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Doubts Rising on Guantanamo Bay Camp; Astronomists Find Rocky New Planet

Aired June 13, 2005 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(STOCK MARKET REPORT)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Checking stories "Now in the News."

President Bush welcomes the presidents of five African nations. All of those countries, Botswana, Ghana, Mozambique, Namibia and Niger all held democratic elections last year. The gathering follows the British-led initiative aimed at forgiving debt incurred by some of the world's poor developing nations.

First things first. Supreme Court Justices say the case of Jose Padilla must be heard by a federal appeals court before they can consider it. Padilla, the so-called dirty bomb suspect, is challenging the president's power to detain someone and deny them legal rights.

More than a million. That's how many Americans are living with the virus that causes AIDS. Critics say the new estimate, just released by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, reflects a failure. This is the first time more than a million Americans have had HIV since the height of the AIDS epidemic two decades ago.

Heading home. Charles Jenkins, who deserted North Korea 40 years ago, on his way back to U.S. He is expected to stay about a week to visit his 91-year-old mother. Last year, Jenkins served 25 days in a U.S. military jail in Japan for his desertion.

And now to Aruba and a mother's relentless search for her missing daughter. Beth Holloway Twitty is demanding authorities put pressure on three young men she believes hold the key. Natalee Holloway was last seen two weeks ago now, leaving them -- leaving a nightclub with those three. Now they were arrested on Thursday. As for two other men arrested, hotel security guards, Holloway's mother says she believes they are innocent and they should be released. Aruba's government spokesman says that might happen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUBEN TRAPENBERG, ARUBA GOVT. SPOKESMAN: We don't get the details from the investigation from what we think may be the case, that these three gentlemen are pointing the finger to these two guys. So if they have an alibi they can substantiate where they have been, they may be released at some point. But that's still ongoing. Today, their lawyer, I've heard, may come with a special appeal so that their case can be considered.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: Authorities say they don't if -- know if all the suspects know each other. None has been formally charged in connection with Holloway's disappearance.

A Florida family is all too familiar with the kind of relentless search that we're seeing in this case. After her teenage daughter disappeared in 1974, a mother spent her whole life looking for answers. We get the story from CNN's Susan Candiotti.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Susan Billig is a woman who never gave up trying to learn the truth with about her missing daughter, who vanished without a trace 31 years ago.

JOSHUA BILLIG, AMY BILLIG'S BROTHER: I mean, relentless. I mean it in that same way. Her passion was relentless and deeply rooted and driven.

CANDIOTTI (on camera): On march 5, 1974, police say 17-year-old Amy Billig left her house, nestled behind this old banyan tree in Coconut Grove, Florida. Her family says she was on her way to her father's art gallery, located just about half a mile way. Some people think she might have been hitchhiking. It would not have been unusual then. And others think they saw her get into a van. But none of it could ever be verified.

(voice-over): The attractive teenager was never found.

J. BILLIG: Looking for my sister really did consume her, all of her time, for quite a while.

CANDIOTTI: Her son vividly remembers photo taken on a busy street shortly after his big sister's disappearance.

J. BILLIG: I mean, I see her -- obviously, her anguish. I see that she's really scared and she's desperate. And she just wants to do anything she can to find her daughter.

CANDIOTTI: And Susan Billig did. She spent years crisscrossing the country, tracking down tips her daughter was kidnapped by a motorcycle gang. In 1996, a deathbed confession from a biker, who claimed Amy was snatched the day she disappeared, then raped, drugged, murdered and dumped in the Florida Everglades. Police say it was probably true, but could not confirm it.

For two decades, Susan Billig endured cruel phone calls from a man who turned out to be a U.S. customs agent, claiming he had information about Amy. He was caught and convicted.

SUSAN BILLIG, MOTHER OF AMY BILLIG: I'm very hurt. I'm very angry this man has taken my life apart for 21 years. CANDIOTTI: At a city park, Amy's brother remembers his sister at a Bayside bench he made in her honor. To this day, Miami Police officially classify Amy's case as a missing person. This week, at age 80, Amy's mother Susan Billig died of cancer, to the end unconvinced of her daughter's fate.

