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Stalled Intelligence Reform Bill; Anchor Away: Rather to Retire from 'CBS Evening News'
Aired November 23, 2004 - 13:59 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Live this hour, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld briefing the Pentagon. We're going to take you there as soon as it happens.
Intelligence reform, will it become a casualty of Capitol Hill politics? We're in-depth on the future of legislation aimed at preventing terror attacks against you.
And a big announcement from CBS. Anchorman Dan Rather is stepping down.
From the CNN Center in Atlanta, I'm Kyra Phillips. Miles is off. This hour of CNN's LIVE FROM starts right now.
We start with Donald Rumsfeld and General Richard Myers. Those are some of the big names you're going to hear from at the Pentagon later this hour. The secretary of defense and chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff are scheduled to hold a briefing in about 30 minutes. You can count on CNN to bring it to you live.
And one of the big issues that's sure to come up at the briefing is the fight over the stalled intelligence reform bill. We have reporters covering all angles of the story. CNN's Barbara Starr is at her post at the Pentagon, and our White House correspondent, Suzanne Malveaux, is in Crawford, Texas.
Barbara, let's start with you.
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kyra, when that briefing starts just about a half an hour from now, intelligence reform likely to be topic number one for both Secretary Rumsfeld and General Myers. Here's what's going on.
As you remember, over the weekend, the intelligence reform bill basically sunk on Capitol Hill over a controversy about whether to shift defense intelligence programs, satellites, communication, imagery analysis, take it all out of the Pentagon and shift it basically under the control of a national -- a national intelligence director. Now, that is something that several key members on Capitol Hill, they don't want to see that shift happen.
They want to keep it in the Pentagon. They believe it's essential to getting intelligence to the soldiers on the battlefield.
The chairman of the Joint Chiefs and the entire Joint Chiefs have now voiced their support. When asked by those key Republicans on Capitol Hill, they are voicing their support for the status quo, not the intelligence reform bill backed by the White House.
The chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff was asked by Congressman Duncan Hunter, the chairman of the House Armed Services Committee. So were all of the joint chiefs, and they all said that they believe it's best right now to keep those defense intelligence programs right where they are under the control of the secretary of defense.
So this now places this in a very difficult political situation for Secretary Rumsfeld, for the White House in their dealings with Capitol Hill. It remains to be seen how all of this sorts out -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Barbara Starr, thank you so much.
And President Bush personally lobbied House Republicans over the weekend in support of that bill. He's now at his Texas ranch for the Thanksgiving holiday. And that's where we find CNN White House correspondent Suzanne Malveaux.
What's the word from there, Suzanne?
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Kyra, White House officials tell us that, of course, President Bush is going to be spending quiet time, some downtime with his family at the Crawford ranch for the Thanksgiving holiday. But as you know, of course, this is really a critical test, a critical challenge for the president for the first task of his second administration, whether or not he can really even push his own party to go forward and move forward the 9/11 intelligence reform.
Now, as you know, before President Bush got directly involved expending some of that political capital that he was talking -- talking about, reaching out to Congressman Sensenbrenner, as well as Duncan Hunter, we are told as well that Chief of Staff Andy Card, as well as the White House liaison, David Hobbs, both of them of course reaching out to the Republican leadership, making those calls.
It was just yesterday Vice President Dick Cheney also meeting with Sensenbrenner. But we are told that the president is not necessarily going to get directly involved at this point. They believe that with pressure on the Pentagon, pressure with the Republican leadership over the next two weeks, they can make this happen, they can turn this thing around. But make no mistake, Kyra that pressure is on.
PHILLIPS: Suzanne Malveaux, live from Crawford, Texas. Thanks.
And in Egypt, a summit concerning post-war Iraq has ended with a show of support for America's timetable on elections. Delegates, including Secretary of State Colin Powell, passed a formal statement supporting Iraq's sovereignty, faster reconstruction and democratic elections at the end of January of 2005. As for quelling the violence that could hamper elections, Powell told CNN chief international correspondent Christiane Amanpour that Iraqi forces are the key.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) COLIN POWELL, SECRETARY OF STATE: The solution to the problem of security ultimately are the Iraqi forces, police forces, border patrol forces, lines of communications, protection forces, and the army imposing order on the country. Also, bringing down the insurgency.
The insurgency I don't think can afford many more battles like Falluja. They lost a lot of people there and lost a lot of weapons.
We got into their command and control system. We know a lot more about this insurgency. So they are -- they're paying a price for their activity.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: Iraq is sure to come up during the Pentagon briefing later this hour. Just a reminder, CNN will bring that to you live as soon as it happens.
