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Taliban Takes Credit for Helicopter Crash; Brain Injuries Common Among Iraq War Vets

Aired June 29, 2005 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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COL. JAMES YONTS, COALITION SPOKESMAN: The aircraft was taking indirect fire, direct fire from elements on the ground.

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KYRA PHILLIPS, HOST: American chopper down in Afghanistan. The Taliban claims a direct hit. We're live from the Pentagon.

Milk and threats of sabotage. Is a new report a warning or a road map for terror?

And the search for Natalee Holloway. The Aruban government calls in the Marines.

Did Russia's president rush off with a Super Bowl championship ring?

From the CNN Center in Atlanta, I'm Kyra Phillips. CNN's LIVE FROM starts right now.

Under fire in the mountains on the hunt for al Qaeda fighters. A U.S. military transport chopper, like this one you're about to see, lies in ruins in the rugged Hindu Kush mountain range of eastern Afghanistan. The fate of 17 U.S. troops on board, unknown.

The Taliban is claiming it shot the helo down. And U.S. officials say that's at least a possibility.

CNN's Barbara Starr was in that region as recently as last week. She's following the story closely from the Pentagon. Barbara, what do we know at this point?

BARBARA STARR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kyra, those troops were being brought into those mountains to support and reinforce other troops already on the ground that were in a firefight with insurgents.

There were four helicopters coming in. They noticed enemy fire. One of the helicopters, apparently, hit. The military spokesman in Afghanistan spoke a little while ago about what happened.

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YONTS: The aircraft was taking indirect fire, direct fire, from elements on the ground. The aircraft, as it was dropping off those personnel, crashed, so we know it was taking fire. Whether or not that caused it to crash we don't know. But it was under indirect and direct fire. So that's why we say that it may have caused the crash of the helicopter.

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STARR: What they are talking about is there was both rocket fire and small arms fire at the time. U.S. Air Force A-10 fixed wing aircraft flying overhead also saw that ground fire, rolled in and fired their rockets against those insurgent positions.

Now what is going on today -- and, of course, again, it is nightfall in Afghanistan. A second night on those mountains, we are told. The wreckage of the aircraft lies at about 10,000 feet down a very steep mountainside.

They have tried to get U.S. ground forces into the area to secure the site. They -- because of bad weather today, both rain and wind, they have not been able to land any helicopters in the area. Still, no word, no official word on the fate of the 17 service members on board -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: now Barbara, you were just in the region. And you traveled via helicopter all over the place, obviously, in areas that were a high threat. They were high-threat areas. Just describe to me what the elements are like, the weather is like, the threat that's out there, and the security involved every time you traveled via helicopter?

STARR: Well, most of this region along the Afghan/Pakistan border is at extraordinarily high altitudes, of course. We're talking 10,000, 14,000 feet.

The video we are showing you right now was taken, actually, in November 2003. This is the very region where the crash has taken place. This was taken by CNN cameraman/producer Tomas Etsler (ph), as he and I both traveled through the Hindu Kush on board Chinook helicopters with General John Abizaid. Tomas Etsler (ph) going for the primary seat on the back of this open helicopter at about 14,000 feet.

You see how very rugged, how very rough the terrain is. Helicopters are the only way in, the only way out. And that is proving to be the real challenge in this case.

These helos fly with very big security packages. But in this case, they were dropping off U.S. troops as a reinforcement for a firefight already going on on the ground, when they believe this enemy fire struck the Chinook -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Well, we saw the shots there just a second ago and the video. How many gunners are usually on board the helicopters when you fly?

STARR: We won't get too much into the security on board these helicopters, because of course, this does put troops at risk. These are ongoing operations. Even today, as they try and recover the remains or the survivors of this helicopter crash, there are still counterinsurgency operations going on in these mountains.

But suffice it to say, there is security. There are gunners on both sides. There are gunners in the back, and, of course, consider this. These helicopters were flying in a four-flight formation. Helicopters do not make solo flights through these mountains. They fly either in pairs, four at a time, perhaps. Communications between the helicopters, everybody keeps their eyeballs out for any type of enemy ground fire.

