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Weeklong Fighting In Najaf Continues; Special Training For U.S. Embassy Employees In Iraq; New Roll-Over Rating System; Interest Rate Hike

Aired August 10, 2004 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BETTY NGUYEN, CNN ANCHOR: President Bush names Porter Goss as his choice to head the CIA. A former CIA agent, Goss is now a Republican Congressman from Florida and chairman of the House Intelligence Committee. Confirmation hearings have yet to be scheduled.
Also afterwards, President Bush opened a five-day campaign swing with a bus tour in Florida. About 10,000 supporters, many of them military veterans, came out to hear Bush speak in Pensacola this morning. The president plans to visit eight states, most of them out West.

Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry is also on a campaign swing across country. He's now in the battleground state of Nevada, where he's hearing concerns and is criticizing the Bush administration over a controversial plan to store nuclear waste at Yucca Mountain. Much more on the activities of both candidates on "INSIDE POLITICS" at 3:30 Eastern.

Keeping you informed, CNN, the most trusted name in news.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Let's bring you up to date on the situation in Iraq. Radical and wanted Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr issues a statement welcoming U.N. help in ending the violence in Najaf.

Al-Sadr's supporters have been fighting U.S. forces in the holy city of Najaf for almost a week now. The U.S. military says clashes are now sporadic and not as fierce as they have been, sort of hard to sort all this out. The U.S. military says the Mehdi militia members are hiding near a cemetery and mosque that is one of the most holy sites in Islam.

In Baghdad, tensions are higher than usual, as well. Mixed calls going out to mosques in Sadr City, with their strong allegiance to Muqtada al-Sadr. One is a call to arms for residents, while another warns people to stay indoors. It's a confusing picture. And we are very fortunate to have Jane Arraf here in Atlanta with us to try to help us sort this out.

Jane of course our Baghdad bureau chief. She just got back from Iraq a couple of weeks ago,. enjoying a little bit of R&R, well deserved we might add.

Good to have you with us, Jane. JANE ARRAF, CNN BAGHDAD BUREAU CHIEF: Thanks, Miles.

O'BRIEN: Let's talk about Muqtada al-Sadr for just a moment. You've had occasion to meet him a couple of times. He's very young, very charismatic, the term firebrand is used. It's hard for us here in the West to understand what his appeal is to Shiites.

ARRAF: I guess his appeal is that he fills a void that just isn't filled by anybody else. He appeals to young, angry men, and particularly he appeals to people who are answering that call of I am the one who is standing up against America, which still has a lot of resonance.

Now the U.S. military, other officials, say he has perhaps only 10 percent of the support of the Shia population, but that is still vast numbers of people.

O'BRIEN: He is a rather canny player, isn't he? He played his cards very well, and certainly using this holy site, the center of Najaf, which is in the pecking order akin to, say, Mecca as far as holy sites go for Islam is a shrewd strategic move, isn't it?

ARRAF: Certainly for Shias, that is the one place that you can't touch, the Imam Ali Mosque. Ali was a man, his followers led to the split between Shia and Sunni Islam, so for Muqtada al-Sadr to have taken that place of his own certainly, and it's a very explosive situation. This is a real test, not just for the Americans, but for the Iraqis.

O'BRIEN: Explosive indeed. And when we read that the Iraqis have sank sanctioned the use of force, actually at this site, of course the U.S. is there, and to say it's an Iraqi decision, well, it's kind of a gray area there, as to who is actually making the decisions on the ground there.

The point is, if they in fact go after al-Sadr and his chief lieutenants, the implications are tremendous, aren't they?

ARRAF: They are absolutely. If you -- they have, as you know, in the past threatened to kill or capture him, and that was the mandate of the U.S. military.

O'BRIEN: They are saying that isn't the case now, interestingly.

ARRAF: You're absolutely right. Interestingly they want to settle this by whatever means possible. And it's unclear how it's going to be solved. He is someone who is very divisive within Iraq. He is someone who other Iraqi Shia clerics are clearly afraid of. It's, again, very explosive.

You, as much as any Western journalist, have spent a tremendous amount of time on the streets of Najaf, oftentimes embedded with U.S. forces. I want to show just a clip just to give people -- they all are familiar with your reporting. Let's remind folks about the kind of reporting we have seen from you. Let's watch for a moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was in a convoy. We had to stop because they blocked the road...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Take cover! Incoming!

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get down.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: Jane, we worry about you. Tell us what it is like on the ground there, doing your job. How are you able to function in the midst of all of that?

ARRAF: Well you just kind of roll with it. That was a really interesting example of what these soldiers faced every day for more than a month. You go out the doors, you go out pretty heavily armed, as you can see that they are, and you are almost guaranteed to get shot at. How we do our jobs?

I think it's terribly important as anyone who is there to continue to do that, even if it is scary. I have to be honest, it is often scary. But we're extremely lucky, and we have to continue to do that kind of thing.

O'BRIEN: There you are there, with the bulletproof vest and the photographer. Obviously, you take tremendous precautions. But you really are, truth be told, you are limited in how much reporting you can do independently on the streets these days. How much can you really get the sense of what is going on with the Iraqi people? How much do have you to be with military forces?