A shakeup in the world of broadcast news. Dan Rather announced today he's stepping down as anchor of the "CBS Evening News." CNN financial news correspondent Chris Huntington live outside the CBS Broadcast Center in New York with the latest.
What's the feel out there, Chris?
CHRIS HUNTINGTON, CNN FINANCIAL NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Well, the feel is -- we caught up with Andy Rooney a few minutes ago, and you'll hear from him in just a second. The feel is that this was not entirely unexpected.
You have to keep in mind that Dan Rather has had the anchor chair of the "CBS Evening News" for nearly 24 years. He's saying today that he will officially step down on March 9, 2005. That would make it an even 24 years in that position, longer even than Walter Cronkite held the post as chief anchor of "The CBS Report."
In a statement today, Rather said in part that "I have always said that I'd know when the time was right to step away from the anchor chair. This past summer, CBS and I began to discuss the matter in earnest and we decided that the close of the election cycle would be an appropriate time."
Now, as I mentioned, Andy Rooney came by a short bit ago. Here's what the sage, if you will, of CBS News had to say about the departure of Dan Rather.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDY ROONEY, "60 MINUTES CORRESPONDENT": Well, I think it's -- he's probably ready to do it. I think it's a good thing to do. He's about 15 years after Cronkite stepped down, that much older. So he's had a good run, and it's been great.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNTINGTON: Now, of course Dan Rather is no stranger to controversy. And most recently, the controversy swirling around a "60 Minutes" report put on the air September 8, calling into question President Bush's service in the Texas Air National Guard and particularly a document that was used in that report that CBS has now conceded it cannot vouch for the authenticity of that.
There's an investigation under way here at CBS. And I asked CBS News if that controversy played any role in Rather's decision to step down. CBS spokesman Gil Schwartz said Dan's decision was independent of the findings of the probe that is under way. I further pressed and said, "Well, what about the controversy in total (ph)?" And Schwartz said, "Look, we're all part of the big world here and everything has a bearing on every decision" -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: All right. Chris Huntington, thank you so much.
And Dan Rather symbolized CBS News for nearly a quarter of a century, like Chris said, and was known for his fierce competitiveness. Robbie Vorhaus is a former CBS News producer who worked with Rather -- Rather, rather -- a play on words there -- and he's joining us now by phone from Sag Harbor, New York.
Actually, I'm being told we're getting him on the line right now. Robbie actually produced for Dan Rather. They worked side by side for a number of years. He not only runs, Robbie, his own PR company that he recently sold -- OK, I'm being told that we're going to take a quick break and we will come back to him right after this.
Shall we read the tease too? All right.
We're going to talk about the 9/11 Commission also. It called for change in fighting terrorism and it called on Washington to make it happen. But now it's getting bogged down in Congress. We're going to look at the behind-the-scenes politics that could be getting in the way just ahead.
Also, we want to remind you we're waiting for that live briefing from the Pentagon in just about 15 minutes or so. We're going to bring that to you live as soon as it happens right here on CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: Just part of Dan Rather's quote today, "I've been lucky and blessed over these years to have what is to me the best job in the world." As you know, we've been talking about anchorman Dan Rather and how he has decided to step down from CBS News. Well, Robbie Vorhaus is a former CBS News producer who worked with Rather. He's joining us by phone now from Sag Harbor, New York.
Good to hear your voice, Robbie.
ROBBIE VORHAUS, FMR. CBS NEWS PRODUCER: Hey, Kyra. How are you? And almost Happy Thanksgiving.
PHILLIPS: There we go. We're close. It should be an interesting holiday for Dan Rather. I guess, first of all, I want to know if you're surprised that this happened now. VORHAUS: Well, no, I'm really not. I mean, after the "60 Minutes" event -- and, you know, Dan's 73 years old, and I think that Tom Brokaw stepping down, you know, Brian Williams is about to step in. Peter Jennings is part of that triumvirate. And I think that Dan's had an illustrious career.
And I think that so many people forget all the incredible things Dan has done. And this is the time for Dan to step down at the 24th anniversary of when he assumed the position from Walter Cronkite. And I think that Dan should be remembered by all of his incredible good work, and he's going to continue to stay on and do some great reporting for CBS.
PHILLIPS: Yes. It seems like his own -- his own job sort of is not doing the best at helping him right now. So let's step aside from the "60 Minutes" story and let's look back at the 20-plus years and what he's done and the impact that he's made.
You produced for him. What was he like, and what are some memorable stories that this country shouldn't forget despite what happened on "60 Minutes"?
