Return to Transcripts main page

Live From...

Tense Hostage Standoff as Man Kidnaps Daughter, Her Mother; Abuse Victims Protest Cardinal Law's Role in Mass for Pope; Senate Committee Weighs U.N. Nomination

Aired April 11, 2005 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


MILES O'BRIEN, CO-HOST: Mass demonstrations, strong emotions for victims of sexual abuse. Find out why they don't want this cardinal in a leading role.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CO-HOST: Trouble at the TSA. What does it mean for safety in the skies? We'll go in-depth with what's next with the agency guarding against terror in the air.

And the man who had Tiger by the tail made history at the masters. PGA golfer Chris DiMarco, joining us, live.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: For 13 years, silicon breast implants have been off the market, used in chemical trials only. Now they might be back. I'll have the details, coming right up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: CNN's Dr. Sanjay Gupta on that story. From the CNN Center in Atlanta, I'm Kyra Phillips.

O'BRIEN: And I'm Miles O'Brien. CNN's LIVE FROM starts right now.

PHILLIPS: A story we continue to follow at the top of the hour. That standoff still going on right now in Irvington, New Jersey. An Amber Alert turned into this police standoff near Interstate 78.

Irvington police issuing the child abduction alert when the father of a 4-year-old fled with her mother after allegedly shooting the grandfather this morning. Police still surrounding that car. Believed that three people are inside. Negotiations have begun, we are told.

Our Deb Feyerick right now joining us from New York with more on what's happening in New Jersey. Can you bring us up to date, Deb?

DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: ... the suspect, apparently her boyfriend about a month ago. She even tried taking out a restraining order against him, and that was in the works but he was not served with the restraining order, which apparently was meant to keep him away from her. There was a domestic dispute about a month ago. He started making threatening phone calls to her. He even abducted her last week. Took her from her home and then brought her back unharmed a little while later. We are told that there was an arrest warrant out for him in connection with that incident.

Now, she was so scared by this man, Almutah Saunders, that she even asked her dad to bring her back and forth from work. That is the man there. That is the suspect, Almutah -- Almutah Saunders.

Apparently, Saunders shot the father this morning in the leg. This was just immediately before the kidnapping of the woman and the couple's 4-month-old baby Jada. So again, it appears that this man, Almutah Saunders, was trying to get his daughter, 4-month-old Jada. There was a high-speed chase earlier this morning, going up to 90 miles an hour.

The grandfather -- there's Erika Turner. That's the woman, and that's the 4-month-old baby. And it apparently was her father who called police. And an Amber Alert was issued, saying that they were being kidnapped and that the man did have a gun.

They were on a highway and, apparently, at one point, she was actually able to make a 911 call, saying that he had had a change of heart, that he was going to release either her or he was going to release the both of them together. But then they drove into this housing complex, which is filled with sort of dead ends and cul-de- sacs, and that's where this whole chase ended.

Police began surrounding the area. They made their way around the car, and at one point the car even started rolling away from the location that it had been in. It didn't get very far. It ended up pulling back in to this space where you see it now.

There's a hostage negotiator just in that center car right there, the one where you see those police officers, members of the SWAT team there, all with shields, ready to go in if something happens. The hostage negotiator, apparently to the left of the car in the gray sweatshirt, has been in communication with him, either by cell phone, but also talking, announced helicopters to clear out, because apparently the suspect's having trouble hearing, and they want to make sure that everybody gets out unharmed -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Deb Feyerick, the details there in our New York bureau.

Meanwhile, on the phone with us, former SWAT commander Howard Robertson. He works in the New Orleans Police Department, trained negotiators and, of course, commanded scenes like this for a number of years.

Howard, taking a look at this situation right now, you see the negotiations are already in progress, SWAT team there at the scene. At what point do negotiations end and the SWAT team move in?

HOWARD ROBERTSON, FORMER SWAT COMMANDER: Kyra, that's going to be a real, real touchy subject, because no matter what the police did here, they're going to be wrong.

If they move in too soon, they could cause someone to get hurt. If they wait too long until after he begins shooting, then they're going to say they waited too long and caused the deaths. That's a real touchy call.

But right now, you've got a lot of positive things happening, in that he's at least listening. He's at least conversing with the negotiator, which is positive.

They've already brought water to them, which means that he's at least thinking logically. You know, he's not out of his mind, where he's going to do something silly. He's thinking. He's starting to talk about taking water and maybe something else later on, where maybe they can exchange for a hostage. That's a positive thing.

PHILLIPS: So when you think of a scenario that could get a lot worse -- I mean, just kind of backing up a little bit, police saying he shot the grandfather in the leg.

ROBERSON: Right.

PHILLIPS: So I'm thinking, OK. If he wanted to kill the grandfather, he probably could have. Is that a sign that maybe he's just trying to get some attention, that he's not really going to kill them? Because if he had the intention of taking his life, the mother's life, the baby's life, even the grandfather's life, wouldn't he have done that by now?

