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Tikrit Under Fire

Aired April 11, 2003 - 13:20   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: U.S. officials, meanwhile, have long speculated that Saddam Hussein might try to make what they call a last stand in his hometown of Tikrit. Coalition warplanes attacked that northern city once again today.
Joining me now from CNN military desk to talk about the battle for Tikrit, Renay San Miguel and Retired U.S. Air Force Major General Don Shepperd. Gentlemen, is this going to be Saddam Hussein's last stand in Tikrit?

RENAY SAN MIGUEL, CNN ANCHOR: Well, Wolf, Saddam Hussein did stack his inner circle, his closest advisers, with folks from his hometown of Tikrit, so it is expected that -- was expected that they would fight to the death for him in the city of about 260,000 people.

But General, with all of the coalition air strikes that have been focused on Tikrit over the last few days, do we really expect a major battle here?

RET. MAJ. GEN. DON SHEPPERD, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: All the air -- all the air assets are going into Tikrit area right now, at least the vast majority of them.

This will either be the last battle or the last sigh, one or the other. It could be a big battle. There could be just walking into it, kind of like Baghdad, and cleaning up pockets.

SAN MIGUEL: But you'll notice -- I mean, there used to be an awful lot of red here three weeks ago. Now the only red that you're seeing on this map is around Tikrit.

We have some satellite imagery from earthviewer.com and Space Imaging Middle East (ph). We want to show some of the presidential complexes that are around here.

You know, it's -- it's -- it's kind of an obvious question, do we expect the bulk of the fighting, if there is, around these presidential palaces, but it hasn't really happened that way in other parts of the country.

SHEPPERD: Yes, this is -- this is basically -- Tikrit's a city of about 28,000, most of them Ba'ath loyalists and many palaces and VIP headquarters around here all built for the Saddam regime. It would be the logical place for him to retreat it if he is still alive, the logical place for him to go to flee from there with perhaps some of those airplanes we heard about earlier today.

And, of course, the other place he could go is on the road to Syria.

SAN MIGUEL: What do we know about the Adnan division? It's one of the few Republican Guard divisions that is still semi-intact. What do we know about them?

SHEPPERD: We don't know if it's semi-intact or not, but if so, the airpower that is being devoted there probably will take it out of business today. It's being hit very hard with air power. It was the last of the divisions that had not been destroyed, was the last report we heard from CENTCOM.

SAN MIGUEL: And we had heard also -- we are hearing from "TIME" magazine's Michael Ware that those irregular Iraqi paramilitary forces that were ringed around Tikrit, as well as some of the Ba'ath Party fighters have pulled in.

They destroyed a bridge over the -- the Tigris River. Is that really going to create a problem for the coalition?

SHEPPERD: It's not going to create a problem for the coalition. It prevent them from reinforcing in any way. So this is probably irrelevant news for the coalition, Renay.

SAN MIGUEL: So what -- so what do you -- what do you think will happen here? I mean, is the bombing really going to have done its job or is this going to be the last stand?

SHEPPERD: My gut tells me that this will be a cleanup of pockets because the air power will decimate anything that's left in the area. There may be some people in underground bunkers and this type of thing surviving. But I think you're see basically a walkover, quick walkover in Tikrit.

SAN MIGUEL: And you mentioned quickly just some planes that -- the five planes that were found by -- by coalition forces, either going to be escape vehicles for the Ba'ath Party regulars there, or maybe to be used for -- squaring down weapons of mass destruction.

SHEPPERD: My guess is they were a fleeing mechanism for those left to go somewhere, probably Syria.

SAN MIGUEL: OK. And it was a moot point because they were destroyed by...

SHEPPERD: Indeed.

SAN MIGUEL: ...by the forces.

General, thank you for your time, as always. Back to you.

BLITZER: Renay, before I let General Shepperd go, one quick question to him. General Shepperd, it's been said repeatedly over the past several hours and days that the big difference between Tikrit, even Baghdad, certainly in the south and the north, is the people of Tikrit, the Tikritis, if you will, they genuinely love Saddam Hussein. He's one of theirs. He's come from there and he's rewarded them over these past decades with unbelievable benefits because of the nature of that relationship.

Will they, therefore, fight for him the way people elsewhere in the country didn't?

SHEPPERD: Wolf, they probably would like to, but they may not have anything left with which to fight. When they've been pounded by airpower for days, they simply may not have mechanism to do it.

This is Saddam territory, the Ba'ath Party clan and tribe are very important in Iraqi and this is Saddam's area. So if any place has feelings for him, it's here. But they just may not have anything left to do it with, despite their feelings.

