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Live From...
Hurricanes Take Mental Toll on Florida Residents; Mount St. Helens Rumbles; Merck Pulls Vioxx Off the Market
Aired September 30, 2004 - 14:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DREW GRIFFIN, CNN ANCHOR: And welcome back. From the CNN Center in Atlanta, this is LIVE FROM. I'm Drew Griffin.
PHILLIPS: And I'm Kyra Phillips. Here's what's all new this half hour.
Just hours away from the first presidential debate. We put the candidates in the "CROSSFIRE." Paul Begala and Bob Novak give us their take on what it will take to come away a winner.
And a bizarre case, a pilot hit in the eye by a laser beam. An investigation underway.
GRIFFIN: Sometimes in Florida, rebuilding from one storm only to be hit by another and yet another -- inside what's being done to help people cope with the damage you don't see right away.
First, here's what's happening right now in the news.
PHILLIPS: Off the market: The arthritis drug Vioxx is no longer for sale. Its manufacturer, Merck & Company, has voluntarily pulled it from the shelves. A recent clinical trial showed Vioxx raised the risk of heart attack and stroke.
A new trial for Terri Schiavo, that's what her parents are seeking this hour in a Florida courtroom. The brain damaged woman has been at the center of a right-to-die dispute for the past 14 years. At issue: whether Schiavo, who left no written will, would choose to have her feeding tube removed.
Freedom delayed: A snag has developed in the deal returning Yaser Hamdi to Saudi Arabia. Under the terms, Hamdi must renounce his U.S. citizenship, avoid any contact with terrorist groups, and stay in Saudi Arabia for five years. Saudi Arabia calls it unenforceable and wants Hamdi released without condition.
Smile when you enter this country: All visitors from Europe and elsewhere now have to be photographed and fingerprinted before they can pass through customs. It's part of a heightened effort to secure America's borders, and officials say it takes all of 15 seconds.
GRIFFIN: It could be make or break. Just over six hours to go, the stage set for tonight's crucial first presidential debate. Democratic contender John Kerry spent part of the day getting familiar with the venue at the University of Miami. The man who wants to keep the job of president was look presidential, meeting with some of the victims of Hurricane Jeanne.
For some idea of what we can expect tonight, let's go to CNN "CROSSFIRE" co-hosts Paul Begala and Robert Novak at the University of Miami. Gentlemen, thank you for joining us.
This is on foreign policy or international relations tonight, and we can't overlook the terrible tragedy that has gone on in Iraq today, especially among these children who have died in yet again another terrible attack there.
Paul, John Kerry building his campaign in the last couple of weeks about the failures in Iraq. Do you advise him to bring up this very tragic day?
PAUL BEGALA, CO-HOST, "CROSSFIRE": Well, I think there's no way to avoid it. I'm sure Jim Lehrer, the moderator of the debate, will raise it. And it raises the question of why, in the face of all of these deaths, the president continues to tell us we're making progress.
I think that's the heart of Kerry's critique on President Bush. It's no longer whether we should have gone to war last year, it is why he's not leveling with us today. Kerry is likely to tell the audience that the president is denying the reality on the ground in Iraq and has no plan to get us out.
GRIFFIN: Bob, how do you tell the America people, with 35 children dead, that we're on the right path in Iraq?
ROBERT NOVAK, CO-HOST, "CROSSFIRE": I think the problem is that to say we're really having a terrible time and we're not doing very well is not very good either.
You know, the little joke that everybody used to tell about John Kerry walks into a bar and other bartender says, "Why the long face senator?" And that is the problem with it, he looks sour, he looks mean, he looks unhappy, and that isn't what the American people want. They want a happy warrior. They want a Ronald Reagan. They want a Franklin Roosevelt.
And so, the problem in bringing this up saying whoa is me, whoa is me, little children are dying, it is not a positive message, particularly when there isn't a clear plan for avoiding it.
GRIFFIN: Bob, let's stick with you. I want to talk about the spin, which has become so important in the last rounds of debates. We've seen it used to actually decide the debate after the debate takes place. Who picks the spinners?
NOVAK: The spinners are picked by the campaign, and they ask people: Will you come in? They asked John McCain will you come and spin this debate? They asked -- is Robert Rubin going to be here, do you know? I think he is one of the spinners.
They asked the most distinguished people and credible people they want. They don't want the same old hacks there who probably can't even get their names in the paper.
The spinning is something that's absolutely new, because the first debates in 1960, which were the first presidential debates, were all held in a TV studio. There's no spinners. There was no audience. It was entirely up to the American people. But now spinning is a -- is an art form and a small cottage industry.
GRIFFIN: Paul, Al Gore basically lost that 2000 debate after the fact when the spinners pointed out how many times he sighed. This is very important.
BEGALA: It is, but it's also really fatuous. It's juvenile. It's infantile. And with the country at war, I mean, can you imagine that four years ago we actually did decide a debate on Al Gore's respiratory patterns?
You know, I hope that our colleagues in the media, who wear makeup for a living, will not be judging John Kerry's makeup or George Bush's breathing patterns, but instead recognize, as you started off this interview with, that we have men dying every day in Iraq, dying because President Bush's policies in Iraq.
