many houses he has?
ZIMMERMAN: If he didn't jump on it, it'd be political malpractice.
DOBBS: Oh, political malpractice. I'll tell you what it would be, it wouldn't be petty, it wouldn't be silly, it would not be absurd and it would, unfortunately, had he avoided it all, given him time to deal with something substantive -- both candidates, by the way, not just yours, but theirs.
We'll be right back in just a moment with our panel. It gets better and better, these guys are just warming up.
(LAUGHTER)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
Dobbs: We're back with Ed Rollins, Errol Louis, Robert Zimmerman. Seven times Barack Obama has been on the cover of "Time" magazine in the last year. The "Washington Post" acknowledges that they have given three times as much coverage on their front page to Barack Obama as Senator McCain. Do you see any bias at all in the coverage here on the part of the national media?
ROLLINS: What I find amazing is with all of that coverage you don't know very much about him.
DOBBS: That's an interesting point.
ROLLINS: I mean, what are the seven cover stories? What have they been? Why is the country sitting out there saying, who is this guy? And what is he for? And what does he say? And I think event he point where the debate, before. This was a guy who was going to run a different kind of campaign. It was going to be a very high, very uplifting campaign. And, you know, the first time he gets a little jab in the nose and starts bleeding, you know, he throws the kitchen sink or the multiple kitchen sinks from the various houses and I think to a certain extent, you know, it's going to be a tough, rough campaign and it's...
ZIMMERMAN: And good for him for fighting back. I'm glad we finally have a Democratic nominee who's prepared to take the Republicans on and not find himself to be swift boated.
DOBBS: Not like those wusses, John F. Kerry and Al Gore? Is that what you said?
ZIMMERMAN: I admire them both very much, but let's face it, the Democratic convention in Boston, four years ago, was speak no evil. And Democrats have got to lay out how they strong differ from the Republicans in this convention.
ROLLINS: And how do they?
ZIMMERMAN: Oh, on virtually every level from the environment to tax policy, protecting middle-income workers. I can do the whole litany, but then I'll be accused of talking points.
ROLLINS: You will be.
DOBBS: Well, so that you won't, and let's keep this fair, because McCain, now among the likely voters according to the most recent Zogby poll is crushing your candidate. I just wanted to say that. The fact is, it is true. At the same time, John McCain is putting forward an economic policy that is disastrous. He's really talking about more free trade, he's talking about greater trade debt, he's not talking about working men and women in this country and their families, by the way, neither is Obama doing too well on that, and he has a legacy in that party, a heritage, DNA that says talk about it and do something about it. What is going on with McCain? Can he win this thing without finding some soul, some sense of populism in himself?
LOUIS: I think one of the great mysteries of this, I mean, it's stunning in a way, is that he's managed to, in some polls, exceed Obama as far as trustworthiness on economic issues. And you're right, I mean, it's not just in the DNA of the party, but you know, this year of all years with the economy tanking, with this Bush administration so unpopular, with the mortgage crisis and so forth, so many problems, pressing problems that you can lay at the foot of the Republican administration, and yet John McCain seems to be making some progress. He found something that sounded like a gimmick, drill, drill, drill, drill and let's have some nuclear plants and he took off in the polls.
DOBBS: It sounds like a gimmick. Partner, I said within the same breath that Pelosi and reed and Obama, five weeks ago, that they're going to have to reverse themselves because it's common sense. We're going to need every possible avenue to bridge to a new renewable energy program in this country. It's just common sense.
ROLLINS: There's one thing everyone knows about John McCain, he's a courageous man. And we're getting in an uncertain world, who do you want sitting across the table from Putin?
DOBBS: Nancy Pelosi.
ROLLINS: Who do you want sitting across from the table of the bankers when they basically are tax...
DOBBS: Harry Reid.
ROLLINS: Again, and I think that's where he's moved forward is the strength of character and whether he doesn't always get his words right or whatever, people know he's a man of courage and people know he'll do what he thinks is the right thing.
