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Jackson Trial Begins; The Low-Down on Oscar Night

Aired February 28, 2005 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: All right. More now on the child molestation trial of Michael Jackson. Want to focus on the legal strategies each side hopes will win its case. Our senior legal analyst, Jeffrey Toobin, has been watching the proceedings today in the California courtroom. He joins us now live from Santa Maria. Jeff, what have you seen so far?
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SR. LEGAL ANALYST: Well, this has been a graphic and combative opening statement by the district attorney, Tom Sneddon. He has laid out in meticulous detail not just the specific incidents that Michael Jackson is accused of, the lewd acts, but sort of the whole story of the relationship between this family and Michael Jackson. What's particularly striking, for anyone who's followed the case, is sitting in that courtroom, the judge has ruled that their names can be used. So in virtually every sentence, the names of the accuser and his family have been used. And of course, we're not going to use them on the air, but it's very striking, the difference from how this case has been covered so far.

O'BRIEN: Jeff, tell us a little bit about the jury. Much has been said about the apparent lack of diversity in this jury. The only African-American is an alternate. Just reading their expressions right now, and I know I'm asking you a lot, reading a lot in, what's your take on where they are right now?

TOOBIN: Well, you know, it's funny, miles. In the first day of any trial, you can tell, the jury is nervous. When they came out for the first time, they didn't know where to sit. So they were sort of stumbling, falling over -- you know, just reorganizing their seats. They are nervous. I mean, the -- this is a lot of attention. They can tell that everyone is looking at them. They're aware of the big responsibility that's being placed on them. Over time, and this is likely to go for several months, they will become more relaxed in their duties. But they are not -- my guess is they are not absorbing everything that Tom Sneddon is saying because it is simply -- there are so many dates, so many names, and it's frankly a little hard to follow at times, that I think it's going to take them a while to adjust to their responsibilities.

O'BRIEN: Is that a mistake, though? If you were, you know, coaching a fellow attorney on an opening statement in a case like this, a prosecutor, would you tell them kind of, you know, less is more?

TOOBIN: Absolutely. I think this has been a somewhat disorganized, repetitive, not easy to follow presentation. All of this evidence is going to come out in court. I don't see the necessity of spewing all these names, dates, going backwards and forwards. Sneddon has a somewhat irritating habit of saying, well, before I get to point A, let me go back to point B, let me jump ahead, let me jump forward. That's hard to follow for people who have never heard any of this evidence before. I don't think it's a great opening statement. But frankly, when this case goes to the jury in so many months, we're not going to be thinking much about opening statements.

O'BRIEN: All right, good point. Jeff Toobin, there in Santa Maria. Appreciate it.

TOOBIN: OK, Miles.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: States like these and their terrorist allies constitute an axis of evil.

And we will never forget the servants of evil.

AYAD ALLAWI, IRAQI INTERIM PRIME MINISTER (through translator): These evil forces will not continue to inflict harm on the Iraqi people.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One more reminder of the evil we face.

TONY BLAIR, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: These are evil, barbaric people.

KOFI ANNAN, U.N. SECRETARY GENERAL: Such an evil must never be allowed to happen again.

JOHN ASHCROFT, FMR. U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: We know that we are locked in a struggle between good and evil.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Evil. The word falls off the lips of world leaders fairly easily, but is the concept of evil something we can easily deal with in our daily lives? On September 11, 2001, our next guest was scheduled to speak in Manhattan on the topic of evil. Well, the terror attacks postponed that speech, but definitely pushed the concept of evil front and center, politically and personally.

September 11th and his own experience of evil were the inspiration for Os Guinness' new book, "Unspeakable: Facing up to Evil in an Age of Genocide and Terror." Author and speaker Os Guinness joins me now from Washington. Os, just listening to all those world leaders, I never, I guess, realized how much we use that word.

OS GUINNESS, AUTHOR, "UNSPEAKABLE": We use it a lot. And we're in the world of atrocities and natural disasters, and yet many people haven't thought about it, which in this country is rather odd because we have evil at the very heart of the constitution and the notion of the separation of powers. And yet many people simply haven't thought through the greatest problem in the modern world. PHILLIPS: Well, let's talk about the greatest problem. You were set to talk about it on September 11th. The terror attacks happened. Why were you -- who were you going to speak to, and did you end up speaking to them days later? A week later?

