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U.S. Troops, Marines Move Into Iraq; Heavy Detonations Continue as it Approaches Midnight in Iraq
Aired March 20, 2003 - 15:31 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: CNN's Miles O'Brien is standing by once again at the CNN Center in Atlanta, and he's got General Wesley Clark with him. I wonder if both of you would explain a little bit what's going on on the ground, as U.S. troops, Marines, move into southern Iraq.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Well, Wolf, I'll tell you, having the former supreme NATO commander with me to help us out probably no better source for that. General Wes Clark here to talk. A big picture here about a potential thrust toward Baghdad, basically from the south, because that is where all the troop massing is.
First of all, let's show you a quick graphic, if we could, as we point out this area right down here on the Kuwaiti border, where everything is going to focus on. If we can show this graphic, we'll show you who the players are and what the anticipated routes might be. General Clark, first of all, big picture here, obviously. We once again want to -- for those of you who haven't figured out this geography yet, we're talking about this area right down here. And let's talk about who is involved.
GEN. WESLEY CLARK (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, let's see. The first thing is you've got a heavy Army force.
O'BRIEN: The 101st Airborne.
CLARK: This is the 101st Airborne, which has a lot of helicopters. And it can jump and move long distances. Then you've got the 3rd Infantry division shown there in the green. The 3rd Infantry division is able to move over land, effective forces. This will be a British and U.S. Marine force.
And what you've got here is a big river system. And this is the Euphrates and the Tigris there. And the Euphrates and Tigris define the maneuver zone.
O'BRIEN: All right. I hate to interrupt you. We're going to continue this in just a second. We have somebody who has dropped in on the line. Joining us is Dexter Filkin with "The New York Times." I'm not sure where Dexter is. Dexter, can you hear me OK?
DEXTER FILKINS, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": Yes, I can hear you fine.
O'BRIEN: All right. Tell us what you have. FILKINS: Well, I'm in far northern Kuwait right on the Iraqi border. And just for the past four hours, four and a half hours, I've just been witnessing an extraordinary artillery bombardment by the United States and British forces into Iraq, and an aerial bombardment as well. It's just extraordinary.
I mean, it feels like an earthquake. And just the rumble and the noise, it's shaking the windows, it's shaking buildings. And this has been going on all evening.
O'BRIEN: So I guess that tells you that something is very imminent as far as a march toward Baghdad?
FILKINS: Well, in this case, right where I am, we are about -- I think about 50 miles due south of Basra. And that's Iraq's second largest city. And I think it's probably the first big city that the United States and the coalition would like to take. And I think those tanks are going over.
I saw them today. The troop carriers are going over and they're just pouring over the border towards Basra right now. And I think the artillery is basically blasting a lane for them to do that.
O'BRIEN: All right. I'm joined by General Wesley Clark. He has a question for you, Dexter. Go ahead, General.
CLARK: Well I think the question there is actually, what's going over that border? Is this the Marines, is this the Brits, is this the 3rd Infantry division? And are you seeing helicopters moving over the border? Is it all armored vehicles? And how do you see it there?
FILKINS: Well, it's hard -- that's a good question. It's hard to -- the sun was going down when the first troops that we saw started to go over. And I -- what I saw earlier in the day was that a lot of British forces lined up, and I know they're headed to Basra. And we saw Howitzers and tanks and troop carriers. And then what I believe were U.S. Marines doing the same.
We saw Apache helicopters tonight, what I think were Apache fly over. We heard helicopters. It's very dark here now. We've heard helicopters all night.
We've heard low-flying planes. So there's a lot going on here, that's for sure.
CLARK: Have you seen any incoming fire at all from the Iraqis coming back on to these forces as they move past?
O'BRIEN: You know what, General Clark, we have our wires crossed there. We want to get that rectified first. We'll get back to Dexter when we can.
Let's continue our discussion, because it couldn't be more apropos for what's going on right now. We're talking about which divisions will be doing what. If you could advance this graphic a little bit for us and give us a sense of what's going on. Move it ahead to where it was. There we go. OK. We've got the 101st Airborne, is that red arrow coming up this way. I'll just draw right back over it. And then you've got the 3rd Infantry division, the heavy armor...
CLARK: That's the heavy armor.
O'BRIEN: ... and that's the key thrust, really, if you're a guy like you, who wore a green suit, right?
CLARK: Well, I'm sure thinking about them.
O'BRIEN: What about the number of people involved in this thrust? And then you've got the British, the Marine Expeditionary Unit -- U.S. Marines, along with the Brits. Sheer numbers, is that enough?
CLARK: It probably is. It depends on how carefully you move with the use of air. It depends on the Iraqi resistance. It's a matter for the commanders on the ground to sort out. But in principle, it can be done based on what we know of the Iraqi fighting force, at least up until Baghdad. And then we don't know.
O'BRIEN: All right. And now we're talking about doing this simultaneously to this shock and awe air campaign. And let's take a look at the depiction we put together through our friends at Analytical Graphics showing this huge -- we're talking about 20,000 vehicles, which if you stack them end to end at 40 feet, I figured it out, it's about 150 in length.
Of course they're not going end to end. They're going across the desert this way. What's the tactic here?
CLARK: In this case, we've got them deployed in a combat formation. And you're leading with some platoons that have had their vehicles spread out. They're in wedge so they can see the enemy and bring fire to bear. The unit behind us sort of spread out and following. It might look that way.
O'BRIEN: All right, it might look that way. And there is another thing we can tell you about, too, and that is the possibility of going through an area let's say that has some mines and obstacles. You might get into a narrow column, just like this. And what you'd have leading into these berms is a modified M1-A1 tank, which has a bulldozer on it.
