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CNN Live Today

American Troops Injured in Mosul Attack Arrive in Germany; Vietnam Memorial Holiday Tree Ceremony

Aired December 22, 2004 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


DARYN KAGAN, CNN CO-ANCHOR: Welcome to CNN LIVE TODAY.
We're going to stay with these live pictures at the Ramstein Air Base. As Matthew Chance was describing to us, the plane landing carrying about 35 wounded military personnel, soldiers that were wounded yesterday in the attack on that military base near Mosul.

And our Matthew Chance is standing by. Let's go to Matthew to tell us more about the plane that is arriving and where the wounded soldiers are being taken.

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Daryn, I'm here at the Ramstein Air Base in southern Germany, where it's extremely noisy and I'm having to speak over the engine of this C-141 transport aircraft of the U.S. Air Force that has just touched down in the past few minutes carrying what we understand to be between 40 and 50 of the injured in this aircraft.

The ambulances have started to make their way towards the aircraft. Forty or 50 on board, some said to be in extremely serious condition. Indeed, at least eight of them, according to doctors who have been given advanced warning of the kinds of injuries to expect. At least eight of those survivors of that devastating attack in Mosul said to be in critical condition.

As soon as they're off-loaded from the aircraft, they will be put on the ambulances and taken to the nearby Landstuhl Medical Facility, the biggest U.S. hospital outside of the -- U.S. Army hospital outside of the United States. There, they can get the kind of specialist attention, the kind of intensive care that they're going to need to get these soldiers back on their feet, or at least stable enough so that they can sustain a flight back home to the United States -- Daryn.

KAGAN: So, Matthew, you say there are about 40 to 50 soldiers on board. As we understand more than 70 people were wounded. Are some injuries not that significant that they did not need to be brought there to Landstuhl?

CHANCE: We are waiting to see. The doctors here are waiting to see exactly who's on board and exactly what kind of injuries they have. They just turned the engines off, so I can speak more easily now. But basically, they are saying they believe there's a mixed bag of injuries on board. Some people with shrapnel injuries, some with broken bones, some may require major surgery. And for each of those people, obviously each case is separate. And for each of them it is going to different periods of time for them to recover here in Germany, before they are fit enough to fly back home to the United States. It could just be a matter of a day or two for some of those people on board who literally just need patching up. But for others, at least eight of them, they say in critical condition. They could be here for a good deal longer before they're fit enough to fly home -- Daryn.

KAGAN: And you explain that there are ambulances standing by waiting to take the wounded to the hospital. Do you know what the operation will look like, as we see the wounded taken off the plane?

CHANCE: Well, these are the ambulances right here that you can see behind me with their flashing orange lights. And you can see that some are geared towards taking people who will be able to walk. Others are geared towards taking people who have to be stretchered off the back of that plane.

What we will see in the next few minutes, I think, is the back of this aircraft lowered down. And I think that process has already begun now. The hydraulics has started to lift that aircraft door at the back and for the ramp to be lowered. After that, it will take at least an hour, we're told by the military authorities here, to actually get those patients off altogether. to get them safely on to the ambulances and transport them as quickly as possible to the Landstuhl Medical Facility. We should say just a couple of miles down the road -- Daryn.

KAGAN: All right. Matthew, we're going to have you stand by. We we're going to stay with these pictures. We will be back to you in a moment.

Meanwhile, let's bring in our Kathleen Koch who is standing by at the Pentagon.

Kathleen, the wounded are brought here to Germany. Those who lost their lives, however, they were taken through Kuwait, as reported by Barbara Starr.

KATHLEEN KOCH, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes. And the bodies, Daryn, will eventually end up at Dover Air Force Base. That obviously is where their remains will be prepared for eventual transport back to their hometowns, back to their loved ones who will have the very difficult duty of laying them to rest.

But the good news, if there is any good news in this attack, is that there were so few dead. There could have been more. The U.S. military has been proud to say that in Iraq they have gotten very quick treatment to U.S. soldiers after incidents, after attacks. And that they are doing better in this conflict than ever before at saving lives. So you have a larger number of wounded, 72 in this case. Sadly there were the 20 killed.

But they're saying in past conflicts the numbers of dead have been higher. So, indeed, we have a large number of wounded, but they are taking them here where they will get the best of care, even better than they were able to get back in Iraq.

KAGAN: And you talk about soldiers getting better care. We saw some of the more moving pictures we saw yesterday that taken immediately after the attack, showed injured soldiers coming to the aid of their fellow soldiers who had been injured more severely.

Randy Kaye has a question for you.

RANDI KAYE, CNN CO-ANCHOR: Kathleen, as long as we have you, if we could just touch on the investigation. We know that yesterday, the Pentagon had been telling us that this was a rocket attack. Today apparently, they're looking into the possibility of mortar rounds, or may be even a bomb planted inside the mess tent, the dining hall where this attack occurred yesterday morning. What are you hearing at this hour?

KOCH: Randi, they're still looking at all three possibilities. But it is, indeed, looking more and more like a bomb may have been responsible. Now obviously, this mess hall had been targeted by mortars many times before. We are sold some 30 times over the past year alone. That coming from embedded reporters in Mosul.

But what we are hearing now from a spokesman with Task Force Olympia there in Mosul, we are told that tiny, very perfectly, concentric, identical circular holes, pits were found throughout the tent. And in particular embedded in some stainless steel kitchen equipment. And what the spokesman tells CNN is that is a very distinct sign that something akin to ball bearings was used with shrapnel inside what very well might have been a bomb, in order to increase the deadliness of the bomb.

Also, there is this website now that has an Iraqi militant group that is claiming responsible saying yes, indeed it was a bomb. That it was carried in there, planted by one individual.

Now, I spoke earlier this morning with a spokesman from Multi- National Forces in Iraq. His name is Lieutenant Colonel Steven Bolin. He says yes, at Mosul and at U.S. bases throughout Iraq, there are Iraqis who come in, they work. They do construction work, janitorial work. They serve as interpreters. And they even do work in dining halls doing cooking, doing cleaning.

Now, Lieutenant Colonel Bolin says these people are searched when they come on the base generally. Their I.D.'s are checked and they are looked at. But then once they clear that point, that checkpoint, they have more or less free rein to roam the base. So we don't know again if this was a bomb yet, but it's certainly something that they are looking very closely at.

KAGAN: Once again, we are watching live pictures from Ramstein Air Base in Germany. We expect any moment to see the wounded soldiers from the attack in Mosul yesterday, be unloaded, taken to the local hospital -- military hospital in Landstuhl.

And as we monitor those pictures, Kathleen, I want to get back to this point that you were talking about concerns for this particular dining hall. In fact, there was a huge effort to replace it and to replace it in a matter of just days.

KOCH: Indeed, there is under construction right now at Camp Marez, there is a concrete end steel bunker that was due to be completed very shortly, where the troops would have been dining much more safely.

Many of the troops, and indeed top military leaders were very aware that any time you have a large number of forces, soldiers, Marines gathered in one place, they are a target. It certainly was no secret to the insurgents in Iraq that these American forces would be gathering generally together in these large groups, three times a day: in the morning, at midday and then in the evening.

So, this was a perfect time for them to launch these attacks, which generally in the past had been very imprecise and they had not scored a dead hit. And this again, if indeed this was a bomb, this could have been one of the reasons that they may have resorted to that for greater accuracy -- Daryn.

KAGAN: All right. Kathleen, you stay with us. We're going to go back to Germany and Matthew Chance.

KAYE: Matthew, we are looking at still at the live pictures there from the Ramstein Base there. And we understand from what we have seen so far, some cargo has been taken off that plane. And we see some stretchers being laid there near the back. Why the cargo first, if there are so many soldiers on there apparently critically wounded?

CHANCE: It's not entirely clear. I think they are just being prepared to make the journey, if you'd like, off the aircraft on to the ambulances. And some of that cargo, I think, is necessary for that operation. What we understand is there are about 50 passengers onboard. Now, that's the latest information. Fifty injured people on that plane, rather. That's the latest information from military officials here on the ground.

Thirteen of them are said to be able to walk. The rest of them are said to be not able to walk. And they will be carried out on stretchers directly on to these ambulances. The most critical will be brought out first and obviously taken as soon as possible to the hospital just a few miles down the road. And the less critical will come out towards the end of this operation, which, as I say, could take as long as an hour to complete -- Daryn.

KAGAN: All right. Matthew, in just a second we're going to show an event that was taking place at the same time these soldiers were being taken off the plane at Ramstein.

An event that is taking place in Washington, D.C. at the Vietnam Memorial Wall, a holiday ceremony. There's a live picture there from Washington, D.C. We just thought it would be interesting to show you the two events taking place thousands of miles apart at the same time. Both emotional. Let's listen in for a second. This is the Holiday Tree Ceremony at the Vietnam Veterans Memorial. Greetings to soldiers around the world being read at the Wall. Let's listen in. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "Dear American Hero, during this holiday season you are remembered with honor and love and gratitude. My thoughts and prayers are with you all. Your thoughtful friend, Dorothy, Reynoldsville, Pennsylvania."

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "May the joy and spirit of the holiday season heal the hearts of the families and friends of the soldiers who gave the ultimate sacrifice. Sincerely Donald Kraus, Sr. Merry Christmas."

KAGAN: And what we are listening into there -- well, there's one more. Let's listen in.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "God bless you, you will never be forgotten. What more can a man do than lay down his life for another? Guy Caltek (ph), U.S. Navy, retired."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "To all my brothers and sisters, may you rest in peace and know that you're not forgotten. With love, Dr. Marion."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Ladies and gentlemen, at this time what we are going to do is take the tree down to the Vietnam Veterans Memorial. And at that place we will decorate it with the messages.

KAGAN: And we will try to keep that picture up at the same time. We are watching two live events taking place at the same, thousand thousands of miles apart. Both important to the men and women serving in the U.S. military all around the world. On the left part of your screen, this is the annual holiday tree at the Wall ceremony.

They start at the East Mall. You have volunteers and a small group of service members from the Walter Reid Army Hospital, who recently served in Operation Iraqi Freedom. They were reading greetings before the tree is going to be placed at the apex of the Wall and decorated with the cards, that has been put together by volunteers and visitors, sending greetings to U.S. military members all around the world.

On the right part of your screen, a very moving scene for a different reason. You have some 40 to 50 members of the U.S. military wounded yesterday in the attack at the military base near Mosul. They are being brought to Ramstein Air Base in Germany. They are going to the Landstuhl Military Hospital, just a couple miles away.

Our Matthew Chance is standing by in Germany, as those soldiers are being brought off the plane -- Matthew.

CHANCE: Thanks, Daryn. And as you can see, that process of unloading those 40 to 50 -- 50 is what the latest figure is. They've been waiting to count the number of people who get off the plane. We can see that process now starting to happen. They off-loaded some cargo ahead of taking the actual injured passengers off the aircraft. Again, 22 people killed, 72 injured in this.

We understand that more planes like this are being readied, or may be readied, and may make their way to this Ramstein Air Base as well. If more from the injured from that devastating attack in Mosul have to be medivacked out of Iraq, they will be brought here first and stabilized, as these people are going to be before making their way back home to the U.S.

As I say, the most critical of these patients will be taken off first and moved straight to hospital. Then we will see the less critical patients come off. Some of them will be able to walk. Thirteen of them, we are told in fact, will be able to walk. That's the understanding of the U.S. military officials right here.

