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CNN Live Today
Tragedy in Tennessee; Jill Carroll's Return; Saddam Hussein on Trial; April Madness?; Eligible for Execution
Aired April 04, 2006 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DARYN KAGAN, CNN ANCHOR: Tough day in parts of the Midwest, floods and mudslides and tornadoes. What's next in this wild week of weather?
First to northern California, a flood alert is in place this morning, following a series of storms. Rains have triggered mudslides across the region and more rain is falling there today.
In North Dakota and Minnesota, floodwaters are rising. The Red River is expected to crest tomorrow in Fargo at more than 20 feet above flood stage. Dozens of homes are at risk.
In parts of the South and Midwest, a trail of destruction from tornadoes, search crews are still looking for more possible victims. Those violent storms battered eight states.
West Tennessee bore the brunt of the tornadoes and severe storms. At least two dozen people there were killed. And across two counties, scenes of incredible damage.
Our Jonathan Freed is with me now from Newbern, Tennessee -- Jonathan.
JONATHAN FREED, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Daryn.
I'm standing in the remains of the United Methodist Church here. We're just outside of Newbern. And the governor of Tennessee just did a flyover in a helicopter looking at the path that this tornado cut right through here. It was about 20 miles long, and we're in the middle of that, more or less. And he told CNN before he went on this tour that the death toll has risen by one. It was 23 in Tennessee, and it is now, unfortunately, up to 24.
Now what I can tell you about here is this part of the church, it appears to be the platform area. You can see some metal chairs that are twisted now where we think the choir would probably have sat. Down here, Daryn, looks to be what was the main chapel area of this church.
And as the sun came up here today, we were really able to get a chance to take a look around in all directions, and all you see is destruction. I mean, this tornado was an F3, Daryn. It was moving at about 200 miles an hour and it was about a quarter to half a mile wide, depending on its progress.
Now we spoke to one gentleman who is a horse farmer here. And he and his wife grabbed their grandchild and took shelter in a bathroom. And let's listen to what happened to them after that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUD CUDE, TORNADO SURVIVOR: But I felt the house shudder and move. I thought it shook it on the foundation a little bit. I had no idea, until I opened my eyes, that we was looking at the sky.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FREED: Basically what he was saying is that the house was just completely destroyed around him. He said the highest part of the house that was left, Daryn, were just the walls surrounding the bathroom. They came out and they saw the sky -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Absolutely incredible stories to be told.
Jonathan Freed, thank you.
And now more stories from people who stared down that monster tornado.
Our Ed Lavandera has that.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The tornado touched down outside of Dyersburg in the western part of the state. Sheriff Jeff Holt was standing on an overpass tracking the storm. He says in seconds it grew to a half-mile wide.
SHERIFF JEFF HOLT, DYER COUNTY, TENNESSEE: I could see just the sheer size of it, you know I knew it must be packing a pretty good punch behind it. When I got inside of the funnel cloud itself, you know I knew this was not going to turn out good.
LAVANDERA: A few minutes later, the storm was carving a 25-mile long path across homes and open fields. Massive trees splintered like twigs, homes just disintegrated.
Bud Cude saw the funnel cloud. He grabbed his wife and grandchild and jumped into the bathroom for cover.
CUDE: We were right there between the commode and the vanity. It sounded like a freight train moving toward us. And we came out that little bitty window right yonder, where we had to get out. That's tallest thing standing.
LAVANDERA: When Cude and his family emerged from the rubble, this is what was left of his home. And just a short distance away, he also discovered the storm had killed at least 20 of his prized Tennessee walking horses.
CUDE: Well, it was a nice young colt we were going to develop for somebody to pleasure ride with.
LAVANDERA: Sheriff Jeff Holt has spent 12 years working as sheriff here. Bbut years of experience will never help him cope with what he saw in the debris Sunday night, an 11-month-old baby boy killed by the storm.
HOLT: When you see an 11-month-old victim, those sights don't leave easy.
LAVANDERA: Ed Lavandera, CNN, Dyer County, Tennessee.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KAGAN: The tornado season is very young and yet already very intense. Chad Myers taking a look at that -- Chad.
CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Good morning, Daryn.
Yes, really going here. March was almost a record-breaking month here. We had 226 tornadoes in March. That's 2006. The three-year average is only 49. Year to date now, 350 tornadoes. We should only have 83. And then the terrible number here, the fatalities, 36 already, only a five-year average of 5.
But I'll tell you what, that damage that we talked about, F3, and people want to know is it a 3 or a 4 or a 5. They average -- they kind of took the number at about 200 miles per hour. And then people think, well, you know, wait a minute, that's an F3, that's not as bad as a 4. But the 4 starts at 207, so I mean you're right there. You're just kind of splitting hairs there whether it actually was a 3 or a 4. And from some of the looks of that damage, it sure does look like some of that was F4 in damage. They may go back and look at that again.
