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Bush Pushes Marriage Incentive
Aired January 14, 2004 - 14:14 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Can you imagine spending $1.5 billion on weddings? That's not the premise of a new reality show, it's Washington reality. The Bush administration is proposing to spend at least that much on an initiative to promote traditional marriage, especially among low-income couples.
Today's "New York Times" quotes one adviser who says it's way for Bush to solidify his conservative base. They've been upset about the recent Massachusetts court ruling that same-sex couples had a right to marry.
We've got a couple of guests to help us kick around this political football. Sandy Rios joins us now CNN's Washington bureau. She's the president of Concerned Women for America. And Marshall Miller, the co-founder of the Alternatives to Marriage Project. He joins us from New York. Great to see you both.
Sandy, let's start with you. Why $1.5 billion? That seems like such a lot of money.
SANDY RIOS, PRESIDENT, CONCERNED WOMEN FOR AMERICA: Well, it may sound like a lot but it isn't so much when you realize $100 billion of our welfare money goes to single parent families. The single parent families are poorest in this nation. Kids are seven to eight more times likely to be poor if they're from single parent families. So, actually, if we could spend $1.5 billion and reduce the hundred billion number, it's a smart move.
PHILLIPS: Marshall, you hear that explanation and you think, Wow, that does make sense?
MARSHALL MILLER, ALTERNATIVES TO MARRIAGE PROJECT: Well $1.5 billion. That's a staggering amount of money. And the question is will these programs work. And the reality is there's no evidence that they will.
We can talk about how this money has been spent in states that have already put Bush's $300 million to use. And frankly, it hasn't been put to very good use. In Texas, the state legislature passed a bill that said they wanted to spend part of that money to have abstinence education for divorced people.
Now I know ordinary Americans like you and me support marriage. We have nothing against marriage. But we don't want to see the federal government spending our money to promote abstinence among people who have already been married. That's just one small example of how this money gets used. PHILLIPS: What about the example of that Sandy brought up and also maybe the example of, hey, the United States has -- we've crunched our numbers here. According to a number of policy, 49 percent divorce rate in the U.S., OK?
So if we put forward this money and it makes -- I don't know. It helps counseling programs, it sends couples to programs, make their marriage healthier, last longer, I mean all of us who are married know that's not a bad thing. You would think, OK, this makes sense.
RIOS: Kyra, could I weigh in? One thing Marshall just said. He said the government shouldn't involve itself in teaching about marriage, it can't do anything to make a difference.
But I would like to say that our welfare laws of the last 30 years have made a huge difference. They've created single mothers with tons of children because if they've gotten married they would have been penalized. And so by an effect of the law as it has been standing is that we have prevented people from going into long-term relationships without being penalized financially.
So government can affect the culture on a lot of issues and especially on marriage.
PHILLIPS: Marshall?
MILLER: This is money for helping people get out of poverty. And the reality is there's no evidence these programs get people out of poverty. And in fact, they prove to be a welcome distraction from some of the real issues that poor people face in this country. Whether that be something as simple as child care which is incredibly expensive, or job training.
And this is a time of record budget deficits for the United States government. I think we have to be really careful about how money is spent and make sure it goes to good use.
(CROSSTALK)
PHILLIPS: Sandy, what about for a male or female who is gay and picks up the paper today and looks at this and says, Wow, Bush plans $1.5 billion to promote marriage. You know, why not promote diversity? Why not promote just healthy relationships?
RIOS: Kyra, the last time I looked, homosexual marriage is not legal in this land. We still honor marriage between a man and a woman.
Now some segments of our population are pushing for that to be changed, but it is not the law of the land, it is not accepted, even when you listen to the surveys. "New York Times" did one just the last part of December. People do not support homosexual marriage.
So that's not a problem. Let me just say, it's not a problem. People understand that marriage is between a man and a woman.
PHILLIPS: Marshall? I have a feeling you're going to disagree with this.
MILLER: The question you asked is about a diversity. You're absolutely right. There is incredible, incredible diversity out there in this country. Not only in terms of gay and lesbian couples, but unmarried couples, people who are single, people who very much want to marry and haven't found somebody yet.