But it has been quite interesting events because, you know, the holiday period. There wasn't an offensive under way in Iraq and these are such unexpected influx of casualties. And so it's been quite an effort under way at the Landstuhl Hospital for military authorities to call back the medical teams, or the doctors or nurses, or the specialists who had been given leave over the holiday period to call them back from their families to come in to prepare the right teams, to give these soldiers the kind of treatment they're going to need when they get to the hospital in the next hour or two -- Daryn.

KAGAN: Yes. And yet, as military medical personnel, I am sure they understand that is all part of the job.

Looking at these pictures from Ramstein, Matthew, this is a scene that we have seen many times before, too many times. And this is Landstuhl being one of the largest U.S. military hospitals in the world. This is where the injured are brought.

CHANCE: That's absolutely right. In fact, I have a statistic from the start of the Iraq War. Nearly 18 and a half thousand patients have been treated at the Landstuhl Medical Facility. U.S. Army -- U.S. military, you know, personnel, of course, injured both in battle and non-battle injuries as well. But that's an extremely high number of people who have been injured and treated at the Landstuhl Medical Facility.

Some 45 of them are in the hospital right now. So that's not a great number. One of the reasons why many of the medical staff were given time off over the holiday period, because there were not that many patients actually being treated. But obviously, this new influx will change all that. And it's a very busy place, I imagine, right now as they prepare to receive some of these extremely serious casualties, as a result of that blast in Mosul into the hospital over the course of the next few hours -- Daryn.

KAGAN: Matthew, do we expect any kind of ceremony as the soldiers are brought off? Or this is an operation meant to just get them off the plane and to the medical treatment they need to receive?

CHANCE: Yes. This is not going to be any kind of military ceremony. This is not the welcoming ceremony as such. This is purely a military operation, a medical operation to get these people into the best kind of treatment that they're going to need. Firs of all, to save their lives.

There are at least eight people on that plane are extremely close to death. They are in critical condition. It is the intensive care, the specialist skills of the doctors here in Landstuhl that is going to be required to save their lives. So, this is not a ceremony. This is not something that they are putting on for the cameras.

They allowed us in to witness this because we lobbied them so hard to do that. But this is something that is a military operation. This is a medical procedure to get these people safely transferred. And I imagine there are quite important medical complications in transporting people, and then transferring them on to an ambulance like this. And then moving them by road to another hospital, when people are in such an unstable state, people in such poor states of health, with such serious injuries. That in itself can be a risky business. So, this is a serious event that is taking place indeed. And one that is not altogether without risk for the people involved -- Daryn.

KAGAN: All right. Matthew, we're going to keep your live picture up. You were mentioning it is the holidays. They had to call back a lot of military medical personnel in order to treat the soldiers, who are coming there to Ramstein and the Landstuhl U.S. Military Hospital.

It being the holidays, we want to show you a little bit more tape. This was tape that was just shot in Washington, D.C. at the ceremony, taking place at the Wall, the Vietnam Veterans Memorial. The holiday tree ceremony.

They have gathered greetings from volunteers and people just wishing well to U.S. military members around the world, wishing to read those greetings at the wall and then place the Christmas tree at the wall.

So, let's listen to the greetings while we watch the live pictures from Ramstein.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "Today I remember and pray for my daughter in the United States Army in Iraq. Merry Christmas, Julie. Come home to us. Jane Goodman."

I just might want to add, I pray that they all come home safe and with with our families. Happy Holidays to all. Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From Ann Chalmers, "We appreciate what you have done for us and our country. Thanks."

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "There are no words I could ever write to let you know what I feel in my heart for you all. You humble me with the sacrifices you have made. God bless you and keep you throughout eternity."

Hope all our guys come home, men and women. Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "To all who have served or will serve, you will not be forgotten."

I just like to add, I'm an OIF veteran. I will be going back next week to finish the mission. And I want to send my thoughts and prayers to the comrades over there now and to all the soldiers, especially the ones in Mosul yesterday. And pray that all our guys come home safe.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "Thanks for everything."

As a personal note, I would like to say Happy Holidays to all the service men and women serving overseas in Iraq and Afghanistan. To everybody Merry Christmas, Happy New Year's. Thanks.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: May this Wall always be a reminder of those who sacrificed their lives, and all who served in this war in service to our country to end our ordeal. Vernon Olson."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "Your courage and dedication to the freedom of our country will always be remembered by our family. Shirley Dee."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "All of you war heroes are truly honorable men and women with dignity. I salute you and support you to the fullest. Happy Holidays, Merry Christmas, and thanks to the service and devotion to this great country. David."

KAYE: And as we continue to look at these live pictures, we want to bring our Kathleen Koch back in.

Kathleen, from what we understand, the FBI is already on the ground in Mosul at Camp Marez. And they are beginning or in the midst of already a detailed explosives forensic investigation there, to try and find out exactly what was behind this attack yesterday. Whether it was a rocket, whether it was mortar rounds or possibly even a bomb planted inside that dining tent.

Can you tell us, if you can, what exactly that forensic investigation may entail?

KOCH: Well, obviously -- Randi, what they will be looking at is the sort of evidence that the Task Force Olympia spokesman spoke with CNN about. They're going to be looking for perforations, things like these very identically circular, concentric holes that this spokesman told us were inside the stainless steel kitchen equipment. Perhaps also, say in any wooden beams in the area, perhaps embedded in of the some tables.

They will look for that as a possible signature of something used as shrapnel, perhaps ball bearings inside a bomb. That would have a different pattern from, say something opposed as a mortar or rocket that came from above and then landed within, versus a bomb that exploded from the bottom and went out. They will look at that type of thing.

This incident also is raising a lot of questions, not only about should there be more hardened structures for the military to dine in Iraq? But should there be more patrols around the many military installations? There have been commanding officers who have requested more manpower for those patrols, but have been turned down. And of course, then the U.S. military announced in recent weeks it would be beefing up the numbers of U.S. forces in Iraq, up to 150,000 from the current 138,000.

But the plan right now is for those forces to really focus their efforts on keeping areas around the polling places safe, not closed in. That will be done by the Iraqi military. But they will sort of form perimeters around -- in a larger area around the areas where people will be voting in order to keep them safe. But they're focus at this point is not planned to be a security for the U.S. military -- Randi.

KAYE: And Kathleen, I would imagine some of this investigation, besides the forensics, would also include interviewing some witnesses who survived the attack, who may have been either inside that dining hall or may be just there on the base. Have you heard any...

KOCH: They would be interviewing witnesses. And they will also be going over carefully the roster of Iraqis who are employed at Camp Marez. As I mentioned earlier, there are a lot of Iraqis hired to do jobs that there simply are not enough U.S. service members to do it.

And again, some very basic tasks. So they could be the ones constructing this new metal and cement dining hall at Camp Marez. They're doing things also like working in the dining halls, being interpreters. So they're going to be very carefully going over that roster to see what Iraqis had access to the base. In particular that day, where were they all? Can they be accounted for? Where are they all right now -- Randy?

KAYE: All right. Kathleen Koch with more information for us this morning. Thank you.

Effects of the attack ripple across the world and make force an agonizing wait for the relatives of those serving in Iraq. Here is one family awaiting word on the fate of a loved one.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just not knowing is so hard wrenching for us because we just want to know if he was there or wasn't there.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Losing a loved one already and knowing that your brother is Iraq, I tell people my Christmas is canceled. It's hard knowing that your brother is out there fighting for your country, but out of nowhere he might be hurt and his life just taken away out of nowhere. And you can't be there with him for his last breath.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAYE: That family had already felt the tragedy of war. Just the day before, they buried a cousin who was killed in another insurgent attack.

KAGAN: We are not going to leave these live pictures. Once again, the live picture coming from the Ramstein Air Base in Germany. Our information tells us about 50 or more soldiers onboard that military plane. About 13 of them might be able to walk off by themselves. The rest of them need stretchers and ambulances taking them to the U.S. military hospital in Landstuhl.

We say that there's 50 or more. It's possible they are -- and we can start seeing some being carried off there. We are also getting information that all 50 might not be from the attack that took place yesterday in Mosul. Of course, it's not surprising there were other injuries and attacks around Iraq, and some of those soldiers needing to be transported as well for some medical help.

Our Matthew Chance standing by as we are just starting to see the first soldiers carried off.

CHANCE: Thanks, Daryn. That's right. The first soldier has now been carried off; it seems being loaded on to the ambulance.

Now, you asked me earlier about why they were taking the cargo off. So a number of reasons for that, I checked into it. But one reason is that's the way they loaded the plane coming from Iraq. Because as a matter of balance, they need a heavier load at the back so they put the cargo at the back. So obviously, it had to be taken off first.

Though while that was happening there were handovers inside the aircraft between the medical teams that had brought the injured from Iraq, and the medical teams who will be taking responsibility for them now. Each, individual patient, of course, had to be discussed. And so each medical team, or the new medical team, if you'd like, knew exactly what the circumstances were, the injuries were for each, individual patient. And that has taken some considerable time.

Now, the eight people who are said to be critical, they are already being off-loaded now. That's what the conversations were about on board the plane, to make sure these people were in the best kind of care and got the best possible kind of attention to make that journey, by these blue-black tag ambulances to the Landstuhl Medical Facility, which is a few miles down the road.

As you mentioned, on board, possibly as many as 50 people. And you also indicated it's not altogether clear that those people are all from the Mosul attack. Certainly it seems that the vast majority of them are, perhaps as many as 40 are from the attack in Mosul. But there may be others on board as well, that were injured in other areas of Iraq and just got on board the plane as it came here at the Ramstein Air Base.

At any rate, all of them will be taken from here to the Landstuhl Medical Facility, where they will get that care they need before they are shipped back home, possibly some of them in time for Christmas.

KAGAN: Matthew, doing some math. A little bit of math here, as you were pointing out, this is going slowly. They are taking their time. They are taking care. If they have 50 people to unload off this plane, I imagine this is going to go on for some time. CHANCE: It's not going to be a quick operation at all, because the main concern is, of course, making sure these people are secure, they are properly sort of secured on to the stretchers. And they will be taken off the plane on and to make sure that is done with the minimum possible risk to them, so they don't incur further injury in transporting.

Obviously transporting people who are so severely injured is a risky business. This could take as long as an hour, it could take longer than that even. It depends on complications that may arise inside the plane while we transport off these people. Obviously, the first people getting off are the people more critical. The people with lesser injuries will be taken off next, and then the 13 or so individuals who are able to walk, walk off the plane.

They may even have some interaction with us here, possibly a wave. Perhaps nothing else for the cameras here that have been waiting at the Ramstein Air Base to see whatever we can see here -- Daryn.

KAGAN: Well, you know there will be family members back in the States looking to see a glimpse if they happen to know one of their loved ones is one of the injured.

A behind the scenes question for you here, Matthew. You were mentioning how CNN had to lobby in order to show these pictures. I know with the dead, the U.S. military has a policy of not allowing the media to shoot pictures. Some say it's out of respect for the families and dead. Some say it's the U.S. military trying not to show casualties and the cost of this war.

How is it that the military is allowing pictures of the wounded to be shown?

CHANCE: Well, they are allowing us this kind of access. But you'll notice that we are taking basically pretty wide shots. And they have also surrounded the actual area where the people are being brought off the back of the plane with military personnel who, I think, have been placed there intentionally to prevent us from getting very clear shots of the actual individuals involved.