(WEATHER REPORT)
KAGAN: Busy week for you, Chad, thank you.
MYERS: You're welcome.
KAGAN: To Washington now and a political shocker, Tom DeLay is calling it quits. Just a month after wining a primary in his home state of Texas, the Republican congressman and former House majority leader has announced he is ending his reelection bid and he's leaving Congress some time in June.
In announcing his decision, DeLay said he is doing what's right for his party and the move is part of his desire to keep his House seat in Republican hands.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. TOM DELAY (R), TEXAS: My loyalty to the Republican Party, indeed my love for the Republican Party, has played no small part in this decision. Having served under Republican and Democrat control in the House, I know firsthand how important it is for Republicans to maintain their national majority.
(END VIDEO CLIP) KAGAN: DeLay and two associates are facing trial in Texas on a money laundering charge. DeLay has denied any wrongdoing.
Sexual predators just a mouse click away from your children. Live this hour on Capitol Hill, lawmakers are hearing from people who know the dangers that lurk on the Internet.
One person testifying before the House committee is a teenager who says he was a victim of those pedophiles. Justin Berry used his Web cam to enter that unseemly world. He says pornographers and predators seized on his innocence, first coaxing him just to take off his shirt on camera, then patiently leading him to increasingly sorted acts.
We're going to hear Justin's testimony. And we warn you, it may not only be disturbing to you, you might want to move your kids out of earshot. And it is because of those kids that Justin Berry says he wants to share his story.
We're going listen in to the hearing and bring you the highlights as they are available.
Prosecutors say he has blood on his hands, new charges against Saddam Hussein in the massacre of thousands of people. A live report ahead on LIVE TODAY.
Her ordeal captured the attention of the world. Now former hostage Jill Carroll comes face to face with those who worked so hard for her release. The emotional homecoming coming up next on CNN LIVE TODAY.
And cells divide, new hope blossoms. Scientists say they are growing new body parts. Our Dr. Sanjay Gupta explains in a moment. Plus, we have the doctor doing this very exciting research.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KAGAN: American journalist Jill Carroll spent 82 days as a hostage in Iraq. Her bosses and co-workers spent that time working behind the scenes for her release. Now an emotional homecoming at "The Christian Science Monitor."
CNN senior correspondent Allan Chernoff shows us.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ALLAN CHERNOFF, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The joyful family reunion videotaped by Jill Carroll's dad, Jim.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hello, everyone.
CHERNOFF: Monday, a celebration of freedom in the newsroom of "The Christian Science Monitor," former hostage Jill Carroll thanked her colleagues for working to get her released.
JILL CARROLL, FREED JOURNALIST: I just want to say how much I'm overwhelmed by how wonderful the paper has been to my family and to everyone.
CHERNOFF: "The Christian Science Monitor," which put freelancer Jill Carroll on its full-time staff after her kidnapping, lobbied governments around the globe to gain her release. Though it's not clear what did the trick, "Monitor" editors say high-level U.S. officials, including FBI Director Robert Mueller, were involved, as were foreign governments. Even Arabic groups, like Hamas and Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood, no friends of the U.S., pushed for release of the American journalist.
The kidnapper's demand for the U.S. to release all female Iraqi prisoners was not met, but Arabic diplomacy expert Richard Schultz believes it was pressure from within the Iraqi government that finally freed Carroll.
RICHARD SCHULTZ, FLETCHER SCHOOL OF DIPLOMACY: Yes, you have people who are elected for the new Parliament who were Sunnis who have connections to the insurgency. Well their connections to the insurgency can be avenues for trying to get someone like her released.
CHERNOFF: Carroll has told "The Monitor" the kidnappers thought she was Jewish. She convinced them she's Christian by repeating the Lord's Prayer and telling them stories from the New Testament. Still, she says, they tried to convert her to Islam.
(on camera): She also told "The Monitor," during her 82 days of captivity, she was moved a few times, was isolated in a dark room where she couldn't see outside and only once was permitted to watch television and read a newspaper. To exercise, she walked around her room, which she said was eight paces wide and she did squats. And to avoid boredom, she sang.
(voice-over): After just a few days of freedom, "The Christian Science Monitor" says Jill is not ready to speak to the general media.
PROF. JACK LEVIN, NORTHEASTERN UNIVERSITY: It is an extremely important thing for someone who's been tortured for 82 days, psychologically, perhaps, but tortured, nonetheless, to get that kind of private time with her family and her friends to restore her psyche. It has been profoundly injured and now this is a way to give her the time to heal.
CHERNOFF (on camera): And to relive it so quickly afterwards could be traumatic again?
