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President Gerald Ford Admitted to Hospital for Tests; Justice or Vengeance?; Anger in Ramadi; Racial Tensions Erupt in Australia; New Poll Numbers Show Bush's Approval Rating Edging Up

Aired December 13, 2005 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: From CNN's world headquarters in Atlanta, Georgia, I'm Kyra Phillips. Here are the stories that we're working on for you right now.
President Ford in the hospital. We're tracking developments in his condition.

Cruises and crimes. Lawmakers investigate disappearances and deaths on board at a hearing in Washington under way this hour.

Live pictures from the New York Stock Exchange. Wall Street awaits a possible interest rate change from the Fed. How will that impact your bottom line?

Plus, the Army Corps of Engineers commander in charge of the New Orleans levees joins me live.

The second hour of LIVE FROM starts right now.

He succeeded the first president to ever resign from office. We're following the health of former President Gerald Ford as he's admitted to the hospital.

Our Tony Harris working the story from our newsroom -- Tony.

TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Kyra, it is the story of the day. Former President Gerald Ford, the 38th president of the United States, in the hospital right now for what's described as tests. Not sure of the symptoms that led to the trip to the hospital at this time.

And Kyra, I would love to be able to put a timestamp on this for you to let you know exactly when the former president was taken to the hospital. Don't have that information just yet.

Here's the brief statement from Penny Circle (ph), the president's chief of staff.

It reads: "President Ford was admitted to Eisenhower Medical Center in Rancho Mirage, California. He is undergoing medical tests and will be released when they have been completed."

Now, just a couple of past health issues that we're aware of, Kyra. A mild stroke during the 2,000 Republican National Convention. And then, again, there was a dizzy spell while playing golf in 96- degree heat. That was in 2003. Keep in mind, the former president is 92 years old. And despite being made out to be something of a klutz by Chevy Chase in a number of "Saturday Night Live" sketches, Gerald Ford was quite the athlete. A star football player at the University of Michigan.

Mr. Ford is one of four living former presidents. The other three: Carter, Clinton and Bush Sr.

CNN's Dan Simon, we can tell you, is on his way to the Eisenhower Medical Center, Kyra. And we will touch base with him and get the latest as soon as we can.

Kyra, back to you.

PHILLIPS: All right, Tony. Thank you so much.

Well, the other story that we're following, he was a convicted quadruple murderer who was nominated for Nobel prizes. A founding father of one of America's best known, most feared street gangs, whose real prominence came behind bars as an anti-gang crusader. A 24-year resident of California's death row, whose death strikes many as justice delayed, others as justice denied.

Stanley "Tookie" Williams was many things to many people. And just after midnight California time, he was injected with chemicals that killed him.

A panel of journalists joined a few of Williams' supporters and relatives it of victims outside the death chamber at San Quentin Prison.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

STEVEN ORNOWSKI, WARDEN, SAN QUENTIN PRISON: He spent his last hours communicating with his attorneys and friends by telephone, pretty much unrestricted. He refused food, but requested and was provided with milk. And I believe also water. He invited five witnesses but declined to invite a spiritual adviser.

STEVE LOPEZ, "LOS ANGELES TIMES": He came in without any kind of resistance shortly after 12:00, it seemed. He was helped on to what, I guess, is a converted dentist's chair and was strapped down. At no point did he seem to give any kind of resistance whatsoever.

JUDY CAMPBELL, KQED RADIO: He raised his head a lot. He looked around. He did in the beginning look at his supporters. Supporters Barbara and a woman next to her were holding their hands in prayer. Another man lifted his right fist.

His lawyers waved at him, nodded, smiled. He nodded, sometimes at his supporters. Often, he hook his head slowly from side to side with sort of a -- kind of a for shame sort of look about him.

BRIAN ROONEY, ABC NEWS: I was struck by what a personal process it was, in that all the people attending to him had their hands on him most of the time. One guard near the right side of his head, in particular, was touching his upper arm a lot of the time. I think in an effort to comfort him.

