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Harry Whittington, Accidentally Shot by Vice President Cheney, Has Minor Heart Attack; Continued Investigations into Alabama Church Fires; Reports Critical of Katrina Spending
Aired February 14, 2006 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BETTY NGUYEN, CNN ANCHOR: Well, the shot Vice President Dick Cheney accidentally fired at a huntiing companion has done more damage than first thought, much more. Doctors say the victim, Texas lawyer Harry Whittington, has suffered a minor heart attack.
CNN's Ed Lavandera is outside his hospital in Corpus Christi.
And Ed, this really does come as a surprise because all we've heard about until now is how minor the injuries are and how healthy Mr. Whittington is.
ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, we asked on several occasions yesterday to what extent the pellets, the BBs from the shotgun blast had penetrated into Mr. Whittington. It was described as superficial.
However, doctors had also couched that to say that within the first 48 to 72 hours these BBs could move within the body until the scar tissue around it was formed and those BBs would settle in. And that appears to be what has happened in this particular case, where one BB, doctors say, has lodged either into the heart a little bit or on the edge of the heart to cause inflammation of the heart.
And doctors early this morning performing a cardiac catheterization to check the blood flow through the heart. They say that what Mr. Whittington suffered was a mild heart attack, did not show any of the classic signs of a heart attack, chest pain and that sort of thing. That this was all because of the inflammation around that heart. Obviously, the heart being a muscle and this BB kind of lodging its way in there, causing some of the inflammation and some of the disruption and discomfort to the heart area there.
Doctors now say that Mr. Whittington will be here at least another seven days. They say that there hasn't been any talk yet of whether or not he will stay here or move to Austin where he lives. But they will continue to do that.
And the doctors also say that they are consulting with the White House medical team that was the first on the scene of the shooting accident on late Saturday afternoon, and they say since those were the doctors that first treat Mr. Whittington on Saturday, that they will continue to consult with them and let them know about what has been going on. But Mr. Whittington back in intensive care after being removed yesterday afternoon from the intensive care unit. He is back there under constant supervision by the doctors here in Corpus Christi -- Betty.
NGUYEN: Ed, this has led to a lot of questions and some frustration by Dr. David Blanchard, the emergency room chief, especially when he was asked by a reporter during that press conference about the case or the instance which an infection might occur with that BB that's in the heart.
LAVANDERA: They -- it doesn't sound like they are incredibly convinced that that will happen at this point in time, so -- but that's one of the reasons why he is back in the intensive care unit. The idea of infection has always been a concern considering the number of BBs that are probably lodged inside of Mr. Whittington.
You know, these shotgun shells carry several hundred of these BBs. And doctors say it's safe to assume that there could up to 100 or so BBs in -- lodged into his body. But they also say that there are many people who suffer these kinds of hunting accidents that continue to live long, healthy lives with no problems, and even though these BBs are inside of them.
And they say that in this case, at least so far, it sounds like what they are saying, that that will continue to happen. But because it has reached the heart muscle, they obviously need to take these extra precautions to make sure that Mr. Whittington will be OK.
NGUYEN: No doubt, especially when we're talking about a minor heart attack.
Ed Lavandera in Corpus Christi.
Thank you, Ed -- Tony.
TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: OK, Betty.
We want to let you hear now from the hospital administrators there in Corpus Christi who are keeping a very close eye, monitoring the situation with Mr. Whittington.
This is Peter Banko, the hospital administrator from just last hour.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. DAVID BLANCHARD, EMERGENCY ROOM CHIEF: We're not 100 percent certain exactly the location of where it is in the 3D dimension. We have discussed with the White House staff, we have discussed with our cardiothoracic vascular surgeons in conjunction with our cardiologists what would be the best approach. We have talked to the family directly regarding that.
And when all else is equal, if you can take a conservative approach and get a good outcome in a stable asymptomatic patient, versus a 78-year-old and take him to surgery with all the intended risks of anesthesia, the possibility of all other things that could happen, we feel at this point it is in his best interest to treat him in a conservative standpoint with medical therapy. And we have the concurrence of the White House staff and all of the various specialists that we have got involved with this.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: My apologies. Obviously, Dr. David Blanchard, the medical director there in Corpus Christi.
The south Texas ranch where the accident involving the vice president happened and its owners are no strangers to big-name hunters and big-name political donors.
CNN's David Mattingly has that story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT, (voice over): To those who have been fortunate enough to get an invitation to the Armstrong Ranch in south Texas, it was no surprise to learn a GOP vice president and an ambassador were hunting quail alongside a wealthy Republican attorney from Austin. Polly Sowell, the former vice chairman of the Texas Republican Party, has been a regular guest of the Armstrongs since the '60s.
POLLY SOWELL, FORMER TEXAS REPUBLICAN OFFICIAL: The only other family that I can think of that might be -- have been more influential would be the Bushes.
MATTINGLY: Among Sowell's photographs, memories of lunch under old oaks, lounging by the pool, open air safari like vehicles for hunting parties and, in this picture, a young Karl Rove after a successful day.
