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Lou Dobbs Tonight
Obama Distraction; Border Tensions; Who is Obama's Spy Chief; President Bush's Approval Rating; All Shopped out; Our Borders and Ports Insecurity
Aired December 26, 2008 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Thanks, Suzanne.
Tonight it's the story that won't go away for the Obama team, the Blagojevich scandal. Now top Obama staffers may be subpoenaed by the governor's defense attorney.
And tonight it could be the worst Christmas shopping season in decades. Sales of just about everything plummeted as economic fears kept consumers home.
And tonight just what does it take to be the White House dog? There's been no shortage of canine advice for the first new family, all that, all the day's news and much more from an independent perspective straight ahead here tonight.
ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT: news, debate, and opinion for Friday, December 26th. Live from New York, sitting in for Lou Dobbs, Lisa Sylvester.
SYLVESTER: Good evening, everybody. No matter how hard the Obama transition team tries, it just can't distance itself from the Blagojevich corruption scandal. Blagojevich's attorneys now want to subpoena the president-elect's chief of staff and other members of Obama's inner circle. Even if the subpoenas aren't approved the corruption scandal continues to be a distraction for the president- elect and his team. Ed Henry has our report from Honolulu. Ed?
ED HENRY, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well good evening, Lisa. You're right, team Obama certainly since this past Tuesday has been trying to turn the page on this Blagojevich scandal, especially since they released that internal investigation showing they say that there was no wrongdoing from anyone from the president-elect on down to key staffers like Rahm Emanuel and Valerie Jarrett (ph), but apparently Governor Blagojevich has different ideas.
As you noted, CNN confirming tonight that in fact defense attorney for the governor has sent a letter to the Illinois state panel that is considering impeachment charges against the governor urging that they subpoena some top Obama aides including Rahm Emanuel, Valerie Jarrett (ph) as well, that confirmed from the speaker's office of the State House, Michael Madigan (ph). They told CNN that they've received this letter.
They've taken it under advisement. This impeachment panel will be meeting Monday morning to consider this and other matters. Now it's important to note, however, that the prosecutors in this case, Patrick Fitzgerald, has previously suggested that he does not want this impeachment situation to interfere with his ongoing criminal investigation. Nevertheless, every day of stories about this is another day when the team Obama is not able to talk about the economy or national security issues and I spoke earlier today to Washington lawyer Bob Bennett, a veteran of many Washington scandals, who said that the drip-drip of revelations can really be a distraction.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's like Count Dracula. The Count needs fresh blood every day, and if he doesn't get his daily dose of blood, he withers away and that's what a scandal is. It needs fresh blood every day.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: But Bennett noted that he thinks in the early days of the scandal as it's unfolded that team Obama has actually done a good job in his judgment politically in trying to get as much information out as possible both with that report earlier this week, that internal investigation but also he noted making the president-elect of the United States available to the U.S. Attorney's Office for an interview of some two hours behind closed doors last week.
Bob Bennett and other Washington attorneys I consulted with today say basically that suggests to them that team Obama is trying to show they have absolutely nothing to hide by making even the president- elect available behind closed doors for questioning and so we'll have to see how this plays out in the days ahead. But they're at least giving the posture of a transition team that is not afraid to let this play out. Lisa?
SYLVESTER: Yes and Ed, they released that report earlier in the week as well, right, to try to clear up saying that no wrongdoing was found?
HENRY: Absolutely, and that report also revealed that beyond the president-elect, that both Rahm Emanuel and Valerie Jarrett (ph) also went behind closed doors with the U.S. Attorney's Office in Chicago to tell all they know and they insisted under questioning that they were not aware of any of the pay-to-play scandal that the governor is wrapped up in, now there's no quid pro quo essentially involved in the alleged auctioning off of Barack Obama's former seat in the U.S. Senate.
So basically team Obama is saying look there's been no wrongdoing here. We're not going to be distracted by this, even as it continues to play out both in Chicago and in the media, Lisa.
SYLVESTER: OK, Ed Henry, thank you very much for that report.
New foreign policy threat, one that will certainly face the incoming Obama administration, Pakistan today reportedly deployed troops to its border with India. Pakistan has been on high alert since last month's terror attacks in the Indian city of Mumbai. India believes the attacks originated in Pakistan. Barbara Starr reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Two Pakistani officials tell CNN their troops are moving from the border with Afghanistan where they are fighting al Qaeda to the border with India amid fears India is planning a cross-border attack. Officially Pakistani Prime Minister Yousef Frozi Gilani (ph) says Pakistan will act only if attacked. India quickly charged Pakistan is trying to divert attention from the real threat of terrorists.
PRANAB MUKERJEE, INDIAN EXTERNAL AFFAIRS MIN.: We would expect that, instead of raising war hysteria, they will address this problem. This is a menace to the regional peace and stability.
STARR: A senior U.S. military official tells CNN the Pentagon sees no direct evidence of a significant Pakistani troop movement so far. This may all be another round of posturing by both sides but feuding between two nuclear powers is exactly what the Bush administration doesn't want to see. The risk is either side could miscalculate and India and Pakistan, which have gone to war three times before, could find themselves again at the brink.
Washington wants Pakistan to focus on fighting terrorism inside its borders. An obviously worried Bush administration issued a statement saying quote, "we hope that both sides will avoid taking steps that will unnecessarily raise tensions." All U.S. hopes are with this man, General Ashva Kiani (ph), Pakistan's army chief of staff. Admiral Mike Mullen, the chairman of the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff, has had two meetings with Kiani (ph) in the last month, making the case any move towards war played right into the terrorist hands.
