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New Freedoms in Iraq Also Create New Challenges

Aired April 21, 2003 - 15:38   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


JUDY WOODRUFF, CNN ANCHOR: Well the new freedoms in Iraq also create new challenges for U.S. efforts to assist in the creation of a functioning and democratic Iraqi government. With me now to talk more about U.S. efforts and what a future Iraqi government might look like, Danielle Pletka. She's with the American Enterprise Institute. And Michelle Flournoy. She's with the Center for Strategic and International Studies.
Danielle, let me start with you. The Bush administration has said all along they want the Iraqi people to decide what kind of government they want. Well if it turns out that the majority Shiites create and want a Muslim government, what does that say? How much of a problem is that for this country?

DANIELLE PLETKA, AMERICAN ENTERPRISE INSTITUTE: Well, first of all, let's understand, on the day after Easter, if somebody had dropped into the United States yesterday and seen all of these Christians going to church and worshipping and all these signs saying "Jesus has risen," perhaps they would make assumptions that weren't correct about American society. So let's not base what they think about Iraq...

WOODRUFF: Based on one rally?

PLETKA: Based on these rallies. But you know I think it's important that we understand, historically, Iraq's Shiite community has not been particularly fundamentalist, nor has it been interested in an Iran style bureaucracy. In fact, I got an e-mail from Iraq this morning that said that the Iranians had sent over hundreds of organizers, political organizers to have people do just this, hold up signs saying no to America, no to the Brits, no, we want Islamic rule. But I don't necessarily think they're representative of all of Iraq's Shiites.

WOODRUFF: Is this a threat, Michelle, at this point to the United States? Hopes of a democratic -- some form of democratic government in Iraq?

MICHELLE FLOURNOY, CENTER FOR STRATEGIC AND INTERNATIONAL STUDIES: I don't think it's a threat, but I think it's something that we need to watch. And one of the things that it underscores in my mind is the need for us to be much more clear about what is the process that we're going to go through with the Iraqis to help them determine their future? What is the national dialogue process look like? The sooner we can make that clear, make that publicly known, advertise it, the sooner we can begin to channel some of this energy into a more productive process of moving forward to create a new government.

WOODRUFF: Danielle, how heavy a hand can the United States play throughout all this as the Iraqis figure this out?

PLETKA: You're asking exactly the right question. How do we walk the fine line between ensuring security and providing an environment in which Iraqis can build their own institutions and being essentially a colonial power, which is something that I think all Iraqis can agree they don't want? And the answer to that is -- I hate to agree with Michelle -- but it is to have better organization. It is to have more transparency about just where we're going, just to we're working with.

It's to end the bickering inside the U.S. government about who our political friends are inside Iraq. And it is to start that process of consultation and consensus inside Iraq through institutions with the military on the sidelines only providing security, rehabilitation and that sort of assistance.

WOODRUFF: Is that how you see it, Michelle? And how long is the United States going to need to stay in Iraq to see that things work out in a stable way?

FLOURNOY: Well, I agree that the military really needs to be focused on providing the foundation on which the rest of reconstruction should occur. And that they really shouldn't be in charge of putting together the government's process.

That said, it's going to take a substantial amount of effort to provide that security. Yes, we should get as many Iraqi police back on the streets, but they are going to need the backup of U.S. forces until indigenous Iraqi institutions can be formed. And that may take a matter of years.

WOODRUFF: Can the United States, Danielle, promote democracy, bottom line, and do it in a way that we don't inflame Iraq's Arab neighbors?

PLETKA: Well, I'm not sure that we need to care desperately about inflaming Iraq's Arab neighbors or Iran, the biggest neighbor and the most interfering one. To the contrary, I don't think we want Iraq to look like the rest of the Middle East. We want it to look a lot better than the rest of the Middle East. And if they don't like it, well, that's probably too bad.

WOODRUFF: Quick last word, Danielle -- Michelle.

FLOURNOY: I think the main thing is walking the line of maintaining adequate security so that reconstruction can proceed. But as soon as possible, putting more of this into Iraqi hands, so that our efforts are seen as in service of the broader effort of the Iraqi people to determine their own future.

WOODRUFF: All right. We want to leave it at that. It's Michelle Flournoy, of the Center for Strategic and International Studies; Daniel Pletka, she's with the American Enterprise Institute. We're going to have many more opportunities to talk about all of this.

Good to see both of you. Thanks very much.

FLOURNY: Thank you.

