Return to Transcripts main page

Live From...

Fifth Suspect in Bombings Arrested; Rove Says Novak Gave Him CIA Agent's Name; Schwarzenegger Under Fire for Magazine Association

Aired July 15, 2005 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BETTY NGUYEN, HOST: And a distant biochemist is being detained at this hour in connection with the London terror attacks. We have the latest of his ties to the U.S.
There's another Category 3 hurricane churning through the Caribbean. Find out where Emily is headed.

And the golden bear makes his last appearance at the British open while Tiger chases another major title. We are live from St. Andrews with the latest on today's round.

Beautiful shot there. From the CNN center here in Atlanta, I'm Betty Nguyen, in for Kyra Phillips. CNN's LIVE FROM begins right now.

We begin this hour with the Cairo connection. Eight days after four disastrous bombings in the London mass transit system, a Ph.D. in biochemistry is being held and questioned in Egypt.

Magdy el-Nashar's connection to the events of 7/7 is unclear at best and possibly non-existent, but tantalizing leads have come to light, largely in Lees. And CNN's John Vause is there now. He joins us now with the latest.

John, what do you know?

JOHN VAUSE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Betty.

Police aren't giving us much indication as to how Magdy el-Nashar fits into the overall picture of this investigation. But there are several things which we do know.

We know that he was born in Egypt, that he has a house in Cairo and that he was studying here, in Leeds, on a student visa. We also know that earlier today Egyptian authorities arrested him at Cairo International Airport. We do not know if he was leaving the country or if he was arriving at the time of the arrest.

Now, all of this, it seems, London police have been following it at a distance.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COMMISSIONER IAN BLAIR, METROPOLITAN POLICE: I can only tell you that I am aware of the development, as you would expect me to be. We will be monitoring the developments in Egypt very carefully. And if it's necessary, we will send officers there or we will seek extradition or whatever other processes are necessary.

But as I've said on many occasions, this -- we hope this is all going to end up in a trial. Speculation by a commissioner right now two hours out of the loop is not the place.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VAUSE: Now a couple of things tie el-Nashar to Leeds. First of all, his apartment, which is right here behind me. You may remember on Tuesday, Betty, anti-terror police started their search in this area by raiding six homes. This was one of the six homes that was, in fact, raided.

Now on Tuesday, police sent in the bomb squad and they said that inside this apartment was a harmful substance. They evacuated the area. Hundreds of people were forced to leave.

CNN has now learned that, in fact, there were traces of chemicals found in this house. Those chemicals, if mixed together, would in fact make some kind of explosive.

Now, El-Nashar, officials say, is linked to the scene of the London bombings, because one of the cell phones that was recovered from the debris had el-Nashar's telephone number on it.

British press have already dubbed him the chemist. That's because he was a doctorate in biochemistry. He got that from here at Leeds University. But he also studied chemistry in North Carolina State in Raleigh. Now campus officials here in Leeds say that el- Nashar has not been seen since the beginning of this month -- Betty.

NGUYEN: John, as part of this wider investigation, what do you know about this alleged al Qaeda member who entered London just before the attacks, but was not under any kind of surveillance?

VAUSE: What we're learning from Sir Ian Blair, the police commissioner, metropolitan police commissioner, very vague on this. What they're saying is that a man entered this country. He was, in fact, on a terror watch list. Not too sure if Sir Ian Blair is saying he was, in fact, an al Qaeda operative, but they did say that he was a low priority at the time. But o f course, now they say they would like to find him -- Betty.

NGUYEN: And we also learn he left just hours before the attacks. So of course, we're going to be learning much more about this and if, indeed, it's connected at all.

John Vause in Leeds, thank you.

Well, before he moved to Leeds, el-Nashar apparently studied briefly at North Carolina State University. CNN's David Mattingly weighs in now from Raleigh.

Hi, David.

DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Betty. One of the bits of information we're getting out of Cairo right now is that Magdy el-Nashar is claiming he had nothing to do with the London bombings. That would be consistent with the person remembered here on the North Carolina State campus.