VORHAUS: Well, I think that anyone who has worked for Dan Rather -- and there have been any number of wonderful journalists. Peggy Noonan, of course, went on to do incredible things in the White House and is now, you know, a leading author and a commentator. And again, many people who work for Dan Rather know that he is the gentleman's gentleman, he is the hardest working journalist in the business.
Here's a guy who, you know, started as -- you know, as a radio reporter and worked his way up to being a news director. And then, you know, here we are on the -- on the anniversary of President Kennedy's assassination, and that's when Dan made his career because he had the instincts to get to where he need to be and to report it fairly and accurately with incredible instinct.
So when you look at all the world leaders who Dan has interviewed, when you look at all of the things that Dan has done, I mean, here was a man who was in Bosnia twice. Here was a man who reported from Russia on the -- on all the changes there, the coming down of the wall in Berlin, you know, the incredible events that Dan Rather was in the middle of and always -- and usually first on the scene. I think that, you know, any journalist, whether or not they're starting their career or in the middle of their career, owes a lot to Dan Rather.
PHILLIPS: So we look at Dan Rather stepping down. Let's talk about sort of the change in the industry for a minute, style versus personality.
I mean, there was a time -- and I mentioned this to our analysts -- or our other journalists at the beginning of the hour -- that you tuned in for Dan Rather or Peter Jennings or Tom Brokaw. And now it's a very different beast, especially with 24/7 cable news taking place. So maybe this is a good time for him, seeming that it's going in a different direction, news is going in a different direction. VORHAUS: Yes, nobody -- nobody -- nobody comes home at night and says, you know, "Honey, give me that martini and I'm going to turn on Dan Rather and watch the news." I mean, we can -- we can so easily now gather information in the way that we want it, in the style that we want it, with, in fact, the slant that we want it.
I mean, there are different news organizations that will give us information whether or not they're from the left or from the right. You know, the African-American community has news-gathering organizations just for that type of news, if you want it.
There's Al-Jazeera for -- for that culture. There's Hispanic. There's French. You can turn on the -- any number of news sources and get news from around the world.
So I think that just having one news source and just having one favorite news person, that day is long gone. Now it's a question of style and substance and the belief of whether or not the organization is reporting the news fairly and accurately in the style and in the slant that you want it.
PHILLIPS: Former producer to Dan Rather and media strategist, Robbie Vorhaus. Thanks for your time today.
VORHAUS: It's a pleasure, Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Let's move forward and talk about sunny or soggy as you head in for your Thanksgiving feast. Let's get the forecast now from Jacqui Jeras in the CNN Weather Center.
Hi, Jacqui.
(WEATHER REPORT)
PHILLIPS: Jacqui Jeras, thanks so much.
Straight ahead, keeping an eye on O.J. Simpson, or at least his money. A new lawsuit brings up some old issues.
RHONDA SCHAFFLER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm Rhonda Schaffler at the New York Stock Exchange. The wealthiest Americans are on a roll. I'll tell you what they're spending their money on. Plus, we'll have a look at today's markets coming up. So don't go away.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: Well, 9/11 created a lot of changes, and you can imagine a number of those changes will be talked about at the Pentagon briefing today. We are expecting Donald Rumsfeld, secretary of defense, and General Richard Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, to step up to the podium about 2:30 Eastern Time today. That's about 10 minutes away. We will take that live as soon as it happens.
Now, as we said, 9/11 has created a lot of changes. Personally, we've talked more about family. As a community, we become more patriotic. And as a government, we questioned what went wrong with U.S. intelligence.
So the 9/11 Commission was created and intelligence reform legislation was written. Now that bill is languishing on Capitol Hill. Why? Let's ask two former congressmen, CNN contributor Bob Barr, former Republican congressman, and in our Washington bureau, Tom Andrews, a former Democratic congressman, now president of Win Without War.
Imagine that, legislation languishing on the Hill. Does that surprise you, Tom?
TOM ANDREWS, PRESIDENT, WIN WITHOUT WAR: I'm shocked. Shocked, Kyra.
You know, this is classic. For those kids who are out there, you know, learning civics, throw those civics books away and pay attention to what's going on right here.
You've got a 9/11 Commission, bipartisan, it comes out with a unanimous report. It's widely supported by the American people, supported apparently by the president of the United States. And supported by both parties in both houses of Congress.
What is the problem? Well, you've got an ox being gourd (ph) here. The Defense Department is having $30 billion worth of its power taken away from it.
