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GOP Leaders Call for Investigation into 'Washington Post' Leak; French Unrest Fueled by Lack of Jobs; Lawyer Killed for Hussein Co- Defendant; Australian Arrests Foil Massive Attack

Aired November 08, 2005 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BETTY NGUYEN, HOST: Gay marriage, governors and abortion. American voters deciding tricky issues today. We will break down what they mean to you.
Strong emotions after big terror arrests. Australian authorities say they stopped a major bomb attack.

And parents versus an HMO. Who should decide how this 4-year-old gets medical treatment?

From the CNN Center in Atlanta, I'm Betty Nguyen, in for Kyra Phillips today. CNN's LIVE FROM starts right now.

Who told what to whom and how could the information endanger national security? Senate Majority Leader Frist and House Speaker Dennis Hastert call for a probe to find out who told "The Washington Post" about alleged secret CIA prisons in Eastern Europe, where terrorism suspects are reportedly being held and interrogated.

CNN's Ed Henry joins us now from Capitol Hill with the latest on this -- Ed.

ED HENRY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Betty, that's right, CNN has confirmed that House Speaker Hastert and Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist are launching this joint investigation by the House and Senate intelligence committees to get to the bottom of who leaked information to "The Washington Post" in this story last week, dealing with so- called black sites, the secret prisons where terror suspects are held.

We're being told -- we've got a copy of the letter right here, basically. And we're being told this is being sent out now to the House and Senate intelligence committee chairmen. They will be leading this investigation, Senator Pat Roberts and Congressman Pete Hoekstra of Michigan.

A spokesman for Speaker Hastert, Ron Bonjean, telling CNN, "The Republican leaders are term determined to get to the bottom of who leaked this classified information." They're very concerned about, quote, "serious and potential damage to hurt national security."

I can tell you, though, there's a lot of skepticism on the Democratic side. I just spoke a few moments ago off camera with Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid. He knew nothing about this, had not gotten any official word from his Republican counterparts. He told me he believes this is, quote, "just a show." And that basically the House and Senate committees are already there to investigate such a report. There's no need to have a big song and dance about this.

And a senior Democratic aide elaborated to me that what Senator Reid was referring to is the Democrats basically think this is a destruction from the fact that Republicans up here on the Hill have not investigated the leak of Valerie Plame's identity, and that they're looking at the polls, they're look at all these Democratic attacks about the leak investigation, about "Scooter" Libby's indictment. And Republicans now want to get ahead of this leak investigation, to try to get to the bottom of who leaked it, because they're having so many political problems over the other CIA leak case.

Republicans up here insisting, though, that there was already a special counsel who is still investigating this, of course, Patrick Fitzgerald. He's already yielded one indictment of the vice president's former chief of staff. And in their eyes, there's been no need for the Republican Congress to investigate the Valerie Plame matter. They say the special counsel has been doing it. But Democrats obviously insist that more should be done, Betty.

NGUYEN: Ed Henry, staying on top of it for us. Thank you, Ed.

Well, from Maine to Mississippi, East Coast to West, Americans are heading to the polls, though not in particularly large numbers. This is, after all, an off-year election. Still, though, all eyes are on Republican candidates to see how the president's recent setbacks might affect the outcome.

Two of the biggest contents are those for governor of Virginia and New Jersey. The mayor's office is also up for grabs in New York City; Detroit, Michigan; Atlanta, Georgia; Houston, Texas; and Boston, Massachusetts.

Well, one of the tightest races, though, is for governor of Virginia. The main party candidates have been running neck and neck for days now. And their campaigns have turned increasingly negative, with one voter calling them both, quote, "stinky."

Democrat Tim Kaine is currently the lieutenant governor. He's received the support of teachers and environmentalists, among others. While Jerry Kilgore has been endorsed by the NRA and business groups.

Now, last night, the state's former attorney general also received a high-powered high-five from President Bush. And Bush joined Kilgore last night.

