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Analysis With David Grange

Aired December 15, 2003 - 14:33   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Well, Iraq may have lost a source of fear with the capture of Hussein, but it hasn't put an end to the guerrilla attacks.
Retired U.S. Army Brigadier General David Grange on the phone from Chicago. General, I do want to ask you about that. Taking a look at the way Saddam Hussein was living, taking a look at the video, and how he was moving from spot to spot. Could he have really been behind the guerrilla warfare in planning these attacks?

BRIG. GEN. DAVID GRANGE (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: I think only loosely. He was a symbol, obviously, as a leader. He coordinated, I believe, some of the activities. But he actually, I think, decentralized a lot of his intent, what he wanted to happen, to some of his lieutenants. And some of those obviously are still on the loose.

PHILLIPS: You see this video. It's pathetic. And he didn't even put up a fight. As an Army soldier, what does this tell you about Saddam and his past reputation of being so powerful?

GRANGE: Well, a lot of bravado. Obviously, he doesn't walk his talk. I hear his sons went out in a gunfight. Right or wrong, they did what they said they would do. He did not.

And I think that that combined with the footage of Saddam when he was captured looking like a criminal on the run really has the perception of where before he was held in esteem by many people that was lost just from those images.

PHILLIPS: General, why do you think he didn't kill himself?

GRANGE: Because he wants to survive. He's not -- again, he's not one to be a martyr in that regard. He just doesn't live what he told other people to do, to fight to the last person in Baghdad or cross the Euphrates River, wherever the case may be.

And he wants to survive. He's always been a survivor. So he just -- he doesn't do what he says he going to do.

PHILLIPS: Why would he want to survive? I mean, look at him. Look at his life. Look at what he represents. Look at the way the world is reacting to him.

GRANGE: Well, I agree with you. I wouldn't want to survive, either. (LAUGHTER)

GRANGE: I don't think that I'd want to face what the -- the trial that he'll go through, and I believe it will be held by the Iraqi people. There are so many that are going to come forth with the atrocities that he committed. I mean, you know, there's several others on trial right now in the Hague and places, but nothing compares to I think in the world today to Saddam.

PHILLIPS: And of course, looking at the videotape you've got to look possibly at the spin that's taking place. There's definitely a message that the U.S. wants to get out here to other countries. Would you agree? In Iran, Syria.

GRANGE: No, I think so. And this -- this is probably one of many hindsights that he used in moving from one to another.

And he used what they call passive security. In other words, not 100 Fedayeen security force that would draw attention but just a few people that he trusted, maybe move him by the taxicab that was referenced yesterday, to keep it low-key.

But this for a leader in this part of the world, this is really humiliating for anybody that really supported him.

PHILLIPS: Well, taking a look at how this all went down, we've got an animation. What do you think this has done -- and you know as a leader in the Army, this has had to have just boosted morale tremendously.

GRANGE: Big time. Here you have a force that seems large, 600. But they had a secure a very large area. They had intelligence on two primary targets within this objective area.

The way -- the combination of conventional and unconventional or special operating forces was well done, something practiced for years now in the U.S. military as well as, for instance, in Great Britain they do the same.

And they didn't want anybody to get in and get out. And because you never have 100 percent, you're not for certain where the individual is.

If you recall, when the United States invaded -- forces invaded Panama, Noriega just got out of the one airport objective early because there was some looseness in the perimeter. This has happened in Tora Bora, I think, with bin Laden, as many say.

So when they do operations, I think that the military's learned from this and they want to make sure the noose is tied, and that they have sufficient force to react to whatever they find on the target. In other words, worst case.

PHILLIPS: Well, the noose is tight on Saddam Hussein now. General David Grange, thanks for your time.

GRANGE: My pleasure. Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com






Aired December 15, 2003 - 14:33   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Well, Iraq may have lost a source of fear with the capture of Hussein, but it hasn't put an end to the guerrilla attacks.
Retired U.S. Army Brigadier General David Grange on the phone from Chicago. General, I do want to ask you about that. Taking a look at the way Saddam Hussein was living, taking a look at the video, and how he was moving from spot to spot. Could he have really been behind the guerrilla warfare in planning these attacks?

BRIG. GEN. DAVID GRANGE (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: I think only loosely. He was a symbol, obviously, as a leader. He coordinated, I believe, some of the activities. But he actually, I think, decentralized a lot of his intent, what he wanted to happen, to some of his lieutenants. And some of those obviously are still on the loose.

PHILLIPS: You see this video. It's pathetic. And he didn't even put up a fight. As an Army soldier, what does this tell you about Saddam and his past reputation of being so powerful?

GRANGE: Well, a lot of bravado. Obviously, he doesn't walk his talk. I hear his sons went out in a gunfight. Right or wrong, they did what they said they would do. He did not.

And I think that that combined with the footage of Saddam when he was captured looking like a criminal on the run really has the perception of where before he was held in esteem by many people that was lost just from those images.

PHILLIPS: General, why do you think he didn't kill himself?

GRANGE: Because he wants to survive. He's not -- again, he's not one to be a martyr in that regard. He just doesn't live what he told other people to do, to fight to the last person in Baghdad or cross the Euphrates River, wherever the case may be.

And he wants to survive. He's always been a survivor. So he just -- he doesn't do what he says he going to do.

PHILLIPS: Why would he want to survive? I mean, look at him. Look at his life. Look at what he represents. Look at the way the world is reacting to him.

GRANGE: Well, I agree with you. I wouldn't want to survive, either. (LAUGHTER)

GRANGE: I don't think that I'd want to face what the -- the trial that he'll go through, and I believe it will be held by the Iraqi people. There are so many that are going to come forth with the atrocities that he committed. I mean, you know, there's several others on trial right now in the Hague and places, but nothing compares to I think in the world today to Saddam.

PHILLIPS: And of course, looking at the videotape you've got to look possibly at the spin that's taking place. There's definitely a message that the U.S. wants to get out here to other countries. Would you agree? In Iran, Syria.

GRANGE: No, I think so. And this -- this is probably one of many hindsights that he used in moving from one to another.

And he used what they call passive security. In other words, not 100 Fedayeen security force that would draw attention but just a few people that he trusted, maybe move him by the taxicab that was referenced yesterday, to keep it low-key.

But this for a leader in this part of the world, this is really humiliating for anybody that really supported him.

PHILLIPS: Well, taking a look at how this all went down, we've got an animation. What do you think this has done -- and you know as a leader in the Army, this has had to have just boosted morale tremendously.

GRANGE: Big time. Here you have a force that seems large, 600. But they had a secure a very large area. They had intelligence on two primary targets within this objective area.

The way -- the combination of conventional and unconventional or special operating forces was well done, something practiced for years now in the U.S. military as well as, for instance, in Great Britain they do the same.

And they didn't want anybody to get in and get out. And because you never have 100 percent, you're not for certain where the individual is.

If you recall, when the United States invaded -- forces invaded Panama, Noriega just got out of the one airport objective early because there was some looseness in the perimeter. This has happened in Tora Bora, I think, with bin Laden, as many say.

So when they do operations, I think that the military's learned from this and they want to make sure the noose is tied, and that they have sufficient force to react to whatever they find on the target. In other words, worst case.

PHILLIPS: Well, the noose is tight on Saddam Hussein now. General David Grange, thanks for your time.

GRANGE: My pleasure. Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com