DAVID WOHL, CBS NEWS: He was a very, very big guy. I had heard he was smaller. He looked like he had been lifting weights nonstop for years. And so I could understand the nurse was having a great deal of difficulty. She was sweating, she was asking for help.

This took much, much longer than I thought it would.

KEVIN FAGAN, "SAN FRANCISCO CHRONICLE": And the most notable thing was that Williams had supporters at the back of the room. Ms. Becnel was among them, I understand.

We could see them. And throughout the last part of the -- or preparing him when he was still conscious, they gave black -- what looked like black power salutes several times to him, one man and two women. And most strikingly at the end of the execution, as those three were heading out, they yelled, "The state of California just killed an innocent man!" Which is the first time I heard any outburst in the death chamber there.

And the folks who were there on behalf of the victims, they were stony.

RITA COSBY, MSNBC: I felt that Tookie Williams died the same way that he lived. He was belligerent, he seemed steadfast to the bitter end.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: And there's no shortage of controversy surrounding the death penalty in America, and its his history is long and varied.

Here's the facts.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

HARRIS (voice over): The United States and Japan are the only two industrialized democracies that still permit capital punishment. Some other nations won't even extradite criminal suspects to the U.S. without assurances they won't face capital punishment.

There are currently more than 3,400 inmates on death row in 38 states. America's most prolific period for capital punishment was in the 1930s, when an average of 167 executions were carried out every year.

The Supreme Court in 1972 ruled against the state of Georgia in a case that effectively banned the death penalty in America. The death penalty was reinstated by another high court decision in 1976. And a 10-year moratorium on capital punishment ended with the execution of Gary Gilmore in Utah in 1977. Gilmore was killed by a firing squad.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Pre-election violence continued today in Iraq. Four U.S. soldiers were killed in a roadside bombing northwest of Baghdad. The soldiers were assigned to Task Force Baghdad, which handles security in that region.

A possible election day attack may have been foiled in Iraq. U.S. and Iraqi forces seized a big weapons cache in an open-air area just south of Baquba today. An Iraqi National Guard officer says the weapons included surface-to-surface missiles, mortar cannons, heavy machine guns, and a large amount of ammunition. Eleven suspects were arrested in a simultaneous operation targeting insurgents in that area.

Emotions running high in the capital of Iraq's vast and dangerous Anbar province today. Some of the Iraqi forces guarding the city are already voting, but their very presence is the subject of an intense debate.

CNN Senior International Correspondent Nic Robertson reports from Ramadi.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Likely among the first to vote, Iraqi army soldiers in Ramadi casting their ballots three days early so they can secure polling stations on election day. For many, the experience seemed new, even a little confusing.

By election day, their challenge will be tougher. Ramadi is one of the most violent cities in Iraq, and turnout is always the lowest in the country.

Undaunted by the bigger hurdle ahead, soldiers were eager to reveal who they voted for. "Five, five, five," this soldier and the next 10 in line all said, indicating their support for the dominant Shia religious parties now in power.

(on camera): Almost 2,000 soldiers are expected to vote today. The vast majority appeared to be casting their ballots in favor of Shia parties. That's because the army here comes from outside of this Sunni-dominated region.

(voice over): And that's what this meeting later in the day was supposed to address. The United States' top general in Iraq and Iraq's defense minister came to town to hammer out a deal on election security and get Sunnis from the Ramadi area to join the Iraqi army.

It didn't go well. Iraq's defense minister brushed aside Sunni demands for their own army division in the Ramadi area, a plan encouraged by the U.S. military to help U.S. troops get out of danger.

ADNAN DULEMI, IRAQI DEFENSE MINISTER: This province became the safe haven for all the evil people who come from all over the world into Iraq, and we lead them into the rest of Iraq to kill other innocent Iraqis.

ROBERTSON: As the anger swelled, we were quickly ushered from the room. (on camera): Well, just as the meeting began to get acrimonious, the press were asked to leave. We're leaving now, but we do hope to speak with the governor and some of the other senior dignitaries before they break up the whole meeting.

(voice over): About an hour and a half later, they began to leave. Passions had cooled, but positions appeared firm. The defense minister giving no ground.

