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Judge in Zacarias Moussaoui Trial to Allow Substitute Security Witnesses; Pickup Truck Crashes Into New Mexico Medical Center
Aired March 17, 2006 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: It's the top of the hour.
Straight to Fredricka Whitfield in the newsroom on that -- more on that Santa Fe crash we were talking about last hour -- Fred.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Hello again, Kyra.
This out in Santa Fe, New Mexico, where a vehicle crashed into a medical center. Well, now, we are learning a pickup truck crashed into that Concentra Medical Center there in Santa Fe. And three people, reportedly, have died.
We know that many others have been transferred to neighboring hospitals. The reason why is because this medical center is one that treats primarily people who have injuries from workers comp -- comp -- work-related injuries. And that's why this medical center is not one of the facilities where these people injured in this accident would be treated. All of them have been taken to other facilities nearby.
But, again, three people have died from this accident. We don't know why this -- this pickup crashed into this medical center. But, of course, when we get that kind of information, we will be able to pass that on to you -- Kyra.
PHILLIPS: All right, Fredricka Whitfield, thank you so much.
Now we are talking about Operation Swarmer, more lukewarm than red hot, but successful so far, from what we are told and from what we have seen in reports from our embed correspondent, Nic Robertson. Weapons stockpiles have been seized, and -- have dozens of suspected insurgents, with no coalition forces wounded, killed or missing.
Nic is the only TV reporter embedded with the coalition.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: What we have seen, what we have been shown is Iraqi troops and U.S. troops working side by side.
We have seen helicopters resupplying troops, taking more troops into the field.
We have been able to see the slow, painstaking work of looking for the weapons caches. Six caches so far, we have been told, have been discovered. What we saw as we flew past some of these ongoing operations, we could see the soldiers fanned out, walking through the fields, a very thorough search of fields, of sand berms, looking for weapons caches, we have been told, AK-47s, explosive, parts of improvised explosive devices, bomb-making equipment has been found in some of these weapons caches.
We have also been told that -- that there are about 50 people detained. We have been told, as well, during this operation, there's still elements of the operation going on here. Up on the top of the hill here, we saw an Iraqi soldier looking out with binoculars. When he was looking out with the binoculars, he spotted a vehicle going across the horizon. Then he called through his interpreter.
He said: Tell the Americans, get a helicopter over there. Get them to look at that vehicle. We think it's -- we think he's trying to get away from this particular area.
That's the -- the way we have seen the operations being conducted here: 1,500 troops, 800 Iraqis, 70 -- 700 U.S. troops in -- involved. There's no information at all about high-value targets here, although there is some specific information perhaps linking in the -- linking in the people responsible for blowing up the holy shrine in Samarra a few weeks ago that precipitated much of the sectarian violence.
We have been told that the perpetrators of that attack lived in this area, although the planning for this operation, Operation Swarmer, we're told, began before -- before that attack on the shrine in Samarra.
They tell us that they hope that this is a warning for the insurgents, so that they can now see the Iraqi security forces can move, with U.S. support, in fast-moving and large operations.
Nic Robertson, north of Samarra, Iraq.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIPS: Now, the question came up before the war started. And, three years later, there is still no answer. How long will American troops have to be in Iraq?
CNN's Tom Foreman takes a hard look.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): From the start of the Iraq war, the question has been debated: How many Americans will have to fight there, and for how long? One assessment came before the first shot was fired from the then-Army chief of staff.
SEN. CARL LEVIN (D), MICHIGAN: General Shinseki, could you give us some idea as to the magnitude of the Army's force requirement for an occupation of Iraq?
GENERAL ERIC SHINSEKI, FORMER ARMY CHIEF OF STAFF: Something on the order of several hundred thousand soldiers are -- are -- are probably, you know, a figure that would be required.
FOREMAN: That comment was widely criticized as overly cautious, overly pessimistic, especially after the invasion force of 165,000 coalition troops took Baghdad in a few weeks.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Major combat operations in Iraq have ended. In the battle of Iraq, the United States and our allies have prevailed.
FOREMAN: But, a few months later, the insurgency took off, fueled by longstanding ethnic differences, just as General Shinseki predicted. And, ever since, hopes for bringing significant numbers of American troops home have risen, only to fall.
Saddam Hussein was captured; American troops stayed the same. The interim Iraqi government took over; American troops stayed. A Constitution was written. Full elections were held. Tens of thousands of Iraqis were trained as soldiers and police officers. And each development brought calls for more American troops coming home.
