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Bush to Visit MLK Grave as Atlanta Protests

Aired January 15, 2004 - 14:38   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: President Bush on his way to Atlanta where there is a chill in the air that has nothing to do with that winter cold wave we've been telling you about. It does have to do with January, today being the 75th anniversary of the Birth of Martin Luther King Jr.
Mr. Bush will pay an uninvited visit to King's tomb. A visit some in Atlanta are calling insensitive, even hypocritical. Later he'll share the stage at campaign fund raiser with a Democratic senator who is one of his closest congressional allies.

Look at this picture on an overpass, Interstate 75 in Atlanta. "Honor King, protest Bush." Joining me now to talk about all of this, two old friends from LIVE FROM..., newspaper columnist Roland Martin in Dallas, and Armstrong Williams in another room here in Washington. Good to have you both here.

Before we get into this, we spent so much time on Carol Moseley Braun. Just factor this are into the presidential race for us. Roland, you go first.

ROWLAND MARTIN, COLUMNIST: Not going to make much difference. Carol Moseley Braun was not polling extremely strong within the African-American community. Frankly, all the data we've seen thus far is African-Americans are saying anybody but Bush. So it really doesn't matter. The Democratic candidate is still going to likely get 89 to 91 percent of the black vote come November.

O'BRIEN: Armstrong? Do you agree?

ARMSTRONG WILLIAMS, COLUMNIST: Carol Moseley Braun simply endorsed Howard Dean. Has nothing do with principle and the fact she believes in him. He's going to underwrite her campaign debt which is astronomical. This is strictly a business deal. It's not going to make a bit of difference. They didn't know who she was before she ran and they know even less about her now that she decided to step out of the race.

O'BRIEN: Let's get back to the subject we started off with here. Today is the actual anniversary of Martin Luther King Jr.'s birth. The president going to Atlanta to lay a wreath on the tomb there.

Roland, it's a darned if you today do, darned if you don't situation. It is customary, and would you viewed, I think, with some criticism if the president did not go to Atlanta. Right? MARTIN: Absolutely right. He will get criticized if he did not go. I think one of the troubling issues I have and I've written about this is that every one likes to use Dr. King -- likes to use his words, use his image and use his legacy for their own personal gain.

O'BRIEN: Including the King family.

MARTIN: Absolutely. So again, whether it's Republicans or Democrats, or even African-Americans, folks want to latch on to King. Yet when the president was -- was in New Orleans today, he made a point about emulating Dr. King and fulfilling his life's vision.

Well if I'm the King family and he's coming to lay a wreath, I'd certainly have critical questions for the president as it relates to the high unemployment of African-Americans in this country. Also in terms of what else he's going to do to stem the tide of HIV infections within African-American community.

Don't come simply to lay a wreath, come to also talk about serious policy issues that are specific to African-Americans.

O'BRIEN: All right. Armstrong, what do you think about that? Is that the voice of someone who will never be pleased with what the president does?

WILLIAMS: He totally missed the boat. This is not about Roland's or anybody else's political view and what they think about George Bush's politics. This is to remind us that Martin Luther King during his lifetime huddled us together as a society. He brought forth the cause and put on the forefront the dirty secret of America from human slavery to desegregation to racism. That we need to move beyond that.

He this for the oppressor and the oppressed. And it's to remind us of the greatness that he brought to our lives, how he enriched America and how he enriched the world. And he reminds that this is great man we should celebrate not as Republicans, as Democrats, but as Americans.

(CROSSTALK)

MARTIN: Armstrong, you're saying that this is a reminder of who he is, but the issues that he discussed and dealt with in his lifetime are also still prevalent today. I think it's very easy to simply lay flowers down.

And again, I criticized president Clinton for doing the photo op for going to MLK's tomb just like I'll criticize President Bush. So I don't think we should always talk about how great he was...

O'BRIEN: Roland, are you saying a president shouldn't go there just on principle because no matter what that president does he distorts his or her -- presumably some day that will be the case -- record on race?

MARTIN: No. I think what an individual should today do is if you're going to pay homage to an individual, you should also be trying to live up to what that person also discussed and What they also lived for. It's very easy to lay flowers and to give a speech. But the question is, can you fulfill the vision, the mission, of MLK verses leaving flowers?

WILLIAMS: Again, we missed the boat. This is about King, his legacy, and never forgetting his dream. It's sort of sacrilegious and we sort of embarrass and hijack his moments when we talk about politics and Republicans and Democrats.

Listen, blacks were unemployed during Clinton, they're going to be unemployed with Bush and the next president. It's about King and his legacy. And we should recognize the tremendous contributions that this former noble peace prize winner -- the imprint he's left on this nation. It is about King. It's not about us.

(CROSSTALK)

O'BRIEN: I want to add another dimension to this, if I could, Rowland. The fact that Zell Miller has gone into the mix here adding a uniquely I think Southern wrinkle to all this, a man who still is technically a Democrat. Says the party left him. How does that factor into all this and how does that play in Georgia among, say, conservative Democrat whites who are there?

