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News Conference on Wendy's Finger Case; Base Closures; Missing the Target

Aired May 13, 2005 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. SONNY PERDUE (R), GEORGIA: Closing any one base in Georgia has never been an option -- excuse me -- has never been an option that we would be satisfied with. And we're not going to be satisfied with it this morning

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: The battle to stop the base closings, why the Pentagon is targeting scores of bases all across the country.

SARA DORSEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Fort McPherson, in Georgia, is one of those military installations here in Georgia set to close. So why are state officials keeping such a positive attitude? I'm Sara Dorsey. We'll have a live report coming up.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: A shocking story of Army recruiting gone wrong. What lengths and what laws can be broken to sign someone up for a military career?

PHILLIPS: A landslide is common in California, but Manhattan? What happened when a century-old wall collapsed onto a busy road?

From the CNN Center in Atlanta, I'm Kyra Phillips.

O'BRIEN: And I'm Miles O'Brine. This hour of CNN's LIVE FROM starts right now.

PHILLIPS: We just thought we'd let you know we're waiting for a news conference right now on that Wendy's chili finger case you can't forget. A live picture from the San Jose Police Department as we wait to hear from the police chief. Evidently new developments. You'll remember that Anna Ayala of Las Vegas caused quite a media sensation when she said she found a fingertip in her chili at Wendy's.

Well, she was arrested on grand theft, as you know. The question still remains, whose finger is it? Hopefully we're going to find out coming up in that news conference.

O'BRIEN: Meanwhile, we watched a still life of poured concrete and microphone. All right.

Well, some are ballistic, some are breathing easy, some are scared, some are scarred from past battles and queasy at the prospect of new ones. They are politicians, plumbers, pediatricians in cities in towns from coast to coast united in their dependence on military bases recommended for realignment, euphemism of the day, by the Pentagon. A long-awaited hit list arrived on Capitol Hill today.

Thirty-three major military installations, scores of smaller sites, the Pentagon wants to mothball all of them in hopes of saving about $50 billion over the next 20 years. Lots of other sites would grow or shrink under a blueprint that remains months away from final approval. More on that momentarily.

Among the big closures, that submarine base you just saw at New London, Connecticut; Fort Monmouth; Monroe; and McPherson; Ellsworth; and Cannon Air Force bases. I think we're now turning our attention to the Wendy's finger news conference

CHIEF ROB DAVIS, SAN JOSE, CALIFORNIA, POLICE: There was an individual who claimed to have found -- to have found a fingertip in a bowl of chili. And we have already met a few weeks ago to give you updates on that case. So I'm not going to go into a long description, but many people that we owe thanks to, other than to say thanks very much once again to Sheriff Bill Young in Las Vegas for the assistance we've received from them, as well as to give credit to the Santa Clara County crime lab, as well as the investigators involved in this case, which would be Lieutenant Stan Fallwetter (ph), Sergeant Lou Fam (ph) and detectives Christopher Wilson, Noreen Marinelli (ph), Jose Martinez, Albert Morales (ph) and Fred Mills.

I'm also going to ask you to bear with me for just a moment while I make a comment in Spanish. And then I'll fill you in on the details.

(SPEAKING SPANISH)

O'BRIEN: All right. As they drift into Spanish, Kyra could probably translate for us. But what -- she says go back now to him. He's in English.

PHILLIPS: OK.

DAVIS: The comment would be this: the jig is up. The puzzle pieces are beginning to fall into place, and the truth is beginning to be exposed. This is not a case necessarily to be smiling about. There are victims in this case that have suffered greatly.

On Wednesday, May the 4th, San Jose Police Department detectives received a lead from -- form the Wendy's reward hotline concerning a Nevada resident who may have been the person whose fingertip was allegedly found in a bowl of chili in San Jose on March 22. San Jose PD detectives were already in Nevada following up on other leads on May 4, and they contacted the individual in question.

It was determined that he lost a portion of his finger in an industrial accident in December of last year and that he is an associate of James Plascencia, the husband of Anna Ayala, the woman being the person who claimed to have found the fingertip in the bowl of chili. On May 11 and 12, scientific testing positively confirmed that this subject was, in fact, the source of the fingertip allegedly found in the chili.