J. BILLIG: I think she went back to her hope that maybe some -- there was -- maybe that she was alive or at least that we hadn't uncovered the whole story.

CANDIOTTI: Susan Billig will be buried next to her husband. And on the tombstone between her parents, Amy, joining them, at least in name.

Susan Candiotti, CNN, Miami.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Well, should the prison at Guantanamo Bay be shut down? We'll have a debate when LIVE FROM returns.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Guantanamo Bay, a military compound where some of the most feared terror suspects are being held. But in the wake of questionable treatment, the calls are mounting for Gitmo to be closed.

Joining me with their views, Lee Casey, an international law expert who has served in the government, and Michael Posner, executive director of Human Rights First. Gentlemen, good to have you both with us.

MICHAEL POSNER, HUMAN RIGHTS FIRST: Thank you.

O'BRIEN: Let's try to just set the perimeters here. Mr. Posner, is this about Guantanamo or this about interrogation tactics?

POSNER: It's about interrogation and detention policies all over the world. Guantanamo is about 500 people. The U.S. is holding more than 11,000 people in Afghanistan, Iraq and in other countries. This is about the policy of detention and how we're interrogating those people.

O'BRIEN: All right, so from your perspective, shutting down Guantanamo does not solve the problem?

POSNER: No, it doesn't, but Guantanamo's become a symbol. And I think in some ways if we took the first step of closing Guantanamo and said we're going to take a broad look at how we're detaining, under what circumstances, how we're reviewing and, most importantly to me, how we're going about interrogating people in accordance with the law. That's what we need to do.

O'BRIEN: Mr. Casey, is it important for the U.S. to make a statement for the world here in some way, even if it's a symbolic statement? LEE CASEY, INTERNATIONAL LAW EXPERT: Well, I agree, frankly, with Michael that the issue is not Guantanamo. And you're right, closing it down would be a symbolic statement. But the question is, where do we put these people then? And so, it doesn't really solve the problem. It gains us a minimal advantage in the propaganda war and, I think, does great damage in the shooting war.

O'BRIEN: You could make a case that the damage has been done and cannot be repaired at this point. Would you go along with that?

CASEY: Well, no, I'm not sure -- you know, obviously, whenever you're involved in a war, the enemy is going to use propaganda. Traditionally, the United States, frankly, isn't very good at propaganda.

O'BRIEN: Why not? Why aren't we better at getting our story out?

CASEY: Well, you know, I think in some sense, we have a tendency to be a little embarrassed to defend ourselves, that kind of thing. I'm not sure why we don't have a very good propaganda arm.

O'BRIEN: It amazes me that the country of Madison Avenue can't tell its story to the world. Mr. Posner, we shouldn't be playing patty cake with these guys, should we?

POSNER: No, not at all. We ought to be questioning them in very aggressive ways, but in accordance with the law. One of the things that makes this country great and one of the things people around the world expect is that we have a commitment to the rule of law. The Army has a field manual that tells the Army how to interrogate. We have constitutional standards. What we're concerned about is that the law is not be followed and that there are things like stress positions and use of dogs, sleep deprivation, which clearly violate the law and should not be part of our interrogation regime.

O'BRIEN: Mr. Casey, are there other ways -- bad term here -- skin a cat? To skin a cat, in this case? You know, I mean, it seems to me that in many cases, the information that is being sought here is kind of old and maybe not that useful in the first place.

CASEY: Well, I'm not sure that's right. You know, we're dealing with a long-term project. The only way you obtain information about what al Qaeda's plans might be is to collect it piece by piece and put it together. That often takes a very long time. And while the individuals now held at Guantanamo may well have stale information, it's only stale if you don't match it up with information we get from elsewhere.

O'BRIEN: Mr. Posner, doesn't the end justify the means in some cases, though? Given what happened on 9/11?