Who says the corps of engineers is not difficult duty? They're right there at the very point of the pointy speer.
CLARK: We call that a mine plow up there on the front of that thing. It should be digging in deep enough to scoop those mines out.
O'BRIEN: Scooping out the mines. On goes the convoy, M1-A1s. You notice they have some mine...
CLARK: Anything that got left there, that roller is going to detonate it so it goes off and doesn't hit the tank.
O'BRIEN: All right. As this column continues onward, our discussion has to take yet another cul-de-sac. General Clark, I know you've got to get going. So we'll try to get you back on the air later to finish this discussion of how that advance on Baghdad would occur. We've got to send it back to Aaron right now.
AARON BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Thank you. That is a remarkable look at how these -- how this operation moves forward. I must say, the graphics help enormously.
Air raid sirens have been going off in Baghdad on and off. All clears, not all clears, warning signals and the rest. Nic Robertson, what are you hearing now as they approach midnight?
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, we're hearing detonations coming from the edge of the city, some heavy detonations perhaps in the last 10 minutes. Just an indication of the state of flux of this war as we watch here.
We have very little else to focus on apart from when the all- clear sounds, when the siren sounds, indicating another possible attack. We're very focused on that here. What we had a while ago was a siren warning that the city may be under attack. What we're hearing now, although we cannot see any explosions, we're hearing distant detonations towards the edge of the city.
Too far away to say exactly where they're impacting. Perhaps we have heard between 15 and 20 such detonations. There was a small amount of anti-aircraft fire again in the distance, but certainly this city, as far as the anti -- as far as the air raid warnings are concerned for Baghdad at the moment, Baghdad residents and military, the air raid warning sirens have been telling them they're still a city under threat, that there is an attack somewhere under way. And we're hearing it on the outskirts of the city -- Aaron.
BROWN: And the intensity of the sounds you hear, can you compare them to the intensity of the sounds you heard now four hours or so ago, when the cruise missiles hit?
ROBERTSON: These are attacks that are clearly much, much further away. They're dull thuds in the distance. I am sure that if one is much closer to the point of impact, then they would be much louder. The impacts that we witnessed before and the anti-aircraft we witnessed before was unfolding less than a mile or about a mile from where we stood. So, of course, intensity much stronger.
What we're hearing at this time is further out on the periphery of the city. Again, an interesting note. Anti-aircraft fire not erupting in the center of the city. Again, an indication, at least, some of our analysts have been commenting on this, on good command and control, use of anti-aircraft fire when the threat comes close. We're seeing occasional bursts of that anti-aircraft fire on the outskirts of the city at this stage, Aaron.
BROWN: And very briefly, Nic, just give me a sense of what the night sky is like. The moon now has risen in Baghdad. Is it a cloudy night? It's a little hard for me to tell, looking at the picture.
ROBERTSON: It has been clearing all evening. When we started, as night fell, it was perhaps nine-tenths cloud cover. Now we're down over the city of Baghdad to perhaps less than one-tenth cloud cover, maybe even less. And if I look out to the other direction, the moon is very bright and very clear.
The clouds that are scudding across in front of it, not even obscuring it. Very thin clouds. Clouds of a form that would be quite a high altitude as well.
The stars also breaking through against the sky. Many stars now appearing in the sky, Aaron. It is quite a clear night now.
BROWN: Nic, thank you. Nic Robertson in Baghdad, who has been on the phone almost constantly it seems for the last 24 hours -- Christiane in Kuwait?
CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, as we've been discussing and you were talking to Dexter Filkins about what movement is going on from Kuwait into Iraq in the north here, again, I want to say that the Kuwaiti news agency is saying that coalition forces, both U.S. and British forces, which have crossed the border, they say, according to the Kuwait news agency, that the town of Umm Qasr, which is a border town right up north and is on the -- it is a port town and it's Iraqi's biggest commercial point, that town has been taken. Again, according to the Kuwait news agency.
I've tried to call military officials who won't confirm that to us now. But certainly, I have been told over the last 24 hours that Umm Qasr, is essentially on the way to Basra and it would be one of the primary land objectives in the south first, to try to get it, to secure the port. It's the biggest entry point for any kind of civilian and humanitarian supplies that are needed. And it would provide at least the first small but tangible land victory there in a strategic location.
As others up north have been talking about, potentially Basra being the main big population point that would be one of the first targets there. So we're still trying to get this absolutely confirmed from other sources. But Kuwait saying that the town of Umm Qasr, Iraq's biggest port on the border between Kuwait and Iraq, has been taken. They say it did go without a fight. And according to these news agency reports, that the Iraqis in the town surrendered.
In the meantime, we're going to go to CNN's Jane Arraf up north. She is in northern Iraq, close to the Turkish border for more details of what's happening there -- Jane.
JANE ARRAF, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Christiane, Kurdish officials here have been constructing tent cities for would-be potential refugees. Now, they've put up 10 tents for administrative purposes up in the mountains, where hundreds of thousands of Kurds have fled. Hundreds of them living in just under plastic sheeting. They say they have 1,000 tents more. Now we saw horrible scenes today. People lining the roads, families alongside the roads almost knee deep in mud trying to warm their hands over fire wood, getting water from streams. Families packed into small tents. Now you can imagine the level of fear that drives families to leave the cities where they have homes to go and camp out, essentially, in the freezing rain in the countryside. And that's essentially what's happening.
We still have not seen any potential refugees crossing from Iraqi-controlled territory. Those checkpoints are closed and those unofficial borders are essentially sealed -- Christiane.
AMANPOUR: Jane, they're obviously not afraid of the U.S. and U.K. forces. But obviously they're afraid of Iraqis. But what are they saying?