ARRAF: It is extremely difficult for television news. You saw there our cameraman, Rick Hall, who is phenomenal. And when the shooting starts, I can duck under the vehicle. Rick was actually up there shooting, to some extent. We are targets, no matter where we go. Easier for newspaper people, but difficult for pretty well everyone these days.

O'BRIEN: The final thought here, the tremendous fall of the Chalabis, Ahmed Chalabi, who at one time was seen as a potential leader for Iraq. He and his nephew now up on charges out of the country, villain or victims there? What do you think?

ARRAF: Whichever one he is, that is sure a fall from grace, isn't it? At one time, this is man who was going to lead the country. He claims of course he's a victim. He does have a lot of political enemies, doesn't have a lot of support in Iraq, but he is smart enough, clever enough, has enough political savvy that maybe he'll turn this around.

O'BRIEN: Perhaps it's the price paid for being perhaps so closely aligned with the U.S. at this juncture.

ARRAF: Absolutely.

O'BRIEN: Jane Arraf, always a pleasure having you drop by. Please stay safe out there when you get back to it in Baghdad. We look forward to more reporting from you.

ARRAF: Thank you so much.

NGUYEN: Diplomats, by the very nature of their job descriptions, know how to deal tactfully with others. So, you wouldn't expect them how to use an AK-47. But the U.S. embassy in Iraq is not the average posting, and that's where some special training comes in handy.

Our Andrea Koppel explains.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN STATE DEPARTMENT CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The green pastures of West Virginia are a world away from the dusty streets of Baghdad. But it's here that hundreds of American diplomats and other federal workers are learning some of the skills they'll need to survive in what's considered the most dangerous diplomatic post in the world.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE INSTRUCTOR: That's going to be the primary area where I'm going to stick my mirror and/or, preferably my body.

KOPPEL: Instructors from the state department's bureau of diplomatic security show students that anything from a suitcase to a cigar box can be used to hide explosives, the kind of explosives that have killed so many people in Iraq.

Look at the effect on this car from only one stick of dynamite.

NANCY PILON, PROTOCOL OFFICER: To hear the sound and actually feel it, and your heart rate starts pumping and it's amazing.

KOPPEL: 42-year-old Nancy Pilon, a protocol officer at the state department is among a small army of American diplomats who volunteered to leave the comforts of home for at least the next six months to work at the new U.S. embassy in Baghdad.

PILON: I think it's important to go there and put a face on the administration hopefully. And I'm looking forward to it.

KOPPEL: 31-year-old Ryan Stiles says he'll be working with Iraqis to help build democratic institutions.

RYAN STILES, COUNTERTERRORISM OFFICIAL: I was doing counterterrorism and homeland security from behind a desk prior to this. And I wanted to get more on the front line.

KOPPEL: 59-year-old Stuart Foote, an auditor for the U.S. Air Force in Ohio is leaving his wife and grown children to help track how Iraqi oil money and U.S. taxpayer funds are spent.

STUART FOOTE, AIR FORCE AUDITOR: This is where the work is. This is where the need is. I didn't go, there would be somebody in a green uniform maybe doing what I'm doing, and there's no reason for that. I'm qualified to do it. And they've set up this opportunity and I'm happy to take advantage of it.

KOPPEL: But before they leave for duty in Iraq, they first have to complete this mandatory week-long course. For some, including Nancy Pilon, that means learning to fire an AK-47 and other weapons for the first time.

(on camera) The philosophy behind this course is essentially the best offense is a good defense. And so while most of these men and women won't actually carry a weapon in Iraq, they'll know how to use one if they ever need to.

FRANK TAYLOR, DIPLOMATIC SECURITY OFFICER: The diplomats are the first line of defense of our nation. They serve in harm's way, and it's our obligation to make sure that when we ask them to go serve their nation that they're the best prepared.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE INSTRUCTOR: Anybody in here ever experience shock?

KOPPEL (voice-over): That means as part of their training, students also learn first aid, what to do if the worst happens.

PAULA WINKLE, VICTIM: I obviously didn't sustain a direct hit or else it would have been severed.

KOPPEL: Paula Winkle says she is living proof the training can save lives and limbs.

Last October she was staying in Baghdad's Al-Rashid hotel when it came under rocket attack. One landed in Paula's room. Twelve surgeries later, she has lost two inches of bone and a lot of muscle, but she still considers herself lucky.

WINKLE: Kind of like a wakeup call, you know. If I hadn't had the training, they're not real sure what would have happened.

KOPPEL: Only a few of the 550 students who have been through the training so far have opted not to go to Baghdad. It's a measure of just how important Iraq is to the United States that these men and women are going at all.

If there were similar dangers in any other country, state department officials say, the U.S. would be ordering its diplomats to leave.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

NGUYEN: And that was Andrea Koppel, our State Department correspondent, reporting.