San Jose PD detectives returned to Nevada on May 12 and determined that this individual did provide the fingertip to James Plascencia. I think you can understand that due to the ongoing nature of the investigation, at this time we cannot identify that individual, and, indeed, we have been asked by our district attorney's office to make sure that we are protecting the pretrial publicity rights of the individuals involved in this case. And we're not going to be giving you more details about the specific types of scientific tests that were run that led us to know that indeed this fingertip does belong to the individual that lost his finger.

That being said, I will take some very brief questions as long as they are not about those two particular items.

One moment. A hand right here. Go ahead.

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE)?

DAVIS: The district attorney's office here in Santa Clara County will of course be reviewing all the details in this case. We're grateful for the cooperation we are currently receiving from these individuals involved. However, I'm sure that the D.A. will also be looking at additional charges for the individuals that we already have in custody on this case.

There was a question over here. So let's go over here.

Yes, sir?

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE)

PHILLIPS: Putting the finger right on the tip of the case, shall we say?

O'BRIEN: You might say.

PHILLIPS: Chief Rob Davis...

O'BRIEN: You might say he kind of nailed it.

PHILLIPS: Sorry. We had to do it.

O'BRIEN: So to speak -- yes.

PHILLIPS: Chief Rob Davis there, on a serious note, with the San Jose Police Department, announcing -- you'll remember, of course -- we'll give you a quick background, the Wendy's chili case, allegedly this woman found a fingertip in the chili. It turns out that Anna Ayala's husband -- well, his friend, rather, lost the tip of his finger in an industrial accident, and that is the finger that this woman allegedly dropped into that chili. As you know, she's been arrested.

We go forward into other news. Meanwhile, Wendy's, though...

O'BRIEN: Interesting. He lost it -- he lost it in December...

PHILLIPS: Right.

O'BRIEN: ... and, what, kept it in the freezer?

PHILLIPS: So she could have been saving this? Well, yes.

O'BRIEN: In the freezer? I guess.

PHILLIPS: Kept it in the freezer, waiting for a good opportunity to drop it in the chili. But anyway, Wendy's, as you know, all week, big promotion going on. They're giving away free Frostys to try and build business up again. As you can imagine, they lost a lot of money when that bad press came out.

O'BRIEN: Double digits.

PHILLIPS: There you go.

O'BRIEN: Yes. All right.

PHILLIPS: All right. Moving on to other news, Fort McPherson is metro Atlanta's seventh largest employer, with 4,141 jobs. At Fort Mac, understandably, closure is a fighting word.

CNN's Sara Dorsey joins me now live with more information on a bit of bad news they received today.

Hi, Sara.

DORSEY: Hi to you, Kyra.

That's right, it's certainly not good news for any of the folks here at Fort McPherson. This fort, along with six other military installations in Georgia, are on the Pentagon's recommended list for the chopping block. But I'll tell you, state officials in Georgia are keeping a surprisingly optimistic view at this point because, in the same breath, the Pentagon has recommended that seven other military installations in this state be bolstered.

State Senator Johnny Isakson said today that things could have been much worse, really, for the state. Here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHNNY ISAKSON (R), GEORGIA: For the entire state, we have a net gain of 7,400 jobs. Georgia is the second largest winner in the BRAC realignment and closing process, second only to the state of Maryland. And so we have a lot to be thankful for.

But we're here because we care about every single job and every single opportunity. And we think we've got a great opportunity to restore Fort Mac, and we're going to make every effort to do so.

(END VIDEO CLIP) DORSEY: And here's a breakdown of the numbers. Three military installations in the state are taking a very big hit, of course. Those include here, Fort McPherson, 4,000 people, both military and civilians will lose jobs here or have to relocate. Fifteen hundred people are also in the same situation at the Naval Air Station in Atlanta. And more than 1,000 at Fort Gillem.

Now, there is some major winners in this whole thing. Fort Benning will gain nearly 10,000 people. Kings Bay Submarine Base will increase by more than 3,000. And Robins Air Force Base will gain nearly 400 people.

Now, I can tell you, Fort McPherson has been the main angle of this. Everyone out here today, politicians, both state and local, have on their fighting gloves. They say that they are going to try to change these recommendations, try to get the committee that is in charge of these military base closings to re-look at this issue.