POSNER: Not at all. When you talk to military leaders, they're very clear that it is not in America's best interest, self interest, for us to be bending the rules and violating Geneva conventions or our own constitutional system. It's going to come back to haunt us. America has soldiers in a hundred countries in the world. If we don't follow the law, others are going to do the same and our soldiers are going to be put in harm's way.

O'BRIEN: And Mr. Casey, just to be clear here, do you think -- I know you don't want to see Guantanamo closed, but don't you think the system needs some fixing?

CASEY: Well, obviously, the system should always be reviewed and improved if it can be. I guess I fundamentally disagree with Michael that we're in violation of the law. We're not. We are, in fact, scrupulously complying with our obligations under international law.

O'BRIEN: Yes, but being held incommunicado and without charges for indefinite periods of time, is that really within the law?

CASEY: Sure. I mean, these people are not criminal suspects. They are enemy combatants captured in war.

O'BRIEN: But that was sort of an arbitrary definition change, wasn't it?

CASEY: No. If you look at the history of it, you'll find the term enemy combatant used in Supreme Court cases in this context, referring to this type of person, as well as older military manuals. We have never accept -- that is, the United States has never accepted the change in the law that groups like Amnesty International are claiming we're now violating.

O'BRIEN: All right. Unfortunately, we've got to leave it there. Lots more to talk about, obviously. Lee Casey, Michael Posner, thanks for your time.

CASEY: Thank you.

POSNER: Thank you.

O'BRIEN: Is another major airline about to write yet another Chapter 11 in a very sad tale? Susan Lisovicz will fill us in on that and some other business news headlines just ahead.

And it is the smallest and most Earth-like planet ever discovered beyond our solar system. We'll zoom in our telescope, so to speak, for a closer look, when LIVE FROM returns.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VERONICA DE LA CRUZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Every day, the human body produces enough to fill a quart-sized mayonnaise jar. That's pretty gross, right? At CNN.com/science, learn about grossology, the impolite science of the human body. It's a traveling exhibit for kids based on a series of books using their favorite gross subjects to interest them in science. The hands-on exhibit is a cross between an arcade and a jungle gym, and features different stations that let kids spin, shoot, climb, squeeze and smell all the gross thing the human body does.

Click through this interactive gallery to see kids learn how scabs, zits and blisters form by climbing the skin wall. See how many gross things you know about the body by testing your grossology I.Q. For example, where does the smell of onion and garlic breath come from? The lungs, mouth, stomach or tongue? You can log on and find out. And check the fact box for the grossology tour schedule, to find out when this grosser than gross exhibit is headed to a town near you. Hope I haven't ruined your appetite.

From the dot-com newsdesk, I'm Veronica De La Cruz.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: You want an empty seat in an airplane? Forget about it! Susan Lisovicz here with more on that, and the rest of the business news.

SUSAN LISOVICZ, BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: You're going to be fighting over the elbow rest if you're in economy class, Miles. That's what it comes down to.

O'BRIEN: I'll sharpen those elbows up, right?

LISOVICZ: Exactly.

Despite a series of modest fare increases, the major U.S. airlines filled nearly 80 percent of their seats last month. A survey conducted for "Usa Today" by Vac (ph) Aviation Solutions shows that May was one of the busiest months for the airlines, but other news in the airline sector is not so good. According to "The Wall Street Journal," there's some speculation that Northwest Airlines may be heading for bankruptcy if the carrier is not able to contain its pension and labor costs. Northwest shares are sinking 12 -- 11 percent -- on that report, about $1.50 off of its 52-week low.

As for the broader marketplace, the Dow is still on the upside, modestly to the upside -- up 30 points. The NASDAQ, meanwhile, up six-and-a-half, or a third of a percent. Crude oil may be a factor in why we're off our highs for this session. Crude, up more than two bucks, nearing $56 a barrel, that's keeping gains in check. OPEC producer said today it has little left in its armory to reign in prices. And that's the latest from Wall Street.

Miles, back to you.

O'BRIEN: All right, thank you very much, Susan.