Thinking about getting a new car? Well, there's a new way to rate vehicles based on how likely they are to roll over in a crash. We'll show you that. O'BRIEN: You're bankrupt. Trump's hotel and casino company flirts with Chapter 11.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

NGUYEN: OK. If you're shopping for a new vehicle, would you like to know how likely it is to roll over in a crash? The federal government has a new roll-over rating system starting with the 2004 model year.

And CNN's Julie Vallese reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JULIE VALLESE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The coveted stars are still there. It's still called the New Car Assessment Program, or NCAP, but now consumers can also see what chance there is a vehicle will roll-over in a single vehicle crash.

DR. JEFFREY RUNGE, NHTSA ADMINISTRATION: This is a problem that continues to produce about a third of our occupant fatalities every year, even though there are less than three percent of our crashes.

VALLESE: Roll-overs are more likely to occur in the light truck category, which includes sport utility vehicles. Government statistics show that in SUV roll-over crashes, most of those killed were not wearing seat belts.

RUNGE: I want NCAP to be where everybody goes before they get in their car on that Saturday morning to go out and start looking at cars.

VALLESE: The new ratings rank cars from one to five stars. They also show the percentage risk of a vehicle roll-over and notes whether the vehicle tipped in what's called the fishhook test.

(on camera): Only five percent of real world roll-over crashes occur because of maneuvers similar to the fishhook test; 95% of vehicles that roll over go off-road, hit something, then roll.

(voice-over): Chrysler's Pacifica received the top ranking among SUVs, the Nissan Quest for minivans, and Chevrolet's Silverado for pickups.

RON DEFORE, SUV OWNERS OF AMERICA: We applaud the federal government in coming out with additional information for consumers. The more information consumers have, the better off and the wiser their purchase decisions will be.

VALLESE: Vehicles from the 2004 model year are the first to include the enhanced scoring system. Past model years won't be retested.

Julie Vallese, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE) NGUYEN: Now, with that said, so what might these government roll-over ratings mean for the automotive industry? David Welch covers the industry for "BusinessWeek" magazine, and he's with us from Detroit.

Good afternoon to you.

DAVID WELCH, "BUSINESSWEEK": Good afternoon.

NGUYEN: Wanted to ask you: Are you a little surprised that, in these rankings, some of the most popular SUVs -- the Ford Explorer and the Mountaineer -- are among the worst on the list?

WELCH: Not at all. The general trend here, if you look at the Pacifica, doing very well, and the Explorer being at the bottom of the list is that the more truck-like a vehicle is in its total construction, you know, generally the worse it did.

That's not always the case, but that's kind of the way it came through in this study and those vehicles are just a bit less stable. They have been very popular for a long time, but they're still built in a way that makes them a little less stable than something like a Pacifica, which is kind of more like a wagon or even a passenger car.

NGUYEN: You bring up a good point. They have been popular for a long time. And for a long time, we've known that roll-overs can be a major issue with SUVs. So, why are people still buying them if they are dangerous?

WELCH: Well, you know, roll-overs are only, you know, about three percent of all accidents. So, people look at that as a pretty remote possibility, even if the result is fairly often a fatal accident. So, you know, SUV buyers are thinking, in any other accident I'm pretty safe.

NGUYEN: Three percent of accidents, but they account for a third of traffic deaths.

WELCH: Right.

NGUYEN: Do you think with this new ranking system that these companies are going to be changing any designs because of it?

WELCH: You'll see some new things. Ford with the Explorer is already coming out with a couple different technologies that help stability.

The Explorer, starting next year, will have a standard sensor that when the vehicle starts to tip, as in a roll-over, it will either brake or cut power to certain wheels to, you know, help the car right itself. They've already got it as an option on some vehicles. They've been working on it since before the study came out, but you know, they know that roll-over is an issue with SUVs -- if not on the road, also, you know, as a marketplace factor.

NGUYEN: In their defense, car companies are going to say, well, a lot of this is a result of people not wearing their seatbelts, not necessarily the roll-over -- that not wearing a seatbelt makes up a lot of traffic deaths on the roadway.

Do you buy into that?

WELCH: Well, to a degree. I mean, let's not get our SUV owners out there in an uproar unnecessarily. The biggest problems on the road are still lack of seatbelt use and drunk driving.

But roll-overs are an issue, and I think what a lot of buyers will start to do is they are going to look at the SUVs with really good roll-over ratings and they are going to maybe, you know, migrate toward those when they make their buying decisions.

NGUYEN: So, you think despite the popularity, this new ranking system is going to make a difference?

WELCH: It could, yes. There are a lot of people who, you know, really look at safety very seriously. A lot of family owners, you know, are -- family-type buyers with a lot of kids buy SUVs, and they want the vehicles to be as safe as possible.

NGUYEN: All right. David Welch from "BusinessWeek," thank you.

WELCH: Thank you.

NGUYEN: Miles?

O'BRIEN: You know, one of the simple things that people overlook is just having your tires properly inflated. That can really be a big issue.

NGUYEN: Air pressure, exactly. It's a big issue for gas mileage, as well.

O'BRIEN: That, too.

All right, Donald Trump may have to fire someone again. Might come a little close to home this time.

NGUYEN: And men versus women -- oh, yeah -- who rules at the ballot box? That's coming up.