So what do they do? They use their powerful skills. And, of course, Donald Rumsfeld used to be in Congress; Dick Cheney, the vice president, used to be the head of that department and was a member of Congress. And they know that Congress is not a democracy or even a republic, Kyra.
It is more like a medieval system of castles and fiefdoms. And if you can get a few of those sovereigns to carry your water, you can oppose the will of the vast majority of the American people and the Congress. And that's exactly what's going on right here.
PHILLIPS: All right. So if I can read between the lines, Tom is talking about all the influences or all the people, companies, constituents that influence congressmen like you or Tom when it comes to legislation. Is that what's bogging this down? There's just so many people writing his or her congressman, congresswoman that a decision just can't get made?
BOB BARR, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, first of all, nobody ever influenced Bob Barr, of course.
PHILLIPS: Oh, of course, not.
(LAUGHTER)
BARR: It -- Tom put his finger on the primary problem. There are a lot of other problems going on here.
There's a lot of -- there are a lot of conservatives that are upset with the proposal for a national I.D. card, for example, that was in the legislation. A lot of conservatives who are concerned about immigration didn't like it because it wasn't strong enough on immigration.
So the problem is, the bill got too big. If they had focused just on what the 9/11 Commission recommended in terms of restructuring intelligence, they might not have gotten it through, but they would have stood a much better chance.
Unfortunately, they -- it became a Christmas tree for all of these other things. And each one of those constituents was able to, you know, pull away one or two of the conferees. But the primary problem is exactly what Tom is talking about.
The Pentagon wants to control intelligence and -- at the expense of the CIA. I think it would be disastrous for the country if we allow the entire intelligence apparatus to reside under the control of the military authors.
PHILLIPS: All right. So, Tom -- go ahead, Tom.
ANDREWS: Kyra, what else is going on here, though, is that the chairman of the Judiciary Committee, Jim Sensenbrenner, didn't get enough of the Christmas tree into this package. And he's saying that unless his immigration priorities are put into this, you know, it's going to -- it's not going to pass.
And his problem -- and this is another dimension of this issue -- it's the House versus the Senate. You know, when I first got to the House, a chairman said to me, "Look, kid, listen to me." He says, "The Republican Party is the opposition. But the enemy is the United States Senate."
Poor Jim Sensenbrenner has passed his reforms continually in the House. They've always been defeated in the Senate. And boy, he finds his way right now to an opportunity to stick it to the Senate and force them to pass his immigration bill. So that's what's in there as well.
The other element here is ego. And, you know, I know you'll be shocked, but there's a lot of ego here in Washington.
PHILLIPS: Yes, imagine that.
ANDREWS: And Mr. Sensenbrenner has said that the chances of this passing are much less. Why? Because some of his colleagues and senators went onto the Sunday shows and criticized him and Chairman Hunter. So we can just write this off.
PHILLIPS: Well, there's been a lot of controversy, too, that this is just meaningless reform. What do you think? Do you think this is a bunch of meaningless reform? It's too big, or too broad?
Or is this something that would truly protect America from another attack? Because if it is, there needs -- there needs to be some congressmen and women stepping up to the plate and making a pretty convincing argument that, hey, we need this for our protection, for our future.
BARR: Well, you've hit on a couple of different things. And you're right sort of on both counts.
There are some very fundamental reforms and substantive changes to the intelligence community within this legislation. And that's one reason why I and a lot of others have cautioned a little bit slower track here.
You don't rush in and completely restructure the foreign intelligence apparatus of the United States of America, as bad as it might be right now, within two weeks. That's nonsense.
But are there -- are there some good provisions in it that will help us? Yes.
We need to bring more coherence, more communication within the intelligence community. But to -- to basically move in the direction, Kyra, of having one intelligence apparatus controlled essentially by the Pentagon, which is what a lot of the folks in the Pentagon want, is not the solution.
What we need to be doing is looking at how to get back to what the initial central intelligence agency was supposed to be. And there's only one way that's going to happen no matter what the legislation says, and that is the president stands up to the Pentagon and dictates that.
PHILLIPS: And a decision has to be made. We'll follow the legislation and how it pans out. Bob Barr and Tom Andrews, former congressmen, thanks, gentlemen.
ANDREWS: Thank you, Kyra.
PHILLIPS: All right.
Well, don't forget, we are about to hear from Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld probably on this issue, and Joint Chiefs Chairman General Richard Myers. That's just minutes away at the bottom of the hour. We're going to bring it to you live as soon as it happens.
Well, oil hit $50 once again this morning. Rhonda Schaffler live from the New York Stock Exchange with a possible impact on stocks -- Rhonda.
