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CNN Larry King Live
Interview With Kelsey Smith's Parents, Boyfriend; Paris Goes Home
Aired June 07, 2007 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LARRY KING, HOST: Tonight, Paris Hilton is out of jail -- after three days?
Wasn't she supposed to serve 23?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She has been sent home and she will be confined to her home for the next 40 days.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: So now she goes from a 12 by eight cell with a metal toilet to her mansion.
Has she really learned her lesson?
Did fame give the world's most notorious heiress a get out of jail free card?
Are those mysterious medical issues in her head?
Was an approaching nervous breakdown behind what some are calling a travesty of justice?
We've got all the latest with the Hollywood insider who broke this stunning story this morning and more.
But first, every parent's worst nightmare -- a suspect charged today with abducting and then murdering their beautiful 18-year-old daughter.
Her only mistake -- going shopping at Target.
How can anyone protect their children from that?
Now Kelsey Smith's parents and her boyfriend live from her vigil to tell us how they stayed so strong through this terrible ordeal.
It's all next on LARRY KING LIVE.
Good evening.
All three of our guests in this opening segment are joining us from Shawnee Mission West High School, where a vigil for 18-year-old Kelsey Smith will be starting very shortly. Kelsey graduated from Shawnee Mission West just about two weeks ago.
Greg Smith, one can only imagine what this must be like.
How you are holding up?
GREG SMITH, FATHER OF KELSEY SMITH: Well, we have our moments. We keep it together. We have a little breakdown. Go somewhere and hide until can you compose yourself, come back out and keep going. But we're going to keep pushing because Kelsey would do it for us. So we're going to do it for her.
KING: Missy, how are you doing?
MISSY SMITH, MOTHER OF KELSEY SMITH: I'm doing fine, thanks.
I have my moments like Greg said. But we draw strength on each other. And a few minutes ago, before we were on the air, we were actually laughing. We were remembering stories and thinking of things she would have said to us as we were sitting here.
KING: And John Biersmith, as the boyfriend -- was it a serious situation or kind of just on the young trying out style?
JOHN BIERSMITH, BOYFRIEND OF KELSEY SMITH: Oh, from the time we were dating, it was a serious relationship. And within seven months, I mean, I think we felt more in that time than most couples could ever feel.
KING: Now why weren't you with her that night, John?
BIERSMITH: Because I was coming from buying my own gift and getting ready for that night. And she was buying something for me and didn't want to tell me.
KING: You were both going to a birthday party?
BIERSMITH: Yes. It was a pool party.
KING: Greg, you've been in law enforcement, right?
G. SMITH: Yes, sir.
KING: Well, what -- are you a police officer?
G. SMITH: Currently I work for the Johnson County Community College Department of Public Safety, which is the law enforcement arm for the college.
KING: So when she went missing in a circumstance like that, did you kind of fear the worst?
G. SMITH: It -- it kind of hit me pretty quick because Kelsey is so responsible and she always contacts us if something happens or if she has to change plans or something like that. And I wasn't too concerned when she was 10, 15 minutes late, because that might happen on a rare occasion. But John was over at our house, so he texted her to get an answer. And when she didn't text back, I really started to get concerned.
KING: And now the 26-year-old man, Edwin Hill, has been accused of premeditated first degree murder, aggravated kidnapping.
Do you know anything about him at all, Greg?
G. SMITH: Only what we're hearing on the news broadcast. Nobody in our family is familiar with him at all.
KING: Missy, does this lead you to think -- to put it bluntly -- nobody is safe?
M. SMITH: That's correct. Kelsey did nothing wrong that night. She went to Target to get a gift. She was coming back home. She was going to be home by 7:20 p.m. And it just happened. She didn't do anything wrong.
KING: John, what is it like for you when you see that -- that TV shot from Target?
BIERSMITH: It's something you just don't believe and you have to watch it over and over again. I've been on YouTube like -- I've seen that video at least 30 times, of her walking in and out of Target.
KING: How were you told, Greg?
G. SMITH: Told that she was missing?
KING: No, told that she had deceased.
G. SMITH: Officers -- one of the lead officers on the case called me on the phone and said he had some news and he'd like to talk to me, he'd like to meet personally. And I asked him if it was something I should be concerned about. And he said you need to brace yourself.
So I went and told my wife that we might be getting bad news and we waited out front of the house until the officers got there, which was just a matter of minutes.
KING: And, Missy, who told you?
M. SMITH: Captain Frederickson told us together.
KING: Did you know it before he said it?
M. SMITH: Sure. Yes.
KING: John, how were you told?
BIERSMITH: I was almost out to Longview Lake. I had to go drop off a phone charger for Tim Miller. And all of a sudden they kicked me out of Longview Lake -- or told me I couldn't go any further and I had to go back to the house. I knew something was wrong then. And so I listened to the radio on the way home. That's how I heard.
KING: You heard it on the radio?
BIERSMITH: I heard that they found what they found on the radio. And it wasn't until I saw the cop cars on her street that I -- that I realized what happened.
KING: There is a memorial planned tonight. There's going to be a vigil tonight.