O'BRIEN: And in today's entertainment buzz: Janet Jackson is coming back to TV. Will she keep her clothes on? You'll have to stay right here to get details on that one.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Well, it's been all of 30 minutes or so, so it's a little early to see or say what the fed's new interest rate hike will do to the economy. But the folks at Gallup did take a look at the last rate hike in June.

Gallup editor -- Editor-in-Chief Frank Newport joining us from Princeton with a little number crunching for us. Frank, did that June impact have an impact -- excuse me, June hike have an impact?

FRANK NEWPORT, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, GALLUP: Well, if it had an impact, it was tied up with a lot of other things that are going on in the economy right now, Miles, including the gas prices that are out there, the concern about jobs, and the lack of good paying jobs.

And all of that put together, I think, means that, although we focus a lot in this presidential race on Iraq and terrorism -- that seems to dominate the news -- the economy still is still the most important issue people say they are going to take into account.

That's the number one message I get when I look through our data. For example, this was the "TIME" magazine poll published this weekend. What's most important in your vote? Well, you see the results there? Top of the list, 27% of Americans more than any of the others chose it's the economy.

Here's the trend that we're talking about here: Is the economy getting better, or is it getting worse? The numbers kind of go up and down, but we just can't get a sustained optimistic burst out of the public where they are convinced the big majority that is getting better. It's kind of been up and down.

In July there, we thought maybe we were getting an increase: 51% better, just 38 worse. We just asked it again. It shrunk back to just a five-point margin, now, Miles: 48 better, 43 worse That's actually deteriorating a little.

So, the American public sitting out there saying where's the great sustained recovery that I think they want to see?

O'BRIEN: You know, part of it is I think we came off such a tremendous boom that it's hard to calibrate properly on what are good times anymore, given what we went through.

All right, let's talk about the gender gap. Historically, women, demographically speaking, have kind of skewed Democratic; men, more Republican. Is that still alive and well?

NEWPORT: Indeed. Still alive and well. It's complicated, because, you know, half or more voters are women, so you can splice them up. And if you're a very religious woman who is conservative, obviously you're voting for Bush. But throwing everything into the mix together, here's our latest poll.

Gender gap? Couldn't be more of a mirror image than this. If you are a man in America today, the best statistical probability is you are voting for Bush: 52, 45 -- these are registered voters. If you're a woman in America today, the best estimate are you're voting for Kerry: 51, 45 for Bush. So, it's still there. Probably will persist up until the election.

And that's why the Bush administration -- by the way, Miles -- has been sending more women out. Sunday talk shows -- a couple of women this past Sunday to do its talking. I think they are trying to reach the women voters. O'BRIEN: There you have it. Frank Newport, as always, offering some interesting insights on the electoral process. Appreciate it.

All right. The fed has decided to raise interest rates by a quarter point. We've told you all about that one.

NGUYEN: Oh, yes. Just happened not too long ago. Rhonda Schaffler joins us now live from the New York Stock Exchange with a look at how investors are reacting. How are they reacting, Rhonda?

RHONDA SCHAFFLER, CNN FINANCIAL NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Betty and Miles. Well, pretty much as expected.

When you think about it, Wall Street got what it was expecting as the fed made this move to raise its key interest rate by a quarter point. What's interesting, though, is the move came despite some recent disappointing economic reports that showed what Mr. Greenspan has called a soft patch in the economy.

In the fed's comments today, it noted the economy is poised to pick up speed again. Fed also repeated and intends to continue raising rates at measured pace. And that means we can expect more of these quarter-point hikes. Stocks briefly retreated from earlier gains on the news. Now, though, they are right back where they were ahead of the decision: Dow up 77 points; Nasdaq adding one percent.

Miles, Betty?

O'BRIEN: All right, Rhonda. Let's talk about Donald Trump. He said, "You're fired," and this time he was looked in his gilded mirror there, right?

SCHAFFLER: Yes, little bit of trouble in the boardroom for Donald Trump. He is of course known for that phrase, "You're fired." He's got issues now to deal with on his own.

He's being forced to step down as CEO of his hotel and casino empire. This is -- his company announces plans to file for bankruptcy protection. Trump Hotels and Casino Resorts in Atlantic City has built up a mountain of debt, about $2 billion worth. Plans to reorganize under bankruptcy protection and emerge sometime next year.

As part of the filing, Trump will be stripped of his majority stake, along as his title. He will remain, though, chairman, and his non-casino holdings will not be affected. And in case you're wondering, the billionaire also still will be the big boss on the NBC show "The Apprentice."

Now, here's a big board. Trading of Trump stock suspended. That is a typical move when a company indicates it's going to file for Chapter 11. And that's the very latest from the New York Stock Exchange.

Miles, Betty?

O'BRIEN: We were so worried about "The Apprentice," too. Thank you, Rhonda. All right, we'll see you in a little bit.

NGUYEN: Well, an old CIA operative could soon be back on the payroll -- this time running the show. President Bush names his choice for CIA director.

Plus, Amber Frey takes the stand in the Peterson trial. We're live in California, of course.

