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Interview With Peter Berlin

Aired December 06, 2002 - 14:44   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: The question many people want to know is why would someone who basically has it all -- fame, wealth, the good life, do something like this?
Peter Berlin is the executive director of Shoplifters Alternative, a group that helps educate people about the causes of this problem. He joins us now from Miami. Hi, Peter.

PETER BERLIN, SHOPLIFTERS ALTERNATIVE: Hi.

PHILLIPS: Even the judge brought that question up, Peter. He said my 16-year-old son came to me and said why would someone like this that seems to have everything want to do this?

BERLIN: Contrary to popular belief, shoplifting is not about greed or poverty or values. It's simply about people struggling with their own personal conflicts and needs. Getting something for nothing represents things to people who are struggling, which it doesn't represent to other people like ourselves who don't get involved in this kind of thing.

Shoplifting really is symptomatic, which signals that an individual has repressed feelings that are unresolved. So if you want to take it one step further, shoplifting or getting something for nothing, is like giving themselves a reward or a gift or a lift which they feel they need or deserve.

So getting something for nothing for a lot of people is simply a substitute for loss, divorce, a bad illness or death of a loved one or a financial situation. Or a relief mechanism for anxiety and depression. Or payback for all the things they do for others and how little they get back in return.

PHILLIPS: Can they be rehabilitated or is the temptation always there?

BERLIN: Yes, they certainly can be rehabilitated very, very effectively. But you need to deal with their issues of denial, their false beliefs, their attitude of entitlement and things of this nature before they can comfortably get to understand that they are self- destructing. When they begin to see that, they don't want to do this anymore.

PHILLIPS: Even the judge made note of that. He said, look, I've seen this before and it's usually a one-time offense, you learn your lesson. But on the other hand, it can be a gateway to other serious crimes, though, right?

BERLIN: Absolutely. While not every shoplifter certainly will become a more serious criminal, certainly I would say almost every criminal, if you will, who have gone on to other types of crimes have started with shoplifting.

PHILLIPS: So does jail time help someone like Winona Ryder or just make the situation worse? She's not getting jail time, she's getting probation and community service, but what do you think about that?

BERLIN: I think jail time's a deterrent. I think jail time is a deterrent to individuals. It's not for everyone.

Jail time alone without the educational rehabilitation isn't going to be as effective. It needs at least the educational component and also the jail time component depending on the magnitude of theft and the frequency with which it occurred.

PHILLIPS: Do you think Winona Ryder is being made an example of? She's getting a lot of attention.

BERLIN: I don't think she's being made an example of. I'm thankful that she is actually having to go through this so that she can get -- come to grips with the issues that she has because they're clearly not financial. They're personal on a different level.

PHILLIPS: How did you get involved with Shoplifters Alternative? Did you ever as a kid get involved with shoplifting?

BERLIN: I got involved with Shoplifters Alternative because I started my career as a security director so I used to catch them and lock them up, I didn't used to rehabilitate them.

Over the last 14 years I got involved with this organization because I saw the opportunity to really turn people's lives around. And that's something that I do.

PHILLIPS: It's a pleasure interviewing you. Thank you so much.

BERLIN: My pleasure.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired December 6, 2002 - 14:44   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: The question many people want to know is why would someone who basically has it all -- fame, wealth, the good life, do something like this?
Peter Berlin is the executive director of Shoplifters Alternative, a group that helps educate people about the causes of this problem. He joins us now from Miami. Hi, Peter.

PETER BERLIN, SHOPLIFTERS ALTERNATIVE: Hi.

PHILLIPS: Even the judge brought that question up, Peter. He said my 16-year-old son came to me and said why would someone like this that seems to have everything want to do this?

BERLIN: Contrary to popular belief, shoplifting is not about greed or poverty or values. It's simply about people struggling with their own personal conflicts and needs. Getting something for nothing represents things to people who are struggling, which it doesn't represent to other people like ourselves who don't get involved in this kind of thing.

Shoplifting really is symptomatic, which signals that an individual has repressed feelings that are unresolved. So if you want to take it one step further, shoplifting or getting something for nothing, is like giving themselves a reward or a gift or a lift which they feel they need or deserve.

So getting something for nothing for a lot of people is simply a substitute for loss, divorce, a bad illness or death of a loved one or a financial situation. Or a relief mechanism for anxiety and depression. Or payback for all the things they do for others and how little they get back in return.

PHILLIPS: Can they be rehabilitated or is the temptation always there?

BERLIN: Yes, they certainly can be rehabilitated very, very effectively. But you need to deal with their issues of denial, their false beliefs, their attitude of entitlement and things of this nature before they can comfortably get to understand that they are self- destructing. When they begin to see that, they don't want to do this anymore.

PHILLIPS: Even the judge made note of that. He said, look, I've seen this before and it's usually a one-time offense, you learn your lesson. But on the other hand, it can be a gateway to other serious crimes, though, right?

BERLIN: Absolutely. While not every shoplifter certainly will become a more serious criminal, certainly I would say almost every criminal, if you will, who have gone on to other types of crimes have started with shoplifting.

PHILLIPS: So does jail time help someone like Winona Ryder or just make the situation worse? She's not getting jail time, she's getting probation and community service, but what do you think about that?

BERLIN: I think jail time's a deterrent. I think jail time is a deterrent to individuals. It's not for everyone.

Jail time alone without the educational rehabilitation isn't going to be as effective. It needs at least the educational component and also the jail time component depending on the magnitude of theft and the frequency with which it occurred.

PHILLIPS: Do you think Winona Ryder is being made an example of? She's getting a lot of attention.

BERLIN: I don't think she's being made an example of. I'm thankful that she is actually having to go through this so that she can get -- come to grips with the issues that she has because they're clearly not financial. They're personal on a different level.

PHILLIPS: How did you get involved with Shoplifters Alternative? Did you ever as a kid get involved with shoplifting?

BERLIN: I got involved with Shoplifters Alternative because I started my career as a security director so I used to catch them and lock them up, I didn't used to rehabilitate them.

Over the last 14 years I got involved with this organization because I saw the opportunity to really turn people's lives around. And that's something that I do.

PHILLIPS: It's a pleasure interviewing you. Thank you so much.

BERLIN: My pleasure.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com