ROBERTSON: You can't go on that assumption, because if you do, then you're making an assumption that he's not going to shoot either the child or the mother or even one of the police officers. You cannot make that assumption. You have to assume that he is capable of killing people.

The good thing is, though, when you're negotiating with him, you can tell him that he was only shot in the leg, that you know, that he hasn't committed a murder. That's things that you can deal with, that you can still get him to calm down and say, "Look, there is a tomorrow for me. You know, today's not the last day of my life. There is a tomorrow."

If you look at how they're staged right now, there's a lot of things here. The -- the assault team is standing outside the whole time. You've been there before. You know what that feels like. They're going to get tired very quickly. And you hope that, because they're staged like that, that then they don't make a decision to assault too soon, because of, you know, becoming tired.

The negotiator seems like he has a really good hand on it, and the longer they talk, the more chance they have of getting them out. Remember earlier when he talked about releasing the wife?

PHILLIPS: Yes, he did. He considered it.

ROBERTSON: So that's in his head. And that's what you want to do, just keep him talking, just keep him talking, keep letting him know that he does have a chance. There is a tomorrow. Let's let these people live. He did love them at one time. He obviously still loves his daughter. He doesn't want to hurt her.

There's a strong, strong possibility, as long as the negotiator has him talking, that this can end positive.

PHILLIPS: Former SWAT commander for the New Orleans Police Department, Howard Robertson, thank you so much.

On the phone with us now also, police director for Irvington, New Jersey, the area where the scenario is going down, Michael Damiano.

What can you tell us about the progress that the negotiator has made at this point? Michael, is he having a good conversation with the suspect?

MICHAEL DAMIANO, POLICE DIRECTOR, IRVINGTON, NEW JERSEY: Well, I think any conversation with the suspect is good. The dialogue is open. It's ongoing. So we are exchanging some information, and, in fact, that's a good sign at this point.

PHILLIPS: And at this point do you know for sure that that 4- month-old baby, Jada, is alive, in addition to the mother, Erika Turner? Is she still alive? Are they all three in that car?

DAMIANO: We cannot see the child at this point. We have information there is a male and female in that car, male and female adult. We have no additional information. We don't want to get too close to the vehicle for obvious reasons.

PHILLIPS: What has the suspect said to your negotiator? Do you have any details about the conversation that's taken place between your hostage negotiator and Almutah Saunders, the suspect in that car?

DAMIANO: Well, quite frankly, just an open dialogue, just exchanging different thoughts about different things at this point. And we're trying desperately to have him turn himself in and certainly give us the child and the female hostage, as well. So I think the entire nature of the conversation surrounds around that issue.

PHILLIPS: Michael Damiano, police director there in Irvington, New Jersey. Thank you so much.

Real quickly, if you're just tuning in, it's a story we're going to continue to follow. It's an Amber Alert that turned into a police standoff. It's going on near Interstate 78 right here in Irvington, New Jersey.

A negotiator, police negotiator, SWAT team by his side. Right now we are told they have established dialogue with this suspected gunman in this car, possibly holding his 4-month-old daughter, Jada, and the mother of that child, Erika Turner, hostage in that car. Police not able to confirm if, indeed, the baby's in the car, but they believe indeed that she is, that a dialogue has been established. We're going to continue to let you know as this moves on, if, indeed, he does give up, and that family is returned to safety -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: All right. We're watching that for you.

Honor and dishonor at the Vatican, meanwhile. A week before the start of the conclave to choose the next pope, one of voting cardinals in the spotlight. And the Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests, SNAP, it is called, is incensed.

The cardinal, Bernard Law, the former archbishop of Boston, who resigned in a scandal 2 1/2 years ago, you'll recall. And he now serves as the arch priest of a major Rome cathedral. It is in that capacity that Law celebrated one of the nine morning masses for Pope John Paul II, an accolade SNAP finds inappropriate at best.

CNN's Dan Lothian reports, many agree in Boston.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAN LOTHIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The Boston Archdiocese is still reeling from the priest sex abuse scandal which exploded three years ago. Some believe it is partly to blame for the closing of some 60 parishes after millions of dollars in settlements were paid out.

RHONDA DUE, BOSTON CATHOLIC: We are mortgaging our future to pay for the sins of the past.

LOTHIAN: Yesterday critics continued to lash out at the church.

JOHN ROGERS, BOSTON CATHOLIC: And every opportunity they have said it's not about the money, but their actions prove otherwise.

LOTHIAN: And the actions of one man continues to draw fire. Cardinal Bernard Law was archbishop in Boston when the scandal broke.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He did not defend the children. He defended the church.

LOTHIAN: Law, who was named in hundreds of lawsuits filed by victims, was abused of protecting pedophile priests, like the one Gary Bergeron says sexually molested him when he was in the sixth grade.