(STOCK MARKET REPORT)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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Aired November 23, 2004 - 13:59 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Live this hour, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld briefing the Pentagon. We're going to take you there as soon as it happens.
Intelligence reform, will it become a casualty of Capitol Hill politics? We're in-depth on the future of legislation aimed at preventing terror attacks against you.
And a big announcement from CBS. Anchorman Dan Rather is stepping down.
From the CNN Center in Atlanta, I'm Kyra Phillips. Miles is off. This hour of CNN's LIVE FROM starts right now.
We start with Donald Rumsfeld and General Richard Myers. Those are some of the big names you're going to hear from at the Pentagon later this hour. The secretary of defense and chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff are scheduled to hold a briefing in about 30 minutes. You can count on CNN to bring it to you live.
And one of the big issues that's sure to come up at the briefing is the fight over the stalled intelligence reform bill. We have reporters covering all angles of the story. CNN's Barbara Starr is at her post at the Pentagon, and our White House correspondent, Suzanne Malveaux, is in Crawford, Texas.
Barbara, let's start with you.
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kyra, when that briefing starts just about a half an hour from now, intelligence reform likely to be topic number one for both Secretary Rumsfeld and General Myers. Here's what's going on.
As you remember, over the weekend, the intelligence reform bill basically sunk on Capitol Hill over a controversy about whether to shift defense intelligence programs, satellites, communication, imagery analysis, take it all out of the Pentagon and shift it basically under the control of a national -- a national intelligence director. Now, that is something that several key members on Capitol Hill, they don't want to see that shift happen.
They want to keep it in the Pentagon. They believe it's essential to getting intelligence to the soldiers on the battlefield.
The chairman of the Joint Chiefs and the entire Joint Chiefs have now voiced their support. When asked by those key Republicans on Capitol Hill, they are voicing their support for the status quo, not the intelligence reform bill backed by the White House.
The chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff was asked by Congressman Duncan Hunter, the chairman of the House Armed Services Committee. So were all of the joint chiefs, and they all said that they believe it's best right now to keep those defense intelligence programs right where they are under the control of the secretary of defense.
So this now places this in a very difficult political situation for Secretary Rumsfeld, for the White House in their dealings with Capitol Hill. It remains to be seen how all of this sorts out -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Barbara Starr, thank you so much.
And President Bush personally lobbied House Republicans over the weekend in support of that bill. He's now at his Texas ranch for the Thanksgiving holiday. And that's where we find CNN White House correspondent Suzanne Malveaux.
What's the word from there, Suzanne?
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Kyra, White House officials tell us that, of course, President Bush is going to be spending quiet time, some downtime with his family at the Crawford ranch for the Thanksgiving holiday. But as you know, of course, this is really a critical test, a critical challenge for the president for the first task of his second administration, whether or not he can really even push his own party to go forward and move forward the 9/11 intelligence reform.
Now, as you know, before President Bush got directly involved expending some of that political capital that he was talking -- talking about, reaching out to Congressman Sensenbrenner, as well as Duncan Hunter, we are told as well that Chief of Staff Andy Card, as well as the White House liaison, David Hobbs, both of them of course reaching out to the Republican leadership, making those calls.
It was just yesterday Vice President Dick Cheney also meeting with Sensenbrenner. But we are told that the president is not necessarily going to get directly involved at this point. They believe that with pressure on the Pentagon, pressure with the Republican leadership over the next two weeks, they can make this happen, they can turn this thing around. But make no mistake, Kyra that pressure is on.
PHILLIPS: Suzanne Malveaux, live from Crawford, Texas. Thanks.
And in Egypt, a summit concerning post-war Iraq has ended with a show of support for America's timetable on elections. Delegates, including Secretary of State Colin Powell, passed a formal statement supporting Iraq's sovereignty, faster reconstruction and democratic elections at the end of January of 2005. As for quelling the violence that could hamper elections, Powell told CNN chief international correspondent Christiane Amanpour that Iraqi forces are the key.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) COLIN POWELL, SECRETARY OF STATE: The solution to the problem of security ultimately are the Iraqi forces, police forces, border patrol forces, lines of communications, protection forces, and the army imposing order on the country. Also, bringing down the insurgency.
The insurgency I don't think can afford many more battles like Falluja. They lost a lot of people there and lost a lot of weapons.
We got into their command and control system. We know a lot more about this insurgency. So they are -- they're paying a price for their activity.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: Iraq is sure to come up during the Pentagon briefing later this hour. Just a reminder, CNN will bring that to you live as soon as it happens.
