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Interview With Walter Boyne

Aired December 31, 2003 - 13:29   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: U.S. troops in Iraq are on alert. They want to make sure that new year doesn't begin with new violence. Meantime, another car bomb rocked the capital today. CNN's Karl Penhaul joining us now live from Baghdad -- Karl.
KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Heidi, before I bring you up to date on that car bomb earlier on in the day, it's now about 9:30 hear local time.

Just a few minutes ago, we heard a very large explosion a little north of the hotel where we're staying in on the other side of the river. No explanation yet from coalition military authorities what that may have been. But certainly did cause a bit of a shake here in the hotel.

We now understand that helicopters are overflying the Green Zone. That's the name given to the administrative headquarters of the coalition authorities here.

Also in the distance, behind me, not visible right now, but we have seen several flairs going off up into the air, illuminating flairs, to kind of lighten the ground around. So possibly so that coalition troops can see what's around them if they are coming under attack. But the more we know about that -- in a few minutes, Heidi, the more we'll bring you.

Just to bring you up to date on what happened in Baghdad today, two roadside bombs. The most serious killed a young child as he was helping his father in a workshop. That bomb directed against U.S. military Humvees as they drove past. We understand five soldiers injured in that attack and three Iraqi soldiers.

A second bomb went off just as night fall was coming. That hit a U.S. military Humvee. We understand that three U.S. soldiers were wounded in that. So certainly, Heidi this does look what coalition authorities have been warning about, an escalation in Iraqi insurgent attacks to coincide with the new year period.

COLLINS: All right, Karl Penhaul, thanks so much. And as you said, the explosion that you just heard moments ago, please let us know if anything more should develop on that. Karl Penhaul, thanks so much, live from Baghdad.

And now a closer look at the U.S. and the Iraq war. Retired Air Force Colonel Walter Boyne wrote a book called "Operation Iraqi Freedom: What Went Right, What Went Wrong and Why." Colonel Boyne is joining us today live from Washington to speak a little bit more on it. Happy New Year to you, sir. Thanks so much for being with us.

COL. WALTER BOYNE (RET.), U.S. AIR FORCE: Happy New Year, Heidi.

COLLINS: We want to talk about the bottom line, or the headlines that we take from strategic warfare about the Iraqi war. There are many, many things done in this war that had obviously never been done before.

BOYNE: That's right. And the most important of them is the jointness with which they operated. Never before have the Army, Navy, Marines, the Air Force, Coast Guard all cooperated at all levels the way they did here. Never before have we had the air domination and the information dominance that we had. It was a remarkable war.

COLLINS: Let's talk about that for a moment. The capability of the American military. When you and I spoke earlier, you said something which stuck in my mind. Even our allies can't keep up with the U.S.

BOYNE: It's going to be a diplomatic problem. They cannot fund the programs we're funding. We have to be interoperable. Right now we're not. We have to look at that in the future, decide how much equipment we can provide them so they can continue to work with us.

COLLINS: We talk about air and information domination. Can you talk about that?

BOYNE: We had some 50 satellites used. They were just so superbly tweaked so they provided the exact information that was required. We had the Joint Stars, the Joint Surveillance Target Attack System, the AWACS U2s and unmanned vehicles.

COLLINS: We're looking at the B-2 right now. At least it's a quiet plane.

BOYNE: And it carries precision-guided munitions. The global positioning system would fix a target and B-2s and B-1s could be on the target in about 12 minutes.

In no time in the past has a country fielded this kind of power. There's no comparison to the Roman Empire, the British empire the Germans at their peak. We are orders of magnitude superior to any relative nation.

COLLINS: It's quite amazing. Another thing we talked about is this term known as revolution in military affairs.

BOYNE: Right.

COLLINS: Otherwise known as RMA. Tell us what that is.

BOYNE: You've heard about it for years and it's been cited often. But this is the first time it's happened. We've had revolution in military affairs. We're so superior.

We have such extraordinary capability that it's also induced a revolution in diplomatic affairs because leaders of -- in potential enemy nations, nations that might cause us trouble, Syria, Iran, so forth have to realize that they have intrigue in their palaces and their courts.

If we are aware of something, they might make a decision and 12 minutes later, they might get a JDAM on them because we have this information and aerial dominance.

COLLINS: And quite frankly, a little bit that has made it so different, at least in look at Iraq, now that Saddam Hussein has been captured, is the targeting of these individuals. We've got Saddam Hussein, Osama bin Laden, and now some progress made, as you say, diplomatically with Libya, because of that.