And in fact, it's been made quite clear to us by the personnel officers here, the press officers here that we've been dealing with, that we're not permitted to take close ups of the faces of the injured as they come off the plane. Because they say they don't want the family members back at home to be able to recognize any of these people.

And one of the reasons for that, and this is a legitimate reason for that, is that they haven't had the opportunity as yet to make it clear to every family, every mother, every father, every wife of all the people that have been caught up in this blast. I'm sure at this point most of the people whose loved ones were killed in this attack have by now been notified.

But when it comes to the injuries -- and remember, there were 72 injuries as a result of this attack in Mosul -- it's a big operation, notifying all the family members and wives, that there may be an injury involved. Again, some of the injuries, though some of them are very serious, some of them aren't very serious at all. Nevertheless, it could be distressing for the families if they see a son, or a husband or a brother walk off this plane here, having not known any indication at all that they were even in Mosul at the time of the attack -- Daryn.

KAGAN: Very good point. There's no good way to find out that your loved one has been injured during military service. However, finding their picture on national television would not be among the best.

Matthew, stand by. Kathleen Koch wanted to get on this question of some pictures being allowed, some not.

KATHLEEN KOCH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Daryn, at Dover Air Force Base, as you mentioned, that, again, is where the bodies of the 18 Americans killed in this deadly explosion will be brought and prepared for burial, for delivery to their families. Since the end of the first Persian Gulf War, back in 1990, they stopped the practice of allowing cameras to go there and witness the ceremony. It is a very solemn ceremony that goes on, that does occur out of the view of the cameras, and out of the view of families. The military explained to us -- we went there just before the invasion of Iraq began, and I was one of the few journalists that got a tour of the facilities at Dover and saw just how they will prepare the bodies. And we were told the military did not want families to feel compelled to spend their money to come to all the way to Dover for a ceremony there and accompany the bodies home, that they felt that that was too much of a burden on the families.

So what does occur, though, even though there are no family members there, no cameras there, is there an honor guard in full dress uniform that greets every casket, carries it off the plane, draped with a flag, and it's brought into the facility, and every piece of human remains is handled with great dignity and great care, labeled everything -- in particular, the personal belongings.

I had an interesting discussion with someone there at Dover Air Force Base who cleans and prepares the personal belongings to be returned to the family along with the remains of their loved one. And that person said it is sometimes very, very difficult handling those belongings. Sometimes there are half-finished letters, and that gentleman told me he had to resist the impulse at that time to finish that letter to the loved one who would be receiving the body. It's a very difficult job that they do, but they take great pride in it.

Another interesting thing, they have every single uniform from every branch of U.S. military at Dover Air Force Base. And every single insignia, star, bar on hand so they can completely replicate the dress uniform...

KAGAN: Kathleen, let me just jump in here a second, but I want to talk about these live pictures that we're just seeing from Ramstein. And that one of the stretchers being loaded off the plane and loaded onto the ambulance, very slowly, very gingerly, with a lot of equipment attached.

And our Matthew Chance, who is there, was pointing out they are taking great care. A number of these wounded are critically wounded, and moving slowly to get these wounded soldiers to the exact kind of medical help that they need.

Kathleen, we're going to get back to you and we're going to keep these live pictures up, but meanwhile, Randi has another story for us.

RANDI KAYE, CNN ANCHOR: We are going to keep these live pictures up for you as we await more wounded soldiers to be removed from that plane at Ramstein. And families, we're told, are still awaiting some word, so you won't be seeing here on CNN any closeups of those wounded soldiers being taken off that plane.

Meanwhile, one Virginia woman did not have to wait long for news on her loved one. Her husband himself made the call. We get the details from reporter Kay Young of CNN affiliate WAVY in Norfolk, Virginia.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TRISH OTTO: When I got the phone call, he said, honey, I want you to know that I'm OK, and that I love you and I'm fine. Everything is OK, but something bad has happened.

KAY YOUNG, WAVY REPORTER: Lieutenant Sean Otto made one call to his wife Trish Tuesday morning. He was referring a deadly rocket attack on a dining hall tent in Mosul Iraq. Fourteen U.S. soldiers, at least two from Otto's Richmond-based engineer battalion were killed.

OTTO: And I know deep inside it's breaking his heart, because he loves his soldiers. He would do anything, give his life for any of them.

YOUNG: Before the attack and the phone call, Trish and her sons were expecting news about Sean. She knew he would be featured in a "Richmond Times Dispatch" article. But the report changed when explosions blew through the dining hall. Lieutenant Otto, who was not hurt in the attack, focused on helping the injured, while for him, the worst was happening.

OTTO: He just said yesterday in the article that -- today's actual article that hey, we've made it this far, we haven't lost any men. And then in the updated article he said, we almost made it, we almost made it home without losing anybody.

YOUNG: Trish considers it a gift that her husband survived. But her mind races with questions because he's still not on his way home.

OTTO: Is there going to be another attack tonight? Is there going to be another one tomorrow? You know, it makes you wonder and worry.

(END VIDEOTAPE) KAYE: That was reporter Kay Young of CNN affiliate WAVY in Norfolk, Virginia. At the bottom of the hour, we will hear from a military widow who formed a grief support group, named, appropriately enough, TAPS.

KAGAN: And in fact as we go ahead and do this in a fluid motion, we're going to ahead and talk to her right now, Randi.

As we watch these live pictures of the wounded being taken off, we have gotten information about some 50 or so will be taken off this cargo plane, loaded on to ambulances and taken to the military hospital in Landstuhl, it's important not to forget that at least 22 people, 14 U.S. soldiers, four U.S. civilians and four Iraqi security forces lost their lives yesterday in that attack on Mosul.

The military takes pride in taking care of its own. There's also this independent program called TAPS, that Randi was mentioning. This program provides an extra level of care for families. TAPS matches military survivors with similar experiences. It was started 10 years ago by Bonnie Carroll after the death of her husband, Brigadier General Tom Carroll.

Bonnie joining us now from New York.

Thank you for being with us, Mrs. Carroll.

BONNIE CARROLL, FOUNDER, TAPS: Thank you very much.

KAGAN: Unfortunately you know only too well, what it feels like to receive the notification with the worst possible news about your loved one.

CARROLL: Yes.

KAGAN: Can you tell us about that moment for you?

CARROLL: Yes, my husband was killed in the United States Army, and my heart goes out to the families who receive that news yesterday. TAPS is a wonderful, loving, caring family now in existence since 1994, providing support to all of those who have served and sacrificed.

KAGAN: As we watch live pictures of the wounded being taken off the plane now, 24 hours ago here on this program, we were watching this story unfold live, and we were getting some of the first pictures in. They were still pictures, and sometimes the still pictures can tell even more of a moving and dramatic story than live video can. And I just had to stop while we were doing this yesterday and think about these thousands of families, because there's about 8,500 people stationed near where this attack took place, thousands of families that must have been tuning in, looking to see if there was sight of their loved ones. If you could talk a little bit about that waiting and not knowing.

CARROLL: Yes, you do, you wait, and hope and pray. And even if your family is not effected, I've been talking with the families out at Ft. Lewis, and their hearts are there, with their service members, with those who were lost, with the families, and it is a comfort to them. I was out at Ft. Lewis a few weeks ago working with the families, just in the event of something such as this, and now we are altogether as one, grieving a loss, and comforting those who have suffered.

KAGAN: And it is important what you and your organization are doing because as we are watching -- the obvious here, the people who are physically wounded in the attack near Mosul, they need the medical attention. But the families waiting and worrying back here, they need attention as well, so -- and care. So what can be done for them? What does your organization do with them?

CARROLL: Well, TAPS is a wonderful support network, providing primarily peer relationships to get families together with others who have been there and truly understand, as in any situation like this, that we speak our own language. And just to connect with another who's -- who understands. All those who have served in the military have risen above the rest of society in character, courage, honor and ability. And As one of our TAPS moms told me the other day, it's not a matter of how long we live, but it's what we stand for, and each of those serving today has stood for freedom.

KAGAN: Another important number to look at, I think, as we feel for the families that have lost loved ones, that have injured soldiers coming off the plane, if you think about the 8,500 families that have loved ones serving there, most of them, most of the loved ones are OK. And yet, the waiting and worrying has got to be terrible.

CARROLL: It is tough. It is tough. I had the chance this year to serve in Iraq for six months, and I think sometimes it was harder on me worrying about the family back home, but the experience of being there and being able to offer immediate support is wonderful.

KAGAN: And this time of year in particular, Bonnie, with the holidays, what kind of advice, what kind of comfort does TAPS offer to those that you work with?

CARROLL: TAPS is really a loving family. As one of our young widows said, it's her safe place to land, a safe place to be. Our phones are answered 24 hours a day, seven days a week. We've got a wonderful Web site at taps.org that has information specifically for coping with the holidays.

And it is a time when we come together. We have online chats, we have support groups meeting all over the country. We really have a family that comes together, whether it's parents, children, siblings, fiances. All those affected by a loss, regardless of circumstances or geography, have a home here.

KAGAN: And I think we're getting ready to watch -- yes, I think we have another stretcher with another wounded soldier being brought off the plane. He will be loaded onto one of these buses, which is serving also as an ambulance and taken to the hospital in Landstuhl. Bonnie, from your own experience, from having lost your husband during military service, what have you learned and what do you know that you didn't know before?

CARROLL: Well, you know, a very wise woman asked me in the depth of my own grief if my husband had enriched my life. And you know, that really took me back. And I said my goodness, yes, he -- in so many ways. And she asked me what I was going to do with those riches. And I think that's what all of our families and children and parents feel as they have been blessed by the love of an amazing person who served their country. And it's now an opportunity. We see such patriotism with our families.

KAGAN: Well, we appreciate your comments and your service to other families. Good luck with your work.

CARROLL: Thank you.

KAGAN: It's very important. Bonnie Carroll with TAPS. One more time, for the families out there, tell us what the Web site is, please?

CARROLL: It's taps.org. And our phone number is 800-959-taps. We're there for them.

KAGAN: Very easy to remember. Thank you so much.

CARROLL: Thank you very much.

KAGAN: Randy.

KAYE: All right and once again, we are going to keep with the live pictures here from Ramstein Air Base as the wounded soldiers are taken off that airplane. We also showed you that earlier today there was a holiday ceremony thanking veterans and active duty military -- has just wrapped up that ceremony in Washington. A holiday tree was placed at the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Wall. The tree has been decorated with cards sent in from across America.

And CNN's Judy Woodruff joins us now from the wall. She was there to witness that ceremony this morning. Good morning, Judy.

JUDY WOODRUFF, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, Randy. This is the ceremony that has taken place every year for many years. And as you said, they do put a tree there at the base of the Vietnam Memorial. You have Vietnam veterans and others remembering those who gave their lives in Vietnam decades ago. But today the ceremony took on a very special meeting because of not only the war in Iraq, but in particular yesterday's carnage in Mosul.