And then -- are other things being planned, Missy?
M. SMITH: Absolutely. Tonight it's a candlelight vigil for all of her friends on the marching field. She so loved marching band. Then in a few days we'll have a memorial to her. And then there will be a private service for us.
KING: Any other thing planned?
Are they going to plan something at the school, Greg?
G. SMITH: Well, they've already done so much here at the high school.
M. SMITH: Oh.
G. SMITH: Just as -- when we came up here tonight, the sign out front that announces what high school this is had a sign on it that said "Remembering Kelsey." They flew the flag here at half mast. They offered the services of the school counselors today for all the kids at school to talk to the -- all of her friends. I mean school is out for the summer and they're opening up this school. It's like it's our second house.
M. SMITH: Yes.
KING: Missy, the pictures we see of her, she was a strikingly beautiful girl.
What can you tell us about her?
M. SMITH: The stories we were remembering were -- there was one time she wanted John to try vanilla ice cream with corn flakes. And she was so stubborn. I was like Kelse, just say please. And she wouldn't do it. And he wasn't going to give in unless she said please. And he asked me if I had wet wipes, because he knew it was going to be a mess.
And she finally looked at him and said will you please just try it, you freaking "a-hole." She was life.
KING: Oh.
M. SMITH: When you think of an all-American girl, she was it.
BIERSMITH: All around. KING: John, was she...
M. SMITH: All around. Very talented.
KING: John, was she going to go to college?
BIERSMITH: Yes, she was going to go to K State to be -- or she was going to major in veterinary.
KING: Oh, she wanted to be a veterinarian?
BIERSMITH: That's correct.
KING: And, Greg, what memory holds do you have of her?
Well, you have -- much have so many. Fathers and daughters are so tied.
G. SMITH: Yes. Actually, one of the -- one of most recent memories, that same day she went missing, we had spent the day -- the afternoon -- in a carnival and gone around and rode the rides together and visited the attractions and that, and just had a really good time.
KING: Thank you all very much.
We wish you nothing but the best.
Greg and Missy Smith and John Biersmith.
And you can seat parents and the boyfriend at the top of the next hour with Nancy Grace on "HEADLINE NEWS."
And we'll be right back.
COMMERCIAL
KING: Welcome back to LARRY KING LIVE.
The big story in other circles, of course, the release of Paris Hilton from jail today.
Harvey Levin joins us in Los Angeles, the managing editor of TMZ.com. They broke the story of Paris Hilton's release.
Tony Potts, correspondent for "Access Hollywood." He is also in Los Angeles.
Also in L.A. Is Jodie "Babydoll" Gibson, the former Hollywood madam and author of "Secrets of a Hollywood Super Madam." She spent two months behind bars in a high power section of a twin tower jail, a sister facility to the one where Paris was incarcerated.
Mark Geragos, the high profile defense attorney. Among his past celebrity clients, Winona Ryder and Michael Jackson.
And in L.A. Dr. Carol Lieberman, M.D. and forensic psychiatrist, and best-selling author.
And in Phoenix, Arizona, Sheriff Joe Arpaio, the Maricopa County sheriff in Arizona. He has been dubbed the toughest sheriff in the West.
Earlier this month -- he's, by the way, in front of his jail with some prisoners behind him. He offered to let Paris Hilton do her time in one of his County jails. The offer was declined by L.A. officials.
Harvey, let's start with you.
The L.A. city attorney -- we just got this in -- Rocky Delgadillo, files a motion today to return Paris Hilton to jail. There'll be a hearing Friday morning.
What is -- what are the grounds for this Harvey?
HARVEY LEVIN, EDITOR, TMZ.COM, BROKE STORY OF PARIS HILTON'S RELEASE: Well, he is saying that the sheriff had absolutely no authority to put her basically under house arrest; that his order, the judge's order, should have stuck. And, Larry, not only is the city attorney asking that Paris Hilton be returned to jail, but he's asking that the sheriff be held in contempt of court. And the judge has now ordered the hearing and ordered that Paris Hilton attend.
KING: Tony Potts, do we know why the sheriff released her?
TONY POTTS, "ACCESS HOLLYWOOD" CORRESPONDENT: We're working on that. They say it was a medical issue and also there may have been some overcrowding, as well.
But the -- the sheriff only has jurisdiction to do that if there is overcrowding. And, also, one of the things that I remember the judge saying when I was in court that day, that he never wanted her to be with a wrist band, with a leg bracelet, as well. And that's one of the things that she has now.
So I think that L.A. County Superior Court is very upset over all of this, Larry.
KING: Jodie, you served two months in jail.
What were you sentenced for?
JODY "BABYDOLL" GIBSON, EX-MADAME, DID TIME IN SISTER FACILITY WHERE HILTON SERVED: For running my escort empire.
KING: And what were you -- how much time were you supposed to do?
GIBSON: Well, no, I did two-and-a-half years in a maximum security prison after the two-and-a-half months I did in a facility waiting to go to prison.
KING: Oh, I see.
So you were in the jail awaiting the time to go to prison?
