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A New Iraq: Still a Dangerous Place

Aired June 12, 2003 - 13:32   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: The end of the war has not meant an end to danger for coalition forces.
CNN correspondent Karl Penhaul covered the war and its aftermath. He left Iraq just two weeks ago and joins me now to talk about the ever present risks to the forces, still there and trying to maintain order.

Tell us a little about what you saw, just as you were living.

KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, absolutely, Heidi. I mean, even today, we've seen Ben Wedeman reporting about the Apache helicopter being shot down in an area west of Baghdad. In the course of the last week, ten days, we've seen, each day, one, two, American servicemen being killed, others being wounded.

And since President Bush declared an end to the major hostilities on May the 1st, I believe the total is now in excess of 40 American servicemen who have been killed. Mostly in shootings, isolated shootings. Or killed in action.

And really, that will take a toll on the American forces. It's wearing them down, bit by bit. This isn't kind of glamorous, front- line actions. These are troops that are maybe being killed guarding trash collection points, they've been killed, maybe guarding banks.

It might be a sign to some extent that the war has been a long one for them, they've been deployed for many months, they're letting their guard down, they're relaxing a little bit. It's also a sign, though, that when they're stretched so thin in multiple tasks that they are exposed to the risks of attack by, could be Ba'ath Party remnants still out there, or it could be ordinary Iraqis, who are really now fed up with the continued presence of coalition forces there.

COLLINS: And it bring us, then, to the question about this new Operation Peninsula Strike that we are learning more about in these troublesome areas where they do think that the Ba'ath Party loyalists still are.

What have you heard about that, as far as the troops and their morale goes? Is this something they feel like they obviously need to be doing?

PENHAUL: Certainly, a very major operation. And I mean, I've seen estimates of anything between 1,000 and 4,000 American troops involved in that. So certainly a very large operation there. And certainly, that part of Iraq, the northwest and west of Baghdad, one Iraqi in fact jokingly described that to me as an area like Texas. Everybody has guns, nobody obeys the law.

And to some extent, it may be Ba'ath Party remnants that are leading this, organizing some kind of guerrilla war now against American forces. On the other hand, it could be ordinary Iraqis who are fed up with American troops violating what they see as the cultural traditions of Iraq, as Ben Wedeman points out in his report in Operation Peninsula Strike a number of women and children have been handcuffed and hauled off for questioning. That will surely fuel resentment in those areas.

Just as in areas west of Baghdad where I was, just the simple fact that American troops are scanning the nearby houses with binoculars was seen as very offensive to Muslim tradition in that area, Heidi.

COLLINS: Right, and of course, it's important to point out that the military is denying that those things have actually happened.

But I'm wondering if you do have a chance, as you are there, to speak with the people of Iraq? Do you think that there is any sort of gratefulness or any sort of relationship at all that they have -- or that they feel towards these U.S. soldiers?

PENHAUL: Certainly. And that's perhaps the most ironic thing. That almost all the Iraqis that I spoke to were very grateful about the coalition forces coming in and getting rid of Saddam Hussein, even the ones now who are -- who are calling for some kind of resistance campaign against the American force, are saying, "Yes, thanks for coming in, thanks for doing this important job. But now it's your time to go home."

And there's no sign that the American troops will go home. There's no sign that the coalition is going to hand over any administration anytime soon to the Iraqis.

COLLINS: What will you remember the most about being there? What will really stick with you?

PENHAUL: I think the Iraqis people themselves. They seem to be a very cultured and very educated people. And ordinary folk that have been caught in situations that they just didn't want to be caught in that they've gone through so many years of a brutal dictatorship. They're now going through this kind of situation. Life is uncertain.

University students, they don't know if they're going to get their degrees. There are people there who used to have job. Now they don't know when there will be any jobs.

COLLINS: Difficult.

