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10 Marines Killed Near Fallujah; U.S. May Pay For Good Press In Iraq; Personal Economy Important; Australian Executed In Singapore; Gupta Investigates Bird Flu

Aired December 02, 2005 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: The big story out of Iraq, the deaths of ten marines near Fallujah. The Marine Corps says that the ten troops died on foot patrol in a blast from an improvised exploding device. In addition to the dead, 11 more marines were wounded. It was the deadliest single attack on U.S. fighters since August 3rd and it is the second costliest attack in the Iraq suffered by the marines. The number of U.S. troop deaths in Iraq now stands at 2,124.
Today United States forces launched a new operation into the heart of Iraq's insurgency. Some 300 U.S. marines and 200 Iraqi allies are now involved in "Operation Shank" in the rebel stronghold Ramadi. That pushed is aimed at disrupting a group of insurgents who are using a part of that city to launch attacks on American and Iraqi civilians. The sweeps are part of a wider effort to provide a security net for parliamentary elections December 15th.

Now the information war. The Pentagon is investigating charges that it paid publications in Iraq to print stories manufactured in Washington. At the same time, the U.S. Command in Baghdad is accusing the insurgents of disseminating propaganda. CNN senior international correspondent Nic Robertson has the story from Baghdad.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This is video that has the U.S. military fighting mad. It's supposedly shows insurgents roaming freely on Thursday in the city of Ramadi, western Iraq. Cameramen filmed the event and sent different videotapes to two TV news agencies. It could be propaganda. And that's what angers coalition commanders. Abu al-Zarqawi, they say, is an expert propagandist.

MAJ. GEN. RICK LYNCH, COALITION SPOKESMAN: Conducting these kidnappings, these beheadings, these explosions so that he gets international coverage to look like he has more capability than he truly has. He is lying to the Iraqi people.

ROBERTSON: That's the point with the videotape from Ramadi. Is it real or staged? It's certainly designed to show that the insurgents can move about a will in the town, but the coalition says that's not the reality.

LYNCH: Over the course of the day we had one attack, it was an RPG attack and it was in effect, it shows you disparity between the perception of security in Ramadi and what is happening on the ground. ROBERTSON: On the streets of Ramadi, where CNN is not safely able to go alone, a man, identified as an insurgent, claims to control the streets. And vows to crack down on U.S. troops. Leaflets, distributed by the gunman, claims Zarqawi the head of al Qaeda in Iran is taking over Ramadi. That he may be close the city is not disputed by U.S. officers. But they claim is on the run.

LYNCH: No doubt that Zarqawi tried to gravitate him and his forces towards Ramadi. But know it to be true our operations are focused on taking him out in Ramadi.

ROBERTSON (on camera): Propaganda is becoming crucial in this battle, for both sides. General Lynch says, "We empower our commanders with the ability to inform the Iraqi public." But he insists everything we say is based on fact. Much to his annoyance, the insurgents, too, appear to have an effective pr machine.

Nic Robertson, CNN, Baghdad.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Now, the other side of the story. The charges that the United States military has hurt it's own credibility by paying for good press in Iraq. Last word there was some sort of hang up in Washington in getting officials from the Pentagon to brief congressional overseers. Who will they send to answer those questions? For more on that we go to senior Pentagon correspondent Jamie McIntyre. It seems like such a bizarre story, Jamie?

JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SENIOR PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well it is interesting, Senator John Warner, the head of the Senate Armed Services Committee was demanding that the Pentagon send some people answer questions. It turned out that Senator Warner came here to the Pentagon. A spokesman for Warner says that that plan changed at the Pentagon's request. He apparently did get some information, according to sources we've talked to.

The Pentagon did not deny the story that the -- that a Washington-based public relations firm paid to have stories that were written by the U.S. military translated into Arabic and then placed in Iraqi newspapers as part of an effort to get its side of the story out. This is what's known in the Pentagon as information operations and the Pentagon still is refusing to say whether that actually violates any Pentagon policy, despite all the hubbub.

Now, we're expected to hear from Senator Warner a little later this hour as he makes his way back over to Capitol Hill. He is going to address reporters from the Senate Gallery and maybe we'll get a better idea of exactly the explanation he was provided. We're still waiting for what was supposed to be a statement coming from the U.S. military in Baghdad, explaining the circumstances of this particular event. But, right now, there's been no explanation and no apology from the Pentagon.

PHILLIPS: So, Jamie, I mean, of course, we hear about something like this and as journalists we would think, oh, my gosh, this is completely unethical. We wouldn't be able to do something like this. Are you saying military policy might be different? The dynamic might be different or the standards might be different because of this ongoing war and the fact that U.S. military is in Iraq trying to get the country going toward democracy? Can we flush that out a little bit more?