Now, maybe we're on the right track like the president says. Maybe we need a new direction like John Kerry says But I hope that those of us in the media who are commenting on this don't sit there and analyze, you know, how many beads of sweat are on the president's brow, but rather what his plan is to get us out of this mess.
GRIFFIN: But Paul...
NOVAK: I disagree with that. When I watched the debate -- that first debate last year, I said immediately he was sighing and didn't need anybody to spin me on that. And that isn't something that the American people wanted in person. He looks funny.
The thing that bothers me is that a lot of our colleagues who don't know what to think about the debate until they take a check of all the spinners pro and con, I think they ought to take, if they're experienced reporter, take a look at it themselves and make a judgment both substance and style.
GRIFFIN: Paul, these are TV debates...
BEGALA: Well, of course not everybody is as cool as Novak. That's the problem. There will be air conditioning in the -- but it's about 100 degrees out here, and here's Novak in a three-piece suit. We can't expect...
GRIFFIN: Paul, I can't let you -- I can't let you...
BEGALA: ... not nearly as cool as Novak.
NOVAK: I'm not sweating either.
GRIFFIN: I can't let you...
BEGALA: And not a drop of sweat on him, I'm telling you.
GRIFFIN: Paul, is...
BEGALA: He's a machine.
GRIFFIN: ... Kerry going to be brief tonight, Paul? Is he going to be concise in this TV debate?
BEGALA: If he's not, he's going to look awfully goofy, because there's going to be a light that comes on.
You know, his preparation in this is 20 years in the Senate where they invented the filibuster, where they talk without end. The president actually comes in much better prepared, because his experience for the last four years has been in little exchanges with journalists, where they ask a question, he ignores it, and they don't follow up, which is exactly what's going to happen tonight.
NOVAK: But you know, the interesting thing is I'm told that the Kerry people at the last minute are objecting to the lights going on. That's not a good sign. That means they're worried about their man going over and looking bad in front of the American people and saying, "I just have a couple of other things I want to get in on this subject."
So, I think that's going to be interesting to see if there's a serious problem at last minute that they don't want the lights on. I know the Bush people are going to insist we made a deal that the lights go on after two minutes, and we're not going to back off of that deal.
GRIFFIN: All right, gentlemen. A cool Robert Novak, apparently hot Paul Begala taking his jacket off -- we thank you both, and we'll look for you guys after the show tonight, after the debate tonight.
BEGALA: Thanks, Drew.
NOVAK: Thanks, Drew.
GRIFFIN: At least there's one issue not up for debate, CNN is your place for full coverage. Join Anderson Cooper, Paula Zahn, Wolf Blitzer, and CNN's election team as they kick off our primetime coverage. It's tonight at 7:00 Eastern.
PHILLIPS: Also today in Florida, rivers swollen by hurricane rain jumped their banks in several areas. And the National Guard was mobilized to help people evacuate. The four big storms since August have affected different people in different ways -- that includes their mental outlook.
CNN's Susan Candiotti reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So, the sweater is borrowed? Your T-shirt? KRISTINA GRIFFIN, HURRICANE VICTIM: We got it -- I got it from Red Cross...
CANDIOTTI (voice-over): Kristina Griffin is a single mom, only 21 with two mouths to feed. Robert turned one the day Jeanne struck; Mystica is two. Frances damaged their rental apartment. Jeanne destroyed it when a ceiling caved in.
GRIFFIN: All my clothes, all the furniture I had left, TV, radio, everything.
CANDIOTTI: The young mother is a poster child for post-hurricane anxiety.
GRIFFIN: ... for them. And they don't know what's going on, so I'm stressed out which makes them more stressed out.
CANDIOTTI: Griffin's undergoing counseling from the Red Cross. Post-traumatic stress is as common as Florida hurricanes this season. Mental health experts report a surge in domestic violence calls, marital problems, drug and alcohol abuse.
SAMANTHA DOWDALL, MENTAL HEALTH EXPERT: A lot of them will say, "I'm perfectly fine. I'm fine, I'm fine." And they're not seeking the help that they need. And then, the tension builds, and then they break.
CANDIOTTI: Some of the tension comes from lacking basic necessities, having to rely on handouts.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are some people that get upset, some people that are just happy to see us out here.
CANDIOTTI: Joseph and Kimberly Stubblefied getting emergency supplies, hoping FEMA will come through on temporary housing to replace their mobile home.
KIMBERLY STUBBLEFIED, HURRICANE VICTIM: I can get all bent out of shape, I guess. We're really just staying together and praying together and keeping positive outlook.
CANDIOTTI: Good for them, but experts say victims shouldn't be afraid to ask for help if the going gets tough. It's what Kristina Griffin is finding out.
GRIFFIN: You have to kind of know that everything is going to work out some way.
CANDIOTTI: A positive attitude after surviving disaster.