ZIMMERMAN: Now, Ed, I admire John McCain's heroism in combat and I admire his patriotism, but to say that he's a man of character, when, in fact, he has produced and supported a military policy, a foreign policy that is so debilitated our role in terms of taking on Russia. We don't have the economic resources...
DOBBS: He produced the policy?
ZIMMERMAN: He supported a policy...
DOBBS: Oh, supported a policy.
ZIMMERMAN: He was a leader for that.
DOBBS: Didn't Obama also?
ZIMMERMAN: No. Actually, no.
ROLLINS: Didn't Senator Bayh, one of the all-stars that you were talking about earlier as a vice presidential candidate, wasn't he a co-author of the revolution? Wasn't Hillary Clinton, who you supported, one of the signers...
ZIMMERMAN: But, when they saw how poorly the war was being managed, they demanded an alternative strategy. The problem was John McCain...
ROLLINS: What was that?
ZIMMERMAN: A phased withdraw to refocus the battle on terrorism. The problem with John McCain is when he saw the failed policy in Iraq, he just dug in deeper.
DOBBS: And urged a surge strategy that acknowledged the same basis for the success that's been enjoyed over the past six months.
ZIMMERMAN: It's produced a military success, but has it made the Iraqi government stand up more on its own?
DOBBS: Yes, No. 2 and most importantly to me, it's reduced the number of casualties among our troops.
ZIMMERMAN: As long as we're there...
DOBBS: Most importantly reduced the casualties.
ZIMMERMAN: Totally correct, but it's also put a backbone on the people, the government there, who basically says we can now live without you. That's not declare "mission accomplished" yet. We've been there -- we've been down that road.
DOBBS: But, wasn't that George Bush's mission accomplished? Not John McCain's. Obama's (INAUDIBLE).
ROLLINS: Now, tell us who the choice is. You know.
DOBBS: All right. We've got to go, guys. This is getting good and I want to just thank you for elevating again the discussion between these two candidates. Errol, thank you very much. It's been fun for you and me to watch these two. Anyway, we did our best. Robert Zimmerman, Ed Rollins, good to see you back here, partner. Coming up at the top of the hour, the ELECTION CENTER and John King in for Campbell Brown, inside, right inside that Democratic National Convention center in Denver.
John, how is it?
JOHN KING, CNN NEWS ANCHOR: It's great, Lou. Feisty conversation you've got going there. And good evening everyone from Denver where the excitement and the anxiety just keep building. In just a few minutes, we'll round up the latest hints and clues about who Barack Obama will pick as his running mate. And I'll wal over to the magic board, right here in the convention hall and show you how the announcement could affect the votes in some crucial swing states.
We'll also look at the stagecraft, here in the convention hall, the Pepsi Center, to talk about a race already turned feisty, could get even more nastier for McCain and Obama -- Lou.
DOBBS: No, I've been calling it a, John, a nasty fest, this campaign between these two. I'm sure it'll pick up from there. John, thanks a lot, John King, look forward to it.
Well, a reminder to join me on the radio Monday through Friday for the Lou Dobbs Show. Go to LouDobbsRadio.com to find the local listing in your area. See you on the radio.
Up next, a stunning reaction to the hospital's decision to give life-saving care to an illegal alien. What has been the reaction? Thank you? Deep gratitude? No, charges of racial discrimination. I'll be joined by the executive director of LULAC, here next, and "Heroes," our weekly tribute to the men and women who serve this nation in uniform. Former Marine Captain Edward Smith, honored for leading his men with valor in Iraq. His story, tonight. We'll be right back.
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DOBBS: As we've been reporting here this week, the controversy is growing over a Chicago hospital's decision to do the right thing, to give life-saving treatment to a stricken illegal alien. The University of Illinois Medical Center, in July, admitted Francis Pantaleon (ph) who suffered a severe brain hemorrhage and lapsed into a coma. He's now in a vegetative state. Pantaleon is an illegal alien from Mexico. He had, of course, no insurance. The hospital carrying the entire cost of his care, which at this point for a patient in a similar condition, in similar hospital surroundings, that care would have amounted to at least, at this point, something near a quarter of a million dollars.