ADMIRAL MIKE MULLEN, JOINT CHIEFS CHAIRMAN: It shouldn't be lost on anyone how a handful of well-trained terrorists using fairly unsophisticated tools in a highly sophisticated manner held at bay an entire city and nearly brought to a boil interstate tensions between two nuclear powers.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
STARR: Now both Pakistan and India have put various military units on alert since those Mumbai attacks a month ago. The U.S. remains watchful and is trying to convince Pakistan to keep focused on fighting al Qaeda and other terrorists groups inside its country rather than looking to India as a potential enemy. Lisa?
SYLVESTER: Barbara Starr, thank you very much for that report.
In this country, terrorists will likely capitalize on weaknesses in border security to carry out plots here over the next few years. A new Department of Homeland Security reports instability in the Middle East and Africa will drive terrorists to enter this country and carry out terror plots. The report obtained by The Associated Press also predicts that terrorists will attempt a bioterrorism attack against a U.S. target. We'll have much more on that report when border security expert Mike Cutler (ph) joins me a little later in the broadcast. With just 25 days left before his inauguration, President-elect Obama has filled his cabinet and the president-elect has named his national security team but one key intelligence position remains unfilled. Brian Todd reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you.
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In an otherwise well-received transition one prominent hole remains; the Obama team is still looking for a CIA director. Former top counterterrorism official John Brennan withdrew his name citing "strong criticism in some quarters prompted by my previous service with the Central Intelligence Agency."
Some liberal bloggers had blasted Brennan's past support for rendition, the capturing and transporting of terror suspects to other countries for interrogation and detention. Some also claimed Brennan supported harsh interrogation techniques which he strongly denied. Two knowledgeable sources tell CNN the Obama team pressured Brennan to withdraw. Obama transition officials say it was his own decision. Was this nomination torpedoed by blogs?
JEFF STEIN, CONGRESSIONAL QUARTERLY: I don't think the bloggers knocked him out so much as that they realized they would have to have a fight, had his confirmation hearing.
TODD: Analysts say even if Brennan didn't support harsh interrogation his overalls ties to the post-9/11 era at the CIA with the pre-war intelligence flap and all the controversial tactics in the war on terror would have made him tough to confirm. Human rights officials are throwing down their gauntlet.
ELISA MASSIMINO, HUMAN RIGHTS FIRST: It is really incumbent on the incoming administration to choose people for those slots who don't have any baggage from the previous policies and can demonstrate a clear break from those policies.
TODD: Elisa Massimino says that doesn't mean everyone who served in the CIA then should be automatically disqualified. But analysts say it will be hard to find a really qualified spy chief who doesn't have some tie-in to that period. A former CIA officer says if the Obama team can find someone like that...
TYLER DRUMHELLER, FORMER CIA OFFICER: They have a unique opportunity to make changes now in the agency the way the agency fits in the intelligence community, to get back to the real core mission of the service to recruit agents and have collect intelligence through classic espionage.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
TODD: Tyler Drumheller says the ideal person for that would now be a former analyst, but someone from the operations side of the CIA, the division that actually carries out missions in the field, so the challenge now for Obama's team, find someone like that who is not associated with the controversies of the past eight years, that will be a tall order, Lisa. The field is narrowing.
SYLVESTER: Yes, Brian, we also know that Obama has not filled a very top intelligence post yet, the director of National Intelligence, although we do know...
TODD: That's right.
SYLVESTER: ... that he does have a front runner -- there is a front-runner for that position, isn't there?
TODD: That's right. A source familiar with the process tells us that the retired Navy Admiral Dennis Blair (ph) is set to be Obama's nominee for that post. His last military job was commander of the U.S. fleet in the Pacific, so he should be named probably after the first of the year.
SYLVESTER: OK, thank you very much, Brian Todd, for that report.
Well the American public has a message for President Bush, it is time to go. A vast majority according to a CNN Opinion Research poll are happy Mr. Bush is leaving, less than a quarter say they'll miss him. Bill Schneider has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST (voice-over): As President Bush prepares to leave office the American public has a parting thought. Good riddance. At least that's the way three- quarters feel.
Fewer than a quarter say they'll miss President Bush. It's been like a failed marriage. Things started out well. When President Bush first took office more than 60 percent saw him as strong and decisive. That impression was reinforced after 9/11.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The people who knocked these buildings down will hear all of us soon.
SCHNEIDER: The public still saw Bush as strong and decisive when he took office the second time in 2005. No more. The public's confidence in this president has dropped dramatically, especially over the past two years. President Bush did once have a reputation as a good manager, then came Hurricane Katrina.
BUSH: And Brownie, you're doing a heck of a job.
SCHNEIDER: And Bush's reputation as a manager got blown away. Mr. Bush got elected on a promise.
BUSH: I think people look for someone who is a uniter, not a divider.
SCHNEIDER: But the vast majority of Americans believe he betrayed that promise. He took a country that was divided under President Clinton and he divided it worse. Even some conservatives feel betrayed.
PAT ROBERTSON, CHRISTIAN BROADCASTING NETWORK: I think we've had some serious goofs along the way and the Katrina matter was terrible. The rebuilding of Iraq has been terrible. The handling of the economy right now has been terrible.