And strike a pose, Miles -- a new tourist attraction in the big apple. We'll tell you all about it.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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Aired August 10, 2004 - 14:30   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BETTY NGUYEN, CNN ANCHOR: President Bush names Porter Goss as his choice to head the CIA. A former CIA agent, Goss is now a Republican Congressman from Florida and chairman of the House Intelligence Committee. Confirmation hearings have yet to be scheduled.
Also afterwards, President Bush opened a five-day campaign swing with a bus tour in Florida. About 10,000 supporters, many of them military veterans, came out to hear Bush speak in Pensacola this morning. The president plans to visit eight states, most of them out West.

Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry is also on a campaign swing across country. He's now in the battleground state of Nevada, where he's hearing concerns and is criticizing the Bush administration over a controversial plan to store nuclear waste at Yucca Mountain. Much more on the activities of both candidates on "INSIDE POLITICS" at 3:30 Eastern.

Keeping you informed, CNN, the most trusted name in news.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Let's bring you up to date on the situation in Iraq. Radical and wanted Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr issues a statement welcoming U.N. help in ending the violence in Najaf.

Al-Sadr's supporters have been fighting U.S. forces in the holy city of Najaf for almost a week now. The U.S. military says clashes are now sporadic and not as fierce as they have been, sort of hard to sort all this out. The U.S. military says the Mehdi militia members are hiding near a cemetery and mosque that is one of the most holy sites in Islam.

In Baghdad, tensions are higher than usual, as well. Mixed calls going out to mosques in Sadr City, with their strong allegiance to Muqtada al-Sadr. One is a call to arms for residents, while another warns people to stay indoors. It's a confusing picture. And we are very fortunate to have Jane Arraf here in Atlanta with us to try to help us sort this out.

Jane of course our Baghdad bureau chief. She just got back from Iraq a couple of weeks ago,. enjoying a little bit of R&R, well deserved we might add.

Good to have you with us, Jane. JANE ARRAF, CNN BAGHDAD BUREAU CHIEF: Thanks, Miles.

O'BRIEN: Let's talk about Muqtada al-Sadr for just a moment. You've had occasion to meet him a couple of times. He's very young, very charismatic, the term firebrand is used. It's hard for us here in the West to understand what his appeal is to Shiites.

ARRAF: I guess his appeal is that he fills a void that just isn't filled by anybody else. He appeals to young, angry men, and particularly he appeals to people who are answering that call of I am the one who is standing up against America, which still has a lot of resonance.

Now the U.S. military, other officials, say he has perhaps only 10 percent of the support of the Shia population, but that is still vast numbers of people.

O'BRIEN: He is a rather canny player, isn't he? He played his cards very well, and certainly using this holy site, the center of Najaf, which is in the pecking order akin to, say, Mecca as far as holy sites go for Islam is a shrewd strategic move, isn't it?

ARRAF: Certainly for Shias, that is the one place that you can't touch, the Imam Ali Mosque. Ali was a man, his followers led to the split between Shia and Sunni Islam, so for Muqtada al-Sadr to have taken that place of his own certainly, and it's a very explosive situation. This is a real test, not just for the Americans, but for the Iraqis.

O'BRIEN: Explosive indeed. And when we read that the Iraqis have sank sanctioned the use of force, actually at this site, of course the U.S. is there, and to say it's an Iraqi decision, well, it's kind of a gray area there, as to who is actually making the decisions on the ground there.

The point is, if they in fact go after al-Sadr and his chief lieutenants, the implications are tremendous, aren't they?

ARRAF: They are absolutely. If you -- they have, as you know, in the past threatened to kill or capture him, and that was the mandate of the U.S. military.

O'BRIEN: They are saying that isn't the case now, interestingly.

ARRAF: You're absolutely right. Interestingly they want to settle this by whatever means possible. And it's unclear how it's going to be solved. He is someone who is very divisive within Iraq. He is someone who other Iraqi Shia clerics are clearly afraid of. It's, again, very explosive.

You, as much as any Western journalist, have spent a tremendous amount of time on the streets of Najaf, oftentimes embedded with U.S. forces. I want to show just a clip just to give people -- they all are familiar with your reporting. Let's remind folks about the kind of reporting we have seen from you. Let's watch for a moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was in a convoy. We had to stop because they blocked the road...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Take cover! Incoming!

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get down.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: Jane, we worry about you. Tell us what it is like on the ground there, doing your job. How are you able to function in the midst of all of that?

ARRAF: Well you just kind of roll with it. That was a really interesting example of what these soldiers faced every day for more than a month. You go out the doors, you go out pretty heavily armed, as you can see that they are, and you are almost guaranteed to get shot at. How we do our jobs?

I think it's terribly important as anyone who is there to continue to do that, even if it is scary. I have to be honest, it is often scary. But we're extremely lucky, and we have to continue to do that kind of thing.

O'BRIEN: There you are there, with the bulletproof vest and the photographer. Obviously, you take tremendous precautions. But you really are, truth be told, you are limited in how much reporting you can do independently on the streets these days. How much can you really get the sense of what is going on with the Iraqi people? How much do have you to be with military forces?