ROBERT ELDER, AUSTIN AMERICAN-STATESMAN: It's a favored destination spot for this type of Republican with social connections, a fair amount of wealth. This happens quite frequently in the Armstrong Ranch.
MATTINGLY: The Bushes and James Baker have been among the guests treated to the abundance of well-managed game across the 50,000 acre ranch. But for many, an invitation to the ranch was prized for more than just the hunting.
ELDER: Certainly if you have access to the vice president, or other high level administration officials, corporate officials, it gives you really a unique opportunity to kind of relax, talk, and who knows what happens from there.
MATTINGLY: Anne and Tobin Armstrongs were Republicans in Texas decades before being a lone star Republicans was cool. Before his death in 2005, Tobin Armstrong was a rancher, a conservationist and an influential figure in the National Cattleman Beef Association.
Vice President Cheney delivered a eulogy at his funeral. Anne Armstrong was a member of the board of Halliburton when Cheney was CEO. Their ties go back to the Ford administration when she was U.S. ambassador to Great Britain. Together, their hospitality became legendary as they cultivated the family ranch into a private getaway where they helped build a state Republican Party one relaxing weekend at a time.
SOWELL: They were certainly uniters. Of course, that's a politically charged phrase now a days. But they certainly were very good at bringing people together.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HARRIS: Well, friends of the Armstrongs call them the peacemakers within state Republican ranks, crediting them in part with building a party that now holds most statewide offices in Texas.
We want to get a better idea of what lies ahead for Harry Whittington. On the phone with us right now is our senior medical correspondent, Dr. Sanjay Gupta.
Sanjay, good to talk with you.
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN SR. MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Thanks, Tony.
HARRIS: I guess what I first want a little bit clarity on is this idea of a heart attack but a mild heart attack, but not really a heart attack that showed some of the classic signs.
Can you explain that to us?
GUPTA: A heart attack is actually a pretty vague term, Tony. What a heart attack typically means is that part of the heart muscle has died. You can't see that physically, so what you do typically is you measure certain things in the blood that happens, that are released into the blood when the heart muscle dies.
In this particular case, it doesn't sound like, you know, the heart muscle died because of lack of oxygen or something to the heart, which is a typical heart attack, but rather because there was some of this actual birdshot lodged in the heart.
HARRIS: Yes.
GUPTA: And that caused the same things to be released into the bloodstream that would be released if you had an actual heart attack. So to put it this way, Tony, it looks like a heart attack. In some ways it is very similar to a heart attack. But it's not in any way the type of heart attack where we think of where you sort of bring your hand to your chest and you're clutching with chest pain.
There was none of that, it sounds like. So it's different than what most people think of.
HARRIS: You know, Sanjay, help us understand some of the reporting on this, because initially it sounded like this was -- at least the -- well, the early reporting suggested that this was pretty benign as events of this kind go, that the wounds were superficial. And then today, in the last hour, we get this report that there was this mild heart attack, and it sounds like there is a piece of this birdshot pellet that is lodged somewhere near the heart and irritating the heart itself. GUPTA: Yes, you know, I felt the same way you did, Tony. The story does seem to have progressed a little bit here. Although, you know, when an injury like this takes place, you do worry about all these tiny pellets.
You have probably seen it now from Rick Sanchez's piece, all these tiny pellets sort of in the skin, in the muscle itself. Some of that pellet -- some of those pellets can actually get close to the heart.
The hope is that they just never move and eventually the body just sort of scars around it and it never becomes an issue. But in the first few days after an injury, the pellets can move a bit, migrate, or whatever you want to call it. And in this case, they moved just to the point where they're actually touching the heart and causing the irritation of the heart.
The heart doesn't like to be touched by anything. If you so much as put your finger on a beating heart, Tony, it's going to react quite violently to that. It doesn't like that. Even a small piece of birdshot in this case can cause those same sorts of reactions.
You know, the other thing to keep in mind I guess maybe goes without saying. This is -- you know, this gentleman is almost 80 years old.
HARRIS: Yes.
GUPTA: And I think that any time you have any kind of injury, you have to put age into the consideration of how someone is going to do. I don't know if he's had some underlying heart disease on top of this.
HARRIS: No, the suggestion is no, that's he's got a -- he's got a strong heart.
GUPTA: Yes. And that's great. You know, he's had the angiogram and all that. So I think that's very good. And that bodes well that he's had this test, showing that his -- that his vessels to his heart are open.
It bodes well in terms of how he should ultimately do.
HARRIS: OK. Well, that's what I want to get to right now, Sanjay. Give me a sense of what we're looking to as we move forward here.
We still have this pellet that has moved to the extent that it's cause this irritation and this mild heart attack. It's still there. Could it continue to move?