And as Jan Scruggs -- just a few minutes ago, who heads the Vietnam Veterans, told the group, he said -- and he choked up as he told the people who had gathered here that the sacrifices go on. The notes that they placed on the three, they read a representative group of them. And they were read by people, including Iraq veterans, people who have gone to Iraq, were wounded, have come home and others who have a special connection with the Vietnam Memorial. Let's listen to some of those messages as they were read.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP))

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There are no words I could ever write to let you know what I feel in my heart for you all. You humble me with the sacrifices you have made. God bless you and keep you throughout eternity. Hope all our guys come home and our women. Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: To all who have served or will serve, you will not been forgotten. I'd just like to add that I'm OIF veteran, I'll be going back next week to finish the mission. And I want to send my thoughts and prayers to my comrades who are over there now, and all the soldiers, especially the ones in Mosul yesterday. And pray that all our guys come home safe.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WOODRUFF: So Daryn and Randy, the overwhelming message is here is -- we remember those who gave their lives in Vietnam, who served in Vietnam. And we want the troops serving right now in Iraq to know that their country is behind them. Some individual expressions of misgivings, frankly, here about the war, but overwhelming support for the troops themselves and what they're going through. Back to you.

KAYE: So again, this is an annual service that they hold there, but certainly very special meaning earlier today this year. Certainly. Thank you. Judy Woodruff at the Vietnam Wall for us.

KAGAN: We're going to keep those live pictures up. More and more soldiers, we hear as many as 50, on board that cargo transport plane being taken off, loaded onto the ambulance buses. And they will be taken to the Landstuhl U.S. Military Hospital in Landstuhl.

President Bush yesterday, speaking about the attack. Let's listen to his comments.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Today we had a rocket attack that took a lot of lives. Any time of the year is a time of sorrow and sadness when we lose a loss of life. This time of year is particularly sorrowful for the families as we head into the Christmas season. We pray for them. We send our heartfelt condolences to the loved ones who suffer today. Just want them to know that the mission is a vital mission for peace.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KAGAN: President Bush giving comments yesterday after the attack. That attack took place about noon local time, just outside of Mosul. It was about 4:00 a.m. Eastern time. Lunchtime in the dining hall. You can only imagine how many people were there and the high number of casualties that took place with that attack.

Just the day before, President Bush had given a news conference that was actually live during this program as well. And he was asked about these attacks and the (UNINTELLIGIBLE) attacks in Iraq. And he said frankly, they are going to have an effect, but this is all part of a large battle that the U.S. determined as well as the ruling Iraqi government right now, to hold these elections on January 30th, which is just about five weeks from now.

KAYE: Right. And apparently they did recognize the threat. I mean, Lieutenant General Thomas Metz said yesterday that we recognize there was a threat at these bases and at these -- what they called, I guess, soft structures, like the dining hall or the mess hall where this happened. These attacks were not new. Apparently, as Kathleen Koch told us this morning, they were building a bunker, a hard structure...

KAGAN: Just a few days away from finishing it.

KAYE: Just two days away from finishing that structure to keep the soldiers there and the civilians and anyone there at Camp Marez safer because of dining structures had been attacked on several bases, actually.

KAGAN: No question, a difficult and dangerous operation. Live pictures staying up from Ramstein Air Base. That's where our Matthew Chance is -- Matthew.

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) Well, as you see, the operation to remove those people off the plane is still continuing a pace. It's going to take some time because it's being done in a very painstaking way. We're seeing a couple of instances over the past 30 minutes or so of people being carried full of drips, on stretchers, obviously unconscious or not really, you know, kind of very able to at least not able to walk, at least, being carried off very carefully off that plane onto the blue ambulances that waiting right next to it.

Those are the most critical patients, about eight of them, we're told, in a very serious condition, indeed and who need urgent medical attention at the Landstuhl Medical Facility, a short distance from here. Also on the plane, a good many other survivors of that devastating attack from Mosul. At least 13 people on board are able to walk, we're told. Some of them have broken bones, though. Some have shrapnel wounds as a result of the blast.

The majority, though, majority from Mosul, not able to walk at all and will be carried off, as we've been seeing, on stretchers. They'll be taken the short distance to Landstuhl Medical Facility, where they'll be given whatever specialist attention they need so they can build their strength and then eventually be taken home back to the U.S. -- Daryn.

KAYE: Matthew, I'll take it. If you could, just give us an idea of how this works for the families. We know some special preparations have been made for those who need to be treated there. And some of the medical personnel have been called back to treat them over this holiday time. What arrangements, if any, are being made for family as they are learning of their wounded relatives?

CHANCE: Well, it's an interesting question because you're absolutely right. It's not just the people here who have physical injuries that need treatment. It is, indeed, the families as well, that may require some kind attention, or at least some contact with their loved ones. And at the Landstuhl Medical Facility, there is the facilities available for them to do that.

Indeed, I have spoken to representatives at the -- U.S. representatives at the medical facility and they're saying that there are a number of accommodations that are available to family members, and they are expecting family members of those injured here to come over the coming days to be with their loved ones, particularly the ones in the most critical condition and to try and give them whatever support they can while they're in this very delicate state.

The authorities here in Landstuhl -- over the road in Landstuhl, are very keen for -- of course, they say it gives the patients something to get better more quickly for. So that's something -- they actually encouraged it.

KAGAN: All right, Matthew. We'll get back with you in just a moment and clean up those audio problems we're having in hearing him. Meanwhile, to the Pentagon.

KAYE: To the Pentagon to go to our Kathleen Koch, who is standing by for us.

Kathleen, if you could, just talk a little bit about these dining places. As you told us earlier, they were trying to build a reinforced structure, a bunker, if you will, to try and keep the folks there safe while they would dine, because really these are prime targets. They are gathering places. Yesterday as many as 400 to 500 people there. So that is a fact that the enemy would know.

KOCH: Certainly, Randy, it is, and this was, again, a very large facility, about the size of a football field, again, with the soft, tent-like structure held up by girders over it, but certainly no protection whatsoever from a rocket, mortar or indeed from a bomb, which is one of the possibilities that investigators are now looking at. Again, a spokesman for Task Force Olympia telling CNN that they did find tiny round metal pits in some of the stainless steel kitchen equipment in that mess hall that could indicate that something like ball bearings were used as shrapnel inside of a bomb in order to increase injuries.

The U.S. military, its take right now on the insurgency, recently had been that they were pleased that they said that the violence was down, that it had decreased dramatically, the Pentagon was saying since the offensive on Falluja last month.

Indeed, General George Casey, who is in charge of the multinational forces throughout Iraq, at a press conference last week said the insurgents may be tough, but they are not 10 feet tall, and he really downplayed the impact they were having, though he did say he believes this was an insurgency that will go on for quite some time.

But he pointed out then, as military and top Pentagon officials have pointed out recently, that most of the attacks had been targeted at Iraqis, Iraqi police, Iraqi soldiers, and indeed Iraqi civilians, like the 60 or so we saw killed over the weekend, and then the election workers. So this attack is really a clear departure from that. And, indeed, if it was a bomb that was carried on to the base by one of the many Iraqis who work at U.S. installations in Iraq, work as interpreters, as cooks, as janitorial workers, if it was carried on there, then that would be a radical departure from these random mortars and rockets that are lobbed quickly, say, by someone, who jumps out of a car, sets up a launcher, shoots it off without much precision, jumps back into a car and runs off. This would be a very new tactic -- Randi.

KAYE: All right, Kathleen, stick with us for just a second as we watch more pictures, live pictures coming to us from Ramstein Air Base there as yet another critically wounded soldier is loaded into one of those buses serving as ambulances that is standing by there at the base.

KAGAN: This attack happened about 35, 36 hours ago from Iraq. Want to get the latest there and bring our Karl Penhaul in. He is standing by from Baghdad -- Karl.

KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Daryn. We've been talking now to the spokesman up at that Camp Marez base up in Mosul to find out what the latest is from there as far as the FBI investigation. As we know from 2:00 a.m. local time, an FBI team was flown to the base to begin investigations, a detailed investigation of the explosions seen in that dining hall. Now obviously that investigation has been going on for the past 14, 16 hours.

What we do know from Lieutenant Colonel Hastings up there from Camp Marez is that certain round elements of shrapnel have been found. He says that these are like ball bearings, or BBs that have been spread around. It would depend on what type of explosive was used as to what type of shrapnel that causes, because typically, a mortar or a rocket may create jagged parts of shrapnel, where something else could create these round very symmetrical perforations which have been found in some of the kitchen equipment inside of that dining room.

What Lieutenant Colonel Hastings has been telling us, that all this goes to show that it was way too early to suggest that it was a rocket or a mortar, that the explosion may have been caused by a placed explosive. We have just come off the phone with him and some of his colleagues in the last few moments, they say it is still too early to tell. The FBI is still continuing a very thorough analysis to find out what kind of explosives would cause this, whether it was an artillery fire or whether somebody walked into that dining hall with some kind of a bomb, placed it and detonated it.

KAGAN: And what about this group that might be taking credit for this attack?

PENHAUL: Well, we have seen claims of responsibility on an Islamic Web site by a group named Ansar Al Sunna. Often these Islamic Web sites are very difficult to verify their authenticity, and also it's very difficult to verify the authenticity of the claims. But we do know from past experience that Ansar Al Sunna is one of the larger rebel factions, one of the larger insurgent factions here in Iraq. We have seen them launch a number of devastating strikes in the past.

For example, last year they claimed responsibility for a suicide car bomb attack on a Turkish embassy here in Baghdad. We also know they launched suicide car bomb attacks on one of the PUK -- one of the Kurdish political party headquarters in the city of Kirkuk. And then earlier this year, in February, two suicide bombers carried backpacks loaded with explosives into the headquarters of political parties up north, and they exploded there as well.

So it does seem these Ansar Al Sunna insurgents are pretty well- skilled, pretty well-versed in suicide attacks. They've also been known to hostage take and to kill hostages. So they have a very varied way of operating. As far as their origins, and we understand that Ansar Al Sunna was made up of a number of factions that came together under one banner. One of those factions, we understand, was Ansar Al Islam, the members of the group claimed to have originated from Al Qaeda factions, and some others made up of Arab Sunnis from here from Iraq. One of their prominent leaders, we understand, is a Jordanian. You'll remember, of course, that another Jordanian has been operating here in Iraq, Abu Musab Al Zarqawi. Unclear, though, what the relationship may be between Ansar Al Sunna and the Zarqawi network -- Daryn.

KAGAN: But to give us a bigger and a better picture of the insurgent movement across Iraq, it's not like it's some centralized movement. It appears to be a bunch of individualized groups working on their own, based on what they think their own passions are.

PENHAUL: It depends who you talk to. Last week, I spent a lot of time talking to U.S. generals, and what emerged from my conversations with them is that they have very little idea of the size of the insurgency. They say their estimates range anything between 4,000 to 20,000 hardcore fighters. They say that they have little idea of how the various insurgent factions are coordinating between themselves. So what we then did, we actually made contact with an insurgent commander here in Baghdad. He was a former general under Saddam Hussein, and now he is an insurgent general. That story was verified by our sources. What he told us was that the backbone of this resistance across Iraq is being led by former military men, former members of Saddam Hussein's army and its intelligence network.

On top of that, he also said that Saddam Hussein brought in a number of Arab volunteers from neighboring countries in the last days of his regime and trained them, as well as Baath Party members, in guerrilla tactics. And from there, there are other Islamic factions, Islamic fundamentalist factions, that are also fighting, but a lot of those may have a relationship with the groups of Arab volunteers that Saddam Hussein himself brought.

So if one looks at that picture, then that could indicate that there is a little more coordination between these guerrilla factions than previously thought. But what the U.S. military tells us is that they can't say that for sure, because they haven't intercepted too many different types of communications between these different groups.

What they do say, though, is there may be some outside help from leading members in countries such as Syria or Iran -- Daryn.