LEVIN: Yes. It's very possible that holding a press conference, which would be a good thing to do in terms of public relations, would actually be a horrible thing because it requires that she actually relive the terrible times that she had for those 82 days.
CHERNOFF (voice-over): Jill Carroll needs time to move forward and time to enjoy her newly-found freedom.
Allan Chernoff, CNN, Boston.
(END VIDEOTAPE) KAGAN: A first for Saddam Hussein, it could mean a second trial. The former Iraqi dictator is now charged with genocide for the deaths of thousands of Kurds.
The latest from CNN's Aneesh Raman in Baghdad.
Aneesh, how are these charges different than the ones that Saddam Hussein currently faces?
ANEESH RAMAN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Daryn, good morning.
Saddam Hussein right now is facing a trial with charges of crimes against humanity. As you said, a second indictment issued this morning by the Iraqi High Tribunal includes a charge of genocide. It centers on what took place in the late 1980s, what was dubbed the Anfal campaign, allegedly the systematic destruction of the Kurdish people in Iraq by Saddam's former regime.
Conservative estimates say that well over 100,000 Kurds were killed. Anfal really is infamously defined by what happened in March 1988 in the town of Halabja where some 5,000 residents were killed after a series of chemical attacks. The court says that Halabja incident will be tried separated, but the broader Anfal campaign, they say the investigation into it is complete. They have handed over that docket to the prosecutorial arm of the court.
It is unclear when this second trial could begin, which raises any number of issues, because Saddam is in the midst of a current trial. The second one, we're not told whether it has to wait until the first trial is done or whether the two trials can happen at the same time.
And another issue, Daryn, is whether Saddam will even be present in court for this second trial. According to Iraqi law, at the end of the first trial, if he is found guilty, if he is sentenced to death, that death sentence must be carried out within 30 days of the appellate process ending.
Now Iraq's President Jalal Talabani this morning said a deal is in the works to perhaps sideline any verdict of these trials until all of them are complete. But Saddam faces upwards of 12 trials, which means it could be a lengthy process before he faces any execution -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Definitely go on for years. What about news of the day, some serious violence in Sadr City today?
RAMAN: Yes, suicide car bomb detonating there earlier today. Casualty numbers now say that at least 10 people were killed, some 28 others wounded. Sadr City of course home not just to the capital's majority Shia population but also home to one of the country's strongest Shia militia, the Mehdi Militia, those loyal to Shia cleric Muqtada al-Sadr. They will likely be further infuriated by this attack. They have long said that if Iraq's security forces cannot protect Iraq's Shia community, they will do it. But disbanding these Shia militias is seen as a key element to bringing stability to the country. To do that though, Daryn, you need a government, which is why we heard very strong, blunt statements from Secretary Rice in Iraq just days ago saying that a unity government must form now given all the issues at hand -- Daryn.
KAGAN: Aneesh Raman live from Baghdad.
Aneesh, thank you
We're going to focus just ahead, 17 minutes past the hour, on some sports news here in the U.S. A jab at Barry Bonds. One fan makes a point about steroids. Wait until you see what he threw -- what the fan threw at Barry Bonds. Details when CNN LIVE TODAY returns.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KAGAN: The markets have been open 50 minutes. Let's see how they're doing. Not nearly as smoking as yesterday, the Dow, though, is up, up 14 points. And the Nasdaq up just a little bit. It is in positive territory just by a few points.
So, Barry Bonds. Did you see what happened to him yesterday? He gets needled. The Gators prove their point. April marking both the beginning of baseball season and the final hooray for March Madness.
Here to wrap up both, Will Selva, sports anchor for CNN Headline News.
Good morning.
WILL SELVA, SPORTS ANCHOR, CNN HEADLINE NEWS: Got to love it. Got to love it. A lot going on in the sports world, right?
KAGAN: Huge. Yes. And let's start with something that was very late, passed my bedtime, the national basketball championship.
SELVA: Yes, exactly, something else.
KAGAN: Florida.
SELVA: Florida coming through. Their first national title for the men. And this is coming from a school that is mostly known as a football school.
KAGAN: Absolutely.
SELVA: One of the guys, Joakim Noah. He was one of the stars here.
KAGAN: Let's talk about his story, because he is the son of a famous athlete. And this was his chance in a different country to claim a different kind of court and a different kind of championship. There's dad.
SELVA: That's right. That's right. There's Yannick Noah, 1983 French Open winner. He was later inducted into the Hall of Fame. Interestingly enough, Joakim Noah's mom is former Miss Sweden and she's also a famous sculptor as well. So Joakim is very well traveled and very well read.
