Return to Transcripts main page

American Morning

America Strikes Back: Colin Powell Visits Pakistan; Taliban Escort Some Journalists Inside Taliban-Held Areas

Aired October 15, 2001 - 11:02   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: For the latest on the nationwide strike in Pakistan, also the secretary of state's visit, let's go live the Christiane Amanpour standing by in Islamabad for more on both of these topics.

Christiane, hello, again.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Bill, Secretary of State Powell arrived here about an hour and a half ago, and as you say, the militant Islamic parties opposed to the U.S. intervention in Afghanistan and opposed to President Musharraf's standing with the United States, they had called for national strike and other protest. But this national strike basically met with lukewarm response. There were some businesses in some parts of the country that remain closed today, most notably in areas that are traditionally sort of strongholds of more militant Islamic parties. But this was not the case in the rest of the country, where there are reports of many, many businesses remaining open. And certainly here in Islamabad, we did see a lot of businesses open.

Security of course very high for Colin Powell's visit here. As I say, he arrived an hour and a half ago, and he will be meeting with the president of Pakistan and other officials. High on the list of topics will not just be an assessment of the military campaign, but also of the political campaign. You know, Zahir Shah (ph), the former king of Afghanistan, has been mentioned as a potential new figurehead leader for some kind of interim broad-based alliance. And Zahir Shah He did send a delegation here to Pakistan to meet with Pakistani leaders, not clear whether they will meet with Colin Powell.

Again, there was more air raids on Afghanistan today. Reports from inside Afghanistan said that these were the heaviest daytime air raids they've sustained since the war began just a week ago.

Also, we have just heard in about half an hour ago, nighttime raids began again in Afghanistan, and specifically around the town of Kandahar and targets in Kandahar -- Bill.

HEMMER: All right, Christiane. Christiane Amanpour again there in Islamabad, watching things there, where it is already nightfall there in the Pakistani capital.

In other parts of the world there, specifically Indonesia, about 300 demonstrators, a small demonstration there, clashed with Indonesian police, outside the gates of parliament in the capital city of Jakarta. Police fired tear gas and water cannons back into the crowd. Demonstrators countered by throwing rocks. One radical Muslim group is pressing the Indonesian president to break tries with Washington.

CATHERINE CALLAWAY, CNN ANCHOR: And as U.S. coalition forces continue to strike at the Taliban, more allies join if the fight. President Bush meeting with the Italian prime minister today to discuss Italy's role in the war on terrorism.

Let's go now to Washington and CNN's Bob Franken, who's at the Pentagon with more.

Good morning, Bob.

BOB FRANKEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Catherine.

And before we get to the Italian prime minister, who made a stop here at the Pentagon, we just wanted to point out that the military, the air raids continue around-the-clock and really quite relentlessly. As Christiane Amanpour just pointed out, there are reports now from Afghanistan that they have resumed under the cover of darkness, around Kandahar, which of course is a Taliban stronghold, and stronghold for Al Qaeda, according to military sources here.

But the raids have been going on both in daylight. In fact, One of the largest daylight raids thus far was conducted over Kabul, with a variety of targets, everything from the telecommunications center, which serves Afghanistan, to various military positions, both in and around Kabul and in the mountains, as far as what are described as terrorist camps. So that goes on, and you can see some of the result.

But at the same time that was occurring, the United States was having discussions with the head of the Italian government, the Prime Minister Berluskoni. Before he went to talk with the president, he came to the Pentagon and met with the Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz, and then went for a tour of the damaged that was caused when that hijacked plane on September 11th crashed into the Pentagon, and then afterwards, after they had their little ceremony, he disclosed in fact representatives of the Italian government are already negotiating with the U.S. military about specific ways that could be helped, and the deputy defense secretary allowed that it could be help backfill for U.S. troops in the Balkans.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL WOLFOWITZ, DEP. DEFENSE SECRETARY: Italy played a very big role in the Balkans, and that's obviously one place we feel a certain amount of strain. So that's obviously a place where Italy might play larger role. But I think Italy can also play a direct role in the ongoing operation in a number of ways that we are investigating.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FRANKEN: Wolfowitz was not willing to answer any of the questions about the current military operations going on in the Afghanistan bombing, but there's going to be briefing at 1:30 Eastern this afternoon. The Defense Secretary Rumsfeld and the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Meyers will face reporters. We're told there may be more pictures of some of the damage. We're not told whether there will be more bombing videotape -- Catherine.

CALLAWAY: Bob, can you tell us a little bit about what kind of role Italy could play possibly in this activity?

FRANKEN: Well, there were no specifics, except for the fact that the discussion, according to Berluskoni included both the use of troops and perhaps naval support, and they made it clear that they were not talking about support that would be limited just to the Balkans, but support will be negotiated in the next day or so.

Interesting, Bob Franken at the Pentagon, thanks, Bob.