One person who knew him as a student back when says that he seemed like a regular guy, someone who never expressed any radical points of view. He only attended college here briefly, only one semester in the spring of 2000. So, this was five years ago when he was here. He was here for one semester as a -- as a chemical engineering graduate student.

After that time, he did not return to campus. It's believed that he went back to his native Cairo, where he had plans to continue his education in the United Kingdom. And that appears to have turned out to be true. He did reenter in classes at the University of Leeds in October of 2000 after leaving here, where he pursued his doctorate in biochemical engineering.

So again, the person remembered here was someone who was not here for very long, did not have a very high profile, someone who seemed like a regular guy. Someone they believe who would not be involved in this sort of incident. And according to what we're hearing out of Cairo, that is what he is claiming at this hour -- Betty.

NGUYEN: David, now that el-Nashar has been detained, does that change what the FBI is doing?

MATTINGLY: Well, the FBI has been looking at his records here at the university, his residential records at the private residences where he lived off campus, and they're checking with people who might have known him.

This was never really a manhunt here. So the fact that he is now in custody and being questioned doesn't change what was happening here in North Carolina. This is a fact finding mission that the FBI is doing to find out more about what he was doing that brief time he was here in North Carolina.

NGUYEN: David Mattingly in North Carolina. Thank you, David.

Could a mass transit massacre happen right here in America? Most of us seem to think so. An A.P. survey finds 57 percent of Americans think an attack on buses, trains or subways somewhere in the U.S. is inevitable. Barely a third think it's preventable.

Nevertheless, and despite overall job approval ratings still in the low 40s, President Bush gets relatively high marks on foreign policy and the war on terror. Fifty-one percent say they approve of the president's performance on those fronts; 48 percent disapprove. Essentially, statistically, that's an even split.

Well, another about face on the legal front at Gitmo. Today the U.S. Court of Appeals in D.C. decided terror suspects at Guantanamo Bay may be tried by military commissions after all. That's a victory for the Bush administration and a blow to a suspect who once served as a chauffeur to Osama bin Laden. A lower court had sided with the chauffeur's position that the commissions were unconstitutional.

Yet another twist in the case of the outed operative. Listen carefully now. It's the alleged source of the confidential source's confidential information, which he leaked to at least one reporter, who almost went to jail because of it.

CNN's Suzanne Malveaux talks us through these details from the White House.

All right. Sort us through it all, Suzanne.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Betty, earlier today we saw the president and his top political advisor, Karl Rove, together on their way to Charlotte, North Carolina. The White House strategy remains the same, that is to say as little as possible, to let the pictures do the talking instead.

But we did get new information that was revealed earlier today that Rove was not just talking to one journalist, but at least two journalists when it came to the identity of Valerie Plame, the CIA agent.

Now the interesting twists here, of course, is that learning from a lawyer familiar with the grand jury testimony, he said earlier today that it was a conversation of July 9, 2003, that it was Novak that called Rove, that he was the one who revealed the name of the CIA agent, Valerie Plame, that Rove responded that he had heard this, too, that this was on the level of gossip and rumor, but that Rove did not know the identity of Valerie Plame until it was columnist Novak who told him during that conversation.

Also from the lawyer, he says that it was July 11, 2003, just two days afterwards that Rove spoke with "TIME" magazine's Matt Cooper. He did not mention Plame's name during that conversation, according to this source, because he was trying to be discreet, this lawyer saying that this demonstrates that Rove was a consumer of information, not necessarily a provider.

Now, Rove's attorney, Robert Luskin, I spoke with him, responding to all of these reports about what has unfolded today. He has said, quite emphatically, he says, "Karl has been cooperating some time with the special prosecutor and has told him every pertinent piece of information that he knows and the special prosecutor was aware of all relative contacts that Karl may have had when he previously reassured him that he was not a target," essentially saying that he believes that this information that has come forward clears his client.

Now of course, what does all of this mean legally? Well, I spoke with one of the people who coauthored the statute, the federal statute in 1982, which defines how leaking is a federal crime. She says simply that it does not meet the standard here. That if, in fact, Novak told Rove the name, gave the name, that there was no indication, no red flag that perhaps she was an undercover agent. Very important.