GUPTA: Well, what they have to do -- it could, to answer your question flat out. But what they have to do, the doctors have to do now that he's in the intensive care unit is make sure that his heart stays stable. That might mean giving him some medications so he doesn't have any irregular heartbeats, giving him some medication so he doesn't have some of the manifestations of a heart attack. You know, low blood pressure, changing heart rate, things like that.
HARRIS: Right.
GUPTA: All that can be controlled now that he has a diagnosis.
I very much doubt -- and, you know, I don't think I'm going to be wrong here. But I very much doubt that they are going to go in and try and take out the pellet.
That is a very invasive procedure. And, you know, unless there was some absolute reason to do it, and it was a very dire situation, I doubt they would do that.
It sounds like they will be able to stabilize him fairly easily -- Tony.
HARRIS: OK. Good stuff.
Senior Medical Correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta on the phone with us.
Sanjay, good to talk to you, as always. Thanks for the information -- Betty.
NGUYEN: Good information there, too, Tony.
Well, ashes to ashes, soot to soot, from one burned church to another. The leads seem to be few and far between. Coming up on LIVE FROM, we will join investigators in Alabama as they try to keep yet another church from going up in flames.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
NGUYEN: They have a profile. They just don't have the perpetrators. Still no arrests in the arson fires at 10 Alabama churches this month even though the reward money has gone up to nearly $100,000.
Now, police believe two men in their 20s or 30s are behind the crimes. They are also getting reports of a dark SUV being spotted outside some of the burned churches. But they are being cautious, saying they don't want to make the same mistake Washington police made during the 2002 sniper shootings.
Back then, everyone was looking for a white van. It turns out the snipers were driving a blue Chevy sedan.
Meanwhile, police in eastern Alabama are calling it a copycat case. They have arrested a man for allegedly setting fire to an abandoned church in White Plains last night. Police believe the suspect is mentally unstable and that he set the fire after watching a string of church arsons on the news. They also say the man wanted to see his brother, who is a volunteer firefighter, in action.
HARRIS: Charred wood, burned crosses, piles of ash and soot, not the ideal evidence in a criminal probe. But that's what investigators in Alabama are facing as they desperately try to solve a rash of church fires.
Our Rusty Dornin joined them.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RUSTY DORNIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Ten fire at 10 churches, a mountain of evidence left in some, bits in others, each one telling a different story. By the time firefighters got to the Morning Star Baptist Church in Boligee, Alabama, there was nothing really left to save. When there's only soot and ash, the arson dogs can prove invaluable.
The same night the Morning Star Church was destroyed, so was the Galilee Baptist Church about 30 miles away. Ricky Farley trains law enforcement dogs to sniff out arson evidence. He came with us to Galilee.
(on camera): When you bring the dogs into a church like this that is completely burned to the ground, what -- what are they looking for?
RICKY FARLEY, ARSON DOG TRAINER: Just any minor traces of accelerant that may not have burned during the fire. You know, a dog can detect one-fifth of a needle drop of accelerant. So these flags could represent where a dog may have indicated that the arson investigators may have saw something that they marked.
DORNIN (voice over): Galilee mystified investigators because it was so remote, only one way in and one way out. No easy getaways here. That was another reason to believe the arsonists are locals, well acquainted with the back roads.
In the wee hours the same night Morning Star and Galilee burned, a fire started at the Dancy Baptist Church about 10 miles away.
(on camera): Investigators believe this is a footprint of one of the arsonists, that they kicked open to the church which triggered the alarm and saved this church from burning to the ground.
(voice over): It also allowed investigators to find a lot of evidence intact.
REV. WALTER HAWKINS, DANCY CHURCH: I believe it started from the pulpit area which is right here.
DORNIN: Reverend Walter Hawkins knows more than many of the pastors about what happened at his church.
(on camera): Have they told you anything about how this started?
HAWKINS: No more than it just started from the pulpit area. There was a communion table that was along the back of the chairs which is no longer available, so we don't know.
DORNIN: If that's the way it started.
HAWKINS: Right, exactly.
DORNIN (voice over): But one of the most intriguing clues came after the arsonists lit the blaze. Investigators believe they tried to escape out the front door.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Apparently, they came out this way, tried to push on the door, but it wouldn't open because it was a deadbolt, and they couldn't get out. So they apparently had to go out the other door where the other hand print was.
DORNIN: Two hand prints cut out by ATF investigators not just physical evidence. Authorities used the incident in appealing to the arsonists to contact them, telling the suspects they understood things must have become very frightening for them inside the church that morning.
JIM CAVANAUGH, ATF INVESTIGATOR: We think they might have been caught in there, probably slow to get out. I think it might have got a little smoky on them, a little hot. You know, some evidence in there that maybe a door stuck and maybe they were in there longer than they thought.
These things can flip on you. They could be trapped and killed.
DORNIN: Investigators say they are looking for two men in their 20s or 30s, strong enough to kick down a door, agile enough to escape a raging fire. Authorities admit it's a struggle to decide which clues to release to the public and which ones they need to keep close to the vest as they try and solve this puzzle and stop these crimes before someone gets hurt.