PLETKA: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired April 21, 2003 - 15:38   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JUDY WOODRUFF, CNN ANCHOR: Well the new freedoms in Iraq also create new challenges for U.S. efforts to assist in the creation of a functioning and democratic Iraqi government. With me now to talk more about U.S. efforts and what a future Iraqi government might look like, Danielle Pletka. She's with the American Enterprise Institute. And Michelle Flournoy. She's with the Center for Strategic and International Studies.
Danielle, let me start with you. The Bush administration has said all along they want the Iraqi people to decide what kind of government they want. Well if it turns out that the majority Shiites create and want a Muslim government, what does that say? How much of a problem is that for this country?

DANIELLE PLETKA, AMERICAN ENTERPRISE INSTITUTE: Well, first of all, let's understand, on the day after Easter, if somebody had dropped into the United States yesterday and seen all of these Christians going to church and worshipping and all these signs saying "Jesus has risen," perhaps they would make assumptions that weren't correct about American society. So let's not base what they think about Iraq...

WOODRUFF: Based on one rally?

PLETKA: Based on these rallies. But you know I think it's important that we understand, historically, Iraq's Shiite community has not been particularly fundamentalist, nor has it been interested in an Iran style bureaucracy. In fact, I got an e-mail from Iraq this morning that said that the Iranians had sent over hundreds of organizers, political organizers to have people do just this, hold up signs saying no to America, no to the Brits, no, we want Islamic rule. But I don't necessarily think they're representative of all of Iraq's Shiites.

WOODRUFF: Is this a threat, Michelle, at this point to the United States? Hopes of a democratic -- some form of democratic government in Iraq?

MICHELLE FLOURNOY, CENTER FOR STRATEGIC AND INTERNATIONAL STUDIES: I don't think it's a threat, but I think it's something that we need to watch. And one of the things that it underscores in my mind is the need for us to be much more clear about what is the process that we're going to go through with the Iraqis to help them determine their future? What is the national dialogue process look like? The sooner we can make that clear, make that publicly known, advertise it, the sooner we can begin to channel some of this energy into a more productive process of moving forward to create a new government.

WOODRUFF: Danielle, how heavy a hand can the United States play throughout all this as the Iraqis figure this out?

PLETKA: You're asking exactly the right question. How do we walk the fine line between ensuring security and providing an environment in which Iraqis can build their own institutions and being essentially a colonial power, which is something that I think all Iraqis can agree they don't want? And the answer to that is -- I hate to agree with Michelle -- but it is to have better organization. It is to have more transparency about just where we're going, just to we're working with.

It's to end the bickering inside the U.S. government about who our political friends are inside Iraq. And it is to start that process of consultation and consensus inside Iraq through institutions with the military on the sidelines only providing security, rehabilitation and that sort of assistance.

WOODRUFF: Is that how you see it, Michelle? And how long is the United States going to need to stay in Iraq to see that things work out in a stable way?

FLOURNOY: Well, I agree that the military really needs to be focused on providing the foundation on which the rest of reconstruction should occur. And that they really shouldn't be in charge of putting together the government's process.

That said, it's going to take a substantial amount of effort to provide that security. Yes, we should get as many Iraqi police back on the streets, but they are going to need the backup of U.S. forces until indigenous Iraqi institutions can be formed. And that may take a matter of years.

WOODRUFF: Can the United States, Danielle, promote democracy, bottom line, and do it in a way that we don't inflame Iraq's Arab neighbors?

PLETKA: Well, I'm not sure that we need to care desperately about inflaming Iraq's Arab neighbors or Iran, the biggest neighbor and the most interfering one. To the contrary, I don't think we want Iraq to look like the rest of the Middle East. We want it to look a lot better than the rest of the Middle East. And if they don't like it, well, that's probably too bad.

WOODRUFF: Quick last word, Danielle -- Michelle.

FLOURNOY: I think the main thing is walking the line of maintaining adequate security so that reconstruction can proceed. But as soon as possible, putting more of this into Iraqi hands, so that our efforts are seen as in service of the broader effort of the Iraqi people to determine their own future.

WOODRUFF: All right. We want to leave it at that. It's Michelle Flournoy, of the Center for Strategic and International Studies; Daniel Pletka, she's with the American Enterprise Institute. We're going to have many more opportunities to talk about all of this.

Good to see both of you. Thanks very much.

FLOURNY: Thank you.

PLETKA: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com