MARTIN: Look. A number of Southern Democrats, frankly, have not gotten over the beating they took in the 1950s and '60s with the legislation that was passed. A lot of criticism of Zell Miller sounds very similar to what we heard in the '60s when the Democratic Party nationally began to embrace civil rights.

And so frankly he's a throwback to those days as opposed to trying to cast a different vision for the Democratic Party there in the South.

WILLIAMS: That is unfair. Zell Miller represents the true South and where this country is headed. This country...

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: Listen. During the mid term election, the Republicans wiped the clock in Georgia. The Republicans continue to win the South and they will win the South in this year's election. The bottom line is Zell Miller realizes that the Democratic Party not only abandoned him, but abandoned many of the black candidacies that Rowland speaks about.

MARTIN: Come on!

(CROSSTALK)

MARTIN: Armstrong, you know Zell Miller and the Republican believe significantly in the Southern Strategy which Richard Nixon put in place. You know that.

(CROSSTALK) O'BRIEN: Gentlemen, gentlemen. One final thought here. I want to throw this out here. Hypothetical. Rowland, you talked about this a little bit in your column. If Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. were alive today, how would he greet the president?

MARTIN: I believe that in the southern tradition, he would be loving, he would be kind, but he would also though press the president on the critical issues. President Lyndon Baines Johnson often criticized King when he came to the White House because he was always pressing LBJ on important matters.

So King would not allow the opportunity to be lost simply to say, Hey, happy birthday. King would also question him on economic issues, also question him on this issue of the war in Iraq. That's the kind of man King was. He never was willing to shirk -- shrink from the responsibility of questioning kings, presidents and high officials.

WILLIAMS: King's movement was not about politics. It was about the highest moral authority. There is a lot of good that President Bush has done. There is much work that he can do.

King would have found the good in Bush and celebrated it and would have given him constructive criticism of how he can do things better, but working with him, not doing like a lot of these civil rights leaders, just sitting on the sidelines criticizing with nothing new to offer. King would have been working with him side by side for the betterment of all Americans.

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: He's met with the Urban League and other civil rights organizations.

(CROSSTALK)

O'BRIEN: Rowland, we didn't put enough quarters in the satellite. You're about to go to hash there. Rowland Martin in Dallas, we don't want to lose the bird on the air. Good to see you as always.

Armstrong Williams, here you are in Washington. Hopefully I'll see in person next time. Good to have you drop by. We appreciate it.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired January 15, 2004 - 14:38   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: President Bush on his way to Atlanta where there is a chill in the air that has nothing to do with that winter cold wave we've been telling you about. It does have to do with January, today being the 75th anniversary of the Birth of Martin Luther King Jr.
Mr. Bush will pay an uninvited visit to King's tomb. A visit some in Atlanta are calling insensitive, even hypocritical. Later he'll share the stage at campaign fund raiser with a Democratic senator who is one of his closest congressional allies.

Look at this picture on an overpass, Interstate 75 in Atlanta. "Honor King, protest Bush." Joining me now to talk about all of this, two old friends from LIVE FROM..., newspaper columnist Roland Martin in Dallas, and Armstrong Williams in another room here in Washington. Good to have you both here.

Before we get into this, we spent so much time on Carol Moseley Braun. Just factor this are into the presidential race for us. Roland, you go first.

ROWLAND MARTIN, COLUMNIST: Not going to make much difference. Carol Moseley Braun was not polling extremely strong within the African-American community. Frankly, all the data we've seen thus far is African-Americans are saying anybody but Bush. So it really doesn't matter. The Democratic candidate is still going to likely get 89 to 91 percent of the black vote come November.

O'BRIEN: Armstrong? Do you agree?

ARMSTRONG WILLIAMS, COLUMNIST: Carol Moseley Braun simply endorsed Howard Dean. Has nothing do with principle and the fact she believes in him. He's going to underwrite her campaign debt which is astronomical. This is strictly a business deal. It's not going to make a bit of difference. They didn't know who she was before she ran and they know even less about her now that she decided to step out of the race.

O'BRIEN: Let's get back to the subject we started off with here. Today is the actual anniversary of Martin Luther King Jr.'s birth. The president going to Atlanta to lay a wreath on the tomb there.

Roland, it's a darned if you today do, darned if you don't situation. It is customary, and would you viewed, I think, with some criticism if the president did not go to Atlanta. Right? MARTIN: Absolutely right. He will get criticized if he did not go. I think one of the troubling issues I have and I've written about this is that every one likes to use Dr. King -- likes to use his words, use his image and use his legacy for their own personal gain.

O'BRIEN: Including the King family.

MARTIN: Absolutely. So again, whether it's Republicans or Democrats, or even African-Americans, folks want to latch on to King. Yet when the president was -- was in New Orleans today, he made a point about emulating Dr. King and fulfilling his life's vision.