Rusty Dornin, CNN, Dancy, Alabama.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HARRIS: So, how exactly are the arsonists sparking the flames? Well, police don't think they are lugging around big cans of gasoline or other fire starters. Instead, it's believed they are using materials already inside the churches.
NGUYEN: Tony, Mardi Gras is just two weeks away. Will New Orleans be ready to handle the crowds? Something that happened today offers some hope. We are going to find out about it when LIVE FROM continues right here on CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
NGUYEN: All right. Developments in this hunting accident involving Vice President Dick Cheney just keep changing today. Now we are learning that White House spokesman Scott McClellan learned about Harry Whittington's condition, this mild heart attack, before noon today when he held a press conference, yet he didn't talk about it. Let's go to CNN's Suzanne Malveaux at the White House to clear all this up.
Are you hearing the same, Suzanne?
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Betty, I just talked to White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan. And he explains it this way. He says that, yes, he was notified just before the briefing about this, that the reason he didn't bring up the condition of Whittington at the time is he felt it was not his place, he said, that it was up to Whittington's doctors to actually give that news in that press conference that we heard a little bit earlier.
He also confirmed that, yes, there are consultations going on between the White House physicians, the team here, the president's doctor, Dr. Tubb, and cardiologists that are treating Mr. Whittington. This is all a courtesy. It is advisory consultations. He is not actually treating him, but they are in those discussions. Those discussions happened earlier this morning.
I should note the timing of this, of course, because I think it kind of explains how the White House is dealing with this episode here and really trying to deal with striking the appropriate tone.
This is coming after an evening of a lot of the talk show hosts, the comedians making a lot of jokes about this. There was a certain sense of levity that some people wanted to express at the White House as well.
In the initial briefing, the gaggle off camera, Scott McClellan was wearing an orange tie, like many are wearing an orange tie here because the NCAA champs the Texas Longhorns were visiting with the president. That is their school color. He made a little joke saying that it wasn't because of the Texas Longhorns, but he was concerned Cheney would be here.
That, of course, being a joke among hunters. They all wear that kind of orange color to alert each other in case they are in the line of fire.
That is something -- it was a light exchange that happened earlier in the morning. And then he was asked about that later at the briefing. Very much a different tone, and that is because he had additional information that things perhaps were not working as well for Mr. Whittington as they had believed early in the morning.
That is one of the reasons why we heard McClellan say at that briefing, simply very straight faced, no jokes about it, "We wish him well in his recovery. Our prayers are with him" -- Betty.
NGUYEN: Suzanne, this is kind of like a deja vu because we heard when this news first broke about the hunting accident -- we didn't learn it from the White House or Vice President Dick Cheney and his office. In fact, we learned it from a Cheney friend, Katharine Armstrong, who talked to the local media down there in Corpus Christi.
Why is the White House, why is Dick Cheney's office being so tight-lipped?
MALVEAUX: Well, dick Cheney's office is different than the White House press office. You have to, first of all, understand that distinction. The White House press office, even Scott McClellan saying that perhaps he would have handled this a bit differently.
The White House -- Cheney's office, rather, they feel that it was adequate to go ahead and issue a statement through his spokeswoman, Lee Ann McBride (ph), who I've been on the phone with as well. They felt that this was a private event that happened at the ranch owner's property, that that first evening when this whole incident happened, they were focusing on at least what kind of medical state Mr. Whittington was in at that time, and that it wasn't the morning until after -- after this accident happened that they even had a discussion about, OK, this is going to get out, how are we going to present this? And that the vice president deferred to Armstrong, his host, to do that.
That is something that he chose to do. It's his prerogative. There have been a lot of discussions about whether or not that was actually appropriate or whether or not they would do it that way again -- Betty.
NGUYEN: Leading to a lot of questions.
CNN's Suzanne Malveaux at the White House.
Thank you for that, Suzanne -- Tony.
HARRIS: OK, Betty.
In the meantime, let's get a little more analysis on the condition of Harry Whittington. After all, he is the man in the hospital in Corpus Christi, Texas, trying to recover after being shot by the vice president.
Dr. Laurence Sperling is an Emory University cardiologist. He's the director of Emory -- Emory's Heart Disease Prevention Program.
And Dr. Sperling, thanks for taking the time to talk to us.
DR. LAURENCE SPERLING, CARDIOLOGIST, EMORY HEALTHCARE: You're very welcome.
HARRIS: Well, I'm a little -- yesterday we were thinking this was pretty much a benign episode, that this was a situation where the wounds were superficial. About an hour ago we learned that the condition is a bit different, and we learned of a mild heart attack.
What are you making of this progress report?
SPERLING: I would say medically this is very concerning. Whenever there is birdshot or buckshot in the heart itself, there certainly is the propensity to have bad things happen. And it sounds like there have been arhythmias related to inflammation. Whether the birdshot is lodged in the heart muscle or the sack around the heart muscle, it is unclear from the information I have available.
