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Former Attorney General Joins Hussein's Defense Team; President to Address Immigration Issues in Speech; Chunk of Supreme Court Building Falls; Counterfeit Goods Hurt Economy

Aired November 28, 2005 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KYRA PHILLIPS, HOST: From CNN's headquarters in Atlanta, I'm Kyra Phillips. Here are some stories that we're working on for you right now.
Saddam Hussein on trial. One of his defenders, a former U.S. attorney general, and he says a trial, a fair trial is going to be difficult.

Supreme Court falling apart literally. A piece of the building takes a tumble.

And can you spot a fake? What you need to know before you shell out big bucks for designer gifts.

All that and more. CNN's LIVE FROM starts right now.

Astonishing scene in Baghdad today. Saddam Hussein back on trial. Listen to who one of his lawyers is: former attorney general of the United States Ramsey Clark. We'll talk about him in just a minute.

But first the man once deemed to be an imminent threat to America returned to a special Iraqi tribunal some 2 1/2 years after U.S. forces overthrew him and CNN's Aneesh Raman standing by in Baghdad where the trial has been suspended at the urging of his defense. We'll talk about that in a minute, too.

But let's just talk about his demeanor in court. Aneesh, I just remember seeing him writing on the palm of his hand.

ANEESH RAMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Uh-huh. Yes, Kyra, good afternoon. It was an incredibly engaged Saddam Hussein at this trial session, markedly different than what we saw last time, where he was resigned at the end of the trial gathering. Today he was aggressive. He was defiant. He was angry at times.

At the beginning of the trial session Saddam made it known that he was not able to take the elevator up in the courtroom. The elevator was broken. He was ushered up some flights of stairs and made a point to the judge about those who have him in custody. The U.S. military still has Saddam Hussein in custody, now at the behest of the Iraqi government, but a very frank exchange between Saddam and the judge today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) SADDAM HUSSEIN, FORMER PRESIDENT OF IRAQ (through translator): I was brought here to the door, and I wore the handcuffs. We don't accept that. And at the same time, the elevator was not working and the Quran in my hand and the handcuffs, I went in the elevator -- we will bring that to the attention of the police.

Mr. Judge, I don't want you to -- I want you to order -- I want to you order them. They are in our -- on our land. I will -- you have the servants. You are an Iraqi and there are foreigners and occupiers and invaders.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAMAN: Now, Kyra, as much as this is a legal process, it is very well also a symbolic one, all involving not just Iraqis, but the world is watching and the court, the judge is keen to make this court seem as legitimate as possible, but the defendants, not the least of which his Saddam, trying to show defiance at every turn -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Aneesh, talk to me about the security for a minute. Saddam Hussein actually had to get an iris scan and so did you?

RAMAN: Yes, I mean the incredibly tight security. At the last trial session one of the marshals, U.S. marshals coordinating security at the actual venue, said it would be easier to get into the White House on that day than it would be to get into this trial courtroom.

When you go in as journalists, you have to be prescreened. I went yesterday. You get an iris scan if you're a U.S. citizen. If you're not, there are a number of questions they ask you. There's a background check.

Once you go in as a member of the media you're still behind a bulletproof, soundproof glass wall, and below you is where the actual trial takes place. So incredibly high security here.

PHILLIPS: We mentioned former attorney general, Ramsey Clark, joining the defense team. Do we know what his role is going to be?

RAMAN: He signed on officially now as an adviser. He was sworn in at today's court session. He arrived in Baghdad yesterday. In comments that he made to CNN earlier he really stressed that he's here to try and fix the security situation as much as he can.

He will not stay during this week while the trial is adjourned in Baghdad. He plans to go back to the U.S. But he's keen to make sure that the lawyers who are involved feel safe, feel that they can represent their clients and stay in this trial process, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Will he actually sit down with Saddam Hussein and advise him?

RAMAN: It's unclear to what extent he will get involved in the specific legal parts of this case. It's unclear whether he'll sit down with Saddam Hussein. He's met him twice before, once in the build-up to the first Gulf War and once in early 2003. He was in the courtroom. He saw Saddam today. But the extent of his involvement is still yet to be worked out, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: I want to make sure I ask you this, Aneesh, before we let you go. You were embedded with U.S. troops. And something interesting that you said previously when spending time with troops. They had a clear mission about what they were doing with regard to fighting terrorism. You've seen that attitude change, though, haven't you?