Have there been any attempts at Iraqi incursions or intimidation? Why are they fleeing, exactly?
ARRAF: It's really interesting. It's Iraqi forces, certainly, and the memory of the chemical attacks on Kurdish villages universally. When we were watching them stream out of the city two days ago in a long, long line of cars, trucks, trailers, tractors, anything they could pile their children in and their bedding on, they were saying they were afraid of a chemical attack.
There are, of course, no preparations here. There are no gas masks to buy. There's nothing anyone can do.
This is the kind of place where people believe if you put tape on your windows, it could keep out chemical gas. So they're just fleeing further into the countryside. The are afraid of Iraqi forces, even though their leaders are telling them it's safe, they should go back to the villages, back to the towns, they're got going to.
Bu they're perhaps even more afraid, Christiane, of Turkish forces, particularly after tonight's vote in which the Turkish parliament said that it would send Turkish forces here. Now a senior Kurdish leader tells us that that is unacceptable. That in his conversations with American officials in Ankara over the past couple of days, Kurdish leaders reiterated that they would not accept Turkish troops here. That's still something that's being worked out with the Americans -- Christiane.
AMANPOUR: And that's something that's going to have to be watched very carefully, because clearly Turkey has not allowed U.S. forces to be stationed there. U.S. forces would have come in for a northern front and to protect some of those strategic locations that the Turks were concerned about. For instance, the oil fields and others there.
So if this boils down to a situation where the Turkish forces come in, everybody has been saying that that could be a recipe for potential chaos and we are going to have to watch that very, very carefully. In the meantime, we're going to go to Wolf again. BLITZER: Thanks very much, Christiane. As we look at these live pictures of Baghdad, where we've heard sirens going on and off over the past hour or so, our Nic Robertson on the scene saying out in the outskirts of Baghdad right now, heavy thuds, the sound of bombs presumably going off. But we don't have more details of that right now.
Here in Kuwait, the government strongly supporting the Bush administration, the United States government in this showdown with Iraq. There's another country in this part of the world that also strongly supports the Bush administration; namely, the government of Israel.
CNN's Kelly Wallace is in Tel Aviv right now. We all remember, Kelly, a dozen years ago, the Israelis suffered at the hands of Saddam Hussein. Thirty-nine scud missiles landing in and around Tel Aviv at that time. Tell us what's going on in Israel right now.
KELLY WALLACE, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, for that reason, Israelis are watching the situation in Iraq very, very closely. But right now, the Israelis government assessment continues to be the same. Israeli officials are saying they believe there is a very, very low probability of a successful Iraqi scud attack on Israel.
And so that is why there is a real sense of calm, relative calm on the streets, even in Tel Aviv, the area that really bore the brunt of those 39 Iraqi scud attacks in 1991. But as we show you, if we can show you some live pictures of the streets of Tel Aviv, you can see it's relatively quiet. This is the start of the weekend here in Israel.
Normally, the streets would be filled with people. There is a sense of relative quiet. People are going about their lives. Kids going to school. Attendance, though, in the Tel Aviv area very low, just about 20 percent.
But this interesting point. In 1991, many people in this area left Tel Aviv. They went to Jerusalem or to southern parts of the country considered safe when it comes to any possible Iraqi scud attack. But according to an Israeli newspaper poll, 84 percent of people in this area say they plan to stay.
Now there is tremendous cooperation going on between Israel and the United States. Prime Minister Sharon got a heads up from Secretary of State Colin Powell 90 minutes before the start of the first U.S. strikes in Iraq. And there are unprecedented steps the two countries are taking to try and prevent any Iraqi scud attack and to prevent Israel from getting involved in any way.
You have upgraded American Patriot anti-missile systems deployed in the most populated parts of this country. You have at least 600 American soldiers in Israel. The U.S. is also loaning to Israel an early warning system. So now Israel will have six to seven minutes' notice of any Iraqi scud attack. That's twice the notice it had in 1991. And then, this unprecedented step. The U.S. is sharing real-time classified information about the military campaign in Iraq with the Israelis. Wolf, all of this is the Americans want to show Israel they're doing everything they possibly can to prevent any attack and, again, to prevent Israel from getting involved in any way -- Wolf.
BLITZER: And, Kelly, before I let you go, I know Israeli intelligence analysts have been carefully studying that videotape of Saddam Hussein, just as U.S. intelligence analysts have been studying it. What's the bottom line assessment of the Israelis who are experts, of course, in trying to understand the Iraqi leader?
WALLACE: The bottom line assessment from the Israeli analysts, they believe it is Saddam Hussein, although they believe the Iraqi leader recorded this in a hurry. They thought it was interesting he was wearing glasses, his speech, he was looking down a lot. They sense this is a man who is face something pressure.
But they do believe it is Saddam Hussein, and they can't say, though, exactly if it was live or pre-recorded. But they do think it was the Iraqi leader -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Kelly Wallace in Tel Aviv, where it's obviously right now still very quiet. Back to you, Aaron.
BROWN: Thank you. Quickly to Nic Robertson. We have a better sense of what has been hit or at least that something has been hit -- Nic.
ROBERTSON: Aaron, now 10 to midnight here, we're hearing the all-clear sirens go off indeed at this moment from Iraqi officials on Iraq's television here a little earlier, saying that a number of locations around the country have been hit, perhaps giving us some element of the big picture, just as the air raid siren giving the all clear there, just winds itself down.
The Iraq television saying that a military site in Basra, in the south of the country, close to the border with Kuwait, had been hit. A target, they said, had been hit in Akashak (ph). That is a town about 300 miles northwest of Baghdad, a town very close to the Syrian border. So an indication there that targets in many different areas of the country are being hit, perhaps targets that people had not initially expected to be hit.