HARRIS: Right.
SPERLING: I don't think there's been a heart attack in the traditional sense, but it sounds like they are going through a thorough evaluation, trying to figure out exactly what is going on with this gentleman.
HARRIS: So you just mentioned medically concerning. So even now, if we think back on the conversation that was held outside of the hospital about an hour or so ago, the sense was that he was doing fine and that he was talking about leaving the hospital, but that the doctors were essentially putting the brakes on this and suggesting that Harry should wait and stay in the hospital for observation.
So are we getting, in your estimation, a true sense of his condition?
SPERLING: It sounds like, at least as of this moment, we found out that there is foreign body within the heart. This is never a benign condition. This is something that needs to be watched very closely. It depends whether or not that foreign body or birdshot is lodged in the heart itself or is even mobile and can move through the blood vessels.
HARRIS: Right.
OK. Doctor, stand by for a second. Let me get your reaction to this.
Just about an hour ago, this is Peter Banko. He's the hospital administrator assessing Mr. Whittington's condition.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETER BANKO, CHRISTUS SPOHN MEMORIAL HOSPITAL: He's not had a heart attack in the traditional sense. As we've said before, he was asymptomatic.
So, when -- you normally think of heart attack as crushing chest pain, shoulder pain, not able to bear it. He had none of those symptoms. Dr. Blanchard can talk a little bit more about -- heart attack is a layman's term.
BLANCHARD: What we're talking about here basically is a silent heart attack or an asymptomatic heart attack. Had we not had the cardiologists and the cardiovascular team actually probing, looking into this particular issue, it probably would have never been picked up in the long run. So this is not the heart attack that we think that is due to a blockage, that the person is going to collapse and have an arrest. Not that type at all. What we're talking about is relative eschema (ph) to a certain area of the heart, due to an inflammatory response to a metallic foreign B.B. And that's the type.
Bear in mind, Mr. Whittington was asymptomatic at all times, even this morning, when this irregular heart rhythm was picked. But we felt clearly in his best interest to pursue it much more aggressively by taking him to the cardiac CAF (ph) lab.
HARRIS: All right, Dr. Sperling, sort of square what you just heard what you just said to us a couple of moments ago, that this condition, this situation, is medically concerning to you. I know I keep coming back to that.
SPERLING: Yes, I would say just from the information we just heard a moment ago, it sounds like there's some damage to the heart itself, possibly minor, related to these foreign bodies or B.B.s, possibly lodged in the heart muscle or the sack around the heart.
It doesn't sound like there's been a traditional heart attack, the way we think blood clot forming in the arteries, causing somebody to go on and be at major risk. But whenever there is something lodged in the heart itself, this is never a trivial condition. This man needs to be monitored very closely from a medical standpoint.
HARRIS: OK, good. Let me pick that up right there. If you were treating Harry Whittington today, what would you be looking for? What test would you be running? How would you be treating him? What's the protocol?
SPERLING: Right now, he should be monitored in terms of his heart rhythm. It sounds like he's already had a rhythm disturbance called atrial fibrillation. He should be monitored in terms of his blood pressure, his heart rate, his clinical condition.
And then in terms of special tests, it will depend upon some of the other information they have determined from their heart catheterization. They might have an echocardiogram or ultrasound. There are a lot of fancy, high technology tests that can be done to assess the heart itself, and I would have to say I wouldn't want to comment unless I was involved in the case directly.
HARRIS: What about this pellet? Is there a chance that it could still move?
SPERLING: I would say that if the pellet itself is not lodged directly in the heart muscle, yes, there's a chance it could move and travel within the bloodstream. And this would be one of the reasons he would need to be monitored closely.
HARRIS: Dr. Sperling, cardiologist at Emory's, director of Emory's Heart Disease Prevention Program. Dr. Sperling, thanks for taking the time. Thanks for the information.
SPERLING: You're welcome.
HARRIS: We continue to follow the twists and turns in this story. The news keeps coming. We'll keep bringing it to you. More LIVE FROM next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
NGUYEN: Well, the White House promises to cooperate as Congress investigates the government's response to Hurricane Katrina. Nearly six months after the storm, sharply critical reports about Katrina spending are adding new heat to the controversy.
CNN congressional correspondent Joe Johns has those details.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOE JOHNS, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It looks like a classic example of waste, fraud and abuse. Waste: $850 million dollars paid for mobile and manufactured homes the government can't use and may have to sell.
RICHARD SKINNER, DHS INSPECTOR GENERAL: But we may have types of housing, like manufactured homes and modular homes, that we'll not be able to use. Instead, we maybe need to go out and buy more trailers.
JOHNS: Fraud. Cash payments to people with bogus Social Security numbers and non-existent addresses. One hundred twenty-two thousand dollars went to people who claim they lived here at this vacant lot. There were also double payments in the program intended to get quick cash to people in need. Nine hundred thousand of 2.5 million applications for the quick cash assistance were flagged as possible duplicates.