A shakeup in the world of broadcast news. Dan Rather announced today he's stepping down as anchor of the "CBS Evening News." CNN financial news correspondent Chris Huntington live outside the CBS Broadcast Center in New York with the latest.
What's the feel out there, Chris?
CHRIS HUNTINGTON, CNN FINANCIAL NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Well, the feel is -- we caught up with Andy Rooney a few minutes ago, and you'll hear from him in just a second. The feel is that this was not entirely unexpected.
You have to keep in mind that Dan Rather has had the anchor chair of the "CBS Evening News" for nearly 24 years. He's saying today that he will officially step down on March 9, 2005. That would make it an even 24 years in that position, longer even than Walter Cronkite held the post as chief anchor of "The CBS Report."
In a statement today, Rather said in part that "I have always said that I'd know when the time was right to step away from the anchor chair. This past summer, CBS and I began to discuss the matter in earnest and we decided that the close of the election cycle would be an appropriate time."
Now, as I mentioned, Andy Rooney came by a short bit ago. Here's what the sage, if you will, of CBS News had to say about the departure of Dan Rather.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDY ROONEY, "60 MINUTES CORRESPONDENT": Well, I think it's -- he's probably ready to do it. I think it's a good thing to do. He's about 15 years after Cronkite stepped down, that much older. So he's had a good run, and it's been great.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNTINGTON: Now, of course Dan Rather is no stranger to controversy. And most recently, the controversy swirling around a "60 Minutes" report put on the air September 8, calling into question President Bush's service in the Texas Air National Guard and particularly a document that was used in that report that CBS has now conceded it cannot vouch for the authenticity of that.
There's an investigation under way here at CBS. And I asked CBS News if that controversy played any role in Rather's decision to step down. CBS spokesman Gil Schwartz said Dan's decision was independent of the findings of the probe that is under way. I further pressed and said, "Well, what about the controversy in total (ph)?" And Schwartz said, "Look, we're all part of the big world here and everything has a bearing on every decision" -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: All right. Chris Huntington, thank you so much.
And Dan Rather symbolized CBS News for nearly a quarter of a century, like Chris said, and was known for his fierce competitiveness. Robbie Vorhaus is a former CBS News producer who worked with Rather -- Rather, rather -- a play on words there -- and he's joining us now by phone from Sag Harbor, New York.
Actually, I'm being told we're getting him on the line right now. Robbie actually produced for Dan Rather. They worked side by side for a number of years. He not only runs, Robbie, his own PR company that he recently sold -- OK, I'm being told that we're going to take a quick break and we will come back to him right after this.
Shall we read the tease too? All right.
We're going to talk about the 9/11 Commission also. It called for change in fighting terrorism and it called on Washington to make it happen. But now it's getting bogged down in Congress. We're going to look at the behind-the-scenes politics that could be getting in the way just ahead.
Also, we want to remind you we're waiting for that live briefing from the Pentagon in just about 15 minutes or so. We're going to bring that to you live as soon as it happens right here on CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: Just part of Dan Rather's quote today, "I've been lucky and blessed over these years to have what is to me the best job in the world." As you know, we've been talking about anchorman Dan Rather and how he has decided to step down from CBS News. Well, Robbie Vorhaus is a former CBS News producer who worked with Rather. He's joining us by phone now from Sag Harbor, New York.
Good to hear your voice, Robbie.
ROBBIE VORHAUS, FMR. CBS NEWS PRODUCER: Hey, Kyra. How are you? And almost Happy Thanksgiving.
PHILLIPS: There we go. We're close. It should be an interesting holiday for Dan Rather. I guess, first of all, I want to know if you're surprised that this happened now. VORHAUS: Well, no, I'm really not. I mean, after the "60 Minutes" event -- and, you know, Dan's 73 years old, and I think that Tom Brokaw stepping down, you know, Brian Williams is about to step in. Peter Jennings is part of that triumvirate. And I think that Dan's had an illustrious career.
And I think that so many people forget all the incredible things Dan has done. And this is the time for Dan to step down at the 24th anniversary of when he assumed the position from Walter Cronkite. And I think that Dan should be remembered by all of his incredible good work, and he's going to continue to stay on and do some great reporting for CBS.
PHILLIPS: Yes. It seems like his own -- his own job sort of is not doing the best at helping him right now. So let's step aside from the "60 Minutes" story and let's look back at the 20-plus years and what he's done and the impact that he's made.
You produced for him. What was he like, and what are some memorable stories that this country shouldn't forget despite what happened on "60 Minutes"?