DULEMI: I ask them, "If you insist to fight against the Iraqi freedom, we are ready to hit you any time."

ROBERTSON: Not clear how two weeks of careful U.S. planning with local leaders culminated in a snub.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The proposal for a division, I think people went too far, too fast.

ROBERTSON: The first such high-level meeting, though, perhaps having the desired effect to get dialogue going.

ABED AL JUMAYLI, SECRETARY OF THE SECURITY COUNCIL (through translator): We agreed to meet again. We hope the coalition and the Iraqi government will fulfill their promises. If they do, then the security will improve.

ROBERTSON: Just three days before the elections, it's not the sort of pickup anyone here was expecting.

Nic Robertson, CNN, Ramadi, Iraq.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: So will it or won't it? The Federal Reserve is to announce a short time from now whether it will raise short-term interest rates.

Economists believe the Fed will boast rates -- or boost rates, rather, about a quarter point to 4.25 percent. If so, it would be the 13th consecutive quarter-point rate hike in the past year and a half.

We'll bring the announcement to you live at 2:15 Eastern.

The news keeps coming. We're going to keep bringing it to you.

More LIVE FROM straight ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, the Federal Reserve is expected to announce its decision on interest rates at any moment. Susan Lisovicz joins us live from the New York Stock Exchange for a preview.

(STOCK MARKET REPORT)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) PHILLIPS: Well, two powerful earthquakes rattled nerves and a lot more overseas today. A 6.8 magnitude earthquake jolted the outlying Fiji Islands. No damage or injuries are reported right now.

That tremor was followed by a smaller but more frightening earthquake in Afghanistan. The 6.6 magnitude quake was centered in the sparsely populated Hindu Kush mountains and felt some 200 miles away in Pakistan's capital of Islamabad.

Some 200 homes were reported damaged and a few people injured in Afghanistan, but the damage paled in comparison to that seen in the region after October's major quake.

Well, more now on that deadly plane crash in Nigeria. Our Jeff Koinange is at the scene of the weekend accident in Port Harcourt. Just a short time ago, the head of a Jesuit school came to the crash scene to pay respects to dozens of children that he knew so well.

Jeff joins us now on the phone with more.

Jeff, you got to spend time with Father Rosselli (ph). What was going through his mind? Was he angry? How was he taking all of this in and just dealing with all the family and relatives?

JEFF KOINANGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'll tell you what, Kyra, picture this: a Jesuit priest from New York City who's been in Nigeria about six years now, principal of his school, has this situation in front of him. He was feeling disappointed because of the reaction from the government.

He was feeling angry because he couldn't do -- he couldn't do much about it. He was feeling helpless.

Every time he thinks of a student, he breaks out, Kyra. He is so devastated. He was so close to these students.

He lost his head boy, which in the British system is like the top student in the school. Every time I was talking to him, he would revert to one of the student's, saying, so and so was so nice, so helpful, so sweet.

He is completely devastated, and is having a hard, hard time coping with the worst tragedy in his school's history -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Now, the school kids are on holiday now. What happens when they get back, when they return?

KOINANGE: I asked him that very question. He said, well, the first thing he's going to do is call a prayer, the whole school to pray, because, as you can imagine, they've lost one-tenth of the school body. He's going to call them to prayer, and then they're going to move from there.

They're going to have to build strength from each other, he says, because the school has to continue going, pick up the pieces and keep going. He's optimistic things will turn out well and the students will turn out as better students, but he says if it takes an incident like this to not only rally the school, but rally the country, well, you know, it's an act of god at the end of the day -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Now Jeff, culturally, how are the dead cared for and how are they buried?

PHILLIPS: Well, it depends. If they're Christians, well, it will take about three, four days. You know, you have your three, four-day ceremony, and then (INAUDIBLE).

The Muslims, some of them have already been buried. It's less than 24 hours, and they have already been buried.

But here's the other catch, Kyra. Because a lot of the bodies were badly mutilated, and burned beyond recognition, some parents have actually been picking up the wrong kids.