And abuse. People using debit cards issued for Katrina evacuees to pay for things that had nothing to do with emergency relief. Instead, some used those debit cards for tattoos, traffic tickets, bail bonds, even $400 to a massage parlor in Dallas that had been busted for prostitution. The eye-opening report from the Government Accountability Office and the inspector general of the Department of Homeland Security unveiled for a Senate committee.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you swear that the testimony you are about to give...
JOHNS: And then there's the case of the military MREs, Meals Ready to Eat, appearing on the Internet. The GAO looked into reports that MREs intended to quickly feed hurricane victims were being sold on eBay. Investigators found two cases where hurricane victims said they sold them because they needed the money. The GAO also found a police officer, a marine, as well as Air Force and National Guard personnel, selling MREs online. There's no law against reselling MREs unless you steal them in the first place.
So what can be done if the goal is keeping them honest? The chairman of the Senate Finance Committee wants to take a page from corporate America and name a chief financial officer.
SEN. CHARLES GRASSLEY (R), FINANCE CHAIRMAN: There was no excuse for, in the first place, not having a procedure in place for the massive expenditures of money that was spent.
JOHNS: The notion that taxpayers are also victims of Hurricane Katrina because the government hasn't controlled the money comes as no surprise to Senate and House investigators.
A draft report of mainly Republican House investigators calls the entire government response a "national failure," adding that, "in this cautionary tale, all the little pigs built houses out of straw." That's right, that harsh description from Republicans about this federal government.
For Republicans and Democrats alike, the more they hear, the worse it gets.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are we prepared were it to happen again?
SEN. JOSEPH LIEBERMAN (D), HOMELAND SECURITY COMMITTEE: I think we are better prepared, because of the powerful lessons and embarrassment that the federal government suffered. Are we totally prepared? Are we as prepared as we should be? I regret to say the answer is no, and I don't want to have to say that much longer.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thanks, Senator.
LIEBERMAN: Appreciate it.
JOHNS: The message from the GAO and the Congress, fix it fast and the next time there's a national disaster, a financial disaster better not follow.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
NGUYEN: Yes, that's an eye opener. That report from CNN's Joe Johns first aired on CNN's "ANDERSON COOPER 360."
HARRIS: Well, another milestone today along New Orleans long road to recovery. With Mardi Gras just two weeks away, Tulane University Hospital reopened its downtown emergency room along with 63 beds, five operating rooms, four cardio laboratories and the pharmacy.
Jim Montgomery is chief operating officer of Tulane University Hospital and Clinic. He joins us from the CNN Gulf Coast bureau in New Orleans.
Jim, good to talk to you. I have to tell you, I watched a little bit of the ceremony today, and it felt like a big deal. I want to show you a bit of tape and have the audience take a look at this. This is of a chopper coming in as part of the ceremony today. Explain the significance of this particular moment that we're watching.
JIM MONTGOMERY, COO, TULANE UNIVERSITY HOSPITAL & CLINIC: The significance of the moment was it was a return to the rooftop where all of our employees and staff and most of all of our patients departed from. We thought it would be a fitting beginning to bring back some of the helicopter pilots and people that were instrumental in our departure back to the hospital. And that's where we did it.
HARRIS: Hey, Jim, how big a deal is this in terms of accomplishments? Where does this rank?
MONTGOMERY: In terms of, I think, Tulane, it ranks right at the very top, in terms of the effort that it's taken to manage this affair, not only since the storm, in terms of bringing the hospital back. There's no playbook about how to do this. HARRIS: Yes. The first Mardi Gras parade, I guess, is Friday. But big events coming in the weeks ahead. How ready is the hospital?
MONTGOMERY: We feel like we're very ready. Our emergency room is fully staffed. Our physicians are back. Our staff is back. We'll have our -- we'll have a downsized facility overall in terms of the total beds available, but we believe it's manageable from where we stand now.
HARRIS: From the practice side, it sounds like you are in pretty decent shape. How about the research side of the hospital, where do you stand?
MONTGOMERY: From the research side of the hospital, we're involved with physicians with different clinical studies. Most of the bench research, obviously, occurs at the medical school and in their research facilities, but that is a function of what we do, and we'll be involved with it.
HARRIS: Take us back to those nightmare days. At what point did you know that your facility was facing some serious damage from flooding?
MONTGOMERY: That would have been early on Tuesday morning, August 30th, when we first discovered that the waters were rising in the streets surrounding us, and about 3:00 that morning we made a decision to evacuate our most critical patients, and subsequent to that evacuated the entire hospital.
HARRIS: What was the most difficult moment, sort of maybe the emotional arc of those days for you and your staff?
MONTGOMERY: I think that just a three day ordeal of moving patients very -- some of them very critically ill, certainly was quite an ordeal. I think once we secured our patients and we were able to transfer them to available hospitals in the area, then the heat was off relative to the responsibilities we had as an organization. Then our next responsibility was to our families and our employees and our physicians who were there with us.