GIBSON: Correct. But, Larry, I have to tell you while I was there, I saw girls, you know, I saw a girl that had a complication from an intrauterine device. And she was operated by the county doctor with no painkillers, no anesthesia. And she came back from that operation looking like she got hit by a Mack truck. And nobody sent her home.
KING: Mark Geragos, before we ask you, you were on this program last month, after Paris got a 45-day sentence. And here's what you said about how long she might serve.
Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FROM "LARRY KING LIVE," MAY 11, 2007)
KING: Are you saying you think if she goes she'll do 45 days?
MARK GERAGOS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I think -- no, because with credits, the most they can keep her is 30. She -- if they're going to be fair about it -- and this sheriff is, you know, Sheriff Baca is a pretty fair guy.
KING: Yes, he is.
GERAGOS: But if they're going to be fair, she shouldn't do more than two or three days, because nobody else is doing more than two the president three days on something like this.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: So, Mr. Geragos, you were on the money. Therefore, you are not surprised.
GERAGOS: Well, thanks. I -- well, I was a little worried that I said two weeks.
Thank you, Larry.
I appreciate that.
KING: You were not surprised?
GERAGOS: No, I was -- I not only was not surprised. In fact, she did about double to triple what anybody else would have done. Normally what happens -- and I've got three clients and I think I told you last time, similarly situated clients. I've had one within the last week who literally turned themselves in, took the bus ride and were released right from county jail onto the electronic monitoring and then was released from that in six days.
If you do what Paris did, where you turn yourself into the jail, then they will not -- they'll just turn you around and release you immediately. So when people say was Paris getting special treatment, I say, yes. She got double or triple what everybody else in L.A. County gets. KING: Dr. Lieberman, you are surprised?
DR. CAROLE LIEBERMAN, FORENSIC PSYCHIATRIST: I'm outraged. I think that this is terrible. Not only is it a bad influence for lots of other people who follow the fashions and whatever else Paris Hilton does, but it teaches people to disrespect the law.
And, you know, I think the most interesting thing is if we were to take out all the people in jails and prisons who have psychological problems, there would be nobody in these jails and prisons. Now it's true that there needs to be better psychological and medical treatment in these facilities. But that is not a reason in itself to let her go.
KING: And I would imagine -- I don't want to guess, Sheriff Arpaio -- you do not agree with this?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO, MARICOPA COUNTY, ARIZONA, KNOWN AS "TOUGHEST SHERIFF IN THE WEST": No, I don't agree with it. The sheriff is my friend. I did call him May 14 and offer to take Paris to my jails, put her in these tents, because of jail overcrowding.
But I am rather shocked that this situation did occur. It sends a bad message. It's a bad day for the criminal justice system, a bad day for law enforcement. She should do her time.
Is it because she has -- she's a celebrity and she has a lot of money?
GERAGOS: No.
ARPAIO: Is that difference?
GERAGOS: No. It's actually...
ARPAIO: Well, you say no.
GERAGOS: No, she's not doing more time -- she's doing more time because she is a celebrity, Sheriff. The problem is we have overcrowding here...
ARPAIO: Oh, you've got some stupid laws out there.
GERAGOS: We -- well -- we don't have stupid laws.
ARPAIO: Oh, that's no (UNINTELLIGIBLE)...
GERAGOS: We have overcrowding. We've got 25,000 prisoners in a space for 12,000. And we've got people going to jail who shouldn't be going to jail. That's the bottom line.
LEVIN: But here's the problem.
GERAGOS: The sheriff doesn't have the money.
LEVIN: But here's the problem -- the basis for what happened was not based on overcrowding. We know from law enforcement sources that what happened here is her shrink visited Paris in jail yesterday and the shrink then went to the jail officials and said she's about to have a nervous breakdown. And then they got all the medical people in the jail to sign off and say Paris is really fragile, she's going to have a nervous breakdown.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.
LEVIN: And the sheriff let her loose.
KING: All right, let me...
LEVIN: And that's not about overcrowding.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, but...
KING: Hold your idea, Harvey.
Let me get a break and we'll come right back and pick it up. Don't go away.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FROM "THE VIEW," COURTESY ABC)
BARBARA WALTERS, CO-HOST: So he said she was reassigned to her home.
JOY BEHAR, CO-HOST: She can travel within 4,000 feet, which is like her bedroom. That's her bedroom.
ELISABETH HASSELBECK, CO-HOST: She was stressed out, like I'm sure no one is when you get into prison.
WALTERS: All we know is this -- Paris Hilton...
BEHAR: Is out.
WALTERS: ... is out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COMMERCIAL
KING: You're looking at the house where Paris Hilton lives. The joke around town is she went from the big house to a really big house.
We have an e-mail question from Laura in San Leandro, California: "I just want to know, if Paris had any kind of medical problem, why wasn't she taken to a hospital instead of sent home?"
Dr. Lieberman, is that a good question?
LIEBERMAN: Absolutely. There are facilities -- there are ways to take care of the medical and psychiatric problems that prisoners have. So there's no excuse for her having to go home to take care of it.
And, also, what's interesting is to think about what kind of psychiatric problem she was having. Why was it so -- why was she on the verge of a nervous breakdown?