And this is causing a lot of concern with some -- obviously with other parents who cannot find their kids in the various mortuaries around the city. A lot of concern, Kyra and a lot, a lot of devastation.

The entire city, where we are right now, in Port Harcourt, major, major devastation. It's going to take a while before not only this city, Kyra, but this country comes together, because this is the second such incident in as many months.

PHILLIPS: Well, what does it tell us about -- of aviation and also the investigative process, too? Probably quite different from what we have here at home. Right, Jeff?

KOINANGE: No doubt about it, but there's been already some action. Nigeria's president, Olusegun Obasanjo, has already grounded two airlines. One of them, the one that crashed, and another one which has a spotty history. He's grounded two indefinitely.

So at least he's taking steps. But it's taken, you know, incidents like these for him to get to the stage.

Obviously, the entire aviation industry has to be overhauled. The aircraft have to be looked into. And any aircraft over a certain age have to be discontinued. That's the bottom line, Kyra.

A lot of people here are afraid of flying. They'd rather drive, 10, 12, maybe even 20 hours to get from one point of a country to another rather than take another flight that might not just get to the destination -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Our Jeff Koinange, live from Nigeria.

Thanks, Jeff.

Well, straight ahead on LIVE FROM, more than three months later, and the questions still remain. Why did those levees fail after Katrina? Some surprising new information today. Brigadier General Robert Crear joins me next. LIVE FROM has all the news you need this afternoon. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Three and a half months after Hurricane Katrina, many victims face spending the holiday season in makeshift housing. While a federal judge has ordered FEMA to extend paying for hotel rooms, storm victims are making their own housing while waiting on those FEMA trailers.

CNN's Susan Roesgen has their story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHARLENE CONRAD, WANTS TRAILER: As long as he's with me, he's my rock.

SUSAN ROESGEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Wayne and Charlene Conrad just wanted to live again in their own home. So they are. Sort of.

After weeks of waiting for a FEMA trailer that has never arrived, they decided to buy a tent and put it up in what's left of their living room.

(on camera): I like the do not disturb sign.

CONRAD: Yes. How do you like that?

ROESGEN (voice over): This is where the master bed is, just barely big enough for the two of them. The house has no power, except in the kitchen. That's where they boil the water to help each other take a shower.

CONRAD: Pours it over me. I suds up. Then when it's time to get the soap off, he pours it off me again. So that's how we take our baths.

ROESGEN: Charlene and Wayne have tried to make living here as nice as possible for themselves and for another couple, longtime friends who set up a tent in the Conrads' house, too.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Outdoor life is not my thing, but...

ROESGEN: Both couples are waiting for FEMA trailers.

CONRAD: You call and you call and you call and you call and it's busy. And finally, when somebody does answer, it's a recording. You've got to press this -- I don't know anymore what to do. I really and truly don't. All we ask is that we get a trailer.

ROESGEN: If Charlene would like to see some FEMA housing she could go to Arkansas. These are mobile homes purchased by FEMA for Katrina victims that haven't been distributed to anyone. And one these wouldn't fit in the Conrad's driveway, anyway. But a smaller travel trailer would, and even more incredible to some people in St. Bernard, 1,400 travel trailers are sitting in their own backyard, empty.

The parish ordered them in a private contractor just days after the hurricane, but they're not being used because FEMA hasn't given the parish the money to pay for them.

LARRY INGARGIOLA, ST. BERNARD PARISH HOMELAND SECURITY CHIEF: They won't pay for the trailers. It they don't pay for the trailers, I can't put the trailers out.

ROESGEN: Parish Homeland Security Chief, Larry Ingargiola, says he talks to FEMA reps three and four times a day and can't get FEMA to fork over the money. FEMA says it's not to blame.

A FEMA spokeswoman in Washington, Nicol Andrews, says, "We agree that it is time that people forced from their homes more than three months ago have a place to call home. So far, she says, FEMA has provided rental assistance for more than 500,000 families and housed more than 40,000 in travel trailers."

INGARGIOLA: We are ready for the trailers in St. Bernard. We are ready.