They say this fort is part of day-to-day operations, it's vital to the military, and that this one should at least be looked at once again. Hopefully, they say that they will be able to make some sort of difference.

Both the governor and two state senators were out here today making a plea on national TV. They say they will continue that fight, and that they are most concerned about the jobs that will be lost in this area, also, because that means money for Atlanta that will be gone if indeed this base closes down -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Sara Dorsey at Fort Mac. Thank you so much.

And you don't turn a battleship on a dime, and you don't close or shrink or expand hundreds of military facilities in a week. What happens is BRAC. The Base Realignment and Closure Commission will screen the recommendations and report to President Bush by September 8. Mr. Bush will then accept the BRAC list or reject it.

All or nothing by September 23. If he accepts it, Congress will vote the list up or down, all or nothing. And if it fails, or if the president rejects it, BRAC has a month to revise and resubmit. If it's approved, the changes will take effect over the next six years

O'BRIEN: Well, the TV show "CSI" -- excuse me, my computer was a little off kilter there -- has a heart-pounding action there. And it's all about how crimes are solved, I'm told.

PHILLIPS: All done in a matter of minutes. But a crime scene investigation is hard work. Coming up, Dr. Sanjay Gupta looks at what it's like to catch a killer.

O'BRIEN: All right. And here's a story that's going to shock you: military recruiting gone wrong as a teenage boy is taught how to break the law.

PHILLIPS: And later, the efforts to prevent a strike at the nation's second largest air carrier and the potential impact on your summer travel.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: It's no secret many young people are steering clear of the military because of the Iraq war. To make itself more marketable, the Army is reducing its minimum active duty requirement now to 15 months and offering some bigger signing bonuses. But falling numbers are putting pressure on those recruiters, and some are bending the rules to keep the military supplied with soldiers.

CNN's Thelma Gutierrez with a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

THELMA GUTIERREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): David McSwane knew he was on to a big story.

DAVID MCSWANE, HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT: I wanted to see how far they would go to get one more soldier.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's getting in there.

GUTIERREZ: What he uncovered at one Army recruiting center is making waves all the way up to the Pentagon.

LT. COL. JEFFREY BRODEUR, U.S. ARMY: We aggressively and immediately started an investigation.

GUTIERREZ: David McSwane is not a professional journalist. He's 17 years old, a senior at Arvada West High School outside Denver, Colorado. And he's a prime target for military recruiters.

MCSWANE: This is just something that affects everyone in my age group, everyone in high school across America.

GUTIERREZ: So, David, a reporter for the high school newspaper, set out to find out just how far Army recruiters would go to enlist a new soldier.

MCSWANE: The scenario I came up with was that I'm a 17-year-old dropout and that I have a drug problem that I just -- I just can't kick.

GUTIERREZ: The Army requires a high school diploma or GED, and they don't except recruits with drug problems. But David says a recruiter at this center in Golden, Colorado, told him not to worry.

MCSWANE: These are the transcripts that go with the diploma.

GUTIERREZ: David says his recruiter told him to go to the Internet to buy this fake high school diploma and bogus school transcripts. David taped the conversations.

MCSWANE: They accepted my diploma and all that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, that's what they told us. So... MCSWANE: All right. But they don't know it's fake or anything and I'm not going to get in trouble?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right. You won't, pal.

MCSWANE: All right. Cool.

GUTIERREZ: As for his made-up drug problem:

MCSWANE: This is the detox he told me to buy.

GUTIERREZ: David says the recruiter told him to buy this product to pass the Army's drug test.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You just have to follow instructions to a tee. It has got like a 150 percent guarantee that you will pass. You know, I've seen it work before.

GUTIERREZ: The recruiter then took David to a store to buy the product while someone videotaped.

MCSWANE: He went as far as driving me down to the place to buy the detox drink in a government vehicle.

GUTIERREZ: After David's investigation was published in his high school newspaper, it snowballed into a P.R. nightmare for the Army.

BRODEUR: Disappointment. Wrapped up into one word.

GUTIERREZ: Lieutenant Colonel Jeffrey Brodeur has 129 recruiters under his command. Two of the four recruiters at this Golden, Colorado, center are now under investigation for alleged recruiting abuses.

BRODEUR: So far today, it appears to be a character issue. We're trained not to do that.