Targets perhaps not in the way of invading forces. Perhaps targets that didn't initially indicate high value government or leadership targets. But Iraq reporting that a target close to the border with Syria was hit. Iraq interestingly reporting that four of its fighters have been killed as well. Very interesting that at early stage, it is already admitting to some fatalities -- Aaron.
BROWN: I'm sorry. Will you say that last thing again? Four of its what?
ROBERTSON: Four of its fighters. An interesting wording, and perhaps the wording is important. But Iraq's television said that four of its fighters, rather than soldiers, had been killed.
BROWN: Got it.
ROBERTSON: This could be an indication, Aaron, between the Iraqi government making a differentiation between soldiers in the regular army and Ba'ath Party volunteers, according to Iraq's government. There have been some two million Iraqi Ba'ath Party volunteers. That's the ruling party here, the Ba'ath Party, who have been armed with (UNINTELLIGIBLE). Perhaps when they say fighters, this is what they're referring to -- Aaron.
BROWN: Nic, thank you very much. Nic Robertson.
Just going back for a second to something that Kelly Wallace said. She was talking about the somewhat blase attitude of Israelis. We were looking at the front page of "The Jerusalem Post" the other day. The big banner headline that day -- and it was big and bold -- was "President Bush Issues Ultimatum." And then on the side column, as almost an afterthought, "Citizens Told to Carry Gas Masks Wherever They Go."
It gives you a sense of, perhaps what 50 years of tension and war will do to your mentality. But it does also say that the Israelis are a bit more blase, if that's a fair word for it, than perhaps we are.
President Bush, when he talked earlier to reporters, mentioned that this effort is an effort, this war is an effort to make the homeland, our homeland, more secure. John King, that whole issue of homeland security must be so much on the minds of so many government officials, given the level of the terror alert today.
JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: And so far, so good, Aaron, is the assessment we're getting from senior administration officials as they try to track what they worry about most. That as we have these strikes overseas throughout Iraq, that there will be retaliatory terror strikes, either by organized terrorist networks or sympathetic terrorists or people against the United States in this country.
So far, so good. No plans, we're told, to raise the threat level, although it's already at orange, which is high. So most of the president's business has been behind the scenes today. He's the most senior of about a handful of senior administration officials, including the vice president and the secretary of state.
The national security advisor fanning out, we are told, in phone calls to more than three dozen world leaders, offering them an update on what is going on. But we did hear from the president a bit earlier today. We see Baghdad, a capital under siege. Mr. Bush in the Cabinet room here at the White House to portray a different image, trying to show that in Washington, it's business as usual. Urgent business, but still business as usual. With Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld on one side, Secretary of State Powell on the other, the president offered a brief statement in the Cabinet room.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I called my Cabinet together to review our strategies, to make the world more peaceful, to make our country more secure. To make the lives of our citizens as healthy and as prosperous as possible.
We heard from Secretary Rumsfeld, who briefed us on the early stages of the war. There is no question we've set the finest of our citizens into harm's way. They performed with great skill and great bravery.
We thank them. We thank their loved ones. We appreciate their sacrifice.
We heard from Secretary Powell, who briefed us on the ever- growing coalition of the willing, nations who support our deep desire for peace and freedom. Over 40 nations now support our efforts. We're grateful for their determination. We appreciate their vision, and we welcome their support.
As well, we discussed the need to make sure we have plans in place to encourage economic vitality and growth. We will continue to push for a Medicare system that is compassionate for your seniors. We care deeply about the fact that some children in our society can't read. We want the best of education for every citizen in America.
This Cabinet is confident about the future of our country. We're confident we can achieve our objectives. I'm grateful for their service to their country. Thank you all.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: So even at the very early stages of a defining moment of the Bush presidency, the president trying to make the case that his eyes, and especially the eyes of his Cabinet, still on the domestic affairs of the United States, as the early prosecution of the war continues. One thing the president said that will be the point of contention around the world, the president called it an ever-growing coalition of 40 countries.
That is a handful more nations that were actively involved in the coalition his father assembled 12 years ago for the Persian Gulf War, but there is a significant difference, of course. In this coalition, it is the United States doing the overwhelming load of the fighting. British forces on the ground, Australian troops scheduled to take part, perhaps in some way.
In the last Gulf War, you had Arab forces on the ground. The Egyptians, the Syrians, the Saudis, the Qataris all taking up arms to expel the Iraqi army form Kuwait. No such participation this time around. So as the president says, Aaron, that this is a growing coalition, that is one of the big geopolitical debates, if you will, going on around the world as the president prosecutes a war that is still in its very early stages.
BROWN: And not to sound in any sense crass, I hope, but the other difference is, in the first Gulf War, a lot of those other countries, the Saudis in particular, but not only the Saudis, wrote big checks to pay for the war.
KING: And that will not happen this time. The administration makes no secret about it. The war will be paid for by U.S. taxpayers. An initial bill of $75 to $85 billion likely to go up to Congress as soon as next week. The administration says, when it comes to the long-term reconstruction of Iraq, that that would be paid for using Iraq's oil, one of the reasons they're so sensitive here about the possibility those oil wells have been set fire today.
But no question about it. Last time, Japan wrote big checks, Saudi Arabia wrote big checks, other members of the Arab coalition wrote big checks. This time, when it comes to the war itself, it is being paid for out of the United States Treasury.
BROWN: John, thank you. Our senior White House correspondent, John King, with us.
In Kuwait with is us for the last couple of hours, Christiane Amanpour, as well, Christiane, I think you're still there. There you are. I can see you now.
We're going to take a short break, Christiane and I. We'll both be back at 7:00 Eastern Time and with you most of the evening and into the early morning today.
