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Capture of Abu Abbas: Legal Options
Aired April 16, 2003 - 15:03 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Since his capture in Baghdad late Monday by Special Forces of the U.S., the tug of war over convicted terrorist Abu Abbas has intensified. Italy wants him extradited to begin serving a life sentence for the 1985 hijkacking of the cruise ship. An American Jew, Leon Klinghoffer, was killed during that hijacking and the Justice Department is considering its legal options.Palestinian leaders say the U.S. should never have seized Abbas.
Lots to sort out here. CNN national security correspondent David Ensor joining us to tell to us about this jurisdictional tug of war here.
Hello, David.
DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes, well, it's quite complicated, Miles.
As you say, the Italians, of course, found him guilty in absentia of directing the seizure of the "Achille Lauro," the process that led, among other things, to the murder of Leon Klinghoffer.
He's got a life sentence to serve in Italy. They would like him sent there.
The Palestinians think he should be set free because of the language in an agreement after the Oslo Accords. U.S. officials saying that just is an incorrect interpretation of -- of -- of -- the law there -- that, yes, it's true that the agreement, the post-Oslo Accord agreement, means that Israel cannot try him for anything that he might have done prior to 1993. But U.S. officials say that has nothing to do with what Italy or the United States might care to do, vis-a-vis Abu Abbas. So they say the Palestinians are simply not correct, that he has not got any kind of immunity from prosecution by the U.S. or by Italy.
Now, the United States wants to learn a lot from this man. They'd like to know whether Abu Abbas had any role in Baghdad, assisting the regime of Saddam Hussein in either its relationships with terrorist groups or its assistance for terrorists.
For example, as you probably know, the Saddam Hussein government had promised $25,000 to be given to any Palestinian family, a member of which was a suicide bomber trying to kill Israelis. That, in the American view, is aiding and abetting terrorism. Certainly in the Israeli view as well. Did Abu Abbas have any role in perhaps getting the money to Palestinian families? That's one question. There are also questions about what he may know about assistance for terrorism.
So the U.S. is taking a firm view, as expressed today by Central Command this morning, that this is a terrorist that they want to talk to.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRIG. GEN. VINCENT BROOKS, U.S. CENTRAL COMMAND: Abu Abbas is a terrorist. He was a terrorist. He remains a terrorist. And he will be viewed as such. Not withstanding anything declarations that have been made in recent years, his role in terrorism, his links to terrorist organizations are abundantly clear.
But perhaps what's more important is he was found in Baghdad. And we've said for a long time that Baghdad and Iraq and the regime that no longer exists have harbored terrorists, have provided a safe haven for terrorists and in some cases have facilitated the operations of terrorists.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ENSOR: So, as they say, they want to talk to Abu Abbas, learn what they can about his role in recent years and the Justice Department will also be considering whether or not to renew charges, U.S. charges of piracy, conspiracy, several other charges connected with the "Achille Lauro" matter of 1985, Miles.
O'BRIEN: Dave -- David, a quick one and then I got another question for you, What might compel Abbas to talk?
ENSOR: Well, his life could be probably more or less pleasant depending own on how cooperative he is. I -- I don't really know. I suppose he might refuse to talk. But if he does refuse to talk, I imagine that the terms of his confinement will be less pleasant.
In the meantime, the U.S. is in no hurry to send him anywhere. They -- they have a lot of questions for him. They want to look into his background. At some point, though, he may well be sent to Italy, which, after all, is a -- is a close ally of the United States and does have, you know, a desire to get him, has asked -- asked for him.
O'BRIEN: Interesting.
ENSOR: Miles.
O'BRIEN: All right.
I understand you're getting some new information about one of the Iraqi ambassadors and his destination possibly being Syria, which brings us back to what we've been talking about the past couple of days, the pressure the U.S. is putting on Syria. Is there increasing evidence that this is becoming the -- the destination of choice for Baathists?
ENSOR: Well, it's interesting.
We -- we reported and several others reported yesterday that a particular key Iraqi, Farouk Hijazi, who is the former head of the Mukabarat, the Iraqi intelligence service, and is now currently serving as ambassador from Iraq to Tunisia, had entered into Syria, according to U.S. officials.
Syrian officials are now denying that Hijazi is in Syria. And I was talking to some U.S. officials about that denial. They have now given me a little bit more specific information about Hijazi. They tell me that Hijazi actually flew from Tunis to Damascus on a direct flight yesterday, that he checked in through Damascus passport control and produced an Iraqi diplomatic passport and was admitted into Syria.
So here you have U.S. officials directly contradicting what the Syrians are saying. They are saying this key individual, who is, by the way, suspected by the United States of involvement in the unsuccessful plot to kill President George Bush senior in Kuwait some years ago -- that this individual is in Syria, despite what the Syrians are saying, Miles.
O'BRIEN: Wow, that could ratchet up the tension quite a bit as it relates to Syria, couldn't it?
ENSOR: Possible.