Now, perhaps the most contentious and expensive race has been that of New Jersey governor. After voting early, Senator Jon Corzine said he was, quote, "A little nervous, a little worried, but confident." The Democrat is counting on big majorities in the cities.

Now, his Republican opponent is Doug Forrester, a former mayor of West Windsor. He is looking for strong support from suburbia.

Then, of course, there's the race for New York City mayor, not considered much of a contest this time around. Polls show Mayor Michael Bloomberg with a wide lead over Democrat Fernando Ferrer. In fact, Governor George Pataki plans to be in the city tonight helping Bloomberg celebrate.

Over to West Coast now. Arnold Schwarzenegger's name isn't on the ballot today, but four of the California governor's reform proposals are. They would make it easier to fire veteran teachers, control public employee unions, set a state spending limit and give some retired judges the power to redraw legislative districts instead of lawmakers. He warns, though, that taxes will rise if his plan fails.

Well, are you going to vote today? Most Americans will not. Election turnout in odd years is historically much lower than in federal elections. And compared to other democratic nations, U.S. voter turnout is low, even for presidential elections.

One group, appropriately named Why Tuesday? says part of the problem is the very day when elections are held. Here are the facts.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NGUYEN (voice-over): Federal law designated Tuesday as election day in 1845. There were a number of reasons. Among them, it was a convenient day for farmers.

Modern turnout in the United States is far less than many other democratic nations. Since 1945, average turnout in American elections is about 48 percent of the voting age population. That puts the U.S. behind 138 other democratic nations, according to the International Institute for Democracy. Italy tops the list with average of 92 percent turnout.

To be fair, some of the nations have only held one election in that time period, and others have penalties against citizens who don't vote. To make it more convenient, several of those nations hold elections on weekends, including Germany, Switzerland and France. And two more recent additions, Afghanistan and Iraq.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

NGUYEN: And that is your fact check.

From the north to the south, it's been another rough night in France. More torched cars, more violence and more anger from rioters, many of them French-born children of immigrants. So what is behind all this rage?

Well, CNN chief international correspondent Christiane Amanpour went inside the housing projects a lot of them call home to find out the answer.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's the worst social unrest in France since the 1968 student uprising. The mayhem started in the bleak and neglected housing projects just beyond the Paris city lights, an explosion of anger by the disaffected youths who live here after two of their own were electrocuted while hiding from what they believed was a police chase.

(on camera) The government built these apartment blocks after World War II when they invited in tens of thousands of immigrants from Africa and Arab countries to fill low-skilled jobs. At the time this was a step up from where they had come from.

But now the jobs have gone, and people are left here without basic services, with second rate education, and worse, with no employment. Indeed, the unemployment rate in these outer city ghettos is four times the national average.

(voice-over) As another nervous night falls on these graffiti-, garbage-strewn blocks, we tried to get some answers. These young people tell us they do not support the violence.

But Kareem (ph) says it's the only way they can express themselves. They are anger and upset. They're saying they're fed up.

Fed up with a life, says Abdul Aziz, that is just dreary survival. "There's nothing for us, no jobs," he says. "When we look for job, employers look at us. They want to know our origin, our address, and that's the end of that."

The French Revolution's famous promise of liberty, equality and fraternity has failed these young people, who were born in France and have nowhere else to call home. Instead of integrating, they are now increasingly turning towards their own.

Back at the housing project, 54-year-old Musara (ph) tell us the authorities alienate these young people. "As soon as the cops see a group of youngsters," she says, "they start chasing them. They ask for their papers. When the kids shout that they're French, the cops insult them and throw their papers on the ground."

"We hope it will improve," says Kareem, "but the authorities have to do their part. They have to do something for the young, to help them, instead of leaving them to rot in these ghettos. They need to help us get jobs and improve our lives. Then things will calm down."