But what ended up happening, what is so compelling about this story is that last season in Florida's opening round loss, he played just two minutes. So what he ended up doing is going to his head coach, Billy Donovan, in tears and said what can I do? His coach said be patient, kid, your time will come. Sure enough, it did.
KAGAN: OK. Well let's talk about that head coach, Billy Donovan, 40 years old,...
SELVA: Forty years old.
KAGAN: ... a national championship and a little piece of sports history himself.
SELVA: Yes, that's right. What's interesting about his story is that his mentor is Rick Pitino, who is the head coach at Louisville. And 10 years ago, he told him, you know what, don't take this gig.
KAGAN: At Florida?
SELVA: At Florida.
KAGAN: Yes.
SELVA: Because, again, it's known for football and...
KAGAN: And, at the time, Steve Spurrier, the legendary college football coach.
SELVA: Exactly.
KAGAN: Yes.
SELVA: And so he is the youngest coach or the youngest coach under 50 to have a national title, active that is.
KAGAN: Well also played very successful as a player.
SELVA: Exactly.
KAGAN: Yes.
SELVA: At Providence, too, when he played with Rick Pitino. So it is an incredible story there. Great story lines for the game.
KAGAN: Good sports legacy.
OK, opening day in baseball. This is going to be, I think, a baseball season that we never forget, mainly focused on Barry Bonds. The San Francisco Giants opened up their season in San Diego yesterday. Talk about the welcome that Barry Bonds.
SELVA: Well it's the kind of welcome that he's going to be getting, Daryn, anywhere that he goes. I mean he's going to get booed. He's going to get jeered. And this has been the case for him throughout his entire career. But right now he sits at 700 home runs, 6 shy of Babe Ruth's milestone.
KAGAN: But talk about this picture. What was this?
SELVA: This was something else.
KAGAN: Yes.
SELVA: Somebody...
KAGAN: Let's show that again. Can we rewrap that?
SELVA: Somebody from the sellout crowd there in San Diego threw a plastic syringe. Thankfully it didn't have any needle attached to it. And obviously that in response to the fact that Major League Baseball is investigating Barry Bonds and other baseball stars for alleged steroid use.
KAGAN: Yes.
SELVA: And you see there, he picked it up. He even said, hey listen, if the fans want to do this to me, that's up to them, but that's not something that I'm looking forward to, obviously. But thankfully it didn't have a needle attached to it. But you know it is going to be something that he's going to be facing every stadium that he goes to. And love him or hate him, and there are a lot of people in the camp that either love or hate Barry Bonds.
KAGAN: Pretty much.
SELVA: Yes, exactly.
KAGAN: Yes.
SELVA: Pretty much. His vision and his focus is amazing right now, so.
KAGAN: Says I don't read the books, I don't listen to all the stuff, but they could have used something yesterday, because the Giants got spanked by the Padres.
SELVA: Yes, they did. Barry Bonds was 1 for 4 and no home runs. So I'm telling you, the media scrutiny on him for every single game is just going to increase, increase, increase.
KAGAN: Giants open up at home on Thursday against the Atlanta Braves.
SELVA: The Atlanta Braves, that's right.
KAGAN: Go Braves! Well we can say that because we're like co- workers with them.
SELVA: Well, yes, all right, I guess.
KAGAN: You know this company owns CNN has owned the Braves.
SELVA: Well you want to lump me into it, OK.
KAGAN: Yes.
SELVA: All right.
KAGAN: If those are the kind of co-workers you should claim.
SELVA: Well, are we going to get box seats, though, or what's up?
KAGAN: I'll introduce you to some people up there. It can be done.
SELVA: I know some people who know some people.
KAGAN: It can be done. You stay around here long enough, it can be done.
Will, thank you.
You can see Will every morning on Headline News on "ROBIN & COMPANY." Gets up very early, way too early to stay up and watch those late games.
SELVA: Yes. Remind me.
KAGAN: Get a nap.
Thank you, Will.
Well personal beliefs and public debates, we're going to talk about the power of prayer. Some say they know prayers can help the sick. Science isn't so sure. Faith is our focus just ahead on CNN LIVE TODAY.
And do you need a new body part? Why not grow it yourself? Our Dr. Sanjay Gupta goes inside the lab for a medical fete that may be hard to believe.
You're watching CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KAGAN: The jury's decision was unanimous and it could mean that the only man charged in the U.S. in connection with the 9/11 attacks may soon face the death penalty. Phase two of Zacarias Moussaoui's sentencing trial begins Thursday.
Our justice correspondent Kelli Arena has more.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KELLI ARENA, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Zacarias Moussaoui sat there ignoring the judge and jury, mumbling to himself. When the court was asked to stand for the verdict to be read, he defiantly remained seated. They jury unanimously decided Moussaoui is responsible for at least one death on September 11th.