Susan Candiotti, CNN, West Palm Beach, Florida.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIPS: Countdown to eruption: The ominous rumblings at Mount St. Helens and what the experts are saying is likely to happen. Also, a blinding laser beam burns a pilot as he tries to land his plane. What investigators think is behind the attack?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LINDA KAPLAN THALER, ADVERTISING EXECUTIVE: Kerry need to do more with his body language, a smile -- more smiles, actually. Lose the tan, OK? If you are going to be president, you don't have time to get a tan.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: What the candidates need to do to connect with viewers and voters. I guess it's not tanning or fake and bake. Madison Avenue experts weigh in on what's best.
ANNOUNCER: You're watching LIVE FROM on CNN, the most trusted name in news.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRIFFIN: Scientists warning Mount St. Helens could blow again any time, but it won't be anything, they say, like that devastating eruption in 1980.
CNN's Kimberly Osias is keeping watch and hoping they're right, Kimberly, near the mountain.
KIMBERLY OSIAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: How are you, Drew? Good to see you.
Well, I'll tell you, it is very exciting. There's a buzz in the air. The choppers are up ahead, much like a Hollywood movie set. But unlike a Hollywood movie set, we don't know when or if Mount St. Helens will blow, because this, of course, is very real, reminding us that the earth is a living organism, geologically speaking, and there's definitely some rumblings. Why? We don't exactly know.
But the area of concern is behind me. It is the dome area. The crater's dome behind me, it is 925-foot high. Well, it has raised up just about four centimeters in the last 48 hours and expanded one centimeter. That has scientists a bit concerned.
Also, they are a bit concerned because of the volume that we're seeing of quakes -- one to 2,000 in the past week. Now, today, the quakes have actually gotten a little deeper. They're fairly shallow, but measuring about three to 3.3 on the Richter scale. Here's a listen to what scientists at the USGs had to say a little while earlier about the likelihood of an eruption.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CYNTHIA GARDNER, U.S. GEOLOGICAL SURVEY: To start off with, we are still in a volcanic advisory. That's an alert level two. That's the alert level that we were raised to yesterday. That is because we think that there is a -- at this point, about a 70 percent chance of a volcanic event somewhere within the next couple days to within a month.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
OSIAS: And in the meantime, we are all just watching and waiting. In fact, it's been quite a boon to tourists. There are a number of people here taking a lot of pictures and waiting for the show -- Drew?
GRIFFIN: All right, Kimberly. Thanks a lot for that report.
PHILLIPS: Airline safety officials investigating an injury suffered last week by a pilot on final approach for landing. It happened in Salt Lake City, and we have this report now from Susan Wood of CNN affiliate KTVX.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SUSAN WOOD, REPORTER, KTVX (voice-over): A lot of people are trying to figure how someone could shoot a laser beam straight into the eye of a pilot of a 737.
CLAUS HAUER, FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR: It's very difficult to do it from below, because you know, the fuselage of the aircraft would cover that. So, you'd have to do it obviously from the angles that the pilot has vision out the windows.
WOOD (on camera): The light shot right into the retina of the pilot. The plane was about five miles out from the airport when the laser illuminated the cockpit. Fortunately, the pilot was able to land.
EARL MORRIS, TSA FEDERAL SECURITY DIRECTOR: We have nothing to indicate that this is any act of terrorism.
WOOD (voice-over): Investigators for the Transportation Safety Administration say the beam did not originate from within the cockpit, but there are very few vantage points that could provide a direct angle.
HAUER: Five miles out, they would probably be even with the Oquirrhs -- the Oquirrh Mountains -- or the Wasatch Mountains or something. You know, so you could be on a mountaintop about level with aircraft coming into Salt Lake.
WOOD: And there are lasers powerful enough to hit a plane from land. Several high level agencies are looking into this, including the FBI, the NTSB and the joint terrorism task force. But homeland security advisors say you should not let this case keep you from flying.
MORRIS: Should people be afraid by this particular incident? No, I don't believe so. I think it's premature to believe it's anything to that level that we would be afraid of.
(END VIDEOTAPE) PHILLIPS: That report from Susan Wood of KTVX. And incidentally, the Delta Airlines pilot is expected to recover from that injury.
GRIFFIN: Style versus substance could be key to tonight's debate. What advice some experts from Madison Avenue are offering for each candidate to seal the deal with the voters. That story after a break.
Also, a new report on how the Pentagon does business involving billions of dollars in no-bid contracts.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: Live pictures now from the University of Miami, where of course, that first debate will take place tonight. Our coverage begins at 7:00 p.m. It looks beautiful, but I'm told 90 degrees, and Bob Novak is in a three piece suit. I don't get it.
Well, convincing voters to choose your candidate, it's unlike convincing shoppers to buy your soapflakes, create a brand, pitch up a winning image and throw it out there. Whether it might be too coarse an analogy for a presidential election but Madison Avenue looks at it that way anyway. National correspondent Kelly Wallace has that.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He's out of touch.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: My opponent has had seven or eight different positions.
KELLY WALLACE, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Think of President Bush and Senator Kerry as two brands vying to become number one.
LINDA KAPLAN THALER, ADVERTISING EXECUTIVE: Brand Kerry and brand Bush.
WALLACE: And right now, according to these Madison Avenue image makers.
JOSH ROGERS, ADVERTISING EXECUTIVE: Senator John Kerry, I think, has done less of a good job in terms of communicating.
