Return to Transcripts main page
Live From...
New Bin Laden Tape Released?; Interview With Attorney For Saddam Hussein
Aired December 16, 2004 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Now in the news, a Pentagon briefing on the conflict in Iraq is expected to happen at any moment. We'll bring it to you live.
Another prominent Republican says he's no fan of Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld. Senator Trent Lott says the U.S. needs more troops in Iraq and says he doesn't think Rumsfeld -- quote -- "listens enough to his uniformed officers."
Lott says he'd like to see the defense secretary replaced in the next year or so. Senator John McCain has voiced similar concerns.
The CIA says it sounds like Osama bin Laden. Another terror tape is posted to an Islamic Web site praising the recent attack on the U.S. Consulate in Saudi Arabia. What's in the tape and when was it made? We'll have details straight ahead.
Preparing Saddam Hussein's defense. The former Iraqi leader met with an attorney today for the first time since his capture more than one year ago. It's not clear when his trial will begin, but several of his aides are expected to face pretrial hearings starting next week.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: But first this hour, Osama bin Laden and another reminder that he's apparently still in business. CNN has learned that the CIA has analyzed the latest audio message and believes it to be authentic. Bin Laden probably recorded it quite recently.
With more on that story, CNN senior international correspondent Nic Robertson in London.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The message is over 70 minutes long. About an hour in, there's a reference to the attack on the U.S. Consulate in Jeddah last week, that just 10 days ago, an indication here that Osama bin Laden perhaps feels so confident about his lines of communication that he's able to release this audio statement on a Web site coming so soon after that attack.
We have not seen until now a reference made in one of these broadcasts to an event, an attack that has happened so recently, so perhaps, again, an indication that he feels secure. Also, the release on the Internet, as opposed to sending a tape, a videotape, as he has done recently, to the Arab broadcaster Al-Jazeera, an indication that perhaps he doesn't want his message edited down, the message very critical of the Saudi royal family. In the past, Al-Jazeera has tended to edit out material that's against the Saudi family, left in material that's against the United States.
But what the message here does, it seems to go back to Osama bin Laden's roots, if you will, his original messages a decade ago trying to overthrow the Saudi royal family. He says that they are lining their pockets why millions of Saudis are going poor. He says that the violence inside Saudi Arabia the responsibility of the Saudi royal family and that the Saudi royal family merely puppets the United States, who are trying to steal the oil and the wealth from Saudi Arabia.
So, really, this a very long message,timed, perhaps, to match with demonstrations called for in Saudi Arabia today by a dissident group based here in London. Those demonstrations, according to eyewitnesses, were very poorly attended. But perhaps bin Laden tried to time the message to that as well, but certainly an appeal here to Saudis to rise up and overthrow the Saudi royal family.
Nic Robertson, CNN, London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIPS: Once again, we remind you, we'll take you live to the Pentagon as soon as that news briefing takes place before reporters. It should happen any moment from now.
Well, he was hiding for months in a spider hole. Then, on December 13 last year, he came face to face with U.S. troops. Today, for the first time since his capture, Saddam Hussein came face to face with one of his attorneys in Baghdad. I talked with a member of Saddam's defense team. Issam Ghazzawi says that his co-counsel met with the ousted president for four hours. He says his client is in good health, in good spirits and is, without a doubt, innocent of any crime.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIPS: Mr. Ghazzawi, Saddam is expected to be charged with genocide and crimes against humanity. How is he going to plead?
ISSAM GHAZZAWI, ATTORNEY FOR SADDAM HUSSEIN: Of course, he's not guilty. And nobody has the right to get him to trial.
He's still the president, the legitimate president of Iraq. You will ask why, because, first of all, the aggression against Iraq from the United States government is illegal. It's illegal war, because they were not retaliating for an attack from Iraqis on the soil of America.
Second of all, they didn't have the permission of the United Nations Security Council under Article 7 to attack Iraq, which would have been legitimate at that point. But they made a flagrant war of aggression against Iraq. And occupiers don't have the right to make any laws, to designate any judge, whatsoever his rank is, or to touch the constitution of the country they are occupying.
PHILLIPS: Sir, with all due respect, Saddam Hussein is no longer the president of Iraq.
GHAZZAWI: Yes, ma'am.
PHILLIPS: He's a fallen dictator. He's been captured. He is in jail and he's about to stand trial for war crimes. How can you say that your client is still the president of Iraq?
GHAZZAWI: He is still the president of Iraq, because the people in Iraq now governing -- this is the interim government, what you call -- they are puppets of the United States administration.
They can't go to bathroom without taking permission from the States. They declared many times that they want to make a trial as soon as possible. They said on the seventh month of this year and then they change their mind to the 11th. Then they said before the end of the year. And, yesterday, their minister said not before 2006.