REP. JOHN MURTHA (D), PENNSYLVANIA: Our military has done everything that has been asked of them. The U.S. cannot accomplish anything further in Iraq militarily. It's time to bring the troops home.
FOREMAN: But the military, while talking vaguely of troop reductions now and then, has consistently kept around 130,000 to 150,000 fighting men and women in Iraq.
(on camera): Various military strategists have said, announcing a date for a troop reduction would be foolish, letting insurgents mount an offensive at a critical moment.
(voice-over): Furthermore, historically, predicting how many troops are needed for any war has been tricky business. And this is war.
SCOTT MCCLELLAN, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: No one said that combat operations weren't ongoing. Those -- those operations continue.
FOREMAN: Nevertheless, nearly three years after combat started, that central question remains: How many American troops, for how long?
Tom Foreman, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIPS: All may not be lost for government prosecutor hoping to win a death penalty for Zacarias Moussaoui. As you heard in the last hour of LIVE FROM, the judge in that case has partially reversed her decision to bar evidence and testimony on aviation security.
That allows the government to call relevant witnesses, so long as they have had no contact with Carla Martin. Martin is the woman you see here. You will remember, she is the government attorney who was placed on leave, after briefing and coaching witnesses, in violation of the judge's rule.
For more on what these developments mean, let's talk to CNN legal correspondent Jeffrey Toobin once again on the phone.
Jeffrey, let's try and put it in perspective again.
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Kyra, what happened here was that the judge said because Carla Martin spoke to these witnesses who involved the FAA part of the case -- and what that means is, it's the part of the case where the government was going to prove, if Moussaoui had told the truth, the airlines would have stopped the 9/11 hijackers.
That's a big part of the case. All the evidence relating to that subject, she originally ruled off-limits. What she did today was, she modified that order. She said: I'm not going to rule the subject off-limits. I am just going to say the original witnesses who were going to testify on that subject can't testify, and, if you can get other witnesses to testify about it, you can call them.
PHILLIPS: Why do you think she changed her mind?
TOOBIN: Because I think her original proposal was just too draconian. It really punished the government too much. This is a very serious crime. Thousands of people died. Millions of dollars were spent in this investigation.
What Carla Martin did was clearly wrong, based on all the evidence that is available now, but to throw the entire case out because of her apparent misconduct involving a handful of witnesses just did seem like too much. It seemed like too much to me. And it apparently seemed like it was too much to her. So, the witnesses who were tampered with are no longer in the case, but the subject matter can be explored by the government. And that seems like a fair resolution to me.
PHILLIPS: Jeffrey Toobin, thanks a lot.
Straight ahead, you find the number, you make the call, and then this.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
COMPUTER VOICE: Please say or enter your account phone number now or say, "I don't know it."
(PHONE DIALING)
COMPUTER VOICE: Sorry. I didn't understand.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
(LAUGHTER) PHILLIPS: So, how do you talk to a real person? Press one to find out. Just kidding. We will have all the answers -- seriously -- coming up on LIVE FROM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIPS: Well, in that Santa Fe crash we have been talking about for the past hour-and-a-half, Fredricka Whitfield working more information in the newsroom -- Fred.
WHITFIELD: Right.
A pickup truck crashed into a medical center. Three people, reportedly, are dead. Several others have been taken to nearby facilities for medical treatment.
On the telephone with us, Deputy Police Chief of Santa Fe Police Eric Johnson.
Chief Johnson, what happened?
ERIC JOHNSON, SANTA FE POLICE DEPARTMENT DEPUTY POLICE CHIEF: Well, at 9:51 a.m., this morning, the Santa Fe Police Department responded to a report of a crash here at the Concentra Medical Center.
At the time of dispatch, it was reported that a vehicle had actually driven through the front of the building. Upon the arrival of the initial responding officers and rescue personnel, it was, in fact, determined that there was a vehicle inside the building.
At this time, we do have three confirmed fatalities on scene. And seven people have been transported to the local hospital here for treatment, one of the seven being the driver of the vehicle.
PHILLIPS: So, that driver of the vehicle is being treated with what kind of extent of injuries? Are you able to interview that person yet?
JOHNSON: At this point, the investigation is ongoing. We don't know what extent of injuries the seven people sustained. And all our efforts have been concentrated on the rescue efforts here at the scene. But, like I say....