And the answer is not because the situation in the big house was so bad, per se, because she was in a special section. But it was because Paris was now having to face Paris -- to confront her inner demons, that when she's on the outside, she escapes in -- she escapes away from and into shopping, into sex, into alcohol, into drugs, into all kinds of other things. But in jail, she had to sit in this small cell and confront herself. And that was what was upsetting to her.
GIBSON: Larry, can I say something for a moment?
Larry, if you remember the last time I was here, I told you that she would be in a cell by herself. And all of your other correspondents argued and said, no, she would have someone with her. So, clearly I was correct on that.
KING: OK.
GIBSON: The problem here is that at the core of this violation was the fact that she was drinking and driving. And this sends out a really negative message to all the 17-year-olds that emulate Paris that it's OK to mess up and, you know, violate probation because it results in a 72 hour...
KING: Tony...
POTTS: Yes, Larry?
KING: OK.
I've got -- Tony, we have learned -- or, apparently a spokesman for the judge who sentenced her, Superior Court Judge Michael Sauer -- says the judge did not agree with the terms of the release.
Do you know that to be true?
POTTS: Yes. Absolutely. In the statement today they said that, as well.
Also, one thing I would like to ask Dr. Lieberman, what if she was on prescription drugs and those are taken away?
Psychologically, does the doctor have the -- the authority to come in and say that she needs to continue to do those?
Could that be a possibility?
LIEBERMAN: Many prisoners get prescription drugs in jail if it's been authorized by a psychiatrist in the jail or outside making a suggestion to the psychiatrist in the jail. Yes. All of that can be taken care of and still the person would be imprisoned.
KING: Mark, doesn't the judge have control of the prisoner, not the sheriff?
GERAGOS: No.
KING: No?
GERAGOS: Actually, in L.A. County this weird dance has gone on now for about 12 years. What used to happen was the sheriff, in order to alleviate overcrowding, would say anybody whose bail is less than $10,000, I'm going to let -- I'm going to release.
So the judges said, OK, we'll raise the minimum bail to $12,000.
Then the sheriff would say OK, anybody who is under $15,000, I'm going to release.
And that game went on until we got to about $25,000.
Then the sheriff decided -- and this was before Sheriff Baca -- so the sheriff says, OK, when it's post-conviction, after you've pled, I'm going to just release the least threatening or the least violent prisoners. Obviously, Paris Hilton on a probation violation for driving on a suspended license is A-number-one in terms of the least violent.
KING: Right.
GERAGOS: And that's how he alleviates the crowding.
KING: Got you.
GERAGOS: Remember, this prison system in California and the jail system in California are both periodically under federal review for overcrowding. That's what the fundamental problem is here that nobody wants to talk about.
KING: Sheriff, Arpaio, what's the -- what's the ruling in Phoenix?
Do you have control of when someone gets out or the judge who sentenced them?
ARPAIO: No. Once they come to jail, they stay in jail. I don't let them out early. They stay here.
KING: Never?
ARPAIO: Never. Never happened. And I have 10,000 people in jail, 2,000 in these tents. They do the full time. And there is no electronic bracelets or anything like that.
KING: Don't you think some people are entitled to early release?
ARPAIO: Well, I don't know how early you're talking about.
KING: Well, let's say someone gets...
ARPAIO: ... if you get 45 days...
KING: If someone gets a year, might they be entitled to get out in eight months?
ARPAIO: No. That depends if they work, we can give them two for one. I make that decision.
KING: You make the...
ARPAIO: I make the decision. That's right.
GERAGOS: Why...
ARPAIO: And...
GERAGOS: Why would you want to keep somebody who is a non- violent person at $30,000 a year incarcerated?
What sense does that make in a state that's now running a deficit?
ARPAIO: Well, wait a minute. Wait a minute.
GERAGOS: Well, you want to keep...
ARPAIO: I'm tired of hearing about money.
GERAGOS: Well, you want to...
(CROSSTALK)
ARPAIO: No, see, our meals...
GERAGOS: Why are you tired of hearing about money?
ARPAIO: Wait a minute.
GERAGOS: You want to pay...
ARPAIO: I'm going to tell you something...
GERAGOS: You're going to raise taxes?
KING: One at a time!
ARPAIO: Our meals are 15 cents. Our meals are 15 cents, 30 cents a day.
GERAGOS: Fantastic.
ARPAIO: These tents cost nothing. OK?
GERAGOS: Fantastic.
ARPAIO: So don't give me the money issue.
GERAGOS: And the money...
ARPAIO: It's always the money issue. GERAGOS: It costs $30,000 a year, minimum.
ARPAIO: Well, maybe in L.A. It does, when you feed them.
GERAGOS: Well, it's more expensive real estate than out in the desert, I'm sure.
KING: Now, we have lost the sheriff there a moment.
Harvey...
GERAGOS: They gave him early release.
(LAUGHTER)
KING: Harvey, I hate to seem dumb and stupid.
Why is this such a story, story?