ROESGEN: People in St. Bernard are trying to come back. A few people have FEMA trailers, but 15,000 to 20,000 don't. That includes this the Conrads, still waiting for a trailer. Sleeping in a tent camped out in their living room instead.

Susan Roesgen, for CNN, St. Bernard Parish.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: More now on Hurricane Katrina's aftermath. Experts investigating the failure of the New Orleans levee system got a surprise today.

Initial sonar tests on the failed 17th Street Canal flood walls suggested that the pilings didn't go deep enough to meet design specifications, but a piling section was pulled out of the ground this morning, and that section was removed. It did meet specifications, which brings us back to the original question. What went wrong?

Brigadier General Robert Crear is the head of the Army Corps of Engineers in Louisiana, he joins me now from New Orleans. General, glad to have you with us.

Just to sort of set up why we're talking about these pilings, it's those sheet pilings that were to help support the flood walls. Correct?

BRIG. GEN. ROBERT CREAR, ARMY CORPS OF ENGINEERS: That is correct. The specification from the Corps of Engineers is they would be 23 feet, and that 17 feet of that would be below sea level and six foot would be above sea level. PHILLIPS: So previously, there were reports that came out that said that those pilings were too short. They should have been deeper. Now, why is it this time around it's showing that those pilings are OK? What was the difference between those two investigations?

CREAR: The investigation team had used seismic technology to measure the depth of those piles. And they did come up short. It was done on two separate occasions, both from a Louisiana team and also a corps team. So the only alternative we has was let's pull the piles just to verify.

In pulling the piles, we did that in two locations. We did four set of piles in south section near the levee breach and then we pulled four sections near the north section, and all eight of those sections met specifications.

PHILLIPS: All right. So if the pilings were OK, what about the weak soil layers and the deterioration that was taking place with regard to the soil? Does that seem to be the main problem?

CREAR: What the piling does is basically helps us complete one of the links in the chain here. The soil conditions is another. It's basically a puzzle.

We, more than probably anybody else, want to know what are the engineering factors, the scientific factors, that cause some portions of the system to fail, and some portions not to fail. And so we see this as part of the process. The ongoing process to find out exactly what happened.

PHILLIPS: As you know, there has been a number of reports published since all this happened, even prior to Katrina, there were a number of reports there were issues with these levees. One the complaints is that the Army Corps of Engineers, that men and women were not inspecting the levees like they should have been, on regular basis, and monitoring them and responding to complaints.

How do you respond to that criticism? What went wrong with regard to those -- I don't know if they were supposed to be daily checks, weekly checks, monthly checks, and how is that now going to be changed?

CREAR: The process is a good process. I don't see any changes that are necessary, but here's how the process works. The levee for operational maintenance belongs to a levee board. In this particular case, the New Orleans Levee board and East Jefferson Levee Boards and they have a responsibility to inspect the levees. Then we inspect them.

Our records indicate that they've been doing their jobs. So that process is the process we use throughout the country, and it is a sound process.

PHILLIPS: But what about the reports, general, of neighbors -- I'm looking at them right now, dating from November, 2005, back a couple of years, about residents talking about leakage and water coming to their neighborhoods and gaps in the levees, and asking for repair crews to come out.

What about those continued complaints? Obviously, there was a problem, and things were not being monitored properly. So how is that going to change now? Will they be more regular checks? More individuals going out, whether at the levee boards or members from the Army Corps of Engineers?

CREAR: Right now, the focus is on -- is to find out what caused the breach in the first place, and then we have until hurricane season next year to analyze that data, some of the things you mentioned will be worth analyzing as well. So we can make a decision as to the type of protection that's going to be required so that we'll have at least the level of protection, if not greater, than what we had prior to Katrina.

PHILLIPS: If another Katrina hits, are those levees able to sustain that type of wind and water capacity right now? And if not, when do you feel those levees will be up to par?

CREAR: Katrina was a hurricane that exceeded the design limitations of this levee system. So this levee was not designed to withstand a hurricane the magnitude of Katrina. But by June of 2006, we will have this levee system back to the level it was prior to -- prior to Hurricane Katrina.