RAMAN: Yes, well, you know, morale is an incredibly difficult thing to judge, and it's near impossible to gauge it nationwide. And the group that we were with, members of the 3rd I.D., embedded with last week, embedded with about a month ago, when you ask them what is this fight about, why are they going out there, before you used to hear more about the war on terror, about building a democracy in Iraq.

Now you hear much more the very simple fact that they want to return home and they want to keep their brothers and sisters in arms alive. They've had an incredibly difficult fight where I was, the northern part of Babel (ph) province, known as the Triangle of Death. Thanksgiving Day three U.S. soldiers were killed, four others wounded in and around that area.

So they go out with a clear mission of wanting to come back. They know the political debate is taking place back home. They cannot let that enter their mind because they face mortal danger on a daily basis, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Aneesh Raman, live from Baghdad. Thanks, Aneesh.

Well, now we told you about former attorney general Ramsey Clark joining Saddam Hussein's defense team. We thought you might want to know a little bit more about his background and history.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TONY PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Ramsey Clark served as attorney general under President Lyndon Johnson from 1967 to the end of Johnson's term in 1969.

During his time at the Justice Department, Clark oversaw several milestones in the civil rights movement and the prosecution of the so- called Boston five for helping young men dodge the draft. Ironically, after his tenure as attorney general, Clark became a key figure in the anti-Vietnam War movement, even going so far as to visit North Vietnam in 1972.

Ramsey Clark has remained a controversial attorney general and public figure since that time. He provided legal counsel to a pastor who was convicted of genocide is Rwanda.

During the conflict in Kosovo flew to Yugoslavia to express support for Slobodan Milosevic. He later provided legal counsel to the Milosevic defense team and called for an international tribunal to investigate alleged war crimes by NATO. Ramsey Clark is also a member of the group Vote to Impeach, an organization that is currently campaigning to impeach President Bush.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Now, it's an issue that predates America itself. Immigration, the daring, enduring often dangerous quest for what's still called the American dream.

Preserving that dream for migrants and citizens alike and preventing potential nightmares in the war against terror, it's one of President Bush's many legislative proposals that hasn't gone anywhere in more than a year. He hopes to give it a boost today, though, in a speech in Tucson.

We get a preview now from CNN's Bob Franken at the White House -- Bob.

BOB FRANKEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the plan is and try to win over those who have opposed this plan. Now, what's significant about this, is that the opposition comes mainly from the president's own party, from those who would describe themselves as hard-liners on immigration, those who want much tougher policies, much greater barriers between particularly Mexico and the United States.

The president is making his speech in Tucson, another one in El Paso tomorrow, where he's going to talk about his proposal, which is going to include plans for high-tech surveillance of the borders, also going to include return to the countries of those who come across, not just to the border areas, but to the interior of the country, obviously, making it more difficult for them to try again.

The one that causes all the problems is the president's proposal for guest workers. That would extend to three years a worker's visa, which could be renewed before the person had to return to his country, again, presumably Mexico, and stay there for a year before applying again.

That is the one that causes so many conservatives to be in an uproar. That is the one that the president says is very helpful to business so it has to be part of his plan. He always used to do this as compassionate conservatism, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Do you think this is going to make a difference in the polls, specifically with Latino voters?

FRANKEN: Well, there's always this fight for Latino voters, but of course, Latino involves Hispanic and involves quite a large array of different ethnic people from different countries who have different interests. The Republicans are a majority among the Cuban-Americans, for instance, but some of the others are not as pro-Republican.

But that is always an ethnic group that is up for grabs, and so certainly that's a factor in all of this.

PHILLIPS: Bob Franken, thanks so much. The president's speech is scheduled for 4:45 p.m. Eastern, 2:45 in Tucson. CNN will bring it to you live when it happens.