SCHNEIDER: Fewer than a third of Americans believe George W. Bush will go down in history as a good president, 40 percent say he left a poor legacy. Another 28 percent call Bush the worst president in American history.
(on camera): President Bush's job approval rating has been at or below freezing since the beginning of the year. Where does it stand now? Twenty-seven percent, one of the lowest ratings for any president, ever.
Bill Schneider, CNN, Los Angeles.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SYLVESTER: Well coming up, what drove a California man dressed as Santa to open fire at a Christmas celebration. We'll have the very latest and hear the 911 tapes.
And economic fears kept shoppers home this Christmas season. We'll have a report on what could be the worst Christmas shopping season in decades next. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SYLVESTER: Severe winter weather tonight in many parts of the country. In Chicago an ice storm paralyzing the region, many roads shut down due to treacherous driving conditions, parts of California, Nevada slammed by heavy snow, one skier on Christmas day was killed in an avalanche at the Squaw Valley (ph) Ski Resort, winter storm warnings in effect for parts of Utah and Arizona and a blizzard warning covering the mountains of southwest Colorado. The snow in Washington State meanwhile keeps on coming. Spokane registering a whopping 46 inches so far this month. Officials are warning that warmer weather could bring on flash flooding.
The day after Christmas usually sees a flood of shoppers, but not this year. The economic downturn has sent retail sales sharply lower as many consumers find themselves simply tapped out. Now retailers are asking for their very own bailout. Kitty Pilgrim has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KITTY PILGRIM, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The early Christmas shopping numbers are in and they aren't good; sales of women's clothing down nearly 23 percent; footwear down 14 percent; electronics down 26 percent. The actual numbers won't come until January 8th, but already retailers know they have to do something to salvage this season. Discounts before Christmas have turned into fire sales with clearance discounts the day after Christmas. MARSHAL COHEN, INDUSTRY ANALYST: So a lot of the early shopping was what the retailers wanted, they got their wish but now guess what, the consumer is kind of tapped out.
PILGRIM: But the consumer is not biting.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I spent less before and after. (INAUDIBLE) to begin with.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Probably just be more frugal with my dollars because of the general state of the economy.
PILGRIM: Luxury goods usually held up but this year sales fell 21 percent. The final burst of shopping never happened. Retail shopping traffic fell 27 percent this year. Stores are trying gimmicks like easy return policies to get people back into the stores.
CHRYSTIA FREELAND, FINANCIAL TIMES: The Americans are having a harder time getting credit and are more conscious of the need to ring back. People are losing their jobs and they are conscious rightly that more people are going to lose their jobs in the New Year.
PILGRIM: Already stores like Circuit City and Linens-N-Things have filed for bankruptcy. Analysts are warning of tough days ahead.
ERIC BEDER, RETAIL SALES ANALYST: (INAUDIBLE) to compare this the last time we had our retailing was slowdown, which was after 9/11. The retailers are in much better financial shape, but we're definitely going to see more stores closing after the holiday season.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PILGRIM: Now gift cards drive shopping the week after Christmas but sales of gift cards already showing declines. Things are so bad the National Retail Federation asked President-elect Barack Obama for a bailout. They want a sales tax holiday for a three 10-day period. And a letter to Obama was signed by the heads of several stores including JC Penney, PetSmart and Sachs -- Lisa.
SYLVESTER: You know if you take a look at it, I mean first it was the banks and then the auto companies, the states, developers, now the retailers. I mean where does this bailout frenzy end? At a certain point where is the responsibility here?
PILGRIM: It certainly does seem like that. Although you know as the old saw (ph) is that 70 percent of the economy is consumption and so if that goes away what kind of economy do you have left?
SYLVESTER: Yes, it's going to be interesting, very interesting to see what the price tag of that stimulus package is going to be when it's all said and done. Thank you, Kitty, for that report.
Well time now for some of your thoughts -- Lester in North Carolina, "Thank you, Lou, for the real news. Your efforts and passion don't go unnoticed. It's so nice to feel we are getting an unbiased opinion. Thanks and keep up the excellent work." George in California -- "Thank you, Lou, for speaking on our behalf to Washington. Please continue to fight to protect our borders and do what is right for this great nation and what is right for its people and not for the political parties."
Dan in Montana, "Should the banks be required to tell the public how the $700 billion of public money is being spent? Is this a rhetorical question? That the banks are not able or unwilling to provide this information is testimony to why America is in this mess in the first place."
We'll have much more of your e-mail a little later in the broadcast. Each of you whose e-mail is read here receives a copy of Lou's new book "Independents Day: Awakening the American Spirit", now available in paperback.
Coming up why we should be concerned about the state of security at our nation's borders and ports. A leading authority on border security will join me here.
And the 911 tapes from the California Christmas Eve massacre are released. We'll have the latest from the scene. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SYLVESTER: Security at our borders and ports is a key concern of a new report from the Department of Homeland Security. Joining me now is former federal immigration agent Mike Cutler, he's testified before Congress on immigration enforcement issues and is currently with the Center for Immigration Studies. So you've had a chance to review this report. What are the main points that you have taken away from this report?
MIKE CUTLER, CENTER FOR IMMIGRATION STUDIES: I still don't understand how, when you read the report and you look at the vulnerabilities and some of these are issues I've testified about before Congress as have others, the Congress still doesn't get it and the administration still doesn't get it. Look we know that the visa waiver program is a huge risk. Yet they've just expanded it from 27 countries to 34 countries.