WALLACE: So their first tip for the Bostonian, make an impression.
THALER: He has to have some great one-liners, he has to have water cooler talk for the next day.
ROGERS: Something people will talk about days on end afterward.
WALLACE: Like this memorable moment in 1984.
RONALD REAGAN, FMR. PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I am not going to exploit for political purposes my opponent's youth and inexperience.
WALLACE: Tip number two for both men, don't let them see you sweat, literally.
ROGERS: Do not sigh, obviously.
BUSH: There's differences...
WALLACE: A la Al Gore in 2000, think more of Bill Clinton's ease in 1992.
THALER: Kerry needs to do more with his body language. A smile, more smiles, actually. Lose the tan, OK? If you're going to be president, you don't have time to get a tan.
WALLACE: And finally, lighten up.
THALER: You know, these are tough times. But we want Marcus Welby, we want somebody to tell us, it's going to be OK.
WALLACE: For Mr. Bush, the main advice, don't muddy the brand and...
THALER: Do not lose your temper.
WALLACE: The senator's challenge, bolstering brand Kerry with men.
ROGERS: Most males look at a candidate in terms of who they would like to have a beer with.
WALLACE: And with women.
THALER: Whoever does a better job convincing the American public, that's the brand I want, that's who's going to win.
WALLACE: And tonight's debate expected to get the largest ratings of the three presidential showdowns which advertising executives say makes it one of the most important image making moments of the campaign. Kelly Wallace, CNN, Coral Gables, Florida.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIPS: And you can join our Kelly Wallace and the rest of the team this evening. 7:00 sharp, in case we haven't told you enough, Eastern Time. That's when CNN's complete prime-time coverage of debate number begins. 7:00 p.m. Eastern Time only on CNN.
GRIFFIN: Got it.
A new report calls the Pentagon's policies of awarding contracts unfair. Rhonda Schaffler is at the New York Stock Exchange with a look at that report -- Rhonda.
RHONDA SCHAFFLER, CNN SR. BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: We're talking about a lot of money here, more than 40 percent of the Pentagon's business, a total of $362 billion over the last six years has been awarded without going through a competitive bidding process. This is according to the nonpartisan group Center for Public Integrity. Most of these awards were given to the biggest defense contractors. The report said Lockheed Martin received the most Pentagon business when there was no competitive bidding. Seventy-four percent of that company's contracts over the last six years were won without competition. The report said industry consolidation is a big factor in the top heavy group of contractors. Over the past six years, more than 50 contractors have been acquired by larger competitors. The Pentagon says it's not read the report yet, and for now has no comment -- Drew.
GRIFFIN: Rhonda, the Vioxx news this morning really hit the market hard. Any bounceback as of late?
SCHAFFLER: Not yet, not for Merck at least and not for the Dow. That's why the Dow is still off, as investors sell Merck on this decision to pull the blockbuster drug Vioxx from the market, a worldwide pulling of that drug. Shares of Merck are plunging more than $12 because Merck is part of the Dow 30. The Dow is off 48 points. The Nasdaq fares better, it's up one quarter of a percent. That's the latest from Wall Street. Kyra, Drew, back to you.
GRIFFIN: Rhonda, thank you, and that will wrap it up for this Thursday edition of LIVE FROM.
PHILLIPS: And it will take us to the next hour of political headlines, "JUDY WOODRUFF'S INSIDE POLITICS.: Hi, Judy.
JUDY WOODRUFF, HOST, "JUDY WOODRUFF'S INSIDE POLITICS": Hi, Kyra, Hi, drew, thank you, both. I am here in sunny Florida. We are just hours away from the start of the first presidential debate. We'll preview what the candidates are doing to get ready for what could be one of the most important nights of their political lives.
Plus how will the search for the world's most wanted man affect the race for the White House? We'll take a look at the hunt for Osama bin Laden. "INSIDE POLITICS" begins in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRIFFIN: In the news right now, more chairs tumbling after the drug company pulls Vioxx off the market. Clinical trials linking the popular arthritis drug increased with increased risk of heart attack and stroke (UNINTELLIGIBLE) accounting for about 10 percent of Merck's yearly sales used by two million people worldwide.
A deadly day in Baghdad. Most of the victims children. A series of car bombs exploding throughout the capital, killing more than 40 people, 34 of those were children, dozens wounded, the most deadly blast came as candy was being handed out to kids attending a ceremony at a new sewage treatment plant.
Watching Mount St. Helens. Scientists warn the volcano could erupt at any time. The mountain has been rumbling intensely and scientists predict there could be a small or moderate eruption, nothing though like the one in 1980 that killed 57 people. Mount St. Helens in southwest Washington state.
Now "JUDY WOODRUFF'S INSIDE POLITICS."
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Ready to rumble. George Bush and John Kerry are just hours away from round one of their debate series.
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We're going to have an opportunity to talk about the issues important to all Americans.
ANNOUNCER: Before the presidential candidates go head to head, two of their campaign top guns will give us a sense of what to expect tonight.
The hunt for bin Laden. We'll follow on a search that's likely to be a major topic of the debate.