VORHAUS: Well, I think that anyone who has worked for Dan Rather -- and there have been any number of wonderful journalists. Peggy Noonan, of course, went on to do incredible things in the White House and is now, you know, a leading author and a commentator. And again, many people who work for Dan Rather know that he is the gentleman's gentleman, he is the hardest working journalist in the business.
Here's a guy who, you know, started as -- you know, as a radio reporter and worked his way up to being a news director. And then, you know, here we are on the -- on the anniversary of President Kennedy's assassination, and that's when Dan made his career because he had the instincts to get to where he need to be and to report it fairly and accurately with incredible instinct.
So when you look at all the world leaders who Dan has interviewed, when you look at all of the things that Dan has done, I mean, here was a man who was in Bosnia twice. Here was a man who reported from Russia on the -- on all the changes there, the coming down of the wall in Berlin, you know, the incredible events that Dan Rather was in the middle of and always -- and usually first on the scene. I think that, you know, any journalist, whether or not they're starting their career or in the middle of their career, owes a lot to Dan Rather.
PHILLIPS: So we look at Dan Rather stepping down. Let's talk about sort of the change in the industry for a minute, style versus personality.
I mean, there was a time -- and I mentioned this to our analysts -- or our other journalists at the beginning of the hour -- that you tuned in for Dan Rather or Peter Jennings or Tom Brokaw. And now it's a very different beast, especially with 24/7 cable news taking place. So maybe this is a good time for him, seeming that it's going in a different direction, news is going in a different direction. VORHAUS: Yes, nobody -- nobody -- nobody comes home at night and says, you know, "Honey, give me that martini and I'm going to turn on Dan Rather and watch the news." I mean, we can -- we can so easily now gather information in the way that we want it, in the style that we want it, with, in fact, the slant that we want it.
I mean, there are different news organizations that will give us information whether or not they're from the left or from the right. You know, the African-American community has news-gathering organizations just for that type of news, if you want it.
There's Al-Jazeera for -- for that culture. There's Hispanic. There's French. You can turn on the -- any number of news sources and get news from around the world.
So I think that just having one news source and just having one favorite news person, that day is long gone. Now it's a question of style and substance and the belief of whether or not the organization is reporting the news fairly and accurately in the style and in the slant that you want it.
PHILLIPS: Former producer to Dan Rather and media strategist, Robbie Vorhaus. Thanks for your time today.
VORHAUS: It's a pleasure, Kyra.
PHILLIPS: Let's move forward and talk about sunny or soggy as you head in for your Thanksgiving feast. Let's get the forecast now from Jacqui Jeras in the CNN Weather Center.
Hi, Jacqui.
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PHILLIPS: Jacqui Jeras, thanks so much.
Straight ahead, keeping an eye on O.J. Simpson, or at least his money. A new lawsuit brings up some old issues.
RHONDA SCHAFFLER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm Rhonda Schaffler at the New York Stock Exchange. The wealthiest Americans are on a roll. I'll tell you what they're spending their money on. Plus, we'll have a look at today's markets coming up. So don't go away.
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PHILLIPS: Well, 9/11 created a lot of changes, and you can imagine a number of those changes will be talked about at the Pentagon briefing today. We are expecting Donald Rumsfeld, secretary of defense, and General Richard Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, to step up to the podium about 2:30 Eastern Time today. That's about 10 minutes away. We will take that live as soon as it happens.
Now, as we said, 9/11 has created a lot of changes. Personally, we've talked more about family. As a community, we become more patriotic. And as a government, we questioned what went wrong with U.S. intelligence.
So the 9/11 Commission was created and intelligence reform legislation was written. Now that bill is languishing on Capitol Hill. Why? Let's ask two former congressmen, CNN contributor Bob Barr, former Republican congressman, and in our Washington bureau, Tom Andrews, a former Democratic congressman, now president of Win Without War.
Imagine that, legislation languishing on the Hill. Does that surprise you, Tom?
TOM ANDREWS, PRESIDENT, WIN WITHOUT WAR: I'm shocked. Shocked, Kyra.
You know, this is classic. For those kids who are out there, you know, learning civics, throw those civics books away and pay attention to what's going on right here.
You've got a 9/11 Commission, bipartisan, it comes out with a unanimous report. It's widely supported by the American people, supported apparently by the president of the United States. And supported by both parties in both houses of Congress.
What is the problem? Well, you've got an ox being gourd (ph) here. The Defense Department is having $30 billion worth of its power taken away from it.