WHITFIELD: Is there anything -- is there anything about the accident scene, or even that pickup truck, that is leading you to believe that perhaps this driver lost control, that something, perhaps medically, may have happened to this person, as to why that vehicle crashed into the building?
JOHNSON: Well, initial reports that we have from witnesses is that the vehicle appeared to be traveling at a fairly high rate of speed across the parking lot here at the shopping center when the crash occurred.
Like I said, we do not know if there was any type of medical condition involving the driver of the vehicle. All of that is still under investigation. This investigation here at the scene is expected to go on for several hours. So, up -- up until this point, all of our efforts have really been concentrated on -- on...
WHITFIELD: Yes.
JOHNSON: ... on the rescue efforts here at the scene, so...
WHITFIELD: So, the impact -- that pickup truck impacting the building, what is in that building or what is at the portion of impact, as to why so many people were injured?
JOHNSON: Well, the -- the vehicle, when it went through the front of the building, it went into the reception area. This is a medical center. It appears that it was the waiting area, people that were waiting to be seen or treated here.
And the building does have extensive damage. The truck actually went in probably about, oh, I am going to estimate 20 to 30 feet inside the building, right through the reception area.
It's believed that there were several people waiting in that area, and that was the reason for the cause of all the injuries and -- and the fatalities as well.
WHITFIELD: All right, a sad, terrible situation. Deputy Police Chief of Santa Fe Eric Johnson, thanks so much.
So, again, Kyra, you heard it from the deputy chief there -- three people confirmed dead, eight people injured, among them, the driver of that pickup truck. And, of course, when they are able to interview that person, perhaps, they will get a better idea as to why that truck crashed into that waiting room area, the entrance area of this Concentra Medical Center in Santa Fe.
PHILLIPS: Those pictures coming to us from our affiliate KOAT.
Fredricka Whitfield, thanks so much.
Straight ahead, press one if you want us to go to commercial. Press two if you want more news. Aren't you glad some things aren't automated?
(LAUGHTER)
PHILLIPS: Coming up, the man behind the "gethuman" campaign.
The news keeps coming. We will keep bringing it to you -- pushing all your buttons here on LIVE FROM.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GERRI WILLIS, CNN PERSONAL FINANCE EDITOR (voice-over): Lower your energy costs by weatherizing your home.
You can save as much as 15 percent on your utility bills by sealing up those drafty windows and doors. Materials like caulk and weather stripping can stop air leaks. And don't forget to insulate your home's exterior walls in areas like your garage, which are also common sources of energy loss.
Also, check out the Department of Energy's Web site for information about their weatherization assistance program. Now, this program is available to lower-income families.
(on camera): And, remember, caulk and weather stripping only cost about $50 for the average home, and you can save two to three times that in one heating season.
I'm Gerri Willis with your energy tip.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(MUSIC)
PHILLIPS: Wow. Otis (ph), that is old-school music right there.
Well, not all technological advances are improvements. You have probably seen this commercial.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, CITIBANK AD)
UNIDENTIFIED ACTRESS: For English, say yes.
UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED ACTRESS: For security purposes, say your pet's name.
UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Fluffy.
UNIDENTIFIED ACTRESS: Please say your pass word.
UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Big boy.
UNIDENTIFIED ACTRESS: Please repeat.
UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Big boy.
Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED ACTRESS: For a shinier credit card, say yes.
UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: No.
Yes.
I don't know.
UNIDENTIFIED ACTRESS: For customer service, say yes.
UNIDENTIFIED ACTRESS: Yes. UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: This is Ryan.
UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: Hello. I have a question about my statement. Yes, hello? Hello? Hello?
UNIDENTIFIED ACTRESS: Sometimes, you just want to get straight through.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: Can we all identify with that, or what? An automated voice says that our call is very important, but, somehow, we doubt that. We keep pushing the buttons, but, in the end, it's our buttons that are being pushed. Isn't there any way to talk to a real, live human being? Usually, there is, but finding it can be tricky.
And that's where Paul English can help. He is the founder of gethuman.com, a Web site dedicated to helping us outsmart automated phone systems. He joins us live from Boston.
So, Paul, how did you come up with this idea? Were you having a meltdown one day with some automated system?
PAUL ENGLISH, FOUNDER, GETHUMAN.COM: Yes.