And it's not lack of desire to marry. These people don't need classes encouraging them get married or billboards saying how great marriage is. People like marriage in this country. We like marriage on TV. We like weddings.
We don't need our government getting involved in promoting it. What we do need our government doing is helping people get out of poverty. And there is some really great examples of programs that work well to do that. This isn't one of them.
RIOS: Then, Marshall, I don't think that you would object. Because statistics show us kids that come from single parent families are the highest poverty level. The problem is single parent families. And so if we can improve that and we can make marriages last, we will attack the poverty problem.
PHILLIPS: Aside from what this money is -- what this proposal talks about and where this money is supposed to go and what it's supposed to help, let's talk about the politics behind this, the timing of this, the talk in this article about is this to solidify Bush's conservative base. I want you both to comment on that before we have to wrap up. Marshall.
MILLER: Yes. Absolutely. I mean this is the kind of thing that sounds good on paper. But when you really look at it, when you look at the issue of single parent families, what people don't need are these programs. They need things to help them get out of poverty.
What happens is that poor people can't get married, they can't find suitable partners. It's not that they don't want to get married. So programs that just encourage them to get married aren't going to solve the very real problems that they face.
And there is an incredible a incredible amount of problems that we face in this country. And throwing money, having more deficits, taking money away from poor people to promote marriage sounds really good. It's the type thing that you're going to hear a lot about in an election year. But doesn't do anything to help those families in today's real world.
PHILLIPS: Sandy, final word.
RIOS: Kyra, this step is a good one but it is no way the same thing as this president taking a strong stand against homosexual marriage. He will not, on any case, and anywhere on the radar screen, help the conservative supporters of his by throwing this bone. This is a separate issue.
He must come out full-fledged in favor of heterosexual marriage. He has to make that clear. He has to take a very strong stand and lead us on that issue in the same way he's led us on the war in Iraq and the war on terrorism. Nothing less will do.
PHILLIPS: Sandy Rios, Marshall Miller, thank you both for your time.
MILLER: Thank you.
PHILLIPS: I'm sure we'll talk about this again.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired January 14, 2004 - 14:14 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Can you imagine spending $1.5 billion on weddings? That's not the premise of a new reality show, it's Washington reality. The Bush administration is proposing to spend at least that much on an initiative to promote traditional marriage, especially among low-income couples.
Today's "New York Times" quotes one adviser who says it's way for Bush to solidify his conservative base. They've been upset about the recent Massachusetts court ruling that same-sex couples had a right to marry.
We've got a couple of guests to help us kick around this political football. Sandy Rios joins us now CNN's Washington bureau. She's the president of Concerned Women for America. And Marshall Miller, the co-founder of the Alternatives to Marriage Project. He joins us from New York. Great to see you both.
Sandy, let's start with you. Why $1.5 billion? That seems like such a lot of money.
SANDY RIOS, PRESIDENT, CONCERNED WOMEN FOR AMERICA: Well, it may sound like a lot but it isn't so much when you realize $100 billion of our welfare money goes to single parent families. The single parent families are poorest in this nation. Kids are seven to eight more times likely to be poor if they're from single parent families. So, actually, if we could spend $1.5 billion and reduce the hundred billion number, it's a smart move.
PHILLIPS: Marshall, you hear that explanation and you think, Wow, that does make sense?
MARSHALL MILLER, ALTERNATIVES TO MARRIAGE PROJECT: Well $1.5 billion. That's a staggering amount of money. And the question is will these programs work. And the reality is there's no evidence that they will.
We can talk about how this money has been spent in states that have already put Bush's $300 million to use. And frankly, it hasn't been put to very good use. In Texas, the state legislature passed a bill that said they wanted to spend part of that money to have abstinence education for divorced people.
Now I know ordinary Americans like you and me support marriage. We have nothing against marriage. But we don't want to see the federal government spending our money to promote abstinence among people who have already been married. That's just one small example of how this money gets used. PHILLIPS: What about the example of that Sandy brought up and also maybe the example of, hey, the United States has -- we've crunched our numbers here. According to a number of policy, 49 percent divorce rate in the U.S., OK?