PHILLIPS: Sir, you say Saddam Hussein is innocent of the charges against him. How do you explain the mass graves? How do you explain the gassing of the Kurds in 1988? If Saddam Hussein is not responsible for those deaths, who is responsible?
GHAZZAWI: Oh, I'll tell you about it, but it's a very long story. And we have, until now, at least one million 1,500,000 papers on these accounts.
No. 1, in Halabja, you said that Saddam Hussein killed the Kurds using chemicals. Saddam Hussein didn't kill the Kurd -- gas to kill the Halabja residents.
PHILLIPS: So, who...
GHAZZAWI: There was a war going between Iran and Iraq. Iran came to Iraq and entered...
PHILLIPS: So, who was responsible for gassing the Kurds?
GHAZZAWI: The Iranians are responsible, because we have reports from the CIA. And Mr. Saddam Hussein can ask the CIA to be his witness from his side, because they send scientists and they send a delegation and tested it. And they said the death was due to cyanide gas compounds, which, at that time, Iraq could not have...
(CROSSTALK)
PHILLIPS: Are you saying Chemical Ali was working with the Iranians, that Chemical Ali has nothing to do with Saddam Hussein?
GHAZZAWI: No. Chemical Ali -- no.
Saddam Hussein did hear about this case from the television, just like any other citizen, because they didn't have that gas, first of all. Then he didn't gas Halabja. PHILLIPS: Sir, you have said that the 1971 Iraq constitution still stands and that Saddam Hussein is still president. The 1971 constitution...
GHAZZAWI: Not only me.
(CROSSTALK)
GHAZZAWI: Mr. Bremer -- Mr. Bremer in his declaration of the new government law, he referred to the constitution of 1971.
PHILLIPS: That is null and void, though, sir.
GHAZZAWI: Said no law should go over it. Yes, ma'am?
PHILLIPS: It is null and void. And now there is a new interim government. There's a new constitution that is going to be put forth in full force. And there is now an Iraqi special tribunal that was adopted before the handover that will be in charge of this trial for Saddam Hussein. Do you think your client will get a fair trial?
GHAZZAWI: In Iraq, I don't think he will get a fair trial. But, in international law, he will be acquitted. If the Security Council have a court, just like Slobodan Milosevic, transparent, with none aligned persons not to the side or the other side, he must be released and acquitted, because it will be a fair trial.
PHILLIPS: Well, the Iraqi special tribunal will be based on international law, sir. Where do you think your client would get a fair trial, if not in Iraq?
(CROSSTALK)
GHAZZAWI: In Iraq, he will have the victors' trial or revenge trial only. But we'll do our best to make it as lawful as possible. We will defend our client to the best of our ability. And, God willing, he will be not responsible for anything they accused him of, because he is innocent.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WHITFIELD: That interview with one of Saddam Hussein's attorneys.
Meantime, we want to take you to Washington briefly to get a shot of the Pentagon briefing that we are expecting to take place momentarily. And when it does, we'll be taking you there live for those comments.
On the lighter side, the showbiz news you need is straight ahead.
SIBILA VARGAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi. I'm Sibila Vargas from Hollywood. "Survivor" Jeff Probst survives the island to find love. Rapper Ludacris takes aim at Bill O'Reilly. And rock band Queen takes to the stage again -- all that when LIVE FROM continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: General George Casey live at the Pentagon now briefing reporters.
Let's listen in.
(JOINED IN PROGRESS)
GEN. GEORGE CASEY, ARMY VICE CHIEF OF STAFF: ... they can elect their own government and build a better life for the Iraqi people.
There is progress across Iraq every day. And every day we and our Iraqi partners are a step closer to accomplishing our objectives.
Now let me just make a couple of points with you.
First of all, the insurgency that we're fighting is not 10 feet tall. They're a tough, aggressive enemy, but they're not 10 feet tall. They're the same people who have repressed the Iraqi people for the last 30 years. They are the reason that over a million Iraqis are missing and why probably several hundred thousand of those missing Iraqis are likely in mass graves around Iraq.
They are focused on their return to dominance so that they can continue to plunder the great natural resources of Iraq. They offer no alternative vision. They offer only intimidation and subjugation.
With the win in Falluja, with the liberation of Falluja, they no longer have any safe havens anywhere in Iraq. And also, as a result of the success in Falluja, it was driven home to them that they cannot defeat the coalition forces.
So they're attacking our will and the will of the Iraqi people. And I personally do not believe that they will defeat the indomitable spirit of 25 million free people who want to build a better live for themselves and for their families.