Christiane Amanpour, CNN, Vichy-Dubois, France.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

NGUYEN: And the French government is hoping new measures will prevent a 13th night of violence. It is giving regional officials the power to impose curfews and declare states of emergencies. And courts and jails, well, they are filling up.

CNN's Jim Bittermann joins us now live from Paris. The first question to you, are these curfews working? Are you seeing the violence stop?

JIM BITTERMANN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, not yet, Betty. In fact, it's a little bit early to tell whether it's going to be a 13th night of violence here. In fact, usually these things break out about 10 or 11 p.m. at night. It's only 7 here. So, in fact, it will be awhile before we can tell whether or not the curfews being -- that are being imposed have any effect.

We only know of one town so far that has decided to impose a curfew. There may be others that we just haven't heard about. But it will be something to see, whether or not these have any effect at all.

Overnight last night, there was a slight decline in the amount of violence: between 15 percent and 20 percent fewer arrests and fewer attacks during the night last night. Kind of a positive sign for the government.

But they still wanted to impose this curfew law, which is 50 years old. It basically was re-enacted because it's been on the books since 1955, when it was used in Algeria during the war of independence in Algeria.

Now that has already drawn fire from the North African community here, particularly Algerians. Said one man tonight, "I never thought that they would dare do this. It's really a provocation for those of us who remember very well the humiliations, the torture and the roundups during the French colonization of Algeria."

So something that sticks out in memories here. And people may feel that the use of this law is really just some kind of provocation, some kind of an oppressive measure, aimed basically at North Africans. And it could lead to further trouble. But at the moment, it's just too early to tell.

NGUYEN: Well, Jim, besides the curfews, is the government, along with community leaders, are they working to find a solution? I mean, how close are they to getting a solution out there to stop the violence?

BITTERMANN: Well, one of the problems is that the usual sort of solutions, the kinds that have been used in the past -- and by the way this rioting in the suburbs goes back -- has roots back to 25 years at least; there have been problems in the suburbs over the years. Usually, the problems are over in two or three days. This time, however, nobody has anticipated the kind of reaction there's been that's gone on and on.

The usual kind of response is to talk to the community leaders, talk to the community associations. There's a lot of associations, sporting associations, the kind of associations in France that can be drawn in to help sort of moderate things. Also, through the school, as educational -- educators who can be drawn into this and can help out.

And basically, though -- and religious figures, as well, they've been asked to help out. In fact, one of the top Islamic organizations here passed a fatwah, a religious decree, against the violence.

None of it has worked this time around. And I think one of the reasons -- and I think the authorities think one of the reasons is that these groups basically are not the kind of groups that one would think of, the kind of groups that are causing problems. One would think of as organized groups.

They're basically bands of young teenagers. Fifty percent of those people who have been arrested have had prior police arrests. They're basically young toughs in these projects, and they're just not responding to any kind of calls for moderation to the violence, not even from their parents, by the way. Some of them are just out on the streets and decide they want to cause trouble, and that's the kind of thing that we've seen over the last 12 nights here.

NGUYEN: Difficult to combat. CNN's Jim Bittermann, live in Paris for us. Thank you, Jim.

Well, if you are planning a trip to France, the State Department isn't advising against it, but it does want you to be on alert. The agency has issued a public announcement urging Americans to avoid areas where riots have taken place. It also says U.S. travelers should leave quickly if they encounter any demonstrations and be particularly careful at night.

Plans for a major terror attack foiled in Australia. Police round up more than a dozen suspects they say had big plans. We have those details ahead on LIVE FROM.

And will an assassination thwart the trial of Saddam Hussein? The latest from Baghdad, after a break.

ANNOUNCER: You're watching LIVE FROM on CNN, the most trusted name in news.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

NGUYEN: Want you to listen to a little bit of the White House briefing that's taking place right now. Spokesperson Scott McClellan talking about the U.S. policy on torture. Take a listen.

HELEN THOMAS, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: ... the ambiguity about torture. Can we get a straight answer? The president says we don't do torture. But Cheney...