GUINNESS: Well, I was invited to actually to speak by a group of Wall Street bankers, one of whom had been wrestling with this issue for many, many years. And we did meet a week later. And one of the people there had got down from the 104th floor of the second tower, and he'd lost 66 colleagues in the terrorist strikes. You can imagine, you could have cut the atmosphere with a knife. It was the most extraordinary evening.

PHILLIPS: Os, when you think of evil, is the only way to define it through religious or spiritual explanation, i.e. Adam and Eve or bad karma?

GUINNESS: Well, certainly, you see today that many of the economic, the political, the psychological categories just simply don't get there. Science can't weigh evil or tell you what color evil is. You have to go down to the deep moral issues, which fundamentally are religious. So there's no question -- the oldest answers are the deepest answers.

PHILLIPS: Now, I can imagine many, many people come to you and say Os Guinness, why do bad things happen? I'm curious. How do you define it?

GUINNESS: Well, defining evil, the traditional answer gets the closest, I think, the intent to do harm. But there are many things that doesn't cover today. Now, when you ask me why, we're in a sound- byte culture, it's impossible to put the answer to evil in a sound- byte. So what I do in the book is give them the seven steps through which anyone from any background can think through the problem of evil. I myself am a follower of Jesus Christ, and I would give the Christian/Jewish answer that God does care deeply and suffer with those who suffer. But you can't put the whole thing in a sound-byte.

KAGAN: That's true. And you can't tell everybody, because of Christianity, that's the only way you can understand evil. So how do you...

GUINNESS: No, I don't actually say that, Kyra. What I do is set out the seven steps for thinking it through, and then show first the Eastern answers, the Hindu and the Buddhists, and ask people to look at that, then the secularists, the atheist, the agnostic and look at that. And only then, by force of contrast, do I look at the biblical, the Jewish and the Christian answers, which I personally think are not only the deepest, but also true. But I invite people to look at them and really make up their own minds.

KAGAN: So Os, how do you address the atheists or the secular?

GUINNESS: Well, atheism, and I've known Bertrand Russell and people like A.J. Ayre (ph) when I was at Oxford. You know, they begin with a chance universe, and they move towards a universe that's going towards ultimate extinction. And atheism has an incredible bravery about fighting evil, but as Camus says, "You face neverending defeat." You never have a vision of a world beyond evil and beyond suffering. And there's nobility, but a tremendous bleakness in the real atheist position. And the Jewish and Christian answer, because you have God, who is engaged with you, is a far more hopeful one.

But the challenge for any of us as humans is to have an answer that is, one, realistic, and two, hopeful, and three, courageous. In other words, not just an answer, that allows you to tackle evil and take your part in really facing suffering and also combating real evil as it happens around the world today.

KAGAN: Sure. And of course, it comes down to each one of us and personal transformation, too. Os Guinness. The book is "Unspeakable: Facing up to Evil in an Age of Genocide and Terror." Interesting book. Thanks for your time, Os.

GUINNESS: My pleasure. Thank you, Kyra.

O'BRIEN: All right. We're going to shift gears quite a bit. When LIVE FROM continues, a good night for Jamie Foxx at the Oscars. You saw his acceptance speech for Best Actor. What happened after the show? Sibila Vargas has the dish coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: All righty. We're working on e-mail, we're doing other things. Mantels all over Hollywood sporting shiny new statuettes. The Oscars, of course, are over for another year. And that's good news, right?

PHILLIPS: And the evening didn't quite live up to the hype over that bad boy host. More on that from CNN entertainment correspondent Sibila Vargas in Los Angeles. Sibila, you look pretty wide awake, refreshed. You weren't out too late?

SIBILA VARGAS, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: I was out late, believe me. But I'm here. I made it. That's right, guys. With all the controversy surrounding Chris Rock, this year's Oscar was one of the most anticipated ever. Wouldn't you say? But the biggest surprise of the evening was that there really weren't any surprises at all.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

HALLE BERRY, ACTRESS: The Oscar goes to...

PIERCE BROSNAN, ACTOR: Sandy Powell, for "The Aviator."