SYLVESTER: Yes, explain for our viewers exactly what the visa waiver program is.
CUTLER: OK. The visa requirement is that when an alien seeks to enter the United States they're supposed to first fill out an application so that they're eligible to enter the United States and then a decision can be made whether or not to admit them. Under the visa waiver program all of the safeguards visas provide evaporate, they don't exist.
It facilitates travel and we know that the people in travel and hospitality industries seem to be happy they've developed this program called Discover America, but they need to remember is that al Qaeda has discovered America. So the definite benefits that the visa requirements are supposed to provide don't apply. We don't get the opportunity to have them fill out an application which contains about 40 questions that can provide good investigative leads, if the person becomes investigated for immigration violations or terrorism involvement. It also helps to keep the bad guys off of airplanes. It keeps the bad guys out of our country.
When they lie on these applications they can be prosecuted for fraud. But under the visa waiver program we don't get the intelligence and there's no potential to prosecute the terrorists who want to enter our country and do harm to us. And the other problem that I saw is that immigration fraud is a huge risk and fraud is committed by people wanting to get residency based on marriage, claiming to be political asylum applicants and so forth.
SYLVESTER: Well hold on that point.
CUTLER: Sure.
SYLVESTER: On that point of immigration we have some sound from Homeland Security Chief Michael Chertoff, at which he's essentially giving his agency a pat on the back saying that they're doing a good job when it comes to immigration. Let's play that sound.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAEL CHERTOFF, HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY: We've added new technology at the border. We have doubled the border patrol from what it was when this president took office and through the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center we've continued to maintain a high professional standard in our training and preparation for our agents.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SYLVESTER: OK, so you have Michael Chertoff saying hey we've done a good job, we've doubled our border patrol. Is that enough? Is that sufficient?
CUTLER: No, it's not. Look, first of all should we double the border patrol? Yes, in fact in 2005, I testified before the Congressional Subcommittee Immigration and Border Security about the fact that while Congress appropriated enough money to hire more border patrol agents and more special agents for ICE. The president cut those numbers by a huge percentage.
But we need to have many more agents working for ICE, Immigration and Customs Enforcement. If the problem is immigration fraud and it's a huge problem and we know that that's an embedding tactic used by the terrorists, we know that's how the 9/11 terrorists did what they did. In fact none of the 9/11 terrorists rammed the border.
They all came through ports of entry. Meanwhile, we have very few agents for the whole country, fewer than 4,000, enforcing the immigration laws for the entire United States while New York City has almost 10 times that number in terms of police officers just for the city of New York and we now have the administration of politicians calling for comprehensive immigration reform. There's absolutely no way that the agency that would have to adjudicate those applications for amnesty would have the resources to truly know who they're even dealing with. The idea of providing illegal aliens whose identities, backgrounds, affiliations and intentions are unknown and unknowable to provide them with official identity documents and lawful status represents a huge threat to national security and Chertoff never discusses that.
SYLVESTER: OK, we're just about out of time, but I want you to address one key component of this report...
(CROSSTALK)
SYLVESTER: ... potential for biological attacks.
CUTLER: Well look, it's one of the ways that according to that report and I believe they're right that we may well get hammered. And if you look at what happened in Mumbai we don't even need to go anything as sophisticated as a biological attack. A bunch of terrorists armed with automatic weapons and explosives did a hell of a job on India.
We remain at risk. You know a nation's security begins at its borders and the way that it enforces the immigration laws. We don't need illusions that the job is being done. We need to have it done in reality. And the final point, Lisa, after 9/11, how many politicians stood there and said hey, nobody connected the dots.
This report connects the dots and they still don't seem to get it. Maybe we need to send these folks crayons or something because the bottom line is they don't seem to want to do anything other than conduct business as usual and at the same time it threatens national security.
SYLVESTER: Yes.
CUTLER: It's outrageous.
SYLVESTER: It is definitely a must read for lawmakers.
CUTLER: Absolutely.
SYLVESTER: And policymakers. Thank you very much, Mike Cutler. We're out of time, but always a pleasure.
CUTLER: Thank you.
SYLVESTER: Appreciate your insight.
CUTLER: Happy, healthy and safe New Year.
SYLVESTER: You too, Mike.
CUTLER: Thanks.
SYLVESTER: Well that brings us to tonight's poll. Is the lack of security at our nation's borders and ports an open invitation to terrorists? Yes or no. Cast your votes at loudobbs.com. We'll bring you the results a little later in the broadcast.
Coming up the Obama team just can't shake the Illinois corruption scandal. Now top Obama advisers may face subpoenas. Three of the nation's top political thinkers will join me with more on that issue and much more.
And what drove a California man dressed as Santa to open fire at a Christmas celebration? We'll have the very latest and hear the 911 tapes. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANNOUNCER: This is LOU DOBBS TONIGHT: news, debate and opinion, an independent view. Here again Lisa Sylvester.
SYLVESTER: The death toll in that Christmas Eve massacre at an L.A. suburb grows to nine tonight. A man dressed as Santa Claus crashed a Christmas Eve party armed with hand guns. He shot at party goers and used a homemade device as a blow torch to destroy the home. Thelma Gutierrez has the latest from Covina, California -- Thelma.