HEMMER: We want to go back overseas now to the frontlines, where the Taliban have escorted some journalists inside Taliban-held authorities. And CNN's Nic Robertson among those traveling with the Taliban, now joining us live from Peshawar, just across the border there.

Nic, tell us what you found out on the other side?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Bill, shortly before we left, we had a meeting, CNN had an exclusive meeting with representatives of Al Qaeda, and I asked them -- my first question was subsequent to these air attacks trying to kill bin Laden, was the leader of Al Qaeda still alive? This particular representative said they had seen him two days ago, and that he understood him still to be alive and well.

I asked him what Osama bin Laden's view was on the ongoing campaign. He said that Osama bin Laden believes that they are winning this war, that they have been successful in defining the terms of this war as an attack on Islam, that they said that Osama bin Laden believes that continuing in this conflict will mean a significant downturn, not only in the economy of the United States and Great Britain, but of the world, and also destruction for political leaders, for their political roles that President Bush and a British Prime Minister Tony Blair.

He also said the only way for the United States to get out of this current predicament would be for the United States to withdraw its troops from Saudi Arabia. And also to disengage from the situation, as he said, in Palestine.

Now there was also a special message this Al Qaeda representative, a special message from Osama bin Laden, and that was that if civilian homes inside Afghanistan are destroyed, then there serious consequences involved that happening, and of course that coming hard on the heals of Taliban showing journalist villages inside Afghanistan, a particular village, that the Taliban say some 200 people died, and that they say this village was bombed by American aircraft. Certainly when they took us to that village, we could see a village in the mountains of some 40-50 homes; 80-90 percent were destroyed. Certainly appeared to us as if the village had been bombed, and certainly appeared a village occupied by civilians -- Bill.

HEMMER: Nic, a few follow-ups here if I could. The Al Qaeda members you talked to, can you again tell us their position or their rank within the organization? How high up where they? How in touch where they?

ROBERTSON: Bill, very hard to say exactly how high up they were. There were two of them. One spoke excellent English. He essentially was the translator for the other representative, who did speak some English. He came across as very serious individuals, very dedicated individuals. They certainly spoke with a manner of authority. They certainly spoke very quickly, readily and easily about Osama bin Laden's views. There was no hesitation there. They were introduced to me by somebody I've known for sometime in Afghanistan. They were introduced to me as Al Qaeda representatives, and they told my that they've come from Osama bin Laden.

So they definitely gave the impression of being from Al Qaeda, but very difficult to say where they would fit in the hierarchy, what their role in Al Qaeda would be. They appear to me to be of either local Afghanis from that particular part, the eastern part of Afghanistan, or perhaps from the border regions of Pakistan, bordering Afghanistan. Locals, definitely not Arabs, I would say, Bill.

HEMMER: Also, Nic, the tour, did you get the impression that these are the kind of tours that may continue, perhaps just the first of many? Did you get an impression on that?

ROBERTSON: Bill, a little bit difficult to hear you, but if I understood you, what way will they continue. They feel that the way that they're fighting this already, they will be successful.

As they put to me, one representative fighting for their beliefs is equivalent to one corps of a modern army. And I asked them to explain what they meant. And they said, look, one representative from our organization, if he blows himself up, he can destroy a huge building or a large number of people, and if they believe for a modern army to do that, he said, that would take a large number of people. That -- it appears to be indicative of their way of thinking of how to approach this problem of being up against a very large force, but also their way of approaching what they see themselves as being up against, a large majority of the rest of the world with no modern armament to take it on -- Bill.

HEMMER: Nic, I want to try again, in case you can hear me this time. Do you get the impression that these tours will continue? Is this just the first of many for journalists?

ROBERTSON: It appears that they may be. It's very difficult to tell. Certainly the Taliban realized from their perspective and believe that they have a story to tell that the rest of the world they thought wasn't getting a clear picture on. They believe and they say that this was a village of civilians that was targeted, and they believe that they weren't getting their message out, and the only way to do that was to bring in independent Western journalist, to show them the village and to leave it for them to debate whether the numbers were correct, whether what the Taliban said happened in that village was correct, whether or not the Western reporters should believe the villagers who they talked to, who talked about American planes, who talked about bombs falling on the village, who talked about losing loved one, and some of whom were in hospital clearly with injuries they say were sustained in that campaign.

Some from the Taliban's perspective, this was a specific case that they really wanted to bring Western reporters in for. It appears that they are, if you will, wising up to the ways of a modern propaganda war, if you will, and certainly they appear to believe that this trick successful for them. Should a similar situation play again? It seems they might again, at this time, let journalist in to cover should a similar situation exist from their view -- Bill.

HEMMER: Got it. OK, Nic, thanks. Many thanks. Nic Robertson there in Pakistan, the only Western journalist to go on that tour inside of Afghanistan this past weekend.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com