Now live from the University of Miami, site of the first presidential debate, JUDY WOODRUFF'S INSIDE POLITICS.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired September 30, 2004 - 14:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DREW GRIFFIN, CNN ANCHOR: And welcome back. From the CNN Center in Atlanta, this is LIVE FROM. I'm Drew Griffin.
PHILLIPS: And I'm Kyra Phillips. Here's what's all new this half hour.
Just hours away from the first presidential debate. We put the candidates in the "CROSSFIRE." Paul Begala and Bob Novak give us their take on what it will take to come away a winner.
And a bizarre case, a pilot hit in the eye by a laser beam. An investigation underway.
GRIFFIN: Sometimes in Florida, rebuilding from one storm only to be hit by another and yet another -- inside what's being done to help people cope with the damage you don't see right away.
First, here's what's happening right now in the news.
PHILLIPS: Off the market: The arthritis drug Vioxx is no longer for sale. Its manufacturer, Merck & Company, has voluntarily pulled it from the shelves. A recent clinical trial showed Vioxx raised the risk of heart attack and stroke.
A new trial for Terri Schiavo, that's what her parents are seeking this hour in a Florida courtroom. The brain damaged woman has been at the center of a right-to-die dispute for the past 14 years. At issue: whether Schiavo, who left no written will, would choose to have her feeding tube removed.
Freedom delayed: A snag has developed in the deal returning Yaser Hamdi to Saudi Arabia. Under the terms, Hamdi must renounce his U.S. citizenship, avoid any contact with terrorist groups, and stay in Saudi Arabia for five years. Saudi Arabia calls it unenforceable and wants Hamdi released without condition.
Smile when you enter this country: All visitors from Europe and elsewhere now have to be photographed and fingerprinted before they can pass through customs. It's part of a heightened effort to secure America's borders, and officials say it takes all of 15 seconds.
GRIFFIN: It could be make or break. Just over six hours to go, the stage set for tonight's crucial first presidential debate. Democratic contender John Kerry spent part of the day getting familiar with the venue at the University of Miami. The man who wants to keep the job of president was look presidential, meeting with some of the victims of Hurricane Jeanne.
For some idea of what we can expect tonight, let's go to CNN "CROSSFIRE" co-hosts Paul Begala and Robert Novak at the University of Miami. Gentlemen, thank you for joining us.
This is on foreign policy or international relations tonight, and we can't overlook the terrible tragedy that has gone on in Iraq today, especially among these children who have died in yet again another terrible attack there.
Paul, John Kerry building his campaign in the last couple of weeks about the failures in Iraq. Do you advise him to bring up this very tragic day?
PAUL BEGALA, CO-HOST, "CROSSFIRE": Well, I think there's no way to avoid it. I'm sure Jim Lehrer, the moderator of the debate, will raise it. And it raises the question of why, in the face of all of these deaths, the president continues to tell us we're making progress.
I think that's the heart of Kerry's critique on President Bush. It's no longer whether we should have gone to war last year, it is why he's not leveling with us today. Kerry is likely to tell the audience that the president is denying the reality on the ground in Iraq and has no plan to get us out.
GRIFFIN: Bob, how do you tell the America people, with 35 children dead, that we're on the right path in Iraq?
ROBERT NOVAK, CO-HOST, "CROSSFIRE": I think the problem is that to say we're really having a terrible time and we're not doing very well is not very good either.
You know, the little joke that everybody used to tell about John Kerry walks into a bar and other bartender says, "Why the long face senator?" And that is the problem with it, he looks sour, he looks mean, he looks unhappy, and that isn't what the American people want. They want a happy warrior. They want a Ronald Reagan. They want a Franklin Roosevelt.
And so, the problem in bringing this up saying whoa is me, whoa is me, little children are dying, it is not a positive message, particularly when there isn't a clear plan for avoiding it.
GRIFFIN: Bob, let's stick with you. I want to talk about the spin, which has become so important in the last rounds of debates. We've seen it used to actually decide the debate after the debate takes place. Who picks the spinners?
NOVAK: The spinners are picked by the campaign, and they ask people: Will you come in? They asked John McCain will you come and spin this debate? They asked -- is Robert Rubin going to be here, do you know? I think he is one of the spinners.
They asked the most distinguished people and credible people they want. They don't want the same old hacks there who probably can't even get their names in the paper.
The spinning is something that's absolutely new, because the first debates in 1960, which were the first presidential debates, were all held in a TV studio. There's no spinners. There was no audience. It was entirely up to the American people. But now spinning is a -- is an art form and a small cottage industry.
GRIFFIN: Paul, Al Gore basically lost that 2000 debate after the fact when the spinners pointed out how many times he sighed. This is very important.
BEGALA: It is, but it's also really fatuous. It's juvenile. It's infantile. And with the country at war, I mean, can you imagine that four years ago we actually did decide a debate on Al Gore's respiratory patterns?
You know, I hope that our colleagues in the media, who wear makeup for a living, will not be judging John Kerry's makeup or George Bush's breathing patterns, but instead recognize, as you started off this interview with, that we have men dying every day in Iraq, dying because President Bush's policies in Iraq.