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Continue as it Approaches Midnight in Iraq>
Aired March 20, 2003 - 15:31 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: CNN's Miles O'Brien is standing by once again at the CNN Center in Atlanta, and he's got General Wesley Clark with him. I wonder if both of you would explain a little bit what's going on on the ground, as U.S. troops, Marines, move into southern Iraq.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Well, Wolf, I'll tell you, having the former supreme NATO commander with me to help us out probably no better source for that. General Wes Clark here to talk. A big picture here about a potential thrust toward Baghdad, basically from the south, because that is where all the troop massing is.
First of all, let's show you a quick graphic, if we could, as we point out this area right down here on the Kuwaiti border, where everything is going to focus on. If we can show this graphic, we'll show you who the players are and what the anticipated routes might be. General Clark, first of all, big picture here, obviously. We once again want to -- for those of you who haven't figured out this geography yet, we're talking about this area right down here. And let's talk about who is involved.
GEN. WESLEY CLARK (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, let's see. The first thing is you've got a heavy Army force.
O'BRIEN: The 101st Airborne.
CLARK: This is the 101st Airborne, which has a lot of helicopters. And it can jump and move long distances. Then you've got the 3rd Infantry division shown there in the green. The 3rd Infantry division is able to move over land, effective forces. This will be a British and U.S. Marine force.
And what you've got here is a big river system. And this is the Euphrates and the Tigris there. And the Euphrates and Tigris define the maneuver zone.
O'BRIEN: All right. I hate to interrupt you. We're going to continue this in just a second. We have somebody who has dropped in on the line. Joining us is Dexter Filkin with "The New York Times." I'm not sure where Dexter is. Dexter, can you hear me OK?
DEXTER FILKINS, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": Yes, I can hear you fine.
O'BRIEN: All right. Tell us what you have. FILKINS: Well, I'm in far northern Kuwait right on the Iraqi border. And just for the past four hours, four and a half hours, I've just been witnessing an extraordinary artillery bombardment by the United States and British forces into Iraq, and an aerial bombardment as well. It's just extraordinary.
I mean, it feels like an earthquake. And just the rumble and the noise, it's shaking the windows, it's shaking buildings. And this has been going on all evening.
O'BRIEN: So I guess that tells you that something is very imminent as far as a march toward Baghdad?
FILKINS: Well, in this case, right where I am, we are about -- I think about 50 miles due south of Basra. And that's Iraq's second largest city. And I think it's probably the first big city that the United States and the coalition would like to take. And I think those tanks are going over.
I saw them today. The troop carriers are going over and they're just pouring over the border towards Basra right now. And I think the artillery is basically blasting a lane for them to do that.
O'BRIEN: All right. I'm joined by General Wesley Clark. He has a question for you, Dexter. Go ahead, General.
CLARK: Well I think the question there is actually, what's going over that border? Is this the Marines, is this the Brits, is this the 3rd Infantry division? And are you seeing helicopters moving over the border? Is it all armored vehicles? And how do you see it there?
FILKINS: Well, it's hard -- that's a good question. It's hard to -- the sun was going down when the first troops that we saw started to go over. And I -- what I saw earlier in the day was that a lot of British forces lined up, and I know they're headed to Basra. And we saw Howitzers and tanks and troop carriers. And then what I believe were U.S. Marines doing the same.
We saw Apache helicopters tonight, what I think were Apache fly over. We heard helicopters. It's very dark here now. We've heard helicopters all night.
We've heard low-flying planes. So there's a lot going on here, that's for sure.
CLARK: Have you seen any incoming fire at all from the Iraqis coming back on to these forces as they move past?
O'BRIEN: You know what, General Clark, we have our wires crossed there. We want to get that rectified first. We'll get back to Dexter when we can.
Let's continue our discussion, because it couldn't be more apropos for what's going on right now. We're talking about which divisions will be doing what. If you could advance this graphic a little bit for us and give us a sense of what's going on. Move it ahead to where it was. There we go. OK. We've got the 101st Airborne, is that red arrow coming up this way. I'll just draw right back over it. And then you've got the 3rd Infantry division, the heavy armor...
CLARK: That's the heavy armor.
O'BRIEN: ... and that's the key thrust, really, if you're a guy like you, who wore a green suit, right?
CLARK: Well, I'm sure thinking about them.
O'BRIEN: What about the number of people involved in this thrust? And then you've got the British, the Marine Expeditionary Unit -- U.S. Marines, along with the Brits. Sheer numbers, is that enough?
CLARK: It probably is. It depends on how carefully you move with the use of air. It depends on the Iraqi resistance. It's a matter for the commanders on the ground to sort out. But in principle, it can be done based on what we know of the Iraqi fighting force, at least up until Baghdad. And then we don't know.
O'BRIEN: All right. And now we're talking about doing this simultaneously to this shock and awe air campaign. And let's take a look at the depiction we put together through our friends at Analytical Graphics showing this huge -- we're talking about 20,000 vehicles, which if you stack them end to end at 40 feet, I figured it out, it's about 150 in length.
Of course they're not going end to end. They're going across the desert this way. What's the tactic here?
CLARK: In this case, we've got them deployed in a combat formation. And you're leading with some platoons that have had their vehicles spread out. They're in wedge so they can see the enemy and bring fire to bear. The unit behind us sort of spread out and following. It might look that way.
O'BRIEN: All right, it might look that way. And there is another thing we can tell you about, too, and that is the possibility of going through an area let's say that has some mines and obstacles. You might get into a narrow column, just like this. And what you'd have leading into these berms is a modified M1-A1 tank, which has a bulldozer on it.
Who says the corps of engineers is not difficult duty? They're right there at the very point of the pointy speer.