Some news from way outer space to share with you. Folks at the University of California Santa Cruz -- team there has been looking way beyond our solar system for extrasolar planets as they are called, and has made a very interesting discovery, which they've just announced via the National Science Foundation a little while ago. What you're seeing are some animations that the National Science Foundation put together to show the finding of this particular planet.

Once again, these are not real pictures, folks, but animations of it. It is a planet that is about seven times the mass of earth, two times the diameter, but the key is, it's got a hard surface, a rocky, hard surface. It's the first planet discovered outside our solar system that isn't just a big gas giant like Uranus or Neptune.

Now, let me just explain to you a little bit about how they find these particular planets. This comes from April, the European Southern Observatory, the actual first image of an extra solar planet gathered because it happened to be near a brown dwarf, which is a star which is kind of dim, so they're able to resolve it. In order to find the planet which we just heard about today, what they do is look at these stars and they look for the wobble in the star over time, and by that wobble, they can -- because they're rocket scientists after all, they're good -- they can infer what is orbiting around and pulling that star. So, via that wobble, they came up with this, and the final thought here is, someday, someday maybe not too far away, they hope to see something like this, another pale blue dot. We will let you know when that happens.

Back with more in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Checking some stories "Now in the News," the Iraqi special tribunal today released new video of Saddam Hussein. The former dictator is seen but not heard being grilled about an alleged massacre in Iraq more than 20 years ago. Four of Hussein's former aides, also seen on the tape.

A Pentagon analyst indicted: court papers made public today alleged Lawrence Franklin leaked classified military information to employees of a pro-Israel lobbying group. The Air Force Reserve colonel has pleaded not guilty. A judge has ordered his trial to begin in September.

President Bush is promising to speed up aid to Africa. He spoke after a White House meeting with five African counterparts who've won free elections in the past year. The president says American wants to do its part to encourage democracy and reform on the continent.

And, it's something that hasn't happened in 53 years. An Israeli has been elected to serve as vice president of the United Nations General Assembly. Dan Gillerman says it's an historic moment for his country. The U.N.'s 60th annual assembly opens in September.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com


Aired June 13, 2005 - 14:30   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(STOCK MARKET REPORT)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Checking stories "Now in the News."

President Bush welcomes the presidents of five African nations. All of those countries, Botswana, Ghana, Mozambique, Namibia and Niger all held democratic elections last year. The gathering follows the British-led initiative aimed at forgiving debt incurred by some of the world's poor developing nations.

First things first. Supreme Court Justices say the case of Jose Padilla must be heard by a federal appeals court before they can consider it. Padilla, the so-called dirty bomb suspect, is challenging the president's power to detain someone and deny them legal rights.

More than a million. That's how many Americans are living with the virus that causes AIDS. Critics say the new estimate, just released by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, reflects a failure. This is the first time more than a million Americans have had HIV since the height of the AIDS epidemic two decades ago.

Heading home. Charles Jenkins, who deserted North Korea 40 years ago, on his way back to U.S. He is expected to stay about a week to visit his 91-year-old mother. Last year, Jenkins served 25 days in a U.S. military jail in Japan for his desertion.

And now to Aruba and a mother's relentless search for her missing daughter. Beth Holloway Twitty is demanding authorities put pressure on three young men she believes hold the key. Natalee Holloway was last seen two weeks ago now, leaving them -- leaving a nightclub with those three. Now they were arrested on Thursday. As for two other men arrested, hotel security guards, Holloway's mother says she believes they are innocent and they should be released. Aruba's government spokesman says that might happen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUBEN TRAPENBERG, ARUBA GOVT. SPOKESMAN: We don't get the details from the investigation from what we think may be the case, that these three gentlemen are pointing the finger to these two guys. So if they have an alibi they can substantiate where they have been, they may be released at some point. But that's still ongoing. Today, their lawyer, I've heard, may come with a special appeal so that their case can be considered.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: Authorities say they don't if -- know if all the suspects know each other. None has been formally charged in connection with Holloway's disappearance.