GARY BERGERON, SEX ABUSE VICTIM: The man doesn't understand what's been going on in, you know, the lives of thousands of men that were abused. I think he still doesn't understand what the effects have been on our lives.

LOTHIAN: According to church documents, when complaints came to Law's attention, he knowingly shuffled dozens of priests accused of abuse from parish to parish. Law acknowledged doing just that with Father John Geoghan. Geoghan was convicted on two counts of child rape and later died in prison.

But when the scandal first became public, Law condemned the press instead of the priests.

BERNARD LAW, ARCH PRIEST, ST. MARY MAJOR BASILICA, ROME: Call down God's power on the weak.

LOTHIAN: In the wake of the scandal, Law resigned, but a short time later, Pope John Paul II appointed him arch priest of St. Mary Major Basilica in Rome. Although a largely ceremonial position, some abuse victims saw it as a slap in the face.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was not stripped of anything. He just left town.

ALEXA MCPHERSON, SEX ABUSE VICTIM: How do I as a victim begin to heal going through that, seeing this? I can't.

LOTHIAN: Now, Law's role, presiding over one of the nine funeral masses for the pope, is again opening deep wounds.

BERGERON: I think he still doesn't understand the immense amount of damage that needs to be repaired before it's safe for him to come out into the public.

LOTHIAN (on camera): The church has apologized for the sins of the fathers. As for Cardinal Law, he declined to talk about the abuse scandal in a recent television interview, saying only that, quote, "all of us deplore in our own lives and in the lives of others a failure to live out the message of Christ."

Dan Lothian, CNN, Boston.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Well, the stage is set for the conclave, due to start one week from today, as Miles mentioned. And that is the stage. Though the whole process is wrapped up in the utmost secrecy, the Vatican did release pictures of the new hotel where the cardinals will be put up, the Sistine Chapel, where they'll deliberate and vote. Even a stove where the ballots will be burned.

Ina break from centuries of tradition, the cardinals won't be locked in the Sistine Chapel throughout, but they did swear not to communicate with the outside world.

O'BRIEN: Well, can an undiplomatic diplomat be America's top U.N. diplomat? That's the question before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, as grills the president's highly controversial nominee for U.N. ambassador. His name is John Bolton.

CNN State Department correspondent Andrea Koppel is watching and listening for us -- Andrea.

ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Miles, grilled is the operative word. In fact, you could say that many Democrats who questioned John Bolton this morning here were on the attack.

They really have a two pronged approach here. One, to try to lay out evidence that they believe shows John Bolton is somebody who doesn't want to do business with the U.N. They want to, in fact, show him in his own words as Senator Barbara Boxer, Democrat of California did, expressing open disdain for the United Nations.

There was a little bit of a show-and-tell here, with some videotape being shown. There was also some theatrics. You had some -- a few protesters standing up in the middle of some of the questioning, holding up banners. They're from Code Pink. One of the banners read something like, "Ban Bolton, Not Treaties." But the hearing did move on from there.

One of the most spirited exchanges took place between Democratic Senator Christopher Dodd from Connecticut and John Bolton. Dodd himself said, "Look, I don't -- I can't think of any instances in the past in which I've opposed a nominee that was presented by a president, who, after all, is elected by the American people."

But he did say that he was really doubting this nomination, and here's a little bit of that exchange in which he asks about allegations that John Bolton tried to block some members of the intelligence community at the State Department from basically challenging him on their findings on Cuba.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. CHRIS DODD (D), CONNECTICUT: Did you ask for these two people be removed from their jobs?

JOHN BOLTON, NOMINEE, U.N. AMBASSADOR: No. I said that I wanted the -- in the case of Mr. Westerman, that I had lost trust in him and thought he should work on other accounts.

DODD: What other portfolio did he have?

BOLTON: In the case within INR, I think there...

DODD: What's his portfolio? What's his...

BOLTON: I don't know what his portfolio was.

DODD: He has one portfolio. Biological weapons and chemical weapons.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KOPPEL: Now, there were a number of offers of defense by Republican members of the committee, among them, George Allen of Virginia, who said that he thought that John Bolton, with his professional experience, having served in three Republican administrations, that he was the perfect man for the job. After all, he'll be going to the U.N. at a time when the U.N. itself believes that it needs to undergo structural reform.

One of those who had been sitting on the fence, Republican Lincoln Chafee of Rhode Island, said just as they broke for a lunch break, Miles -- he said just a short time ago, that although Bolton would not have been his candidate for the job of U.N. ambassador, at this point, he does think that he would be supporting this nomination.

And that's an important vote, because as things looked going into this committee hearing this morning, it was eight Democrats, who were mostly voting against him, and ten Republicans. Lincoln Chafee could have swung this vote one way or the other. And it looks now like he's going to support the nomination.

O'BRIEN: All right. Pivotal vote indeed. Andrea Koppel in Washington, thank you -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Straight ahead, a tornado chaser hits the jackpot with not one but two, but five twisters caught on tape. We're counting them down for you just ahead on LIVE FROM.