EDWARD ADAMS, COURT SPOKESMAN: By this verdict the jury has found that death is a possible sentence in this case.
ARENA: As Moussaoui left the courtroom, he yelled, "You'll never get my blood! God curse you all!" His defense team had no comment.
The Justice Department said it's pleased with the jury's ruling. That same jury will now hear more testimony and decide what Moussaoui's sentence will be. It has two choices: death or life in prison.
KENDALL COFFEY, FMR. U.S. ATTORNEY: I think death penalty eligible is going to turn into death penalty certain, because one of the key things in this next phase is going to be victim impact testimony, how person after person who lost loved ones on 9/11 talks about the devastating, shattering impact that those murders had on their lives.
ARENA: Some 9/11 family members expressed satisfaction the death penalty option is still on the table. Abraham Scott's wife was working in the Pentagon when Flight 77 hit and killed her.
ABRAHAM SCOTT, WIDOWER OF 9/11 VICTIM: I will also say that I love my wife truly and I know that whatever happens to him will not bring her back. But I do believe that her -- the death of Moussaoui will -- will bring comfort.
ARENA: Other family members don't think Moussaoui should be executed. Some worry he will be seen as martyr if he is.
CHRISTY COOMBS, 9/11 FAMILY MEMBER: He wants to be putt to death so he can, in his own mind, frame himself as a martyr to die for Allah, to die for killing Americans. And this is what we're on the road to doing.
ARENA (on camera): The new phase of the trial begins on Thursday. As the government presents 9/11 victims, the defense team is expected to bring out Moussaoui's troubled past, and argue that he's mentally unstable.
Kelli Arena, CNN, Alexandria, Virginia.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KAGAN: And now on to the power of prayer. It is something that people have been talking about forever, and now there's new study that is stirring the debate again. Researchers found that prayers from strangers did not make any difference for one group of patients. But can prayer be measured by science? Our guest, a man of faith and a bestselling author, Rabbi Harold Kushner's most recent book is called "The Lord is my Shepherd." You might also remember him from his earlier work, "When Bad Things Happen to Good People." Rabbi Kushner joins me now from Boston.
Rabbi, good morning.
RABBI HAROLD KUSHNER, "THE LORD IS MY SHEPHERD": Hello, good morning, Daryn. It's a pleasure to be on with you.
KAGAN: It's really interesting to talk to you about this topic. What do you think about the premise of scientists setting up this study where they had people pray for strangers that were being treated for heart disease?
KUSHNER: The most important thing we learned is that Dr. Benson (ph) and his team have done God a tremendous favor. This is the nicest thing anybody's done for God in years. You realize what this study means? People no longer have reasons to be angry at God because their mother died during surgery, no longer have reasons to be angry at God because their father got cancer. This is not what God does.
God doesn't make sick people healthy, God makes sick people brave. God makes sick people feel cherished even when they are very sick. God gives the skill and dedication and compassion to doctors and nurses and they're the ones who make people healthy. But once you're no longer blaming God for the fact that your prayer wasn't answered, then you can turn to God for the strength and the confidence and the courage you need to get through an ordeal.
KAGAN: I'm going to need a little inspiration here, Rabbi. I'm going to a little balancing act. I'm going to ask you for your help here, because we have tape coming in from President Bush and an event that he did at the White House. He's going to talk about former House majority leader Tom DeLay, who said he's stepping down. We're going to watch that videotape in just a moment. Meanwhile, we're going to continue our conversation, and then I'm going come back to you and we're going to do this. So we're going to do both at the same time. Are you with me?
KUSHNER: I'm all yours.
KAGAN: OK. While we wait for that videotape that was shot at the White House to come in, I want to ask about the specific prayer that was asked here. And they asked these strangers to pray and this was, quote, "for a successful surgery with a quick, healthy recovery and no complications." And some of the reading I've been doing, they call prayers like that Santa prayers. Like you're praying for the red bike, you're praying for something very specific rather than praying for things like the strength and courage and wisdom to get through a difficult time.
KUSHNER: I think two things at work here, Daryn. One is we have confused God with Santa Claus, and we think if we ask God for what we want, then we're not...
KAGAN: Rabbi, keep that thought, OK?
KUSHNER: Will do.
KAGAN: Keep that thought. Here's President Bush, just moments ago at the White House.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: ... a health care system that empowers patients to make rational and smart decisions for themselves and their families. A health care system in which the relationship between the patient and the provider are central. Not a health care system where decisions are made by the federal government.
And so we've been having a discussion here today about how to make sure our health care system meets certain objectives. One, empowering the patients. Two, how do we have a system that helps control rising costs in health care? And one of the interesting and innovative ways to do that is through health savings accounts.