Pantaleon's condition has stabilized, the hospital wants to discharge him to a long-term care facility in Mexico. Now incredibly, Pantaleon's family is organizing protests against the hospital, saying the hospital is discriminating against Mexicans. We reported here Wednesday that special interest groups, MALDEF, LULAC, among others, were involved on behalf of the family, and I issued this challenge to those groups. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
I would hope that working with the government of Mexico that you would instill some sense of responsibility on the part of that government for its citizens. And the idea that there would not be a demonstration on the part of LULAC and MALDEF, in front of that hospital to say thank you to the doctors and the staff of the University of Illinois Medical Center for what they've done for that patient, I think is reprehensible on your part.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DOBBS: Well, joining me now is Brent Wilkes, he's the national executive director of LULAC, the League of the United Latin American Citizens.
Brent, good to have you here. Let me ask you something. Why not a simple thank you to these folks?
BRENT WILKES, LULAC: Well, I tell you, we thank the doctors for the life saving care that provided; they are the heroes, here. They've helped this gentleman and they've done their job. It's the hospital administrators we have a problem with, Lou. They're trying to save a buck and actually take a man out of their hospital that's comatose and they've admitted the prognosis is not very good -- fly him over six hours and they're not even sure he can make the trip. Basically, they want to issue this gentleman a death sentence so they can save some money and kick him out of the hospital. We find that reprehensible. Lou, the fact that you're encouraging them to do that, we find that reprehensible, as well.
DOBBS: Yeah, I know, you're big on reprehensible when it comes to a sense of entitlement on the part of illegal aliens. The fact of the matter is, Brent, there is no thank you, here. You guys have not issued a thank you. Here is what LULAC said in it's press release...
WILKES: Lou, Lou, I thanked the doctors right no national television, right now, I'm thanking them...
DOBBS: Oh, now you are.
WILKES: You've done a great job.
DOBBS: Thank you.
WILKES: And we want you to continue to...
DOBBS: I appreciate you responding to my request that you do that. And you've got to feel better about that, don't you? Because those doctors deserve a thank you and those nurses and that staff and that hospital administrator. When in the world, Brent, did there become such a sense of entitlement among illegal aliens in this country that a hospital that taxpayers have a responsibility, not the country of origin, not their family, not ethnocentric interest groups, to provide for the care? Why aren't you raising money for the care of that young man? WILKES: Well, let me first of all, Lou, you're confusing -- this is not an issue of immigration, this is about...
WILKES: Did I say immigration? Did I say immigration? I didn't say anything about immigration.
WILKES: Lou, please let me finish.
DOBBS: I will. But, first imt you to understand I did not say a word about immigration.
WILKES: You've made your point, sir.
DOBBS: OK.
WILKES: Now, the person is in the hospital, he's comatose, the individual is in desperate need of care. And the hospital administrators they want to save money and they want to remove them from their facility to a location they haven't even selected yet, and they're not even sure that the person would survive the trip. The family doesn't want it, Lou, and if you had a similar situation, if it was your grandmother that was in a hospital, they wanted to fly her six hours from that facility to a place they don't know where it is yet and they're not even sure she could make the trip, would you find that acceptable? Would you find that humane?
This is an issue of humanity, it's not a matter of immigration or the fact that the person committed a misdemeanor violation of immigration law, it's about humanity. He has human rights, and that's something that you have to learn to respect and you cannot just keep going around and trying to take away all the human rights of people regardless of their immigration status. It doesn't matter. He's a human being, and he needs to have that care, and we have an obligation to it to him, just like we provide the same care to anyone else in this country. Even if they commit a more sever crime...