LEVIN: Well, it's a -- it's a big story now because it's not just Paris Hilton, but the whole system now is under a microscope, Larry. I mean this is the quintessential celebrity justice, at least that's the argument.
Again, this has nothing to do with overcrowding.
Did Paris Hilton get cut a break because the sheriff said, you know, we don't want to send her to the psych ward at County because it's too big and bad, so we're going to send her home.
And, you know, Larry, what is really going on...
(CROSSTALK)
POTTS: But, also, Harvey, he's not up for reelection until -- Sheriff Baca -- until 2010. So that has...
LEVIN: But I'll tell you what's really going on here.
POTTS: Right?
LEVIN: What's -- what's really going on here is the sheriff wanted Paris Hilton out of that jail, because she was stopping the trains. Everything was about Paris Hilton. And I kind of get the sheriff's point of view on this thing. They couldn't function. Everything they were doing was...
POTTS: They can't function because of one person?
LEVIN: They wanted -- they wanted. Yes. I mean it was literally derailing them.
GERAGOS: I don't understand...
POTTS: But there were only a couple of us outside after two days. GERAGOS: I still don't understand why you have to say it has nothing to do with overcrowding. It does have something to do with fundamental fairness. How is it that you say -- the sheriff says I'm going to make her do 23 days on 45 when every other person who gets 45 days in her situation is not getting 23 days?
LEVIN: Mark, you're right.
GERAGOS: I think that's unfair.
LEVIN: But the problem is the judge -- the sheriff did the right thing, but maybe for the wrong reason.
GERAGOS: Well, he used it...
LEVIN: And that's the issue.
GERAGOS: I think what happened is he got -- he saw what was happening to her. He knows that he had an issue there. He knows fundamentally -- this is a very fair man, Lee Baca is. And he says you know what?
At a certain point, I'm not going to keep her here when I'm letting everybody else out the back door and she's got a medical problem, and it's a severe medical problem.
LIEBERMAN: Oh...
GERAGOS: Why not?
LIEBERMAN: It is not a (UNINTELLIGIBLE)...
GERAGOS: And, you know, Dr. Lieberman...
LIEBERMAN: It is not (UNINTELLIGIBLE)...
GERAGOS: ... I understand...
LIEBERMAN: ... medical problem.
GERAGOS: You haven't diagnosed her. You make a career out of going around diagnosing people who you've never seen it, so don't even say it.
LIEBERMAN: I'm not giving her a diag...
GERAGOS: So don't even say it.
LIEBERMAN: I don't know what you're talking about.
GERAGOS: Then why are you saying it's...
LIEBERMAN: I'm not giving her a diagnosis...
GERAGOS: ... not a severe diag -- a severe problem?
LIEBERMAN: Well, I'm going by what the...
GERAGOS: How do you know?
LIEBERMAN: I'm giving -- I'm going by what...
GERAGOS: How do you know?
LIEBERMAN: ... the doctor himself said.
GERAGOS: The doctor can't say anything because he's got HIPAA regulations. You know that...
LIEBERMAN: Yes, but he wrote something...
GERAGOS: ... as well as I do.
LIEBERMAN: ... he wrote something in a declaration, number one.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (UNINTELLIGIBLE).
LIEBERMAN: And, number two, the point is that whatever -- there are people who are on suicide watch...
GERAGOS: That's correct.
LIEBERMAN: ... in jail and in prisons.
GERAGOS: And those are people who are generally charged...
LIEBERMAN: And they take...
(CROSSTALK)
KING: All right, I've got to get a break, guys.
GERAGOS: ... with real felonies.
KING: I've got to...
GERAGOS: With real cases.
KING: We'll be right back.
And please try to talk one at a time.
We'll be right back.
Don't go away.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, COURTESY TMZ.COM)
PARIS HILTON (SINGING): And I can escape and recreate a place that's my own world, and I could be your favorite girl forever. Perfectly together. And tell me boy, now wouldn't that be sweet?
(END VIDEO CLIP) (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HILTON: I wanted to go to County to show that I can do it and I want to be treated like everyone else.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... making it up.
But the word is that Paris isn't adapting to the jail experience at all.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She has been fitted with an ankle bracelet and she has been sent home and she will be confined to her home for the next 40 days.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And she will be confined to her home for the next 60 days.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: We're back with our outstanding panel. Al Sharpton, who always has an opinion on everything, says that he met Paris when he hosted "Saturday Night Live." And then says, "Her release gives all the appearance of economic and racial favoritism." Do you buy it, Harvey?
LEVIN: That is stupid. That is just stupid for Al Sharpton to turn this into a racial issue. It's insane, Larry. I mean this is an issue of Paris Hilton versus John Doe, whether John Doe is black or white or green. And the issue is did she get celebrity justice and I think that's a really important debate that you asked earlier: why is this case resonating the way it is. It's because it now has the layers of all this a fair treatment for people. And I think that's something everybody cares about vitally.
KING: We have an e-mail question from Linda in Boulder, Colorado: "Can Paris party at her mansion while she's under house arrest?" Mark?
GERAGOS: Can she party at her mansion?