THELMA GUTIERREZ, CNN NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Lisa, police here say this was a crime that was extremely well planned. They say the gunman had targets in mind. He wanted to get at his ex-wife and her immediate family members. He even had a getaway plan concocted.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(voice-over): Forty-five-year-old Bruce Jeffrey Pardo was described by neighbors as a gentle man, who served as an usher at Holy Redeemer Catholic Church. But on Christmas Eve, just before midnight, police say the aerospace employee drove to the home of his ex-in-laws where more than two dozen people, including his former wife and her parents, were having their annual holiday party.
CHIEF KIM RANEY, COVINA POLICE DEPT: There was a knock at the front door and a gentleman dressed as Santa Claus was at the door carrying a large wrapped package.
GUTIERREZ: It was a tradition for a neighbor to dress up like Santa Claus for the party, so when an 8-year-old girl spotted him, she ran toward him. That's when police say pardo pulled out a semiautomatic weapon and shot her in the face. She's expected to survive. Horrified party goers recognized the shooter.
ED WINTER, LA COUNTY CORONER ASST CHIEF: He fired multiple rounds into the people attending the party and multiple people were struck and this is when people were trying to escape the residence or hide under furniture.
GUTIERREZ: Some jumped from windows on the second floor of the house, then police say Pardo pulled out what was in the package.
RANEY: The package he had appears to be a homemade pressurized device that helps spread flammable accelerant throughout the residence.
GUTIERREZ: The home quickly became an inferno. Inside the bodies of nine charred victims, so badly burned, they had to be identified through dental records. Police say pardo was also severely burned.
RANEY: He suffered third-degree Bushes on both arms, also appears that the Santa Claus suit that he was wearing did melt onto his body. Pardo did have $17,000 of cash, saran wrapped to his legs or concealed inside of a girdle that he was wearing. He also had a plane ticket for a flight on an early morning flight Thursday, Christmas morning, from LAX to Canada.
GUTIERREZ: When the rampage was over, the injured gunman drove to his brother's house where he shot and killed himself. The motive, a failed marriage and contentious divorce.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
Now investigators just released pictures of that pressurized canister that Pardo used to start that fire. They say that he apparently used racing fuel and that is why that home beam engulfed in flames so quickly. They also caught up to his car, the getaway car. They say that in that car, there was a suit, another Santa suit that that was booby trapped with hundreds of rounds of ammunition and that he had intended on doing much more harm than he had already done, but just a terrible, terrible situation, Lisa.
SYLVESTER: Yeah, what a horrendous story, Thelma. Do we know anymore? I know that there was a divorce, but do we know anything more about the motive? I mean, because his friends, from what I'm hearing his friends have all said this was a guy you wouldn't expect to be involved in something like this.
GUTIERREZ: Yeah, Lisa. I mean, people described him as a church usher, a person who was very affable, who was very friendly, who would always stop and talk to neighbors. They obviously, he had some kind of a problem with his ex-wife. They had just recently divorced, just a week ago they had reached a settlement so it was a very bitter situation, but police are looking into whether or not he had threatened her for awhile.
They say that there were no restraining orders, however, but they are looking in to the past of that relationship between the couple to find out whether or not he had given them any signs that he was going to be doing this, but they say this was a very, very well-planned crime.
SYLVESTER: And that 8-year-old girl who opened the door, thinking it was Santa Claus, I believe you said that she's going to be OK?
GUTIERREZ: Yeah, she is going to be okay but she was shot in the face. She was taken to a hospital; they say that she will have a long road ahead of her. There was also a 16-year-old girl who was also shot, she will survive as well. But it's just a terrible situation, and you know, when you stop and think, Lisa, these people knew each other. It was about two dozen people, maybe they're related, just a very, very sad Christmas.
SYLVESTER: All right, Thelma Gutierrez, thanks for that great reporting.
Coming up, a short-lived pardon. President Bush reverses course on the pardon for a politically connected Brooklyn developer, accused of scamming hundreds of homeowners. We'll discuss that issue and more with three of the country's top political analysts.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SYLVESTER: Joining me now, three of the best political analysts in the country, all CNN contributors. Former White House political director and Republican strategist, Ed Rollins; syndicated columnists and professor journalism at Lehman College, Miguel Perez; and Democratic strategist, Robert Zimmerman. Thank you all for joining us. Appreciate it. Let's first get started.
So, on Tuesday, President Bush announces 19 pardons and then turns around and says oops, there was a problem with one of them. Obviously there was a man named Isaac Toussie. It was discovered that his father donated a consider amount of sums, $30,000 or so, to Republicans, Isaac Toussie was a convicted of fraud, mail fraud, fraud related to housing. What do you make of that, Robert? What are your thoughts on this?
ROBERT ZIMMERMAN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well, it's interesting, going into this. Presidential pardons are not granted to saints, they're granted to sinners and that's why they're being pardoned. In this particular matter, I can't speak to the merits of that. That should be reviewed by the Department of justice and there are proper legal channels to review it.
What we have here, according to news reports that have been confirmed, this pardon like many others, did not go through the proper Department of Justice channels, they went directly to the White House. What's interesting is the public relations aspect of this, where the White House now is withdrawing the pardon or trying to, they're not sure legally they can, but because of campaign contributions made by this individual's father, yet the White House acknowledged they never bothered asking about contributions.
SYLVESTER: Yeah, Dana Perino, she had a statement and we have a full graphic of this that we want to share with our viewers. I want to read it for you: "Given that no one advising the president knew of the donation by Toussie's father and because of the possibility of an appearance of impropriety, the counsel to the president withdrew his recommendation."