And silicone breast implants blamed for some nightmarish healthy problems. Find out why the FDA is considering allowing more women to use them.

And instead of "You're fired," this "Apprentice" cast members hears, "You're under arrest."

It's all ahead on LIVE FROM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Severe weather spawning some scary tornadoes in Kansas. Dorothy, a storm chaser, captured not one but five tornadoes yesterday in central Kansas. No injuries reported, but the same could not be said regarding damage.

Colorado reeling from a much different problem, an early spring blizzard. As much as two feet of snow fell in the Denver area over the weekend. For travelers, a nightmare, as you can see. The snow shut down the Denver airport and forced interstates to close.

Let's get the scoop on all this wild weather. We said unrelated, but really it's all part of the big, same system, isn't it, Jacqui?

(WEATHER REPORT)

O'BRIEN: All right. Jacqui Jeras, thank you very much. We appreciate that.

Little bit of breaking news comes into us right now. Let's go live right now to Capitol Hill, where there appears to be a problem that is causing some security concerns.

CNN's Joe Johns on the line with us now. Joe, what can you tell us?

JOE JOHNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Miles, I can tell you that right now, the major inconvenience appears to be to Capitol Hill police as well as tourists who are at the United States Capitol this afternoon.

Some time ago, a man who appears to be pretty well dressed -- I got a look at him -- with two suitcases, roller bags, walked up to the front stairs of the west front of the Capitol, and apparently has just been standing there perfectly still. It's not clear to me whether he's talking or not.

There's one report, unverifiable, from one police officer, who said he came up with a bullhorn. And at this stage, you can probably try to categorize this as a protest, but it appears that the U.S. Capitol police have decided to take this very seriously. They've brought in their emergency response people, we're told. We're also seeing just a large number of police officers who are keeping their distance from this man.

There was also, in the Capitol, something called the Enunciator System. It's a communication system that is used to tell people about threats and so on going on in the Capitol. A message went out, warning people in the Capitol, apparently, to -- to stay away from the windows.

So they're taking this very seriously. It's not clear at all why. In an earlier report, which certainly could be proven to be wrong, because we don't have any evidence, was that this man may have some disagreement over employment with someone in this building. But, again, you know, that's early reports, and, you know, early reports are often wrong.

So we're watching tourists around the west front of the Capitol. I certainly am on the Senate side, where I am, being rerouted around this area, while police amass. And last I checked, looked on as a man stood perfectly still with a couple of bags that he was carrying, and it looks a bit like a standoff. And that's about what I know -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: Joe Johns on Capitol Hill. Thank you very much. More LIVE FROM in just a moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS (voice-over): Next on LIVE FROM, securing the skies, another shakeup at the top of the TSA. What does it mean for air safety?

CHRIS DIMARCO, GOLFER: I just played great, and, you know, Tiger played great, too.

PHILLIPS: He's the man who took Tiger to sudden death. Masters runner-up Chris DiMarco joins us live.

Later on LIVE FROM, lucky duck! This mallard mom-to-be is getting Secret Service protection. Find out why.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: In a decades-long debate, are silicone breast implants safe? Years after they were banned, the FDA is holding hearings to consider whether they are now safe enough to be placed back on the market.

Details from CNN senior medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GUPTA: Well, it seems like we've been talking about silicon implants for some time now, but it dates back even further than most people think. In 1962, actually, was the first time a woman received silicone breast implants; 1977, the first trial ran for a woman with ruptured implants.

So just 15 years later. 1990, a lot of people started paying attention, congressional safety hearings. In '92, the FDA restricted the use of silicone breast implants, and in 2003, just a couple of years ago, FDA advisers recommended lifting that ban. In a rare move, the FDA said, no not so fast. First, some more studies.

At issue, really, is whether or not these silicone breast implants rupture and how often they rupture. The company that originally made these silicone breast implants, Dow Corning, has since gone out of business. Two other companies now presenting their data.

Here's what they found. Manufacturer Inamed said there's a rupture rate of three to 21 percent over 10 years. The manufacturer Mentor, said one to five percent over three years.

The FDA in its own study said in all women, a cross-section of all women, about a 74 percent to 75 percent risk of rupture over 10 years and of women who are having implants after reconstructive surgery, 93 percent risk of rupture over 10 years. So significantly different numbers.

Today, Monday, there's going to be open hearings. Tuesday, there will be deliberations, and Wednesday there should be a vote.

Again, it will be a very emotional sort of couple of days for the FDA and all the women who also will be testifying either for or against these silicone implants.

Now, silicone was largely replaced by saline over the years, as you'll remember. A lot of people do believe that silicone is a superior product. And the Institute of Medicine did a study in 1999 saying there was no association between silicone rupture and lots of the symptoms of joint pain and muscle pain and MS-like pain.