KAGAN: Thank you very much, Karl Penhaul, live in Baghdad.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com


Aired December 22, 2004 - 10:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DARYN KAGAN, CNN CO-ANCHOR: Welcome to CNN LIVE TODAY.
We're going to stay with these live pictures at the Ramstein Air Base. As Matthew Chance was describing to us, the plane landing carrying about 35 wounded military personnel, soldiers that were wounded yesterday in the attack on that military base near Mosul.

And our Matthew Chance is standing by. Let's go to Matthew to tell us more about the plane that is arriving and where the wounded soldiers are being taken.

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Daryn, I'm here at the Ramstein Air Base in southern Germany, where it's extremely noisy and I'm having to speak over the engine of this C-141 transport aircraft of the U.S. Air Force that has just touched down in the past few minutes carrying what we understand to be between 40 and 50 of the injured in this aircraft.

The ambulances have started to make their way towards the aircraft. Forty or 50 on board, some said to be in extremely serious condition. Indeed, at least eight of them, according to doctors who have been given advanced warning of the kinds of injuries to expect. At least eight of those survivors of that devastating attack in Mosul said to be in critical condition.

As soon as they're off-loaded from the aircraft, they will be put on the ambulances and taken to the nearby Landstuhl Medical Facility, the biggest U.S. hospital outside of the -- U.S. Army hospital outside of the United States. There, they can get the kind of specialist attention, the kind of intensive care that they're going to need to get these soldiers back on their feet, or at least stable enough so that they can sustain a flight back home to the United States -- Daryn.

KAGAN: So, Matthew, you say there are about 40 to 50 soldiers on board. As we understand more than 70 people were wounded. Are some injuries not that significant that they did not need to be brought there to Landstuhl?

CHANCE: We are waiting to see. The doctors here are waiting to see exactly who's on board and exactly what kind of injuries they have. They just turned the engines off, so I can speak more easily now. But basically, they are saying they believe there's a mixed bag of injuries on board. Some people with shrapnel injuries, some with broken bones, some may require major surgery. And for each of those people, obviously each case is separate. And for each of them it is going to different periods of time for them to recover here in Germany, before they are fit enough to fly back home to the United States. It could just be a matter of a day or two for some of those people on board who literally just need patching up. But for others, at least eight of them, they say in critical condition. They could be here for a good deal longer before they're fit enough to fly home -- Daryn.

KAGAN: And you explain that there are ambulances standing by waiting to take the wounded to the hospital. Do you know what the operation will look like, as we see the wounded taken off the plane?

CHANCE: Well, these are the ambulances right here that you can see behind me with their flashing orange lights. And you can see that some are geared towards taking people who will be able to walk. Others are geared towards taking people who have to be stretchered off the back of that plane.

What we will see in the next few minutes, I think, is the back of this aircraft lowered down. And I think that process has already begun now. The hydraulics has started to lift that aircraft door at the back and for the ramp to be lowered. After that, it will take at least an hour, we're told by the military authorities here, to actually get those patients off altogether. to get them safely on to the ambulances and transport them as quickly as possible to the Landstuhl Medical Facility. We should say just a couple of miles down the road -- Daryn.

KAGAN: All right. Matthew, we're going to have you stand by. We we're going to stay with these pictures. We will be back to you in a moment.

Meanwhile, let's bring in our Kathleen Koch who is standing by at the Pentagon.

Kathleen, the wounded are brought here to Germany. Those who lost their lives, however, they were taken through Kuwait, as reported by Barbara Starr.

KATHLEEN KOCH, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes. And the bodies, Daryn, will eventually end up at Dover Air Force Base. That obviously is where their remains will be prepared for eventual transport back to their hometowns, back to their loved ones who will have the very difficult duty of laying them to rest.

But the good news, if there is any good news in this attack, is that there were so few dead. There could have been more. The U.S. military has been proud to say that in Iraq they have gotten very quick treatment to U.S. soldiers after incidents, after attacks. And that they are doing better in this conflict than ever before at saving lives. So you have a larger number of wounded, 72 in this case. Sadly there were the 20 killed.

But they're saying in past conflicts the numbers of dead have been higher. So, indeed, we have a large number of wounded, but they are taking them here where they will get the best of care, even better than they were able to get back in Iraq.

KAGAN: And you talk about soldiers getting better care. We saw some of the more moving pictures we saw yesterday that taken immediately after the attack, showed injured soldiers coming to the aid of their fellow soldiers who had been injured more severely.

Randy Kaye has a question for you.

RANDI KAYE, CNN CO-ANCHOR: Kathleen, as long as we have you, if we could just touch on the investigation. We know that yesterday, the Pentagon had been telling us that this was a rocket attack. Today apparently, they're looking into the possibility of mortar rounds, or may be even a bomb planted inside the mess tent, the dining hall where this attack occurred yesterday morning. What are you hearing at this hour?

KOCH: Randi, they're still looking at all three possibilities. But it is, indeed, looking more and more like a bomb may have been responsible. Now obviously, this mess hall had been targeted by mortars many times before. We are sold some 30 times over the past year alone. That coming from embedded reporters in Mosul.

But what we are hearing now from a spokesman with Task Force Olympia there in Mosul, we are told that tiny, very perfectly, concentric, identical circular holes, pits were found throughout the tent. And in particular embedded in some stainless steel kitchen equipment. And what the spokesman tells CNN is that is a very distinct sign that something akin to ball bearings was used with shrapnel inside what very well might have been a bomb, in order to increase the deadliness of the bomb.

Also, there is this website now that has an Iraqi militant group that is claiming responsible saying yes, indeed it was a bomb. That it was carried in there, planted by one individual.

Now, I spoke earlier this morning with a spokesman from Multi- National Forces in Iraq. His name is Lieutenant Colonel Steven Bolin. He says yes, at Mosul and at U.S. bases throughout Iraq, there are Iraqis who come in, they work. They do construction work, janitorial work. They serve as interpreters. And they even do work in dining halls doing cooking, doing cleaning.

Now, Lieutenant Colonel Bolin says these people are searched when they come on the base generally. Their I.D.'s are checked and they are looked at. But then once they clear that point, that checkpoint, they have more or less free rein to roam the base. So we don't know again if this was a bomb yet, but it's certainly something that they are looking very closely at.

KAGAN: Once again, we are watching live pictures from Ramstein Air Base in Germany. We expect any moment to see the wounded soldiers from the attack in Mosul yesterday, be unloaded, taken to the local hospital -- military hospital in Landstuhl.

And as we monitor those pictures, Kathleen, I want to get back to this point that you were talking about concerns for this particular dining hall. In fact, there was a huge effort to replace it and to replace it in a matter of just days.

KOCH: Indeed, there is under construction right now at Camp Marez, there is a concrete end steel bunker that was due to be completed very shortly, where the troops would have been dining much more safely.

Many of the troops, and indeed top military leaders were very aware that any time you have a large number of forces, soldiers, Marines gathered in one place, they are a target. It certainly was no secret to the insurgents in Iraq that these American forces would be gathering generally together in these large groups, three times a day: in the morning, at midday and then in the evening.

So, this was a perfect time for them to launch these attacks, which generally in the past had been very imprecise and they had not scored a dead hit. And this again, if indeed this was a bomb, this could have been one of the reasons that they may have resorted to that for greater accuracy -- Daryn.

KAGAN: All right. Kathleen, you stay with us. We're going to go back to Germany and Matthew Chance.

KAYE: Matthew, we are looking at still at the live pictures there from the Ramstein Base there. And we understand from what we have seen so far, some cargo has been taken off that plane. And we see some stretchers being laid there near the back. Why the cargo first, if there are so many soldiers on there apparently critically wounded?

CHANCE: It's not entirely clear. I think they are just being prepared to make the journey, if you'd like, off the aircraft on to the ambulances. And some of that cargo, I think, is necessary for that operation. What we understand is there are about 50 passengers onboard. Now, that's the latest information. Fifty injured people on that plane, rather. That's the latest information from military officials here on the ground.

Thirteen of them are said to be able to walk. The rest of them are said to be not able to walk. And they will be carried out on stretchers directly on to these ambulances. The most critical will be brought out first and obviously taken as soon as possible to the hospital just a few miles down the road. And the less critical will come out towards the end of this operation, which, as I say, could take as long as an hour to complete -- Daryn.

KAGAN: All right. Matthew, in just a second we're going to show an event that was taking place at the same time these soldiers were being taken off the plane at Ramstein.

An event that is taking place in Washington, D.C. at the Vietnam Memorial Wall, a holiday ceremony. There's a live picture there from Washington, D.C. We just thought it would be interesting to show you the two events taking place thousands of miles apart at the same time. Both emotional. Let's listen in for a second. This is the Holiday Tree Ceremony at the Vietnam Veterans Memorial. Greetings to soldiers around the world being read at the Wall. Let's listen in. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "Dear American Hero, during this holiday season you are remembered with honor and love and gratitude. My thoughts and prayers are with you all. Your thoughtful friend, Dorothy, Reynoldsville, Pennsylvania."

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "May the joy and spirit of the holiday season heal the hearts of the families and friends of the soldiers who gave the ultimate sacrifice. Sincerely Donald Kraus, Sr. Merry Christmas."

KAGAN: And what we are listening into there -- well, there's one more. Let's listen in.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "God bless you, you will never be forgotten. What more can a man do than lay down his life for another? Guy Caltek (ph), U.S. Navy, retired."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "To all my brothers and sisters, may you rest in peace and know that you're not forgotten. With love, Dr. Marion."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. Ladies and gentlemen, at this time what we are going to do is take the tree down to the Vietnam Veterans Memorial. And at that place we will decorate it with the messages.

KAGAN: And we will try to keep that picture up at the same time. We are watching two live events taking place at the same, thousand thousands of miles apart. Both important to the men and women serving in the U.S. military all around the world. On the left part of your screen, this is the annual holiday tree at the Wall ceremony.

They start at the East Mall. You have volunteers and a small group of service members from the Walter Reid Army Hospital, who recently served in Operation Iraqi Freedom. They were reading greetings before the tree is going to be placed at the apex of the Wall and decorated with the cards, that has been put together by volunteers and visitors, sending greetings to U.S. military members all around the world.

On the right part of your screen, a very moving scene for a different reason. You have some 40 to 50 members of the U.S. military wounded yesterday in the attack at the military base near Mosul. They are being brought to Ramstein Air Base in Germany. They are going to the Landstuhl Military Hospital, just a couple miles away.

Our Matthew Chance is standing by in Germany, as those soldiers are being brought off the plane -- Matthew.

CHANCE: Thanks, Daryn. And as you can see, that process of unloading those 40 to 50 -- 50 is what the latest figure is. They've been waiting to count the number of people who get off the plane. We can see that process now starting to happen. They off-loaded some cargo ahead of taking the actual injured passengers off the aircraft. Again, 22 people killed, 72 injured in this.

We understand that more planes like this are being readied, or may be readied, and may make their way to this Ramstein Air Base as well. If more from the injured from that devastating attack in Mosul have to be medivacked out of Iraq, they will be brought here first and stabilized, as these people are going to be before making their way back home to the U.S.

As I say, the most critical of these patients will be taken off first and moved straight to hospital. Then we will see the less critical patients come off. Some of them will be able to walk. Thirteen of them, we are told in fact, will be able to walk. That's the understanding of the U.S. military officials right here.