Clearly, though, it seems that they botched this thing. Miguel, do you think they didn't do enough vetting, that they should have checked? I mean, it's fairly easy to see and to check who gave campaign contributions. MIGUEL PEREZ, SYNDICATED COLUMNIST: They should have checked but at the same time if they checked too much then people, the other side of the coin is that some people might accuse the White House of actually granting the pardon because he had a father who was a donor. So, the solution is no one who gives a major donation of this kind should get a pardon of any kind. That way it sends out a clear message that these pardons cannot be bought.
SYLVESTER: OK so, Ed, Scooter Libby, should he get a pardon?
ED ROLLINS, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: I don't think he needs a pardon. I think his sentence was commuted and I think that's, in essence, all that needs to be said. He's not applied for a pardon, not asked for him, so I would be surprised if the president gave him one.
I need to say this, Fred Fielding is the White House counsel, he's a very dear friend of mine, White House counsel under President Reagan and President Nixon, has great political antenna and somehow just missed it. And I think the part of the process is what Robert said, it really all should come to the Justice Department. He should not check contributions because then you start basically making politics a part of it as opposed to the merits, but the system is broken down.
SYLVESTER: OK, I want to turn now, Robert to one of your favorite topics, Caroline Kennedy. She sat down with CNN affiliate New York One a short while ago, and she gave an interview with them. We have a clip that we want to play for you.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CAROLINE KENNEDY, AUTHOR: And I think that I have relationships in Washington that I would like to put to work to benefit the people of New York. You know I ran Health Run, the vice presidential search process for Barack Obama, I have a good working relationship with him. You know, and I saw -- I know what, you know, people in Washington, and I want to be able to be part of the team that uses all my relationships...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SYLVESTER: OK, Robert, clearly she's saying my connections, my ties to President-elect Obama will be good for the state of New York. Your thoughts?
ZIMMERMAN: I think the problem Caroline Kennedy has is that she's listening to her political consultants and she's listening to her political pundits who tell her she's a front-runner. She's not listening to Governor David Paterson who's made it very clear that there's a wide spectrum of very qualified and able individuals. She just came back from a trip from Afghanistan and Iraq with Congressman Steve Israel. There's Andrew Cuomo, there's Congresswoman Caroline Maloney or Kirstan Jilabran (ph).
The point simply here is that Caroline Kennedy has got to demonstrate the leadership and commitment she has to the state. And in fact, instead of taking questions only that are only submitted by writing from reporters and choosing to answer some and ignoring others, not engaging in full disclosure. I mean, Queen Elizabeth is more accessible to her subjects than Caroline Kennedy has been in terms of talking about the issues.
SYLVESTER: OK, Miguel, what do you make of this? I mean, she's starting to do some interviews, there's been a lot of criticism because she has been shielded in a way. I mean, I heard somebody say that they were Sarah Palinizing her...
PEREZ: Frankly, I wish this would be all over and that Governor Paterson would make up his mind as quickly as possible. And I think the solution to all this, if the governor really wants to look good before the voters, because I think that's what's in play here, who he aligns himself with, you know, tell the voters, listen, I'm going to name a placeholder, somebody who's going to hold this position until we can have an election in New York and let you decide whether Caroline Kennedy is qualified or not.
SYLVESTER: Yeah, Governor Paterson says, hey look, I'm not going to be rushed in this, I'm going to take my sweet time.
ROLLINS: Well, he shouldn't be rushed and equally as important what her lobbying campaign has done has put her on the list. She probably wasn't going to be in this list or at least not at the top of the list to begin with.
But, the argument that I know the president or I have people in Washington - there's 100 senators, every senator is important. The man who was ranked 99th four years ago is the president-elect of the United States. I mean, you go there and you argue for the state and the merits of New York and obviously she's not going to be any more important than anybody else who goes and argues in that position.
ZIMMERMAN: That's a very important point, Ed. You know, the issue that Mike Bloomberg is making is that the governor should rush to judgment because of the political turmoil it's creating. Mike Bloomberg and his lieutenants are responsible for creating the political turmoil. That's the very definition of chutzpah.
I think the government has every right to take his time and be deliberative about this and let everyone who wants to come out, everyone who's interested in pursuing this, make their case. I think that's the best way to serve this state. I think the idea that Mike Bloomberg knows best because he can see upstate New York from his townhouse doesn't really cut it with New Yorkers.
SYLVESTER: OK, we're going to have to take a break, here. We will have more with our panel, but first a reminder to vote in tonight's poll. Is the lack of security at our nation's borders and ports an open invitation to terrorists? Yes or no. Cast your votes at loudobbs.com and we'll bring you the results in a few minutes.
Coming up, President-elect Obama has been busy assembling his team, but now he has to choose another member of his family. We'll have the latest developments on the search for the first dog, next. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SYLVESTER: And we're back now with our panel. Well, Blagojevich's lawyers want to subpoena some of the key members of the Obama's inner circle, Valerie Jarrett, Rahm Emanuel. Robert, your thoughts on that?
ZIMMERMAN: Let's understand what's happening, here. Governor Blagojevich, Governor Blagojevich is ultimately a punk, and he's a coward. What is he attempting to do is try to paralyze his state government, ultimately deny a U.S. seat in the Senate to his constituents of Illinois and create all this type of drama around subpoenas for the purpose of a plea bargain. All this is about is trying to galvanize media attention and paralyze his government to force a plea bargain. It's not going to work. Nobody's threatened or intimidated by his threats of subpoenas.