A lot of big stuff comes down at the Supreme Court of the United States, but not like today. If you've been watching CNN you know a pretty hefty chunk of marble fell off the court building's world famous facade just before the start of oral arguments. No one was hurt, but three dozen people were standing nearby.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHANNA SCHRAMM, SUPREME COURT VISITOR: There was like a big noise. We were standing right in front of the Supreme Court, and there was a big noise and the rock. And we looked around and there was a big chunk of the Supreme Court that had fallen. You could see it bouncing still, because it was coming down the steps and it was just like a big noise.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: CNN's Kimberly Osias is there. So Kimberly, you've been checking around and talking with people. Could it be construction work that actually caused the vibration to knock off a piece of that chunk?

KIMBERLY OSIAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kyra, they don't really know. I actually spoke to a construction worker that worked at the Capitol and also worked in this area, although not on this project. They're doing a huge overhaul. I mean, this building was built in the 1930s, so it is certainly due for it. It is the library, or it wouldn't affect that west pediment area where it happened.

If we can, let's show you where everything went down literally. It happened about 9:30 Eastern Time, about 30 minutes before oral arguments were set to begin. And you heard that one little girl that said, you know, she heard this crash. That's what they heard. They couldn't believe that it actually happened.

A lot of people actually were touching the smaller pieces. It was one part that came down -- if we can look at that central figure. There are three figures right in the center. There are nine on that western pediment area. From the left to the right, they're named Authority, Liberty and Order. And it happened, actually, above Order's head, if you will.

It is actually called dental molding. It is a square of marble that kind of -- part of it actually kind of came loose, and it came down about, I guess, 100 or so feet, passed in front of those columns, those Corinthian columns, very grand, and broke apart in sort of two huge basketball-sized pieces and other smaller pieces, as well, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Now just a little interesting twist. Let's talk about who that figurine is and then an interesting tie to Sandra Day O'Connor.

OSIAS: You have some inside knowledge there, Kyra. PHILLIPS: So do you.

OSIAS: You know, I'm connected here. So if you actually go inside and you look at where the justices sit, the chief actually, of course, sits obviously in the center, and to the right of the justice would be where O'Connor sits. That, and, of course, you know she's retiring this year.

And this is sort of interesting. On Halloween, there was another scare, if you will. A light bulb popped and it sort of jarred Justice Ginsburg who was actually querying one of the attorneys at the time. She was a bit shaken and then, of course, recovered.

But showing that he's, of course, very quick on his feet, the chief justice, new Justice Roberts said, "Oh, is this what you do to all the chiefs?"

Then I think it was Scalia that said, "No, remember, it's Halloween, everybody."

PHILLIPS: Yes, exactly, a little weird vibe going on. OK. And also Kimberly, in case our viewers don't know who all those individuals are up there, we're going to test them, coming up in our next hit with you. All right?

OSIAS: That's a big test. Yes.

PHILLIPS: There we go. Kimberly Osias, thanks.

Well, what is 18 1/2 feet tall actually, and towers over the president? No, it's no the Secret Service. We're talking about his Christmas tree, of course.

First lady Laura Bush took the delivery of the Fraser fir from North Carolina. And don't forget this, the Capitol Christmas tree. That also arrives today, from New Mexico. Not sure I saw that one. We'll work it for you.

Well, you've heard the warning. If it sounds too good to be true it probably is. And while you're doing your holiday shopping this year, a little friendly reminder to check the label on those designer clothes, purses and accessories. LIVE FROM has all the news you need coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: People in Alabama have been keeping an eye on the sky for severe thunderstorms or possible tornadoes. You're looking at live images right now from Montgomery, Alabama, from our affiliate WSFA. Forecasters say that there's a risk of severe weather across much of Alabama now and to the early evening hours, and parts of the Ohio Valley to the Gulf Coast are already bracing for more severe weather.

Let's get an update from CNN meteorologist Chad Myers. Hey, Chad. (WEATHER REPORT)

PHILLIPS: We'll keep checking in.

Retailers were hoping to begin the holiday shopping season with a bit of a bang. Did they? Well, that depends on who you ask. Shopper track, RCT Corporation which monitors sales at more than 4,500 stores, says that Friday and Saturday sales were down slightly from last year.

The National Retail Federation has a very different take. Its survey of consumers suggests that spending was up nearly 22 percent over last year. And we may get a better idea Thursday when retailers report their November sales figures.