Some of those situations, some of those questions will probably be answered over the next three days. We'll certainly keep you posted.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN, Atlanta.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com


Aired April 11, 2005 - 13:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CO-HOST: Mass demonstrations, strong emotions for victims of sexual abuse. Find out why they don't want this cardinal in a leading role.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CO-HOST: Trouble at the TSA. What does it mean for safety in the skies? We'll go in-depth with what's next with the agency guarding against terror in the air.

And the man who had Tiger by the tail made history at the masters. PGA golfer Chris DiMarco, joining us, live.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: For 13 years, silicon breast implants have been off the market, used in chemical trials only. Now they might be back. I'll have the details, coming right up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: CNN's Dr. Sanjay Gupta on that story. From the CNN Center in Atlanta, I'm Kyra Phillips.

O'BRIEN: And I'm Miles O'Brien. CNN's LIVE FROM starts right now.

PHILLIPS: A story we continue to follow at the top of the hour. That standoff still going on right now in Irvington, New Jersey. An Amber Alert turned into this police standoff near Interstate 78.

Irvington police issuing the child abduction alert when the father of a 4-year-old fled with her mother after allegedly shooting the grandfather this morning. Police still surrounding that car. Believed that three people are inside. Negotiations have begun, we are told.

Our Deb Feyerick right now joining us from New York with more on what's happening in New Jersey. Can you bring us up to date, Deb?

DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: ... the suspect, apparently her boyfriend about a month ago. She even tried taking out a restraining order against him, and that was in the works but he was not served with the restraining order, which apparently was meant to keep him away from her. There was a domestic dispute about a month ago. He started making threatening phone calls to her. He even abducted her last week. Took her from her home and then brought her back unharmed a little while later. We are told that there was an arrest warrant out for him in connection with that incident.

Now, she was so scared by this man, Almutah Saunders, that she even asked her dad to bring her back and forth from work. That is the man there. That is the suspect, Almutah -- Almutah Saunders.

Apparently, Saunders shot the father this morning in the leg. This was just immediately before the kidnapping of the woman and the couple's 4-month-old baby Jada. So again, it appears that this man, Almutah Saunders, was trying to get his daughter, 4-month-old Jada. There was a high-speed chase earlier this morning, going up to 90 miles an hour.

The grandfather -- there's Erika Turner. That's the woman, and that's the 4-month-old baby. And it apparently was her father who called police. And an Amber Alert was issued, saying that they were being kidnapped and that the man did have a gun.

They were on a highway and, apparently, at one point, she was actually able to make a 911 call, saying that he had had a change of heart, that he was going to release either her or he was going to release the both of them together. But then they drove into this housing complex, which is filled with sort of dead ends and cul-de- sacs, and that's where this whole chase ended.

Police began surrounding the area. They made their way around the car, and at one point the car even started rolling away from the location that it had been in. It didn't get very far. It ended up pulling back in to this space where you see it now.

There's a hostage negotiator just in that center car right there, the one where you see those police officers, members of the SWAT team there, all with shields, ready to go in if something happens. The hostage negotiator, apparently to the left of the car in the gray sweatshirt, has been in communication with him, either by cell phone, but also talking, announced helicopters to clear out, because apparently the suspect's having trouble hearing, and they want to make sure that everybody gets out unharmed -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Deb Feyerick, the details there in our New York bureau.

Meanwhile, on the phone with us, former SWAT commander Howard Robertson. He works in the New Orleans Police Department, trained negotiators and, of course, commanded scenes like this for a number of years.

Howard, taking a look at this situation right now, you see the negotiations are already in progress, SWAT team there at the scene. At what point do negotiations end and the SWAT team move in?

HOWARD ROBERTSON, FORMER SWAT COMMANDER: Kyra, that's going to be a real, real touchy subject, because no matter what the police did here, they're going to be wrong.

If they move in too soon, they could cause someone to get hurt. If they wait too long until after he begins shooting, then they're going to say they waited too long and caused the deaths. That's a real touchy call.

But right now, you've got a lot of positive things happening, in that he's at least listening. He's at least conversing with the negotiator, which is positive.

They've already brought water to them, which means that he's at least thinking logically. You know, he's not out of his mind, where he's going to do something silly. He's thinking. He's starting to talk about taking water and maybe something else later on, where maybe they can exchange for a hostage. That's a positive thing.

PHILLIPS: So when you think of a scenario that could get a lot worse -- I mean, just kind of backing up a little bit, police saying he shot the grandfather in the leg.

ROBERSON: Right.

PHILLIPS: So I'm thinking, OK. If he wanted to kill the grandfather, he probably could have. Is that a sign that maybe he's just trying to get some attention, that he's not really going to kill them? Because if he had the intention of taking his life, the mother's life, the baby's life, even the grandfather's life, wouldn't he have done that by now?