And then secondly, Betty, of course, the big question here is how is this all going to play out politically? We still don't know who that first source is when it comes to who did Novak speak with? Who initially gave him that name, if you believe these stories here that it was not necessarily Rove?

And then secondly, how long is this going to be a distraction? This is the second day President Bush on the road, talking about a policy issue that is getting very little attention -- Betty.

NGUYEN: And it can be quite confusing. So let's get this straight. If the journalists mentioned it first and then Rove talked about it, is it still in question whether Rove broke the law by speaking about it at all?

MALVEAUX: Well, what Rove has to do and what the prosecutor has to show is that he intentionally knew that Valerie Plame was an undercover agent, first of all, and that he knew that the government was trying to hide her identity and he went forward and identified her anyway. That is what the prosecution has to prove. So far, his lawyer says he has not done that. He has not only not done that, he says Rove is not even a target of this investigation.

NGUYEN: All right. We will be watching. Suzanne Malveaux, thank you.

Well, call it the six degrees of Karl Rove. It is our focus today on "INSIDE POLITICS," 3:30 p.m. Eastern, 12:30 Pacific right here on CNN.

It's another day of high water in and around Houston, but that may be just a drop in the bucket compared to what may be coming. Look at this.

Hurricane Emily is on a path for the Yucatan sometime Sunday and possibly the southern tip of Texas on Wednesday. But as you can see, it's already getting lots of rain there. In the meantime, misery from drenching rains that have ruined basements, stranded cars and put an estimated 33 rescues yesterday alone. Thirty-three people had to be rescued because of the flood waters that you see there.

Let's get the low down on Emily now from CNN meteorologist Jill Brown. Where is she, Jill?

JILL BROWN, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Well, Emily is still well out over open water. So we've got a little time to watch that one. The immediate concern, really, in Texas is that we'll see more rain today in some of the same spots that we saw yesterday. So I'll get to Emily in just a second.

I want to show you, flash flood watches are in effect out here, all of these green shaded counties. That's until 7 p.m. this evening. And you'll notice that there's actually not a whole lot of heavy rain right around Houston now. It's a little farther to the south. And what the weather service is saying is one to two inches of rain possible.

But yesterday, we had up to six inches and there could be some isolated incidents of the same. So more rain in those flooded areas. Obviously, it's quickly going to cause some problems, even an inch of rain.

Along Interstate 10, mainly light rain. The heavier stuff of off the coast, thankfully, in Louisiana, and then we have some pockets of heavier rain in and around New Orleans. And then if you back up a bit, you can see scattered showers now popping up all over the place in the east just like yesterday. And that's something we'll continue to see.

Texas, we call this the Texas two-step, because we have both sides of the story here with this very heavy rain and our upper level disturbance kind of keeping it going with all that tropical moisture.

On the other side of that trough is where the extreme heat starts, and that stands to the west coast. And it looks like we'll be dealing with that as we go into the weekend. So actually, pretty busy weekend.

Here is a look at Emily now over the Caribbean. Some of these outer bands may be bringing some showers in, but not expected to make land fall in the next 24 hours.

Take a look now at our track and our information. Winds are 125. That's down from earlier. It's a Category 3, not a Category 4 any longer. So if we follow the path of this, it is expected to brush the southern coast of Jamaica tomorrow with 120 mile per hour winds. That's an improvement in the forecast, and then make its way to the northern Yucatan Peninsula, brush the Yucatan, head out into the Gulf of Mexico. So Cozumel, Cancun, it looks like, Sunday, Monday, after that in the Gulf of Mexico, heading up toward either Mexico or Texas.

And it looks like the main thing that we've seen happen, Betty, is that the upper level winds have not been as favorable as expected. And that is good news, because that has weakened Emily a little bit and it may weaken her a little more as we go through time.

So next update from the hurricane center is in one hour. We'll see what we get there, and we'll watch this story for the next few days.

NGUYEN: And we sure hope so, because South Texas really doesn't need any more rain after the video we saw today.

BROWN: No.

NGUYEN: All right. Thank you.