But it has been quite interesting events because, you know, the holiday period. There wasn't an offensive under way in Iraq and these are such unexpected influx of casualties. And so it's been quite an effort under way at the Landstuhl Hospital for military authorities to call back the medical teams, or the doctors or nurses, or the specialists who had been given leave over the holiday period to call them back from their families to come in to prepare the right teams, to give these soldiers the kind of treatment they're going to need when they get to the hospital in the next hour or two -- Daryn.

KAGAN: Yes. And yet, as military medical personnel, I am sure they understand that is all part of the job.

Looking at these pictures from Ramstein, Matthew, this is a scene that we have seen many times before, too many times. And this is Landstuhl being one of the largest U.S. military hospitals in the world. This is where the injured are brought.

CHANCE: That's absolutely right. In fact, I have a statistic from the start of the Iraq War. Nearly 18 and a half thousand patients have been treated at the Landstuhl Medical Facility. U.S. Army -- U.S. military, you know, personnel, of course, injured both in battle and non-battle injuries as well. But that's an extremely high number of people who have been injured and treated at the Landstuhl Medical Facility.

Some 45 of them are in the hospital right now. So that's not a great number. One of the reasons why many of the medical staff were given time off over the holiday period, because there were not that many patients actually being treated. But obviously, this new influx will change all that. And it's a very busy place, I imagine, right now as they prepare to receive some of these extremely serious casualties, as a result of that blast in Mosul into the hospital over the course of the next few hours -- Daryn.

KAGAN: Matthew, do we expect any kind of ceremony as the soldiers are brought off? Or this is an operation meant to just get them off the plane and to the medical treatment they need to receive?

CHANCE: Yes. This is not going to be any kind of military ceremony. This is not the welcoming ceremony as such. This is purely a military operation, a medical operation to get these people into the best kind of treatment that they're going to need. Firs of all, to save their lives.

There are at least eight people on that plane are extremely close to death. They are in critical condition. It is the intensive care, the specialist skills of the doctors here in Landstuhl that is going to be required to save their lives. So, this is not a ceremony. This is not something that they are putting on for the cameras.

They allowed us in to witness this because we lobbied them so hard to do that. But this is something that is a military operation. This is a medical procedure to get these people safely transferred. And I imagine there are quite important medical complications in transporting people, and then transferring them on to an ambulance like this. And then moving them by road to another hospital, when people are in such an unstable state, people in such poor states of health, with such serious injuries. That in itself can be a risky business. So, this is a serious event that is taking place indeed. And one that is not altogether without risk for the people involved -- Daryn.

KAGAN: All right. Matthew, we're going to keep your live picture up. You were mentioning it is the holidays. They had to call back a lot of military medical personnel in order to treat the soldiers, who are coming there to Ramstein and the Landstuhl U.S. Military Hospital.

It being the holidays, we want to show you a little bit more tape. This was tape that was just shot in Washington, D.C. at the ceremony, taking place at the Wall, the Vietnam Veterans Memorial. The holiday tree ceremony.

They have gathered greetings from volunteers and people just wishing well to U.S. military members around the world, wishing to read those greetings at the wall and then place the Christmas tree at the wall.

So, let's listen to the greetings while we watch the live pictures from Ramstein.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "Today I remember and pray for my daughter in the United States Army in Iraq. Merry Christmas, Julie. Come home to us. Jane Goodman."

I just might want to add, I pray that they all come home safe and with with our families. Happy Holidays to all. Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From Ann Chalmers, "We appreciate what you have done for us and our country. Thanks."

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "There are no words I could ever write to let you know what I feel in my heart for you all. You humble me with the sacrifices you have made. God bless you and keep you throughout eternity."

Hope all our guys come home, men and women. Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "To all who have served or will serve, you will not be forgotten."

I just like to add, I'm an OIF veteran. I will be going back next week to finish the mission. And I want to send my thoughts and prayers to the comrades over there now and to all the soldiers, especially the ones in Mosul yesterday. And pray that all our guys come home safe.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "Thanks for everything."

As a personal note, I would like to say Happy Holidays to all the service men and women serving overseas in Iraq and Afghanistan. To everybody Merry Christmas, Happy New Year's. Thanks.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: May this Wall always be a reminder of those who sacrificed their lives, and all who served in this war in service to our country to end our ordeal. Vernon Olson."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "Your courage and dedication to the freedom of our country will always be remembered by our family. Shirley Dee."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "All of you war heroes are truly honorable men and women with dignity. I salute you and support you to the fullest. Happy Holidays, Merry Christmas, and thanks to the service and devotion to this great country. David."

KAYE: And as we continue to look at these live pictures, we want to bring our Kathleen Koch back in.

Kathleen, from what we understand, the FBI is already on the ground in Mosul at Camp Marez. And they are beginning or in the midst of already a detailed explosives forensic investigation there, to try and find out exactly what was behind this attack yesterday. Whether it was a rocket, whether it was mortar rounds or possibly even a bomb planted inside that dining tent.

Can you tell us, if you can, what exactly that forensic investigation may entail?

KOCH: Well, obviously -- Randi, what they will be looking at is the sort of evidence that the Task Force Olympia spokesman spoke with CNN about. They're going to be looking for perforations, things like these very identically circular, concentric holes that this spokesman told us were inside the stainless steel kitchen equipment. Perhaps also, say in any wooden beams in the area, perhaps embedded in of the some tables.

They will look for that as a possible signature of something used as shrapnel, perhaps ball bearings inside a bomb. That would have a different pattern from, say something opposed as a mortar or rocket that came from above and then landed within, versus a bomb that exploded from the bottom and went out. They will look at that type of thing.

This incident also is raising a lot of questions, not only about should there be more hardened structures for the military to dine in Iraq? But should there be more patrols around the many military installations? There have been commanding officers who have requested more manpower for those patrols, but have been turned down. And of course, then the U.S. military announced in recent weeks it would be beefing up the numbers of U.S. forces in Iraq, up to 150,000 from the current 138,000.

But the plan right now is for those forces to really focus their efforts on keeping areas around the polling places safe, not closed in. That will be done by the Iraqi military. But they will sort of form perimeters around -- in a larger area around the areas where people will be voting in order to keep them safe. But they're focus at this point is not planned to be a security for the U.S. military -- Randi.

KAYE: And Kathleen, I would imagine some of this investigation, besides the forensics, would also include interviewing some witnesses who survived the attack, who may have been either inside that dining hall or may be just there on the base. Have you heard any...

KOCH: They would be interviewing witnesses. And they will also be going over carefully the roster of Iraqis who are employed at Camp Marez. As I mentioned earlier, there are a lot of Iraqis hired to do jobs that there simply are not enough U.S. service members to do it.

And again, some very basic tasks. So they could be the ones constructing this new metal and cement dining hall at Camp Marez. They're doing things also like working in the dining halls, being interpreters. So they're going to be very carefully going over that roster to see what Iraqis had access to the base. In particular that day, where were they all? Can they be accounted for? Where are they all right now -- Randy?

KAYE: All right. Kathleen Koch with more information for us this morning. Thank you.

Effects of the attack ripple across the world and make force an agonizing wait for the relatives of those serving in Iraq. Here is one family awaiting word on the fate of a loved one.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just not knowing is so hard wrenching for us because we just want to know if he was there or wasn't there.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Losing a loved one already and knowing that your brother is Iraq, I tell people my Christmas is canceled. It's hard knowing that your brother is out there fighting for your country, but out of nowhere he might be hurt and his life just taken away out of nowhere. And you can't be there with him for his last breath.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAYE: That family had already felt the tragedy of war. Just the day before, they buried a cousin who was killed in another insurgent attack.

KAGAN: We are not going to leave these live pictures. Once again, the live picture coming from the Ramstein Air Base in Germany. Our information tells us about 50 or more soldiers onboard that military plane. About 13 of them might be able to walk off by themselves. The rest of them need stretchers and ambulances taking them to the U.S. military hospital in Landstuhl.

We say that there's 50 or more. It's possible they are -- and we can start seeing some being carried off there. We are also getting information that all 50 might not be from the attack that took place yesterday in Mosul. Of course, it's not surprising there were other injuries and attacks around Iraq, and some of those soldiers needing to be transported as well for some medical help.

Our Matthew Chance standing by as we are just starting to see the first soldiers carried off.

CHANCE: Thanks, Daryn. That's right. The first soldier has now been carried off; it seems being loaded on to the ambulance.

Now, you asked me earlier about why they were taking the cargo off. So a number of reasons for that, I checked into it. But one reason is that's the way they loaded the plane coming from Iraq. Because as a matter of balance, they need a heavier load at the back so they put the cargo at the back. So obviously, it had to be taken off first.

Though while that was happening there were handovers inside the aircraft between the medical teams that had brought the injured from Iraq, and the medical teams who will be taking responsibility for them now. Each, individual patient, of course, had to be discussed. And so each medical team, or the new medical team, if you'd like, knew exactly what the circumstances were, the injuries were for each, individual patient. And that has taken some considerable time.

Now, the eight people who are said to be critical, they are already being off-loaded now. That's what the conversations were about on board the plane, to make sure these people were in the best kind of care and got the best possible kind of attention to make that journey, by these blue-black tag ambulances to the Landstuhl Medical Facility, which is a few miles down the road.

As you mentioned, on board, possibly as many as 50 people. And you also indicated it's not altogether clear that those people are all from the Mosul attack. Certainly it seems that the vast majority of them are, perhaps as many as 40 are from the attack in Mosul. But there may be others on board as well, that were injured in other areas of Iraq and just got on board the plane as it came here at the Ramstein Air Base.

At any rate, all of them will be taken from here to the Landstuhl Medical Facility, where they will get that care they need before they are shipped back home, possibly some of them in time for Christmas.

KAGAN: Matthew, doing some math. A little bit of math here, as you were pointing out, this is going slowly. They are taking their time. They are taking care. If they have 50 people to unload off this plane, I imagine this is going to go on for some time. CHANCE: It's not going to be a quick operation at all, because the main concern is, of course, making sure these people are secure, they are properly sort of secured on to the stretchers. And they will be taken off the plane on and to make sure that is done with the minimum possible risk to them, so they don't incur further injury in transporting.

Obviously transporting people who are so severely injured is a risky business. This could take as long as an hour, it could take longer than that even. It depends on complications that may arise inside the plane while we transport off these people. Obviously, the first people getting off are the people more critical. The people with lesser injuries will be taken off next, and then the 13 or so individuals who are able to walk, walk off the plane.

They may even have some interaction with us here, possibly a wave. Perhaps nothing else for the cameras here that have been waiting at the Ramstein Air Base to see whatever we can see here -- Daryn.

KAGAN: Well, you know there will be family members back in the States looking to see a glimpse if they happen to know one of their loved ones is one of the injured.

A behind the scenes question for you here, Matthew. You were mentioning how CNN had to lobby in order to show these pictures. I know with the dead, the U.S. military has a policy of not allowing the media to shoot pictures. Some say it's out of respect for the families and dead. Some say it's the U.S. military trying not to show casualties and the cost of this war.

How is it that the military is allowing pictures of the wounded to be shown?

CHANCE: Well, they are allowing us this kind of access. But you'll notice that we are taking basically pretty wide shots. And they have also surrounded the actual area where the people are being brought off the back of the plane with military personnel who, I think, have been placed there intentionally to prevent us from getting very clear shots of the actual individuals involved.