MCINTYRE: Well there are two standards here. One is the standard for what the U.S. government says officially. What military spokes people say and what public affairs people say and what goes into press releases and there is a standard there of truth, accuracy and full disclosure. Maybe it's not always met, but that is the standard.

There is, however, a different standard for what is called information operations directed at -- in other countries. Not at the American public. Propaganda, some people might call it. That doesn't necessarily mean it's inaccurate, but it doesn't follow the same standard and that's where this confusion lies. That wall between what is public affairs, public statement and what is information warfare.

What is trying to play games with the enemy? And that's where the confusion lies. That's where the Pentagon, frankly, is refusing to draw the line and say here's what we'll do and information operations and here's what we won't do. They're trying to keep that murky.

PHILLIPS: So this group, the linking group. I was reading about it in the paper, various papers. Can you explain what exactly the Lincoln Group does and is this group consulting how to start develop some type of free press?

MCINTYRE: Well, it's a public relations firm. It has a $6 million contract with the Pentagon. Actually it has a couple contracts with the Pentagon. But this particular contact is to help get the word out in Iraq help develop the kind of systems that will get the stories. A lot of this is sort of legitimate public relations. That's what they do. Where you cross the line is when you start paying people to print stories and then not disclose who actually wrote them.

I mean, a lot of times the problems can be simply solved by full disclosure. If there is a story written by a U.S. military spokesperson and you disclose that and the context is there and the paper decides to run it, there's not a problem with that. When you start to get sneaky with what the source is that there could be a problem.

PHILLIPS: Got it. Jamie McIntyre working the story from the Pentagon. Thanks Jamie. In a very ethical way, I might add. Thanks Jamie.

MCINTYRE: Thank you.

PHILLIPS: Well forgive a personal question here. How's your bottom line? Amid the usual flurry of confusing, sometimes conflicting economic facts and figures what matters to most of us is the income and outgo and whether we have jobs to go to. As we talked earlier President Bush and Fed Chief Alan Greenspan both weighed in today on America's economic prospects. But forget all that. CNN's Ali Velshi joins me with information that you can take to the bank. We are going to ask him about his bottom line. Ali prosperity begins at home though right?

ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR: That is right. And to most Americans for all the numbers, there are a lot of numbers that one can take into account. A lot have been released this week. In the end the economy that matters most to most people is their own economy. What is your own financial situation is. That's based on some absolutely basic things your job, your home and your investments. How you feel about that dictates how you act.

If you feel like you have a job and you'll continue to have a job, you'll continue to spend money. That's sort of the basic one. Right now we saw, out of Katrina by some estimates than 500,000 jobs wiped out. We've now seen in November 215,000 jobs created, may not be your job or even the job of anyone you know. But if you're hearing too much about jobs being lost, you start to worry about your own job. When you start to hear the jobs are being created, it sounds a little more positive and you can go out and keep on spending money. That's key number one, jobs.

Then the houses. We talked about this one. The average price of a house in America is $218,000. House prices on average are still going up. There are parts of the country where they're not going up, but fundamentally the biggest investment most people have is their house and house prices are still OK. They might not be going up as much as they have been in previous years, but that's still OK.

And the third thing is we hear about bankruptcies, we hear about pensions, we hear about Social Security maybe not being there. You need to know that the money that you set aside for retirement, your investments, your stocks are doing OK; at least hopefully they're not losing money. If you look at the stock market now while we watch the DOW maybe trying to get to 11,000. It has been a pretty good year for investments too. Those are the things that come together to make people think that their own economy is doing OK.

PHILLIPS: All right. So, the president getting a lot of credit for this? No credit for this? Not enough credit for this?

VELSHI: You know, one can never say because I think when the economy is good; the president tends to get credit. When the economy is bad the president gets blamed. If the economy is good and the numbers show that, I think the president is going to want to be out there as much as possible talking that up and there's nothing I heard the president say today, particularly, about the economy that suggests he's explicitly trying to take credit for it. But he's the guy at the top of the food chain when it comes to the economy.

PHILLIPS: Well let's get into your theory. What is this about Americans and worms?

VELSHI: You know a worm -- you shouldn't do this at home because I've since learned it's cruel. If you take a worm and you cut it in half, it doesn't behave exactly as you would have expected to as a child. It keeps on going. So my point is that even if all these things weren't happening to keep the American consumer spending money, the American consumer necessarily doesn't not spend money just because conditions aren't optical. The American consumers will keep on spending money even if the money is not entirely there. So the American consumer keeps the economy going and that is why the economy fundamentally is strong.

PHILLIPS: Ali Velshi, thank you very much.