Second point, the Iraqi security forces are getting stronger every day. Our plan to build the Iraqi military and police forces is broadly on track. By February, there will be 70 trained and equipped battalions in the Iraqi army. One of those will be a mechanized infantry battalion.
Progress has also been made in the police and special police forces. By February, there will be six public order battalions, a special police regiment, four police commando battalions and some nine regional SWAT teams, special weapons and tactics teams, all of them contributing to the fight against the insurgents and the terrorists on a day-to-day basis.
As most of you know, we still have a way to go in this area, but as I said, we're broadly on track and generally very pleased with the performance of the Iraqi security forces.
Third point, reconstruction momentum is building. In June, there were only around 230 projects actually what we call turning dirt, actually started on the ground. By the end of November, there were over 1,000, with a value of over $3 billion. All of this in spite of insurgents' efforts to disrupt the reconstruction process.
This is a great tribute to the folks that work on those projects, particularly in the embassy, and the coalition business men and women who are over there working to build a better Iraq.
The fourth point, the interim government and their security forces are broadly accepted by the Iraqi people. Some poll ratings for the government are as high as 70 percent approval rating. The Iraqi people express a generally favorable opinion about their new army and about their police. And more than 60 percent of Iraqis believe that the country is headed in the right direction and they are optimistic about their future.
We're also broadly on track for the elections. Fourteen of the 18 provinces have four or less incidents of violence a day. And the registration process in most of the country was executed.
The Iraqi election committee is working on some alternative solutions for the two areas of the country in which it was disrupted.
I want to be clear. The insurgents and the terrorists will continue to attack and attempt to disrupt the election process. We see that daily. They won't succeed. The elections in January will then be but another step forward in our relentless progress toward a new Iraq.
Now, if I could say a word to the home audience here in the United States.
As a nation, you can take great pride in the role that our soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines are playing in helping build a better Iraq. Each and every one of them recognizes the importance that successfully accomplishing this mission holds for our own security, and each and every one of them makes a difference every day.
Wherever I go, I see the acts of bravery, compassion and selflessness, and I couldn't be prouder of these wonderful men and women.
Our success to date is also attributed to the men and women of the Iraqi security forces and the coalition who have given their lives to defeat terrorism and to help build a new Iraq.
We grieve with the loved ones of all of our servicemembers and with those of Iraqi servicemembers who have died. We are humbled by their sacrifice and their contribution in bringing freedom to Iraq, and we are humbled by their sacrifice in enhancing the security of the United States and the coalition.
Lastly, we are, especially during the holiday season, also deeply thankful for the love and support of our families and loved of ones, whose sacrifices and strength underpin everything that we do.
Progress toward a constitutionally elected government will not be easy. Nothing worthwhile ever is. But the challenge of helping the people of Iraq build a better future is one that the Iraqi people and the armed forces of 30 freedom-loving countries can take on.
So thank you very much, and I'll take your questions.
QUESTION: General, based at least partly on the candidates the Shia are offering, are you concerned on what influence Iran may have over the Iraqi government after the January elections?
CASEY: I missed the first part of your question.
QUESTION: Based at least in part on the candidates that Shia are offering, are you concerned about the possible influence that Iran might have on the Iraqi government after the election?
CASEY: My personal view, this is political, but I'm there every day and I'll give you just my personal view. I don't see substantial Iranian influence on this particular government that will be elected in January. I see Iran as more of a longer term threat to Iraqi security. But that's just -- that's my view, and I'm a military person who is there.
QUESTION: What do you mean from a longer view? Are you talking about a possible military threat as opposed to political?
CASEY: I'm not talking about that.
I'm just saying, from a strategic perspective, Iran is a long- term threat to stability in Iraq. If you look on the other side, I think Syria is a short-term threat, because of the support they provide to the former Baathist leaders that we see operating in and out of Syria.
QUESTION: General, you talked about how the government is considering alternative solutions in some of those Sunni triangle areas where registration is a problem. And then you said that one of those is holding elections over a longer period of time, more than one day, in other words.
What is your assessment of the security situation in doing that? Doesn't that just give a longer period of time for potential attacks by insurgents?
And also, could you tell us what the American role is in security of those election sites?
CASEY: I do not think the extended election period is still on the table. I know that it was discussed, but I've discussed it with some of the leadership in the Iraqi government. I don't believe it's on the table anymore, at least it wasn't when I left.
We are working closely with the minister of interior and the Iraqi election committee in building a security plan for the elections.
It's not finally formed yet. It will be probably by the end of this month. In general, the role of the coalition forces will be one of broad area security, and it will be the Iraqi security forces that will work the specifics of the polling areas and places like that.