So if we put forward this money and it makes -- I don't know. It helps counseling programs, it sends couples to programs, make their marriage healthier, last longer, I mean all of us who are married know that's not a bad thing. You would think, OK, this makes sense.
RIOS: Kyra, could I weigh in? One thing Marshall just said. He said the government shouldn't involve itself in teaching about marriage, it can't do anything to make a difference.
But I would like to say that our welfare laws of the last 30 years have made a huge difference. They've created single mothers with tons of children because if they've gotten married they would have been penalized. And so by an effect of the law as it has been standing is that we have prevented people from going into long-term relationships without being penalized financially.
So government can affect the culture on a lot of issues and especially on marriage.
PHILLIPS: Marshall?
MILLER: This is money for helping people get out of poverty. And the reality is there's no evidence these programs get people out of poverty. And in fact, they prove to be a welcome distraction from some of the real issues that poor people face in this country. Whether that be something as simple as child care which is incredibly expensive, or job training.
And this is a time of record budget deficits for the United States government. I think we have to be really careful about how money is spent and make sure it goes to good use.
(CROSSTALK)
PHILLIPS: Sandy, what about for a male or female who is gay and picks up the paper today and looks at this and says, Wow, Bush plans $1.5 billion to promote marriage. You know, why not promote diversity? Why not promote just healthy relationships?
RIOS: Kyra, the last time I looked, homosexual marriage is not legal in this land. We still honor marriage between a man and a woman.
Now some segments of our population are pushing for that to be changed, but it is not the law of the land, it is not accepted, even when you listen to the surveys. "New York Times" did one just the last part of December. People do not support homosexual marriage.
So that's not a problem. Let me just say, it's not a problem. People understand that marriage is between a man and a woman.
PHILLIPS: Marshall? I have a feeling you're going to disagree with this.
MILLER: The question you asked is about a diversity. You're absolutely right. There is incredible, incredible diversity out there in this country. Not only in terms of gay and lesbian couples, but unmarried couples, people who are single, people who very much want to marry and haven't found somebody yet.
And it's not lack of desire to marry. These people don't need classes encouraging them get married or billboards saying how great marriage is. People like marriage in this country. We like marriage on TV. We like weddings.
We don't need our government getting involved in promoting it. What we do need our government doing is helping people get out of poverty. And there is some really great examples of programs that work well to do that. This isn't one of them.
RIOS: Then, Marshall, I don't think that you would object. Because statistics show us kids that come from single parent families are the highest poverty level. The problem is single parent families. And so if we can improve that and we can make marriages last, we will attack the poverty problem.
PHILLIPS: Aside from what this money is -- what this proposal talks about and where this money is supposed to go and what it's supposed to help, let's talk about the politics behind this, the timing of this, the talk in this article about is this to solidify Bush's conservative base. I want you both to comment on that before we have to wrap up. Marshall.
MILLER: Yes. Absolutely. I mean this is the kind of thing that sounds good on paper. But when you really look at it, when you look at the issue of single parent families, what people don't need are these programs. They need things to help them get out of poverty.
What happens is that poor people can't get married, they can't find suitable partners. It's not that they don't want to get married. So programs that just encourage them to get married aren't going to solve the very real problems that they face.
And there is an incredible a incredible amount of problems that we face in this country. And throwing money, having more deficits, taking money away from poor people to promote marriage sounds really good. It's the type thing that you're going to hear a lot about in an election year. But doesn't do anything to help those families in today's real world.
PHILLIPS: Sandy, final word.
RIOS: Kyra, this step is a good one but it is no way the same thing as this president taking a strong stand against homosexual marriage. He will not, on any case, and anywhere on the radar screen, help the conservative supporters of his by throwing this bone. This is a separate issue.
He must come out full-fledged in favor of heterosexual marriage. He has to make that clear. He has to take a very strong stand and lead us on that issue in the same way he's led us on the war in Iraq and the war on terrorism. Nothing less will do.
PHILLIPS: Sandy Rios, Marshall Miller, thank you both for your time.
MILLER: Thank you.
PHILLIPS: I'm sure we'll talk about this again.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