CLARK: We call that a mine plow up there on the front of that thing. It should be digging in deep enough to scoop those mines out.
O'BRIEN: Scooping out the mines. On goes the convoy, M1-A1s. You notice they have some mine...
CLARK: Anything that got left there, that roller is going to detonate it so it goes off and doesn't hit the tank.
O'BRIEN: All right. As this column continues onward, our discussion has to take yet another cul-de-sac. General Clark, I know you've got to get going. So we'll try to get you back on the air later to finish this discussion of how that advance on Baghdad would occur. We've got to send it back to Aaron right now.
AARON BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Thank you. That is a remarkable look at how these -- how this operation moves forward. I must say, the graphics help enormously.
Air raid sirens have been going off in Baghdad on and off. All clears, not all clears, warning signals and the rest. Nic Robertson, what are you hearing now as they approach midnight?
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, we're hearing detonations coming from the edge of the city, some heavy detonations perhaps in the last 10 minutes. Just an indication of the state of flux of this war as we watch here.
We have very little else to focus on apart from when the all- clear sounds, when the siren sounds, indicating another possible attack. We're very focused on that here. What we had a while ago was a siren warning that the city may be under attack. What we're hearing now, although we cannot see any explosions, we're hearing distant detonations towards the edge of the city.
Too far away to say exactly where they're impacting. Perhaps we have heard between 15 and 20 such detonations. There was a small amount of anti-aircraft fire again in the distance, but certainly this city, as far as the anti -- as far as the air raid warnings are concerned for Baghdad at the moment, Baghdad residents and military, the air raid warning sirens have been telling them they're still a city under threat, that there is an attack somewhere under way. And we're hearing it on the outskirts of the city -- Aaron.
BROWN: And the intensity of the sounds you hear, can you compare them to the intensity of the sounds you heard now four hours or so ago, when the cruise missiles hit?
ROBERTSON: These are attacks that are clearly much, much further away. They're dull thuds in the distance. I am sure that if one is much closer to the point of impact, then they would be much louder. The impacts that we witnessed before and the anti-aircraft we witnessed before was unfolding less than a mile or about a mile from where we stood. So, of course, intensity much stronger.
What we're hearing at this time is further out on the periphery of the city. Again, an interesting note. Anti-aircraft fire not erupting in the center of the city. Again, an indication, at least, some of our analysts have been commenting on this, on good command and control, use of anti-aircraft fire when the threat comes close. We're seeing occasional bursts of that anti-aircraft fire on the outskirts of the city at this stage, Aaron.
BROWN: And very briefly, Nic, just give me a sense of what the night sky is like. The moon now has risen in Baghdad. Is it a cloudy night? It's a little hard for me to tell, looking at the picture.
ROBERTSON: It has been clearing all evening. When we started, as night fell, it was perhaps nine-tenths cloud cover. Now we're down over the city of Baghdad to perhaps less than one-tenth cloud cover, maybe even less. And if I look out to the other direction, the moon is very bright and very clear.
The clouds that are scudding across in front of it, not even obscuring it. Very thin clouds. Clouds of a form that would be quite a high altitude as well.
The stars also breaking through against the sky. Many stars now appearing in the sky, Aaron. It is quite a clear night now.
BROWN: Nic, thank you. Nic Robertson in Baghdad, who has been on the phone almost constantly it seems for the last 24 hours -- Christiane in Kuwait?
CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, as we've been discussing and you were talking to Dexter Filkins about what movement is going on from Kuwait into Iraq in the north here, again, I want to say that the Kuwaiti news agency is saying that coalition forces, both U.S. and British forces, which have crossed the border, they say, according to the Kuwait news agency, that the town of Umm Qasr, which is a border town right up north and is on the -- it is a port town and it's Iraqi's biggest commercial point, that town has been taken. Again, according to the Kuwait news agency.
I've tried to call military officials who won't confirm that to us now. But certainly, I have been told over the last 24 hours that Umm Qasr, is essentially on the way to Basra and it would be one of the primary land objectives in the south first, to try to get it, to secure the port. It's the biggest entry point for any kind of civilian and humanitarian supplies that are needed. And it would provide at least the first small but tangible land victory there in a strategic location.
As others up north have been talking about, potentially Basra being the main big population point that would be one of the first targets there. So we're still trying to get this absolutely confirmed from other sources. But Kuwait saying that the town of Umm Qasr, Iraq's biggest port on the border between Kuwait and Iraq, has been taken. They say it did go without a fight. And according to these news agency reports, that the Iraqis in the town surrendered.
In the meantime, we're going to go to CNN's Jane Arraf up north. She is in northern Iraq, close to the Turkish border for more details of what's happening there -- Jane.
JANE ARRAF, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Christiane, Kurdish officials here have been constructing tent cities for would-be potential refugees. Now, they've put up 10 tents for administrative purposes up in the mountains, where hundreds of thousands of Kurds have fled. Hundreds of them living in just under plastic sheeting. They say they have 1,000 tents more. Now we saw horrible scenes today. People lining the roads, families alongside the roads almost knee deep in mud trying to warm their hands over fire wood, getting water from streams. Families packed into small tents. Now you can imagine the level of fear that drives families to leave the cities where they have homes to go and camp out, essentially, in the freezing rain in the countryside. And that's essentially what's happening.
We still have not seen any potential refugees crossing from Iraqi-controlled territory. Those checkpoints are closed and those unofficial borders are essentially sealed -- Christiane.
AMANPOUR: Jane, they're obviously not afraid of the U.S. and U.K. forces. But obviously they're afraid of Iraqis. But what are they saying?
Have there been any attempts at Iraqi incursions or intimidation? Why are they fleeing, exactly?