O'BRIEN: All right. David Ensor, thank you very much. Appreciate it.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired April 16, 2003 - 15:03 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Since his capture in Baghdad late Monday by Special Forces of the U.S., the tug of war over convicted terrorist Abu Abbas has intensified. Italy wants him extradited to begin serving a life sentence for the 1985 hijkacking of the cruise ship. An American Jew, Leon Klinghoffer, was killed during that hijacking and the Justice Department is considering its legal options.Palestinian leaders say the U.S. should never have seized Abbas.
Lots to sort out here. CNN national security correspondent David Ensor joining us to tell to us about this jurisdictional tug of war here.
Hello, David.
DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes, well, it's quite complicated, Miles.
As you say, the Italians, of course, found him guilty in absentia of directing the seizure of the "Achille Lauro," the process that led, among other things, to the murder of Leon Klinghoffer.
He's got a life sentence to serve in Italy. They would like him sent there.
The Palestinians think he should be set free because of the language in an agreement after the Oslo Accords. U.S. officials saying that just is an incorrect interpretation of -- of -- of -- the law there -- that, yes, it's true that the agreement, the post-Oslo Accord agreement, means that Israel cannot try him for anything that he might have done prior to 1993. But U.S. officials say that has nothing to do with what Italy or the United States might care to do, vis-a-vis Abu Abbas. So they say the Palestinians are simply not correct, that he has not got any kind of immunity from prosecution by the U.S. or by Italy.
Now, the United States wants to learn a lot from this man. They'd like to know whether Abu Abbas had any role in Baghdad, assisting the regime of Saddam Hussein in either its relationships with terrorist groups or its assistance for terrorists.
For example, as you probably know, the Saddam Hussein government had promised $25,000 to be given to any Palestinian family, a member of which was a suicide bomber trying to kill Israelis. That, in the American view, is aiding and abetting terrorism. Certainly in the Israeli view as well. Did Abu Abbas have any role in perhaps getting the money to Palestinian families? That's one question. There are also questions about what he may know about assistance for terrorism.
So the U.S. is taking a firm view, as expressed today by Central Command this morning, that this is a terrorist that they want to talk to.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRIG. GEN. VINCENT BROOKS, U.S. CENTRAL COMMAND: Abu Abbas is a terrorist. He was a terrorist. He remains a terrorist. And he will be viewed as such. Not withstanding anything declarations that have been made in recent years, his role in terrorism, his links to terrorist organizations are abundantly clear.
But perhaps what's more important is he was found in Baghdad. And we've said for a long time that Baghdad and Iraq and the regime that no longer exists have harbored terrorists, have provided a safe haven for terrorists and in some cases have facilitated the operations of terrorists.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ENSOR: So, as they say, they want to talk to Abu Abbas, learn what they can about his role in recent years and the Justice Department will also be considering whether or not to renew charges, U.S. charges of piracy, conspiracy, several other charges connected with the "Achille Lauro" matter of 1985, Miles.
O'BRIEN: Dave -- David, a quick one and then I got another question for you, What might compel Abbas to talk?
ENSOR: Well, his life could be probably more or less pleasant depending own on how cooperative he is. I -- I don't really know. I suppose he might refuse to talk. But if he does refuse to talk, I imagine that the terms of his confinement will be less pleasant.
In the meantime, the U.S. is in no hurry to send him anywhere. They -- they have a lot of questions for him. They want to look into his background. At some point, though, he may well be sent to Italy, which, after all, is a -- is a close ally of the United States and does have, you know, a desire to get him, has asked -- asked for him.
O'BRIEN: Interesting.
ENSOR: Miles.
O'BRIEN: All right.
I understand you're getting some new information about one of the Iraqi ambassadors and his destination possibly being Syria, which brings us back to what we've been talking about the past couple of days, the pressure the U.S. is putting on Syria. Is there increasing evidence that this is becoming the -- the destination of choice for Baathists?
ENSOR: Well, it's interesting.
We -- we reported and several others reported yesterday that a particular key Iraqi, Farouk Hijazi, who is the former head of the Mukabarat, the Iraqi intelligence service, and is now currently serving as ambassador from Iraq to Tunisia, had entered into Syria, according to U.S. officials.
Syrian officials are now denying that Hijazi is in Syria. And I was talking to some U.S. officials about that denial. They have now given me a little bit more specific information about Hijazi. They tell me that Hijazi actually flew from Tunis to Damascus on a direct flight yesterday, that he checked in through Damascus passport control and produced an Iraqi diplomatic passport and was admitted into Syria.
So here you have U.S. officials directly contradicting what the Syrians are saying. They are saying this key individual, who is, by the way, suspected by the United States of involvement in the unsuccessful plot to kill President George Bush senior in Kuwait some years ago -- that this individual is in Syria, despite what the Syrians are saying, Miles.
O'BRIEN: Wow, that could ratchet up the tension quite a bit as it relates to Syria, couldn't it?
ENSOR: Possible.
O'BRIEN: All right. David Ensor, thank you very much. Appreciate it.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