SYLVESTER: You're having harsh words for people, first Bloomberg, now Blagojevich.
ROLLINS: He's got to get in the year.
(LAUGHING)
PEREZ: It's not just about paralyzing the state government, though, there's an effort of paralyzing the Obama administration here and that's what is the threat. I mean, they're not doing it purposely, but yeah, they're doing...
ZIMMERMAN: They're not going to be paralyzed. And Miguel, these are just political tactics that...
PEREZ: But, they want to bog down this administration with concern about investigations and so forth. I hope it doesn't happen, for our sake.
ZIMMERMAN: As long as the media doesn't get carried away with it.
ROLLINS: To the best of all of our knowledge, nothing improper happened by the transition team, by this perfectly legitimate, at least everything I've read that the new chief of staff or anybody else. The idea that you would take people who are now going to be in Washington and at very high level positions and subpoena them to come back and testify before an impeachment trial is absurd. You can basically give whatever testimony you want under subpoena in Washington, D.C., but you cannot disrupt this new administration by being dragged through this crap that's going on there.
SYLVESTER: But, here's the point, they're starting -- they want to start on an up-beat. They have a list of agenda, they've got things that they want to tackle and need to tackle, things like the economy. And Miguel, to your point, they've got this thing in the background buzzing around that they can't seem to shake off. PEREZ: The last thing they need right now, this new administration is to worry about subpoenas and so forth. I mean, we really need -- this country really needs to move forward now and you know, let's say that there was some minor involvement by an Obama administration, what's going to happen? Nothing's going to happen and this country is going to be the worse for it.
ROLLINS: Well, the key thing here is it's in Fitzgerald's hands, Fitzgerald needs to indict him and get this thing moving in the legal process. If the legislature wants to basically impeach him for his past punkedness or lousy governorship or whatever they can do that. But I think the criminal thing has to move forward and move forward quickly.
SYLVESTER: All right, now, speaking of turning the page, we have new numbers out, a CNN Opinion Research Poll shows that most Americans cannot wait for President Bush to leave office. So, there are the figures there, 75 percent, that's three out of four people say they're glad to see Mr. Bush is leaving. Only 23 percent say that they're going to miss him -- Robert.
ZIMMERMAN: He's taken the fun out of saying "I told you so." I mean, this White House, and his administration has, it's really united the country, and in fact, one of the legacies of the Bush years is in fact that we have a Barack Obama, Joe Biden administration, and that we have, in both parties, just hundreds of thousands of new activists and volunteers because I -- hopefully we'll rember the lessons of the type of criminal negligence, incompetent and ultimately scandalous behavior of this White House.
SYLVESTER: Yeah, I want to put that graphic up, because there's another set of numbers that I want to point out -- 51 percent, if you take a look, 51 percent said that they were glad Clinton was leaving, so that 51 percent in 2001 for Clinton, compared to 75 percent for Bush, now. Miguel, what do you make of the numbers?
PEREZ: I almost feel bad, sorry for the president. We want our president to do well and obviously this is one, this is an administration that has failed in so many ways. And you want them to go out with some kind of humble attitude and I think the president is somewhat adopting that attitude on his way out.
Unfortunately he has a vice president who is boasting about the fact that he had all this tremendous power in a failed administration. You know, unapologetic about all the failures and that is Bush's problem.
ROLLINS: Neither will be missed and it is a failed presidency and it's an even more failed vice presidency. I think we've had past presidents, Nixon, obviously, Carter, Ford was voted out of office, we had a period there where we had nothing but failed presidencies. You need to have this new president, basically, restore the confidence in the country. That's what Reagan did, that's what this president needs to do, make Americans feel the government can work for them and it's a big task with all the challenges ahead, but we've got to pray for that... SYLVESTER: Yeah, I think the big thing to take away is that people are ready for change. I mean, that was what Obama campaigned on and that is what these numbers are reflecting. We're ready for change come January 20.
ZIMMERMAN: You have a bipartisan sense of consensus a bipartisan sense of enthusiasm for a new administration. Hopefully that will lead to a stronger sense of working together and a public demanding that their government work in a bipartisan fashion.
SYLVESTER: Robert, you're going to have to the last word because we've got to stop there. We're out of time. Thank you gentlemen, very much for your time. It's always a pleasure.
Well, President-elect Obama has assembled most of his new administration, but one key position remains open in his family. Louise Schiavone has the latest developments on Obama's search for the first dog.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LOUISE SCHIAVONE, CNN NEWS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Sometimes when you're on agenda overload, as the Obama/Biden team might be, it's good to do the simple things first. For both the vice president and the president the move with the fewest policy implications...
BARACK OBAMA (D), UNITED STATES PRESIDENT-ELECT: Tasha and Malia, I love you both, more than you can imagine and you have earned the new puppy that's coming with us to the White House.
JOE BIDEN (D), US VICE PRESIDENT-ELECT: He said I'll make you a deal. He said, you take the vice presidency, you get elected, get a dog.
SCHIAVONE: Joe Biden got straight to work with a German Shepherd puppy-elect. Not only in hand, but also now named "Champ" for sentimental reasons.
BIDEN: My dad's this. He'd say, "Champ, when you get knocked down, just get up, just get up."