QUESTION: General, how concerned are you that the Sunnis will not participate or not turn out in numbers sufficient, not only because of the security situation, but simply because of disaffection? And if they do, what does that mean?
CASEY: Again, I wish -- my political consultant, John Negroponte, could probably do a better job on this one.
My view is -- I'll give you my opinion. My opinion is that there will be Sunni participation in this and in a reasonable amount.
I believe that the insurgents are pursuing a strategy I call purposeful disenfranchisement by intimidating Sunnis away from the election process so they can say, "Well, the Sunnis didn't vote, so therefore, the election is invalid."
I don't think that's going to be a successful strategy, but it's one that they are trying to implement.
So I think there will be sufficient Sunni participation in this for people to accept the fact that it is a reasonably free and fair election.
QUESTION: You talked about the polling places that will largely be Iraqi security forces there -- what, 9,000 polling places?
CASEY: They are undetermined; somewhere between 6,000 and 9,000; 9,000 is the high end.
QUESTION: And when you look at the number of Iraqi security forces, it seems like there wouldn't be very many Iraqi security forces. If you could talk about that, the numbers at those polling places. And I know you don't want to be too specific on that. But if you'll give us more detail about what the Americans will do. Will they be, sort of, rapid reaction? What?
CASEY: Again, we're still working through the process. But, I mean, it's like any type of security situation. If you want to guard, you don't guard every place just at the point. You guard it away from the point. You restrict access to it. You keep vehicles from moving in the direction of the polling places around them.
I mean, there's a range of options that you do to reduce exposure of these particular sites, rather than just taking 20 or 30 people and huddling around the site itself. That's being worked out.
My experience with elections in the past in Bosnia and Kosovo, again, the forces of the coalition, the security forces normally operate away from the polling sites in an area security role and do provide reaction force, if there's problems.
CASEY: And the other thing we do, and we will do, and are doing, is to continue to conduct operations prior to the elections to disrupt the insurgents and to keep them from disrupting the election process.
So there's an offensive component to this as well.
QUESTION: General, you talk about the progress in security across Iraq. It seems that that airport road is a symbol of what many people say is a growing insurgency. What is the story with that road, and why can't U.S. and Iraqi forces patrol it effectively to stop the attacks that are happening on it?
CASEY: I wouldn't necessarily see it as a symbol of a growing insurgency. I would see it as a symbol of the growing use of car bombs in the insurgency. And that really is the question of the airport road.
It's a tactic that's been adopted by the insurgents. They don't have to do much. A car bomb a day in Baghdad or on the airport road sends a symbol that the insurgency is very powerful, when in actuality I don't believe that they are.
It's a classic technique of the urban insurgent. They are trying to provoke us to do something that will make us look like we're overreacting to them. I mean, you could tie up traffic -- I mean, if you searched every car getting on the airport road, you'd put that part of Baghdad in knots.
So it really is the issue of dealing with car bombs. We continually work on that and we will get to a point where the airport road is secure and our people and the people in the embassy are protected against car bombs.
But as with any battle, it's an action, reaction, counteraction cycle that we go through with the enemy and the enemy does to us.
QUESTION: So is there a plan for that road or just a broader plan for attacking the terrorists and their ability to make car bombs?
CASEY: It's a little bit of each, but we're actively working with the minister of interior and his traffic forces on ways to reduce the threats to our forces on the airport road.
QUESTION: I know you addressed this in your opening remarks. But in your view, are we winning in Iraq and how do you define winning? And as a follow-up, do you believe, given the current situation there, that credible national elections will be held or could be held or are possible to be held by January 30th?
CASEY: My view of winning is that we are broadly on track to accomplishing our objectives, which is a constitutionally elected government that is representative of all the Iraqi people and with Iraqi security forces that are capable of maintaining domestic order and denying Iraq as a safe haven for terror.
I believe we'll get there by the end of December '05, and I believe we are on track to get there by December of '05.
What was the second part?
QUESTION: About the elections. Do you think that... CASEY: I do.
QUESTION: ... given the situation, that credible elections will be held on January 30th?
CASEY: I do. I mean, it is going to be hard. They will fight us every step of the way.
But I do believe credible elections can be held. Again, in the south and in the north, 14 of those 18 provinces that -- what I believe is that they will be uneventful. They will be contested in the center area of the country, but I believe we will succeed in that.
QUESTION: As a final question, how do you -- what do you tell the families of the service men who have been killed and maimed over there? How do you define victory in Iraq, ultimate victory to these people who are losing their loved ones.
CASEY: I think I just did.
PHILLIPS: Army General George Casey briefing reporters there, actually handling the Pentagon briefing today, talking about reconstruction in Iraq and, of course, elections that are set to start at the beginning of the year.