Next on LIVE FROM we go unscripted with the Dolans. Find out what Ken and Daria have to say about Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger's very lucrative side job. Also, Chief Justice Rehnquist says he's staying on the job. What impact will his announcement have on President Bush's choice to replace Justice Sandra Day O'Connor?

And later from LIVE FROM some police officers are trying a new tactic to prevent terrorist attacks on city buses.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) NGUYEN: Moonlighting in Sacramento? Well, California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger is taking some political heat for having a second job. It was recently revealed that the former body builder has a multi-million dollar deal with several fitness magazines, packed with ads for nutritional supplements. And some lawmakers say that is a conflict of interest.

Ken and Daria Dolan join us now to hash all of this out. We appreciate you being on the show. Hello there.

KEN DOLAN, CO-HOST, "DOLANS UNSCRIPTED": Hi, Betty.

DARIA DOLAN, CO-HOST, "DOLANS UNSCRIPTED": How are you?

NGUYEN: I'm doing great. OK, here's the question. It's an $8 million deal. Is this a conflict of interest?

D. DOLAN: Well, you know, they say he's essentially going to do this in his spare time, which only says to me, Betty, you, Ken and I are in the wrong business, doing the wrong work.

NGUYEN: But in California, you're allowed to have extra jobs, even though you're in office.

D. DOLAN: I think that it was on the books and never fully intended that anybody would take them up on it. Now they're reaping the rewards of that kind of legislation.

K. DOLAN: Betty, I'm of the opinion -- and of course, my opinion is somewhat suspect on occasion, but I'm of the opinion that if Arnold Schwarzenegger made $25 million in "Terminator III" and $20 million and had so much money, which is one of the reasons he said, "I'm not taking my salary," then why take the chance -- now, $8 million is $8 million. I have to work two weeks at CNN to make that, two weeks.

NGUYEN: Is that all?

K. DOLAN: Two weeks.

D. DOLAN: Where are your paychecks going?

K. DOLAN: Never mind.

NGUYEN: Really. I need that paycheck.

K. DOLAN: But Betty, my opinion is why take a chance to get into a political mess for money that he probably doesn't need where there might be conflict of interest? Wasn't there some -- wasn't there some legislation?

D. DOLAN: There was some problems, I think, at least in my humble opinion. Maybe not so humble.

K. DOLAN: Not so humble, yes.

D. DOLAN: But anyway, he's receiving 1 percent of the advertising in group of fitness and body building magazines, which comes in large part from nutritional -- what's the word I want?

K. DOLAN: Supplements.

NGUYEN: Supplements, yes.

D. DOLAN: Supplements. There was a piece of legislation, that he had to come to some decision on, regarding trying to put more disclaimers on nutritional supplements not too terribly long ago. That, to me, when he said, no, we don't need to put additional warnings on these labels, becomes a conflict of interest.

K. DOLAN: Yes. Some of that -- in fact, some of those facts were in the "L.A. Times" article also.

D. DOLAN: Yes.

K. DOLAN: Betty, I think it may be more in bad taste than anything else. I don't think anybody -- certainly, I don't think that there's any skullduggery here. It looks like from the facts I've seen in the "L.A. Times" article and other research that we've done before we talked with you today, I think it was just a bad choice.

NGUYEN: Well, like you said, I mean, he doesn't need the money. It's $8 million. That's chump change. Why would you do this? Why would you put your political future possibly at risk?

K. DOLAN: Great point, Betty. That's exactly my point. Why risk Betty and Ken and Daria talking about it to 85 million homes and the "L.A. Times" and everybody else? Why not wait until you're out? He signed that just two or three days before his inauguration, I believe. So I just think the timing is all wrong, I think.

D. DOLAN: Well, and the fact of the matter is we're not talking a state in which there is a very friendly to Republicans state legislation either. So I mean, it's just like throwing gasoline on a fire. And if he's surprised that this is coming out of the media and out of the state house, I think he's very naive.

K. DOLAN: I think it was a bad, bad choice.

NGUYEN: Bad impersonation there, Ken, I have to tell you.

