Return to Transcripts main page

Live From...

Chirac Goes on TV to Discuss Possible Veto

Aired March 10, 2003 - 15:08   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: France's president went on prime time television amid rumors he wants to veto the resolution personally. CNN's Jim Bittermann is live from Paris with the latest on all that.
How did the president -- Chirac's address go?

JIM BITTERMANN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Miles, it's still going on at this hour. In fact, he's still being interviewed by the two anchors of the two main channels here, but basically what he said is that if it comes to it, France will exercise its veto just like the Russian foreign minister said Russia would exercise its veto.

Basically, he told the reporters that are interviewing him that, in fact, he does not believe it is now the right time to move such a resolution, that the British and Americans are moving before the United Nations Security Council.

He said, basically, that -- he said to the reporters, he said it's not up to you and me to decide whether or not the inspections routine should continue. It's up to the inspectors themselves. They say they're getting cooperation, and so the inspections should continue.

He said we're not at the point yet of authorizing any war against Iraq. And he said, if that war were to be authorized in resolution, then basically, France would veto it.

However, he added that the way the French are counting the noses, they don't believe that the United States is going to get the nine votes that it needs in order to move that resolution across the table. Here's the way the president put it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JACQUES CHIRAC, PRESIDENT OF FRANCE (through translator): I'm saying is that France would oppose that resolution -- 15 Security Council members, five permanent members, and ten members that on a rotating basis change every two years. For a resolution should be adopted, it has to have a majority of nine members. First hypothesis, which is the most probable as we speak, the resolution will not have a majority of nine members. The Americans think the opposite, they will have. Perhaps, but that is my belief.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BITTERMANN: But now, as to whether or not President Chirac would go to the United States to actually cast any vote himself, he left that vague for the moment. He said that there are discussions still going on. He said that basically, it's going to be a collective decision. One of the reporters asked him if he was going to go alone if it came down to that. He said no, it will be a decision that they take collectively.

He suggested through his foreign ministry -- foreign minister on Friday, Miles, that, in fact, he would like to see all the heads of state gathered, all the heads of state from the various Security Council member countries in order to take this decision, because he says it's a discussion of life and death issues, and it should be taken at the highest level.

O'BRIEN: And that's the end of Jim Bittermann. I would have liked to ask him a question. We'll just save that for another time.

BITTERMANN: Let's go to David Ensor, who is in our Washington Bureau. We've been talking about something buried in the Hans Blix report to the United Nations about weapons, and that is the possibility that Iraq is actively engaged in developing drones that could dispense, perhaps, chemical or biological weapons. David Ensor joining us with a little bit more on that -- hello, David.

DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Miles. Well, you talked not long ago about the Iraqi plan of some years ago to turn MiG-21s into pilotless drones. And there was, of course, another aircraft, the L-29 that that was also experimentally done with.

There was also some previous discussion by Secretary Powell at the U.N. of drones. But what's interesting now is U.S. officials are pointing to a line in Hans Blix's latest report that talks about the discovery of a new type of drone aircraft in Iraq, and U.S. officials tell me that the inspectors have, in fact, found one of these. According to the Blix report, it has a wing span of 7.45 meters, and they say that it has not been declared by Iraq.

Now, I understand from U.S. officials that this type of drone, which has just been discovered, is believed to have a payload of about 50 kilograms. As one official put it, that's a lot of anthrax, and a range of around 200 U.S. miles. So that would be well in excess of the 150 kilometer limit that was imposed upon Iraq on any production of drone aircraft.

So this is a new type of drone aircraft that has just been discovered in the last couple of weeks, I am told, by the inspectors. The U.S. feels that Mr. Blix did not make enough of a point of this, that this is evidence, clear evidence, of an additional violation of U.N. Security Council Resolution 1441. It's another potential weapon that is supposed to have been declared and wasn't. The inspectors have discovered at least one of them, and the great question is, how many of them are there, and how far advanced is this drone program -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: So David, just to be clear, the inspectors actually laid eyes on the hardware in this case. We don't know how many there are. Have they had any satisfactory reply from the Iraqis when asked about them?