But when you look at those mountains, rough terrain. People could be hiding anywhere. It's a very tough proposition, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Our Barbara Starr, LIVE FROM the Pentagon. Thanks, Barbara.

Well, more than 3 1/2 years after U.S. troops drove the Taliban out of power, it's still in the picture and a source of fascination for Sebastian Junger. He's the best-selling author of "The Perfect Storm" and contributing editor of "Vanity Fair" magazine. He was actually embedded with the Northern Alliance as it battled the Taliban far before September 11. He joins me now live from New York.

Sebastian, good to see you.

SEBASTIAN JUNGER, AUTHOR, "THE PERFECT STORM": Hi, there.

PHILLIPS: I just want to step back for a minute, because I remember reading about when you were with the Northern Alliance. I remember the pictures, your relationship with Masoud and what it was like to battle the Taliban as they tried to search for Osama bin Laden and take him down.

Knowing what you know about Masoud and the mission there to take down the Taliban, years later now, where the U.S. is, where we are, with regard to the status there, do you see much difference? The pros and the cons?

JUNGER: Well, Masoud's position was that the Taliban were, in effect, an arm of Pakistan. And that without Pakistani support, the Taliban would never have been able to do what they do.

I think he would probably say the same thing now. He was killed right before 9/11. But if he were on the ground right now, I think he would say that -- that the Taliban keep replenishing their ranks, and they wouldn't be able to do that without outside support.

I mean, there are reports from the U.S. military of killing hundreds of Taliban at a time, even in this past week. An insurgency can't sustain that kind of damage without being replenished.

PHILLIPS: So we talk a lot about the relationship between Pakistan and the United States. Pervez Musharraf and President Bush talking and meeting. Why isn't Pakistan taking a harder stance on what seems to be the reason that the Taliban is still thriving in Afghanistan?

JUNGER: Well, Musharraf is in a very tenuous position. On the one hand, he has to at least appear to support the United States in the war on terror. And he, in fact, is doing some -- making some good efforts in that fight.

On the other hand, there is a very conservative religious movement in his country, and if he pushed too hard against that movement, which is basically a movement that supports the insurgency in Afghanistan, the Taliban, if he pushes too hard, he could split his government. He could find himself overthrown.

So he's really walking a tight rope, trying to accommodate the United States, but not push extremist elements in his country past the point where they would actually try to overthrow him.

PHILLIPS: Do you believe and do you think Masoud believed that if, indeed, Pakistan, Musharraf now, took a tougher stance against terrorism, joined the U.S., that, indeed, together, both countries could find Osama bin Laden and take down the Taliban?

JUNGER: My guess, and it really is just a guess, is that the -- there is a lack of political will in Pakistan to take down bin Laden, or it would have happened by now. Which means that it would require U.S. help, military help across, coming across the border from Afghanistan, into Pakistan. And that would be politically very, very risky for him.

I think what you would then end up with, the only other alternative, would be small Special Forces teams that could do the job. And maybe that's already happening. Who knows? But we really can't see thousands of U.S. troops moving across the border into Pakistan without really putting Musharraf at risk.

PHILLIPS: Meanwhile, when we see a helicopter like this Chinook that was allegedly shot down, the Taliban claiming responsibility for it, why is it thriving? Tell me about the recruiting and what you know about the recruiting and why it remains strong.

JUNGER: Well, there are religious schools in Pakistan called madrasses, and they recruit young men. When I was with Masoud in 2000 in Afghanistan, I would say probably half the fighters in the Taliban trenches were young Pakistanis.

And we talked with prisoners of war that Masoud had taken. Half of them were Pakistanis. They're young guys. They're filled with fervor, a religious fervor to fight, to establish a -- basically, a theocracy in Afghanistan and Pakistan.

And there's no problem getting more of these guys. I mean, as said before, we've killed hundreds at a time at different points in the past few years. And it hasn't made a dent in the insurgency, in the Taliban. There will always be more young guys like that. Ultimately, the solution, I think, will be a political one, as in -- as maybe in Iraq the solution will be a political one, not just a military one. PHILLIPS: And I'm assuming it doesn't help with the drug trade and the poppy crops and the money created there, is continuing to help support the Taliban?