HARRIS: Yes, in terms of dollars and cents, how much damage did the hospital sustain, and as a private institution, what do you do? Do you tap into the endowment? How do you begin to find the funds necessary to rebuild?
MONTGOMERY: We are actually a joint venture between HCA and Tulane University, so our damages are about $90 million from a property and casualty loss. That includes equipment. That includes rebuilding the first floor, primarily, and a few other large pieces of equipment. And we're fully insured with respect to that. So our funding is coming from insurance proceeds.
HARRIS: Got you. Is Charity gone? I mean, this is significant from this standpoint is that you are the only -- I guess the only hospital downtown that will be open during Mardi Gras. Is Charity essentially gone? MONTGOMERY: Charity right now is not open. There is a small facility called a cache (ph) facility that's still available to us. They plan to open their trauma center in the next month, and they are looking to open one of their two hospitals that they had opened, and I think that's supposedly by -- hopefully by this summer.
HARRIS: Jim, congratulations. It really did feel like a big deal today as I was watching the ceremonies. We are glad you are there. We really are.
MONTGOMERY: Thank you. We feel very good about it.
HARRIS: Thank you.
NGUYEN: Well, Tony, romance is in the air this Valentine's Day. In fact, they are handing out roses in the news room. You should pick up one for your wife. We won't tell her where you got it.
Here's a question for you. Is there something more behind the feelings of love? Is there a scientific explanation for all the goo goo eyes? We are going to talk about it with this guy.
Recognize him in that suit? You may not. That's Bill Nye the Science Guy. Yes, you've never seen him like that before, have you? No bow tie there. He's going to prove that love will make you do strange things. There he is with his lovely new bride. They are both going to join us straight ahead.
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NGUYEN: There are new developments in that hunting accident involving Vice President Dick Cheney and 78-year-old Harry Whittington, who was injured in that shooting.
Let's go now to CNN's Suzanne Malveaux at the White House. What have you learned, Suzanne?
MALVEAUX: Well, Betty, we just got a statement from the vice president's office here just being released. This is the first acknowledgment even of this accident from the vice president's office in an official capacity. I'm just going to read it to you here.
It says "the vice president was told when he arrived at the White House this morning that doctors had decided, based on overnight monitoring, to perform a cardiac catheterization on Mr. Whittington.
"The vice president's chief of staff passed him a note at about 12:30 Eastern time to inform him that Mr. Whittington's doctors would brief in Texas at about 1:00 Eastern on complications in Mr. Whittington's condition.
"The vice president was on Capitol Hill when he received this information. When the vice president returned to the White House, he was able to watch part of the press conference.
"At about 1:30 the vice president called Mr. Whittington and spoke to him. The vice president wished Mr. Whittington well and asked if there was anything that he needed. The vice president said that he stood ready to assist.
"Mr. Whittington's spirits were good, but obviously his situation deserves the careful monitoring that his doctors are providing. The vice president said that his thoughts and prayers are with Mr. Whittington and his family." This coming from the vice president's office -- Betty.
NGUYEN: And the first time that we have heard from his office since the accident over the weekend. CNN's Suzanne Malveaux will be following this. Thank you -- Tony.
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HARRIS: What is that, like Andre 5,000 or something? What is going on in Control B? Wacky, wacky. All right. It's a time for romance, love, and popping the question.
Many couples will get engaged this Valentine's Day, and chances are they, like many lovers heading for the alter, have taken their time before deciding to say I do. It is "The State of Love in America."
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think marriage is sacred, lovely, beautiful. It's a beautiful thing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm looking to be complete. You know, right now I'm half. I'm looking for my other half.
HARRIS (voice-over): Young love can certainly be romantic, but mature love is what's hot these days. Couples are getting married later in life.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We got engaged in South Carolina.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In Charleston.
HARRIS: Colette and Klaus took the plunge when they were a mature 32 years old.
COLETTE TETREAULT, MARRIED AT 32: I have always been somebody who wanted to know that I could stand on my own two feet before I made a life with somebody.
HARRIS: Since 1970 the age of first marriage in the U.S. has jumped from 21 to 25 for women, and 23 to 27 for men.
ELISABETH BURGESS, ASSOC. PROF. OF SOCIOLOGY, GSU: People are thinking marriage is something I will do when I grow up, and that age of when I grow up keeps moving up.
HARRIS: Now, four years later, Colette and Klaus have two children. TETREAULT: Here comes the baby, Sebastian. Here she comes.
After we got married, and I knew we wanted to have kids right away. And I think it had been about six months, and I said, well, you know, my eggs are coming down the tubes in wheelchairs. I don't know if they're going to make it.
HARRIS: But in her 20s she was climbing the pyramids in Guatemala and caving and snorkeling in Belize.
TETREAULT: I was kind of a nut. I was traveling. I wasn't ready for kids and dogs and cats and settling down. When I had gotten through all that and experienced pretty much most of what I wanted to, you know, I was ready.