WHITFIELD: And that's going to do it for us for this edition of LIVE FROM.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired December 16, 2004 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Now in the news, a Pentagon briefing on the conflict in Iraq is expected to happen at any moment. We'll bring it to you live.
Another prominent Republican says he's no fan of Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld. Senator Trent Lott says the U.S. needs more troops in Iraq and says he doesn't think Rumsfeld -- quote -- "listens enough to his uniformed officers."
Lott says he'd like to see the defense secretary replaced in the next year or so. Senator John McCain has voiced similar concerns.
The CIA says it sounds like Osama bin Laden. Another terror tape is posted to an Islamic Web site praising the recent attack on the U.S. Consulate in Saudi Arabia. What's in the tape and when was it made? We'll have details straight ahead.
Preparing Saddam Hussein's defense. The former Iraqi leader met with an attorney today for the first time since his capture more than one year ago. It's not clear when his trial will begin, but several of his aides are expected to face pretrial hearings starting next week.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: But first this hour, Osama bin Laden and another reminder that he's apparently still in business. CNN has learned that the CIA has analyzed the latest audio message and believes it to be authentic. Bin Laden probably recorded it quite recently.
With more on that story, CNN senior international correspondent Nic Robertson in London.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The message is over 70 minutes long. About an hour in, there's a reference to the attack on the U.S. Consulate in Jeddah last week, that just 10 days ago, an indication here that Osama bin Laden perhaps feels so confident about his lines of communication that he's able to release this audio statement on a Web site coming so soon after that attack.
We have not seen until now a reference made in one of these broadcasts to an event, an attack that has happened so recently, so perhaps, again, an indication that he feels secure. Also, the release on the Internet, as opposed to sending a tape, a videotape, as he has done recently, to the Arab broadcaster Al-Jazeera, an indication that perhaps he doesn't want his message edited down, the message very critical of the Saudi royal family. In the past, Al-Jazeera has tended to edit out material that's against the Saudi family, left in material that's against the United States.
But what the message here does, it seems to go back to Osama bin Laden's roots, if you will, his original messages a decade ago trying to overthrow the Saudi royal family. He says that they are lining their pockets why millions of Saudis are going poor. He says that the violence inside Saudi Arabia the responsibility of the Saudi royal family and that the Saudi royal family merely puppets the United States, who are trying to steal the oil and the wealth from Saudi Arabia.
So, really, this a very long message,timed, perhaps, to match with demonstrations called for in Saudi Arabia today by a dissident group based here in London. Those demonstrations, according to eyewitnesses, were very poorly attended. But perhaps bin Laden tried to time the message to that as well, but certainly an appeal here to Saudis to rise up and overthrow the Saudi royal family.
Nic Robertson, CNN, London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIPS: Once again, we remind you, we'll take you live to the Pentagon as soon as that news briefing takes place before reporters. It should happen any moment from now.
Well, he was hiding for months in a spider hole. Then, on December 13 last year, he came face to face with U.S. troops. Today, for the first time since his capture, Saddam Hussein came face to face with one of his attorneys in Baghdad. I talked with a member of Saddam's defense team. Issam Ghazzawi says that his co-counsel met with the ousted president for four hours. He says his client is in good health, in good spirits and is, without a doubt, innocent of any crime.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIPS: Mr. Ghazzawi, Saddam is expected to be charged with genocide and crimes against humanity. How is he going to plead?
ISSAM GHAZZAWI, ATTORNEY FOR SADDAM HUSSEIN: Of course, he's not guilty. And nobody has the right to get him to trial.
He's still the president, the legitimate president of Iraq. You will ask why, because, first of all, the aggression against Iraq from the United States government is illegal. It's illegal war, because they were not retaliating for an attack from Iraqis on the soil of America.
Second of all, they didn't have the permission of the United Nations Security Council under Article 7 to attack Iraq, which would have been legitimate at that point. But they made a flagrant war of aggression against Iraq. And occupiers don't have the right to make any laws, to designate any judge, whatsoever his rank is, or to touch the constitution of the country they are occupying.
PHILLIPS: Sir, with all due respect, Saddam Hussein is no longer the president of Iraq.
GHAZZAWI: Yes, ma'am.
PHILLIPS: He's a fallen dictator. He's been captured. He is in jail and he's about to stand trial for war crimes. How can you say that your client is still the president of Iraq?
GHAZZAWI: He is still the president of Iraq, because the people in Iraq now governing -- this is the interim government, what you call -- they are puppets of the United States administration.
They can't go to bathroom without taking permission from the States. They declared many times that they want to make a trial as soon as possible. They said on the seventh month of this year and then they change their mind to the 11th. Then they said before the end of the year. And, yesterday, their minister said not before 2006.