KIRSTEN DUNST, ACTRESS: Thelma Skumacher (ph) for "The Aviator."

BERRY: Dante Feretti (ph), for "The Aviator."

VARGAS (voice-over): In the early rounds at the Oscars, "The Aviator" racked up points. But in the final realm, the film went down to the count. The boxing drama "Million Dollar Baby" claimed the title of Best Picture.

BARBARA STREISAND, ACTRESS: I'm so happy to give this to you again, Clint.

VARGAS: As producer, Clint Eastwood shared the Best Picture prize. But the trophy for best director was his alone.

EASTWOOD: I'd like to thank my wife, who is my best pal down here.

VARGAS: At age 74, he's almost as old as Oscar himself.

EASTWOOD: I've watched Sidney Lemett (ph) out there, who's 80, and I figure, I'm just a kid.

VARGAS: "Million Dollar Baby" also earned two acting trophies, one for Morgan Freeman for supporting role, and another for Hilary Swank, the second Best Actress win of her career.

HILARY SWANK, BEST ACTRESS WINNER: It's really one of the most surreal things. And even standing here right now talking, I feel like I may be dreaming.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the Oscar goes to -- Cate Blanchett in "The Aviator."

VARGAS: "The Aviator's" Cate Blanchett won Best Supporting Actress. No surprise there. No surprise, either, when it came to Best Actor.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Jamie Foxx in "Ray."

JAMIE FOXX, BEST ACTOR WINNER: And I can't wait to go to sleep tonight because we've got a lot to talk about. I love you.

VARGAS (on camera): Going into the show, everyone was wondering what would Chris Rock say? Well, he didn't play it safe. He even reserved some barbs for the stars, which later drew a response from Sean Penn.

CHRIS ROCK, COMEDIAN/OSCARS HOST: Who is Jude Law? Why is he in every movie I have seen the last four years?

SEAN PENN, ACTOR: I did want to answer our host's question about who Jude Law is. He's one of our finest actors.

VARGAS (voice-over): A little punch, counter-punch on a night that belonged to "Million Dollar Baby."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VARGAS: So there you have it. A big night, indeed, for "Million Dollar Baby." Back to you guys.

O'BRIEN: All right. Big night for Jamie Foxx, as well. VARGAS: Absolutely. Jamie Foxx, I mean, that's what we've all been hearing about for the last six months. And you've got to give it to the man. He's one of the most compelling entertainment stories of the year, how this incredible role has launched him into superstardom. He gave one of the most heartfelt speeches of the night, at least in my opinion. How could you not root for him? And you can bet it was a long night for the Oscar winner. In fact, my Oscar special co-host, Karyn Bryant, caught up with Foxx at the governor's ball.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KARYN BRYANT, HEADLINE NEWS ANCHOR: You going to get your drink on tonight?

FOXX: Tonight, we may have a little champagne tonight to bring the night in, right? But you know what? It's a great feeling right now. Right now is the most incredible feeling you can ever imagine. So we will celebrate tonight and it will be fun, but it's just been so beautiful.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VARGAS: And it has been a beautiful ride for Foxx. This makes him the third black man in history to get an Oscar for best actor -- Kyra.

O'BRIEN: All right, what about ratings? How did they do?

VARGAS: The show did very well, considering how poorly the other awards show have been performing. I mean, think about the Golden Globes and the Grammys. Not very good this year. But early reports say that the ratings were slightly higher than last year and it was the highest-rated Academy Awards since 2000. Not bad. You can bet some of that had to do with all the controversy that swirled around Chris Rock hosting the show. So after all, it might have been a good choice -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Thank you, Sibila.

O'BRIEN: He created a little controversy there. You don't think that was to spike the ratings, do you?

PHILLIPS: You never know.

O'BRIEN: Sibila Vargas, thank you very much.

Hollywood is certainly talking about Chris Rock's edgy performance hosting the Oscars. And he did stir up a little controversy in advance. And there was -- well, a little less profanity than normal, wouldn't you say?

PHILLIPS: And a lot of responses, too, from e-mails.