Kyra, it really started with my local bank, who had been acquired about four different times. And I was trying to reach the guy who worked at my local branch that I have been dealing with for years. And it was just impossible for the new national bank to connect me to my local branch.
PHILLIPS: So, are there any companies out there where -- where we can actually call and immediately get a human?
ENGLISH: There are.
I mean, you -- you mentioned a moment ago the Citibank commercials. I think they clearly have latched on that this is a big issue for people. And they are promoting a card which has direct connect. There are many other companies as well that do have humans that directly answer the phone.
PHILLIPS: Can we actually go onto your Web site and find out what companies do have the humans and...
(LAUGHTER)
PHILLIPS: ... and the ones that don't?
ENGLISH: That's right. We actually are taking ratings now on the Web site. So, it's not only how long does it take to get the a human, but it's also, once a human answers, what's the quality of that service? Do they speak English? Are they helpful? Do they resolve your problem.
And, so, now that we are collecting ratings, we will be publishing a list of the best and worst companies in the U.S. for customer service.
PHILLIPS: All right. I have a question for you. And I know this might sound a little crazy, but we are going to attempt to do this live.
ENGLISH: All right.
PHILLIPS: If I -- I have an 800-number of a company that actually drives me nuts, because I can never get through, and I am always on hold forever.
So -- and, Robert, make sure you don't shoot this 800-number, OK, because then...
(LAUGHTER)
PHILLIPS: ... people will be able to identify the company.
So, I'm going to -- I am going to get it on the horn. And then I want you to tell me what to do to bypass all these various scenarios. OK?
ENGLISH: OK, Kyra.
PHILLIPS: So, get me there as quick as I can to a person.
ENGLISH: Sure.
PHILLIPS: And, once I get a person...
(LAUGHTER)
PHILLIPS: ... I am going to hang up, OK?
(LAUGHTER)
ENGLISH: All right.
PHILLIPS: OK. Here we go.
Let's hope I do this right.
ENGLISH: OK.
PHILLIPS: OK. I hit conference. Is it working? Let's try it again.
All right, guys, I am going to try it again, OK, because it's not working. Here we go.
OK. Hang in here with me. I'm going through the system from the very beginning. OK. Now I'm pressing -- I dialed the number. I am going to press hold. And now I am going to press conference. Here comes the number.
(LAUGHTER) PHILLIPS: I hit conference again, but I am hearing CNN.
Is it going to work?
Oh, bummer. Sorry, guys. We tried to do it live. Maybe we can do it.
I know it worked when we -- we did the test. So...
(LAUGHTER)
PHILLIPS: I think it takes me awhile to get hooked up on the beeper line. So, let's go to your Web site.
All right. Let's go through the tips, starting with -- you know, you say, OK, if you want to get to a human, here's the first thing you have got to do: interrupt.
What do you mean by interrupt?
ENGLISH: This is an easy one. And this one does work in many cases, but not all.
When they start reading to you the options of what you are supposed to do, don't even listen to the menu and just hit zero immediately. Sometimes, you will hear the operator say back to you: "Invalid option. Please try again." When you hear that, that's a good thing. It means you have confused the computer, and you should enter zero again, or whatever code, to confuse it. Eventually, the computer will get confused and, usually, it puts you right into queue for a human.
PHILLIPS: All right: talk.
ENGLISH: This is another one. Many of these systems are coded to recognize certain words, like representative or agent, or they also are coded to -- to -- if they don't understand you at all, so, if you mumble or yell an obscenity, I hate to say it, but it's true, sometimes, they then will connect you to a human, if they cannot understand you.
PHILLIPS: All right, third, just hold.
ENGLISH: Yes. This is a good one. Pretend you have an old rotary phone that doesn't have touch dial. In this case, they also will throw you -- connect to a human.
PHILLIPS: All right, account collections.
ENGLISH: Isn't it interesting that account collections, or sales, answers the phones pretty quickly? It's not always the case. But, many times, when you get someone in sales, if you say, I called the wrong extension, or can you connect me to someone in customer service, sometimes, they will put you right into the queue, so you don't have to go through all the -- the computer nonsense.
PHILLIPS: Toll call.
ENGLISH: This is a good one.
This is one we just discovered recently. If you look at your credit card on the back, there is often two numbers, the toll-free number to call, 1-800 whatever, and then there's a local number. Many times, they list the local number, in case you are calling from overseas, where toll-free doesn't work.