A Florida family is all too familiar with the kind of relentless search that we're seeing in this case. After her teenage daughter disappeared in 1974, a mother spent her whole life looking for answers. We get the story from CNN's Susan Candiotti.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Susan Billig is a woman who never gave up trying to learn the truth with about her missing daughter, who vanished without a trace 31 years ago.

JOSHUA BILLIG, AMY BILLIG'S BROTHER: I mean, relentless. I mean it in that same way. Her passion was relentless and deeply rooted and driven.

CANDIOTTI (on camera): On march 5, 1974, police say 17-year-old Amy Billig left her house, nestled behind this old banyan tree in Coconut Grove, Florida. Her family says she was on her way to her father's art gallery, located just about half a mile way. Some people think she might have been hitchhiking. It would not have been unusual then. And others think they saw her get into a van. But none of it could ever be verified.

(voice-over): The attractive teenager was never found.

J. BILLIG: Looking for my sister really did consume her, all of her time, for quite a while.

CANDIOTTI: Her son vividly remembers photo taken on a busy street shortly after his big sister's disappearance.

J. BILLIG: I mean, I see her -- obviously, her anguish. I see that she's really scared and she's desperate. And she just wants to do anything she can to find her daughter.

CANDIOTTI: And Susan Billig did. She spent years crisscrossing the country, tracking down tips her daughter was kidnapped by a motorcycle gang. In 1996, a deathbed confession from a biker, who claimed Amy was snatched the day she disappeared, then raped, drugged, murdered and dumped in the Florida Everglades. Police say it was probably true, but could not confirm it.

For two decades, Susan Billig endured cruel phone calls from a man who turned out to be a U.S. customs agent, claiming he had information about Amy. He was caught and convicted.

SUSAN BILLIG, MOTHER OF AMY BILLIG: I'm very hurt. I'm very angry this man has taken my life apart for 21 years. CANDIOTTI: At a city park, Amy's brother remembers his sister at a Bayside bench he made in her honor. To this day, Miami Police officially classify Amy's case as a missing person. This week, at age 80, Amy's mother Susan Billig died of cancer, to the end unconvinced of her daughter's fate.

J. BILLIG: I think she went back to her hope that maybe some -- there was -- maybe that she was alive or at least that we hadn't uncovered the whole story.

CANDIOTTI: Susan Billig will be buried next to her husband. And on the tombstone between her parents, Amy, joining them, at least in name.

Susan Candiotti, CNN, Miami.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Well, should the prison at Guantanamo Bay be shut down? We'll have a debate when LIVE FROM returns.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Guantanamo Bay, a military compound where some of the most feared terror suspects are being held. But in the wake of questionable treatment, the calls are mounting for Gitmo to be closed.

Joining me with their views, Lee Casey, an international law expert who has served in the government, and Michael Posner, executive director of Human Rights First. Gentlemen, good to have you both with us.

MICHAEL POSNER, HUMAN RIGHTS FIRST: Thank you.

O'BRIEN: Let's try to just set the perimeters here. Mr. Posner, is this about Guantanamo or this about interrogation tactics?

POSNER: It's about interrogation and detention policies all over the world. Guantanamo is about 500 people. The U.S. is holding more than 11,000 people in Afghanistan, Iraq and in other countries. This is about the policy of detention and how we're interrogating those people.

O'BRIEN: All right, so from your perspective, shutting down Guantanamo does not solve the problem?

POSNER: No, it doesn't, but Guantanamo's become a symbol. And I think in some ways if we took the first step of closing Guantanamo and said we're going to take a broad look at how we're detaining, under what circumstances, how we're reviewing and, most importantly to me, how we're going about interrogating people in accordance with the law. That's what we need to do.

O'BRIEN: Mr. Casey, is it important for the U.S. to make a statement for the world here in some way, even if it's a symbolic statement? LEE CASEY, INTERNATIONAL LAW EXPERT: Well, I agree, frankly, with Michael that the issue is not Guantanamo. And you're right, closing it down would be a symbolic statement. But the question is, where do we put these people then? And so, it doesn't really solve the problem. It gains us a minimal advantage in the propaganda war and, I think, does great damage in the shooting war.