ARRAF: It is extremely difficult for television news. You saw there our cameraman, Rick Hall, who is phenomenal. And when the shooting starts, I can duck under the vehicle. Rick was actually up there shooting, to some extent. We are targets, no matter where we go. Easier for newspaper people, but difficult for pretty well everyone these days.

O'BRIEN: The final thought here, the tremendous fall of the Chalabis, Ahmed Chalabi, who at one time was seen as a potential leader for Iraq. He and his nephew now up on charges out of the country, villain or victims there? What do you think?

ARRAF: Whichever one he is, that is sure a fall from grace, isn't it? At one time, this is man who was going to lead the country. He claims of course he's a victim. He does have a lot of political enemies, doesn't have a lot of support in Iraq, but he is smart enough, clever enough, has enough political savvy that maybe he'll turn this around.

O'BRIEN: Perhaps it's the price paid for being perhaps so closely aligned with the U.S. at this juncture.

ARRAF: Absolutely.

O'BRIEN: Jane Arraf, always a pleasure having you drop by. Please stay safe out there when you get back to it in Baghdad. We look forward to more reporting from you.

ARRAF: Thank you so much.

NGUYEN: Diplomats, by the very nature of their job descriptions, know how to deal tactfully with others. So, you wouldn't expect them how to use an AK-47. But the U.S. embassy in Iraq is not the average posting, and that's where some special training comes in handy.

Our Andrea Koppel explains.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN STATE DEPARTMENT CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The green pastures of West Virginia are a world away from the dusty streets of Baghdad. But it's here that hundreds of American diplomats and other federal workers are learning some of the skills they'll need to survive in what's considered the most dangerous diplomatic post in the world.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE INSTRUCTOR: That's going to be the primary area where I'm going to stick my mirror and/or, preferably my body.

KOPPEL: Instructors from the state department's bureau of diplomatic security show students that anything from a suitcase to a cigar box can be used to hide explosives, the kind of explosives that have killed so many people in Iraq.

Look at the effect on this car from only one stick of dynamite.

NANCY PILON, PROTOCOL OFFICER: To hear the sound and actually feel it, and your heart rate starts pumping and it's amazing.

KOPPEL: 42-year-old Nancy Pilon, a protocol officer at the state department is among a small army of American diplomats who volunteered to leave the comforts of home for at least the next six months to work at the new U.S. embassy in Baghdad.

PILON: I think it's important to go there and put a face on the administration hopefully. And I'm looking forward to it.

KOPPEL: 31-year-old Ryan Stiles says he'll be working with Iraqis to help build democratic institutions.

RYAN STILES, COUNTERTERRORISM OFFICIAL: I was doing counterterrorism and homeland security from behind a desk prior to this. And I wanted to get more on the front line.

KOPPEL: 59-year-old Stuart Foote, an auditor for the U.S. Air Force in Ohio is leaving his wife and grown children to help track how Iraqi oil money and U.S. taxpayer funds are spent.

STUART FOOTE, AIR FORCE AUDITOR: This is where the work is. This is where the need is. I didn't go, there would be somebody in a green uniform maybe doing what I'm doing, and there's no reason for that. I'm qualified to do it. And they've set up this opportunity and I'm happy to take advantage of it.

KOPPEL: But before they leave for duty in Iraq, they first have to complete this mandatory week-long course. For some, including Nancy Pilon, that means learning to fire an AK-47 and other weapons for the first time.

(on camera) The philosophy behind this course is essentially the best offense is a good defense. And so while most of these men and women won't actually carry a weapon in Iraq, they'll know how to use one if they ever need to.

FRANK TAYLOR, DIPLOMATIC SECURITY OFFICER: The diplomats are the first line of defense of our nation. They serve in harm's way, and it's our obligation to make sure that when we ask them to go serve their nation that they're the best prepared.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE INSTRUCTOR: Anybody in here ever experience shock?

KOPPEL (voice-over): That means as part of their training, students also learn first aid, what to do if the worst happens.

PAULA WINKLE, VICTIM: I obviously didn't sustain a direct hit or else it would have been severed.

KOPPEL: Paula Winkle says she is living proof the training can save lives and limbs.

Last October she was staying in Baghdad's Al-Rashid hotel when it came under rocket attack. One landed in Paula's room. Twelve surgeries later, she has lost two inches of bone and a lot of muscle, but she still considers herself lucky.

WINKLE: Kind of like a wakeup call, you know. If I hadn't had the training, they're not real sure what would have happened.

KOPPEL: Only a few of the 550 students who have been through the training so far have opted not to go to Baghdad. It's a measure of just how important Iraq is to the United States that these men and women are going at all.

If there were similar dangers in any other country, state department officials say, the U.S. would be ordering its diplomats to leave.

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NGUYEN: And that was Andrea Koppel, our State Department correspondent, reporting.

Thinking about getting a new car? Well, there's a new way to rate vehicles based on how likely they are to roll over in a crash. We'll show you that. O'BRIEN: You're bankrupt. Trump's hotel and casino company flirts with Chapter 11.

