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British Police Continue Investigation; Famine in Niger; Lance Armstrong's Streak; Security and Intelligence

Aired July 25, 2005 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Sunni delegation has ended its boycott and rejoined the process along onside Shiites and Kurds. The Sunni contingent walked out last week, demanding better protection after two of its members were assassinated.
Let's return quickly to the challenges facing Britain in wake of the terrorist operations in London. After the deadly attacks July 7th the British sought advice with a government all too familiar with the fight against terrorism, that would be Israel. Joining us now with a view on how Israelis combat terror, Rafi Ron, CEO of the New Age Security Solutions and a former chief of security for the Israeli Airport Authority. Rafi, thanks for being with us.

RAFI RON, NEW AGE SECURITY SOLUTIONS: Thank you for having me.

PHILLIPS: You were in the Israeli army. You actually had to go through training to deal with suicide bombers. Can you tell me about that training and what's involved?

RON: Well, I think it started back at the time when the Israeli military was in Lebanon and suicide attacks were used against Israeli soldiers there. The whole tactics of moving from one place to another, and the whole tactics of security checkpoints, road checkpoints, have changed in a way to protect our soldiers, and to mitigate the risk to a minimal level.

PHILLIPS: Well, let's talk about, we obviously cover all of the suicide bombings that take place. We try to keep tabs on everything that takes place in your country, but there are even instances, one recently, just a couple days ago, where Israeli police, the IDF, they were able to talk the suicide bomber out of doing what he was going to do, they were able to disrobe him, and get him not to act out what he was planning to do.

That just seems unbelievable. How does that happen? How are you trained to do that and how are you able to do that, because it's suicide bombings that are rocking Iraq, and now we're seeing it in London.

RON: Yes, I think it all starts with the level and the quality of the intelligence that is available to the security forces. Israel has been investing in intelligence focused on suicidal terrorism very, very substantially during the years since the phenomena started to be part of our life in Israel, and I think that if I said that 90 percent of the planned suicidal attacks in Israel are being prevented by quality intelligence, I think this would give a good idea as to what is available to the security forces.

So when a terrorist has been launched, there is a fair chance that at least some information about it will become available, and that the ability of the security forces to mitigate, to stop him, and to at some point even convince him to abort his attack, it becomes possible. This is not the first case, by the way.

PHILLIPS: No, I know. I've been tracking - obviously, there are a number of suicide bombers that succeed in what they want to do. But the ones you're able to convince not to do it, is it the art of negotiation, is it containing him in an area where there's nobody else around so you just - I mean, tell me what it is. How do you actually get through to somebody? As we read about suicide bombers and why they do what they do, they don't care about dying. There is no negotiation involved.

RON: Yeah, this is true, but at the same time, each person is an individual, and the circumstances that allow this kind of dialogue with an intended suicide terrorist are usually unique, in each case and case. I think that the common denominator is simply the fact that we've been living with the phenomena long enough to understand it much better than it is understood in other parts of the world, and I think that the fact that our security forces and the people in the field that at the end of the day have to face these terrorists, have been receiving more trading. This is certainly the some of the factors that lead to this kind of positive result, which certainly enough is not always the case.

PHILLIPS: What would be your advice to London right now? If you had a chance to sit down with their counterterrorism unit what would you say to them?

RON: I think that the main thing is to try and focus on the individuals, identifying people by their behavior would be critical, because the whole idea of suicidal terrorism in the case of lack of early intelligence warning, is how to detect them out in the field, and how to make sure that the people that will have to address them, they will know what they're doing. So a lot of it has to do with the skills and the training that they were providing through our law enforcement, as well as the non-law enforcement people out there that may be facing this kind of risk.

PHILLIPS: So with this early intelligence warning, could what we see, what we saw happen to the young Brazilian man that was shot eight times and killed and turned out he wasn't linked at all, at this point, to the bombings, could that have been avoided with proper early warnings systems and tactics?

RON: I think in this case, a lot has to do probably with the level of stress that the British police is under, and at this point in time, I'm sure that this tragedy was a result of the fact that the officers, they were very quick to act under the circumstances, but this is obviously a tragedy that should not have occurred.