GUTIERREZ: Jim Massey was a Marine recruiter for three years.

JIM MASSEY, FMR. MILITARY RECRUITER: This isn't just an isolated incident. This is a widespread epidemic.

GUTIERREZ: Massey says military recruiters are under such intense pressure to make their quota, they'll often stretch the truth to sign up recruits. He says he did it, too.

MASSEY: I was a recruiter for three years. And I recruited 75 young men. And I would say 98 percent of the young men that I signed up for the Marine Corps were frauded into the military in some capacity.

GUTIERREZ: Massey says, when he failed to sign up two recruits a month, he received these letters of reprimand.

MASSEY: I had never had any types of or signs or symptoms of depression in my entire life until I went out on recruiting duty. My second year out on recruiting duty, I was taking antidepressants.

GUTIERREZ: Massey fought in Iraq, then came home with a change of heart. He's now an anti-war activist.

MASSEY: I sold my soul a long time ago to the Marine Corps. And each day, I strive to get a little bit of it back.

GUTIERREZ: Major General Michael Rochelle, commanding general in charge of recruiting for the U.S. Army, plans to shut down 1,700 recruiting offices across the country for one day to review procedures for the Army's 7,500 recruiters, in direct response to the allegations made by David McSwane and others.

MAJ. GEN. MICHAEL ROCHELLE, U.S. ARMY RECRUITING COMMAND: I was disappointed by it. I was very disappointed by it. I've been around the Army a long time. So, very little shocks me, if you will. It hurts personally and professionally.

GUTIERREZ: General Rochelle says the target is 80,000 new recruits a year. It is a tough task, he says, to recruit an all- volunteer Army at a time of war. Many parents use their influence to discourage enlistment.

ROCHELLE: One is the fear of loss of life or limb. And that's real. Take those two factors, along with the seeming resistance on the part of influencers, and you present a pretty daunting challenge for the Army.

SHELLY HANSEN, MOTHER OF DAVID: I worried that people would think he wasn't patriotic.

GUTIERREZ: Sally Hansen says she feared a backlash against her son for exposing his recruiters.

HANSEN: He's probably one of the most patriotic kids I know. He was in the Young Marines for almost a year and earned a couple awards.

GUTIERREZ: Now David has an award from his school for his expose on the Army.

MCSWANE: If I were a soldier out on the front line, I wouldn't want someone next to me who my life could be depending on going through withdrawal or having a drug addiction or just being someone I can't trust. I just don't think that's something we need on our front lines.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Smart kid. The Army missed recruiting goals for February, March and again in April.

PHILLIPS: Well, one of the most successful crime programs on TV could be hurting criminal cases in the courts.

O'BRIEN: They call it the "CSI" effect. Coming up, Dr. Sanjay Gupta looks at how crime scenes really work and why juries may be letting real life criminals off the hook.

PHILLIPS: And later, the fast track to sainthood. Why the Catholic Church is bending the rules for Pope John Paul II.

KATHLEEN HAYS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm Kathleen Hays at the New York Stock Exchange. Coming up, United and its unions has stepped up talks in some tense wage negotiations. I'll have the latest on that story.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Well, if you're flying the friendly skies these days...

PHILLIPS: Friendly?

O'BRIEN: Well, yes, you're right. It's kind of an anachronism, isn't it? Yes.

Well, one time it was the friendly skies. United these days, it's...

(CROSSTALK)

PHILLIPS: Back when they had food

O'BRIEN: Food. Yes, remember that?

PHILLIPS: Free cocktails.

Anyway, Kathleen Hays has more on what we're trying to...

O'BRIEN: You miss those, don't you?

PHILLIPS: ... talk about live from the New York Stock Exchange.

(STOCK MARKET REPORT)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: "Now in the News," the battle starts today, so says the mayor of one town slated to lose its Air Force base under a new round of closings. The Pentagon today proposed shutting 33 major bases with a loss of almost 30,000 jobs.

From defense lawyer to defense witness, Michael Jackson's one- time attorney, Mark Geragos, is expected to take the stand any time now in the pop star's child molestation trial. Geragos represented Jackson during the initial investigation, but he was let go more than a year ago.

Hurricane dividend. Nine months ago today, a string of major storms began battering Florida. Folks were stuck at home without electricity for...