ENSOR: Well, in Blix's report, he says that they are inquiring, and that this is a matter of active research and inquiry. I don't know that they've got a satisfactory answer yet. As for the -- as for whether they've actually seen one, that is something that U.S. officials tell me is the case. I haven't heard it from the inspectors themselves.

O'BRIEN: Now we talked, as you saw just a few moments ago about the L-29s and MiG-21s that have been retrofitted for drone usage. Any current evidence of those in play, or is this the drone we need to focus on?

ENSOR: This is not the only drone aircraft that the Iraqis are understood to have tested. You may recall from the testimony at the United Nations some weeks back, more than a month back, that Mr. Powell talked about the testing of a drone on a kind of a circular path, where the Iraqis were flying it way in excess of the 150 kilometer limit, running it for hundreds of kilometers to test whether it could go that far. That would, of course, put it in range for Israel and some other U.S. bases in the area.

O'BRIEN: Of course, it's worth pointing out this cleverly exploits a loophole in the constraints that Iraq accepted to after the 1991 Gulf War, which was the limitation on the length that a ballistic missile could fly. No such limitations on aircraft, except to say there are no-fly zones north and south.

ENSOR: That's right. And by the way, I should also mention that the U.S. will probably be highlighting this particular example of what they see as new evidence of a violation by Iraq, but we understand there may be other examples produced in the next few days as the U.S. tries to marshal additional support on the U.N. Security Council. There may be additional items that U.S. intelligence has found that you may hear about from Secretary Powell or other U.S. officials as they seek to convince doubting voters on the U.N. Security Council that this is a country that is in deep and continued and repeated violation of 1441 -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: And one more thing, David, before you get away. Any explanation from Mr. Blix or anybody on his group as to why this wasn't mentioned kind of in open session? In other words, it was part of a written report that was rather voluminous.

ENSOR: You know, I haven't had a chance to speak to his people yet, so I really can't answer that question at this point.

O'BRIEN: All right. Sorry to put you on the spot there. David Ensor, back to the phones for you. We appreciate it.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com






Aired March 10, 2003 - 15:08   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: France's president went on prime time television amid rumors he wants to veto the resolution personally. CNN's Jim Bittermann is live from Paris with the latest on all that.
How did the president -- Chirac's address go?

JIM BITTERMANN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Miles, it's still going on at this hour. In fact, he's still being interviewed by the two anchors of the two main channels here, but basically what he said is that if it comes to it, France will exercise its veto just like the Russian foreign minister said Russia would exercise its veto.

Basically, he told the reporters that are interviewing him that, in fact, he does not believe it is now the right time to move such a resolution, that the British and Americans are moving before the United Nations Security Council.

He said, basically, that -- he said to the reporters, he said it's not up to you and me to decide whether or not the inspections routine should continue. It's up to the inspectors themselves. They say they're getting cooperation, and so the inspections should continue.

He said we're not at the point yet of authorizing any war against Iraq. And he said, if that war were to be authorized in resolution, then basically, France would veto it.

However, he added that the way the French are counting the noses, they don't believe that the United States is going to get the nine votes that it needs in order to move that resolution across the table. Here's the way the president put it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JACQUES CHIRAC, PRESIDENT OF FRANCE (through translator): I'm saying is that France would oppose that resolution -- 15 Security Council members, five permanent members, and ten members that on a rotating basis change every two years. For a resolution should be adopted, it has to have a majority of nine members. First hypothesis, which is the most probable as we speak, the resolution will not have a majority of nine members. The Americans think the opposite, they will have. Perhaps, but that is my belief.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BITTERMANN: But now, as to whether or not President Chirac would go to the United States to actually cast any vote himself, he left that vague for the moment. He said that there are discussions still going on. He said that basically, it's going to be a collective decision. One of the reporters asked him if he was going to go alone if it came down to that. He said no, it will be a decision that they take collectively.

He suggested through his foreign ministry -- foreign minister on Friday, Miles, that, in fact, he would like to see all the heads of state gathered, all the heads of state from the various Security Council member countries in order to take this decision, because he says it's a discussion of life and death issues, and it should be taken at the highest level.

