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Interview with Arian Ardie

Aired October 14, 2002 - 13:32   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


CAROL LIN, CNN ANCHOR: More now on the devastation in paradise. The deadly blast in Bali destroyed an entire block of the island. The attack could also level the important tourist economy in Indonesia.
With more on this, we are joined by Arian Ardie, he is with the American Chamber of Commerce in Indonesia. He is now in Jakarta, but he was actually in Bali over the weekend -- Arian, it is good to see you, and good to see you safe and alive. You were actually miles away from the blast, but you actually felt it?

ARIAN ARDIE, That's correct. I was about eight kilometers away, and it felt like a truck had landed on the roof. I thought it was an earthquake, but it only lasted for a second.

LIN: So what did you do after you heard it? Did you know what it was immediately?

ARDIE: No. It really didn't occur to me what it was until about an hour later, when I started receiving some phone calls from some friends who were journalists and indicated that there had been an explosion at a popular club in the main tourist area of Bali.

LIN: So what was going through your mind then? It seems like you felt like you had to do something?

ARDIE: Well, I was really scared, because a number of my friends had been there for a rugby tournament, and they had indicated they would be going to that club. So, I went down to the local hospital where I heard the wounded were being taken, and when I arrived, it was a scene of just utter chaos. Ambulances arriving, bringing people out, people being treated in the hallways. Many people just trying to find out who the victims were, trying to get medical treatment.

LIN: And by what you saw there, what was going through your mind? I can't imagine being an eyewitness to that kind of carnage.

ARDIE: It was just unbelievable. It was shock, and I think one of the victims that a friend of mine spoke to indicated, How could this happen in paradise? It really was, and continues to be, a shock to everyone, and the manner by which this could really be perpetrated against innocent civilians.

LIN: Now, you do a lot of business in Indonesia, don't you?

ARDIE: Yes, I do.

LIN: So what was your sense in traveling to that region? From what we understand by American officials, there has been a constant dialogue between American officials and the Indonesian government to do more to crack down on terrorism. Did you have a sense, in going to Indonesia, tht as a Westerner, as an American, that your life would be in danger?

ARDIE: Really haven't thought about it. I've been living here for the past nine years, and we've had quite a bit of turmoil over the last five years. The Indonesian government has taken a first important step in battling the terrorist problem by indicating that there are terrorists in Indonesia, and that there are possibly terrorist cells operating here.

Until this incident happened, that admission really was not there.

LIN: I mean, my sense of it, as an American watching from overseas, is that people there hate Americans, that there is a distinct anti-American, pro-Islamist movement going on in Indonesia.

ARDIE: That's really not true. The majority of Indonesians are very moderate Muslims. Americans are well respected here. We have a good bilateral relationship. And, what was perpetrated, if it was by Muslims, would be a very small radical extremist group that's trying to really undermine the overall harmony that there -- that exists in Indonesia. There have been pockets of violence in parts of the country, but for the most part, that violence has not been directed against Americans, has not been directed against foreigners.

LIN: All right. Thank you very much, Arian Ardie, for sharing your experience there, and we really appreciate the time that you have given us. Thank you. Stay safe.

Well, many of the casualties in the terror bombings were Australians. Bali is their jewel of the east, and a popular getaway. But with the fear of more attacks, Australians, along with U.S. embassy workers are leaving paradise for safety.

CNN's John Vause has the story now from Sydney.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN VAUSE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Home and safe, the wounded who could travel and others just frightened and desperate to leave, brought back on special commercial flights into the arms of anxious relatives. Their ordeal may be over, but they bring with him horrific memories of the carnage at Kuta Beach.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The blast knocked everyone flying back on their back and everything was already falling and everyone just tried to get everyone else out the back doorway over the wall.

VAUSE: But with dozens of Australians unaccounted for, there will be difficult days ahead for many families, with fears Australians account for most of the dead. Bali is Australia's most popular overseas destination. Many of those caught up in this attack from sporting teams celebrating the end of the season. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We had 11 of us came over. We've lost six. I spent the day at the morgue. I've identified five. There's still one we can't find. I don't know if we ever will.

VAUSE: For authorities here, though, the first priority, evacuate the wounded. More than 100 victims of this terrorist attack flown home in C-130s, the first arriving at Darwin Airport in northern Australia. On board, 15 victims, all of them suffering terrible burns, most of them young. One of the injured did not survive the three hour flight from Bali. Some of the more seriously hurt are being evacuated on private jets. Six victims here arriving in Perth.

DR. LEN NOTARAS, DARIN HOSPITAL: The sheer magnitude of what has actually occurred is going to take some considerable time to sink into a lot of people, including ourselves here at the hospital. It has been our own, you know, 11th of September.

VAUSE: Agents from Australia's intelligence organization and federal police are now in Bali, working with Indonesian authorities to track down those responsible.

Australian Prime Minister John Howard has called a special meeting of senior government ministers to consider the country's response.