Health savings accounts are good for the uninsured. They're good for small businesses. They're good for larger corporations. And people around the table here have been sharing their experiences with how folks are saving money through health savings accounts. And I would urge the small business owner or the individual who is concerned about his or her health care to take a look at a health savings account.
We talked about the importance of cost savings to these important products, but we also talked about how we can work with the United States Congress to strengthen them, to make them more appealing, to give people more choices in the marketplace. To say to the American people, we trust your judgment. We trust you to make the right decision for you and your families.
And so I want to thank you all for coming for this most interesting discussion. And I'll be glad to take a couple of questions.
Nedra (ph).
QUESTION: Yes, sir. Thank you. I'm wondering if we can get your reaction to Tom DeLay's resignation. Do you think it hurts the image of the Republican Party or your ability to get work done in Congress?
BUSH: I had a talk last night on my way back from the ball game with Congressman DeLay. He informed me of his decision. My reaction was it had to have been a very difficult decision for someone who loved representing his district in the state of Texas. I wished him all the very best, and I know he's looking forward -- he's looking to the future.
My own judgment is that our party will continue to succeed because we're the party of ideas. And one of the most important ideas is to make sure that health care is available and affordable for the citizens of this country. One way to do so is to trust the patients, trust the American people when it comes to making rational decisions for health care for them and their families. And that's exactly what we've been discussing here at the table.
Karen (ph).
QUESTION: Thank you, sir. Your new chief of staff takes over soon, and I'm wondering, is there likely to be far-reaching changes in the staff at the White House and is Secretary Snow expected to stay on?
BUSH: Secretary Snow is here at the table. He's been a part of this discussion. I'm glad you brought him up. He is -- has been a valuable member of my administration and I trust his judgment and appreciate his service.
I've -- as you know, accepted the resignation of Andrew Card, my longtime friend, a person who will go down in the annals as one of the really finest chiefs of staff in the history of the White House. And I've asked Josh Bolten to take his place. Josh has served us very well as the director of the Office of Management and Budget.
I told Josh that he is -- will organize the White House in such a way that he is comfortable with and it meets my needs. And my needs are to have make good, crisp information so I can make decisions on behalf of the American people. And I look forward to Josh's recommendations as to how to get this White House to -- for the last two and a half years of my administration, to continue to function in an effective way. And it functioned very effectively under Andy Card, by the way. I am most proud of his administration and proud of the team that he assembled.
Dick (ph).
QUESTION: Mr. President, the situation in Iraq continues to be fraught with violence. You have expressed indications in recent days of progress towards forming a coalition government. Do you think, as some people on the ground are saying in the Iraqi political (INAUDIBLE)?
BUSH: I believe that people ought to pay attention to the fact that three months ago, a little over three months ago, 12 million people went to the polls and said I want to live in a democracy. And there's a group of folks in Iraq that want to stop the advance of democracy. And therefore, they're willing to use violence.
The one way to help bring confidence to the Iraqi people, that those few will not be able to determine the future of that country, is for there to be a unity government that steps up and says I'm wiling to lead. So I sent Secretary Rice to Iraq with that message. And the message is that people of Iraq have voted, and now it's time for the elected leaders to stand up and do their job.
So we look forward to working with them to put together a unity government, a government that will reject the sectarian violence, will reject the militias, reject Zarqawi and the terrorists that are trying to create enough chaos so that America loses nerve. And I'm not going lose my nerve as the president because we're doing the right thing in establishing a democracy in that country. And by establishing a democracy, we're laying the foundation for peace and that's what we want.
We want there to be peace. We want our children to not have to grow up under the threat of violence coming out of the Middle East. And one of the lessons of September 11th, 2001, is this sense of -- you know, that tyranny is OK. But underneath the surface, there was resentment and the way -- and anger that became the breeding grounds for these killers. And the best way to defeat that is with the light and hope of democracy.
And you bet it's tough in Iraq. And it's tough because people are trying to stop the advance of democracy. And I'm convinced we're making progress there. But do I urge the folks on the ground to get that unity government in place so that the Iraqi people have confidence in their future.
I thank you all.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KAGAN: We're listening to comments from President Bush. That was taped just a few minutes ago at the White House. He's at a health care summit. President Bush not making a lot of comments on Tom DeLay, the former majority leader who has announced that he will be resigning from Congress. Also, President Bush non-committal when asked will there be future staff changes at the White House?
Now, back to our discussion with Rabbi Harold Kushner. We were talking about the power of prayer in healing, looking at a recent study that came to the conclusion that prayer did not have an effect on the physical healing on the patients that they looked at.
And Rabbi Kushner, when I interrupted you, you were making the point that you think people confuse God, in your opinion, with Santa Claus.
KUSHNER: Well, Daryn, you see, the obvious connection between what we've been saying and what the president was just saying -- if prayer really made people feel better, we wouldn't have to spend all this money on health care. We would just pray for them.