O'BRIEN: Biting wit, however, targets inside and outside the movie industry.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROCK: Now, just imagine you worked at the Gap. You're $70 trillion behind on your register, and then you start a war with Banana Republic because you say they got toxic tank tops over there.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: All right. So you've been sending us your e-mails. Everybody's a critic, after all. So let's share a few. Kyra and I will do it together.

Chuck in Ironton, Missouri, has this: "Chris was being Chris. He pokes fun because this is what he gets paid to do. He was a little aggressive with the 'stars' comments. I was surprised to know there were only four of them. I asked Chris won't be getting any flowers from Sean Penn anytime soon." Or Jude Law, for that matter.

PHILLIPS: John in Virginia: "Distasteful and old news. Election bias is a thing of the past. Chris Rock doesn't fit the criteria of host."

O'BRIEN: Sawbrown with this: "Chris Rock rocked! I loved his performance. Jude Law was in a lot of movies last year. I noticed it, didn't you?"

PHILLIPS: All right. Willis from Washington, D.C.: "Rock was great -- if anything, there should have been more of him. Billy Crystal seemed to get twice the screen time when he hosted. They tied his hands and he still got in some sharp, witty jabs at the self- important nitwits who get paid very well to, essentially, play pretend.

O'BRIEN: And L.E. in Ohion has this: "Immature, offensive, shallow. I didn't even smile once. What more need I say."

I don't think there is anything more to say, L.E.

PHILLIPS: Rachel in Maryland: "If anything, I thought Chris Rock wasn't irreverent enough. The movie industry is sickeningly self- congratulatory and it was a lot of fun to see Rock poke some fun at it. Movies are fun. But ultimately, actors are often not very smart people making obscene amounts of money to do something that doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of life. Where's the fuss over cops or teachers?"

Rachel makes a good point there.

O'BRIEN: All right. There you go. The teachers' Academy Awards. I want to thank all the little people, and Jimmy, give me that book report you own me.

PHILLIPS: All right. If you've seen "Million Dollar Baby," you know what life can be like for female boxers.

O'BRIEN: I don't have a clue. I haven't seen it. Is it animated? PHILLIPS: Hey. In our next half hour, this is one woman that can kick your butt, Miles. We're going to tell you all about her.

O'BRIEN: I don't think there's any doubt of that.

Oh, and sharks, sharks! Oh, no! Close encounters off the Florida coast. Cue the cellos. Watch out for the sharks.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, in Boynton Beach, Florida, those black spots in the water are sharks, and they're cruising just offshore as blissfully unaware beachgoers yesterday enjoyed the sun and surf just yards away. Lifeguards quickly closed the beach once the fish were sighted. Luckily there were no injuries to report.

Well, as Americans keep pushing the limits of retirement. A new Web site could help older workers find the right job. Chris Huntington joins us live from the New York Stock Exchange with that report -- Chris.

CHRIS HUNTINGTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Kyra, well, in 2010, one in three workers will be over the age of 50. And companies that might want to get a jump on recruiting these older and experienced workers just might find some help from the American Association of Retired Persons, AARP. The seniors group has launched a new job section on its Web site. This could be a useful tool for both employers and employees.

Most Baby Boomers, apparently, plan to continue working after they retire from the full-fledged rat race. Some plan to do it as a way to supplement their income. But most say they'll work to keep their minds sharp. AARP's Web site will let job seekers make comparisons on factors like health insurance and flexible hours -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Another big drug recall today. What's that one about?

HUNTINGTON: Yes, this is serious, Kyra. A multiple sclerosis drug named Tysabri which had shown a lot of promise. Its makers, the American biotech company Biogen and an Irish pharmaceutical firm Elan, are withdrawing the drug voluntarily from the market after one patient died and another developed a serious disease to the central nervous system. Shares of both of those companies are getting severely punished on Wall Street right now. Biogen shares down more than 44 percent. Elan has lost more than two-thirds of its value.

(STOCK MARKET REPORT)

PHILLIPS: Thanks, Chris.

O'BRIEN: Thank you, Chris.

Kyra and I are with you for another half hour of LIVE FROM. The suspected BTK killer is behind bars. That's one problem solved, we think. Now police have another. An explanation and a live report from Wichita.