JOHN HOWARD, AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER: And it has happened to our own on our doorstep.

VAUSE: The government here says there's no evidence that Australians were targeted by terrorists, and rejects any suggestion that it may be linked to Australia's outspoken support for the U.S.- led war on terrorism and says that support will continue.

John Vause, CNN, Sydney.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LIN: Well, Australians, along with American federal agents, are helping in the probe of the bombing. There has been no claim of responsibility, but investigators do suspect a link to al Qaeda.

Our Jakarta bureau chief, Maria Ressa, is live with the latest on the investigation, and also perhaps, in a sense, more important to our American audience, a sense of what Indonesia is, and who the Indonesians are. This is obviously going to have a big impact on tourism, Maria, in a country of more than 200 million people there. How important is tourism?

MARIA RESSA, CNN JAKARTA BUREAU CHIEF: Well, huge in the sense that it -- for Bali, it is Bali's economic lifeline. If you look at that, it is interesting that it became the target of a terrorist attack. In line with the taped messages that came out from Ayman al- Zawahiri and Osama bin Laden a week ago.

Secondly, for Indonesia, tourism is Indonesia's third largest dollar earner. It has taken massive hits since 1998, when we had the riots, the end of 32 years of former President Suharto's rule, and then we have had the financial crisis in 1997, really four changes of governments, four administrations in the last four years here. This country is the world's largest Muslim population, but in addition to that, it is also a very fledgling democracy. In many ways, if you look at it, it is the perfect target for Osama bin Laden. He is looking to topple secular Democratic states to replace them with an Islamic shariah law state.

LIN: So, Maria, is it a homogenous society, or there are actually different ethnic groups within Indonesia?

RESSA: Extremely different ethnic groups, more than 350 ethnic groups speaking 500-some odd languages. It spans 17,000 islands. This is a huge place. It is, in many ways, a testimony to former President Suharto in a sense that he was able to keep it together. If you recall in 1998, there were fears that there would be what analysts called the Balkanization of Indonesia.

That hasn't happened, although it has been very difficult times for the government. Part of the problem for this administration, Megawati Sukarnoputri, is that -- is that she is facing so many fractures and a very -- a very young legislature, really inexperienced. So that's been part of her problem in going actively against terrorists and al Qaeda-linked groups here.

LIN: So -- all right. Just a very quick last question for you, Maria -- I'm sorry. You know what, we have got to go to the White House right now. Maria Ressa, thank you very much for a good portrait of the Indonesian people.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired October 14, 2002 - 13:32   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL LIN, CNN ANCHOR: More now on the devastation in paradise. The deadly blast in Bali destroyed an entire block of the island. The attack could also level the important tourist economy in Indonesia.
With more on this, we are joined by Arian Ardie, he is with the American Chamber of Commerce in Indonesia. He is now in Jakarta, but he was actually in Bali over the weekend -- Arian, it is good to see you, and good to see you safe and alive. You were actually miles away from the blast, but you actually felt it?

ARIAN ARDIE, That's correct. I was about eight kilometers away, and it felt like a truck had landed on the roof. I thought it was an earthquake, but it only lasted for a second.

LIN: So what did you do after you heard it? Did you know what it was immediately?

ARDIE: No. It really didn't occur to me what it was until about an hour later, when I started receiving some phone calls from some friends who were journalists and indicated that there had been an explosion at a popular club in the main tourist area of Bali.

LIN: So what was going through your mind then? It seems like you felt like you had to do something?

ARDIE: Well, I was really scared, because a number of my friends had been there for a rugby tournament, and they had indicated they would be going to that club. So, I went down to the local hospital where I heard the wounded were being taken, and when I arrived, it was a scene of just utter chaos. Ambulances arriving, bringing people out, people being treated in the hallways. Many people just trying to find out who the victims were, trying to get medical treatment.

LIN: And by what you saw there, what was going through your mind? I can't imagine being an eyewitness to that kind of carnage.

ARDIE: It was just unbelievable. It was shock, and I think one of the victims that a friend of mine spoke to indicated, How could this happen in paradise? It really was, and continues to be, a shock to everyone, and the manner by which this could really be perpetrated against innocent civilians.

LIN: Now, you do a lot of business in Indonesia, don't you?

ARDIE: Yes, I do.

LIN: So what was your sense in traveling to that region? From what we understand by American officials, there has been a constant dialogue between American officials and the Indonesian government to do more to crack down on terrorism. Did you have a sense, in going to Indonesia, tht as a Westerner, as an American, that your life would be in danger?

ARDIE: Really haven't thought about it. I've been living here for the past nine years, and we've had quite a bit of turmoil over the last five years. The Indonesian government has taken a first important step in battling the terrorist problem by indicating that there are terrorists in Indonesia, and that there are possibly terrorist cells operating here.

Until this incident happened, that admission really was not there.