KAGAN: It would be nice if it was that easy, wouldn't it?
KUSHNER: I wish it were.
But no, we think God is Santa Claus. We give him a list of what we need and don't have, try to persuade him we deserve it and then wonder why it doesn't happen. The fact is it doesn't happen and it doesn't work. That's not what God does.
I think that the problem, of course, with a rigorous, scientific, double-blind test, like the ones that these physicians did, is everybody had to offer the same prescribed prayer, and if that undermines the scientific validity of it, if that gives some people of profound faith the freedom to say, well, if we used the right prayer instead of the one they gave us it might have worked out better.
KAGAN: Let me ask you on a personal note, I know you wrote your very famous book "When Bad Things Happen to Good People" after the death of your own son. During that crisis, during that time, did you not Pray to God and specifically ask God to spare your son's life?
KUSHNER: I prayed a lot for Aaron's well-being. I prayed that a miracle would happen and he would live, but I also prayed that my wife and I would have the strength and the wisdom to know how to deal with his incurable illness, and I prayed that he would have the grace and the strength of soul to cope with the fact that at 14 years old he knew he was going die of congestive heart failure. The prayer for a miracle that he would live, that he would survive was not answered. The prayer for his strength and for our strength was answered, and it was because of the prayer being answered that we were able to cope with his ultimate loss.
KAGAN: A very personal journey, and you've been very brave to share it with many people, and I know you've been very inspirational.
Do you think at the end of day if you want to believe you believe, and if you don't, you don't?
KUSHNER: I can't stop people from believing. I can warn them that if you think groveling before God will make an operation turn out better, you're setting yourself up for a terrible disappointment. You can end up angry at God and angry at the doctor instead of being grateful to both of them for what they have tried so heroically to do for the person you care about.
KAGAN: A fascinating conversation.
Rabbi, before you go, there was one other story that came up today. I wanted your take on this. It has to do with living longer. To live longer, this study says you should worship regularly. That's the finding of this recent study at the University of Pittsburgh. A doctor there comparing the health effects of regular exercise, cholesterol-lowering drug and attendance at religious services. He found going to weekly worship services can add two to three years on to a person's life. What would you make out of that, rabbi?
KUSHNER: You know, the story of the man who comes to his rabbi, and says, Rabbi, if I change the way I spend my weekends, instead of going to bars and trying to pick up women, if I came to your synagogue services, would that help me live longer. The rabbi says no, but it will feel longer.
KAGAN: Bringing humor to these very serious discussions. Rabbi, thank you for your time today.
KUSHNER: My pleasure.
KAGAN: Fascinating discussion. Rabbi Harold Kushner, thank you for your time. Good to have you with us. We'd love to have you back very soon.
Well, on to a totally non-spiritual conversation. April 15th is just around the corner and we're talking taxes. Are yours in order? Now's the time to focus on your credit.
Valerie Morris offers a few ideas in our report "At This Age: the 20s."
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm 23 and I want to know how I can better build up my credit score and what would you recommend for me to build up my credit.
VALERIE MORRIS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (on camera): First, you need to not only know your credit score, but how it differs from your credit report. They're related, but they're not the same. A credit report is a thumb print of your borrowing and payment history. A credit score is the three-digit summary of your credit report, that many lenders, or even employers, may use when screening new applicant. This score is how a lender decides whether and at what interest rate to give you a loan. So whether the bills are piling up and you're saddled with bad credit, or you just want to improve your personal financial situation, Greg McBride, of bankrate.com, says, first and foremost, always pay your bills on time. Timely payments are the single biggest factor in determining your credit score. Plus, on-time payments today will help remedy late payments in your past. What's more, McBride says if you don't have established credit or you're trying to re-establish credit, consider using a secured credit card. With a secured card, you deposit money with the insurer, and this deposit becomes your line of credit.
Reporting on financial matters, in your 20s, I'm Valerie Morris in New York.
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KAGAN: And if you invest wisely in your 30s you can be set for life. There are risks, though. Buying stocks and bonds is the topic next week in "At This Age: the 30s."
Cells, they divide and new hope blossoms. Scientists say they are growing new body parts.
Our Dr. Sanjay Gupta explains in a moment.
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KAGAN: Science fiction? hardly. Today it is medical fact. Researchers say they have grown entirely new organs from the cells of patients. They say seven people have received life-changing transplants from themselves.
Our senior medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta has a look. His report first aired on CNN's "ANDERSON COOPER 360."
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DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Kaitlyne's bladder was the side of a them bell and could not sustain normal amounts of fluid, causing major damage to her kidneys. Doctors offered the most common surgical option, using a piece of intestine to create a new bladder. But that procedure is not without risks.