JUNGER: Yes, the drug trade -- I mean it provides an enormous amount of money for an insurgency. And even when I was there with Masoud, it was very clear that's how the Taliban were funding themselves.

It's a sprawling country. There's no central authority. It's very, very hard to police something like the drug trade. And it's a very poor country. So you have to be a little bit more forgiving, I think, for the people of Afghanistan if they tried to bring up their level of living, their standard of living by selling opium.

PHILLIPS: Sebastian Junger, I look forward to your next trip to Afghanistan, hopefully a safe one. Appreciate your time today.

JUNGER: Thank you.

PHILLIPS: More fine-tuning today for the U.S. intelligence apparatus. Ninety days, give or take, after a blue ribbon panel raised dozens of red flags over intel lapses and shortcomings, in particular, concerning threats from WMD, the White House is green- lighting 70 of the panel's 74 recommendations for reform. Those include a brand-new national security office within the FBI.

FBI chief Robert Mueller and Attorney General Roberto Gonzalez plan a news conference to talk about the changes next hour. You'll see it live, right here on LIVE FROM.

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PHILLIPS (voice-over): Later on LIVE FROM, America's milk, a target for terror? Scientists release the report the government did not want you to see.

Later on LIVE FROM...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was really scared, because I didn't know who it was.

PHILLIPS: An online threat of violence at school. Was it a prank or the real thing? A parent alerts the authorities and is stunned by the community's response.

Next on LIVE FROM...

SGT. DAVID EMME, BRAIN INJURY PATIENT: Yes, I'm not Sergeant David Emme that I used to be.

PHILLIPS: The silent wound of war. CNN's Dr. Sanjay Gupta investigates a devastating injury from the war in Iraq.

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PHILLIPS: And welcome back to LIVE FROM. Live from the newsroom, we're talking about standing his ground at Ft. Bragg. President Bush, commander in chief, tells the troops and the nation and the world that the U.S. will stay in Iraq, quote, "until the fight is won."

Mr. Bush evoked the specter of September 11 five times in his 28- minute address, on the first anniversary of the handover of Iraqi self-rule.

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GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES (voice-over): The troops here and across the world are fighting a global war on terror. The war reached our shores on September the 11th, 2001.

After September 11, I made a commitment to the American people: this nation will not wait to be attacked again. We will defend our freedom. We will take the fight to the enemy.

The only way our enemies can succeed is if we forget the lessons of September the 11th.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: Two separate investigations and President Bush have concluded there's no evidence Saddam Hussein conspired with al Qaeda or Osama bin Laden on the 9/11 attacks or anything else. But that didn't stop a Republican congressman from saying this earlier today on CNN.

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REP. ROBIN HAYES (R), NORTH CAROLINA: It's very clear that terrorists are connected to what Saddam Hussein was all about. And that, again, faces us as the most severe threat going forward.

CAROL COSTELLO, HOST, "DAYBREAK": But there is no evidence that Saddam Hussein was connected in any way to al Qaeda.

HAYES: Ma'am, I'm sorry, but you're mistaken. There's evidence everywhere. We get access to it. Unfortunately, others don't.

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PHILLIPS: Well, the reviews are in from the Bush speech, and they're largely positive. A CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup poll of people who actually watched the speech finds 46 percent report a very positive reaction, 28 percent somewhat positive. And we point out presidential speech viewers are a much more partisan group than the general public.

We also note the 46 percent very positive rating is a steep drop from the 67 percent who raved about the president's "mission accomplished" speech back in May 2003 aboard the USS Abraham Lincoln. Before last night's address, 56 percent of respondents felt that the president had a clear plan for the war in Iraq. Afterward, 63 percent did.

Well, Democrats are hoping the president's salute to the troop will translate to more money for veterans, in particular, for health care provided by the V.A.

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SEN. JAY ROCKEFELLER (D), WEST VIRGINIA: I've watched, aghast, while they have not only not contemplated taking care of those veterans, but have jiggered the figures so to save money because they were so busy with their tax cuts that they couldn't figure out a way how to give the V.A. health care that our veterans deserve and need in a way which people have never needed before. Because this is not just injuries, but this is psychological, inside injuries, which stay for years and years and years.