So what do they do? They use their powerful skills. And, of course, Donald Rumsfeld used to be in Congress; Dick Cheney, the vice president, used to be the head of that department and was a member of Congress. And they know that Congress is not a democracy or even a republic, Kyra.
It is more like a medieval system of castles and fiefdoms. And if you can get a few of those sovereigns to carry your water, you can oppose the will of the vast majority of the American people and the Congress. And that's exactly what's going on right here.
PHILLIPS: All right. So if I can read between the lines, Tom is talking about all the influences or all the people, companies, constituents that influence congressmen like you or Tom when it comes to legislation. Is that what's bogging this down? There's just so many people writing his or her congressman, congresswoman that a decision just can't get made?
BOB BARR, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, first of all, nobody ever influenced Bob Barr, of course.
PHILLIPS: Oh, of course, not.
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BARR: It -- Tom put his finger on the primary problem. There are a lot of other problems going on here.
There's a lot of -- there are a lot of conservatives that are upset with the proposal for a national I.D. card, for example, that was in the legislation. A lot of conservatives who are concerned about immigration didn't like it because it wasn't strong enough on immigration.
So the problem is, the bill got too big. If they had focused just on what the 9/11 Commission recommended in terms of restructuring intelligence, they might not have gotten it through, but they would have stood a much better chance.
Unfortunately, they -- it became a Christmas tree for all of these other things. And each one of those constituents was able to, you know, pull away one or two of the conferees. But the primary problem is exactly what Tom is talking about.
The Pentagon wants to control intelligence and -- at the expense of the CIA. I think it would be disastrous for the country if we allow the entire intelligence apparatus to reside under the control of the military authors.
PHILLIPS: All right. So, Tom -- go ahead, Tom.
ANDREWS: Kyra, what else is going on here, though, is that the chairman of the Judiciary Committee, Jim Sensenbrenner, didn't get enough of the Christmas tree into this package. And he's saying that unless his immigration priorities are put into this, you know, it's going to -- it's not going to pass.
And his problem -- and this is another dimension of this issue -- it's the House versus the Senate. You know, when I first got to the House, a chairman said to me, "Look, kid, listen to me." He says, "The Republican Party is the opposition. But the enemy is the United States Senate."
Poor Jim Sensenbrenner has passed his reforms continually in the House. They've always been defeated in the Senate. And boy, he finds his way right now to an opportunity to stick it to the Senate and force them to pass his immigration bill. So that's what's in there as well.
The other element here is ego. And, you know, I know you'll be shocked, but there's a lot of ego here in Washington.
PHILLIPS: Yes, imagine that.
ANDREWS: And Mr. Sensenbrenner has said that the chances of this passing are much less. Why? Because some of his colleagues and senators went onto the Sunday shows and criticized him and Chairman Hunter. So we can just write this off.
PHILLIPS: Well, there's been a lot of controversy, too, that this is just meaningless reform. What do you think? Do you think this is a bunch of meaningless reform? It's too big, or too broad?
Or is this something that would truly protect America from another attack? Because if it is, there needs -- there needs to be some congressmen and women stepping up to the plate and making a pretty convincing argument that, hey, we need this for our protection, for our future.
BARR: Well, you've hit on a couple of different things. And you're right sort of on both counts.
There are some very fundamental reforms and substantive changes to the intelligence community within this legislation. And that's one reason why I and a lot of others have cautioned a little bit slower track here.
You don't rush in and completely restructure the foreign intelligence apparatus of the United States of America, as bad as it might be right now, within two weeks. That's nonsense.
But are there -- are there some good provisions in it that will help us? Yes.
We need to bring more coherence, more communication within the intelligence community. But to -- to basically move in the direction, Kyra, of having one intelligence apparatus controlled essentially by the Pentagon, which is what a lot of the folks in the Pentagon want, is not the solution.
What we need to be doing is looking at how to get back to what the initial central intelligence agency was supposed to be. And there's only one way that's going to happen no matter what the legislation says, and that is the president stands up to the Pentagon and dictates that.
PHILLIPS: And a decision has to be made. We'll follow the legislation and how it pans out. Bob Barr and Tom Andrews, former congressmen, thanks, gentlemen.
ANDREWS: Thank you, Kyra.
PHILLIPS: All right.
Well, don't forget, we are about to hear from Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld probably on this issue, and Joint Chiefs Chairman General Richard Myers. That's just minutes away at the bottom of the hour. We're going to bring it to you live as soon as it happens.
Well, oil hit $50 once again this morning. Rhonda Schaffler live from the New York Stock Exchange with a possible impact on stocks -- Rhonda.
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