KING: Yes. GERAGOS: Most of the electronic monitors have you blow into a breathalyzer periodically. So she can party if she's doing something other than alcohol.
KING: Can she have visitors sleep over, guests, any restrictions?
GERAGOS: Yes. The only restrictions are on the form that probation gives you, you sign a contract basically and the contract says that you won't leave except for specified activities. It can be church, it can be laundry, it could be school, things of that nature. And you can go grocery shopping occasionally.
TONY POTTS, CORRESPONDENT, "ACCESS HOLLYWOOD": And Larry, I was outside the house today and Mrs. Beasley's man arrived with cupcakes and was mauled trying to get inside. Now I don't know if there is a trans fat issue there, but also that and also some special pet food was delivered as well. So everybody is coming and going from there today.
KING: Doctor -- go ahead.
GIBSON: I have a question, Larry. I'm just curious, and maybe Mark can answer me on this, is there some sort of charity that one can make a contribution to that's associated with the Police Benevolent situation. I'm just curious if that does exit or not?
GERAGOS: Why, implying that there's something going on?
GIBSON: I'm only inquiring.
GERAGOS: I just go back to what I said before and whether it was anybody else. When we cast this as celebrity justice, the problem you've got is you can go back, find me one person who's gotten a 45- day sentence for a driving offense who's doing this kind of time. There isn't anybody else who's doing it.
LEVIN: But not only that, but sheriff's deputies union has basically come out and said what is the sheriff doing? This is ridiculous. So this is not...
KING: Wait a minute, though. But Harvey, now Mark doesn't need anybody to defend him. But he's up against it here tonight because everybody disagrees with him.
LEVIN: I'll help you out, Mark.
KING: But Harvey, if this attorney who represents people there all the time tells you that people are regularly let out after three days, why you are upset if she's let out after three days?
LEVIN: Look, my only issue is she should have never been sentenced to what she was sentenced to. This judge was insane to do that. She should have gotten out after two or three days. I agree with that but it should have been based on overcrowding. And I just have issues. I don't know... GERAGOS: As opposed to the medical. And that's where Harvey and I agree. I listened to that -- I mean this morning I saw them interrupt the G-8 conference so they could break to the Paris Hilton. And I heard Steve Whittmore, who I like a lot, the sheriff's spokesman, I worked with him on numerous cases, I heard him say the medical conditions and I said -- I thought to myself, oh, Steve, why even go there because that is going to open up a whole other can of worms. And why not explain to the public what's going on? It's a wonderful opportunity to educate the public. Do you want to just keep raising your taxes in order to just warehouse people who don't belong there?
LIEBERMAN: You know, but I think that the fact that the G-8 conference has been interrupted for this and the fact that this is a story that's going out internationally shows that people are laughing at us all over the world. Whatever the issue is about crowding, and I don't really think people should be punished or not punished depending upon how much room there is for them, I think we need to find more room for them.
GERAGOS: You think she should do more time because of who she is?
(CROSSTALK)
KING: Mark, let her talk.
LIEBERMAN: I think that -- we look like fools, that we're trying to spread democracy and justice and freedom and all this all over world. And in the meantime, people are seeing that a celebrity, yet again, just like O.J. and many other celebrities, are getting special celebrity justice. And I think that that's terrible.
GERAGOS: How are they doing extra time give you celebrity justice? That's the celebrity injustice. She is doing more time than anybody else.
LIEBERMAN: That was the time that the judge sentenced her to.
GERAGOS: The judges in this county -- there's over 300 judges who sentence people every day. When I go into every courtroom, there isn't a lawyer around who will tell you that when you go into a courtroom, you tell the judge, I would like you to order the sheriff to move this person from this jail to this jail because he's getting raped there. The judge will say, "I'm sorry, I can't do that. I've got no control over the sheriff." They don't have any control. The sheriff is under federal orders. The state is under federal orders. They're about to take over the prison system in this state. And people are arguing about whether Paris Hilton should get three days or 45 days?
KING: Let me get a break. We'll be right back, guys, with more on this topic. Don't go away.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) KING: We're back. By the way, Robin Gibbons, who is due to be us with on the program tonight, will be here tomorrow night on LARRY KING LIVE.
Now we'll get back to our panel in a little while. We welcome for this segment Glynn Birch. Glynn is the national president of Mothers Against Drunk Driving. You know them as MADD. His 21- month-old son this is he, Courtney, was killed by a drunken driver in 1988. Why is a man president of Mothers Against Drunk Driving?
GLYNN BIRCH, PRESIDENT, MOTHERS AGAINST DRUNK DRIVING: Well, because I believe in Mothers Against Drunk Driving. I'm very thankful for the mothers that gave me a platform to talk about the violent crash that my son was involved with, my youngest son.
KING: And how do you associate this with Paris Hilton, because she had drunk driving charges?
BIRCH: That's correct.
KING: So what do you think of this whole thing?
BIRCH: Well, first of all, Paris has not shown any responsibility. She violated the rights to drive by driving drunk. She violated her rights by driving on a suspended license. She even asked the governor for leniency in her sentencing, got it reduced and now she has the house arrest for 40 days.