SCOTT MCCLELLAN, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: It's about as straight as it can be.

THOMAS: Yes, but Cheney...

MCCLELLAN: Yes, thank you.

THOMAS: ... has gone to the Senate and asked for an exemption on...

MCCLELLAN: No, he's not. Are you claiming he's asked for an exemption on torture? No. That's...

THOMAS: He did not ask...

MCCLELLAN: That is inaccurate.

THOMAS: Are you denying everything that came from the Hill in terms of torture?

MCCLELLAN: No, you're mischaracterizing things, and I'm not going to get into discussions. We have...

THOMAS: ... straight answer for once...

MCCLELLAN: Let me give it to you, just like the president has. We do not torture. He does not condone torture, and he would never...

THOMAS: ... asking for redemption?

MCCLELLAN: Let me respond. And he would never authorize the use of torture. We have an obligation to do all that we can to protect the American people...

THOMAS: The answer...

MCCLELLAN: It is an answer...

THOMAS: We do...

MCCLELLAN: It is an answer. Because the American people want to know that we are doing all in our power to prevent terrorist acts from happening...

THOMAS: But you don't give...

THOMAS: ... there are people in this world who want to spread a hateful ideology based on killing innocent men, women and children. We saw what they can do on September 11...

THOMAS: ... exemption. Let me just ask one question -- is the administration asking for an exemption?

MCCLELLAN: I am answering your question. The president has made it very clear that we are going to do...

THOMAS: You're not. Yes or no...

MCCLELLAN: ... no, you don't want the American people to hear what the facts are, Helen, and I'm going to tell them the facts.

NGUYEN: Now to the fight for Iraq. Operation Steel Curtain" hits day four as U.S. and Iraqi military forces keep up a serious effort along the Syrian border.

Now the action is centered in Husayba. You see it right there. U.S. commanders say the town has been used as a command center for smuggling weapons and fighters into Iraq.

And today, house to house searches continue. Forces uncovered a weapons cache, a bomb making factory and a sniper position. So far, one Marine and 36 insurgents have been reported killed since Operation Steel Curtain began.

A garrison of Iraqi troops is expected to remain behind in Husayba to maintain control once this mission ends.

Now to Baghdad, where a lawyer representing one of Saddam Hussein's co-defendants is shot dead. Yes, it is the second such killing in less than a month.

CNN's Aneesh Raman with more on how these assassinations may put the entire trial at risk.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANEESH RAMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: With just under three weeks to go until the trial of Saddam Hussein and seven other co-defendants is set to resume, a second attack on lawyers involved in the defense of this case.

Two lawyers coming under attack by three gunmen early this afternoon in Baghdad. Adel Muhammed Zubeidi was killed in the incident after three gunmen opened fire on his vehicle.

Mr. Zubeidi was a lawyer for Taha Yassin Ramadan, perhaps the second most recognizable defendant in this trial, aside from Saddam Hussein himself. Ramadan was, of course, Iraq's former vice president.

The other person in the vehicle, Tamir Humud Qusai (ph), was a lawyer. It's unclear for whom he represented, whether it was Mr. Ramadan or Barzan al-Tikriti, Saddam Hussein's half brother.

Now, according to Iraqi police, both men had no security with them at the time. It is the second incident against defense lawyers. A day after the trial commenced on October 20, Sadoon Janabi, a lawyer for Award Bandar, the former chief judge of the revolutionary court, was abducted from his office in the capital and within hours was executed.

Now at that time, Iraq's government said that they do offer special protection for the lawyers involved, that Mr. Janabi had not requested it. It's unclear whether the two lawyers who came under attack today requested any such security.

But this incident does do, as the October 20 incident did, bring into question whether or not security is too big a concern for this trial to proceed. And as we wait for the trial to commence again on November 28, it is likely by all expectations that the defense may petition either for a delay, for change of venue, as has been suggested.