Well if I'm the King family and he's coming to lay a wreath, I'd certainly have critical questions for the president as it relates to the high unemployment of African-Americans in this country. Also in terms of what else he's going to do to stem the tide of HIV infections within African-American community.

Don't come simply to lay a wreath, come to also talk about serious policy issues that are specific to African-Americans.

O'BRIEN: All right. Armstrong, what do you think about that? Is that the voice of someone who will never be pleased with what the president does?

WILLIAMS: He totally missed the boat. This is not about Roland's or anybody else's political view and what they think about George Bush's politics. This is to remind us that Martin Luther King during his lifetime huddled us together as a society. He brought forth the cause and put on the forefront the dirty secret of America from human slavery to desegregation to racism. That we need to move beyond that.

He this for the oppressor and the oppressed. And it's to remind us of the greatness that he brought to our lives, how he enriched America and how he enriched the world. And he reminds that this is great man we should celebrate not as Republicans, as Democrats, but as Americans.

(CROSSTALK)

MARTIN: Armstrong, you're saying that this is a reminder of who he is, but the issues that he discussed and dealt with in his lifetime are also still prevalent today. I think it's very easy to simply lay flowers down.

And again, I criticized president Clinton for doing the photo op for going to MLK's tomb just like I'll criticize President Bush. So I don't think we should always talk about how great he was...

O'BRIEN: Roland, are you saying a president shouldn't go there just on principle because no matter what that president does he distorts his or her -- presumably some day that will be the case -- record on race?

MARTIN: No. I think what an individual should today do is if you're going to pay homage to an individual, you should also be trying to live up to what that person also discussed and What they also lived for. It's very easy to lay flowers and to give a speech. But the question is, can you fulfill the vision, the mission, of MLK verses leaving flowers?

WILLIAMS: Again, we missed the boat. This is about King, his legacy, and never forgetting his dream. It's sort of sacrilegious and we sort of embarrass and hijack his moments when we talk about politics and Republicans and Democrats.

Listen, blacks were unemployed during Clinton, they're going to be unemployed with Bush and the next president. It's about King and his legacy. And we should recognize the tremendous contributions that this former noble peace prize winner -- the imprint he's left on this nation. It is about King. It's not about us.

(CROSSTALK)

O'BRIEN: I want to add another dimension to this, if I could, Rowland. The fact that Zell Miller has gone into the mix here adding a uniquely I think Southern wrinkle to all this, a man who still is technically a Democrat. Says the party left him. How does that factor into all this and how does that play in Georgia among, say, conservative Democrat whites who are there?

MARTIN: Look. A number of Southern Democrats, frankly, have not gotten over the beating they took in the 1950s and '60s with the legislation that was passed. A lot of criticism of Zell Miller sounds very similar to what we heard in the '60s when the Democratic Party nationally began to embrace civil rights.

And so frankly he's a throwback to those days as opposed to trying to cast a different vision for the Democratic Party there in the South.

WILLIAMS: That is unfair. Zell Miller represents the true South and where this country is headed. This country...

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: Listen. During the mid term election, the Republicans wiped the clock in Georgia. The Republicans continue to win the South and they will win the South in this year's election. The bottom line is Zell Miller realizes that the Democratic Party not only abandoned him, but abandoned many of the black candidacies that Rowland speaks about.

MARTIN: Come on!

(CROSSTALK)

MARTIN: Armstrong, you know Zell Miller and the Republican believe significantly in the Southern Strategy which Richard Nixon put in place. You know that.

(CROSSTALK) O'BRIEN: Gentlemen, gentlemen. One final thought here. I want to throw this out here. Hypothetical. Rowland, you talked about this a little bit in your column. If Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. were alive today, how would he greet the president?

MARTIN: I believe that in the southern tradition, he would be loving, he would be kind, but he would also though press the president on the critical issues. President Lyndon Baines Johnson often criticized King when he came to the White House because he was always pressing LBJ on important matters.

So King would not allow the opportunity to be lost simply to say, Hey, happy birthday. King would also question him on economic issues, also question him on this issue of the war in Iraq. That's the kind of man King was. He never was willing to shirk -- shrink from the responsibility of questioning kings, presidents and high officials.

WILLIAMS: King's movement was not about politics. It was about the highest moral authority. There is a lot of good that President Bush has done. There is much work that he can do.

King would have found the good in Bush and celebrated it and would have given him constructive criticism of how he can do things better, but working with him, not doing like a lot of these civil rights leaders, just sitting on the sidelines criticizing with nothing new to offer. King would have been working with him side by side for the betterment of all Americans.

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: He's met with the Urban League and other civil rights organizations.

(CROSSTALK)

O'BRIEN: Rowland, we didn't put enough quarters in the satellite. You're about to go to hash there. Rowland Martin in Dallas, we don't want to lose the bird on the air. Good to see you as always.

Armstrong Williams, here you are in Washington. Hopefully I'll see in person next time. Good to have you drop by. We appreciate it.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com