And in fact, it's been made quite clear to us by the personnel officers here, the press officers here that we've been dealing with, that we're not permitted to take close ups of the faces of the injured as they come off the plane. Because they say they don't want the family members back at home to be able to recognize any of these people.

And one of the reasons for that, and this is a legitimate reason for that, is that they haven't had the opportunity as yet to make it clear to every family, every mother, every father, every wife of all the people that have been caught up in this blast. I'm sure at this point most of the people whose loved ones were killed in this attack have by now been notified.

But when it comes to the injuries -- and remember, there were 72 injuries as a result of this attack in Mosul -- it's a big operation, notifying all the family members and wives, that there may be an injury involved. Again, some of the injuries, though some of them are very serious, some of them aren't very serious at all. Nevertheless, it could be distressing for the families if they see a son, or a husband or a brother walk off this plane here, having not known any indication at all that they were even in Mosul at the time of the attack -- Daryn.

KAGAN: Very good point. There's no good way to find out that your loved one has been injured during military service. However, finding their picture on national television would not be among the best.

Matthew, stand by. Kathleen Koch wanted to get on this question of some pictures being allowed, some not.

KATHLEEN KOCH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Daryn, at Dover Air Force Base, as you mentioned, that, again, is where the bodies of the 18 Americans killed in this deadly explosion will be brought and prepared for burial, for delivery to their families. Since the end of the first Persian Gulf War, back in 1990, they stopped the practice of allowing cameras to go there and witness the ceremony. It is a very solemn ceremony that goes on, that does occur out of the view of the cameras, and out of the view of families. The military explained to us -- we went there just before the invasion of Iraq began, and I was one of the few journalists that got a tour of the facilities at Dover and saw just how they will prepare the bodies. And we were told the military did not want families to feel compelled to spend their money to come to all the way to Dover for a ceremony there and accompany the bodies home, that they felt that that was too much of a burden on the families.

So what does occur, though, even though there are no family members there, no cameras there, is there an honor guard in full dress uniform that greets every casket, carries it off the plane, draped with a flag, and it's brought into the facility, and every piece of human remains is handled with great dignity and great care, labeled everything -- in particular, the personal belongings.

I had an interesting discussion with someone there at Dover Air Force Base who cleans and prepares the personal belongings to be returned to the family along with the remains of their loved one. And that person said it is sometimes very, very difficult handling those belongings. Sometimes there are half-finished letters, and that gentleman told me he had to resist the impulse at that time to finish that letter to the loved one who would be receiving the body. It's a very difficult job that they do, but they take great pride in it.

Another interesting thing, they have every single uniform from every branch of U.S. military at Dover Air Force Base. And every single insignia, star, bar on hand so they can completely replicate the dress uniform...

KAGAN: Kathleen, let me just jump in here a second, but I want to talk about these live pictures that we're just seeing from Ramstein. And that one of the stretchers being loaded off the plane and loaded onto the ambulance, very slowly, very gingerly, with a lot of equipment attached.

And our Matthew Chance, who is there, was pointing out they are taking great care. A number of these wounded are critically wounded, and moving slowly to get these wounded soldiers to the exact kind of medical help that they need.

Kathleen, we're going to get back to you and we're going to keep these live pictures up, but meanwhile, Randi has another story for us.

RANDI KAYE, CNN ANCHOR: We are going to keep these live pictures up for you as we await more wounded soldiers to be removed from that plane at Ramstein. And families, we're told, are still awaiting some word, so you won't be seeing here on CNN any closeups of those wounded soldiers being taken off that plane.

Meanwhile, one Virginia woman did not have to wait long for news on her loved one. Her husband himself made the call. We get the details from reporter Kay Young of CNN affiliate WAVY in Norfolk, Virginia.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TRISH OTTO: When I got the phone call, he said, honey, I want you to know that I'm OK, and that I love you and I'm fine. Everything is OK, but something bad has happened.

KAY YOUNG, WAVY REPORTER: Lieutenant Sean Otto made one call to his wife Trish Tuesday morning. He was referring a deadly rocket attack on a dining hall tent in Mosul Iraq. Fourteen U.S. soldiers, at least two from Otto's Richmond-based engineer battalion were killed.

OTTO: And I know deep inside it's breaking his heart, because he loves his soldiers. He would do anything, give his life for any of them.

YOUNG: Before the attack and the phone call, Trish and her sons were expecting news about Sean. She knew he would be featured in a "Richmond Times Dispatch" article. But the report changed when explosions blew through the dining hall. Lieutenant Otto, who was not hurt in the attack, focused on helping the injured, while for him, the worst was happening.

OTTO: He just said yesterday in the article that -- today's actual article that hey, we've made it this far, we haven't lost any men. And then in the updated article he said, we almost made it, we almost made it home without losing anybody.

YOUNG: Trish considers it a gift that her husband survived. But her mind races with questions because he's still not on his way home.

OTTO: Is there going to be another attack tonight? Is there going to be another one tomorrow? You know, it makes you wonder and worry.

(END VIDEOTAPE) KAYE: That was reporter Kay Young of CNN affiliate WAVY in Norfolk, Virginia. At the bottom of the hour, we will hear from a military widow who formed a grief support group, named, appropriately enough, TAPS.

KAGAN: And in fact as we go ahead and do this in a fluid motion, we're going to ahead and talk to her right now, Randi.

As we watch these live pictures of the wounded being taken off, we have gotten information about some 50 or so will be taken off this cargo plane, loaded on to ambulances and taken to the military hospital in Landstuhl, it's important not to forget that at least 22 people, 14 U.S. soldiers, four U.S. civilians and four Iraqi security forces lost their lives yesterday in that attack on Mosul.

The military takes pride in taking care of its own. There's also this independent program called TAPS, that Randi was mentioning. This program provides an extra level of care for families. TAPS matches military survivors with similar experiences. It was started 10 years ago by Bonnie Carroll after the death of her husband, Brigadier General Tom Carroll.

Bonnie joining us now from New York.

Thank you for being with us, Mrs. Carroll.

BONNIE CARROLL, FOUNDER, TAPS: Thank you very much.

KAGAN: Unfortunately you know only too well, what it feels like to receive the notification with the worst possible news about your loved one.

CARROLL: Yes.

KAGAN: Can you tell us about that moment for you?

CARROLL: Yes, my husband was killed in the United States Army, and my heart goes out to the families who receive that news yesterday. TAPS is a wonderful, loving, caring family now in existence since 1994, providing support to all of those who have served and sacrificed.

KAGAN: As we watch live pictures of the wounded being taken off the plane now, 24 hours ago here on this program, we were watching this story unfold live, and we were getting some of the first pictures in. They were still pictures, and sometimes the still pictures can tell even more of a moving and dramatic story than live video can. And I just had to stop while we were doing this yesterday and think about these thousands of families, because there's about 8,500 people stationed near where this attack took place, thousands of families that must have been tuning in, looking to see if there was sight of their loved ones. If you could talk a little bit about that waiting and not knowing.

CARROLL: Yes, you do, you wait, and hope and pray. And even if your family is not effected, I've been talking with the families out at Ft. Lewis, and their hearts are there, with their service members, with those who were lost, with the families, and it is a comfort to them. I was out at Ft. Lewis a few weeks ago working with the families, just in the event of something such as this, and now we are altogether as one, grieving a loss, and comforting those who have suffered.

KAGAN: And it is important what you and your organization are doing because as we are watching -- the obvious here, the people who are physically wounded in the attack near Mosul, they need the medical attention. But the families waiting and worrying back here, they need attention as well, so -- and care. So what can be done for them? What does your organization do with them?

CARROLL: Well, TAPS is a wonderful support network, providing primarily peer relationships to get families together with others who have been there and truly understand, as in any situation like this, that we speak our own language. And just to connect with another who's -- who understands. All those who have served in the military have risen above the rest of society in character, courage, honor and ability. And As one of our TAPS moms told me the other day, it's not a matter of how long we live, but it's what we stand for, and each of those serving today has stood for freedom.

KAGAN: Another important number to look at, I think, as we feel for the families that have lost loved ones, that have injured soldiers coming off the plane, if you think about the 8,500 families that have loved ones serving there, most of them, most of the loved ones are OK. And yet, the waiting and worrying has got to be terrible.

CARROLL: It is tough. It is tough. I had the chance this year to serve in Iraq for six months, and I think sometimes it was harder on me worrying about the family back home, but the experience of being there and being able to offer immediate support is wonderful.

KAGAN: And this time of year in particular, Bonnie, with the holidays, what kind of advice, what kind of comfort does TAPS offer to those that you work with?

CARROLL: TAPS is really a loving family. As one of our young widows said, it's her safe place to land, a safe place to be. Our phones are answered 24 hours a day, seven days a week. We've got a wonderful Web site at taps.org that has information specifically for coping with the holidays.

And it is a time when we come together. We have online chats, we have support groups meeting all over the country. We really have a family that comes together, whether it's parents, children, siblings, fiances. All those affected by a loss, regardless of circumstances or geography, have a home here.

KAGAN: And I think we're getting ready to watch -- yes, I think we have another stretcher with another wounded soldier being brought off the plane. He will be loaded onto one of these buses, which is serving also as an ambulance and taken to the hospital in Landstuhl. Bonnie, from your own experience, from having lost your husband during military service, what have you learned and what do you know that you didn't know before?

CARROLL: Well, you know, a very wise woman asked me in the depth of my own grief if my husband had enriched my life. And you know, that really took me back. And I said my goodness, yes, he -- in so many ways. And she asked me what I was going to do with those riches. And I think that's what all of our families and children and parents feel as they have been blessed by the love of an amazing person who served their country. And it's now an opportunity. We see such patriotism with our families.

KAGAN: Well, we appreciate your comments and your service to other families. Good luck with your work.

CARROLL: Thank you.

KAGAN: It's very important. Bonnie Carroll with TAPS. One more time, for the families out there, tell us what the Web site is, please?

CARROLL: It's taps.org. And our phone number is 800-959-taps. We're there for them.

KAGAN: Very easy to remember. Thank you so much.

CARROLL: Thank you very much.

KAGAN: Randy.

KAYE: All right and once again, we are going to keep with the live pictures here from Ramstein Air Base as the wounded soldiers are taken off that airplane. We also showed you that earlier today there was a holiday ceremony thanking veterans and active duty military -- has just wrapped up that ceremony in Washington. A holiday tree was placed at the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Wall. The tree has been decorated with cards sent in from across America.

And CNN's Judy Woodruff joins us now from the wall. She was there to witness that ceremony this morning. Good morning, Judy.

JUDY WOODRUFF, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, Randy. This is the ceremony that has taken place every year for many years. And as you said, they do put a tree there at the base of the Vietnam Memorial. You have Vietnam veterans and others remembering those who gave their lives in Vietnam decades ago. But today the ceremony took on a very special meeting because of not only the war in Iraq, but in particular yesterday's carnage in Mosul.