PHILLIPS: Also ahead, rejoicing in the streets of one Middle Eastern city, a nation's entire government abruptly resigns. We'll tell you about it. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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Aired February 28, 2005 - 14:30   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: All right. More now on the child molestation trial of Michael Jackson. Want to focus on the legal strategies each side hopes will win its case. Our senior legal analyst, Jeffrey Toobin, has been watching the proceedings today in the California courtroom. He joins us now live from Santa Maria. Jeff, what have you seen so far?
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SR. LEGAL ANALYST: Well, this has been a graphic and combative opening statement by the district attorney, Tom Sneddon. He has laid out in meticulous detail not just the specific incidents that Michael Jackson is accused of, the lewd acts, but sort of the whole story of the relationship between this family and Michael Jackson. What's particularly striking, for anyone who's followed the case, is sitting in that courtroom, the judge has ruled that their names can be used. So in virtually every sentence, the names of the accuser and his family have been used. And of course, we're not going to use them on the air, but it's very striking, the difference from how this case has been covered so far.

O'BRIEN: Jeff, tell us a little bit about the jury. Much has been said about the apparent lack of diversity in this jury. The only African-American is an alternate. Just reading their expressions right now, and I know I'm asking you a lot, reading a lot in, what's your take on where they are right now?

TOOBIN: Well, you know, it's funny, miles. In the first day of any trial, you can tell, the jury is nervous. When they came out for the first time, they didn't know where to sit. So they were sort of stumbling, falling over -- you know, just reorganizing their seats. They are nervous. I mean, the -- this is a lot of attention. They can tell that everyone is looking at them. They're aware of the big responsibility that's being placed on them. Over time, and this is likely to go for several months, they will become more relaxed in their duties. But they are not -- my guess is they are not absorbing everything that Tom Sneddon is saying because it is simply -- there are so many dates, so many names, and it's frankly a little hard to follow at times, that I think it's going to take them a while to adjust to their responsibilities.

O'BRIEN: Is that a mistake, though? If you were, you know, coaching a fellow attorney on an opening statement in a case like this, a prosecutor, would you tell them kind of, you know, less is more?

TOOBIN: Absolutely. I think this has been a somewhat disorganized, repetitive, not easy to follow presentation. All of this evidence is going to come out in court. I don't see the necessity of spewing all these names, dates, going backwards and forwards. Sneddon has a somewhat irritating habit of saying, well, before I get to point A, let me go back to point B, let me jump ahead, let me jump forward. That's hard to follow for people who have never heard any of this evidence before. I don't think it's a great opening statement. But frankly, when this case goes to the jury in so many months, we're not going to be thinking much about opening statements.

O'BRIEN: All right, good point. Jeff Toobin, there in Santa Maria. Appreciate it.

TOOBIN: OK, Miles.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: States like these and their terrorist allies constitute an axis of evil.

And we will never forget the servants of evil.

AYAD ALLAWI, IRAQI INTERIM PRIME MINISTER (through translator): These evil forces will not continue to inflict harm on the Iraqi people.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One more reminder of the evil we face.

TONY BLAIR, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: These are evil, barbaric people.

KOFI ANNAN, U.N. SECRETARY GENERAL: Such an evil must never be allowed to happen again.

JOHN ASHCROFT, FMR. U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: We know that we are locked in a struggle between good and evil.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Evil. The word falls off the lips of world leaders fairly easily, but is the concept of evil something we can easily deal with in our daily lives? On September 11, 2001, our next guest was scheduled to speak in Manhattan on the topic of evil. Well, the terror attacks postponed that speech, but definitely pushed the concept of evil front and center, politically and personally.

September 11th and his own experience of evil were the inspiration for Os Guinness' new book, "Unspeakable: Facing up to Evil in an Age of Genocide and Terror." Author and speaker Os Guinness joins me now from Washington. Os, just listening to all those world leaders, I never, I guess, realized how much we use that word.

OS GUINNESS, AUTHOR, "UNSPEAKABLE": We use it a lot. And we're in the world of atrocities and natural disasters, and yet many people haven't thought about it, which in this country is rather odd because we have evil at the very heart of the constitution and the notion of the separation of powers. And yet many people simply haven't thought through the greatest problem in the modern world. PHILLIPS: Well, let's talk about the greatest problem. You were set to talk about it on September 11th. The terror attacks happened. Why were you -- who were you going to speak to, and did you end up speaking to them days later? A week later?