ROBERTSON: You can't go on that assumption, because if you do, then you're making an assumption that he's not going to shoot either the child or the mother or even one of the police officers. You cannot make that assumption. You have to assume that he is capable of killing people.

The good thing is, though, when you're negotiating with him, you can tell him that he was only shot in the leg, that you know, that he hasn't committed a murder. That's things that you can deal with, that you can still get him to calm down and say, "Look, there is a tomorrow for me. You know, today's not the last day of my life. There is a tomorrow."

If you look at how they're staged right now, there's a lot of things here. The -- the assault team is standing outside the whole time. You've been there before. You know what that feels like. They're going to get tired very quickly. And you hope that, because they're staged like that, that then they don't make a decision to assault too soon, because of, you know, becoming tired.

The negotiator seems like he has a really good hand on it, and the longer they talk, the more chance they have of getting them out. Remember earlier when he talked about releasing the wife?

PHILLIPS: Yes, he did. He considered it.

ROBERTSON: So that's in his head. And that's what you want to do, just keep him talking, just keep him talking, keep letting him know that he does have a chance. There is a tomorrow. Let's let these people live. He did love them at one time. He obviously still loves his daughter. He doesn't want to hurt her.

There's a strong, strong possibility, as long as the negotiator has him talking, that this can end positive.

PHILLIPS: Former SWAT commander for the New Orleans Police Department, Howard Robertson, thank you so much.

On the phone with us now also, police director for Irvington, New Jersey, the area where the scenario is going down, Michael Damiano.

What can you tell us about the progress that the negotiator has made at this point? Michael, is he having a good conversation with the suspect?

MICHAEL DAMIANO, POLICE DIRECTOR, IRVINGTON, NEW JERSEY: Well, I think any conversation with the suspect is good. The dialogue is open. It's ongoing. So we are exchanging some information, and, in fact, that's a good sign at this point.

PHILLIPS: And at this point do you know for sure that that 4- month-old baby, Jada, is alive, in addition to the mother, Erika Turner? Is she still alive? Are they all three in that car?

DAMIANO: We cannot see the child at this point. We have information there is a male and female in that car, male and female adult. We have no additional information. We don't want to get too close to the vehicle for obvious reasons.

PHILLIPS: What has the suspect said to your negotiator? Do you have any details about the conversation that's taken place between your hostage negotiator and Almutah Saunders, the suspect in that car?

DAMIANO: Well, quite frankly, just an open dialogue, just exchanging different thoughts about different things at this point. And we're trying desperately to have him turn himself in and certainly give us the child and the female hostage, as well. So I think the entire nature of the conversation surrounds around that issue.

PHILLIPS: Michael Damiano, police director there in Irvington, New Jersey. Thank you so much.

Real quickly, if you're just tuning in, it's a story we're going to continue to follow. It's an Amber Alert that turned into a police standoff. It's going on near Interstate 78 right here in Irvington, New Jersey.

A negotiator, police negotiator, SWAT team by his side. Right now we are told they have established dialogue with this suspected gunman in this car, possibly holding his 4-month-old daughter, Jada, and the mother of that child, Erika Turner, hostage in that car. Police not able to confirm if, indeed, the baby's in the car, but they believe indeed that she is, that a dialogue has been established. We're going to continue to let you know as this moves on, if, indeed, he does give up, and that family is returned to safety -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: All right. We're watching that for you.

Honor and dishonor at the Vatican, meanwhile. A week before the start of the conclave to choose the next pope, one of voting cardinals in the spotlight. And the Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests, SNAP, it is called, is incensed.

The cardinal, Bernard Law, the former archbishop of Boston, who resigned in a scandal 2 1/2 years ago, you'll recall. And he now serves as the arch priest of a major Rome cathedral. It is in that capacity that Law celebrated one of the nine morning masses for Pope John Paul II, an accolade SNAP finds inappropriate at best.

CNN's Dan Lothian reports, many agree in Boston.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAN LOTHIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The Boston Archdiocese is still reeling from the priest sex abuse scandal which exploded three years ago. Some believe it is partly to blame for the closing of some 60 parishes after millions of dollars in settlements were paid out.

RHONDA DUE, BOSTON CATHOLIC: We are mortgaging our future to pay for the sins of the past.

LOTHIAN: Yesterday critics continued to lash out at the church.

JOHN ROGERS, BOSTON CATHOLIC: And every opportunity they have said it's not about the money, but their actions prove otherwise.

LOTHIAN: And the actions of one man continues to draw fire. Cardinal Bernard Law was archbishop in Boston when the scandal broke.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He did not defend the children. He defended the church.

LOTHIAN: Law, who was named in hundreds of lawsuits filed by victims, was abused of protecting pedophile priests, like the one Gary Bergeron says sexually molested him when he was in the sixth grade.

GARY BERGERON, SEX ABUSE VICTIM: The man doesn't understand what's been going on in, you know, the lives of thousands of men that were abused. I think he still doesn't understand what the effects have been on our lives.