PHILLIPS: What about better than what it was able to sustain prior to Hurricane Katrina?

CREAR: In some cases, in fact, it will be better, and we've taken some of the -- some of the diagnostics from the evaluation teams and actually have incorporated them into the design.

At the Lower Ninth Ward, for example, the overtoppings -- we all agree that the failure there was caused by overtopping of the levee, which undermined the foundation, which caused it to fail.

So as part of the design criteria there, we in fact put armament on the inside of that levee sow that would reduce the chances of it failing, because of overtopping. So, yes. It would be certainly at the level it was prior to Katrina, but in some cases, based on, again, the facts that we've found and the reasons for failure, better.

PHILLIPS: As you can imagine, there are a lot of men and women counting on you. Brigadier General, Robert Crear, Army Corps of Engineers. Thank you for your time, sir.

CREAR: I thank you.

PHILLIPS: There's going to be a change at one of the agencies that came under fire after Hurricane Katrina. American Red Cross President, Marcia Evans announced her resignation.

Critics charge that The Red Cross failed to respond to Katrina quickly enough. The Red Cross spokesperson says the board had concerning about Evans' management style, but denied that her departure is linked to Katrina. Up next, violence in the streets. Why is neighbor attacking neighbor down under. That's a story you don't want to miss. The news keeping coming. We'll keep bringing it to you.

Michael Holmes from CNN International joins us live right after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Massive protests down under. Police bracing for what could be a third night of racially-charged riots in the suburbs around Sydney, Australia. Youth gangs of Middle-Eastern descent have attacked white people, vandalized cars and hurled rocks at police. Police say white youths also have attacked people believed to be of Arab descent.

Australia's parliament is moving to give police special lockdown powers now in an emergency sessions. It's also increasing jail time for rioters. Police have beefed up patrols with hundreds of extra officers. Well, the tension's been simmering a long time. Racial chants at Cronulla Beach put it on the front burner.

Michael Holmes lived in Sydney for years. He used to surf at that beach. He knows that area very well. You were born and raised in this area?

MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: I was. I mean, I born on the west coast of Australia, but I lived in Sydney for years and years and surfed Cronulla Beach for a long time. It's a famous beach in Australia. Macakaluko (ph), it would be known to surfer. A world champion surfed on that beach. It's an oasis, if you'd like. And to see these scenes is very disturbing to all of us.

I mean, Australians are very territorial, it has to be said, when it comes to their beaches. And they don't like people even from other suburbs sometimes coming out. I experienced that as well.

PHILLIPS: Well, and I asked you about the racial tension. And the prime minister coming forward, saying, there has not been an undercurrent of racial tension. That's not what this is about that. But you're saying you would disagree?

HOLMES: Yes. I think that -- I hate to admit this; you know, I'm an Aussie -- but I think there is an undercurrent of racism in Australia. But you need to explain it. It's deeper than that. I think it's related to lack of understanding, or even, I should say, a desire to understand other cultures, as opposed to it being strictly about race or religion. I think there's an ignorance there that stems from years of not mixing with each other.

PHILLIPS: But this is also a nation that has had all types of ethnicities....

HOLMES: Oh, absolutely.

PHILLIPS: ... come to -- so, has it just always sort of been segregated and now -- I mean, explain where the shift...

HOLMES: I think every new group that comes in -- and I think the Lebanese community is an exception. But every new group that comes in has a bedding-down period, if you like. Australia, as you said, it's one of the most multicultural nations on Earth.

Melbourne, the city of Melbourne, I think, is in the top one or two multicultural cities on earth. There's over 130 nations represented there, and everyone gets along pretty well. Post-war migration was Greeks, Yugoslavs and the like. Everyone gets along fine. More recently, it's been Asian migration.

The Lebanese, economically, were kept a little bit separate. In a way themselves, it's almost a ghetto environment. And they have maintained a strict upbringing that has led to a lot of this. There is background. This doesn't just start.