If you look at Israel during the last 15 years, I don't think that you can se even a single case where somebody was shot in an urban neighborhood, under such a tragic circumstances. There might have been cases, say out in roadblocks, in the West Bank and the Gaza Strip, where these incidents occur but these are obviously so-called front line areas. But in the cities such events do not occur and this is the result of the training and restraint that security forces are going under.

PHILLIPS: Rafi Ron, thank you for your time today. Appreciate it.

RON: Thank you.

PHILLIPS: Back to bargaining in Beijing. U.S. envoy Christopher Hill holding a rare informal meeting with his North Korean counter point. Hours from now the more serious business begins. Six nation talked aimed at convincing Pyongyang to dismantle its nuclear weapons program. Some see today's one on one meeting as a concession. For a long time North Koreans have wanted to direct talks with Washington.

Charges of corruption fill the air again in the Philippines. Congressional members in Manila today filed an impeachment complaint charging that President Gloria Arroyo with rigging last year's election, something she has denied. That complaint was filed hours before President Arroyo delivered her state of the union address. In it she called to a shift to the parliamentary form of government in the Philippines. Filipinos have twice ousted their leaders, Dictator Ferdinand Marcos in 1986 and President Joseph Estrada in 2001.

The words Africa and famine are finding themselves uttered together again. This time about the West African nation of Niger, where hundreds of children have died from malnutrition and millions of people are in jeopardy. What's worse is that it's a condition that relief experts say could easily have been prevented. CNN's Jeff Koinange has the story. We have got to warn you, too, you may find some of these images a bit disturbing.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEFF KOINANGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): No, this is not a refugee camp if Darfur. Instead, it's yet another looming crisis in yet another African country. The West African nation of Niger. Here in the tiny village of Maradi in the country's southeast, hungry mothers bring their equally hungry and malnourished children to refugee camps, hoping to get some relief. Relief that's clearly not coming fast enough.

DR. MEGO TERZIAN, DOCTORS WITHOUT BORDERS (through translator): Most of the children arrive at our center in terrible shape, very late and often our doctors cannot do anything.

KOINANGE: Hundreds of children have already died according to the aid agency, Doctors Without Borders, and tens of thousands more face eminent death. Another three and a half million people face starvation if help doesn't arrive on time. But what's most disturbing, according to the UN special envoy Jan Egeland, this is a crisis that could have easily been avoided.

JAN EGELAND, UN SPECIAL ENVOY: We have a full blown emergency in Niger. Children are dying from hunger. It was all predictable.

KOINANGE: Predictable because most aid agencies had seen it coming. A recurring drought followed by a massive locust infestation across the nation led many here to forecast the worst. And with the rainy season about to kick off, diseases are about to make things even worse.

JOHANNE DUHESNNES, DOCTORS WITHOUT BORDERS (through translator): It brings diarrhea and malaria and small children, especially malnourished ones cannot stand it. They are weak because of malnutrition. Now they are weak because of disease. It will increase the mortality rate in the next three months.

KOINANGE: Those strong enough to flee the countryside are making their way to the capital Niamey and resorting to begging for food on street corners. "We need food for the children," this woman says. "This year the drought and the locusts have devastated everything. We have no food."

No food and no relief in sight, because the $50 million the UN keeps as an emergency fund is only available in the form of loans, which Niger cannot afford to repay. Instead, according to the UN, $500 million will be required just to jumpstart an emergency relief operation. Aid agencies warn that as many as 150,000 people may die in the coming weeks, if aid doesn't get to Maradi in time. An indication things here are about to get even worse. Jeff Koinange, CNN, Lagos, Nigeria.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Time may be running out for many of the children of Niger. We're giving you numbers to call if you'd like to help. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well on the outside chance that you haven't yet heard, Lance Armstrong did do it again, his career ending triumph at the Tour de France helped cement his place as one of the greatest athletes ever and a slightly lesser scale, a guaranteed mention for years and years to come in arguments over the sporting world's all-time streaks. So here to talk about that is Steve Overmyer of CNN Sports.

STEVE OVERMYER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Let's get the argument started now.

PHILLIPS: Yeah, let's go ahead and think of streaks.