PHILLIPS: Sir, you say Saddam Hussein is innocent of the charges against him. How do you explain the mass graves? How do you explain the gassing of the Kurds in 1988? If Saddam Hussein is not responsible for those deaths, who is responsible?
GHAZZAWI: Oh, I'll tell you about it, but it's a very long story. And we have, until now, at least one million 1,500,000 papers on these accounts.
No. 1, in Halabja, you said that Saddam Hussein killed the Kurds using chemicals. Saddam Hussein didn't kill the Kurd -- gas to kill the Halabja residents.
PHILLIPS: So, who...
GHAZZAWI: There was a war going between Iran and Iraq. Iran came to Iraq and entered...
PHILLIPS: So, who was responsible for gassing the Kurds?
GHAZZAWI: The Iranians are responsible, because we have reports from the CIA. And Mr. Saddam Hussein can ask the CIA to be his witness from his side, because they send scientists and they send a delegation and tested it. And they said the death was due to cyanide gas compounds, which, at that time, Iraq could not have...
(CROSSTALK)
PHILLIPS: Are you saying Chemical Ali was working with the Iranians, that Chemical Ali has nothing to do with Saddam Hussein?
GHAZZAWI: No. Chemical Ali -- no.
Saddam Hussein did hear about this case from the television, just like any other citizen, because they didn't have that gas, first of all. Then he didn't gas Halabja. PHILLIPS: Sir, you have said that the 1971 Iraq constitution still stands and that Saddam Hussein is still president. The 1971 constitution...
GHAZZAWI: Not only me.
(CROSSTALK)
GHAZZAWI: Mr. Bremer -- Mr. Bremer in his declaration of the new government law, he referred to the constitution of 1971.
PHILLIPS: That is null and void, though, sir.
GHAZZAWI: Said no law should go over it. Yes, ma'am?
PHILLIPS: It is null and void. And now there is a new interim government. There's a new constitution that is going to be put forth in full force. And there is now an Iraqi special tribunal that was adopted before the handover that will be in charge of this trial for Saddam Hussein. Do you think your client will get a fair trial?
GHAZZAWI: In Iraq, I don't think he will get a fair trial. But, in international law, he will be acquitted. If the Security Council have a court, just like Slobodan Milosevic, transparent, with none aligned persons not to the side or the other side, he must be released and acquitted, because it will be a fair trial.
PHILLIPS: Well, the Iraqi special tribunal will be based on international law, sir. Where do you think your client would get a fair trial, if not in Iraq?
(CROSSTALK)
GHAZZAWI: In Iraq, he will have the victors' trial or revenge trial only. But we'll do our best to make it as lawful as possible. We will defend our client to the best of our ability. And, God willing, he will be not responsible for anything they accused him of, because he is innocent.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WHITFIELD: That interview with one of Saddam Hussein's attorneys.
Meantime, we want to take you to Washington briefly to get a shot of the Pentagon briefing that we are expecting to take place momentarily. And when it does, we'll be taking you there live for those comments.
On the lighter side, the showbiz news you need is straight ahead.
SIBILA VARGAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi. I'm Sibila Vargas from Hollywood. "Survivor" Jeff Probst survives the island to find love. Rapper Ludacris takes aim at Bill O'Reilly. And rock band Queen takes to the stage again -- all that when LIVE FROM continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: General George Casey live at the Pentagon now briefing reporters.
Let's listen in.
(JOINED IN PROGRESS)
GEN. GEORGE CASEY, ARMY VICE CHIEF OF STAFF: ... they can elect their own government and build a better life for the Iraqi people.
There is progress across Iraq every day. And every day we and our Iraqi partners are a step closer to accomplishing our objectives.
Now let me just make a couple of points with you.
First of all, the insurgency that we're fighting is not 10 feet tall. They're a tough, aggressive enemy, but they're not 10 feet tall. They're the same people who have repressed the Iraqi people for the last 30 years. They are the reason that over a million Iraqis are missing and why probably several hundred thousand of those missing Iraqis are likely in mass graves around Iraq.
They are focused on their return to dominance so that they can continue to plunder the great natural resources of Iraq. They offer no alternative vision. They offer only intimidation and subjugation.
With the win in Falluja, with the liberation of Falluja, they no longer have any safe havens anywhere in Iraq. And also, as a result of the success in Falluja, it was driven home to them that they cannot defeat the coalition forces.
So they're attacking our will and the will of the Iraqi people. And I personally do not believe that they will defeat the indomitable spirit of 25 million free people who want to build a better live for themselves and for their families.