LIN: I mean, my sense of it, as an American watching from overseas, is that people there hate Americans, that there is a distinct anti-American, pro-Islamist movement going on in Indonesia.

ARDIE: That's really not true. The majority of Indonesians are very moderate Muslims. Americans are well respected here. We have a good bilateral relationship. And, what was perpetrated, if it was by Muslims, would be a very small radical extremist group that's trying to really undermine the overall harmony that there -- that exists in Indonesia. There have been pockets of violence in parts of the country, but for the most part, that violence has not been directed against Americans, has not been directed against foreigners.

LIN: All right. Thank you very much, Arian Ardie, for sharing your experience there, and we really appreciate the time that you have given us. Thank you. Stay safe.

Well, many of the casualties in the terror bombings were Australians. Bali is their jewel of the east, and a popular getaway. But with the fear of more attacks, Australians, along with U.S. embassy workers are leaving paradise for safety.

CNN's John Vause has the story now from Sydney.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN VAUSE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Home and safe, the wounded who could travel and others just frightened and desperate to leave, brought back on special commercial flights into the arms of anxious relatives. Their ordeal may be over, but they bring with him horrific memories of the carnage at Kuta Beach.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The blast knocked everyone flying back on their back and everything was already falling and everyone just tried to get everyone else out the back doorway over the wall.

VAUSE: But with dozens of Australians unaccounted for, there will be difficult days ahead for many families, with fears Australians account for most of the dead. Bali is Australia's most popular overseas destination. Many of those caught up in this attack from sporting teams celebrating the end of the season. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We had 11 of us came over. We've lost six. I spent the day at the morgue. I've identified five. There's still one we can't find. I don't know if we ever will.

VAUSE: For authorities here, though, the first priority, evacuate the wounded. More than 100 victims of this terrorist attack flown home in C-130s, the first arriving at Darwin Airport in northern Australia. On board, 15 victims, all of them suffering terrible burns, most of them young. One of the injured did not survive the three hour flight from Bali. Some of the more seriously hurt are being evacuated on private jets. Six victims here arriving in Perth.

DR. LEN NOTARAS, DARIN HOSPITAL: The sheer magnitude of what has actually occurred is going to take some considerable time to sink into a lot of people, including ourselves here at the hospital. It has been our own, you know, 11th of September.

VAUSE: Agents from Australia's intelligence organization and federal police are now in Bali, working with Indonesian authorities to track down those responsible.

Australian Prime Minister John Howard has called a special meeting of senior government ministers to consider the country's response.

JOHN HOWARD, AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER: And it has happened to our own on our doorstep.

VAUSE: The government here says there's no evidence that Australians were targeted by terrorists, and rejects any suggestion that it may be linked to Australia's outspoken support for the U.S.- led war on terrorism and says that support will continue.

John Vause, CNN, Sydney.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LIN: Well, Australians, along with American federal agents, are helping in the probe of the bombing. There has been no claim of responsibility, but investigators do suspect a link to al Qaeda.

Our Jakarta bureau chief, Maria Ressa, is live with the latest on the investigation, and also perhaps, in a sense, more important to our American audience, a sense of what Indonesia is, and who the Indonesians are. This is obviously going to have a big impact on tourism, Maria, in a country of more than 200 million people there. How important is tourism?

MARIA RESSA, CNN JAKARTA BUREAU CHIEF: Well, huge in the sense that it -- for Bali, it is Bali's economic lifeline. If you look at that, it is interesting that it became the target of a terrorist attack. In line with the taped messages that came out from Ayman al- Zawahiri and Osama bin Laden a week ago.

Secondly, for Indonesia, tourism is Indonesia's third largest dollar earner. It has taken massive hits since 1998, when we had the riots, the end of 32 years of former President Suharto's rule, and then we have had the financial crisis in 1997, really four changes of governments, four administrations in the last four years here. This country is the world's largest Muslim population, but in addition to that, it is also a very fledgling democracy. In many ways, if you look at it, it is the perfect target for Osama bin Laden. He is looking to topple secular Democratic states to replace them with an Islamic shariah law state.

LIN: So, Maria, is it a homogenous society, or there are actually different ethnic groups within Indonesia?

RESSA: Extremely different ethnic groups, more than 350 ethnic groups speaking 500-some odd languages. It spans 17,000 islands. This is a huge place. It is, in many ways, a testimony to former President Suharto in a sense that he was able to keep it together. If you recall in 1998, there were fears that there would be what analysts called the Balkanization of Indonesia.

That hasn't happened, although it has been very difficult times for the government. Part of the problem for this administration, Megawati Sukarnoputri, is that -- is that she is facing so many fractures and a very -- a very young legislature, really inexperienced. So that's been part of her problem in going actively against terrorists and al Qaeda-linked groups here.

LIN: So -- all right. Just a very quick last question for you, Maria -- I'm sorry. You know what, we have got to go to the White House right now. Maria Ressa, thank you very much for a good portrait of the Indonesian people.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com