Now, maybe we're on the right track like the president says. Maybe we need a new direction like John Kerry says But I hope that those of us in the media who are commenting on this don't sit there and analyze, you know, how many beads of sweat are on the president's brow, but rather what his plan is to get us out of this mess.
GRIFFIN: But Paul...
NOVAK: I disagree with that. When I watched the debate -- that first debate last year, I said immediately he was sighing and didn't need anybody to spin me on that. And that isn't something that the American people wanted in person. He looks funny.
The thing that bothers me is that a lot of our colleagues who don't know what to think about the debate until they take a check of all the spinners pro and con, I think they ought to take, if they're experienced reporter, take a look at it themselves and make a judgment both substance and style.
GRIFFIN: Paul, these are TV debates...
BEGALA: Well, of course not everybody is as cool as Novak. That's the problem. There will be air conditioning in the -- but it's about 100 degrees out here, and here's Novak in a three-piece suit. We can't expect...
GRIFFIN: Paul, I can't let you -- I can't let you...
BEGALA: ... not nearly as cool as Novak.
NOVAK: I'm not sweating either.
GRIFFIN: I can't let you...
BEGALA: And not a drop of sweat on him, I'm telling you.
GRIFFIN: Paul, is...
BEGALA: He's a machine.
GRIFFIN: ... Kerry going to be brief tonight, Paul? Is he going to be concise in this TV debate?
BEGALA: If he's not, he's going to look awfully goofy, because there's going to be a light that comes on.
You know, his preparation in this is 20 years in the Senate where they invented the filibuster, where they talk without end. The president actually comes in much better prepared, because his experience for the last four years has been in little exchanges with journalists, where they ask a question, he ignores it, and they don't follow up, which is exactly what's going to happen tonight.
NOVAK: But you know, the interesting thing is I'm told that the Kerry people at the last minute are objecting to the lights going on. That's not a good sign. That means they're worried about their man going over and looking bad in front of the American people and saying, "I just have a couple of other things I want to get in on this subject."
So, I think that's going to be interesting to see if there's a serious problem at last minute that they don't want the lights on. I know the Bush people are going to insist we made a deal that the lights go on after two minutes, and we're not going to back off of that deal.
GRIFFIN: All right, gentlemen. A cool Robert Novak, apparently hot Paul Begala taking his jacket off -- we thank you both, and we'll look for you guys after the show tonight, after the debate tonight.
BEGALA: Thanks, Drew.
NOVAK: Thanks, Drew.
GRIFFIN: At least there's one issue not up for debate, CNN is your place for full coverage. Join Anderson Cooper, Paula Zahn, Wolf Blitzer, and CNN's election team as they kick off our primetime coverage. It's tonight at 7:00 Eastern.
PHILLIPS: Also today in Florida, rivers swollen by hurricane rain jumped their banks in several areas. And the National Guard was mobilized to help people evacuate. The four big storms since August have affected different people in different ways -- that includes their mental outlook.
CNN's Susan Candiotti reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So, the sweater is borrowed? Your T-shirt? KRISTINA GRIFFIN, HURRICANE VICTIM: We got it -- I got it from Red Cross...
CANDIOTTI (voice-over): Kristina Griffin is a single mom, only 21 with two mouths to feed. Robert turned one the day Jeanne struck; Mystica is two. Frances damaged their rental apartment. Jeanne destroyed it when a ceiling caved in.
GRIFFIN: All my clothes, all the furniture I had left, TV, radio, everything.
CANDIOTTI: The young mother is a poster child for post-hurricane anxiety.
GRIFFIN: ... for them. And they don't know what's going on, so I'm stressed out which makes them more stressed out.
CANDIOTTI: Griffin's undergoing counseling from the Red Cross. Post-traumatic stress is as common as Florida hurricanes this season. Mental health experts report a surge in domestic violence calls, marital problems, drug and alcohol abuse.
SAMANTHA DOWDALL, MENTAL HEALTH EXPERT: A lot of them will say, "I'm perfectly fine. I'm fine, I'm fine." And they're not seeking the help that they need. And then, the tension builds, and then they break.
CANDIOTTI: Some of the tension comes from lacking basic necessities, having to rely on handouts.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are some people that get upset, some people that are just happy to see us out here.
CANDIOTTI: Joseph and Kimberly Stubblefied getting emergency supplies, hoping FEMA will come through on temporary housing to replace their mobile home.
KIMBERLY STUBBLEFIED, HURRICANE VICTIM: I can get all bent out of shape, I guess. We're really just staying together and praying together and keeping positive outlook.
CANDIOTTI: Good for them, but experts say victims shouldn't be afraid to ask for help if the going gets tough. It's what Kristina Griffin is finding out.
GRIFFIN: You have to kind of know that everything is going to work out some way.
CANDIOTTI: A positive attitude after surviving disaster.
Susan Candiotti, CNN, West Palm Beach, Florida.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIPS: Countdown to eruption: The ominous rumblings at Mount St. Helens and what the experts are saying is likely to happen. Also, a blinding laser beam burns a pilot as he tries to land his plane. What investigators think is behind the attack?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LINDA KAPLAN THALER, ADVERTISING EXECUTIVE: Kerry need to do more with his body language, a smile -- more smiles, actually. Lose the tan, OK? If you are going to be president, you don't have time to get a tan.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: What the candidates need to do to connect with viewers and voters. I guess it's not tanning or fake and bake. Madison Avenue experts weigh in on what's best.