What has happened is a lot of young Lebanese men who were raised in a traditional situation where their mothers and their sisters were respected -- anyone who's wearing a bikini at Cronulla Beach is seen as a prostitute. And they will go down there -- I'm talking 20-year- old guys -- and tell these girls to cover up, get off the beach. You're a disgrace.

This led to some fights with surf lifesavers, which led to what happened when Anglos, as they call them, responded en masse. And now it's going back and it's going forth. It's a real tinderbox situation, I hate to say.

PHILLIPS: Now, there was also a story that surfaced about a gang rape, right, that involved some Lebanese?

HOLMES: Part of the background.

PHILLIPS: OK, so that's part of what...

HOLMES: That's all part of the background. About a year ago, there was a group of Lebanese men who admitted they had no respect for Western women, who were convicted of gang-raping young Western women. And that -- then you combine the Bali bombings, you combine the war in Iraq, the war on terror.

All of a sudden, these simmering suspicions, if you like, about other people, have come to the fore. And it took something like what happened to the lifesavers getting beaten up for this to really take up.

Australians like to think of themselves as egalitarian, and I think in many respects, that's true, but there's also an elitism that I think is borne of insecurity, if you like, a lack of identity, I think, felt by many Australians. Who are we? And these things will just rear their heads, but never like this before. It's very worrying and a bit depressing.

PHILLIPS: Well, it's -- what we saw in France, in the riots in France and this sort of undercurrent. HOLMES: Which is also economic, and also...

PHILLIPS: Exactly.

HOLMES: ... also about people feeling disenfranchised, if you like. And a lot of Lebanese youth in Australia feel disenfranchised. They don't -- they haven't been educated at a higher level, their parents are very traditional. A lot of their upbringing is traditional. I wouldn't want to put it down as purely race or religion. I think it's this...

PHILLIPS: It's economics, as well.

HOLMES: It's economics and it's a clash of culture. And a lack of understanding about culture.

PHILLIPS: So what's being done to move forward? Is this something new for the government, with regard to trying to deal with the poverty side of things? The integration, the understanding cultures and...

HOLMES: I think it's caught everyone off guard. And what you're saying now, police are having to say -- because under Australian law, you get picked up for putting a baseball bat through somebody's window, you get locked up and then you get bail straight away. Some of these guys have been arrested three times, bailed out, back on the streets, getting up to trouble.

So they got to bring in new laws in the New South Wales parliament, where these bail conditions will be revoked, where they'll take cell phones -- because this is a high-tech battle that's going on on the street. It's all text messaging.

PHILLIPS: So this was all gathered together through text messaging?

HOLMES: This was done -- what you're seeing then was done with a text messaging campaign. And the Lebanese gangs have also organized in much the same way. So the police want to be able to take cars off people, because they're traveling around in convoys to go and bash anyone they see, both sides. And they want to take away cell phones. They want to get away with the bail condition. I have to reiterate, though, to defend Australian, these idiots on both sides do not represent the majority of Australians.

PHILLIPS: What do you call them? Yabbos, right?

HOLMES: Yabbos, yabbos, yes.

PHILLIPS: You taught me that word. Thugs.

HOLMES: Yes. Yabbos. It just means thugs, kids whose parents should be, as I again say, in Australia giving them a clip around the ear and telling them to stay home. And meanwhile, they're out there drinking on the beach and giving everyone a bad name. And that's my beach, too. PHILLIPS: That's right. And hopefully we'll see calm on that beach soon.

HOLMES: Hopefully.

PHILLIPS: We'll follow what happens in parliament. I know they're meeting for increased police protection.

HOLMES: Yes. That's the New South Wales parliament, not the federal parliament. But yes, they're made just like the state parliament and they're going to pass down some laws.

PHILLIPS: Michael Holmes, thank you so much.

HOLMES: Good to see you, Kyra, as always.

PHILLIPS: Appreciate it. Always enjoy your insight. Always a story happening in your side of the world.

Well, straight ahead, a miraculous tale of survival. A skydiver literally faces death as she plunges to the ground, but there's more to this story. You're not going to want to miss it. The news keeps coming and we keep bringing it to you. More LIVE FROM, right after this.