HARRIS: She completed a graduate degree in nursing at Georgetown University in D.C. Today she's a nurse midwife.
Sociologist Dr. Elizabeth Burgess says Colette is typical of many women today. They have a lot to accomplish in their 20s.
ELISABETH BURGESS, ASSOC. PROF. OF SOCIOLOGY, GSU: Nowadays a larger percentage of women who are in the workforce, larger percentage of women who get Bachelor's Degrees who go on to graduate work, who go on to professional schools, become doctors and lawyers and dentists.
HARRIS: A CDC report shows that after ten years of marriage, younger brides are twice as likely to divorce or separate than older brides, 48 percent versus 24 percent. Marriage therapist Michael Chafin says older couples are usually better working through conflict.
MICHAEL CHAFIN, MARRIAGE AND FAMILY THERAPIST: The older you get, the more you realize how much you don't know. And the more you realize how much you don't know, then the more accepting you are of other people's differences.
HARRIS: Klaus says he's definitely reaping the benefits of maturity in his marriage.
KLAUS PLANTON, MARRIED AT 32: I probably wasn't quite ready for marriage at 25, so I had a little probably wilder time when I was single, in the 20s or mid 20s, I was still not there yet.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HARRIS: And my next guest is a man who wasn't there yet in his 20s, 30s, or 40s. Bill Nye, The Science Guy, is a newlywed at 50. He fell in love by reading the book then meeting the author. The chemistry was great. The couple married this month. Bill and Blair Nye join us from Los Angeles to talk about the science of love. Good to talk to you both.
Wow, Bill, you hit the Lottery. She's wonderful.
BILL NYE, 'THE SCIENCE GUY': Check me out, dude. The thing is she's so smart. That's what I'm telling you. I'm attracted to her because she is brilliant.
HARRIS: That explains why you were attracted to her. But Blair, look at him, he's Bill Nye, the Science Guy for goodness sake. He wears the funny bow ties. He's smart as could be. Why did you choose him? You had a choice.
BLAIR NYE, WIFE OF 'THE SCIENCE GUY': The bow tie is adorable. He is a wonderful romantic guy and everything I always dreamed of. He's just very thoughtful. He is very smart. He's very organized, great athlete. We have all kinds of interests in common, and it just seemed the thing to do, so we got married.
HARRIS: Bill, where were you in your life? We mentioned you are 50 years old getting married for the first time. Where were you in your life and why did, outside of a great woman next to you, why did this feel like the right time?
BILL NYE: Well, I guess I had a mid life crisis, I guess, that is to say if you live to be 100. I don't know, I guess I never met anybody that would sit and listen to my thoughtful thoughts before. That can't be right. I never was ready to engage with someone. I guess that would be a pun.
You guys wanted to talk about evolution. I think this is a fantastic example where what you feel is a result of these millennia of developing humans. She had all the qualities that appeal to me. I found her irresistible.
HARRIS: I have to tell you, Blair, I haven't read your book yet. I understand it is a terrific read. I'm sort of asking sort of the same question of you. Where were you kind of in your life because as your book lays out, you have lived quite an extraordinary life.
BLAIR NYE: It's not as racy as you might think.
HARRIS: Let's look at the cover of the book.
BILL NYE: The cover is great.
HARRIS: The cover is great.
BLAIR NYE: It's a spoof on Rousseau's the painting, "The Dream" with me as the central character, but I was a professional musician, an oboe player my entire life. I was in New York. I just felt like I had done everything I could do as an oboe player. I do love music. I wanted to do other things.
I got a journalism degree and started writing some pieces for "The New York Times" and decided to move to L.A. to pursue other kinds of writing. I arrived in L.A. on September 8th. Met this guy on September 10th. Here we are.
HARRIS: Do you agree with Bill's assessment that part of this assessment is evolution of human beings, we get to this stage, it is right, we find the person, we make the connection. BILL NYE: Can I just interrupt? It is not just evolution. Evolution is the fundamental idea. It is the greatest thing in biology. So it is the power of evolution that brought us together.
HARRIS: Bill, there also needs to be chemistry; correct?
BILL NYE: It is one thing is what I'm saying.
HARRIS: Is it true that it was through the book, through the writing, that you first became attracted to her and had to meet her?
BILL NYE: Yes, the writing I thought was so compelling, and her story has this poignancy that just really appealed to me. Now, can you imagine, can you imagine quitting your day job, or in this case your all night six days a week job, and going back to college? I mean with all due respect it sounds really hard.
The people that I know that I've met Blair through, led to her book through, were professional classical musicians who went to law school at the age of 39. That sounds to me really challenging. She is very brave. That really appeals to me.
HARRIS: Congratulations to you both and many years of happy blissful married life together, and thanks for taking the time to be with us on this Valentine's Day.
BILL NYE: Happy Valentine's Day.
HARRIS: To you too as well. LIVE FROM has that loving feeling and the news you need all afternoon. Stay with us. We'll be right back.
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