VELSHI: Don't be spreading that whole I think people are worms thing.

PHILLIPS: I will never think of worms the same way again. All right Ali. That is true we just keep spending no matter what, don't we?

VELSHI: Yes.

PHILLIPS: All right. Thanks Ali. We'll see you next hour.

Well controversial execution. A young Australian put to death in Singapore. We're on that story.

The news keeps coming and we are going to keep bringing to you. Stay with us. More LIVE FROM straight ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Tony Harris working two stories for us now in the newsroom. Tony a little update on what is happening at the courthouse.

TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: What's that line? The news keeps coming.

PHILLIPS: And we keep bringing it two you.

HARRIS: Two stories we're watching right now. First of all, some live pictures right now. Let's take you to Lakewood, Washington. Where there's a pretty intense, OK, pictures from just a couple minutes ago of a pretty intense fire that is still, although these are taking taped pictures. The fire is under way and it is pretty intense as you can see right now.

This is at the Northwest Medical Billing and Accounting Building there. You may not get that medical bill, as you would expect this month because of a fire that's at the building right now. Everyone evacuated from the building and no reports of injuries and the firefighters are all over it right now and thanks to our affiliate King TV but those pictures.

We will continue to follow this developing story out of Connecticut. Bomb threats were actually called in to multiple courthouses around the state. So all 45 state judicial court buildings were evacuated, shut down and being swept for bombs. Just want to read you this note. From this e-mail we received just a moment a go Kyra. That Judge Everheart a spokesperson for Connecticut's governor is telling CNN that the threat was actually made at about 10:00 a.m. on a constituent phone line that was answered by a staff member and then once that happened we saw all of this activity.

We saw the building shut down. All 45 throughout the state, evacuated, shut down and swept for bombs. And that's the situation right now. Still, the all clear has not been given on the situation in Connecticut and an investigation as you can understand, is continuing under way and we'll bring you further updates, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Tony Harris, thank you so much.

While the death penalty debate gets fresh steam here in the U.S., a city-state of Singapore has underscored its notorious anti-drug policy. Listen to this an Australian citizen, 25 years old, was hanged there today, his crime, trafficking heroin. Seven News Australian Adrian Brown reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ADRIAN BROWN, SEVEN NEWS (voice-over): She had just faced the worst moment of her life, convulsed by grief, another lay ahead. Kimun's public exit from the jail and from what remained of her son's life. Protective arms guiding her gently to an awaiting car.

The failed fight for clemency was over. A long, painful night beckoned. As the hours passed, there was a mood of subdued reflection among Van Nguyen supporters. It was never going to be a big vigil and to get around the law that prevents spontaneous gatherings of more than five people; they arrived and left in pairs.

And another arrival, Van Nguyen's twin brother Kora alone in his thoughts. Living forever with the knowledge that Nguyen became a drug mule to help pay off his debts. Also there, the closest of friend. They were allowed inside the jail one last time, but only as far as the visitor center. A small gesture of compassion, like the earlier decision to allow Nguyen's mother to hold her son's hand.

JULIAN MCMAHON, NGUYEN'S LAWYER: She said to me she was going talking to him and able to touch his hair and his face and that was a great comfort to her.

BROWN: 6:00 a.m., the exact moment, an eerie silence. Now just after ten minutes past 6:00 so it's fair to assume Van Nguyen is now dead. After being read the last rights by a prison chaplain he was led hooded and handcuffed to the gallows where the noose was then tightened around his neck and the trap door lever pulled plunging him to his death.

MR. RAVI, HUMAN RIGHTS ACTIVIST: Who are witnesses to this murder? The government of Australia and Singapore.

BROWN: And as someone who knows what Nguyen's mother is going through now. Her son, a sole mate was hung for drug trafficking last May. Singapore says the mandatory death penalty for drugs will stay, whatever Australia says.

LEE HSIEN LOONG, SINGAPORE PRIME MINISTER: Barbaric. Well, the Australian press is colorful. Many adjectives have been used. We have to uphold the rule of law and the rule of law has to apply impartially to Singaporeans and foreigners alike.

BROWN: Nguyen knew the risk he was taking when he flew into Singapore with 390 grams of pure heroin. The estimated street value more than $1 million. The warnings right there on the landing card. If he looked out of the window he might have even seen the jail. Four hours after his execution, his body was removed from the prison in readiness for the flight home, exactly three years to the day that he set out on his fateful journey.

In Singapore, Adrian Brown, Seven News.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Singapore is known to the world or known for the world over for being tough on unbending on crime. Here are some of the facts.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS (voice-over): More than 400 people have been executed there by hanging since 1991 with a population of about 4.5 million people, Singapore is generally thought to execute more people relative to its population than any other country in the world. Crimes that carry a mandatory death sentence are drug trafficking, firearm offenses and murder, but the laws in Singapore aren't just tough on hard crimes. In 1993 graffiti made news after several expensive cars were found spray-painted.