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PHILLIPS: The economy, the state of the Iraq, the president and the death penalty. Americans reacting to a very wide range of issues this week in the new Gallup polling. If you're talking about it, Frank Newport knows about it.

Frank, let's start with this morning's execution of former Crips gang co-founder, Stanley "Tookie" Williams in California. Creating major reaction in the Black community in particular. What does the latest data show?

FRANK NEWPORT, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, GALLUP: Well, as we told you before, Kyra, a clear majority of Americans in general favored the death penalty and have for many, many years, for decades, absolutely.

But there are differences by race, we saw this clearly at the time of the O.J. Simpson trial that there were differences in views of the criminal justice system. We see it reflected now on the data on the death penalty. We've aggregated several different polls over the last couple of years.

You see the numbers: Whites, 69 percent favor the death penalty, less than half, down to 38 percent of Blacks in the United States favor the death penalty. Clearly, two different worlds as far as perceptions of the use of that death penalty according to race in the United States today.

PHILLIPS: All right. Now, President Bush has already given three of the four speeches on Iraq. Has it made a dent in his approval ratings? NEWPORT: Well, his approval rating is up, Kyra. We had measured it, as you know, prior to Thanksgiving in the 37 percent, 38 percent range. Now we are back up to 42 percent in our most recent CNN-USA TODAY Gallup poll.

Was this a direct effect of the speeches the president's been making on Iraq? It's difficult to tell. We do know that his sub approval rating on handling the situation in Iraq is up by four points from prior to Thanksgiving.

At the same time over here we see his approval on handling the economy is also up. Other numbers show that's improving. It could be several differ factors. But, Kyra, it's probably reasonable to say that his more aggressive stance on Iraq with those speech has had an impact.

PHILLIPS: Let's talk about Iraq and the focus on it.

NEWPORT: Well, the mixed messages over the weekend, I would say, in our polling numbers. This is more positive for the administration: has Iraq made progress towards democracy. Clear majority of American, 63 percent said yes over the last two years.

However, a big, big motif of those speeches the president has been making is planned for victory. We asked does the president have a plan for victory in Iraq? Right after his Naval Academy speech, 41 percent said yes. Now, over the weekend, 38 percent say yes. So, really, we still have a majority of Americans disagree with that premise.

PHILLIPS: Let's move over to the economy. We've been talking with our business folks. Holiday sales so-so. What have you found out with regard to what Americans are thinking about the economy and if it's healthy?

NEWPORT: Well, healthy is an interesting word. It is improving, according to our perceptual data. I wouldn't say we have the robust kind of attitudes we measured back in, say, 1999 in the dotcom boom.

Is the economy getting better or getting worse? Great measure. We ask it twice a month, kind of the direction of the economy measure. The bottom line, which is the good line, ticking up, Kyra, now to 39 percent moo say it's getting better. Half of Americans say worse.

In some senses these aren't great numbers but look at trend. I would say Americans are getting more positive about the economy and maybe when the dust settles after the holiday spending season, retailers will have something to be happy about -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Frank Newport, thanks so much.

Listen to this. It's an amazing tale of survival. A Missouri woman survives her first solo skydive, even though both of her chutes failed.

Shayna Richardson said she spun out of control at a speed of 50 miles an hour and hit a parking lot face-first. Somehow she survived with several broken bones and a few other injuries. And then the jump happened on October ninth, and listen to this, doctors later informed her she was pregnant.

Four surgeries and two months later, this young woman says she and her fetus are doing fine. She's due to deliver June 25th and plans to make her next parachute jump, yes, she wants to do it again, in August. CNN's Wolf Blitzer will have more on this woman's incredible survival story tonight at 7:00 eastern on THE SITUATION ROOM.

Wow.

Still to come on LIVE FROM..., excitement in Hollywood. The Golden Globe nominations are out. Who's in and who's out? We're live from Los Angeles. Stay right there.

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PHILLIPS: A developing story that we've been following all afternoon -- the health of former President Gerald Ford. Our Tony Harris working it in the news room right now -- Tony.

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