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PHILLIPS: Two years plus now since U.S. forces began fighting in Iraq. Almost four years in Afghanistan. It's long enough for doctors to detect a pattern of many injuries suffered by returning combat veterans.

Our senior medical correspondent, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, has more.

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DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Every war has a signature injury. For Sergeant David Emme, this was it. It came on November 19, when his truck set off an explosive device.

EMME: I didn't see a blast or anything. Next thing I know is I wake up and my head hurts.

I had two teeth that were blown out. I basically didn't have an ear drum in my left ear.

GUPTA: And a brain that had been rattled back and forth in his helmet, a traumatic brain injury.

As things stand today, over two-thirds of the soldiers injured in a blast in Iraq suffer from a traumatic brain injury. Simply, it has become the signature of this war.

DR. DEBORAH WARDEN, VETERANS BRAIN INJURY CENTER: I think about my head, if you think about even in a car accident, my head going forward, hitting the ground or the windshield...

GUPTA: Dr. Deborah Warden has seen firsthand the impact, and she knows this war is different. The Vietnam War became known for spinal cord injuries, limb amputations and Agent Orange poisonings. The first Gulf War inflicted the controversial syndrome of the same name. But this time, it is land mines, mortar attacks and rocket- propelled grenades. They create blasts that literally rock the brain, similar to a high impact car accident. The skull moves forward, impacts a hard surface, and then stops suddenly. The brain goes back and forth and then begins to swell.

EMME: It bruised my brain and what ended up happening is my brain swelled up twice the size of a normal brain.

They took a big hunk of my skull out.

GUPTA: The operation saved his life, and he looks pretty normal today. But the signature of a traumatic brain injury may be subtle.

EMME: It was like somebody speaking a foreign language, you know, and they had to keep on reportedly telling me the same stuff. Because you know, due to the brain injury, I had a hard time comprehending, or talking or verbalizing a lot of stuff.

GUPTA: In mild cases, a traumatic brain injury may be a mild headache or occasional dizziness. More severe case can involve complete memory loss, personality changes or even persistent vegetative state.

Unlike an obviously severed limb, traumatic brain injuries are difficult to diagnose. But make no mistake, they are increasingly common. Doctors at Walter Reed say they have seen twice as many brain injury patients as limb amputees returning from Iraq. And today, all patients returning with a war wound are automatically screened for a traumatized brain.

When Sergeant Emme was screened, his doctors saw clear changes.

EMME: A lot of times what they call this -- they call this the silent wound or the silent injury, that I'm not the Sergeant David Emme that I used to be.

GUPTA: A silent signature of war. Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN, New York.

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PHILLIPS: Now we're getting live pictures from the Pentagon, where Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld is about to hold a town hall meeting at the Army Auditorium. We're monitoring that for you this hour.

And firefighters out west are nervously watching the weather and hoping to get the upper hand. We're on the wildfire, straight ahead.

Plus, plans for Ground Zero. A first look at a new design for Freedom Tower.

Stay with us. More LIVE FROM right after a quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Trevor Rees-Jones was the soul survivor of the car crash that killed Princess Diana and his boss, Dodi Fayed, in August 1997.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The car is totally smashed in.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The fired family bodyguard, a passenger in the car that night, needed extensive surgery to rebuild his face. But rebuilding his life has been tougher. He lost his job working for Dodi's father, Mohammed al-Fayed, after the millionaire claimed Rees- Jones had a role in the crash.

TREVOR REES-JONES, FORMER BODYGUARD FOR AL-FAYED FAMILY: He only sees his own truth. He's not going to be happy until the definitive version is the one that he puts out. And it's never going to be because, as far as I'm concerned, it was just a simple car accident.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A French inquiry cleared Rees-Jones of any responsibility in 1999. A year later, he wrote a book about his experience, called "The Bodyguard's Story."

But since the book, he has never sought publicity, but says he has moved on with his life. He runs his own security company and has worked in Iraq and for the U.N. in East Timor.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: And good news for car buyers. Chrysler could soon match a popular incentive that's drawing buyers for one of its rivals. Susan Lisovicz, joining us live from the New York Stock Exchange with that story -- Susan.

(STOCK REPORT)

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