If you call your credit card and the 800-number has you -- tells you it's a 20-minute wait, hang up and call back the local number. And, many times, that's prioritized to get you direct into queue.
PHILLIPS: All right, Paul, I was multitasking. Here we go. I got them.
ENGLISH: All right.
PHILLIPS: OK. Here we go. For English, press one. So, I pressed one. Here we go. Oh, now they don't have us at the beeper line. We had all these technicians up here working it.
(LAUGHTER)
PHILLIPS: We tried conferencing it. Here we go. Let's see if it works now.
(LAUGHTER)
PHILLIPS: Is it going through?
ENGLISH: The complexities of live TV.
PHILLIPS: I know.
Can you hear it?
ENGLISH: I cannot.
PHILLIPS: Let's see if we got it. OK. Wait a minute. I have got you now. Now let's see if we have it.
COMPUTER VOICE: For quality...
PHILLIPS: Here we go.
(CROSSTALK)
COMPUTER VOICE: ... services, your call may be monitored or recorded.
ENGLISH: Oh, I hate that message.
PHILLIPS: OK. What do I do?
ENGLISH: OK. Hit zero. PHILLIPS: Hit zero. OK.
ENGLISH: And hit zero each time this one talks.
PHILLIPS: Even when I am -- I am like on hold with this company, keep pushing zero?
ENGLISH: Each time it talks for this company, hit zero.
(RINGING)
PHILLIPS: Uh-oh. I have a feeling we are going to get somebody.
Now it's just dialing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Dwight speaking. How may I help you?
(LAUGHTER)
PHILLIPS: Hey, Dwight. Got the wrong number. Thanks.
(LAUGHTER)
PHILLIPS: So, OK. We tried -- I must have pushed about six buttons until you came up. And then I pushed the zero while it was actually in the recording, and then it went to somebody. I pushed zero three times. So, that's the key.
ENGLISH: That's right. That's a good one.
It doesn't work with all companies.
(LAUGHTER)
ENGLISH: But, if that doesn't work, you can try one of the other tips, or look up the company in the database to see if they are listed with a special phone number or some other code.
PHILLIPS: And, finally, the last tip was actually press Spanish, instead of English, because, sometimes, that goes to somebody quicker?
ENGLISH: That's right. We get a lot of complaints, actually, from people who are upset that you have to press one for English.
But I will tell you one thing when you hear that menu. If the English line takes too long, if you press two for Spanish, the operators are all bilingual, and, many time, the bilingual operators have a shorter queue.
PHILLIPS: Www.gethuman.com.
Paul English, we tried it. We tested it. Thank, you know, it's live television. We gave it our best shot. I guess we did prove one thing. If you keep pressing zero, you finally do get a human.
ENGLISH: That's right. (LAUGHTER)
PHILLIPS: Thanks so much, Paul.
ENGLISH: All right. Sure. Thanks, Kyra. .
PHILLIPS: All right.
Well, when it comes to spending money, Congress just can't help itself. Lawmakers raised the roof on the national debt again. Up next, see how much you would have to dish out every day for the rest of your life to hit $1 trillion.
But, first, CNN's Jennifer Westhoven was another look at options for retirement in our "Life After Work" series.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JENNIFER WESTHOVEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Hanging from a kite 3,000 feet above a mountain might scare most people, but not Tosh Hopkins.
TOSH HOPKINS, HANG GLIDER: To me, it's very peaceful up there, just floating about with the birds. To some people, it is exhilarating, but, to me, it's peaceful.
WESTHOVEN: Tosh Hopkins and her husband, Bruce (ph), retired to Georgia's Lookout Mountain last year. There, the Hopkins found a community of hang gliders and a home right on the landing field that lets them fly as often as they want. Bruce (ph) Hopkins pilots an ultra-light plane and tows his wife's glider up to 2,000 feet.
T. HOPKINS: The airplane will roll down the field there if this the wind is this way. And you will, see there's another gazebo at the other end, and we can go the other way. And, as you can see, it's quite a large field. So, if there is a crosswind, you can actually come in and land crosswind in your -- in your glider. So, it's a -- a wonderful place to take off and to land.
I think it is magic, because, according to the laws of science, you can't take more energy out of something than you put into it. But, with hang gliding, you get a lot more energy out than you put into it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a lovely part of the country. And we have everything that we like to do here. So, it's -- it's turning out to be a very nice -- or ideal retirement location for us.
WESTHOVEN: Jennifer Westhoven, CNN.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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