Second point, the Iraqi security forces are getting stronger every day. Our plan to build the Iraqi military and police forces is broadly on track. By February, there will be 70 trained and equipped battalions in the Iraqi army. One of those will be a mechanized infantry battalion.
Progress has also been made in the police and special police forces. By February, there will be six public order battalions, a special police regiment, four police commando battalions and some nine regional SWAT teams, special weapons and tactics teams, all of them contributing to the fight against the insurgents and the terrorists on a day-to-day basis.
As most of you know, we still have a way to go in this area, but as I said, we're broadly on track and generally very pleased with the performance of the Iraqi security forces.
Third point, reconstruction momentum is building. In June, there were only around 230 projects actually what we call turning dirt, actually started on the ground. By the end of November, there were over 1,000, with a value of over $3 billion. All of this in spite of insurgents' efforts to disrupt the reconstruction process.
This is a great tribute to the folks that work on those projects, particularly in the embassy, and the coalition business men and women who are over there working to build a better Iraq.
The fourth point, the interim government and their security forces are broadly accepted by the Iraqi people. Some poll ratings for the government are as high as 70 percent approval rating. The Iraqi people express a generally favorable opinion about their new army and about their police. And more than 60 percent of Iraqis believe that the country is headed in the right direction and they are optimistic about their future.
We're also broadly on track for the elections. Fourteen of the 18 provinces have four or less incidents of violence a day. And the registration process in most of the country was executed.
The Iraqi election committee is working on some alternative solutions for the two areas of the country in which it was disrupted.
I want to be clear. The insurgents and the terrorists will continue to attack and attempt to disrupt the election process. We see that daily. They won't succeed. The elections in January will then be but another step forward in our relentless progress toward a new Iraq.
Now, if I could say a word to the home audience here in the United States.
As a nation, you can take great pride in the role that our soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines are playing in helping build a better Iraq. Each and every one of them recognizes the importance that successfully accomplishing this mission holds for our own security, and each and every one of them makes a difference every day.
Wherever I go, I see the acts of bravery, compassion and selflessness, and I couldn't be prouder of these wonderful men and women.
Our success to date is also attributed to the men and women of the Iraqi security forces and the coalition who have given their lives to defeat terrorism and to help build a new Iraq.
We grieve with the loved ones of all of our servicemembers and with those of Iraqi servicemembers who have died. We are humbled by their sacrifice and their contribution in bringing freedom to Iraq, and we are humbled by their sacrifice in enhancing the security of the United States and the coalition.
Lastly, we are, especially during the holiday season, also deeply thankful for the love and support of our families and loved of ones, whose sacrifices and strength underpin everything that we do.
Progress toward a constitutionally elected government will not be easy. Nothing worthwhile ever is. But the challenge of helping the people of Iraq build a better future is one that the Iraqi people and the armed forces of 30 freedom-loving countries can take on.
So thank you very much, and I'll take your questions.
QUESTION: General, based at least partly on the candidates the Shia are offering, are you concerned on what influence Iran may have over the Iraqi government after the January elections?
CASEY: I missed the first part of your question.
QUESTION: Based at least in part on the candidates that Shia are offering, are you concerned about the possible influence that Iran might have on the Iraqi government after the election?
CASEY: My personal view, this is political, but I'm there every day and I'll give you just my personal view. I don't see substantial Iranian influence on this particular government that will be elected in January. I see Iran as more of a longer term threat to Iraqi security. But that's just -- that's my view, and I'm a military person who is there.
QUESTION: What do you mean from a longer view? Are you talking about a possible military threat as opposed to political?
CASEY: I'm not talking about that.
I'm just saying, from a strategic perspective, Iran is a long- term threat to stability in Iraq. If you look on the other side, I think Syria is a short-term threat, because of the support they provide to the former Baathist leaders that we see operating in and out of Syria.
QUESTION: General, you talked about how the government is considering alternative solutions in some of those Sunni triangle areas where registration is a problem. And then you said that one of those is holding elections over a longer period of time, more than one day, in other words.
What is your assessment of the security situation in doing that? Doesn't that just give a longer period of time for potential attacks by insurgents?
And also, could you tell us what the American role is in security of those election sites?
CASEY: I do not think the extended election period is still on the table. I know that it was discussed, but I've discussed it with some of the leadership in the Iraqi government. I don't believe it's on the table anymore, at least it wasn't when I left.
We are working closely with the minister of interior and the Iraqi election committee in building a security plan for the elections.
It's not finally formed yet. It will be probably by the end of this month. In general, the role of the coalition forces will be one of broad area security, and it will be the Iraqi security forces that will work the specifics of the polling areas and places like that.
QUESTION: General, how concerned are you that the Sunnis will not participate or not turn out in numbers sufficient, not only because of the security situation, but simply because of disaffection? And if they do, what does that mean?