GUINNESS: Well, I was invited to actually to speak by a group of Wall Street bankers, one of whom had been wrestling with this issue for many, many years. And we did meet a week later. And one of the people there had got down from the 104th floor of the second tower, and he'd lost 66 colleagues in the terrorist strikes. You can imagine, you could have cut the atmosphere with a knife. It was the most extraordinary evening.

PHILLIPS: Os, when you think of evil, is the only way to define it through religious or spiritual explanation, i.e. Adam and Eve or bad karma?

GUINNESS: Well, certainly, you see today that many of the economic, the political, the psychological categories just simply don't get there. Science can't weigh evil or tell you what color evil is. You have to go down to the deep moral issues, which fundamentally are religious. So there's no question -- the oldest answers are the deepest answers.

PHILLIPS: Now, I can imagine many, many people come to you and say Os Guinness, why do bad things happen? I'm curious. How do you define it?

GUINNESS: Well, defining evil, the traditional answer gets the closest, I think, the intent to do harm. But there are many things that doesn't cover today. Now, when you ask me why, we're in a sound- byte culture, it's impossible to put the answer to evil in a sound- byte. So what I do in the book is give them the seven steps through which anyone from any background can think through the problem of evil. I myself am a follower of Jesus Christ, and I would give the Christian/Jewish answer that God does care deeply and suffer with those who suffer. But you can't put the whole thing in a sound-byte.

KAGAN: That's true. And you can't tell everybody, because of Christianity, that's the only way you can understand evil. So how do you...

GUINNESS: No, I don't actually say that, Kyra. What I do is set out the seven steps for thinking it through, and then show first the Eastern answers, the Hindu and the Buddhists, and ask people to look at that, then the secularists, the atheist, the agnostic and look at that. And only then, by force of contrast, do I look at the biblical, the Jewish and the Christian answers, which I personally think are not only the deepest, but also true. But I invite people to look at them and really make up their own minds.

KAGAN: So Os, how do you address the atheists or the secular?

GUINNESS: Well, atheism, and I've known Bertrand Russell and people like A.J. Ayre (ph) when I was at Oxford. You know, they begin with a chance universe, and they move towards a universe that's going towards ultimate extinction. And atheism has an incredible bravery about fighting evil, but as Camus says, "You face neverending defeat." You never have a vision of a world beyond evil and beyond suffering. And there's nobility, but a tremendous bleakness in the real atheist position. And the Jewish and Christian answer, because you have God, who is engaged with you, is a far more hopeful one.

But the challenge for any of us as humans is to have an answer that is, one, realistic, and two, hopeful, and three, courageous. In other words, not just an answer, that allows you to tackle evil and take your part in really facing suffering and also combating real evil as it happens around the world today.

KAGAN: Sure. And of course, it comes down to each one of us and personal transformation, too. Os Guinness. The book is "Unspeakable: Facing up to Evil in an Age of Genocide and Terror." Interesting book. Thanks for your time, Os.

GUINNESS: My pleasure. Thank you, Kyra.

O'BRIEN: All right. We're going to shift gears quite a bit. When LIVE FROM continues, a good night for Jamie Foxx at the Oscars. You saw his acceptance speech for Best Actor. What happened after the show? Sibila Vargas has the dish coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: All righty. We're working on e-mail, we're doing other things. Mantels all over Hollywood sporting shiny new statuettes. The Oscars, of course, are over for another year. And that's good news, right?

PHILLIPS: And the evening didn't quite live up to the hype over that bad boy host. More on that from CNN entertainment correspondent Sibila Vargas in Los Angeles. Sibila, you look pretty wide awake, refreshed. You weren't out too late?

SIBILA VARGAS, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: I was out late, believe me. But I'm here. I made it. That's right, guys. With all the controversy surrounding Chris Rock, this year's Oscar was one of the most anticipated ever. Wouldn't you say? But the biggest surprise of the evening was that there really weren't any surprises at all.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

HALLE BERRY, ACTRESS: The Oscar goes to...

PIERCE BROSNAN, ACTOR: Sandy Powell, for "The Aviator."