K. DOLAN: Thank you, Betty. Thank you.

NGUYEN: OK. Let's talk about what's coming up on the show this weekend. Homeland security, you're going to be talking a lot about that.

K. DOLAN: Are we ever? Are we ever?

D. DOLAN: We are indeed, yes. We're going to take a look at can we truly protect ourselves on mass transit in this country? And we're also going to take a look at the possibility of should we profile? Is there a profile of terrorism or isn't there?

K. DOLAN: And we had an interesting profile story. We just took a little trip last week, Betty, where there was a very, very interesting profile story next to us. When I say story, as we were flying -- and we're going to pass it along. It's a little bit alarming. And my final point on this Betty, was we'll talk more tomorrow morning. Is why does it take such a horrible tragedy in a big city like London for us to say, you know, we better do something about the rails, Spain, and the subways and buses, London. I don't know.

D. DOLAN: And the last thing -- point I want to make, Betty, is that our guest will be joining us. Ralphie Ran (ph) used to be the head of all Israeli security, raises the point that we, in this country, are far too dependent upon the benefits of technology. So we'll have an interesting discussion with him tomorrow.

K. DOLAN: We'll have a busy Saturday, Betty.

NGUYEN: Yes. And I'll be looking forward to the show.

K. DOLAN: Thanks, Betty.

D. DOLAN: Thanks.

NGUYEN: Thanks, Ken and Daria.

K. DOLAN: Best to everybody.

NGUYEN: You can catch the Dolans this Saturday at 10 a.m. Eastern. "DOLANS UNSCRIPTED," be sure to watch.

A baby survives a scary building collapse. Ahead on LIVE FROM, find out what may have helped save her life.

Also ahead, as London authorities try to solve the case of the bomb attacks, what lessons have they already learned from their long history confronting Irish terrorists?

And later on LIVE FROM, the latest on NASA's efforts to get the Shuttle Discovery back on track for launch.

ANNOUNCER: You're watching LIVE FROM on CNN, the most trusted name in news.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

NGUYEN: New York authorities are trying to figure out what triggered a building collapse that trapped five people on an upper Manhattan street.

A 7-month-old baby in a stroller was among those buried in the rubble yesterday. A paramedic tells "The New York Times" the little girl was probably trapped for five to six minutes and that she may have been saved by her baby stroller, which enclosed her like a cocoon. She and two women, who were also trapped, are hospitalized in stable condition today.

In January of 1982, a horrifying plane crash gripped the headlines, and no one who saw footage of the rescue attempts will ever forget those images. As part of our 25th anniversary, CNN's Aaron Brown revisits that fateful day and how it forever changed the life of one young woman, who lived to tell the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AARON BROWN, HOST, "NEWSNIGHT" (voice-over): Air Florida Flight 90 took off from Washington's National Airport on the 13th of January, 1982, bound for Tampa, Florida, but it only made it as far as the 14th Street Bridge.

Kelly Duncan Moore was a 22-year-old flight attendant plucked from the frigid waters of the Potomac, one of just five survivors of the crash. She doesn't remember much, only coming to the surface and clinging to the wreckage of the plane.

KELLY DUNCAN MOORE, CRASH SURVIVOR: The most significant memories I have from the crash are the moments before the crash. I remember looking and seeing a man turn around and look at me. And he looked afraid.

BROWN: Moore is now in her 40s and says the experiences, as you can imagine, changed her life and her priorities.

MOORE: I started praying. I never prayed before. And I started asking God, why am I here? And what am I supposed to do now?

Jesus answers...

BROWN: She has since devoted her life to God and to children, working as a teacher and a youth minister in a Baptist church in Miami. She's married with three teenage children.

MOORE: I feel like every day has been a blessing. I have a wonderful life. It sounds crazy to say it, but that accident changed my life for good. God used a bad thing to turn my life around.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

NGUYEN: Chief Justice William Rehnquist says he is not ready to step down. What fallout will Rehnquist's announcement have on President Bush's choice to replace Justice Sandra Day O'Connor?

And later on LIVE FROM, the latest chapter in the Harry Potter craze.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com