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com


Aired May 13, 2005 - 14:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. SONNY PERDUE (R), GEORGIA: Closing any one base in Georgia has never been an option -- excuse me -- has never been an option that we would be satisfied with. And we're not going to be satisfied with it this morning

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: The battle to stop the base closings, why the Pentagon is targeting scores of bases all across the country.

SARA DORSEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Fort McPherson, in Georgia, is one of those military installations here in Georgia set to close. So why are state officials keeping such a positive attitude? I'm Sara Dorsey. We'll have a live report coming up.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: A shocking story of Army recruiting gone wrong. What lengths and what laws can be broken to sign someone up for a military career?

PHILLIPS: A landslide is common in California, but Manhattan? What happened when a century-old wall collapsed onto a busy road?

From the CNN Center in Atlanta, I'm Kyra Phillips.

O'BRIEN: And I'm Miles O'Brine. This hour of CNN's LIVE FROM starts right now.

PHILLIPS: We just thought we'd let you know we're waiting for a news conference right now on that Wendy's chili finger case you can't forget. A live picture from the San Jose Police Department as we wait to hear from the police chief. Evidently new developments. You'll remember that Anna Ayala of Las Vegas caused quite a media sensation when she said she found a fingertip in her chili at Wendy's.

Well, she was arrested on grand theft, as you know. The question still remains, whose finger is it? Hopefully we're going to find out coming up in that news conference.

O'BRIEN: Meanwhile, we watched a still life of poured concrete and microphone. All right.

Well, some are ballistic, some are breathing easy, some are scared, some are scarred from past battles and queasy at the prospect of new ones. They are politicians, plumbers, pediatricians in cities in towns from coast to coast united in their dependence on military bases recommended for realignment, euphemism of the day, by the Pentagon. A long-awaited hit list arrived on Capitol Hill today.

Thirty-three major military installations, scores of smaller sites, the Pentagon wants to mothball all of them in hopes of saving about $50 billion over the next 20 years. Lots of other sites would grow or shrink under a blueprint that remains months away from final approval. More on that momentarily.

Among the big closures, that submarine base you just saw at New London, Connecticut; Fort Monmouth; Monroe; and McPherson; Ellsworth; and Cannon Air Force bases. I think we're now turning our attention to the Wendy's finger news conference

CHIEF ROB DAVIS, SAN JOSE, CALIFORNIA, POLICE: There was an individual who claimed to have found -- to have found a fingertip in a bowl of chili. And we have already met a few weeks ago to give you updates on that case. So I'm not going to go into a long description, but many people that we owe thanks to, other than to say thanks very much once again to Sheriff Bill Young in Las Vegas for the assistance we've received from them, as well as to give credit to the Santa Clara County crime lab, as well as the investigators involved in this case, which would be Lieutenant Stan Fallwetter (ph), Sergeant Lou Fam (ph) and detectives Christopher Wilson, Noreen Marinelli (ph), Jose Martinez, Albert Morales (ph) and Fred Mills.

I'm also going to ask you to bear with me for just a moment while I make a comment in Spanish. And then I'll fill you in on the details.

(SPEAKING SPANISH)

O'BRIEN: All right. As they drift into Spanish, Kyra could probably translate for us. But what -- she says go back now to him. He's in English.

PHILLIPS: OK.

DAVIS: The comment would be this: the jig is up. The puzzle pieces are beginning to fall into place, and the truth is beginning to be exposed. This is not a case necessarily to be smiling about. There are victims in this case that have suffered greatly.

On Wednesday, May the 4th, San Jose Police Department detectives received a lead from -- form the Wendy's reward hotline concerning a Nevada resident who may have been the person whose fingertip was allegedly found in a bowl of chili in San Jose on March 22. San Jose PD detectives were already in Nevada following up on other leads on May 4, and they contacted the individual in question.

It was determined that he lost a portion of his finger in an industrial accident in December of last year and that he is an associate of James Plascencia, the husband of Anna Ayala, the woman being the person who claimed to have found the fingertip in the bowl of chili. On May 11 and 12, scientific testing positively confirmed that this subject was, in fact, the source of the fingertip allegedly found in the chili.