When student Michael Fay pleaded guilty he was sentenced to four months in jail, a fine of $2,233 and a caning, and gum lovers be wear, though an over all ban on chewing gum was lifted in 2004, only registered users are allowed to indulge. And those who flout the law could be jailed for up to two years and fined almost $3,000.

Other offenses that can land someone in jail jaywalking, littering, and spitting. Government officials claim their hard line attitude is effective in curbing crime and making Singapore one of the safest places in the world to live and work.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Well, charges today for a Colorado teenager who caused the death of a man on a bicycle. Police say the 17-year-old driver was paying more attention to his cell phone, less attention to the road when he drifted into the bike lane. The cyclist he hit later died. The charge is careless driving resulting in death. That carries a maximum sentence of one year in prison. The unnamed driver was reportedly typing a text message at the time of the accident. Investigating the levees. An update on the situation in New Orleans. One of the nation's top leading forensic engineers joins me live. You won't want to miss it.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, at least 30 separate outbreaks of the deadly bird flu virus have been reported among birds throughout China. Yet the country has only reported two human deaths from this disease. It has global health officials worried since smaller countries such as Vietnam and Indonesia with fewer outbreaks have had many more human cases.

Now, according to the "New York Times," World Health Organization spokesman Dick Thompson says that his agency doesn't think China is concealing data on human bird flu cases but he fears the country may lack effective diagnosing ability in rural areas where outbreaks are more likely.

We want to remind you that our Dr. Sanjay Gupta recently traveled to Thailand and Indonesia to investigate the potential for global bird flu pandemic and his special "Killer Flu a Breath Away" will air a week from this Sunday and all next week LIVE FROM has special advance reports and interviews with Sanjay Gupta.

Departing Fed Chief Alan Greenspan is out with some dire warnings today. What is he so concerned about? Kathleen Hays joins us live from the New York Stock Exchange. Kathleen let's start with that old budget deficit.

KATHLEEN HAYS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well you know Kyra this is something that the Fed chairman has been warning about a lot lately. Even though we had a large and growing budget deficit for a while. He seems concerned because he knows there are some things that won't be there forever, like spending on the war in Iraq. Like more spending on Homeland Security, but there are some trends in place that he thinks have to be corrected. It's going to be tough to cut spending, as Greenspan suggests we should with the baby booming retirement ahead.

In 2008 the baby booming leading edge are going to hit 62. They become eligible for Social Security. By 2011 they can start getting Medicare. Right now there are 3.25, well, let's say 3 workers for every retired person. By 2030, that ratio goes only 2 to 1. Two workers paying taxes for every person collecting those benefits. How do you, how do you deal with that? Well, you're going it have a bigger budget deficit.

In fact, the portion of the budget deficit that is going to go to Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid. Right now it's 8 percent of GDP. It's going to raise to more than 9 percent by 2015 and by 2030 it gets up to 13 percent. He says we probably promised more than we can pay to the baby boomers. At some point there is, you know a point where the rubber meets the road as they say.

What are you going to do cut benefits? Boost taxes by demonian (ph) measures. Chairman Greenspan saying we have to do something now. Of course this has been the last year and a half where the president's plan to reform Social Security went totally down the tubes, distracted by other things, Kyra. That's a big warning and a big worry.

PHILLIPS: Now Kathleen, you had the chance to get to know Alan Greenspan. Tell us about that, do you think he's worried about his legacy at all?

HAYS: He certainly has a long and lustrous legacy and we heard many speeches and applause and we'll continue to hear that but, of course, he's worried about his legacy. The last thing he wants after overseeing for example the longest time expansion since World War II in the '90s followed by what many people consider a short and shallow recession, he wants to preserve that legacy.

Let's say he leaves office and let's say that this trade deficit he also warned today, let's say the foreign investors holding all our U.S. dollars and U.S. bonds decide they don't like them so much and we see our dollar fall and our interest rates rise. If that happened quickly, that could disrupt the stock market, the bond market and that would hit regular people because that could hurt their own investments or the companies they work for, Kyra.

So he doesn't want to see that happen. With the budget deficit, his critics say that, you know, back in 2000 when we had a surplus and in 2001 when President Bush argued for tax cuts, Mr. Greenspan seemed to say tax cuts would be OK. And now as critics say, but why did you say that? We have a big deficit. That's one thing he wants to be able to answer in the affirmative that this was corrected because, basically, I left you a solid, flexible economy.

So, that's the latest from Wall Street. LIVE FROM continues right after this.

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