BOYNE: Exactly right. And there's some hope for the technology in the future. If we continue the investment that we do and continue the progress, in five or six years, we'll have a technology that will be able to identify individual car bombers, individual suicide bombers as they suit up. It's almost incredible to contemplate, but it isn't out of our reach to do that.

COLLINS: I know you used to fly the B-52. Also amazing in this war, some of those types of aircraft 40 years old or so being used in a new way, combining new technologies.

BOYNE: Right. The B-52, first flown in 1952, was using Lightning Pod, an Israeli-manufactured equipment for targeting, infrared navigation targeting. And they just bolted it on and it worked like a charm. This has really been the history of the armed forces that they can take old weapons systems, things that have should be retired years ago, and just put new equipment in them and they continue to function first rate.

COLLINS: Is this something that will help justify if you will, any other plans, you know, as the world goes on. Of course there are new developments in airspace. And in warfare. Will that help to justify the new plans that come out, saying, well, B-52's been around for 40 years, we still use it today because we can combine it with the new technologies.

BOYNE: Well, that's true. Everything reaches a finite end of its life. Are takers, are too old, our helicopters, even the B-52s are too old. We really ought to consider creating a new bomber that can fly without the extensive aerial refueling.

But when you think about the amortization, they criticized the B- 52 terribly for its extreme cost. Unit production cost, about $3 million during the final run. Just way too expensive. Put that over the 50-year service life it becomes a pretty cheap airplane.

COLLINS: Colonel Boyne, if you were to say one or two thing the military learned or should learn from this war to carry it into, unfortunately, future wars that will exist, what will they be?

BOYNE: First, we'll never fight a war as we fought in the past, without this complete jointness. We had a combined air control center that just got the information out to everybody at all levels. We'll never go back to a system with separate services fighting.

Another thing is information. We have to maintain and improve our dominance. Our satellite systems are getting old. We need to think about replacing them and updating them. The country's spending about 3.4 percent of gross domestic product on defense. We need to up that so we make sure we maintain this relative lead we have.

COLLINS: All right. Colonel Walter Boyne, thank you so much for your time. The book is called "Operation Iraqi Freedom: What Went Right, What Went Wrong and Why." Thank you for your time on this holiday.

BOYNE: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired December 31, 2003 - 13:29   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: U.S. troops in Iraq are on alert. They want to make sure that new year doesn't begin with new violence. Meantime, another car bomb rocked the capital today. CNN's Karl Penhaul joining us now live from Baghdad -- Karl.
KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Heidi, before I bring you up to date on that car bomb earlier on in the day, it's now about 9:30 hear local time.

Just a few minutes ago, we heard a very large explosion a little north of the hotel where we're staying in on the other side of the river. No explanation yet from coalition military authorities what that may have been. But certainly did cause a bit of a shake here in the hotel.

We now understand that helicopters are overflying the Green Zone. That's the name given to the administrative headquarters of the coalition authorities here.

Also in the distance, behind me, not visible right now, but we have seen several flairs going off up into the air, illuminating flairs, to kind of lighten the ground around. So possibly so that coalition troops can see what's around them if they are coming under attack. But the more we know about that -- in a few minutes, Heidi, the more we'll bring you.

Just to bring you up to date on what happened in Baghdad today, two roadside bombs. The most serious killed a young child as he was helping his father in a workshop. That bomb directed against U.S. military Humvees as they drove past. We understand five soldiers injured in that attack and three Iraqi soldiers.

A second bomb went off just as night fall was coming. That hit a U.S. military Humvee. We understand that three U.S. soldiers were wounded in that. So certainly, Heidi this does look what coalition authorities have been warning about, an escalation in Iraqi insurgent attacks to coincide with the new year period.

COLLINS: All right, Karl Penhaul, thanks so much. And as you said, the explosion that you just heard moments ago, please let us know if anything more should develop on that. Karl Penhaul, thanks so much, live from Baghdad.

And now a closer look at the U.S. and the Iraq war. Retired Air Force Colonel Walter Boyne wrote a book called "Operation Iraqi Freedom: What Went Right, What Went Wrong and Why." Colonel Boyne is joining us today live from Washington to speak a little bit more on it. Happy New Year to you, sir. Thanks so much for being with us.

COL. WALTER BOYNE (RET.), U.S. AIR FORCE: Happy New Year, Heidi.

COLLINS: We want to talk about the bottom line, or the headlines that we take from strategic warfare about the Iraqi war. There are many, many things done in this war that had obviously never been done before.