San Jose PD detectives returned to Nevada on May 12 and determined that this individual did provide the fingertip to James Plascencia. I think you can understand that due to the ongoing nature of the investigation, at this time we cannot identify that individual, and, indeed, we have been asked by our district attorney's office to make sure that we are protecting the pretrial publicity rights of the individuals involved in this case. And we're not going to be giving you more details about the specific types of scientific tests that were run that led us to know that indeed this fingertip does belong to the individual that lost his finger.

That being said, I will take some very brief questions as long as they are not about those two particular items.

One moment. A hand right here. Go ahead.

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE)?

DAVIS: The district attorney's office here in Santa Clara County will of course be reviewing all the details in this case. We're grateful for the cooperation we are currently receiving from these individuals involved. However, I'm sure that the D.A. will also be looking at additional charges for the individuals that we already have in custody on this case.

There was a question over here. So let's go over here.

Yes, sir?

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE)

PHILLIPS: Putting the finger right on the tip of the case, shall we say?

O'BRIEN: You might say.

PHILLIPS: Chief Rob Davis...

O'BRIEN: You might say he kind of nailed it.

PHILLIPS: Sorry. We had to do it.

O'BRIEN: So to speak -- yes.

PHILLIPS: Chief Rob Davis there, on a serious note, with the San Jose Police Department, announcing -- you'll remember, of course -- we'll give you a quick background, the Wendy's chili case, allegedly this woman found a fingertip in the chili. It turns out that Anna Ayala's husband -- well, his friend, rather, lost the tip of his finger in an industrial accident, and that is the finger that this woman allegedly dropped into that chili. As you know, she's been arrested.

We go forward into other news. Meanwhile, Wendy's, though...

O'BRIEN: Interesting. He lost it -- he lost it in December...

PHILLIPS: Right.

O'BRIEN: ... and, what, kept it in the freezer?

PHILLIPS: So she could have been saving this? Well, yes.

O'BRIEN: In the freezer? I guess.

PHILLIPS: Kept it in the freezer, waiting for a good opportunity to drop it in the chili. But anyway, Wendy's, as you know, all week, big promotion going on. They're giving away free Frostys to try and build business up again. As you can imagine, they lost a lot of money when that bad press came out.

O'BRIEN: Double digits.

PHILLIPS: There you go.

O'BRIEN: Yes. All right.

PHILLIPS: All right. Moving on to other news, Fort McPherson is metro Atlanta's seventh largest employer, with 4,141 jobs. At Fort Mac, understandably, closure is a fighting word.

CNN's Sara Dorsey joins me now live with more information on a bit of bad news they received today.

Hi, Sara.

DORSEY: Hi to you, Kyra.

That's right, it's certainly not good news for any of the folks here at Fort McPherson. This fort, along with six other military installations in Georgia, are on the Pentagon's recommended list for the chopping block. But I'll tell you, state officials in Georgia are keeping a surprisingly optimistic view at this point because, in the same breath, the Pentagon has recommended that seven other military installations in this state be bolstered.

State Senator Johnny Isakson said today that things could have been much worse, really, for the state. Here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHNNY ISAKSON (R), GEORGIA: For the entire state, we have a net gain of 7,400 jobs. Georgia is the second largest winner in the BRAC realignment and closing process, second only to the state of Maryland. And so we have a lot to be thankful for.

But we're here because we care about every single job and every single opportunity. And we think we've got a great opportunity to restore Fort Mac, and we're going to make every effort to do so.

(END VIDEO CLIP) DORSEY: And here's a breakdown of the numbers. Three military installations in the state are taking a very big hit, of course. Those include here, Fort McPherson, 4,000 people, both military and civilians will lose jobs here or have to relocate. Fifteen hundred people are also in the same situation at the Naval Air Station in Atlanta. And more than 1,000 at Fort Gillem.

Now, there is some major winners in this whole thing. Fort Benning will gain nearly 10,000 people. Kings Bay Submarine Base will increase by more than 3,000. And Robins Air Force Base will gain nearly 400 people.

Now, I can tell you, Fort McPherson has been the main angle of this. Everyone out here today, politicians, both state and local, have on their fighting gloves. They say that they are going to try to change these recommendations, try to get the committee that is in charge of these military base closings to re-look at this issue.