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NGUYEN: OK. If you're shopping for a new vehicle, would you like to know how likely it is to roll over in a crash? The federal government has a new roll-over rating system starting with the 2004 model year.

And CNN's Julie Vallese reports.

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JULIE VALLESE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The coveted stars are still there. It's still called the New Car Assessment Program, or NCAP, but now consumers can also see what chance there is a vehicle will roll-over in a single vehicle crash.

DR. JEFFREY RUNGE, NHTSA ADMINISTRATION: This is a problem that continues to produce about a third of our occupant fatalities every year, even though there are less than three percent of our crashes.

VALLESE: Roll-overs are more likely to occur in the light truck category, which includes sport utility vehicles. Government statistics show that in SUV roll-over crashes, most of those killed were not wearing seat belts.

RUNGE: I want NCAP to be where everybody goes before they get in their car on that Saturday morning to go out and start looking at cars.

VALLESE: The new ratings rank cars from one to five stars. They also show the percentage risk of a vehicle roll-over and notes whether the vehicle tipped in what's called the fishhook test.

(on camera): Only five percent of real world roll-over crashes occur because of maneuvers similar to the fishhook test; 95% of vehicles that roll over go off-road, hit something, then roll.

(voice-over): Chrysler's Pacifica received the top ranking among SUVs, the Nissan Quest for minivans, and Chevrolet's Silverado for pickups.

RON DEFORE, SUV OWNERS OF AMERICA: We applaud the federal government in coming out with additional information for consumers. The more information consumers have, the better off and the wiser their purchase decisions will be.

VALLESE: Vehicles from the 2004 model year are the first to include the enhanced scoring system. Past model years won't be retested.

Julie Vallese, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE) NGUYEN: Now, with that said, so what might these government roll-over ratings mean for the automotive industry? David Welch covers the industry for "BusinessWeek" magazine, and he's with us from Detroit.

Good afternoon to you.

DAVID WELCH, "BUSINESSWEEK": Good afternoon.

NGUYEN: Wanted to ask you: Are you a little surprised that, in these rankings, some of the most popular SUVs -- the Ford Explorer and the Mountaineer -- are among the worst on the list?

WELCH: Not at all. The general trend here, if you look at the Pacifica, doing very well, and the Explorer being at the bottom of the list is that the more truck-like a vehicle is in its total construction, you know, generally the worse it did.

That's not always the case, but that's kind of the way it came through in this study and those vehicles are just a bit less stable. They have been very popular for a long time, but they're still built in a way that makes them a little less stable than something like a Pacifica, which is kind of more like a wagon or even a passenger car.

NGUYEN: You bring up a good point. They have been popular for a long time. And for a long time, we've known that roll-overs can be a major issue with SUVs. So, why are people still buying them if they are dangerous?

WELCH: Well, you know, roll-overs are only, you know, about three percent of all accidents. So, people look at that as a pretty remote possibility, even if the result is fairly often a fatal accident. So, you know, SUV buyers are thinking, in any other accident I'm pretty safe.

NGUYEN: Three percent of accidents, but they account for a third of traffic deaths.

WELCH: Right.

NGUYEN: Do you think with this new ranking system that these companies are going to be changing any designs because of it?

WELCH: You'll see some new things. Ford with the Explorer is already coming out with a couple different technologies that help stability.

The Explorer, starting next year, will have a standard sensor that when the vehicle starts to tip, as in a roll-over, it will either brake or cut power to certain wheels to, you know, help the car right itself. They've already got it as an option on some vehicles. They've been working on it since before the study came out, but you know, they know that roll-over is an issue with SUVs -- if not on the road, also, you know, as a marketplace factor.

NGUYEN: In their defense, car companies are going to say, well, a lot of this is a result of people not wearing their seatbelts, not necessarily the roll-over -- that not wearing a seatbelt makes up a lot of traffic deaths on the roadway.

Do you buy into that?

WELCH: Well, to a degree. I mean, let's not get our SUV owners out there in an uproar unnecessarily. The biggest problems on the road are still lack of seatbelt use and drunk driving.

But roll-overs are an issue, and I think what a lot of buyers will start to do is they are going to look at the SUVs with really good roll-over ratings and they are going to maybe, you know, migrate toward those when they make their buying decisions.

NGUYEN: So, you think despite the popularity, this new ranking system is going to make a difference?

WELCH: It could, yes. There are a lot of people who, you know, really look at safety very seriously. A lot of family owners, you know, are -- family-type buyers with a lot of kids buy SUVs, and they want the vehicles to be as safe as possible.

NGUYEN: All right. David Welch from "BusinessWeek," thank you.

WELCH: Thank you.

NGUYEN: Miles?

O'BRIEN: You know, one of the simple things that people overlook is just having your tires properly inflated. That can really be a big issue.

NGUYEN: Air pressure, exactly. It's a big issue for gas mileage, as well.

O'BRIEN: That, too.

All right, Donald Trump may have to fire someone again. Might come a little close to home this time.

NGUYEN: And men versus women -- oh, yeah -- who rules at the ballot box? That's coming up.

O'BRIEN: And in today's entertainment buzz: Janet Jackson is coming back to TV. Will she keep her clothes on? You'll have to stay right here to get details on that one.