O'BRIEN: You could make a case that the damage has been done and cannot be repaired at this point. Would you go along with that?

CASEY: Well, no, I'm not sure -- you know, obviously, whenever you're involved in a war, the enemy is going to use propaganda. Traditionally, the United States, frankly, isn't very good at propaganda.

O'BRIEN: Why not? Why aren't we better at getting our story out?

CASEY: Well, you know, I think in some sense, we have a tendency to be a little embarrassed to defend ourselves, that kind of thing. I'm not sure why we don't have a very good propaganda arm.

O'BRIEN: It amazes me that the country of Madison Avenue can't tell its story to the world. Mr. Posner, we shouldn't be playing patty cake with these guys, should we?

POSNER: No, not at all. We ought to be questioning them in very aggressive ways, but in accordance with the law. One of the things that makes this country great and one of the things people around the world expect is that we have a commitment to the rule of law. The Army has a field manual that tells the Army how to interrogate. We have constitutional standards. What we're concerned about is that the law is not be followed and that there are things like stress positions and use of dogs, sleep deprivation, which clearly violate the law and should not be part of our interrogation regime.

O'BRIEN: Mr. Casey, are there other ways -- bad term here -- skin a cat? To skin a cat, in this case? You know, I mean, it seems to me that in many cases, the information that is being sought here is kind of old and maybe not that useful in the first place.

CASEY: Well, I'm not sure that's right. You know, we're dealing with a long-term project. The only way you obtain information about what al Qaeda's plans might be is to collect it piece by piece and put it together. That often takes a very long time. And while the individuals now held at Guantanamo may well have stale information, it's only stale if you don't match it up with information we get from elsewhere.

O'BRIEN: Mr. Posner, doesn't the end justify the means in some cases, though? Given what happened on 9/11?

POSNER: Not at all. When you talk to military leaders, they're very clear that it is not in America's best interest, self interest, for us to be bending the rules and violating Geneva conventions or our own constitutional system. It's going to come back to haunt us. America has soldiers in a hundred countries in the world. If we don't follow the law, others are going to do the same and our soldiers are going to be put in harm's way.

O'BRIEN: And Mr. Casey, just to be clear here, do you think -- I know you don't want to see Guantanamo closed, but don't you think the system needs some fixing?

CASEY: Well, obviously, the system should always be reviewed and improved if it can be. I guess I fundamentally disagree with Michael that we're in violation of the law. We're not. We are, in fact, scrupulously complying with our obligations under international law.

O'BRIEN: Yes, but being held incommunicado and without charges for indefinite periods of time, is that really within the law?

CASEY: Sure. I mean, these people are not criminal suspects. They are enemy combatants captured in war.

O'BRIEN: But that was sort of an arbitrary definition change, wasn't it?

CASEY: No. If you look at the history of it, you'll find the term enemy combatant used in Supreme Court cases in this context, referring to this type of person, as well as older military manuals. We have never accept -- that is, the United States has never accepted the change in the law that groups like Amnesty International are claiming we're now violating.

O'BRIEN: All right. Unfortunately, we've got to leave it there. Lots more to talk about, obviously. Lee Casey, Michael Posner, thanks for your time.

CASEY: Thank you.

POSNER: Thank you.

O'BRIEN: Is another major airline about to write yet another Chapter 11 in a very sad tale? Susan Lisovicz will fill us in on that and some other business news headlines just ahead.

And it is the smallest and most Earth-like planet ever discovered beyond our solar system. We'll zoom in our telescope, so to speak, for a closer look, when LIVE FROM returns.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VERONICA DE LA CRUZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Every day, the human body produces enough to fill a quart-sized mayonnaise jar. That's pretty gross, right? At CNN.com/science, learn about grossology, the impolite science of the human body. It's a traveling exhibit for kids based on a series of books using their favorite gross subjects to interest them in science. The hands-on exhibit is a cross between an arcade and a jungle gym, and features different stations that let kids spin, shoot, climb, squeeze and smell all the gross thing the human body does.

