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Prolonged Targeting of Westerners Uncertain in Gaza
Aired October 15, 2003 - 13:35 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Let's shift out attention now to the Middle East in the meantime. An eight-foot pock mark in the road map to peace. It's the spot where three Americans were killed, another seriously wounded today in a bomb attack. Now Americans are advised to get out of Gaza altogether. And Palestinian officials are concerned their ties to the U.S. could suffer.
We get insights now from CNN international correspondent Matthew Chance here in the house in Atlanta. Spent an awful lot of time recently in Gaza. Matthew, good to have you with us.
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good to be here, Miles.
O'BRIEN: I can't recall in recent memory Americans being singled out for attack. This is significant, isn't it?
CHANCE: It could very well a very significant departure for the Palestinian militant groups because, as you mentioned, over the past three years, at least, of this intifada, this Palestinian uprising, foreign nationals of any description have not been targeted.
I think we have to say at this point it's too early to tell whether this is the start of a trend or whether it was just an isolated incident. Obviously if it is the start of a trend then we'll see whether it is or not with the events coming up. That will be very ominous for the international community who operate on the ground there.
O'BRIEN: Of course the circumstantial evidence is very strong. This was a convoy which would have been not hard to mistake, had U.S. diplomatic plates, was guarded in such a way that diplomats would have been guarded. So it would have been unlikely if it would have been mistaken for something else.
CHANCE: I think so, too. I mean Gaza is such a small geographical area, everybody in it really knows who's coming in, who's going out between the few checkpoints that people use to come in and out.
These cars are not the kind of cars you see on the streets driven by ordinary Palestinians, though, big silver armored vehicles. Everybody in Gaza knows these vehicles come and go all the time, that it's most likely to be an American diplomatic delegation that drives down that road into Gaza City.
So I don't think there's any question that people who planted this bomb knew that this was an American convoy.
O'BRIEN: And of course the irony is this was a mission to interview people for Fulbright Scholars, people who had come to the U.S. and studied in the U.S. Palestinians, really there on a mission of good will. Saeb Erakat saying these people are there to help us.
What does that tell you about how much control the Palestinian Authority has over groups like Hamas?
CHANCE: Well I think it tells quite a lot, actually. I mean the Israelis often say that Palestinian President Yasser Arafat can turn the violence on and off as if it were on a tap.
But clearly, that is not the case, and we've seen that demonstrated today with this attack. It's clearly not in the interest of the Palestinian Authority for these kinds of attacks to take place against U.S. officials.
But nevertheless, we are seeing some aspect, some militants, perhaps not the main Palestinian militant factions, but perhaps splinter groups within them who do see the Americans as legitimate targets.
Just want to make one last point which is that this really shatters the illusion that the Americans can play some kind of honest broker role in...
O'BRIEN: If that illusions still existed even. But nevertheless puts it really in perspective, doesn't it?
CHANCE: Absolutely. I think that you know many of the Palestinians -- the Palestinian Authority pays lip service to the idea that the Americans can be honest brokers. The U.S. themselves say they can, the Israelis say they can.
Ask any Palestinian on the street. They say the U.S. repeatedly vetoes U.N. Security Council resolutions condemning Israel's action, they militarily support Israel, they provide funding for Israel to buy weapons. And so for many Palestinians at best there seems opponents, at the very worst, as we've seen today, they can be seen as enemies.
O'BRIEN: If the U.S. is not in a position to broker peace who, then, is?
CHANCE: That is a very tough question because one of the facts on the ground there, is there is no one else, apart from the Americans, who have the kind of authority to bring the two sides together to try to foreign some kind of peace deal. And so that will really be one of the big challenges.
Obviously, there is the United Nations, but its position has been somewhat undermined. It's not entirely trusted by the Israelis, nor are the European Union. That's why you've seen this collection of international bodies, the EU, the U.N., the U.S. and Russia, the quartet, combine together to try to forge a peace agreement in this region. But obviously what Palestinians want to see is the Americans take a more -- what they would see as more impartial role in this problem.
O'BRIEN: What about the safety of you and our crews there? Is this ire directed at the media as well? In other word, average westerners?
CHANCE: Well, certainly, up until this point it has not been. It's one of the few kind of war stories that journalists cover where you really don't encounter that many threats from the actual militants themselves. There are obvious dangers on the ground, but not necessarily directly coming from the possibility of being targeted by militants.
Now, I think that remain the case. I certainly hope it remains the case. Bit obviously, we'll have to see how it pans out over the next days and weeks and months to see whether this is the start of the campaign against not just the Americans, but the international community on the ground.
O'BRIEN: Matthew Chance, as you return there be safe and we appreciate...
CHANCE: Thank you very much.