ARRAF: It's really interesting. It's Iraqi forces, certainly, and the memory of the chemical attacks on Kurdish villages universally. When we were watching them stream out of the city two days ago in a long, long line of cars, trucks, trailers, tractors, anything they could pile their children in and their bedding on, they were saying they were afraid of a chemical attack.
There are, of course, no preparations here. There are no gas masks to buy. There's nothing anyone can do.
This is the kind of place where people believe if you put tape on your windows, it could keep out chemical gas. So they're just fleeing further into the countryside. The are afraid of Iraqi forces, even though their leaders are telling them it's safe, they should go back to the villages, back to the towns, they're got going to.
Bu they're perhaps even more afraid, Christiane, of Turkish forces, particularly after tonight's vote in which the Turkish parliament said that it would send Turkish forces here. Now a senior Kurdish leader tells us that that is unacceptable. That in his conversations with American officials in Ankara over the past couple of days, Kurdish leaders reiterated that they would not accept Turkish troops here. That's still something that's being worked out with the Americans -- Christiane.
AMANPOUR: And that's something that's going to have to be watched very carefully, because clearly Turkey has not allowed U.S. forces to be stationed there. U.S. forces would have come in for a northern front and to protect some of those strategic locations that the Turks were concerned about. For instance, the oil fields and others there.
So if this boils down to a situation where the Turkish forces come in, everybody has been saying that that could be a recipe for potential chaos and we are going to have to watch that very, very carefully. In the meantime, we're going to go to Wolf again. BLITZER: Thanks very much, Christiane. As we look at these live pictures of Baghdad, where we've heard sirens going on and off over the past hour or so, our Nic Robertson on the scene saying out in the outskirts of Baghdad right now, heavy thuds, the sound of bombs presumably going off. But we don't have more details of that right now.
Here in Kuwait, the government strongly supporting the Bush administration, the United States government in this showdown with Iraq. There's another country in this part of the world that also strongly supports the Bush administration; namely, the government of Israel.
CNN's Kelly Wallace is in Tel Aviv right now. We all remember, Kelly, a dozen years ago, the Israelis suffered at the hands of Saddam Hussein. Thirty-nine scud missiles landing in and around Tel Aviv at that time. Tell us what's going on in Israel right now.
KELLY WALLACE, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, for that reason, Israelis are watching the situation in Iraq very, very closely. But right now, the Israelis government assessment continues to be the same. Israeli officials are saying they believe there is a very, very low probability of a successful Iraqi scud attack on Israel.
And so that is why there is a real sense of calm, relative calm on the streets, even in Tel Aviv, the area that really bore the brunt of those 39 Iraqi scud attacks in 1991. But as we show you, if we can show you some live pictures of the streets of Tel Aviv, you can see it's relatively quiet. This is the start of the weekend here in Israel.
Normally, the streets would be filled with people. There is a sense of relative quiet. People are going about their lives. Kids going to school. Attendance, though, in the Tel Aviv area very low, just about 20 percent.
But this interesting point. In 1991, many people in this area left Tel Aviv. They went to Jerusalem or to southern parts of the country considered safe when it comes to any possible Iraqi scud attack. But according to an Israeli newspaper poll, 84 percent of people in this area say they plan to stay.
Now there is tremendous cooperation going on between Israel and the United States. Prime Minister Sharon got a heads up from Secretary of State Colin Powell 90 minutes before the start of the first U.S. strikes in Iraq. And there are unprecedented steps the two countries are taking to try and prevent any Iraqi scud attack and to prevent Israel from getting involved in any way.
You have upgraded American Patriot anti-missile systems deployed in the most populated parts of this country. You have at least 600 American soldiers in Israel. The U.S. is also loaning to Israel an early warning system. So now Israel will have six to seven minutes' notice of any Iraqi scud attack. That's twice the notice it had in 1991. And then, this unprecedented step. The U.S. is sharing real-time classified information about the military campaign in Iraq with the Israelis. Wolf, all of this is the Americans want to show Israel they're doing everything they possibly can to prevent any attack and, again, to prevent Israel from getting involved in any way -- Wolf.
BLITZER: And, Kelly, before I let you go, I know Israeli intelligence analysts have been carefully studying that videotape of Saddam Hussein, just as U.S. intelligence analysts have been studying it. What's the bottom line assessment of the Israelis who are experts, of course, in trying to understand the Iraqi leader?
WALLACE: The bottom line assessment from the Israeli analysts, they believe it is Saddam Hussein, although they believe the Iraqi leader recorded this in a hurry. They thought it was interesting he was wearing glasses, his speech, he was looking down a lot. They sense this is a man who is face something pressure.
But they do believe it is Saddam Hussein, and they can't say, though, exactly if it was live or pre-recorded. But they do think it was the Iraqi leader -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Kelly Wallace in Tel Aviv, where it's obviously right now still very quiet. Back to you, Aaron.
BROWN: Thank you. Quickly to Nic Robertson. We have a better sense of what has been hit or at least that something has been hit -- Nic.
ROBERTSON: Aaron, now 10 to midnight here, we're hearing the all-clear sirens go off indeed at this moment from Iraqi officials on Iraq's television here a little earlier, saying that a number of locations around the country have been hit, perhaps giving us some element of the big picture, just as the air raid siren giving the all clear there, just winds itself down.
The Iraq television saying that a military site in Basra, in the south of the country, close to the border with Kuwait, had been hit. A target, they said, had been hit in Akashak (ph). That is a town about 300 miles northwest of Baghdad, a town very close to the Syrian border. So an indication there that targets in many different areas of the country are being hit, perhaps targets that people had not initially expected to be hit.