They say this fort is part of day-to-day operations, it's vital to the military, and that this one should at least be looked at once again. Hopefully, they say that they will be able to make some sort of difference.

Both the governor and two state senators were out here today making a plea on national TV. They say they will continue that fight, and that they are most concerned about the jobs that will be lost in this area, also, because that means money for Atlanta that will be gone if indeed this base closes down -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Sara Dorsey at Fort Mac. Thank you so much.

And you don't turn a battleship on a dime, and you don't close or shrink or expand hundreds of military facilities in a week. What happens is BRAC. The Base Realignment and Closure Commission will screen the recommendations and report to President Bush by September 8. Mr. Bush will then accept the BRAC list or reject it.

All or nothing by September 23. If he accepts it, Congress will vote the list up or down, all or nothing. And if it fails, or if the president rejects it, BRAC has a month to revise and resubmit. If it's approved, the changes will take effect over the next six years

O'BRIEN: Well, the TV show "CSI" -- excuse me, my computer was a little off kilter there -- has a heart-pounding action there. And it's all about how crimes are solved, I'm told.

PHILLIPS: All done in a matter of minutes. But a crime scene investigation is hard work. Coming up, Dr. Sanjay Gupta looks at what it's like to catch a killer.

O'BRIEN: All right. And here's a story that's going to shock you: military recruiting gone wrong as a teenage boy is taught how to break the law.

PHILLIPS: And later, the efforts to prevent a strike at the nation's second largest air carrier and the potential impact on your summer travel.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: It's no secret many young people are steering clear of the military because of the Iraq war. To make itself more marketable, the Army is reducing its minimum active duty requirement now to 15 months and offering some bigger signing bonuses. But falling numbers are putting pressure on those recruiters, and some are bending the rules to keep the military supplied with soldiers.

CNN's Thelma Gutierrez with a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

THELMA GUTIERREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): David McSwane knew he was on to a big story.

DAVID MCSWANE, HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT: I wanted to see how far they would go to get one more soldier.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's getting in there.

GUTIERREZ: What he uncovered at one Army recruiting center is making waves all the way up to the Pentagon.

LT. COL. JEFFREY BRODEUR, U.S. ARMY: We aggressively and immediately started an investigation.

GUTIERREZ: David McSwane is not a professional journalist. He's 17 years old, a senior at Arvada West High School outside Denver, Colorado. And he's a prime target for military recruiters.

MCSWANE: This is just something that affects everyone in my age group, everyone in high school across America.

GUTIERREZ: So, David, a reporter for the high school newspaper, set out to find out just how far Army recruiters would go to enlist a new soldier.

MCSWANE: The scenario I came up with was that I'm a 17-year-old dropout and that I have a drug problem that I just -- I just can't kick.

GUTIERREZ: The Army requires a high school diploma or GED, and they don't except recruits with drug problems. But David says a recruiter at this center in Golden, Colorado, told him not to worry.

MCSWANE: These are the transcripts that go with the diploma.

GUTIERREZ: David says his recruiter told him to go to the Internet to buy this fake high school diploma and bogus school transcripts. David taped the conversations.

MCSWANE: They accepted my diploma and all that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, that's what they told us. So... MCSWANE: All right. But they don't know it's fake or anything and I'm not going to get in trouble?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right. You won't, pal.

MCSWANE: All right. Cool.

GUTIERREZ: As for his made-up drug problem:

MCSWANE: This is the detox he told me to buy.

GUTIERREZ: David says the recruiter told him to buy this product to pass the Army's drug test.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You just have to follow instructions to a tee. It has got like a 150 percent guarantee that you will pass. You know, I've seen it work before.

GUTIERREZ: The recruiter then took David to a store to buy the product while someone videotaped.

MCSWANE: He went as far as driving me down to the place to buy the detox drink in a government vehicle.

GUTIERREZ: After David's investigation was published in his high school newspaper, it snowballed into a P.R. nightmare for the Army.

BRODEUR: Disappointment. Wrapped up into one word.

GUTIERREZ: Lieutenant Colonel Jeffrey Brodeur has 129 recruiters under his command. Two of the four recruiters at this Golden, Colorado, center are now under investigation for alleged recruiting abuses.

BRODEUR: So far today, it appears to be a character issue. We're trained not to do that.

GUTIERREZ: Jim Massey was a Marine recruiter for three years.