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O'BRIEN: Well, it's been all of 30 minutes or so, so it's a little early to see or say what the fed's new interest rate hike will do to the economy. But the folks at Gallup did take a look at the last rate hike in June.

Gallup editor -- Editor-in-Chief Frank Newport joining us from Princeton with a little number crunching for us. Frank, did that June impact have an impact -- excuse me, June hike have an impact?

FRANK NEWPORT, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, GALLUP: Well, if it had an impact, it was tied up with a lot of other things that are going on in the economy right now, Miles, including the gas prices that are out there, the concern about jobs, and the lack of good paying jobs.

And all of that put together, I think, means that, although we focus a lot in this presidential race on Iraq and terrorism -- that seems to dominate the news -- the economy still is still the most important issue people say they are going to take into account.

That's the number one message I get when I look through our data. For example, this was the "TIME" magazine poll published this weekend. What's most important in your vote? Well, you see the results there? Top of the list, 27% of Americans more than any of the others chose it's the economy.

Here's the trend that we're talking about here: Is the economy getting better, or is it getting worse? The numbers kind of go up and down, but we just can't get a sustained optimistic burst out of the public where they are convinced the big majority that is getting better. It's kind of been up and down.

In July there, we thought maybe we were getting an increase: 51% better, just 38 worse. We just asked it again. It shrunk back to just a five-point margin, now, Miles: 48 better, 43 worse That's actually deteriorating a little.

So, the American public sitting out there saying where's the great sustained recovery that I think they want to see?

O'BRIEN: You know, part of it is I think we came off such a tremendous boom that it's hard to calibrate properly on what are good times anymore, given what we went through.

All right, let's talk about the gender gap. Historically, women, demographically speaking, have kind of skewed Democratic; men, more Republican. Is that still alive and well?

NEWPORT: Indeed. Still alive and well. It's complicated, because, you know, half or more voters are women, so you can splice them up. And if you're a very religious woman who is conservative, obviously you're voting for Bush. But throwing everything into the mix together, here's our latest poll.

Gender gap? Couldn't be more of a mirror image than this. If you are a man in America today, the best statistical probability is you are voting for Bush: 52, 45 -- these are registered voters. If you're a woman in America today, the best estimate are you're voting for Kerry: 51, 45 for Bush. So, it's still there. Probably will persist up until the election.

And that's why the Bush administration -- by the way, Miles -- has been sending more women out. Sunday talk shows -- a couple of women this past Sunday to do its talking. I think they are trying to reach the women voters. O'BRIEN: There you have it. Frank Newport, as always, offering some interesting insights on the electoral process. Appreciate it.

All right. The fed has decided to raise interest rates by a quarter point. We've told you all about that one.

NGUYEN: Oh, yes. Just happened not too long ago. Rhonda Schaffler joins us now live from the New York Stock Exchange with a look at how investors are reacting. How are they reacting, Rhonda?

RHONDA SCHAFFLER, CNN FINANCIAL NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Betty and Miles. Well, pretty much as expected.

When you think about it, Wall Street got what it was expecting as the fed made this move to raise its key interest rate by a quarter point. What's interesting, though, is the move came despite some recent disappointing economic reports that showed what Mr. Greenspan has called a soft patch in the economy.

In the fed's comments today, it noted the economy is poised to pick up speed again. Fed also repeated and intends to continue raising rates at measured pace. And that means we can expect more of these quarter-point hikes. Stocks briefly retreated from earlier gains on the news. Now, though, they are right back where they were ahead of the decision: Dow up 77 points; Nasdaq adding one percent.

Miles, Betty?

O'BRIEN: All right, Rhonda. Let's talk about Donald Trump. He said, "You're fired," and this time he was looked in his gilded mirror there, right?

SCHAFFLER: Yes, little bit of trouble in the boardroom for Donald Trump. He is of course known for that phrase, "You're fired." He's got issues now to deal with on his own.

He's being forced to step down as CEO of his hotel and casino empire. This is -- his company announces plans to file for bankruptcy protection. Trump Hotels and Casino Resorts in Atlantic City has built up a mountain of debt, about $2 billion worth. Plans to reorganize under bankruptcy protection and emerge sometime next year.

As part of the filing, Trump will be stripped of his majority stake, along as his title. He will remain, though, chairman, and his non-casino holdings will not be affected. And in case you're wondering, the billionaire also still will be the big boss on the NBC show "The Apprentice."

Now, here's a big board. Trading of Trump stock suspended. That is a typical move when a company indicates it's going to file for Chapter 11. And that's the very latest from the New York Stock Exchange.

Miles, Betty?

O'BRIEN: We were so worried about "The Apprentice," too. Thank you, Rhonda. All right, we'll see you in a little bit.

NGUYEN: Well, an old CIA operative could soon be back on the payroll -- this time running the show. President Bush names his choice for CIA director.

Plus, Amber Frey takes the stand in the Peterson trial. We're live in California, of course.

And strike a pose, Miles -- a new tourist attraction in the big apple. We'll tell you all about it.

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