Targets perhaps not in the way of invading forces. Perhaps targets that didn't initially indicate high value government or leadership targets. But Iraq reporting that a target close to the border with Syria was hit. Iraq interestingly reporting that four of its fighters have been killed as well. Very interesting that at early stage, it is already admitting to some fatalities -- Aaron.
BROWN: I'm sorry. Will you say that last thing again? Four of its what?
ROBERTSON: Four of its fighters. An interesting wording, and perhaps the wording is important. But Iraq's television said that four of its fighters, rather than soldiers, had been killed.
BROWN: Got it.
ROBERTSON: This could be an indication, Aaron, between the Iraqi government making a differentiation between soldiers in the regular army and Ba'ath Party volunteers, according to Iraq's government. There have been some two million Iraqi Ba'ath Party volunteers. That's the ruling party here, the Ba'ath Party, who have been armed with (UNINTELLIGIBLE). Perhaps when they say fighters, this is what they're referring to -- Aaron.
BROWN: Nic, thank you very much. Nic Robertson.
Just going back for a second to something that Kelly Wallace said. She was talking about the somewhat blase attitude of Israelis. We were looking at the front page of "The Jerusalem Post" the other day. The big banner headline that day -- and it was big and bold -- was "President Bush Issues Ultimatum." And then on the side column, as almost an afterthought, "Citizens Told to Carry Gas Masks Wherever They Go."
It gives you a sense of, perhaps what 50 years of tension and war will do to your mentality. But it does also say that the Israelis are a bit more blase, if that's a fair word for it, than perhaps we are.
President Bush, when he talked earlier to reporters, mentioned that this effort is an effort, this war is an effort to make the homeland, our homeland, more secure. John King, that whole issue of homeland security must be so much on the minds of so many government officials, given the level of the terror alert today.
JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: And so far, so good, Aaron, is the assessment we're getting from senior administration officials as they try to track what they worry about most. That as we have these strikes overseas throughout Iraq, that there will be retaliatory terror strikes, either by organized terrorist networks or sympathetic terrorists or people against the United States in this country.
So far, so good. No plans, we're told, to raise the threat level, although it's already at orange, which is high. So most of the president's business has been behind the scenes today. He's the most senior of about a handful of senior administration officials, including the vice president and the secretary of state.
The national security advisor fanning out, we are told, in phone calls to more than three dozen world leaders, offering them an update on what is going on. But we did hear from the president a bit earlier today. We see Baghdad, a capital under siege. Mr. Bush in the Cabinet room here at the White House to portray a different image, trying to show that in Washington, it's business as usual. Urgent business, but still business as usual. With Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld on one side, Secretary of State Powell on the other, the president offered a brief statement in the Cabinet room.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I called my Cabinet together to review our strategies, to make the world more peaceful, to make our country more secure. To make the lives of our citizens as healthy and as prosperous as possible.
We heard from Secretary Rumsfeld, who briefed us on the early stages of the war. There is no question we've set the finest of our citizens into harm's way. They performed with great skill and great bravery.
We thank them. We thank their loved ones. We appreciate their sacrifice.
We heard from Secretary Powell, who briefed us on the ever- growing coalition of the willing, nations who support our deep desire for peace and freedom. Over 40 nations now support our efforts. We're grateful for their determination. We appreciate their vision, and we welcome their support.
As well, we discussed the need to make sure we have plans in place to encourage economic vitality and growth. We will continue to push for a Medicare system that is compassionate for your seniors. We care deeply about the fact that some children in our society can't read. We want the best of education for every citizen in America.
This Cabinet is confident about the future of our country. We're confident we can achieve our objectives. I'm grateful for their service to their country. Thank you all.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: So even at the very early stages of a defining moment of the Bush presidency, the president trying to make the case that his eyes, and especially the eyes of his Cabinet, still on the domestic affairs of the United States, as the early prosecution of the war continues. One thing the president said that will be the point of contention around the world, the president called it an ever-growing coalition of 40 countries.
That is a handful more nations that were actively involved in the coalition his father assembled 12 years ago for the Persian Gulf War, but there is a significant difference, of course. In this coalition, it is the United States doing the overwhelming load of the fighting. British forces on the ground, Australian troops scheduled to take part, perhaps in some way.
In the last Gulf War, you had Arab forces on the ground. The Egyptians, the Syrians, the Saudis, the Qataris all taking up arms to expel the Iraqi army form Kuwait. No such participation this time around. So as the president says, Aaron, that this is a growing coalition, that is one of the big geopolitical debates, if you will, going on around the world as the president prosecutes a war that is still in its very early stages.
BROWN: And not to sound in any sense crass, I hope, but the other difference is, in the first Gulf War, a lot of those other countries, the Saudis in particular, but not only the Saudis, wrote big checks to pay for the war.
KING: And that will not happen this time. The administration makes no secret about it. The war will be paid for by U.S. taxpayers. An initial bill of $75 to $85 billion likely to go up to Congress as soon as next week. The administration says, when it comes to the long-term reconstruction of Iraq, that that would be paid for using Iraq's oil, one of the reasons they're so sensitive here about the possibility those oil wells have been set fire today.
But no question about it. Last time, Japan wrote big checks, Saudi Arabia wrote big checks, other members of the Arab coalition wrote big checks. This time, when it comes to the war itself, it is being paid for out of the United States Treasury.
BROWN: John, thank you. Our senior White House correspondent, John King, with us.
In Kuwait with is us for the last couple of hours, Christiane Amanpour, as well, Christiane, I think you're still there. There you are. I can see you now.
We're going to take a short break, Christiane and I. We'll both be back at 7:00 Eastern Time and with you most of the evening and into the early morning today.
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