KIRSTEN DUNST, ACTRESS: Thelma Skumacher (ph) for "The Aviator."

BERRY: Dante Feretti (ph), for "The Aviator."

VARGAS (voice-over): In the early rounds at the Oscars, "The Aviator" racked up points. But in the final realm, the film went down to the count. The boxing drama "Million Dollar Baby" claimed the title of Best Picture.

BARBARA STREISAND, ACTRESS: I'm so happy to give this to you again, Clint.

VARGAS: As producer, Clint Eastwood shared the Best Picture prize. But the trophy for best director was his alone.

EASTWOOD: I'd like to thank my wife, who is my best pal down here.

VARGAS: At age 74, he's almost as old as Oscar himself.

EASTWOOD: I've watched Sidney Lemett (ph) out there, who's 80, and I figure, I'm just a kid.

VARGAS: "Million Dollar Baby" also earned two acting trophies, one for Morgan Freeman for supporting role, and another for Hilary Swank, the second Best Actress win of her career.

HILARY SWANK, BEST ACTRESS WINNER: It's really one of the most surreal things. And even standing here right now talking, I feel like I may be dreaming.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the Oscar goes to -- Cate Blanchett in "The Aviator."

VARGAS: "The Aviator's" Cate Blanchett won Best Supporting Actress. No surprise there. No surprise, either, when it came to Best Actor.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Jamie Foxx in "Ray."

JAMIE FOXX, BEST ACTOR WINNER: And I can't wait to go to sleep tonight because we've got a lot to talk about. I love you.

VARGAS (on camera): Going into the show, everyone was wondering what would Chris Rock say? Well, he didn't play it safe. He even reserved some barbs for the stars, which later drew a response from Sean Penn.

CHRIS ROCK, COMEDIAN/OSCARS HOST: Who is Jude Law? Why is he in every movie I have seen the last four years?

SEAN PENN, ACTOR: I did want to answer our host's question about who Jude Law is. He's one of our finest actors.

VARGAS (voice-over): A little punch, counter-punch on a night that belonged to "Million Dollar Baby."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VARGAS: So there you have it. A big night, indeed, for "Million Dollar Baby." Back to you guys.

O'BRIEN: All right. Big night for Jamie Foxx, as well. VARGAS: Absolutely. Jamie Foxx, I mean, that's what we've all been hearing about for the last six months. And you've got to give it to the man. He's one of the most compelling entertainment stories of the year, how this incredible role has launched him into superstardom. He gave one of the most heartfelt speeches of the night, at least in my opinion. How could you not root for him? And you can bet it was a long night for the Oscar winner. In fact, my Oscar special co-host, Karyn Bryant, caught up with Foxx at the governor's ball.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KARYN BRYANT, HEADLINE NEWS ANCHOR: You going to get your drink on tonight?

FOXX: Tonight, we may have a little champagne tonight to bring the night in, right? But you know what? It's a great feeling right now. Right now is the most incredible feeling you can ever imagine. So we will celebrate tonight and it will be fun, but it's just been so beautiful.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VARGAS: And it has been a beautiful ride for Foxx. This makes him the third black man in history to get an Oscar for best actor -- Kyra.

O'BRIEN: All right, what about ratings? How did they do?

VARGAS: The show did very well, considering how poorly the other awards show have been performing. I mean, think about the Golden Globes and the Grammys. Not very good this year. But early reports say that the ratings were slightly higher than last year and it was the highest-rated Academy Awards since 2000. Not bad. You can bet some of that had to do with all the controversy that swirled around Chris Rock hosting the show. So after all, it might have been a good choice -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Thank you, Sibila.

O'BRIEN: He created a little controversy there. You don't think that was to spike the ratings, do you?

PHILLIPS: You never know.

O'BRIEN: Sibila Vargas, thank you very much.

Hollywood is certainly talking about Chris Rock's edgy performance hosting the Oscars. And he did stir up a little controversy in advance. And there was -- well, a little less profanity than normal, wouldn't you say?

PHILLIPS: And a lot of responses, too, from e-mails.