Click through this interactive gallery to see kids learn how scabs, zits and blisters form by climbing the skin wall. See how many gross things you know about the body by testing your grossology I.Q. For example, where does the smell of onion and garlic breath come from? The lungs, mouth, stomach or tongue? You can log on and find out. And check the fact box for the grossology tour schedule, to find out when this grosser than gross exhibit is headed to a town near you. Hope I haven't ruined your appetite.

From the dot-com newsdesk, I'm Veronica De La Cruz.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: You want an empty seat in an airplane? Forget about it! Susan Lisovicz here with more on that, and the rest of the business news.

SUSAN LISOVICZ, BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: You're going to be fighting over the elbow rest if you're in economy class, Miles. That's what it comes down to.

O'BRIEN: I'll sharpen those elbows up, right?

LISOVICZ: Exactly.

Despite a series of modest fare increases, the major U.S. airlines filled nearly 80 percent of their seats last month. A survey conducted for "Usa Today" by Vac (ph) Aviation Solutions shows that May was one of the busiest months for the airlines, but other news in the airline sector is not so good. According to "The Wall Street Journal," there's some speculation that Northwest Airlines may be heading for bankruptcy if the carrier is not able to contain its pension and labor costs. Northwest shares are sinking 12 -- 11 percent -- on that report, about $1.50 off of its 52-week low.

As for the broader marketplace, the Dow is still on the upside, modestly to the upside -- up 30 points. The NASDAQ, meanwhile, up six-and-a-half, or a third of a percent. Crude oil may be a factor in why we're off our highs for this session. Crude, up more than two bucks, nearing $56 a barrel, that's keeping gains in check. OPEC producer said today it has little left in its armory to reign in prices. And that's the latest from Wall Street.

Miles, back to you.

O'BRIEN: All right, thank you very much, Susan.

Some news from way outer space to share with you. Folks at the University of California Santa Cruz -- team there has been looking way beyond our solar system for extrasolar planets as they are called, and has made a very interesting discovery, which they've just announced via the National Science Foundation a little while ago. What you're seeing are some animations that the National Science Foundation put together to show the finding of this particular planet.

Once again, these are not real pictures, folks, but animations of it. It is a planet that is about seven times the mass of earth, two times the diameter, but the key is, it's got a hard surface, a rocky, hard surface. It's the first planet discovered outside our solar system that isn't just a big gas giant like Uranus or Neptune.

Now, let me just explain to you a little bit about how they find these particular planets. This comes from April, the European Southern Observatory, the actual first image of an extra solar planet gathered because it happened to be near a brown dwarf, which is a star which is kind of dim, so they're able to resolve it. In order to find the planet which we just heard about today, what they do is look at these stars and they look for the wobble in the star over time, and by that wobble, they can -- because they're rocket scientists after all, they're good -- they can infer what is orbiting around and pulling that star. So, via that wobble, they came up with this, and the final thought here is, someday, someday maybe not too far away, they hope to see something like this, another pale blue dot. We will let you know when that happens.

Back with more in a moment.

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O'BRIEN: Checking some stories "Now in the News," the Iraqi special tribunal today released new video of Saddam Hussein. The former dictator is seen but not heard being grilled about an alleged massacre in Iraq more than 20 years ago. Four of Hussein's former aides, also seen on the tape.

A Pentagon analyst indicted: court papers made public today alleged Lawrence Franklin leaked classified military information to employees of a pro-Israel lobbying group. The Air Force Reserve colonel has pleaded not guilty. A judge has ordered his trial to begin in September.

President Bush is promising to speed up aid to Africa. He spoke after a White House meeting with five African counterparts who've won free elections in the past year. The president says American wants to do its part to encourage democracy and reform on the continent.

And, it's something that hasn't happened in 53 years. An Israeli has been elected to serve as vice president of the United Nations General Assembly. Dan Gillerman says it's an historic moment for his country. The U.N.'s 60th annual assembly opens in September.

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