JIM MASSEY, FMR. MILITARY RECRUITER: This isn't just an isolated incident. This is a widespread epidemic.

GUTIERREZ: Massey says military recruiters are under such intense pressure to make their quota, they'll often stretch the truth to sign up recruits. He says he did it, too.

MASSEY: I was a recruiter for three years. And I recruited 75 young men. And I would say 98 percent of the young men that I signed up for the Marine Corps were frauded into the military in some capacity.

GUTIERREZ: Massey says, when he failed to sign up two recruits a month, he received these letters of reprimand.

MASSEY: I had never had any types of or signs or symptoms of depression in my entire life until I went out on recruiting duty. My second year out on recruiting duty, I was taking antidepressants.

GUTIERREZ: Massey fought in Iraq, then came home with a change of heart. He's now an anti-war activist.

MASSEY: I sold my soul a long time ago to the Marine Corps. And each day, I strive to get a little bit of it back.

GUTIERREZ: Major General Michael Rochelle, commanding general in charge of recruiting for the U.S. Army, plans to shut down 1,700 recruiting offices across the country for one day to review procedures for the Army's 7,500 recruiters, in direct response to the allegations made by David McSwane and others.

MAJ. GEN. MICHAEL ROCHELLE, U.S. ARMY RECRUITING COMMAND: I was disappointed by it. I was very disappointed by it. I've been around the Army a long time. So, very little shocks me, if you will. It hurts personally and professionally.

GUTIERREZ: General Rochelle says the target is 80,000 new recruits a year. It is a tough task, he says, to recruit an all- volunteer Army at a time of war. Many parents use their influence to discourage enlistment.

ROCHELLE: One is the fear of loss of life or limb. And that's real. Take those two factors, along with the seeming resistance on the part of influencers, and you present a pretty daunting challenge for the Army.

SHELLY HANSEN, MOTHER OF DAVID: I worried that people would think he wasn't patriotic.

GUTIERREZ: Sally Hansen says she feared a backlash against her son for exposing his recruiters.

HANSEN: He's probably one of the most patriotic kids I know. He was in the Young Marines for almost a year and earned a couple awards.

GUTIERREZ: Now David has an award from his school for his expose on the Army.

MCSWANE: If I were a soldier out on the front line, I wouldn't want someone next to me who my life could be depending on going through withdrawal or having a drug addiction or just being someone I can't trust. I just don't think that's something we need on our front lines.

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O'BRIEN: Smart kid. The Army missed recruiting goals for February, March and again in April.

PHILLIPS: Well, one of the most successful crime programs on TV could be hurting criminal cases in the courts.

O'BRIEN: They call it the "CSI" effect. Coming up, Dr. Sanjay Gupta looks at how crime scenes really work and why juries may be letting real life criminals off the hook.

PHILLIPS: And later, the fast track to sainthood. Why the Catholic Church is bending the rules for Pope John Paul II.

KATHLEEN HAYS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm Kathleen Hays at the New York Stock Exchange. Coming up, United and its unions has stepped up talks in some tense wage negotiations. I'll have the latest on that story.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Well, if you're flying the friendly skies these days...

PHILLIPS: Friendly?

O'BRIEN: Well, yes, you're right. It's kind of an anachronism, isn't it? Yes.

Well, one time it was the friendly skies. United these days, it's...

(CROSSTALK)

PHILLIPS: Back when they had food

O'BRIEN: Food. Yes, remember that?

PHILLIPS: Free cocktails.

Anyway, Kathleen Hays has more on what we're trying to...

O'BRIEN: You miss those, don't you?

PHILLIPS: ... talk about live from the New York Stock Exchange.

(STOCK MARKET REPORT)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: "Now in the News," the battle starts today, so says the mayor of one town slated to lose its Air Force base under a new round of closings. The Pentagon today proposed shutting 33 major bases with a loss of almost 30,000 jobs.

From defense lawyer to defense witness, Michael Jackson's one- time attorney, Mark Geragos, is expected to take the stand any time now in the pop star's child molestation trial. Geragos represented Jackson during the initial investigation, but he was let go more than a year ago.

Hurricane dividend. Nine months ago today, a string of major storms began battering Florida. Folks were stuck at home without electricity for...

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