OVERMYER: On the best streaks. First off, we're eliminating all of the team sports because even though cycling is a bit of a team sport it's not like winning the Super Bowl or the NBA championship. It's more individualistic. When you start thinking of some of the most incredible streaks in the history of sports, you have to start off with really Byron Nelson back in 1945, Byron Nelson, won 11 straight PGA tour victories. Remember, he's not just beating one guy. He's beating the field and he did it 11 straight weeks in a row. As for boxing, Bernard Hopkins, as a matter of fact his streak just ended 20 straight title defenses. His streak just ended about a couple of weeks ago as well, but Hopkins, this guy was fighting basically twice a year or ten years and won every fight in the middleweight division.

Bjorn Borg, another perfect example, here he is winning Wimbledon five straight years and women's side, even more impressively, Martina Navratilova won it six straight times in Wimbledon. You start looking at some of these, Kyra and you start wondering how do these measure up year after year being able to stand in there.

And you almost have to put Lance Armstrong at the top. Because, again, it's such a grueling event. It's not on the same surface every year. The Tour changes its track every single season. Every year he's got to come up with a new way to learn the tour, to ride and beat these guys and really avert all challenges year after year.

PHILLIPS: Right, let's talk about that for a minute because I've been reading the articles, he's superhuman, he was born with some physical gift. Dr. Sanjay Gupta even did a piece how his lungs and the oxygen and all of this. So is it the training or does he have some sort of physical gift that not many people have? Was he born with something where he's able to just endure like nobody else?

OVERMYER: Well, they're saying that's exactly what that is. You wouldn't have imagined it back in 1993 and '94, when he actually quit after the first mountain stages of the Tour de France. He couldn't handle it. So something changed in this man.

PHILLIPS: And it was after cancer.

OVERMYER: It was after cancer. The average vO2 max, which is the way to measure lung capacity you and I, we have 45 as a number. If we're pro-athletes, you get 60. Lance Armstrong is 85, he is about double what the normal human being has from a v02 max, so his lung capacity really is a little bit greater, only about 20 men in the world have lung capacity at what Lance Armstrong is.

PHILLIPS: I take it those other 19 men, they're not cycling?

OVERMYER: No, actually, there are about ten of those guys. One of the reports say ten of those guys are actually cyclists.

PHILLIPS: Really?

OVERMYER: It's a very grueling event. It's even more grueling I think than the triathlon.

PHILLIPS: Yeah, it's a nightmare. I've tried to bike. I can't handle it. I can do anything else. I'd like to just put Byron Nelson out on the golf course but when we talk about who could be the next amazing cyclist if indeed, Lance does retire, is there anybody out there that can come close to what he's done?

OVERMYER: You know what? I don't think in our lifetime we'll see another rider, American or anyone, that will be able to compete with what Lance has done, seven in a row. Here's a couple of guys who finished in the top ten, Levi Leipheimer and Floyd Landis, there in the green there, actually finished in the top ten. Three American id riders finishing in the top ten Tour de France. No other country had more than one rider in the top ten so American cycling has started to take off really because of Lance.

As a matter of fact, a report that I just recently saw, U.S. Cycling's membership is up 30 percent since Lance Armstrong first won the first Tour de France. And again, you credit that to Lance. As for Leipheimer and Landis, those guys are also somewhere in their early thirties so they might not be the next coming of Armstrong but there is a great white hope more or less, the next great thing and his name is Tyler Ferrer, he's a 21-year-old kid and he's a junior cyclist right now, and they're saying he could be the next ...

PHILLIPS: So we're watching him.

OVERMYER: ... American hope there.

PHILLIPS: Thanks, Steve, appreciate it.

While we may see a movie one day about Lance Armstrong. That wouldn't surprise any of us, right? But in the meantime, theatergoers have to settle for chocolate and lots of chocolate. That and a scene in the movie "Wedding Crashers" that has some military veterans a little fired up All that ahead on entertainment news. Hey, Sibila.

SIBILA VARGAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Kyra. And the verdict just in in that court battle involving Cameron Diaz and the topless photos. The jury's decision when LIVE FROM returns.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, the use of stun guns by police has created a lot of controversy. Now the company that makes them wants to put more of them on the street. Susan Lisovicz has more on that story live from the New York Stock Exchange. Susan, I wonder if you would buy a stun gun.

SUSAN LISOVICZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm not sure. I am not sure about that. I think I could just use my karate kicks, I think.