O'BRIEN: Biting wit, however, targets inside and outside the movie industry.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROCK: Now, just imagine you worked at the Gap. You're $70 trillion behind on your register, and then you start a war with Banana Republic because you say they got toxic tank tops over there.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: All right. So you've been sending us your e-mails. Everybody's a critic, after all. So let's share a few. Kyra and I will do it together.

Chuck in Ironton, Missouri, has this: "Chris was being Chris. He pokes fun because this is what he gets paid to do. He was a little aggressive with the 'stars' comments. I was surprised to know there were only four of them. I asked Chris won't be getting any flowers from Sean Penn anytime soon." Or Jude Law, for that matter.

PHILLIPS: John in Virginia: "Distasteful and old news. Election bias is a thing of the past. Chris Rock doesn't fit the criteria of host."

O'BRIEN: Sawbrown with this: "Chris Rock rocked! I loved his performance. Jude Law was in a lot of movies last year. I noticed it, didn't you?"

PHILLIPS: All right. Willis from Washington, D.C.: "Rock was great -- if anything, there should have been more of him. Billy Crystal seemed to get twice the screen time when he hosted. They tied his hands and he still got in some sharp, witty jabs at the self- important nitwits who get paid very well to, essentially, play pretend.

O'BRIEN: And L.E. in Ohion has this: "Immature, offensive, shallow. I didn't even smile once. What more need I say."

I don't think there is anything more to say, L.E.

PHILLIPS: Rachel in Maryland: "If anything, I thought Chris Rock wasn't irreverent enough. The movie industry is sickeningly self- congratulatory and it was a lot of fun to see Rock poke some fun at it. Movies are fun. But ultimately, actors are often not very smart people making obscene amounts of money to do something that doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of life. Where's the fuss over cops or teachers?"

Rachel makes a good point there.

O'BRIEN: All right. There you go. The teachers' Academy Awards. I want to thank all the little people, and Jimmy, give me that book report you own me.

PHILLIPS: All right. If you've seen "Million Dollar Baby," you know what life can be like for female boxers.

O'BRIEN: I don't have a clue. I haven't seen it. Is it animated? PHILLIPS: Hey. In our next half hour, this is one woman that can kick your butt, Miles. We're going to tell you all about her.

O'BRIEN: I don't think there's any doubt of that.

Oh, and sharks, sharks! Oh, no! Close encounters off the Florida coast. Cue the cellos. Watch out for the sharks.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, in Boynton Beach, Florida, those black spots in the water are sharks, and they're cruising just offshore as blissfully unaware beachgoers yesterday enjoyed the sun and surf just yards away. Lifeguards quickly closed the beach once the fish were sighted. Luckily there were no injuries to report.

Well, as Americans keep pushing the limits of retirement. A new Web site could help older workers find the right job. Chris Huntington joins us live from the New York Stock Exchange with that report -- Chris.

CHRIS HUNTINGTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Kyra, well, in 2010, one in three workers will be over the age of 50. And companies that might want to get a jump on recruiting these older and experienced workers just might find some help from the American Association of Retired Persons, AARP. The seniors group has launched a new job section on its Web site. This could be a useful tool for both employers and employees.

Most Baby Boomers, apparently, plan to continue working after they retire from the full-fledged rat race. Some plan to do it as a way to supplement their income. But most say they'll work to keep their minds sharp. AARP's Web site will let job seekers make comparisons on factors like health insurance and flexible hours -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Another big drug recall today. What's that one about?

HUNTINGTON: Yes, this is serious, Kyra. A multiple sclerosis drug named Tysabri which had shown a lot of promise. Its makers, the American biotech company Biogen and an Irish pharmaceutical firm Elan, are withdrawing the drug voluntarily from the market after one patient died and another developed a serious disease to the central nervous system. Shares of both of those companies are getting severely punished on Wall Street right now. Biogen shares down more than 44 percent. Elan has lost more than two-thirds of its value.

(STOCK MARKET REPORT)

PHILLIPS: Thanks, Chris.

O'BRIEN: Thank you, Chris.

Kyra and I are with you for another half hour of LIVE FROM. The suspected BTK killer is behind bars. That's one problem solved, we think. Now police have another. An explanation and a live report from Wichita.

PHILLIPS: Also ahead, rejoicing in the streets of one Middle Eastern city, a nation's entire government abruptly resigns. We'll tell you about it. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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