Now that brick and mortar stores have had their first big weekend, it's time for Internet retailers to get some time in the spotlight. Today is called Cyber Monday. Why? Because the Monday after Thanksgiving has become a big day for Internet sales. It's apparently because it's a slow day at many offices, and more than a few employees, well, they end up surfing the web while they're at work. Now we got all of you in trouble.

Well, Internet shoppers spent about $380 million on Cyber Monday last year and are expected to spend even more online today.

Have you spotted a designer gift that looks like an unbelievable bargain? Well, you might want to take a second look. A growing number of counterfeit items, including everything from handbags to video games -- that's right. CNN's Lisa Sylvester reports that they're anything but a gift to the U.S. economy.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): On New York's Canal Street rows of designer handbags, from Louis Vuitton to Kate Spade. They're knockoffs, fakes, counterfeit goods that may end up as holiday gifts, but they are hurting the U.S. economy.

JON DUDAS, UNDER SECRETARY OF COMMERCE: Counterfeiting is a tremendous problem. Estimated U.S. losses are $250 billion a year. It also affects jobs. Up to 750,000 jobs a year lost.

SYLVESTER: The phony products, including clothes from The Gap, video games and watches, come mainly from China. This La Coste shirt retails in the United States for $65 and up. The Chinese version, $7.

Before you think you're getting a holiday bargain, consider the safety risk, especially with toys.

DUDAS: Found exploding cell phone batteries. There was a case in Texas where the U.L., Underwriters Laboratory, label was counterfeited and the electrical cords to which they were attached burst into flames.

SYLVESTER: U.S. business leaders have been urging the federal government to pressure China to enforce intellectual property rights laws. The president of the Motion Picture Association of America at a congressional hearing.

DAN GLICKMAN, MOTION PICTURE ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA: We estimate the piracy rate exceeds 90 percent. That is, over 90 percent of the DVDs sold in China are fake.

SYLVESTER: Last month the Bush administration requested through the World Trade Organization that China submit in writing what changes it's making to its legal system to deal with the growing problem. If China fails to act, the federal government may bring a formal case.

Senator Tom Coburn believes Congress needs to take a tough stand against China.

SEN. TOM COBURN (R), OKLAHOMA: We have the right to place countervailing duties on China if they're undermining our national security, and when you totally ignore our intellectual properties, you in the long run undermine our national security.

SYLVESTER (on camera): Republican Senator Tom Coburn supports an amendment, sponsored by senators Graham and Schumer, that would slap an across-the-board tariff on goods coming in from China. He says it would level the playing field and get China's attention so maybe the political will finally will be there to enforce intellectual property rights laws.

Lisa Sylvester, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: And we're going to check in with Susan Lisovicz at the New York Stock Exchange next to see what you're working on. Susan, give us a sneak peek?

SUSAN LISOVICZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Kyra, it concerns Merck, and it's not good, perhaps, if you work there. Big job cuts from that big pharmaceutical company. I'll have that story and tell you how much the troubled drug maker plans to save, coming up on LIVE FROM. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Troubled drug maker Merck has a prescription for its ailing sales and job cuts, possibly closing some plants. Susan Lisovicz, live at the New York Stock Exchange, with all that.

Hi, Susan.

(STOCK REPORT)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: In Vietnam emergency workers locked down 30 homes and isolated 60 people infected with the deadly form of bird flu, but relax, this is only a test. More than 1,000 medical, government and medical officials took part in the drill near Hanoi. It included building makeshift field hospitals to treat victims, as well as dealing with imaginary bird flu deaths.

And in Shanghai, China, international airline passengers entering or leaving the country are now being screened for possible bird flu. Starting today, passengers with fevers higher than 100.4 will be examined more closely and could be required to undergo hospital treatment.

And wait a little longer to exhale. That's the new advice of the American Heart Association as it revises guidelines for CPR. Now the heart group recommends 30 chest compressions instead of 15 before performing two rescue breaths. Studies show that chest compressions get more blood flow to the rest of the body and that may help save more lives. More than 300,000 Americans die of cardiac arrest each year, and 95 percent of the victims die before they even get to the hospital.

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