BOYNE: That's right. And the most important of them is the jointness with which they operated. Never before have the Army, Navy, Marines, the Air Force, Coast Guard all cooperated at all levels the way they did here. Never before have we had the air domination and the information dominance that we had. It was a remarkable war.

COLLINS: Let's talk about that for a moment. The capability of the American military. When you and I spoke earlier, you said something which stuck in my mind. Even our allies can't keep up with the U.S.

BOYNE: It's going to be a diplomatic problem. They cannot fund the programs we're funding. We have to be interoperable. Right now we're not. We have to look at that in the future, decide how much equipment we can provide them so they can continue to work with us.

COLLINS: We talk about air and information domination. Can you talk about that?

BOYNE: We had some 50 satellites used. They were just so superbly tweaked so they provided the exact information that was required. We had the Joint Stars, the Joint Surveillance Target Attack System, the AWACS U2s and unmanned vehicles.

COLLINS: We're looking at the B-2 right now. At least it's a quiet plane.

BOYNE: And it carries precision-guided munitions. The global positioning system would fix a target and B-2s and B-1s could be on the target in about 12 minutes.

In no time in the past has a country fielded this kind of power. There's no comparison to the Roman Empire, the British empire the Germans at their peak. We are orders of magnitude superior to any relative nation.

COLLINS: It's quite amazing. Another thing we talked about is this term known as revolution in military affairs.

BOYNE: Right.

COLLINS: Otherwise known as RMA. Tell us what that is.

BOYNE: You've heard about it for years and it's been cited often. But this is the first time it's happened. We've had revolution in military affairs. We're so superior.

We have such extraordinary capability that it's also induced a revolution in diplomatic affairs because leaders of -- in potential enemy nations, nations that might cause us trouble, Syria, Iran, so forth have to realize that they have intrigue in their palaces and their courts.

If we are aware of something, they might make a decision and 12 minutes later, they might get a JDAM on them because we have this information and aerial dominance.

COLLINS: And quite frankly, a little bit that has made it so different, at least in look at Iraq, now that Saddam Hussein has been captured, is the targeting of these individuals. We've got Saddam Hussein, Osama bin Laden, and now some progress made, as you say, diplomatically with Libya, because of that.

BOYNE: Exactly right. And there's some hope for the technology in the future. If we continue the investment that we do and continue the progress, in five or six years, we'll have a technology that will be able to identify individual car bombers, individual suicide bombers as they suit up. It's almost incredible to contemplate, but it isn't out of our reach to do that.

COLLINS: I know you used to fly the B-52. Also amazing in this war, some of those types of aircraft 40 years old or so being used in a new way, combining new technologies.

BOYNE: Right. The B-52, first flown in 1952, was using Lightning Pod, an Israeli-manufactured equipment for targeting, infrared navigation targeting. And they just bolted it on and it worked like a charm. This has really been the history of the armed forces that they can take old weapons systems, things that have should be retired years ago, and just put new equipment in them and they continue to function first rate.

COLLINS: Is this something that will help justify if you will, any other plans, you know, as the world goes on. Of course there are new developments in airspace. And in warfare. Will that help to justify the new plans that come out, saying, well, B-52's been around for 40 years, we still use it today because we can combine it with the new technologies.

BOYNE: Well, that's true. Everything reaches a finite end of its life. Are takers, are too old, our helicopters, even the B-52s are too old. We really ought to consider creating a new bomber that can fly without the extensive aerial refueling.

But when you think about the amortization, they criticized the B- 52 terribly for its extreme cost. Unit production cost, about $3 million during the final run. Just way too expensive. Put that over the 50-year service life it becomes a pretty cheap airplane.

COLLINS: Colonel Boyne, if you were to say one or two thing the military learned or should learn from this war to carry it into, unfortunately, future wars that will exist, what will they be?

BOYNE: First, we'll never fight a war as we fought in the past, without this complete jointness. We had a combined air control center that just got the information out to everybody at all levels. We'll never go back to a system with separate services fighting.

Another thing is information. We have to maintain and improve our dominance. Our satellite systems are getting old. We need to think about replacing them and updating them. The country's spending about 3.4 percent of gross domestic product on defense. We need to up that so we make sure we maintain this relative lead we have.

COLLINS: All right. Colonel Walter Boyne, thank you so much for your time. The book is called "Operation Iraqi Freedom: What Went Right, What Went Wrong and Why." Thank you for your time on this holiday.

BOYNE: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com