DR. ANTHONY ATALA, WAKE FOREST UNIV. SCHOOL OF MEDICINE: This may lead to problems with bone growth, mucus production, certain metabolic problems, even cancer.
GUPTA: Dr. Anthony Atala, a urologist at Wake Forest University, believed there had to be a way to dodge those problems. Kaitlyne's own bladder. Not just repairing it, but creating an entirely new bladder using her own cells.
So how does it work? Well, a small piece, less than the size of a postage stamp, is taken from the patient's bladder. Both muscle and bladder cells are teased out from that piece of the bladder and grown in a Petrie dish. When there are a sufficient number of cells, they're layered onto a three-dimensional mold shaped like a bladder and they're allowed to grow. Several weeks later, the cells have produced a newly engineered bladder which is implanted into the patient. Several more weeks later, the new bladder has grown fully inside the body and can function on its own.
All seven patients who underwent the procedure including Kaitlyne report dramatic improvements.
Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN, reporting.
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KAGAN: Thank you, Sanjay. Let's talk to the actual doctor. Dr. Anthony Atala joins us now. He is a urologist, as Sanjay was saying, at Wake Forest University and the leader researcher in this new medical development.
Doctor, good morning, and congratulations.
ATALA: Good morning.
KAGAN: How'd you get the idea, I know, let's just grow a new bladder?
ATALA: Well, you know, I'm actually a urologic surgeon and doing the actual reconstruction, we were using intestine, which is not a very good tissue to use. And it turns out it was a procedure that had been done for over a hundred years, and it would have been nice to have their own tissue for the patients because that would be the ideal thing.
KAGAN: Well, a lot of things would be nice, but it doesn't mean that you can make them a reality.
ATALA: True. You know, at that point we actually, you know, started working on it, but, you know, that was 16 years ago. If I knew then what I knew now, I wonder whether I would have actually pursued it.
KAGAN: If you knew how long that road was going to be. Another nice side effect of this is there's no rejection because it's the patient's own tissue. It's not really a transplant.
ATALA: That is correct. You know, the cells were taken from the patient, grown outside the body. The organ is constructed -- the segment of the organ is constructed and placed back into the patient.
KAGAN: So if it works for bladders, would it work for other organs?
ATALA: We are currently using the same strategies that we use for bladder engineering and we're using those same strategies here at the Wake Forest Institute for Regenerative Medicine to work on other tissues and organs, including heart, liver, pancreas and others.
KAGAN: So conceivably, one day in the future, you have a bad heart, doctors can take a piece of your heart and just grow you a new one?
ATALA: That is the hope. That's certainly the goal.
KAGAN: That is absolutely incredible. You're saying if you knew now what you knew then -- what you didn't know then, what a long road it's been -- what was the big hurdle in getting over to success?
ATALA: Actually, the biggest hurdle was getting the cells to grow outside the body. At the time, you know, it was just not thought that that could be possible. So we spent several years just trying to get the cells to grow.
KAGAN: We hear a lot about stem cells. Is this stem cells?
ATALA: They're not stem cells, actually. They're the patient's own cells and everybody has a repository, a home, if you will, for these cells, ready to go into action once an injury occurs.
KAGAN: So if you don't need stem cells to do this, why do we need stem cells?
ATALA: Well, in fact, for most of the tissues and organs in the body, they're saying natural deposit of cells. And it's just a matter of being able to harvest those in the future and knowing how to get these cells to actually grow.
KAGAN: And what was that trick, for those of you that don't speak your science jargon?
ATALA: Well, first knowing where to find the cells and second, once you know where they are, to actually know thou get them to expand. And that's really related to the soup, if you will, that they need to grow in and be nourished. KAGAN: See, we like simple terms like that, like the cell soup. Understand that. Well, it's fascinating stuff and very exciting. Congratulations on your success so far. What would you say is the next step, the next exciting thing that will come from this research?
ATALA: Well, we are actually now expanding the trials for more patients and, of course, at the institute, we're just working on other organs hopefully to do the same.
KAGAN: Good luck with your research. Important, important work. Dr. Anthony Atala from Wake Forest University. Thank you, sir.
ATALA: Thank you.
KAGAN: Good to have a chance to speak with you.
ATALA: Likewise.
KAGAN: He was a favorite for online sexual predators. Right now, he is their greatest threat. A teenager sharing his story on Capitol Hill right now. And we'll share that story with you, coming up.
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KAGAN: Picking up the pieces. That is the job facing hundreds of people in West Tennessee. A tornado update coming up.
Also, it is something that high school students look forward to all year long. It should be a Cinderella story. We're talking the prom, but it's not working that way for some Texas teenagers. Their story in their own words and their own prom dresses, just ahead.
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