SCHIAVONE: For the Obama family it's apparently going to take a while. A good idea given the sometimes high profile roles played by executive matching canines like "Fala," FDR's loyal companion, LBJ's pet beagle, "Him;" Richard Nixon's legendary dog "Checkers."
RICHARD NIXON, FMR U.S. PRESIDENT: The kids, like all kids, love the dog. And I just want to say this right now, that regardless of what they say about it, we're going to keep it.
SCHIAVONE: And a rambunctious "Barney," now parking his doggy bags. For the first family, say the experts, the right dog should be part politician.
PATRICIA MCCONNELL, ANIMAL BEHAVIORIST: You want a dog who loves everybody, you know, you want a dog who's like, hi, who are you? Are you a human? I love humans. They don't want a dog who's cautious and suspicious and is going to bite reporters.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How are you doing?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, that's not how Barney normally is.
SCHIAVONE: About the idea of a rescue dog in the White House, maybe not says this behavior icon.
CESAR MILAN, DOG WHISPERER, NATL GEOGRAPHIC CHANNEL: Rehabilitating a dog, it takes a lot of effort. The president already has a big job, which is rehabilitating the country, so I'd rather have a balanced dog in my house than an unstable dog trying to rehabilitate a country.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCHIAVONE: If you're a student of history or old enough to remember when President Truman said it, you're probably thinking this, if you want a friend in Washington, get a dog - Lisa.
SYLVESTER: I love that. So, what are we talking about, a little guard dog or one of these cute little fluffy little things?
SCHIAVONE: Well, you know, the experts say you're not really supposed to get a guard dog. They have the Secret Service for that and if you ever needed help, you wouldn't want the guard dog preventing somebody helping you. So actually, the -- what I heard today was they were thinking about a little Westy. But you know, they say that a Golden Retrievers have masters and terriers have staff. So, they all have their own cute little personalities and I'm sure it will be a fun search.
SYLVESTER: And you know the media is going to be all over that story, too. All right, thank you very much, Louise Schiavone, for that report.
Well, still ahead, "Heroes." Tonight, we introduce you to a combat medic who braved enemy fire to save the lives of his fellow comrades. His story when we return.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SYLVESTER: Time now for "Heroes," our tribute to the men and women who serve this country in uniform. Tonight, we honor Petty Officer Joshua Chiarini, a combat medic who was awarded the Silver Star for his extraordinary courage and heroism while serving in Iraq. Philippa Holland has his story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PHILIPPA HOLLAND, CNN NEWS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): There are many calls on the battlefield, yet none so urgent as "Corpsman up." It means a marine is down. Petty Officer Joshua Chiarini is one of the corpsmen. In three deployments to Iraq, he did not lose a single Marine. Chiarini says he owes that success to one thing. PETTY OFFICER 2N CLASS JOSHUA CHIARINI, U.S. NAVY: As a corpsman, you got to be always flexible. You know, the role of a medical provider at one time, but you also might need to step in the role as a rifleman, you know, to save one of your Marines.
HOLLAND: During a 2006 deployment in al Anbar Province, Doc Chiarini traveled with the Marine convoy. A roadside bomb forced the lead vehicle off the road.
CHIARINI: As I'm watching this, I'm on the radio, I'm looking forward at them. I see them all climb out. And all of a sudden, as soon as they step out of the vehicle, there is a massive secondary explosion that was twice as big as the first one. And they all disappeared in the giant fire wall and my heart just dropped.
HOLLAND: Chiarini grabbed his rifle and medical kit and dashed more than 100 yards, dodging enemy bullets to the wounded Marines and their interpreter.
CHIARINI: I started taking fire from different sides of the road, but, to me, I didn't know I was getting shot at, like I just running, like all I could think about was, you know, getting to my guys. And it's like running the longest run of your life.
The dreaded sound. You hear "Corpsman up."
HOLLAND: Chiarini moved each wounded man to safety, treating them with one hand, and returning fire with the other.
CHIARINI: It felt like all the other corpsmen had gone before me in the past had their hands on my shoulders while I worked and, you know, a God was looking down on me and taking care of me that day.
HOLLAND: Chiarini now wears a Silver Star for his heroism and he knows what the medal signifies.
CHIARINI: Freedom is not free. I mean, the price is paid in blood, unfortunately.
The real heroes are the ones that haven't come back, who gave all the sacrifice all, and the ones that are still over there fighting right now. And you know, my heart goes out to them, you know, be safe, brothers.
HOLLAND: Philippa Holland, CNN.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SYLVESTER: And we appreciate his service. Well, tonight's poll results, 97 percent of you think the lack of security at our nation's borders and ports is an open invitation to terrorists. Time now for some of your thoughts.
Guy in Kansas writes: "As promised, change is coming. It appears, from Washington, D.C., politics to Chicago politics." Floyd in Texas: "Washington, D.C. needs to practice what they preach. If they would hold themselves accountable they way they do the automakers instead of the banks, or country would be a lot better off. Keep up the good work, although it must be frustrating"
Rich in Ohio, "Lou, you may be alone in the fight for what's right or wrong in this world, but we thank you from the bottom of our heart."
And thanks for being with us tonight. Please join us tomorrow. For all of us here, thanks for watching. Good night from New York. "Flashpoint: How the White House was Won and Lost," a Campbell Brown, NO BIAS, NO BULL special report starts right now.