PHILLIPS: Oh, that's impressive! You'll have to tell me about that training.

LISOVICZ: When you're at the New York Stock Exchange you learn a lot of abilities, let me put it that way, keep your own space, but stun gun maker Taser International is launching an aggressive marketing campaign to boost sales of the weapon to the general public. It's kicking off the campaign tomorrow in Miami, Florida, which is a state that does not require background checks on buyers. Critics say the marketing push will put a dangerous and largely unregulated weapon on the streets. The models which range in price from $400 to $1000 are as powerful as the Tasers many police officers carry. They weapons release a 50,000 volt charge and that is enough to mark a person off their feet. Taser guns are legal in 43 states, including Florida. Not sure if it is legal in Georgia, which means that I could put the question right back to you, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Hmmm, I'll have to check on that. Drug maker Johnson & Johnson facing some tough charges, too. What's going on there?

LISOVICZ: Exactly, Kyra. Ten women reportedly suing J&J because of health risks from a popular birth control patch. They say the Ortho-Evra patch caused them to suffer blood clots and strokes. The "New York Post" reports the suit is expected to be filed this week and according to the Associated Press about a dozen women died last year from blood clots believed to be related to the Ortho Evra patch.

Johnson & Johnson is a member of the Dow 30. It's stock is down about 1.5 percent now and that pretty much describes things for the overall trend, Dow Industrials off 35 points, the NASDAQ losing half a percent. And that's the latest from Wall Street. Kyra, back to you.

PHILLIPS: All right. Susan, thanks so much.

Well, it was sugar and spice and everything nice at movie theaters over the weekend. Entertainment correspondent Sibila Vargas joins us now though to tell us about a box office that was well, in a word, sa-weet. Is that right?

VARGAS: Very, very sweet weekend at the box office, Kyra, as moviegoers continued on their oh so fabulous candy binge. "Charlie and the Chocolate Factory" made a little over $28 million bringing the ten-day total to $114 million. "Wedding Crasher" retained the number two spot with just over $26 million and not so good for "The Island" and "Bad News Bears." The two films had very weak debuts, opening in fourth and fifth place respectively.

Well, "Wedding Crashers" may have come in second at the box office but the film is making some veterans steaming mad.

Okay, in the scene Owen Wilson and Vince Vaughn go on to pretend to play Purple Heart recipients to win the affections of attractive bridesmaids. Well apparently, some groups aren't taking it too lightly, saying imposters of a widespread problem and nothing to joke about. Under a bill introduced in the U.S. House of Representatives on Friday the characters in the movie would be charged with a crime for falsely claiming to be decorated veterans.

Right now, only wearing, manufacturing, buying, or selling trading a medal of honor say crime. And good news for Cameron Diaz. She wins in court today. The photographer who took topless pictures of the actress 11 years ago and tried to sell them back to her for millions of dollars has been convicted of forgery, attempted grand theft and perjury. The 32 year old John Rutter could also face up to six years in prison.

And finally, rockers Green Day are strolling to the top with the most nominations for the 2005 MTV Video Music Awards. The trio received six nods for their single "Boulevard of Broken Dreams" and another two for "American Idiot." Pop singer Gwen Stefani and rapper Missy Elliott tied for second place with six nominations each. Diddy, formerly known as P. Diddy, will host the show on Sunday, August 28th on MTV. The 22nd annual will broadcast live from Miami and did you get it, it's Diddy, now. Not Puffy. Not Puff Duff daddy, just Diddy.

KYRA: I'm just going to call him Sean. That's the name his mama gave him.

VARGAS: That's the name his mama gave him. Just keep it. What's this change? Identity crisis, I don't know.

PHILLIPS: He's just trying to reinvent himself, he and Madonna, more names than i don't know. Thanks, Sibila.

Straight head, Supreme Court nominee John Roberts spotted again today, shaking hands around the Hill. Ed Henry calls it a charm offensive. We're going to talk with him about that. Also in our next half hour, a behind the scenes look at the effort to gain support for court contenders.

That's right, CNN congressional correspondent Ed Henry live coming up in the next hour. You don't want to miss him.

And lost and found and perhaps a sign of eternal love, is there such a thing? A man finds the wedding ring he thought was gone forever. Wait until you hear where it turned up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

END

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