And as Jan Scruggs -- just a few minutes ago, who heads the Vietnam Veterans, told the group, he said -- and he choked up as he told the people who had gathered here that the sacrifices go on. The notes that they placed on the three, they read a representative group of them. And they were read by people, including Iraq veterans, people who have gone to Iraq, were wounded, have come home and others who have a special connection with the Vietnam Memorial. Let's listen to some of those messages as they were read.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP))

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There are no words I could ever write to let you know what I feel in my heart for you all. You humble me with the sacrifices you have made. God bless you and keep you throughout eternity. Hope all our guys come home and our women. Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: To all who have served or will serve, you will not been forgotten. I'd just like to add that I'm OIF veteran, I'll be going back next week to finish the mission. And I want to send my thoughts and prayers to my comrades who are over there now, and all the soldiers, especially the ones in Mosul yesterday. And pray that all our guys come home safe.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WOODRUFF: So Daryn and Randy, the overwhelming message is here is -- we remember those who gave their lives in Vietnam, who served in Vietnam. And we want the troops serving right now in Iraq to know that their country is behind them. Some individual expressions of misgivings, frankly, here about the war, but overwhelming support for the troops themselves and what they're going through. Back to you.

KAYE: So again, this is an annual service that they hold there, but certainly very special meaning earlier today this year. Certainly. Thank you. Judy Woodruff at the Vietnam Wall for us.

KAGAN: We're going to keep those live pictures up. More and more soldiers, we hear as many as 50, on board that cargo transport plane being taken off, loaded onto the ambulance buses. And they will be taken to the Landstuhl U.S. Military Hospital in Landstuhl.

President Bush yesterday, speaking about the attack. Let's listen to his comments.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Today we had a rocket attack that took a lot of lives. Any time of the year is a time of sorrow and sadness when we lose a loss of life. This time of year is particularly sorrowful for the families as we head into the Christmas season. We pray for them. We send our heartfelt condolences to the loved ones who suffer today. Just want them to know that the mission is a vital mission for peace.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KAGAN: President Bush giving comments yesterday after the attack. That attack took place about noon local time, just outside of Mosul. It was about 4:00 a.m. Eastern time. Lunchtime in the dining hall. You can only imagine how many people were there and the high number of casualties that took place with that attack.

Just the day before, President Bush had given a news conference that was actually live during this program as well. And he was asked about these attacks and the (UNINTELLIGIBLE) attacks in Iraq. And he said frankly, they are going to have an effect, but this is all part of a large battle that the U.S. determined as well as the ruling Iraqi government right now, to hold these elections on January 30th, which is just about five weeks from now.

KAYE: Right. And apparently they did recognize the threat. I mean, Lieutenant General Thomas Metz said yesterday that we recognize there was a threat at these bases and at these -- what they called, I guess, soft structures, like the dining hall or the mess hall where this happened. These attacks were not new. Apparently, as Kathleen Koch told us this morning, they were building a bunker, a hard structure...

KAGAN: Just a few days away from finishing it.

KAYE: Just two days away from finishing that structure to keep the soldiers there and the civilians and anyone there at Camp Marez safer because of dining structures had been attacked on several bases, actually.

KAGAN: No question, a difficult and dangerous operation. Live pictures staying up from Ramstein Air Base. That's where our Matthew Chance is -- Matthew.

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) Well, as you see, the operation to remove those people off the plane is still continuing a pace. It's going to take some time because it's being done in a very painstaking way. We're seeing a couple of instances over the past 30 minutes or so of people being carried full of drips, on stretchers, obviously unconscious or not really, you know, kind of very able to at least not able to walk, at least, being carried off very carefully off that plane onto the blue ambulances that waiting right next to it.

Those are the most critical patients, about eight of them, we're told, in a very serious condition, indeed and who need urgent medical attention at the Landstuhl Medical Facility, a short distance from here. Also on the plane, a good many other survivors of that devastating attack from Mosul. At least 13 people on board are able to walk, we're told. Some of them have broken bones, though. Some have shrapnel wounds as a result of the blast.

The majority, though, majority from Mosul, not able to walk at all and will be carried off, as we've been seeing, on stretchers. They'll be taken the short distance to Landstuhl Medical Facility, where they'll be given whatever specialist attention they need so they can build their strength and then eventually be taken home back to the U.S. -- Daryn.

KAYE: Matthew, I'll take it. If you could, just give us an idea of how this works for the families. We know some special preparations have been made for those who need to be treated there. And some of the medical personnel have been called back to treat them over this holiday time. What arrangements, if any, are being made for family as they are learning of their wounded relatives?

CHANCE: Well, it's an interesting question because you're absolutely right. It's not just the people here who have physical injuries that need treatment. It is, indeed, the families as well, that may require some kind attention, or at least some contact with their loved ones. And at the Landstuhl Medical Facility, there is the facilities available for them to do that.

Indeed, I have spoken to representatives at the -- U.S. representatives at the medical facility and they're saying that there are a number of accommodations that are available to family members, and they are expecting family members of those injured here to come over the coming days to be with their loved ones, particularly the ones in the most critical condition and to try and give them whatever support they can while they're in this very delicate state.

The authorities here in Landstuhl -- over the road in Landstuhl, are very keen for -- of course, they say it gives the patients something to get better more quickly for. So that's something -- they actually encouraged it.

KAGAN: All right, Matthew. We'll get back with you in just a moment and clean up those audio problems we're having in hearing him. Meanwhile, to the Pentagon.

KAYE: To the Pentagon to go to our Kathleen Koch, who is standing by for us.

Kathleen, if you could, just talk a little bit about these dining places. As you told us earlier, they were trying to build a reinforced structure, a bunker, if you will, to try and keep the folks there safe while they would dine, because really these are prime targets. They are gathering places. Yesterday as many as 400 to 500 people there. So that is a fact that the enemy would know.

KOCH: Certainly, Randy, it is, and this was, again, a very large facility, about the size of a football field, again, with the soft, tent-like structure held up by girders over it, but certainly no protection whatsoever from a rocket, mortar or indeed from a bomb, which is one of the possibilities that investigators are now looking at. Again, a spokesman for Task Force Olympia telling CNN that they did find tiny round metal pits in some of the stainless steel kitchen equipment in that mess hall that could indicate that something like ball bearings were used as shrapnel inside of a bomb in order to increase injuries.

The U.S. military, its take right now on the insurgency, recently had been that they were pleased that they said that the violence was down, that it had decreased dramatically, the Pentagon was saying since the offensive on Falluja last month.

Indeed, General George Casey, who is in charge of the multinational forces throughout Iraq, at a press conference last week said the insurgents may be tough, but they are not 10 feet tall, and he really downplayed the impact they were having, though he did say he believes this was an insurgency that will go on for quite some time.

But he pointed out then, as military and top Pentagon officials have pointed out recently, that most of the attacks had been targeted at Iraqis, Iraqi police, Iraqi soldiers, and indeed Iraqi civilians, like the 60 or so we saw killed over the weekend, and then the election workers. So this attack is really a clear departure from that. And, indeed, if it was a bomb that was carried on to the base by one of the many Iraqis who work at U.S. installations in Iraq, work as interpreters, as cooks, as janitorial workers, if it was carried on there, then that would be a radical departure from these random mortars and rockets that are lobbed quickly, say, by someone, who jumps out of a car, sets up a launcher, shoots it off without much precision, jumps back into a car and runs off. This would be a very new tactic -- Randi.

KAYE: All right, Kathleen, stick with us for just a second as we watch more pictures, live pictures coming to us from Ramstein Air Base there as yet another critically wounded soldier is loaded into one of those buses serving as ambulances that is standing by there at the base.

KAGAN: This attack happened about 35, 36 hours ago from Iraq. Want to get the latest there and bring our Karl Penhaul in. He is standing by from Baghdad -- Karl.

KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Daryn. We've been talking now to the spokesman up at that Camp Marez base up in Mosul to find out what the latest is from there as far as the FBI investigation. As we know from 2:00 a.m. local time, an FBI team was flown to the base to begin investigations, a detailed investigation of the explosions seen in that dining hall. Now obviously that investigation has been going on for the past 14, 16 hours.

What we do know from Lieutenant Colonel Hastings up there from Camp Marez is that certain round elements of shrapnel have been found. He says that these are like ball bearings, or BBs that have been spread around. It would depend on what type of explosive was used as to what type of shrapnel that causes, because typically, a mortar or a rocket may create jagged parts of shrapnel, where something else could create these round very symmetrical perforations which have been found in some of the kitchen equipment inside of that dining room.

What Lieutenant Colonel Hastings has been telling us, that all this goes to show that it was way too early to suggest that it was a rocket or a mortar, that the explosion may have been caused by a placed explosive. We have just come off the phone with him and some of his colleagues in the last few moments, they say it is still too early to tell. The FBI is still continuing a very thorough analysis to find out what kind of explosives would cause this, whether it was an artillery fire or whether somebody walked into that dining hall with some kind of a bomb, placed it and detonated it.

KAGAN: And what about this group that might be taking credit for this attack?

PENHAUL: Well, we have seen claims of responsibility on an Islamic Web site by a group named Ansar Al Sunna. Often these Islamic Web sites are very difficult to verify their authenticity, and also it's very difficult to verify the authenticity of the claims. But we do know from past experience that Ansar Al Sunna is one of the larger rebel factions, one of the larger insurgent factions here in Iraq. We have seen them launch a number of devastating strikes in the past.

For example, last year they claimed responsibility for a suicide car bomb attack on a Turkish embassy here in Baghdad. We also know they launched suicide car bomb attacks on one of the PUK -- one of the Kurdish political party headquarters in the city of Kirkuk. And then earlier this year, in February, two suicide bombers carried backpacks loaded with explosives into the headquarters of political parties up north, and they exploded there as well.

So it does seem these Ansar Al Sunna insurgents are pretty well- skilled, pretty well-versed in suicide attacks. They've also been known to hostage take and to kill hostages. So they have a very varied way of operating. As far as their origins, and we understand that Ansar Al Sunna was made up of a number of factions that came together under one banner. One of those factions, we understand, was Ansar Al Islam, the members of the group claimed to have originated from Al Qaeda factions, and some others made up of Arab Sunnis from here from Iraq. One of their prominent leaders, we understand, is a Jordanian. You'll remember, of course, that another Jordanian has been operating here in Iraq, Abu Musab Al Zarqawi. Unclear, though, what the relationship may be between Ansar Al Sunna and the Zarqawi network -- Daryn.

KAGAN: But to give us a bigger and a better picture of the insurgent movement across Iraq, it's not like it's some centralized movement. It appears to be a bunch of individualized groups working on their own, based on what they think their own passions are.

PENHAUL: It depends who you talk to. Last week, I spent a lot of time talking to U.S. generals, and what emerged from my conversations with them is that they have very little idea of the size of the insurgency. They say their estimates range anything between 4,000 to 20,000 hardcore fighters. They say that they have little idea of how the various insurgent factions are coordinating between themselves. So what we then did, we actually made contact with an insurgent commander here in Baghdad. He was a former general under Saddam Hussein, and now he is an insurgent general. That story was verified by our sources. What he told us was that the backbone of this resistance across Iraq is being led by former military men, former members of Saddam Hussein's army and its intelligence network.

On top of that, he also said that Saddam Hussein brought in a number of Arab volunteers from neighboring countries in the last days of his regime and trained them, as well as Baath Party members, in guerrilla tactics. And from there, there are other Islamic factions, Islamic fundamentalist factions, that are also fighting, but a lot of those may have a relationship with the groups of Arab volunteers that Saddam Hussein himself brought.

So if one looks at that picture, then that could indicate that there is a little more coordination between these guerrilla factions than previously thought. But what the U.S. military tells us is that they can't say that for sure, because they haven't intercepted too many different types of communications between these different groups.

What they do say, though, is there may be some outside help from leading members in countries such as Syria or Iran -- Daryn.

KAGAN: Thank you very much, Karl Penhaul, live in Baghdad.

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