CASEY: Again, I wish -- my political consultant, John Negroponte, could probably do a better job on this one.
My view is -- I'll give you my opinion. My opinion is that there will be Sunni participation in this and in a reasonable amount.
I believe that the insurgents are pursuing a strategy I call purposeful disenfranchisement by intimidating Sunnis away from the election process so they can say, "Well, the Sunnis didn't vote, so therefore, the election is invalid."
I don't think that's going to be a successful strategy, but it's one that they are trying to implement.
So I think there will be sufficient Sunni participation in this for people to accept the fact that it is a reasonably free and fair election.
QUESTION: You talked about the polling places that will largely be Iraqi security forces there -- what, 9,000 polling places?
CASEY: They are undetermined; somewhere between 6,000 and 9,000; 9,000 is the high end.
QUESTION: And when you look at the number of Iraqi security forces, it seems like there wouldn't be very many Iraqi security forces. If you could talk about that, the numbers at those polling places. And I know you don't want to be too specific on that. But if you'll give us more detail about what the Americans will do. Will they be, sort of, rapid reaction? What?
CASEY: Again, we're still working through the process. But, I mean, it's like any type of security situation. If you want to guard, you don't guard every place just at the point. You guard it away from the point. You restrict access to it. You keep vehicles from moving in the direction of the polling places around them.
I mean, there's a range of options that you do to reduce exposure of these particular sites, rather than just taking 20 or 30 people and huddling around the site itself. That's being worked out.
My experience with elections in the past in Bosnia and Kosovo, again, the forces of the coalition, the security forces normally operate away from the polling sites in an area security role and do provide reaction force, if there's problems.
CASEY: And the other thing we do, and we will do, and are doing, is to continue to conduct operations prior to the elections to disrupt the insurgents and to keep them from disrupting the election process.
So there's an offensive component to this as well.
QUESTION: General, you talk about the progress in security across Iraq. It seems that that airport road is a symbol of what many people say is a growing insurgency. What is the story with that road, and why can't U.S. and Iraqi forces patrol it effectively to stop the attacks that are happening on it?
CASEY: I wouldn't necessarily see it as a symbol of a growing insurgency. I would see it as a symbol of the growing use of car bombs in the insurgency. And that really is the question of the airport road.
It's a tactic that's been adopted by the insurgents. They don't have to do much. A car bomb a day in Baghdad or on the airport road sends a symbol that the insurgency is very powerful, when in actuality I don't believe that they are.
It's a classic technique of the urban insurgent. They are trying to provoke us to do something that will make us look like we're overreacting to them. I mean, you could tie up traffic -- I mean, if you searched every car getting on the airport road, you'd put that part of Baghdad in knots.
So it really is the issue of dealing with car bombs. We continually work on that and we will get to a point where the airport road is secure and our people and the people in the embassy are protected against car bombs.
But as with any battle, it's an action, reaction, counteraction cycle that we go through with the enemy and the enemy does to us.
QUESTION: So is there a plan for that road or just a broader plan for attacking the terrorists and their ability to make car bombs?
CASEY: It's a little bit of each, but we're actively working with the minister of interior and his traffic forces on ways to reduce the threats to our forces on the airport road.
QUESTION: I know you addressed this in your opening remarks. But in your view, are we winning in Iraq and how do you define winning? And as a follow-up, do you believe, given the current situation there, that credible national elections will be held or could be held or are possible to be held by January 30th?
CASEY: My view of winning is that we are broadly on track to accomplishing our objectives, which is a constitutionally elected government that is representative of all the Iraqi people and with Iraqi security forces that are capable of maintaining domestic order and denying Iraq as a safe haven for terror.
I believe we'll get there by the end of December '05, and I believe we are on track to get there by December of '05.
What was the second part?
QUESTION: About the elections. Do you think that... CASEY: I do.
QUESTION: ... given the situation, that credible elections will be held on January 30th?
CASEY: I do. I mean, it is going to be hard. They will fight us every step of the way.
But I do believe credible elections can be held. Again, in the south and in the north, 14 of those 18 provinces that -- what I believe is that they will be uneventful. They will be contested in the center area of the country, but I believe we will succeed in that.
QUESTION: As a final question, how do you -- what do you tell the families of the service men who have been killed and maimed over there? How do you define victory in Iraq, ultimate victory to these people who are losing their loved ones.
CASEY: I think I just did.
PHILLIPS: Army General George Casey briefing reporters there, actually handling the Pentagon briefing today, talking about reconstruction in Iraq and, of course, elections that are set to start at the beginning of the year.
WHITFIELD: And that's going to do it for us for this edition of LIVE FROM.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