PENHAUL: It's an incredibly difficult for them and there's no certainly for them when that will come to an end. COLLINS: Well, Karl Penhaul, we're glad to have you back on U.S. soil. Thanks so much for sharing your experiences today. Appreciate it, Karl.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com






Aired June 12, 2003 - 13:32   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: The end of the war has not meant an end to danger for coalition forces.
CNN correspondent Karl Penhaul covered the war and its aftermath. He left Iraq just two weeks ago and joins me now to talk about the ever present risks to the forces, still there and trying to maintain order.

Tell us a little about what you saw, just as you were living.

KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, absolutely, Heidi. I mean, even today, we've seen Ben Wedeman reporting about the Apache helicopter being shot down in an area west of Baghdad. In the course of the last week, ten days, we've seen, each day, one, two, American servicemen being killed, others being wounded.

And since President Bush declared an end to the major hostilities on May the 1st, I believe the total is now in excess of 40 American servicemen who have been killed. Mostly in shootings, isolated shootings. Or killed in action.

And really, that will take a toll on the American forces. It's wearing them down, bit by bit. This isn't kind of glamorous, front- line actions. These are troops that are maybe being killed guarding trash collection points, they've been killed, maybe guarding banks.

It might be a sign to some extent that the war has been a long one for them, they've been deployed for many months, they're letting their guard down, they're relaxing a little bit. It's also a sign, though, that when they're stretched so thin in multiple tasks that they are exposed to the risks of attack by, could be Ba'ath Party remnants still out there, or it could be ordinary Iraqis, who are really now fed up with the continued presence of coalition forces there.

COLLINS: And it bring us, then, to the question about this new Operation Peninsula Strike that we are learning more about in these troublesome areas where they do think that the Ba'ath Party loyalists still are.

What have you heard about that, as far as the troops and their morale goes? Is this something they feel like they obviously need to be doing?

PENHAUL: Certainly, a very major operation. And I mean, I've seen estimates of anything between 1,000 and 4,000 American troops involved in that. So certainly a very large operation there. And certainly, that part of Iraq, the northwest and west of Baghdad, one Iraqi in fact jokingly described that to me as an area like Texas. Everybody has guns, nobody obeys the law.

And to some extent, it may be Ba'ath Party remnants that are leading this, organizing some kind of guerrilla war now against American forces. On the other hand, it could be ordinary Iraqis who are fed up with American troops violating what they see as the cultural traditions of Iraq, as Ben Wedeman points out in his report in Operation Peninsula Strike a number of women and children have been handcuffed and hauled off for questioning. That will surely fuel resentment in those areas.

Just as in areas west of Baghdad where I was, just the simple fact that American troops are scanning the nearby houses with binoculars was seen as very offensive to Muslim tradition in that area, Heidi.

COLLINS: Right, and of course, it's important to point out that the military is denying that those things have actually happened.

But I'm wondering if you do have a chance, as you are there, to speak with the people of Iraq? Do you think that there is any sort of gratefulness or any sort of relationship at all that they have -- or that they feel towards these U.S. soldiers?

PENHAUL: Certainly. And that's perhaps the most ironic thing. That almost all the Iraqis that I spoke to were very grateful about the coalition forces coming in and getting rid of Saddam Hussein, even the ones now who are -- who are calling for some kind of resistance campaign against the American force, are saying, "Yes, thanks for coming in, thanks for doing this important job. But now it's your time to go home."

And there's no sign that the American troops will go home. There's no sign that the coalition is going to hand over any administration anytime soon to the Iraqis.

COLLINS: What will you remember the most about being there? What will really stick with you?

PENHAUL: I think the Iraqis people themselves. They seem to be a very cultured and very educated people. And ordinary folk that have been caught in situations that they just didn't want to be caught in that they've gone through so many years of a brutal dictatorship. They're now going through this kind of situation. Life is uncertain.

University students, they don't know if they're going to get their degrees. There are people there who used to have job. Now they don't know when there will be any jobs.

COLLINS: Difficult.

PENHAUL: It's an incredibly difficult for them and there's no certainly for them when that will come to an end. COLLINS: Well, Karl Penhaul, we're glad to have you back on U.S. soil. Thanks so much for sharing your experiences today. Appreciate it, Karl.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com