ANNOUNCER: You're watching LIVE FROM on CNN, the most trusted name in news.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRIFFIN: Scientists warning Mount St. Helens could blow again any time, but it won't be anything, they say, like that devastating eruption in 1980.
CNN's Kimberly Osias is keeping watch and hoping they're right, Kimberly, near the mountain.
KIMBERLY OSIAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: How are you, Drew? Good to see you.
Well, I'll tell you, it is very exciting. There's a buzz in the air. The choppers are up ahead, much like a Hollywood movie set. But unlike a Hollywood movie set, we don't know when or if Mount St. Helens will blow, because this, of course, is very real, reminding us that the earth is a living organism, geologically speaking, and there's definitely some rumblings. Why? We don't exactly know.
But the area of concern is behind me. It is the dome area. The crater's dome behind me, it is 925-foot high. Well, it has raised up just about four centimeters in the last 48 hours and expanded one centimeter. That has scientists a bit concerned.
Also, they are a bit concerned because of the volume that we're seeing of quakes -- one to 2,000 in the past week. Now, today, the quakes have actually gotten a little deeper. They're fairly shallow, but measuring about three to 3.3 on the Richter scale. Here's a listen to what scientists at the USGs had to say a little while earlier about the likelihood of an eruption.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CYNTHIA GARDNER, U.S. GEOLOGICAL SURVEY: To start off with, we are still in a volcanic advisory. That's an alert level two. That's the alert level that we were raised to yesterday. That is because we think that there is a -- at this point, about a 70 percent chance of a volcanic event somewhere within the next couple days to within a month.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
OSIAS: And in the meantime, we are all just watching and waiting. In fact, it's been quite a boon to tourists. There are a number of people here taking a lot of pictures and waiting for the show -- Drew?
GRIFFIN: All right, Kimberly. Thanks a lot for that report.
PHILLIPS: Airline safety officials investigating an injury suffered last week by a pilot on final approach for landing. It happened in Salt Lake City, and we have this report now from Susan Wood of CNN affiliate KTVX.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SUSAN WOOD, REPORTER, KTVX (voice-over): A lot of people are trying to figure how someone could shoot a laser beam straight into the eye of a pilot of a 737.
CLAUS HAUER, FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR: It's very difficult to do it from below, because you know, the fuselage of the aircraft would cover that. So, you'd have to do it obviously from the angles that the pilot has vision out the windows.
WOOD (on camera): The light shot right into the retina of the pilot. The plane was about five miles out from the airport when the laser illuminated the cockpit. Fortunately, the pilot was able to land.
EARL MORRIS, TSA FEDERAL SECURITY DIRECTOR: We have nothing to indicate that this is any act of terrorism.
WOOD (voice-over): Investigators for the Transportation Safety Administration say the beam did not originate from within the cockpit, but there are very few vantage points that could provide a direct angle.
HAUER: Five miles out, they would probably be even with the Oquirrhs -- the Oquirrh Mountains -- or the Wasatch Mountains or something. You know, so you could be on a mountaintop about level with aircraft coming into Salt Lake.
WOOD: And there are lasers powerful enough to hit a plane from land. Several high level agencies are looking into this, including the FBI, the NTSB and the joint terrorism task force. But homeland security advisors say you should not let this case keep you from flying.
MORRIS: Should people be afraid by this particular incident? No, I don't believe so. I think it's premature to believe it's anything to that level that we would be afraid of.
(END VIDEOTAPE) PHILLIPS: That report from Susan Wood of KTVX. And incidentally, the Delta Airlines pilot is expected to recover from that injury.
GRIFFIN: Style versus substance could be key to tonight's debate. What advice some experts from Madison Avenue are offering for each candidate to seal the deal with the voters. That story after a break.
Also, a new report on how the Pentagon does business involving billions of dollars in no-bid contracts.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: Live pictures now from the University of Miami, where of course, that first debate will take place tonight. Our coverage begins at 7:00 p.m. It looks beautiful, but I'm told 90 degrees, and Bob Novak is in a three piece suit. I don't get it.
Well, convincing voters to choose your candidate, it's unlike convincing shoppers to buy your soapflakes, create a brand, pitch up a winning image and throw it out there. Whether it might be too coarse an analogy for a presidential election but Madison Avenue looks at it that way anyway. National correspondent Kelly Wallace has that.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He's out of touch.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: My opponent has had seven or eight different positions.
KELLY WALLACE, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Think of President Bush and Senator Kerry as two brands vying to become number one.
LINDA KAPLAN THALER, ADVERTISING EXECUTIVE: Brand Kerry and brand Bush.
WALLACE: And right now, according to these Madison Avenue image makers.
JOSH ROGERS, ADVERTISING EXECUTIVE: Senator John Kerry, I think, has done less of a good job in terms of communicating.
WALLACE: So their first tip for the Bostonian, make an impression.
