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Interview With Magnus Ranstorp

Aired September 09, 2003 - 14:31   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Has the war on terrorism hampered al Qaeda's ability to stage terrorist attacks and is Osama bin Laden still calling the shots? Joining me here in Atlanta is Dr. Magnus Ranstorp. He is the director of the Center for the Study of Terrorism and Political Violence at University of St. Andrews. He's come a long way from Scotland to be with us here in Atlanta. We appreciate it.
DR. MAGNUS RANSTORP, UNIVERSITY OF ST. ANDREWS: Well thank you, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Well after you and I talked today, I think probably one of the most disturbing things that you said is basically we can't win this war on terror. let's talk about the reasons why because this is something we don't hear a lot of.

RANSTORP: Well I think George Bush highlighted the fact that we have been very successful in the war terrorism, we have arrested two- thirds of the serious leadership of al Qaeda. But there are many more out there, and there are not only the ones that we know are associated with bin Laden, with Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, but also their deputies, their associates that are out there, that are still at large. They are still dispersed around the globe, in many geographical locations. Not just in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, but also in many geographical locations.

So I think we have to be in this for the long haul. And I think there would be a mirage to believe that we are going to win this war with a swift action in Iraq.

PHILLIPS: All right, well let's talk about another one of the reasons you point this out. You've talked about blind spots, and that's why there's no way can you just focus on Afghanistan and think you're going to take al Qaeda out of picture. You've talked about Latin America, you've talked about South Africa. Explain to our viewers about your theory or your understanding about blind spots and how the tentacles are just so extreme.

RANSTORP: Well, look, we are involved in a global war on terrorism. It's the largest multinational broadest coalition ever assembled. We have 90 countries participating in this, exchanging intelligence with the United States.

These stretch not only into the Middle East but also all around the globe. To Southeast Asia, to Chechnya, to the Caucuses. Also of course to Africa. It's not just east Africa, Somalia, Kenya and Tanzania, but also west Africa. And I just returned from Latin America and of course there has been some tentacles stretching from al Qaeda from Afghanistan all the way into South America. Perhaps not in terms of terrorism plotting and trying to perpetrate terrorist activity, but certainly in generating financing.

PHILLIPS: So that's what's in it for the other countries, it's money in the pockets of certain individuals, that they just let things happen, let certain people come in?

RANSTORP: Well I think it will be a great mistake just to focus in on what is the Saudis contribution to the war on terrorism or its affiliation with al Qaeda...

PHILLIPS: You're right because we hear so much about Saudi, Iran, Pakistan. But you're saying, Hey, look elsewhere.

RANSTORP: It's missing the point.

Look, the basic building blocks for al Qaeda has always been to generate funding with identity theft, credit card fraud, bank fraud and they're doing that on a large scale all across the globe.

So in essence just by tackling Saudi Arabia, just by going after certain states they are providing funding for these organizations that will be a (UNINTELLIGIBLE) victory in terms of tackling this problem.

PHILLIPS: We've got to talk about Iraq. How big is the al Qaeda influence in Iraq? And is that why we're seeing so much chaos?

RANSTORP: Kyra, I'm going to be very honest with you, no one really knows. I don't think the intelligence agency know, the governments know exactly the scale and scope of this.

But certainly we have evidence of al Qaeda streaming in from certain Gulf states, Saudi Arabia is one of those states. We also have from Iran, from Syria, from other places. And Iraq has really become the magnet, the unifying force. They may be in disarray, may be operating semi-organized, but perhaps (UNINTELLIGIBLE) completely opportunistic. And they are striking against U.S. forces, inflicting a thousand wounds, trying to make the United States retreat in terms of its military presence in Iraq and perhaps even in broader terms.

PHILLIPS: I think we need to head to Scotland and take a few of your classes. Dr. Magnus Ranstorp, thank you.

RANSTORP: Pleasure.

PHILLIPS: All right.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired September 9, 2003 - 14:31   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Has the war on terrorism hampered al Qaeda's ability to stage terrorist attacks and is Osama bin Laden still calling the shots? Joining me here in Atlanta is Dr. Magnus Ranstorp. He is the director of the Center for the Study of Terrorism and Political Violence at University of St. Andrews. He's come a long way from Scotland to be with us here in Atlanta. We appreciate it.
DR. MAGNUS RANSTORP, UNIVERSITY OF ST. ANDREWS: Well thank you, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Well after you and I talked today, I think probably one of the most disturbing things that you said is basically we can't win this war on terror. let's talk about the reasons why because this is something we don't hear a lot of.

RANSTORP: Well I think George Bush highlighted the fact that we have been very successful in the war terrorism, we have arrested two- thirds of the serious leadership of al Qaeda. But there are many more out there, and there are not only the ones that we know are associated with bin Laden, with Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, but also their deputies, their associates that are out there, that are still at large. They are still dispersed around the globe, in many geographical locations. Not just in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, but also in many geographical locations.

So I think we have to be in this for the long haul. And I think there would be a mirage to believe that we are going to win this war with a swift action in Iraq.

PHILLIPS: All right, well let's talk about another one of the reasons you point this out. You've talked about blind spots, and that's why there's no way can you just focus on Afghanistan and think you're going to take al Qaeda out of picture. You've talked about Latin America, you've talked about South Africa. Explain to our viewers about your theory or your understanding about blind spots and how the tentacles are just so extreme.

RANSTORP: Well, look, we are involved in a global war on terrorism. It's the largest multinational broadest coalition ever assembled. We have 90 countries participating in this, exchanging intelligence with the United States.

These stretch not only into the Middle East but also all around the globe. To Southeast Asia, to Chechnya, to the Caucuses. Also of course to Africa. It's not just east Africa, Somalia, Kenya and Tanzania, but also west Africa. And I just returned from Latin America and of course there has been some tentacles stretching from al Qaeda from Afghanistan all the way into South America. Perhaps not in terms of terrorism plotting and trying to perpetrate terrorist activity, but certainly in generating financing.

PHILLIPS: So that's what's in it for the other countries, it's money in the pockets of certain individuals, that they just let things happen, let certain people come in?

RANSTORP: Well I think it will be a great mistake just to focus in on what is the Saudis contribution to the war on terrorism or its affiliation with al Qaeda...

PHILLIPS: You're right because we hear so much about Saudi, Iran, Pakistan. But you're saying, Hey, look elsewhere.

RANSTORP: It's missing the point.

Look, the basic building blocks for al Qaeda has always been to generate funding with identity theft, credit card fraud, bank fraud and they're doing that on a large scale all across the globe.

So in essence just by tackling Saudi Arabia, just by going after certain states they are providing funding for these organizations that will be a (UNINTELLIGIBLE) victory in terms of tackling this problem.

PHILLIPS: We've got to talk about Iraq. How big is the al Qaeda influence in Iraq? And is that why we're seeing so much chaos?

RANSTORP: Kyra, I'm going to be very honest with you, no one really knows. I don't think the intelligence agency know, the governments know exactly the scale and scope of this.

But certainly we have evidence of al Qaeda streaming in from certain Gulf states, Saudi Arabia is one of those states. We also have from Iran, from Syria, from other places. And Iraq has really become the magnet, the unifying force. They may be in disarray, may be operating semi-organized, but perhaps (UNINTELLIGIBLE) completely opportunistic. And they are striking against U.S. forces, inflicting a thousand wounds, trying to make the United States retreat in terms of its military presence in Iraq and perhaps even in broader terms.

PHILLIPS: I think we need to head to Scotland and take a few of your classes. Dr. Magnus Ranstorp, thank you.

RANSTORP: Pleasure.

PHILLIPS: All right.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com