You know, the thing about this, Larry, is this is not unusual. The sentence she has right now, as Mothers Against Drunk Driving knows, happens too frequently. Drunk driving...
KING: To lots of people?
BIRCH: Absolutely.
KING: So do you think she's being singled out or you're mad at the whole process?
BIRCH: We're very concerned about the whole process. Drunk driving is one of the most frequently committed violent crimes in America and it should be treated that way.
We talk about my son's death. You know, I can tell you about drama when it comes to -- and having to go to a hospital, finding your youngest son there and being told that he was involved in a crash and then later finding out it was a drunk driver. You know, the drunk driver that killed my son had three prior convictions, blood alcohol of 0.26. So...
KING: What do you want to happen to Paris?
BIRCH: Paris, along with the house arrest when she gets out, her vehicle should have ignition anti-lock installed into it.
KING: What is that? BIRCH: An alcoholic ignition anti-lock is a device that's placed on the car. Whenever it needs to start -- it's connected to the ignition system. Before she can start it, she has to blow into this device. It's an exercise. It's a humming. And if it detects alcohol at a certain level, the car won't start. This way there's no way that she can violate, you know, driving drunk.
KING: Is this common?
BIRCH: It's common. Well, we want it to be common. We are in Washington, D.C. to make sure that most states follow the same example that New Mexico has. Every convicted drunk driver in New Mexico has to have an ignition anti-lock placed in the vehicle. They had a 12 percent reduction in deaths. And we are here to make sure that our legislative leaders understand that. And so we're mandating that all states have convicted -- all convicted drunk drivers with an ignition lock.
KING: Shouldn't any person that drinks want that? No, you would think you'd want it just for you own protection.
BIRCH: It's as simple as you just said so. You know, the thing about it, though, is, Larry in, 2006, for the past 15 years we've had the highest death rates due to alcohol-related fatalities. And for 0.08 or above, which is drunk driving, and Paris was arrested, I believe at 0.08, it's at 14,000. Now if America is it happy with losing 14,000 lives every single year, which is 100 percent preventable, then we're fine.
KING: Sure is, thanks, Glynn.
BIRCH: Thank you for your time, Larry.
KING: Glynn Birch, national president, Mothers Against Drunk Driving.
We'll be back with more on the Paris Hilton caper right after this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Paris?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Paris?
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let this man out of here. Move! Let this man out of here. Let this man out of here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: We're back. We've made connections with the sheriff again. We'll bring him right in, but we have a statement from Paris Hilton released through her attorney, Richard Hutton. "I want to thank the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department and staff of the Century Regional Detention Center for treating me fairly and professionally. I am going to serve the remaining 40 days of my sentence. I have learned a great deal from this ordeal and hope that others have learned from my mistakes."
Does that satisfy you, Sheriff Arpaio?
ARPAIO: No, it doesn't satisfy me. Of course she's happy. She's going to live in a house arrest or whatever you want to call it. Of course she's happy. I'm glad that they treated her nice. The sheriff is a professional guy. He's a friend. But the whole system is awful and this is a national/international story. What message are we sending around the world over this type of situation?
KING: You have many prisoners there that are in for drunk driving or suspended licenses due to drunk driving, sheriff?
ARPAIO: Yes, I got them in. I got 2,000 in hot tents here. They're doing their time. They're not getting out early. They're doing their time. And, you know, everybody complains about how much it costs. That's not the issue. That's not the issue. When you violate the law, you go to jail, you do you your time. It's a very simple philosophy.
KING: And do you think it works?
ARPAIO: What works? It worked for her. She's not doing her time.
KING: No, I mean they don't do crimes again?
ARPAIO: Well, some of them come back. But you know what, they want to come back. They're still going to wear the pink underwear and striped uniforms and work on the chain gang. I can go on and on. That's how I run this operation.
KING: Mark? How do you react to that?
GERAGOS: This is a family rated show, isn't it? So I can't really react to it. I mean he's a bumper sticker. He doesn't understand the system. He doesn't understand that there...
ARPAIO: Don't tell me -- I've been doing this for 15 years. You're full of garbage. Why don't you come down here because if you violate the law, you know where you're going?
GERAGOS: Yes, trust me; I don't need to come around anywhere near where you are. The problem is...
ARPAIO: Well, that's great, stay where you're at.
GERAGOS: Promise me -- I promise you, I will. The problem with what he does is it doesn't solve anything. He's got a higher recidivism rate than virtually any other place in the country.
ARPAIO: Well, you're full of garbage. Show me that. GERAGOS: Everything he's talking about is just utter nonsense. So...
KING: Now we have a...
GERAGOS: .. he can do whatever he wants. And if the county likes that, more power to him. I guess the alternative is can you go and live there.
KING: We have an e-mail question from Brian in Rolla, Mississippi. "Will Paris at least have to give up her driver's license and do community service like an ordinary person would have to?"
Do you know, Harvey?
LEVIN: No. I mean this is a straight sentence, Larry. This is not about community service. This is specifically about a probation violation, driving on a suspended license. So the big issue now is she's getting hauled into court tomorrow. And the question is will the judge throw her back in jail? And my strong opinion about this is the judge has absolutely no authority to do this. The sheriff has jurisdiction over what the sheriff did right or wrong. And I think, though, there is going to be just a huge dog fight in court tomorrow.