O'BRIEN: your dispatches. As always, thanks for joining us in the house today.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired October 15, 2003 - 13:35 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Let's shift out attention now to the Middle East in the meantime. An eight-foot pock mark in the road map to peace. It's the spot where three Americans were killed, another seriously wounded today in a bomb attack. Now Americans are advised to get out of Gaza altogether. And Palestinian officials are concerned their ties to the U.S. could suffer.
We get insights now from CNN international correspondent Matthew Chance here in the house in Atlanta. Spent an awful lot of time recently in Gaza. Matthew, good to have you with us.
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good to be here, Miles.
O'BRIEN: I can't recall in recent memory Americans being singled out for attack. This is significant, isn't it?
CHANCE: It could very well a very significant departure for the Palestinian militant groups because, as you mentioned, over the past three years, at least, of this intifada, this Palestinian uprising, foreign nationals of any description have not been targeted.
I think we have to say at this point it's too early to tell whether this is the start of a trend or whether it was just an isolated incident. Obviously if it is the start of a trend then we'll see whether it is or not with the events coming up. That will be very ominous for the international community who operate on the ground there.
O'BRIEN: Of course the circumstantial evidence is very strong. This was a convoy which would have been not hard to mistake, had U.S. diplomatic plates, was guarded in such a way that diplomats would have been guarded. So it would have been unlikely if it would have been mistaken for something else.
CHANCE: I think so, too. I mean Gaza is such a small geographical area, everybody in it really knows who's coming in, who's going out between the few checkpoints that people use to come in and out.
These cars are not the kind of cars you see on the streets driven by ordinary Palestinians, though, big silver armored vehicles. Everybody in Gaza knows these vehicles come and go all the time, that it's most likely to be an American diplomatic delegation that drives down that road into Gaza City.
So I don't think there's any question that people who planted this bomb knew that this was an American convoy.
O'BRIEN: And of course the irony is this was a mission to interview people for Fulbright Scholars, people who had come to the U.S. and studied in the U.S. Palestinians, really there on a mission of good will. Saeb Erakat saying these people are there to help us.
What does that tell you about how much control the Palestinian Authority has over groups like Hamas?
CHANCE: Well I think it tells quite a lot, actually. I mean the Israelis often say that Palestinian President Yasser Arafat can turn the violence on and off as if it were on a tap.
But clearly, that is not the case, and we've seen that demonstrated today with this attack. It's clearly not in the interest of the Palestinian Authority for these kinds of attacks to take place against U.S. officials.
But nevertheless, we are seeing some aspect, some militants, perhaps not the main Palestinian militant factions, but perhaps splinter groups within them who do see the Americans as legitimate targets.
Just want to make one last point which is that this really shatters the illusion that the Americans can play some kind of honest broker role in...
O'BRIEN: If that illusions still existed even. But nevertheless puts it really in perspective, doesn't it?
CHANCE: Absolutely. I think that you know many of the Palestinians -- the Palestinian Authority pays lip service to the idea that the Americans can be honest brokers. The U.S. themselves say they can, the Israelis say they can.
Ask any Palestinian on the street. They say the U.S. repeatedly vetoes U.N. Security Council resolutions condemning Israel's action, they militarily support Israel, they provide funding for Israel to buy weapons. And so for many Palestinians at best there seems opponents, at the very worst, as we've seen today, they can be seen as enemies.
O'BRIEN: If the U.S. is not in a position to broker peace who, then, is?
CHANCE: That is a very tough question because one of the facts on the ground there, is there is no one else, apart from the Americans, who have the kind of authority to bring the two sides together to try to foreign some kind of peace deal. And so that will really be one of the big challenges.
Obviously, there is the United Nations, but its position has been somewhat undermined. It's not entirely trusted by the Israelis, nor are the European Union. That's why you've seen this collection of international bodies, the EU, the U.N., the U.S. and Russia, the quartet, combine together to try to forge a peace agreement in this region. But obviously what Palestinians want to see is the Americans take a more -- what they would see as more impartial role in this problem.
O'BRIEN: What about the safety of you and our crews there? Is this ire directed at the media as well? In other word, average westerners?
CHANCE: Well, certainly, up until this point it has not been. It's one of the few kind of war stories that journalists cover where you really don't encounter that many threats from the actual militants themselves. There are obvious dangers on the ground, but not necessarily directly coming from the possibility of being targeted by militants.
Now, I think that remain the case. I certainly hope it remains the case. Bit obviously, we'll have to see how it pans out over the next days and weeks and months to see whether this is the start of the campaign against not just the Americans, but the international community on the ground.
O'BRIEN: Matthew Chance, as you return there be safe and we appreciate...
CHANCE: Thank you very much.
O'BRIEN: your dispatches. As always, thanks for joining us in the house today.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