THALER: He has to have some great one-liners, he has to have water cooler talk for the next day.
ROGERS: Something people will talk about days on end afterward.
WALLACE: Like this memorable moment in 1984.
RONALD REAGAN, FMR. PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I am not going to exploit for political purposes my opponent's youth and inexperience.
WALLACE: Tip number two for both men, don't let them see you sweat, literally.
ROGERS: Do not sigh, obviously.
BUSH: There's differences...
WALLACE: A la Al Gore in 2000, think more of Bill Clinton's ease in 1992.
THALER: Kerry needs to do more with his body language. A smile, more smiles, actually. Lose the tan, OK? If you're going to be president, you don't have time to get a tan.
WALLACE: And finally, lighten up.
THALER: You know, these are tough times. But we want Marcus Welby, we want somebody to tell us, it's going to be OK.
WALLACE: For Mr. Bush, the main advice, don't muddy the brand and...
THALER: Do not lose your temper.
WALLACE: The senator's challenge, bolstering brand Kerry with men.
ROGERS: Most males look at a candidate in terms of who they would like to have a beer with.
WALLACE: And with women.
THALER: Whoever does a better job convincing the American public, that's the brand I want, that's who's going to win.
WALLACE: And tonight's debate expected to get the largest ratings of the three presidential showdowns which advertising executives say makes it one of the most important image making moments of the campaign. Kelly Wallace, CNN, Coral Gables, Florida.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIPS: And you can join our Kelly Wallace and the rest of the team this evening. 7:00 sharp, in case we haven't told you enough, Eastern Time. That's when CNN's complete prime-time coverage of debate number begins. 7:00 p.m. Eastern Time only on CNN.
GRIFFIN: Got it.
A new report calls the Pentagon's policies of awarding contracts unfair. Rhonda Schaffler is at the New York Stock Exchange with a look at that report -- Rhonda.
RHONDA SCHAFFLER, CNN SR. BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: We're talking about a lot of money here, more than 40 percent of the Pentagon's business, a total of $362 billion over the last six years has been awarded without going through a competitive bidding process. This is according to the nonpartisan group Center for Public Integrity. Most of these awards were given to the biggest defense contractors. The report said Lockheed Martin received the most Pentagon business when there was no competitive bidding. Seventy-four percent of that company's contracts over the last six years were won without competition. The report said industry consolidation is a big factor in the top heavy group of contractors. Over the past six years, more than 50 contractors have been acquired by larger competitors. The Pentagon says it's not read the report yet, and for now has no comment -- Drew.
GRIFFIN: Rhonda, the Vioxx news this morning really hit the market hard. Any bounceback as of late?
SCHAFFLER: Not yet, not for Merck at least and not for the Dow. That's why the Dow is still off, as investors sell Merck on this decision to pull the blockbuster drug Vioxx from the market, a worldwide pulling of that drug. Shares of Merck are plunging more than $12 because Merck is part of the Dow 30. The Dow is off 48 points. The Nasdaq fares better, it's up one quarter of a percent. That's the latest from Wall Street. Kyra, Drew, back to you.
GRIFFIN: Rhonda, thank you, and that will wrap it up for this Thursday edition of LIVE FROM.
PHILLIPS: And it will take us to the next hour of political headlines, "JUDY WOODRUFF'S INSIDE POLITICS.: Hi, Judy.
JUDY WOODRUFF, HOST, "JUDY WOODRUFF'S INSIDE POLITICS": Hi, Kyra, Hi, drew, thank you, both. I am here in sunny Florida. We are just hours away from the start of the first presidential debate. We'll preview what the candidates are doing to get ready for what could be one of the most important nights of their political lives.
Plus how will the search for the world's most wanted man affect the race for the White House? We'll take a look at the hunt for Osama bin Laden. "INSIDE POLITICS" begins in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRIFFIN: In the news right now, more chairs tumbling after the drug company pulls Vioxx off the market. Clinical trials linking the popular arthritis drug increased with increased risk of heart attack and stroke (UNINTELLIGIBLE) accounting for about 10 percent of Merck's yearly sales used by two million people worldwide.
A deadly day in Baghdad. Most of the victims children. A series of car bombs exploding throughout the capital, killing more than 40 people, 34 of those were children, dozens wounded, the most deadly blast came as candy was being handed out to kids attending a ceremony at a new sewage treatment plant.
Watching Mount St. Helens. Scientists warn the volcano could erupt at any time. The mountain has been rumbling intensely and scientists predict there could be a small or moderate eruption, nothing though like the one in 1980 that killed 57 people. Mount St. Helens in southwest Washington state.
Now "JUDY WOODRUFF'S INSIDE POLITICS."
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Ready to rumble. George Bush and John Kerry are just hours away from round one of their debate series.
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We're going to have an opportunity to talk about the issues important to all Americans.
ANNOUNCER: Before the presidential candidates go head to head, two of their campaign top guns will give us a sense of what to expect tonight.
The hunt for bin Laden. We'll follow on a search that's likely to be a major topic of the debate.
Now live from the University of Miami, site of the first presidential debate, JUDY WOODRUFF'S INSIDE POLITICS.
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