KING: Do you think it could come to it, Tony, that we have a kind of conflict here judicially?
POTTS: Absolutely. And also, you know, if she does community service down the road, will it be like Naomi Campbell? Will she show up in her Jimmy Cho's and make a spectacle of it as opposed to turn it into what it really is? And would anybody really listen to Paris Hilton in the community anyway? So we'll see what happens tomorrow. I'll be down at the court at 9:00 a.m. tomorrow morning to see what goes on. It'll be very interesting, Larry.
KING: Dr. Lieberman, as a psychiatrist, why weren't you more sympathetic to her?
LIEBERMAN: Well, you know, I am sympathetic in the way that I think that she should have gotten and still get lots of psychiatric treatment. And actually the psychiatrist who was so quick to say that she should be let out because she's on the verge of a nervous breakdown, should have been treating her all along before she went into jail because if he realized, which he should have that she was going to have a hard time with it, as I said before, facing her demons, then he should have been preparing her every day for what she was going to have to face.
And you know the saddest thing -- I do feel sorry for her in the sense that they -- Paris and her family and lawyers are all feeling pretty smug right now and celebrating. But, you know, really the best thing that could have happened to her would have been for her to go to jail and face these demons and confront the things in her life from her past that are making her go out and drink and...
GERAGOS: She went to jail. She was there. She was there for 72 hours.
LIEBERMAN: Not long enough. She needs to stop being a spoiled brat. She needs to...
(CROSSTALK)
LEVIN: And if I'm in jail for three days, I'd be scared to death.
GERAGOS: How much more time do you need?
LIEBERMAN: Well, she has to stop being a spoiled brat and has to learn some rules and has to really...
(CROSSTALK)
LEVIN: But it's not like you're sentencing like you're Dr. Phil. You sentence people to punish them.
LIEBERMAN: No, she needs therapy.
LEVIN: No, no. You don't sentence -- you do not sentence people to look into their inner soul and become better people. You sentence them to punish them.
LIEBERMAN: Yes. What I'm saying is she should be getting the punishment that she was awarded by the judge and she should be seeing a therapist.
GERAGOS: She got it. She's seeing a therapist. You don't know if she saw the therapist before. You're guessing.
LIEBERMAN: No, I'm not guessing, Mark. The therapist...
GERAGOS: And once again, you're doing what you do best, which is to diagnose from the sidelines.
LIEBERMAN: When you don't have something smart to say, you go into a personal attack.
GERAGOS: All I know with you is that you have a history of doing this.
LIEBERMAN: The attorney said -- the psychiatrist said in his own declaration that he has seen Paris off and on and what she needs is somebody to be seeing her in regular therapy.
KING: I've got to get one more break in and we'll be back with our remaining moments. Don't go away.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: More popular than ever.
JIMMY KIMMEL, "THE JIMMY KIMMEL SHOW": We're listening, Paris Hilton. DAVID LETTERMAN, HOST, "LATE SHOW WITH DAVID LETTERMAN": This Paris Hilton thing...
JAY LENO, HOST, "THE TONIGHT SHOW": Paris is going to take responsibility and do the time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For one, I think she shouldn't have got out. I think she should have done her time. You do the crime, you do the time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm happy Paris Hilton got out of jail. And I'm just glad she's going to have the 40 days at home.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think it's ridiculous. I don't think she should have been let off easy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it's a sad day in America when it's better to be rich and guilty than poor and innocent. I mean if that was me or anybody that I know we'd still be in jail right now.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: Those are King Cam cameras out today reacting to the early release of Paris Hilton from jail.
By the way, a reminder that the parents of the late Kelsey Smith and her boyfriend -- the tragedy that occurred in Kansas -- those parents and boyfriend will be on with Nancy Grace on "HEADLINE NEWS" at the top of the hour.
What do you think is going to happen tomorrow, Mark Geragos?
GERAGOS: Well, the judge is going to huff and puff but there's not much that he can do. The sentence has already been imposed. She turned herself in. The sheriff released her. The city attorney, I understand their frustration. I mean you have to understand from their standpoint, all they deal with is misdemeanors. So virtually all of their sentences are meaningless in misdemeanor cases because people get released. So they're venting their frustration and they're going to do that. But ultimately if the judge tries to put her back in, he's on very shaky legal ground. In fact, I would think it would be a double jeopardy situation because she has already turned herself in. She's already been sentenced. He can't control what the sheriff does.
KING: Thanks, Mark.
Thank you all very much.
Originally tonight we were going to do a show on depression. That show will be rescheduled for Monday night. But our text vote question of the night was: have you ever suffered from depression? Now, get this: 96 percent voted yes.
Tonight's text vote question, did Paris get preferential treatment? Text vote from your cell phone to CNNTV which is 26688. Text King A for yes or King B for no.
And Robin Gibbons will be with us tomorrow night. And Anderson Cooper stands by to host "AC 360."
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