Return to Transcripts main page

Live From...

Interview with Billie Vincent, Jim Tilmon

Aired August 15, 2002 - 14:50   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

MARTIN SAVIDGE: We want to turn now to allegations of serious trouble in a program that was meant to make flying safer in wake of September 11. "USA Today" reporting at least 80 air marshals have quit amid hazard working conditions, and a dramatic lowering of standards. Sources tell "USA Today" that a marksmanship test has been dropped, background checks are sometimes cursory, and officially mandated dress codes that will make the marshals stand out in the crowd when that is exactly what they do not want to do.
Joining us now from Washington with some insight on the program is former FAA Security Director Billie Vincent, and from Phoenix, aviation consultant Jim Tilmon -- thank you both for joining us.

Let's start with this whole issue, Mr. Vincent. Let me start with you. This is not exactly the best of times for this to come out. People already nervous, September 11, the anniversary coming up, and this was supposed to fix it all. What are your feelings?

BILLIE VINCENT, FORMER FAA SECURITY DIRECTOR: Well, Martin, that is the problem. It's falsely proclaimed or put forward as to fixing all the problems. First, it doesn't, and it is the wrong policy initiative.

Unfortunately, you are right, it is the wrong time for this to come out, as far as the problems within the program, and my sources say that all of those problems notwithstanding Mr. Quinn's (ph) remarks from the TSA -- all of those problems are existent in the present program, but we really ought to be directing our attention toward a full-scale pilot air marshal system, not a federal air marshal system.

SAVIDGE: Mr. Tilmon, let me ask you this, with your experience in aviation, we begin to wonder now, is the pilot the last line of defense, and do we fall back on the issue of putting guns in the hands of pilots once more?

JIM TILMON, AVIATION CONSULTANT: Well, I am really sorry to hear that this discussion has gone to pilots and guns. That is a completely different discussion altogether, and deserves its own attention. This one deserves a great deal of attention because it is an alarmist and sensational attempt to talk about a program that I feel has been very, very successful. I don't know when Mr. Vincent's experience has been, but I have visited the air marshal's training program. I have interviewed a number of air marshals now on duty. I have talked with airline pilots, with chief pilots, with flight attendants, and people in the airline associations, and they all sing great praises about this program. A lot of the things that you read in the papers, let's face it, just isn't quite the way it looks to be, and I am alarmed at the fact that we are in the midst of a war, and we have people talking about what is wrong with the system, and not being very accurate about it.

SAVIDGE: Some of these things that are brought up by "USA Today," though are events that have apparently taken place rather recently, that there was strict training, that the target practice was enforced -- that they worked on that, but that has fallen by the wayside.

I just want to know how recently have you talked with your sources, and if you feel confident this article is not accurate.

TILMON: I have have made a great deal -- done a great deal of research as late as this morning, and I talked with sources, and they tell me that marksmanship program is intact. But you know what, a lot of people are focusing on just that. This job as an air marshal involves a whole lot more than just shooting straight. It involves public relations to an extent, dealing with medical emergencies on board the airplane, understanding the whole politics of the airline industry and dealing with people on board an airplane that might be a little bit nervous when they don't need to be.

It is a very, very intensive training program, unlike any other program in the world, and other nations are coming here to find out how we are doing it. I think the "USA Today" article was very unfair, very ill-timed, and maybe doing a disservice to the American public.

SAVIDGE: Those things you point out, though, should be handled -- I mean, the crew is trained to do that. We want the air marshal, obviously, to handle security, and the question is, first of all, the background checks, are these people the proper people to be placed on board an aircraft with a weapon as a line of defense? Let me ask you, Mr. Tilmon.

TILMON: They are the best to be chosen for that, better than anybody else. They are law enforcement people. They are best trained. They are coming from some of the finest agencies in American government. They have an incredible track record, and if you had a chance to do what I did, Mr. Vincent, and go and talk with some of these people in person and see the training, you would agree with me.

VINCENT: Well, Jim, unfortunately you make a lot of assumptions there. I have 50 years in aviations, and all of that, across the board, in air traffic control, all the way through being head of security for the FAA and the federal air marshals reported to me.

I reconstituted the group in 1985, so I know the program probably much better than you do, even though I won't discount your knowledge. But, unfortunately, and I'd like it to be otherwise, there are people within the system that says that everything this was in "USA Today" article is true. Now, I also am a big supporter of the federal air marshal program...

SAVIDGE: Mr. Vincent, I have got to interrupt you. You have made a very strong point. Thank you both, gentlemen, there is another piece of this news puzzle we have to move on to.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com