LOTHIAN: According to church documents, when complaints came to Law's attention, he knowingly shuffled dozens of priests accused of abuse from parish to parish. Law acknowledged doing just that with Father John Geoghan. Geoghan was convicted on two counts of child rape and later died in prison.

But when the scandal first became public, Law condemned the press instead of the priests.

BERNARD LAW, ARCH PRIEST, ST. MARY MAJOR BASILICA, ROME: Call down God's power on the weak.

LOTHIAN: In the wake of the scandal, Law resigned, but a short time later, Pope John Paul II appointed him arch priest of St. Mary Major Basilica in Rome. Although a largely ceremonial position, some abuse victims saw it as a slap in the face.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was not stripped of anything. He just left town.

ALEXA MCPHERSON, SEX ABUSE VICTIM: How do I as a victim begin to heal going through that, seeing this? I can't.

LOTHIAN: Now, Law's role, presiding over one of the nine funeral masses for the pope, is again opening deep wounds.

BERGERON: I think he still doesn't understand the immense amount of damage that needs to be repaired before it's safe for him to come out into the public.

LOTHIAN (on camera): The church has apologized for the sins of the fathers. As for Cardinal Law, he declined to talk about the abuse scandal in a recent television interview, saying only that, quote, "all of us deplore in our own lives and in the lives of others a failure to live out the message of Christ."

Dan Lothian, CNN, Boston.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Well, the stage is set for the conclave, due to start one week from today, as Miles mentioned. And that is the stage. Though the whole process is wrapped up in the utmost secrecy, the Vatican did release pictures of the new hotel where the cardinals will be put up, the Sistine Chapel, where they'll deliberate and vote. Even a stove where the ballots will be burned.

Ina break from centuries of tradition, the cardinals won't be locked in the Sistine Chapel throughout, but they did swear not to communicate with the outside world.

O'BRIEN: Well, can an undiplomatic diplomat be America's top U.N. diplomat? That's the question before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, as grills the president's highly controversial nominee for U.N. ambassador. His name is John Bolton.

CNN State Department correspondent Andrea Koppel is watching and listening for us -- Andrea.

ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Miles, grilled is the operative word. In fact, you could say that many Democrats who questioned John Bolton this morning here were on the attack.

They really have a two pronged approach here. One, to try to lay out evidence that they believe shows John Bolton is somebody who doesn't want to do business with the U.N. They want to, in fact, show him in his own words as Senator Barbara Boxer, Democrat of California did, expressing open disdain for the United Nations.

There was a little bit of a show-and-tell here, with some videotape being shown. There was also some theatrics. You had some -- a few protesters standing up in the middle of some of the questioning, holding up banners. They're from Code Pink. One of the banners read something like, "Ban Bolton, Not Treaties." But the hearing did move on from there.

One of the most spirited exchanges took place between Democratic Senator Christopher Dodd from Connecticut and John Bolton. Dodd himself said, "Look, I don't -- I can't think of any instances in the past in which I've opposed a nominee that was presented by a president, who, after all, is elected by the American people."

But he did say that he was really doubting this nomination, and here's a little bit of that exchange in which he asks about allegations that John Bolton tried to block some members of the intelligence community at the State Department from basically challenging him on their findings on Cuba.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. CHRIS DODD (D), CONNECTICUT: Did you ask for these two people be removed from their jobs?

JOHN BOLTON, NOMINEE, U.N. AMBASSADOR: No. I said that I wanted the -- in the case of Mr. Westerman, that I had lost trust in him and thought he should work on other accounts.

DODD: What other portfolio did he have?

BOLTON: In the case within INR, I think there...

DODD: What's his portfolio? What's his...

BOLTON: I don't know what his portfolio was.

DODD: He has one portfolio. Biological weapons and chemical weapons.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KOPPEL: Now, there were a number of offers of defense by Republican members of the committee, among them, George Allen of Virginia, who said that he thought that John Bolton, with his professional experience, having served in three Republican administrations, that he was the perfect man for the job. After all, he'll be going to the U.N. at a time when the U.N. itself believes that it needs to undergo structural reform.

One of those who had been sitting on the fence, Republican Lincoln Chafee of Rhode Island, said just as they broke for a lunch break, Miles -- he said just a short time ago, that although Bolton would not have been his candidate for the job of U.N. ambassador, at this point, he does think that he would be supporting this nomination.

And that's an important vote, because as things looked going into this committee hearing this morning, it was eight Democrats, who were mostly voting against him, and ten Republicans. Lincoln Chafee could have swung this vote one way or the other. And it looks now like he's going to support the nomination.

O'BRIEN: All right. Pivotal vote indeed. Andrea Koppel in Washington, thank you -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Straight ahead, a tornado chaser hits the jackpot with not one but two, but five twisters caught on tape. We're counting them down for you just ahead on LIVE FROM.