BLITZER: All right, General Shepperd, Renay San Miguel, thanks, as usual. We always learn something from you guys.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com






Aired April 11, 2003 - 13:20   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: U.S. officials, meanwhile, have long speculated that Saddam Hussein might try to make what they call a last stand in his hometown of Tikrit. Coalition warplanes attacked that northern city once again today.
Joining me now from CNN military desk to talk about the battle for Tikrit, Renay San Miguel and Retired U.S. Air Force Major General Don Shepperd. Gentlemen, is this going to be Saddam Hussein's last stand in Tikrit?

RENAY SAN MIGUEL, CNN ANCHOR: Well, Wolf, Saddam Hussein did stack his inner circle, his closest advisers, with folks from his hometown of Tikrit, so it is expected that -- was expected that they would fight to the death for him in the city of about 260,000 people.

But General, with all of the coalition air strikes that have been focused on Tikrit over the last few days, do we really expect a major battle here?

RET. MAJ. GEN. DON SHEPPERD, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: All the air -- all the air assets are going into Tikrit area right now, at least the vast majority of them.

This will either be the last battle or the last sigh, one or the other. It could be a big battle. There could be just walking into it, kind of like Baghdad, and cleaning up pockets.

SAN MIGUEL: But you'll notice -- I mean, there used to be an awful lot of red here three weeks ago. Now the only red that you're seeing on this map is around Tikrit.

We have some satellite imagery from earthviewer.com and Space Imaging Middle East (ph). We want to show some of the presidential complexes that are around here.

You know, it's -- it's -- it's kind of an obvious question, do we expect the bulk of the fighting, if there is, around these presidential palaces, but it hasn't really happened that way in other parts of the country.

SHEPPERD: Yes, this is -- this is basically -- Tikrit's a city of about 28,000, most of them Ba'ath loyalists and many palaces and VIP headquarters around here all built for the Saddam regime. It would be the logical place for him to retreat it if he is still alive, the logical place for him to go to flee from there with perhaps some of those airplanes we heard about earlier today.

And, of course, the other place he could go is on the road to Syria.

SAN MIGUEL: What do we know about the Adnan division? It's one of the few Republican Guard divisions that is still semi-intact. What do we know about them?

SHEPPERD: We don't know if it's semi-intact or not, but if so, the airpower that is being devoted there probably will take it out of business today. It's being hit very hard with air power. It was the last of the divisions that had not been destroyed, was the last report we heard from CENTCOM.

SAN MIGUEL: And we had heard also -- we are hearing from "TIME" magazine's Michael Ware that those irregular Iraqi paramilitary forces that were ringed around Tikrit, as well as some of the Ba'ath Party fighters have pulled in.

They destroyed a bridge over the -- the Tigris River. Is that really going to create a problem for the coalition?

SHEPPERD: It's not going to create a problem for the coalition. It prevent them from reinforcing in any way. So this is probably irrelevant news for the coalition, Renay.

SAN MIGUEL: So what -- so what do you -- what do you think will happen here? I mean, is the bombing really going to have done its job or is this going to be the last stand?

SHEPPERD: My gut tells me that this will be a cleanup of pockets because the air power will decimate anything that's left in the area. There may be some people in underground bunkers and this type of thing surviving. But I think you're see basically a walkover, quick walkover in Tikrit.

SAN MIGUEL: And you mentioned quickly just some planes that -- the five planes that were found by -- by coalition forces, either going to be escape vehicles for the Ba'ath Party regulars there, or maybe to be used for -- squaring down weapons of mass destruction.

SHEPPERD: My guess is they were a fleeing mechanism for those left to go somewhere, probably Syria.

SAN MIGUEL: OK. And it was a moot point because they were destroyed by...

SHEPPERD: Indeed.

SAN MIGUEL: ...by the forces.

General, thank you for your time, as always. Back to you.

BLITZER: Renay, before I let General Shepperd go, one quick question to him. General Shepperd, it's been said repeatedly over the past several hours and days that the big difference between Tikrit, even Baghdad, certainly in the south and the north, is the people of Tikrit, the Tikritis, if you will, they genuinely love Saddam Hussein. He's one of theirs. He's come from there and he's rewarded them over these past decades with unbelievable benefits because of the nature of that relationship.

Will they, therefore, fight for him the way people elsewhere in the country didn't?

SHEPPERD: Wolf, they probably would like to, but they may not have anything left with which to fight. When they've been pounded by airpower for days, they simply may not have mechanism to do it.

This is Saddam territory, the Ba'ath Party clan and tribe are very important in Iraqi and this is Saddam's area. So if any place has feelings for him, it's here. But they just may not have anything left to do it with, despite their feelings.

BLITZER: All right, General Shepperd, Renay San Miguel, thanks, as usual. We always learn something from you guys.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com