O'BRIEN: And that's the end of Jim Bittermann. I would have liked to ask him a question. We'll just save that for another time.

BITTERMANN: Let's go to David Ensor, who is in our Washington Bureau. We've been talking about something buried in the Hans Blix report to the United Nations about weapons, and that is the possibility that Iraq is actively engaged in developing drones that could dispense, perhaps, chemical or biological weapons. David Ensor joining us with a little bit more on that -- hello, David.

DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Miles. Well, you talked not long ago about the Iraqi plan of some years ago to turn MiG-21s into pilotless drones. And there was, of course, another aircraft, the L-29 that that was also experimentally done with.

There was also some previous discussion by Secretary Powell at the U.N. of drones. But what's interesting now is U.S. officials are pointing to a line in Hans Blix's latest report that talks about the discovery of a new type of drone aircraft in Iraq, and U.S. officials tell me that the inspectors have, in fact, found one of these. According to the Blix report, it has a wing span of 7.45 meters, and they say that it has not been declared by Iraq.

Now, I understand from U.S. officials that this type of drone, which has just been discovered, is believed to have a payload of about 50 kilograms. As one official put it, that's a lot of anthrax, and a range of around 200 U.S. miles. So that would be well in excess of the 150 kilometer limit that was imposed upon Iraq on any production of drone aircraft.

So this is a new type of drone aircraft that has just been discovered in the last couple of weeks, I am told, by the inspectors. The U.S. feels that Mr. Blix did not make enough of a point of this, that this is evidence, clear evidence, of an additional violation of U.N. Security Council Resolution 1441. It's another potential weapon that is supposed to have been declared and wasn't. The inspectors have discovered at least one of them, and the great question is, how many of them are there, and how far advanced is this drone program -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: So David, just to be clear, the inspectors actually laid eyes on the hardware in this case. We don't know how many there are. Have they had any satisfactory reply from the Iraqis when asked about them?

ENSOR: Well, in Blix's report, he says that they are inquiring, and that this is a matter of active research and inquiry. I don't know that they've got a satisfactory answer yet. As for the -- as for whether they've actually seen one, that is something that U.S. officials tell me is the case. I haven't heard it from the inspectors themselves.

O'BRIEN: Now we talked, as you saw just a few moments ago about the L-29s and MiG-21s that have been retrofitted for drone usage. Any current evidence of those in play, or is this the drone we need to focus on?

ENSOR: This is not the only drone aircraft that the Iraqis are understood to have tested. You may recall from the testimony at the United Nations some weeks back, more than a month back, that Mr. Powell talked about the testing of a drone on a kind of a circular path, where the Iraqis were flying it way in excess of the 150 kilometer limit, running it for hundreds of kilometers to test whether it could go that far. That would, of course, put it in range for Israel and some other U.S. bases in the area.

O'BRIEN: Of course, it's worth pointing out this cleverly exploits a loophole in the constraints that Iraq accepted to after the 1991 Gulf War, which was the limitation on the length that a ballistic missile could fly. No such limitations on aircraft, except to say there are no-fly zones north and south.

ENSOR: That's right. And by the way, I should also mention that the U.S. will probably be highlighting this particular example of what they see as new evidence of a violation by Iraq, but we understand there may be other examples produced in the next few days as the U.S. tries to marshal additional support on the U.N. Security Council. There may be additional items that U.S. intelligence has found that you may hear about from Secretary Powell or other U.S. officials as they seek to convince doubting voters on the U.N. Security Council that this is a country that is in deep and continued and repeated violation of 1441 -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: And one more thing, David, before you get away. Any explanation from Mr. Blix or anybody on his group as to why this wasn't mentioned kind of in open session? In other words, it was part of a written report that was rather voluminous.

ENSOR: You know, I haven't had a chance to speak to his people yet, so I really can't answer that question at this point.

O'BRIEN: All right. Sorry to put you on the spot there. David Ensor, back to the phones for you. We appreciate it.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com