And silicone breast implants blamed for some nightmarish healthy problems. Find out why the FDA is considering allowing more women to use them.

And instead of "You're fired," this "Apprentice" cast members hears, "You're under arrest."

It's all ahead on LIVE FROM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Severe weather spawning some scary tornadoes in Kansas. Dorothy, a storm chaser, captured not one but five tornadoes yesterday in central Kansas. No injuries reported, but the same could not be said regarding damage.

Colorado reeling from a much different problem, an early spring blizzard. As much as two feet of snow fell in the Denver area over the weekend. For travelers, a nightmare, as you can see. The snow shut down the Denver airport and forced interstates to close.

Let's get the scoop on all this wild weather. We said unrelated, but really it's all part of the big, same system, isn't it, Jacqui?

(WEATHER REPORT)

O'BRIEN: All right. Jacqui Jeras, thank you very much. We appreciate that.

Little bit of breaking news comes into us right now. Let's go live right now to Capitol Hill, where there appears to be a problem that is causing some security concerns.

CNN's Joe Johns on the line with us now. Joe, what can you tell us?

JOE JOHNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Miles, I can tell you that right now, the major inconvenience appears to be to Capitol Hill police as well as tourists who are at the United States Capitol this afternoon.

Some time ago, a man who appears to be pretty well dressed -- I got a look at him -- with two suitcases, roller bags, walked up to the front stairs of the west front of the Capitol, and apparently has just been standing there perfectly still. It's not clear to me whether he's talking or not.

There's one report, unverifiable, from one police officer, who said he came up with a bullhorn. And at this stage, you can probably try to categorize this as a protest, but it appears that the U.S. Capitol police have decided to take this very seriously. They've brought in their emergency response people, we're told. We're also seeing just a large number of police officers who are keeping their distance from this man.

There was also, in the Capitol, something called the Enunciator System. It's a communication system that is used to tell people about threats and so on going on in the Capitol. A message went out, warning people in the Capitol, apparently, to -- to stay away from the windows.

So they're taking this very seriously. It's not clear at all why. In an earlier report, which certainly could be proven to be wrong, because we don't have any evidence, was that this man may have some disagreement over employment with someone in this building. But, again, you know, that's early reports, and, you know, early reports are often wrong.

So we're watching tourists around the west front of the Capitol. I certainly am on the Senate side, where I am, being rerouted around this area, while police amass. And last I checked, looked on as a man stood perfectly still with a couple of bags that he was carrying, and it looks a bit like a standoff. And that's about what I know -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: Joe Johns on Capitol Hill. Thank you very much. More LIVE FROM in just a moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS (voice-over): Next on LIVE FROM, securing the skies, another shakeup at the top of the TSA. What does it mean for air safety?

CHRIS DIMARCO, GOLFER: I just played great, and, you know, Tiger played great, too.

PHILLIPS: He's the man who took Tiger to sudden death. Masters runner-up Chris DiMarco joins us live.

Later on LIVE FROM, lucky duck! This mallard mom-to-be is getting Secret Service protection. Find out why.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: In a decades-long debate, are silicone breast implants safe? Years after they were banned, the FDA is holding hearings to consider whether they are now safe enough to be placed back on the market.

Details from CNN senior medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GUPTA: Well, it seems like we've been talking about silicon implants for some time now, but it dates back even further than most people think. In 1962, actually, was the first time a woman received silicone breast implants; 1977, the first trial ran for a woman with ruptured implants.

So just 15 years later. 1990, a lot of people started paying attention, congressional safety hearings. In '92, the FDA restricted the use of silicone breast implants, and in 2003, just a couple of years ago, FDA advisers recommended lifting that ban. In a rare move, the FDA said, no not so fast. First, some more studies.

At issue, really, is whether or not these silicone breast implants rupture and how often they rupture. The company that originally made these silicone breast implants, Dow Corning, has since gone out of business. Two other companies now presenting their data.

Here's what they found. Manufacturer Inamed said there's a rupture rate of three to 21 percent over 10 years. The manufacturer Mentor, said one to five percent over three years.

The FDA in its own study said in all women, a cross-section of all women, about a 74 percent to 75 percent risk of rupture over 10 years and of women who are having implants after reconstructive surgery, 93 percent risk of rupture over 10 years. So significantly different numbers.

Today, Monday, there's going to be open hearings. Tuesday, there will be deliberations, and Wednesday there should be a vote.

Again, it will be a very emotional sort of couple of days for the FDA and all the women who also will be testifying either for or against these silicone implants.

Now, silicone was largely replaced by saline over the years, as you'll remember. A lot of people do believe that silicone is a superior product. And the Institute of Medicine did a study in 1999 saying there was no association between silicone rupture and lots of the symptoms of joint pain and muscle pain and MS-like pain.

Some of those situations, some of those questions will probably be answered over the next three days. We'll certainly keep you posted.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN, Atlanta.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com