But nonetheless, huge logistical questions in terms of managing this incredibly sensitive trial in an incredible volatile country ahead for Iraq's special tribunal.

Aneesh Raman, CNN, Baghdad.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

NGUYEN: Want to get you now to the latest from Australia, where counterterrorism specialists say they have averted certain disaster after an 18-month investigation. Seventeen people have been arrested on terror charges in Melbourne and Sydney so far, and the investigation is not over yet.

I spoke just a few moments ago with CNN's Michael Holmes for more on the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NGUYEN: Michael, Australian authorities have made 17 arrests. How big of a deal is this, because it sounds like it's a pretty big one?

MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This for Australia is a massive, massive deal. It's the biggest anti-terror operation in the country's history. Hundreds of police officers involved. This -- they've been investigating this for 12 months.

And they only took the action yesterday because they found what they said was a huge increase in chatter. Mainly, that they thought that this thing they'd been following was about to happen. And -- and so they moved quickly and took 17 people into custody. There's more raids going on today, more people likely to be picked up.

NGUYEN: What do you know about those 17 people? Are they connected with a larger terror network? What do you know?

HOLMES: People are still just starting to learn about the makeup of this group. There's -- it's a mixture. Most of them are of Arab heritage.

What's interesting and also relates to the London terror bombings is that many if not most of them are Australian born. So they're not people who have come in from other nation, set up basically. They were born here, raised -- or born in Australia, raised in Australia, grew up in the Australian culture and way of life. And that, think, is very shocking for a lot of Australians.

One is a western Australian.

NGUYEN: Really?

HOLMES: He is a westerner; he's not of Arab descent at all. The rest are mainly of Arab descent. One, at least, is a Muslim cleric, as well.

NGUYEN: And you talk about the links to the London bombings. Are there more links that you think are going to be discovered through this?

HOLMES: There are already. In fact, some of the explosives or ingredients for explosives that were recovered from one of the houses that was raided, identical to the explosives that were used in the London bombing. And so it's a chemical bomb. It's one that explodes with great ferocity, with a very small package. And so that has been taken and is being examined now from one of those houses.

NGUYEN: Authorities did find those stockpiles. Did they also find any planned bombings?

HOLMES: No, what they have not, at least, told us yet is what the targets were, what the specific plans were. But reading between the lines, they know, the authorities know, what the targets were. The suspicion is that it was going to involve targets in both Sydney and Melbourne and was going to be a spectacular, as they call it, a massive attack of some sort. What it was specifically, we don't yet know.

NGUYEN: And this is just really the beginning. It's gone on for a little while. But there are more arrests to come, you believe?

HOLMES: Oh, yes. Yes, indeed, there are. The police really were forced to -- the police and, in fact, Australia's version of the CIA, were involved in this heavily. They were forced to act quickly because of this increase in chatter.

They thought they had a little bit more time. They then heard this chatter, including, from one person who was arrested who had volunteered to become a martyr, to be a suicide bomber.

NGUYEN: Yes.

HOLMES: And that would have been the first suicide bomber ever on Australian soil.

So once this chatter increased, they realized we have to move now.

NGUYEN: Have to move, yes.

HOLMES: Because they felt it was imminent. And in fact, the Australian parliament last week passed changes to the anti-terror laws specifically because of this threat. They made some subtle changes in the wording of the laws that allowed the police to carry out these raids easily, or more easily under law.

NGUYEN: Because of what they thought was imminent danger?

HOLMES: Yes. And what they knew about the people they were after.

NGUYEN: CNN International anchor, Michael Holmes, thank you for that insight.

HOLMES: You're welcome.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

NGUYEN: In other news, will a new trade deal mean a price increase for the clothes you buy? Well, that is ahead on LIVE FROM. And a sick 4-year-old boy. Well, his parents know which doctor they want, but their HMO wants a different one. So who should decide? That story coming up.

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