DOBBS: Do you feel -- Yeah, now I've heard you. Now, if you would listen to me. Do you feel just somewhat sanctimonious and hypocritical to suggest that a hospital, that has invested over a quarter of a million dollars and saved the life of a young man tragically stricken with an aneurysm and who has been, if he were a illegal citizen, he would have been discharged at least a week to two weeks ago because he's stabilized to a long-term care facility -- do you think, do you think that you have a greater responsibility because you are so concerned in the interest of humanitarianism, for the care of this young man? You are the ethnocentric organization, here, that is focused on this because of his ethnicity -- why in the world are you not raising money for his care and relieving that burden from the taxpayers of Illinois, and, and American taxpayers supporting through Medicaid, perhaps his long-term care, at least part of it? Why in the world are you not taking some responsibility for him because your organization, the government of Mexico -- by the way, the family sharing the same attorney as the council of Mexico and Chicago -- why is Mexico not taken responsibility for one of its citizens? Why is there not an acknowledgment also that the hospital is willing to spend all of that money for a plane to take him back to Mexico, to his country in which he lives? Why doesn't Mexico want to embrace this young man and take responsibility for his care?
WILKES: Because they don't think he's going to survive the trip, Lou. You are issuing a death sentence to the young man by encouraging the hospital to discharge them into a situation where he could not survive, Lou, and that is not humane. You can not do something like that. Let me answer your question. We are -- all of our members pay taxes, Lou. This gentleman, even though undocumented, he paid taxes. We all pay into the system, in case, God forbid, something catastrophic would happen to one of us, and then if it does happen, we expect the laws to be followed and the hospitals provide that catastrophic care that they're supposed to. That's all that we're asking, here. The same thing that anyone of us would get treated the same...
DOBBS: An American citizen would have been discharged to a long- term care facility because he's in a vegetative state and he's taking up a bed in a hospital. You know that.
WILKES: You know what, we don't have a problem -- Lou, if they want to discharge him to a long-term care facility in Chicago where he can survive the trip and it's going to be able to provide the care, we have no problem with that. I don't think his family does either. The problem is, they want ship him all the way back to Mexico to save some money and he's going to die on that trip.
DOBBS: Why don't you take responsibility financially for his care? Why don't you take responsibility at LULAC? Why not insist the government of Mexico, instead of trying to put this on the taxpayers of the United States, why don't you have the government of Mexico, he is a Mexican citizen -- why don't you, as an activist, ethnocentric activist, in your group, why don't the government of Mexico, why you all get together and take responsibility for his care? There would be no problem if you did that.
WILKES: Well, listen, I'm not the one who's negotiating the agreements between the United States and Mexico and how they take care of these things. I know they do have agreements in terms of Social Security and other entitlement programs...
DOBBS: Which has actually nothing to do with this case.
WILKES: But, I'll tell you one thing, Lou, you know, even terrorists get quality care from the medical care from the United States in Guantanamo...
DOBBS: Oh man, if you're saying that this young man didn't receive quality care at the University of Illinois Medical Center, you need to say I'm sorry along with the thank you that you finally uttered, here. We do appreciate you for doing that, Brent. Thank you for your thank you to the people who saved this young man's life.
Brent Wilkes, executive director of LULAC, thanks for being with us.
We're out of time. Reminder now to vote in our poll. Do you believe ethnocentric interest groups, such as LULAc and La Raza, are responsible for what has become a delusional sense of entitlement among illegal aliens in this country? Cast your vote at LouDobbs.com. we'll have the results here right after this short break, we'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DOBBS: Tonight's poll results: 98 percent of you say ethnocentric special interest groups, such as LULAC and La Raza, are responsible for a delusional sense of entitlement that has arisen among illegal aliens in this country.
Well, James in Arizona writing in to say: "Finally. Thank God you've taken up one of the most important and neglected topics of our time: the national debt."
Charles in Florida: "Dear Lou, it's been eight years since our last vote counting fiasco, and here we are again with no system in place to ensure a rapid, accurate counting of votes. Amazing we can put a man on the moon, but can't get a system designed to count and accurately record votes."
Stanley in Illinois: "Lou, if God wanted man to vote, he would have given us a candidate." That has to be one of my favorite. Let me repeat that: "Lou, if God wanted man to vote, he would have given us a candidate."
Gorge in Virginia: "Keep up in the good work, the straight talk that Americans deserve. As one American to another, it's simple: give them hell, Lou." I'll sure try.
Send us your thoughts as LouDobbs.com. Thanks for being with us. The ELECTION CENTER with John King in Denver at the Democratic National Convention, begins now -- John.
